Time  Nick         Message
03:50 benrob0329   Is it bad that I ordered a unicom classic (model m) keyboard the same day I found them?
03:52 bigfoot547   no
03:53 * kaeza      read that as an unicorn classic keyboard
03:53 * Sokomine   waits for benrob0329s new keyboard to arrive, then grabs it and runs away with it
03:53 Sokomine     same here, kaeza. but it's late
03:54 kaeza        would have been nice :(
03:55 benrob0329   A unicorn classic?
03:55 benrob0329   Is that where the keys are rainbow colored?
03:55 kaeza        Sokomine, it's never too late
03:56 kaeza        night is young or whatever that was
03:57 benrob0329   Its not even tomorrow yet
07:02 Calinou      hi
07:02 Calinou      https://i.imgur.com/nEyxjAe.png
07:02 Calinou      seen on /r/linuxmasterrace :P
07:02 Calinou      so true
07:49 CWz          is it possible to change rails while riding the cart
07:54 IhrFussel    The default mod crashed my server...the causing line was "if def.drawtype == "airlike" or" apparently def was nil (nodes.lua L1788) ... anyone a clue what could cause a node definition of a pointed pos to be nil?
08:52 shivajiva    wow, is it repeatable or just a random event?
09:27 IhrFussel    shivajiva, it happened once since June 4 so...pretty unlikely to happen again I guess
09:34 shivajiva    I can't find it in my logs so it's pretty rare
09:35 IhrFussel    Here is the exact error line ServerError: AsyncErr: ServerThread::run Lua: Runtime error from mod '' in callback item_OnPlace(): ...hare/minetest/games/minetest_game/mods/default/nodes.lua:1788: attempt to index local 'def' (a nil value)
09:37 shivajiva    wondering if its caused by a specific player but with one example it's impossible to tell I guess
09:48 IhrFussel    My guess is either pos for pointing returned nil or the pointed node returned nil
09:51 shivajiva    I would think it's the pos given the error checking I have had to add in various places to stop crashes related to nil being returned for a coord
10:19 IhrFussel    shivajiva, so it's NOT just me who sees "pos.x" and some huge number in error messages? It ends like e+08 or something like that
10:23 IhrFussel    I can't find it right now but it says something like "value too high (expected < [somehugenumber]+e[0-9] got [somebiggernumber]+e[0-9])
10:28 shivajiva    yes that's the gist of the error, I added a function to validate coords to stop the crash in areas and item_drop
10:29 shivajiva    those were the 2 mods that produced the error consistently
10:35 IhrFussel    Yes I remember now I added a minetest.log() for that scenario to see when pos.x returns something larger than map_gen_limit
10:36 IhrFussel    It last happened a few days ago 2017-06-10 17:54:02: ACTION[Server]: AREAS X POS ERROR ... and it happened every few minutes back then...I really wonder what causes it
10:37 shivajiva    wilkgr showed it to me as a way to crash the server by using maptools bouncer to get outside the map and then all you have to do is drop an item to cause a crash
10:38 shivajiva    talk about thinking outside the box :)
10:43 shivajiva    I spent a few hours cleaning up the methods he found, in the end I asked him to stop trying to abuse the server via his privs
11:44 IhrFussel    shivajiva, do you have an example error message for me? I'm trying to find the definition of the error in the src
11:44 Bobr2        hi IhrFussel
11:45 IhrFussel    Hello Bobr2 =)
11:45 Bobr2        how are u =)
11:47 IhrFussel    I'm fine and you? ... hm I think the error isn't defined by core/c++ ... it's likely a Lua parse error
11:47 Bobr2        stressed but over all im fine thanks
11:49 Bobr2        does that mean u dont think its in the core which has some faulty coding
11:52 IhrFussel    I grepped for "expected .{1,} got 1.{1,}" and it returns no results, so it's likely a Lua parse error
11:52 IhrFussel    OOps not 1.{1,} I mean .{1,}
11:52 Bobr2        dont worry i dont know that much so i wont notice lol
11:53 Bobr2        can i post an eroror in here
12:01 Bobr2        hi Darcidride
12:04 shivajiva    ERROR[Main]: ServerError: AsyncErr: ServerThread::run Lua: Runtime error from mod '' in callback on_playerReceiveFields(): Invalid float vector dimension range 'x' (expected -2.14748e+06 < x < 2.14748e+06 got -2.14748e+06).
12:08 shivajiva    ERROR[Main]: ServerError: Runtime error from mod 'areas' in callback environment_Step(): Invalid float vector dimension range 'z' (expected -2.14748e+06 < z < 2.14748e+06 got -2.14748e+06).
12:10 IhrFussel    There were already 2 issues regarding that error, but nothing got fixed it seems
12:11 Darcidride   Hi Bobr2, Hi everybody
12:15 red-001      :( CSM doesn't have find_nodes_in_area
12:15 red-001      well I guess I will have to rewrite the ambince mod more
12:17 Bobr2        sounds fun
12:18 nerzhul      red-001, can you close your serialization try catch hide problem exception please ?
12:19 red-001      sure
12:19 nerzhul      ty
12:19 red-001      but please merge https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/1776 or something similar asap
12:19 red-001      !title
12:19 ShadowBot    Book: Also limit the max size of the title. by red-001 · Pull Request #1776 · minetest/minetest_game · GitHub
12:19 nerzhul      i hope a coredev can help me by reviwing my last C++11 conversion PR i really want to finish that boring stuff earliest time possible in the rleease cycle
12:20 nerzhul      i'm not minetest_game powered dev :p
12:21 red-001      well it already has a "high priority" lable
12:21 nerzhul      i'm not minetest_game powered dev :p
12:21 nerzhul      oops
12:22 red-001      nerzhul, is there a reason that CSM doesn't have find_nodes_in_area but has other similar functions?
12:30 nerzhul      red-001, i think either nobody did the PR or it wasn't merged :p
12:30 nerzhul      we really should finish to find a consensus on the flavour PR
12:30 nerzhul      esspecially for nodes
12:31 nerzhul      after that i will work on mod channels
12:31 red-001      maybe we could replace the functions with less cheaty ones
12:31 red-001      or add two clases of node functions
12:32 red-001      one that just tells you how many nodes are in an area and the other that gives more excat information
12:33 nerzhul      add a hard range limit to prevent reading very far nodes, for example more than 100 nodes is not normal, because logically you cannot hear or see them correctly
12:33 nerzhul      or 64
12:34 Bobr2        may i ask what an error means
12:35 Bobr2        this is the error
12:35 Bobr2        2017-06-15 12:28:50: ERROR[Server]: 3d_armor: Player position is nil [set_player_armor]
12:36 red-001      i n v a l i d  s t a t e ? ? ?
12:37 shivajiva    that error usually appears when a player joins, my logs have plenty of examples of it
12:37 IhrFussel    Bobr2, the game somehow didn't return a player pos
12:38 Bobr2        https://pastebin.com/SnfdzbJh
12:38 IhrFussel    pos = player:getpos() if not pos then minetest.log("error", "3d_armor: Player position is nil "..msg) return end << this is the relevant line in the code
12:39 red-001      huh
12:39 red-001      I wonder how that could happen
12:40 Bobr2        i dont kow
12:40 IhrFussel    Most likely cause the player left the game as the function ran?
12:41 nerzhul      IhrFussel, no serverthread and lua state is on the same thread, there is no concurrency problem
12:41 nerzhul      are*
12:41 IhrFussel    Then getpos() is broken and nobody wants to fix it
12:42 Bobr2        is it a bad error?
12:42 shivajiva    definitely a possibility but I have that error on my dev server with just me joining
12:43 IhrFussel    Bobr2, does it happen a lot or only sometimes?
12:43 Bobr2        alot
12:45 Fixer        red-001: i n v a l i d  f o n t ! ! !
12:47 shivajiva    lol I have a player named error1 spamming my grep search for errors
12:47 Bobr2        how they doing that
12:47 shivajiva    by having that name
12:48 red-001      so .. who is error0?
12:48 shivajiva    :')
12:57 Fixer        tl;dr
13:01 Bobr2        dmobs had a problem but i fixed it thanks to shivajiva do you guys want the fix for it?
13:10 red-001      eh make a PR to the dmobs repo?
13:11 Fixer        ^^
13:11 Bobr2        urm ok
13:14 Bobr2        wont let me
13:15 shivajiva    do you have an account @ github?
13:18 Bobr2        yeah it might let me now
13:27 benrob0329   Hello all
13:27 shivajiva    Hi benrob
13:27 benrob0329   My new keyboard shipped
13:28 benrob0329   Shouldn't take too long to get here, as im only a couple States north
13:29 shivajiva    I don't like waiting for things, kinda spoilt by nextday deliveries
13:29 benrob0329   Heh, I didn't feel like dishing out $50 for it
13:30 shivajiva    unless it's farnel who like to take the site down for maintenance when you process your order
13:30 shivajiva    it will be worth it :)
13:31 benrob0329   shivajiva: not when shipping costs half as much as the product itself at that point
13:32 shivajiva    eww
13:32 shivajiva    that's not nice
13:33 shivajiva    how heavy is this KB lol
13:33 benrob0329   3 pounds
13:34 * shivajiva  gets his scales out to weigh his KB
13:34 benrob0329   Its a Unicomp Classic 103 (descendent of the model M)
13:34 shivajiva    430g
13:35 benrob0329   I kinda wish they still put the steel backplates in :P
13:36 benrob0329   Yes, itd probably double the weight
13:36 Bobr2        any one know how to fix this
13:36 Bobr2        2017-06-15 15:00:45: ERROR[Server]: 3d_armor: Player position is nil [set_player_armor]
13:36 benrob0329   But it would increase the build quality a lot
13:36 benrob0329   Bobr2: does it crash the server?
13:37 Bobr2        i dont know
13:37 benrob0329   If it doesn't, don't worry about it
13:37 shivajiva    just reading their bumf on the Ultra Classic...t's Ultra because it uses a newly designed clamshell cover set reducing the footprint by 20% and eliminating almost ½ pound of plastic.
13:38 benrob0329   shivajiva: yes, but its not as pretty
13:38 shivajiva    are you dating this KB? :D
13:39 shivajiva    sorry, couldn't resist :P
13:39 benrob0329   It have a mouse button blank at the bottom, and is $10 more expensive
13:39 benrob0329   Well, I think LGR probably does
13:39 benrob0329   *it has
13:40 shivajiva    I use a Humlin with a membrane, sick of wearing the letters off normal KB's
13:41 benrob0329   So you like bottoming out your keys?
13:42 shivajiva    everything is a compromise but it doesn't trigger adjacent keys so I'm learning to live with it
13:44 shivajiva    I work with ECU's that have oil and grease films on them so unless I want to wash my hands every time I type it's the best way
13:47 benrob0329   Fair enough
13:50 Calinou      <shivajiva> I don't like waiting for things, kinda spoilt by nextday deliveries
13:50 Calinou      :D
13:50 Calinou      many places have next-day delivery in France, including Amazon
13:51 Bobr2        am i allowed to ask if another error is a problem as well?
13:54 shivajiva    Calinou: I like the concept of JIT, who wants to hold excessive stock these days unless it's obsolete and you have a requirement ;)
13:54 Calinou      you can even get delivery on the same evening in the largest French cities, but it's expensive
14:09 IhrFussel    benrob0329, it doesn't crash the server because the mod returns the function before it can crash..but IMO that's NOT the solution to the nil pos bug in the engine
14:11 IhrFussel    There are many other mods that don't check the pos value before using it and it shouldn't be the modders responsibility to validate the player pos
14:12 IhrFussel    The weird thing is ONLY the X pos seems to be buggy sometimes... Y and Z are fine
14:14 IhrFussel    Or maybe they are 2 separate bugs: One is pos returning nil and the other one is pos X giving a silly value like -2.14748e+06
14:23 red-001      hey DS-minetest does the client load all sounds in the soundpack?
14:23 red-001      and where is the sound pack?
14:30 Calinou      https://stackoverflow.blog/2017/06/15/developers-use-spaces-make-money-use-tabs/
14:30 Calinou      :D
14:30 Bobr         problem
14:30 Bobr         2017-06-12 06:14:23: ERROR[Main]: ServerError: Lua: Runtime error from mod '' in callback on_chat_message(): ...games/minetest/games/minetest_game/mods/irc/callback.lua:34: attempt to call field 'strip_colors' (a nil value)
14:30 red-001      can't fix
14:31 red-001      update your server
14:31 red-001      or use an old version of the IRC mod
14:34 DS-minetest  red-001: the soundpack is in minetest/sounds (not user path)
14:34 DS-minetest  normally it loads the sound at the moment when it's played
14:35 red-001      neat
14:35 red-001      that worked
14:37 red-001      I still want to turn my sound off because of how bad the default sounds are
14:39 red-001      btw the thing I'm working on that needs this is https://github.com/red-001/MinetestAmbience
14:40 DS-minetest  maybe it would be good if there was another type of soundpack that would contain sounds that are played instead of the default ones. (the current soundpacks are only used if a sound is missing)
14:40 red-001      wow watch out
14:41 red-001      someone could use it for cheating
14:42 kaeza        greetings
14:43 Bobr         wb CWz
14:44 CWz          hey
14:44 Wayward_One  hi all :)
14:44 Bobr         je;;p :)
14:44 Bobr         hello :)
14:56 benrob0329   Greetings kaeza
15:12 Jordach      https://twitter.com/austinnotduncan/status/875098061856362496
15:12 Jordach      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ld2nWfIap2k
15:12 Jordach      mrw ^
15:21 rubenwardy   Calinou, that'll be because spaces are more popular
15:22 rubenwardy   so bigger companies are more likely to use spaces, and enforce code style
15:54 benrob0329   Hi Megaf
16:27 Calinou      https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=17887
16:27 Calinou      apparently, people aren't understanding you *cannot* use legally the Steam APIs in an open source game
16:27 Calinou      especially a LGPL one
16:27 Calinou      steam_api.dll is proprietary
16:28 red-001      eh dynamic linking?
16:28 Calinou      and if you start requiring it for mods, you're pure evil
16:28 Calinou      yeah, it might be allowed per LGPL, but still evil in my book if mods start to require it
16:28 Calinou      Steamworks doesn't play well with others, IIRC
16:28 red-001      pretty sure the issue if there is one will be with value and not LGPL
16:29 Calinou      also, selling mods is... meh, I find
16:29 Calinou      it'll drive the creation of proprietary mods which can't be redistributed
16:29 Calinou      (possibly violating the LGPL in the process, again)
16:30 red-001      pretty sure LGPL is suppose to be fine with this
16:30 red-001      GPL isn't
16:31 Calinou      the LGPL doesn't make proprietary mods automatically legal
16:31 Calinou      and on an ethical standpoint, it's questionable, I hate seeing proprietary mods for games
16:31 Calinou      (regardless if the game is proprietary or not)
16:31 Calinou      and I don't think modding should be a business anyway
16:52 Bobr         welcome back
16:53 paramat      Ihrfussel your default crash is easily fixed by checking that the node above the chest exists
16:53 paramat      could you open an issue to remind us?
17:10 paramat      i'll add a check for def being nil
17:10 paramat      the node may have been unloaded or 'unknown'
17:22 Shara        Hello all
17:23 benrob0329   Hi Shara, nerzhul
17:25 Raven262     hello Shara
17:25 Shara        Hi benrob0329, Raven262. How goes?
17:25 benrob0329   Good, ordered my first mechanical keyboard
17:25 Raven262     Good, won a round of dota2, again
17:26 Raven262     lisac and I are becoming an invincible team
17:26 * benrob0329 dreams of a minetest mmo
17:26 Shara        Make one :P
17:26 Raven262     well, lag is the main problem imo
17:26 Shara        Yea, I know.
17:27 benrob0329   And camera placement
17:27 benrob0329   And shaders
17:27 Raven262     well shaders are not required but would be nice
17:28 Raven262     still, client side prediction and turn based combat would probably solve the lag problem
17:28 Raven262     if there were anyone who would write that stuff
17:29 benrob0329   Fortunately and unfortunately, my peers are wanting to get into gamedev
17:30 Shara        If you want turn based, I think you have the wrong game :P
17:30 benrob0329   So C++ got moved down the list (Godot was the decided engine)
17:31 benrob0329   I hate it when you plan something, and then everything else happens
17:31 Raven262     Shara, minetest has no hope to do otherwise :P
17:31 Raven262     lag is just to intense
17:32 benrob0329   imho minetest's combat is lacking
17:32 Shara        Doesn't seem 'that' bad for me
17:32 Shara        Combat is just rather flat. But that's the case in many games
17:33 benrob0329   No good projectiles (should be an item + weapon group/type thing)
17:33 Raven262     yes
17:33 benrob0329   No knockback
17:33 Shara        Aren't there knockback PRs?
17:33 benrob0329   Yes, good luck getting them merged
17:33 Raven262     no projectiles also limits us to non ranged weapons
17:33 Raven262     but
17:33 Raven262     did anyone think of hitscans like in doom?
17:34 Raven262     no need for projectiles that way
17:34 Shara        No projectiles?
17:34 benrob0329   Mele combat isn't a bad thing, but its rather uninvolved atm
17:34 Shara        Tere's stuff in mods even if not in MTG
17:34 Shara        There's*
17:34 Raven262     yes and that is very laggy
17:34 benrob0329   Like, no sword + shield combo
17:35 benrob0329   No blocking (no pun intended)
17:35 Raven262     hey, you always have shield in 3d armour xD
17:35 Raven262     though you can't block
17:35 benrob0329   But that's not fun
17:35 Raven262     nah it isn't
17:35 Raven262     its basic
17:35 benrob0329   Its just like any other bit of protection
17:36 benrob0329   A potion would be more exciting
17:36 Raven262     there is witchcraft for that
17:36 benrob0329   Also, you cant throw anything
17:36 benrob0329   Potion != withcraft
17:36 Raven262     well, throwing mod?
17:36 Shara        Mods let you throw all kinds of things...
17:36 benrob0329   To an extent
17:37 Shara        THrowing teleport potions is kind of fun
17:37 benrob0329   Its laggy, and you cant say..hurl a rock or sand at someone
17:37 Raven262     yes
17:37 Raven262     its laggy
17:37 Raven262     and there we go again
17:37 Shara        AGain, I don't seem to encounter so much lag.
17:38 Raven262     well not in singleplayer
17:38 benrob0329   Throwing should be part of dropping
17:38 Shara        Or on my server unless it's been running a long time
17:38 benrob0329   Like Teresolagy
17:39 benrob0329   (If you hold down q, a power meter appears allowing you to chunk the item your holding)
17:39 paramat      many servers are just running too many overly-heavy mods (like moretrees)
17:39 Shara        Yup
17:39 IhrFussel    My server peaks at 3 secs max_lag mostly (which isn't too much) with 153 mods
17:39 Raven262     well you can't make a server with mtgame only :P
17:39 benrob0329   I mean you can
17:40 Shara        On DL I've been known to ride around on a dragon which I can make shoot fireballs at players :)
17:40 benrob0329   But MTG isn't fun
17:40 benrob0329   Which is a problem
17:40 Shara        So not even limiting protectiles to the player only there
17:40 benrob0329   MTG should be fun, period.
17:40 Shara        projectiles*
17:41 Raven262     no, mtg should be a placeholder
17:41 benrob0329   Why?
17:41 Raven262     for other games to develop upon it
17:41 benrob0329   MTG is THE DEFAULT game
17:41 Raven262     yes
17:41 Shara        I'd like it to be a nice base to build on top of
17:41 Raven262     thats what i'm talking about
17:41 benrob0329   The default game should be fun
17:41 Shara        But this is why it stays in limbo - everyone wants it to be something else
17:42 benrob0329   Im not saying heavy
17:42 benrob0329   Im saying fun
17:42 benrob0329   It should be fun in its simplicity
17:42 Raven262     i would suggest that minetest should be bundled with some more subgames not only mtg
17:42 Shara        benrob0329: Fun is not always so easy to quantify.
17:43 benrob0329   Shara: well its not fun, that much is certain
17:43 Shara        If you want stuff added or changed in MTG, talk to the devs/submit PRs.
17:43 benrob0329   So many things need to be overhauled right now
17:44 benrob0329   Like we have boats, and carts. But no vehicle class in the engine
17:44 Shara        Then help. Everyone knows there are problems.
17:44 Shara        Hard part is doing something about it.
17:45 Shara        I personally like Raven262 suggestion, but not seeing any sign of it happening soon
17:45 Raven262     I can only do some textures...
17:45 benrob0329   Bows will be unimmersive if added currently, because there isn't any way of doing animations or proper physics
17:46 Raven262     animated wielded items? are they possible?
17:46 Shara        paramat: Your params suggestion is what I was thinking of in work today :)
17:46 benrob0329   Raven262: there is a PR for it, sitting there
17:46 Raven262     oh
17:47 Raven262     well, ask paramat about it i guess
17:47 benrob0329   We don't have a way of doing smooth animations either
17:47 Raven262     textures could compensate there
17:48 benrob0329   What we really need for a bow is layered animated textures
17:48 benrob0329   Ie bow on top of arrow
17:48 Raven262     yes
17:48 Raven262     that wouldn't be too hard to do
17:48 Raven262     with animated textures
17:48 benrob0329   Compositing is best for it
17:49 * Raven262   is a bit afk, replies may delay.
18:04 paramat      the main issue is dev time, and we can't do anything about that
18:30 paramat      Shara shivajiva tenplus1 and server admin, i assume you want all CSM functions disabled by default? see https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/5930#issuecomment-308821530 and please support
18:31 Shara        I would certainly prefer anything that can send something to the server off by default
18:32 Shara        It sort of feels like something you should choose to enable once you understand CSM enough to make that judgement call
18:37 paramat      yeah
18:40 octacian     paramat: You know, I'm personally no longer against being able to control some CSM functions, however, I'd like to see server side-injection first. The ability to disable only specific functions would still be good though IMO.
18:41 octacian     I can rotate an entity on the y axis with set_yaw, how do I rotate it on the x and z axis?
18:41 paramat      yes server-provided CSM has much more potential, and less potential for player abuse
18:42 octacian     paramat: However, I'd still like to see the ability to at least use client-side mods for formspecs. For example, a formspec to provide a GUI for teleporting to, kicking, banning, and messaging players.
18:42 paramat      set_look_vertical lua_api L3206
18:43 octacian     Thank you.
18:43 Bobr         hi octacian XD
18:43 octacian     Hello Bobr.
18:43 lisac        hey, does MT use width & height settings when not fullscreen?
18:43 octacian     I figured I'd make an item entity with a collision box only the size of the object with slight
18:43 octacian     ugh
18:43 IhrFussel    Someone on my server just connected as "Gaylord581" I really hope that was no pre-defined name from the app in use xD
18:43 octacian     paramat: Is it possible to rotate the collision box?
18:44 paramat      and use 'set_look_horizontal', 'set yaw' is deprecated
18:44 octacian     Since when?
18:44 paramat      not possible
18:44 octacian     Oh well... At least it'll look nice.
18:44 paramat      since a few months
18:44 octacian     hmm, OK
18:45 paramat      octacian don't worry, we're asking for optional restrictions, not removing client-provided CSM completely
18:46 octacian     Good.
18:46 * octacian   has forgotten how to check if an itemstring refers to a node.
18:47 octacian     OK, IK I can check minetest.registered_items, but nodes are there too. What do I do then?
18:47 paramat      lisac yes, but the format of screen dimension settings changed in 0.4.16, you may need to edit your .conf
18:51 octacian     paramat: set_look_vertical doesn't seem to work. I want to rotate the item so that it sits flat rather than upright.
18:51 octacian     (working on item entity)
18:53 lisac        paramat, So if I set my width and height, and maximize the screen, it should be the width and height size?
18:55 octacian     paramat: It seems as though set_look_* and get_look_* only works for the player
18:56 octacian     paramat: Just confirmed, they only work on the player. Is there any particular reason?
18:59 Fixer        PART FIST @ PART GIRLL
19:01 paramat      no maximise just fills your screen
19:01 paramat      octacian because mobs only have horizontal rotation
19:01 octacian     Why can they not have vertical as well?
19:02 octacian     All it does is rotate the visual AFAIK anyways
19:02 paramat      it has not been needed yet
19:02 octacian     So, there is no particular reason why it hasn't been added or why get_yaw and set_yaw is still used on entities?
19:02 octacian     (non-player entities, that is)
19:02 paramat      simplicity
19:03 octacian     I feel like simplicity is better with consistency
19:03 paramat      and mobs do not have heads that pitch
19:03 paramat      nor do players
19:03 paramat      in a way, seen from outside
19:03 Raven262     lol imagine mobs rotating on x and z
19:03 octacian     So that's why set_yaw wasn't renamed?
19:04 Raven262     or player camera rotation on x and z
19:04 octacian     (on non-player entities - I need to be more clear)
19:04 octacian     Raven262: Would be incredibly useful for both :P
19:04 Raven262     yes i already see many possibilities, octacian
19:04 octacian     Think about it. Airplanes, causing entities to do stuff like fall over. lol
19:05 Raven262     birds rotation during flight too
19:05 octacian     hmm, Well, maybe I'll take a look. Seems like that might be a slightly simpler task that attempting to rewrite the entire HUD API.
19:05 octacian     heh, Attempting to rewrite the HUD API is not a good way to try to learn C++, just FYI.
19:06 Raven262     xD
19:06 * octacian   is finally listening to Wuzzy and trying to learn to implement useful features in an engine rather than as an extra mod that you have to depend on
19:07 Raven262     I actually didn't see many mods that have many non-optional dependencies
19:08 Fixer        octacian: learn cpp by implementing z-sorting :trollface:
19:08 octacian     Fixer: Mind starting off with what z-sorting is? :P
19:09 Fixer        octacian: exactly
19:09 Fixer        octacian: install any stained glass mod
19:09 Fixer        octacian: put one glass behind another behind another - observe
19:09 octacian     Ah, yes. And place multiple layers.
19:10 octacian     I once wrote my own stained glass mod. In fact, it was the first mod I ever wrote.
19:10 Raven262     you can get stuff invisible that way
19:10 Raven262     heh i always start making a stainglass mod, end up unfinished cause i don't like how i started
19:10 * octacian   didn't finish his because his HDD failed last year
19:11 octacian     Man, when that HDD failed...
19:11 octacian     I had to rewrite over 800 lines of a computer mod
19:11 tenplus1     hi folks
19:11 Shara        Hi Ten :)
19:11 tenplus1     hi shara :P
19:11 Raven262     its kinda really simple to make stainglass mod, for loop + colorize modifier do the thing in few lines of code
19:11 Raven262     Hello tenplus1
19:11 tenplus1     hi raven :D
19:11 Shara        Raven262: Yup, my glass mod does that :P
19:11 * octacian   remembers that he REALLY needs to work on his computer mod
19:11 Calinou      hi
19:12 tenplus1     hi cal, hi octacian
19:12 octacian     Hey tenplus1
19:12 Raven262     Yep, Shara, thats the easiest colorization approach
19:12 Raven262     but now there is another option too which i didn't manage to implement
19:12 Raven262     colorization using metadata
19:12 * octacian   wishes he'd known about the colorize modifying when he wrote his stained glass mod 2 years ago
19:12 Calinou      I now do local backups on a NAS, which is in RAID 1
19:13 Shara        I need to actually update my servers before looking at that stuff, but apparently I'm too busy making silly PRs instead :)
19:13 Calinou      more convenient than plugging and unplugging an external HDD all the time
19:13 tenplus1     who said that shara ?
19:13 Shara        I said it :D
19:13 tenplus1     :P
19:14 Shara        I finally decided to actually play writer, so I've been correctly silly capitalisation issues in descriptions and things :D
19:14 Shara        correcting*
19:14 Fixer        270 fps during rain in mc beta 1.7.3
19:14 Shara        And hoping params PR I made so they display correctly in /help all will get in now as well
19:14 * tenplus1   checks pulls
19:15 Raven262     I found that one mod on the forums with some descriptions capitalized and some not...
19:15 Raven262     it was hard to look at it
19:15 tenplus1     ehehe, prolly mine :P
19:15 Shara        Raven262: Lots of mods have the issue. I made a PR to fix it accross the whole of MTG a couple of nights back
19:15 Raven262     lol
19:15 Raven262     i didn't know that was a global case
19:16 Shara        Got tired of seeing "Dark Green Wool" but "Dark green dye"
19:16 Raven262     heh
19:16 Raven262     since most of my testing mods lately only use for loops, my capitalization is good.
19:16 Raven262     i never fail to capitalize
19:16 Shara        Yes, best to use loops when you can :)
19:17 Calinou      "My favourite colour is grey!"
19:17 * Calinou    runs
19:17 Raven262     lol
19:17 Raven262     well he might be colorblind, Calinou.
19:17 Raven262     like lisac
19:17 Raven262     right lisac?
19:18 lisac        .
19:18 Raven262     Lisac hates that kind of jokes
19:18 Calinou      I'm not colorblind
19:18 Raven262     he likes grey color a lot
19:18 Raven262     not you, Calinou
19:18 Raven262     the one who stated that
19:18 Calinou      ah :p
19:18 Raven262     xD
19:18 lisac        Hey, what do you call a person without a nose or a body?
19:18 lisac        Nobody knows
19:18 lisac        ^ a joke
19:18 Raven262     ^ a lisac
19:18 Calinou      heh
19:19 lisac        ^ a heh
19:19 tenplus1     lol, hi lisac
19:19 tenplus1     http://lolsnaps.com/upload_pic/50592b9d-cut-the-rid-wire.jpeg
19:19 Raven262     lisac, whats your favourite colour?
19:19 Shara        tenplus1: Love it :)
19:19 Raven262     xD
19:19 paramat      or perhaps a nose without a body
19:20 Raven262     paramat sure has some odd ideas Oo
19:21 Fixer        tenplus1: proper keyboard detected
19:21 tenplus1     :)
19:21 Fixer        not this todays gay shit
19:21 Fixer        even plastic feels toyish
19:21 Fixer        low quality shit
19:21 Raven262     my keyboard is actually very nice, but is really old
19:22 Raven262     i think it has more than 15 years
19:23 tenplus1     das my keyboard http://www.geeky-gadgets.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/Acer-Revo-70.jpg
19:24 Raven262     well that looks oddly flat
19:24 Jordach      mine https://i.ytimg.com/vi/hN19bR6KqqA/maxresdefault.jpg
19:25 tenplus1     yup P
19:25 Jordach      R G B  b o i s
19:25 tenplus1     ooh nice Jordach
19:25 Jordach      mechanical clicky
19:25 Raven262     Jordach, mine looks basically the same just with no lights and white
19:29 Calinou      https://lut.im/OeAKVa6rKf/L5vzxj6iVuexJT0z.png
19:29 Calinou      Memetest
19:29 Calinou      (:D)
19:29 Calinou      I made this
19:30 Raven262     lol
19:31 Fixer        Calinou: there is no spoon
19:40 paramat      tenplus1 see https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/5930#issuecomment-308821530 perhaps you can add a comment with your opinion?
19:42 paramat      all please note, an emoticon of support in a comment or 1st post isn't very noticeable, please add a comment if you feel strongly about something
19:44 tenplus1     hi twoelk
19:45 twoelk       hi11
19:45 Bobr         hi ten
19:45 tenplus1     hi bob
19:45 paramat      i moved my additional request to the main issue thread https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5915#issuecomment-308844357
19:46 tenplus1     commented
19:47 twoelk       I was just trying to grow trees fast and dearly missed the fertilizer mod - wonder what chance it has to be included in mtg :-D
19:48 tenplus1     twoelk: my bonemeal mod does the same and quick grows crops and grass also :)  github.com/tenplus1/bonemeal
19:49 Bobr         can some one help me with this error
19:49 Bobr         2017-06-15 21:41:16: ERROR[Main]: ServerError: AsyncErr: ServerThread::run Lua: Runtime error from mod 'default' in callback item_OnUse(): /home/di3hard139/.minetest/games/dcb/mods/default/tools.lua:398: attempt to index a nil value
19:49 twoelk       duh, bonemeal it was :-P
19:51 tenplus1     :PPP
19:53 Bobr         this error is confusing
20:07 kaeza        Bobr, start by looking at that line
20:07 kaeza        ?
20:07 Bobr         hmh
20:08 kaeza        the full traceback is also useful
20:09 paramat      for the moment we still consider MTG to be a simple 'core' to add modules to, so for the moment we are trying to resist adding anything specialist like fertiliser
20:10 tenplus1     keep that as a mod
20:10 paramat      new subgames are needed to be 'fun' or 'complete' as they are, MTG is not for that
20:12 paramat      the future of MTG is so uncertain it's best we are restrained for now, we are just adding some content (nodes, improving biomes) instead of fancy new features
20:14 tenplus1     fix bugs and add the small things that improves gameplay
20:14 paramat      exactly, for now
20:16 benrob0329   Hi tenplus1
20:16 tenplus1     hi benrob
20:17 benrob0329   Whats up?
20:17 tenplus1     chillin :PPP u?
20:17 benrob0329   Waiting for my new keyboard
20:18 tenplus1     kewl
20:20 tenplus1     nite folks
22:09 paramat      interesting, my hand is red in creative mode
22:09 Fixer        paramat: I've asked that before
22:09 Fixer        is this intended?
22:11 paramat      noooo
22:12 paramat      started in the last few commits
22:12 Fixer        yeah
22:12 paramat      does look good though, like a superpower glove
22:14 paramat      i know there's a graphics/shader issue that can make the whole world red
22:18 paramat      i have a cute red mitten =3
22:20 Jordach      sfan5, gc64 build pl0x
22:21 sfan5        uh?
22:21 sfan5        https://kitsunemimi.pw/tmp/minetest-0.4.16-gc64-win64.7z
22:21 Jordach      one with at least commit 7bfd53b
22:21 sfan5        why
22:21 Jordach      >Plantlike meshoptions: Fix inverted random vertical offset
22:22 Jordach      l o o k s  l i k e  t r a s h
22:22 sfan5        doesnt the gc64 crash too often to be useful?
22:22 Jordach      j u s t  l i k e  y o u r  w a i f u
22:22 Jordach      no, doesn't crash for me
22:22 sfan5        ok i'll make you one
22:22 Jordach      just make it latest
22:25 Jordach      i've had 0 crashes in Solar Plains with GC64
22:30 sfan5        Jordach: https://a.uguu.se/SnMHFMwmELBL_minetest-0.4.16-2ab09bb-gc64-win64.7z
22:31 Jordach      sfan5, why not make GC64 experimental builds every 2-4 weeks
22:31 sfan5        >effort
22:31 Jordach      you spent more effort making one build than automating it
22:31 Jordach      :thinking:
22:32 sfan5        swapping library files once in a while is less work than editing scripts & the html generator to deal with another category
22:32 Jordach      make a new directorly and let nginx handle that
22:33 Jordach      just https://minetest.kitsunemimi.pw/builds/experimental/
22:38 Jordach      >SnMHFMwmELBL_minetest-0.4.16-2ab09bb-gc64-win64.7z
22:38 Jordach      >14.4 KB/s - 5.8 MB of 10.5 MB, 6 mins left
22:38 sfan5        blame uguu
22:40 Jordach      >chromecast
22:40 Jordach      >youtube live steam
22:40 Jordach      >this stream is offline
22:41 Jordach      >still playing
22:41 Jordach      really activates the almonds
23:12 paramat      good grief it just gets worse the more i look https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/5930/files#r122332900
23:12 paramat      nerz is resisting as much as he can
23:14 bigfoot547   Or, you shouldn't disturb him until he finishes his baguette. :P (No hard feelings nrz, baguettes are awesome)
23:14 paramat      few devs are around to stand up to him, so i have to make a fuss
23:14 sfan5        paramat: how about you let him finish his damn pr before you come criticizing that it's not good enough
23:17 paramat      my comment there is valid
23:20 paramat      review happens before a PR is finished, and review is criticism
23:23 red-001      the pr doesn't even do anything yet
23:24 red-001      I say limit node and chat for now
23:25 paramat      does nothing because the of the default?
23:28 paramat      if the PR does nothing that's part of the problem with it :] and why i ask for default disabled
23:32 paramat      anything that is part of flavours is potentially harmful and therefore should be disabled by default
23:40 Fixer        sfan5: nice, will try it with Dreambuilder OOM modpack