Time Nick Message 09:45 copygirl I have a question that might be related to Minetest engine internals and might even be a "flaw" in the engine. 09:46 copygirl This is sort of as a player, but if I can help out Warr1024 with this that would be nice. 09:48 copygirl So in NodeCore I build machines that depend on entities and nodes updating. That is, item entities fall, and settle into nodes, and optics will tick and do things to the nodes. This can be pretty timing sensitive, so any out-of-syncness of the entity and node updates will often cause my machine to do something before the item has settled to become a node in-world, and thus break. 09:50 copygirl Unfortunately I'm unsure how NodeCore processes its node updates. Perhaps it's an internal buffer that gets filled with future upates that then get processed at certain intervals. I'll have to dive through the code, or maybe Warr1024 can fill me in. 09:52 copygirl So I'm wondering, what can be done to ensure that entity updates run more syncronously with node updates? Is there an event or hook that runs after all entities have been processed? Maybe that would be a good place to check for if enough time has passed to run the next batch of node updates. 09:54 sfan5 that's quite abstract. which engine feature is nodecore using to implement those "node updates" 09:54 sfan5 ? 09:57 copygirl Looks like it uses `register_globalstep` to process optics updates. 09:59 copygirl Just for reference, I *believe* this is where the optics updates hook into: https://gitlab.com/sztest/nodecore/-/blob/master/mods/nc_optics/api.lua#L289 10:00 copygirl (Currently seeing if nodecore's functions does anything different from minetest's builtin.) 10:02 copygirl From what I can see it's just calling the minetest function, you just also provide a label. 10:31 sfan5 that looks like it's keeping track of the nodes on its own and then the updates run every server step 10:32 sfan5 (entity updates also run every server step) 10:34 [MTMatrix] engine update -> mod update, eg. update legacy mods for new engine requirements, i think so 🤔 10:37 [MTMatrix] But yes, as sfan5 said, sync every server step, and server step valid for all versions of minetest 🤔 10:39 copygirl In what order is entity physics, entity events and global step being processed? 10:43 copygirl I guess by entity event I mean `on_step` in particular. 10:52 copygirl Is the tick rate in Minetest constant? Can it be made constant? 10:53 copygirl Or rather, can the delta time between each step/tick/update or whatever you call them be made constant? 10:58 [MTMatrix] for example, try make dedicated_server_step = 1.00 #, and players (player controlled entities) will be looks like glitch moves, also maybe valid for entities. I maybe wrong, wait for devs answer 10:59 [MTMatrix] for example, try make dedicated_server_step = 1.00 #, and players (player controlled entities) will be looks like glitch moves, also maybe valid for entities (not player controlled). I maybe wrong, wait for devs answer 11:17 copygirl Oh sorry by "delta time between each tick" I rather meant the delta time passed to those systems to be a constant value. If the server stutters for one reason or another, it would call update functions with that constant delta time until it's caught up. 11:17 copygirl I believe that's what some modern time-sensitive games do, such as FPS games. To code the game to be delta-time variant, but to keept the delta-time constant between each update for consistency. 11:18 copygirl And then you can adjust the tick rate for your server depending on how much resources you have available. 11:20 erle please explain how you can have a constant delta if the load changes 11:22 erle calling update functions with a constant delta until it's caught up only works up to a point 11:22 rubenwardy fixed time steps are done independently from the frame rate 11:25 erle rubenwardy what are you planning to use the thing for that you added where items have custom textures? 11:25 copygirl erle: When you get to the point where you can't keep up anymore you probably want to start skipping updates and print a big warning message. 11:26 rubenwardy I'm not planning to use it currently 11:27 erle oh, that explains a lot 11:27 erle (i wondered why comments on the PR about use cases were marked offtopic) 11:28 erle rubenwardy anyway, it will be useful for handheld maps i think 11:28 [MTMatrix] also, steps can be skipped if server got perfomance issues? 11:28 rubenwardy yeah. And enchanted tools or very dynamic items 11:31 erle i guess that now, if a handheld map item has a base64 encoded bitmap stored in meta you can use the ${foo} syntax and [png texmod to generate a nice framed item (instead of having to include it thrice for hud, handheld texture, inventory texture) 11:31 erle is that correct? 11:35 copygirl rubenwardy: I gotta ask, was that in response to erle or me? 11:36 erle i hope it was in response to me 11:36 erle bc that's how i interpreted it and responded myself 11:38 [MTMatrix] [micro offtop] messengers without replay/quote support be like :3 11:40 copygirl I mean, in IRC you just add the name of the person you wanna respond to. Though yes, it does lack the specific message you're responding to. 11:41 copygirl One thing I was curious about is whether this was reported on the issue tracker yet? 11:42 copygirl Mismatches in the way entities and nodes update (the latter done on globalstep) causes otherwise reliable machines to break seemingly randomly so it's certainly a bug of sorts. And I'm not sure if it's one NodeCore can work around to fix itself. 11:43 rubenwardy copygirl: to erle 11:44 [MTMatrix] minetest can run it? https://piped.thedroth.rocks/watch?v=FDiapbD0Xfg 👀 12:42 pgimeno "I mean, in IRC you just add the name of the person you wanna respond to. Though yes, it does lack the specific message you're responding to." - Depends on how lazy you are ;) 12:43 copygirl True true 13:08 [MTMatrix] ofc 13:48 json What time is the core developers meeting today? 13:51 Krock in 1 hour 13:52 json at 15 o'clock? 13:52 json UTC 13:56 json https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/12926 13:58 json Can you discuss whether to close this PR or not? 13:58 json a lot of time has passed and no activity 14:05 Krock sure 14:06 json thank you! 14:11 Krock It's still a draft and on the roadmap, thus I wonder why there's a particular interest in closing it. v-rob might want to resume the work when he's got time for it again. Also: do you happen to be known under another username? I'm asking in case you're a minetest organization member or related 14:11 Krock there's smarter things to do than closing draft PRs 14:59 Krock something came up, will be around in 15 minutes. 15:00 srifqi okay 15:08 Krock back 15:09 Krock general meeting ping Desour srifqi rubenwardy sfan5 ? 15:09 Krock https://dev.minetest.net/Meetings#2023-10-15 15:10 * Desour is here 15:11 Krock so today's plan is to enter the feature freeze 15:12 nrz_ oh i'm half around this time 😄 15:12 sfan5 copygirl: you can follow the broad sequence here https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/serverenvironment.cpp#L1328 15:12 sfan5 I'm online but not guaranteed I can take part entirely 15:13 Desour is it realistic that all the remaining milestone points are completed within 2 weeks? 15:15 Krock there's tough ones like #13849 15:15 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13849 -- Inventorylist: It's no longer possible to collect items from slots via drop and pickup doubleclick 15:15 Krock I mean the double-click feature could be removed but that might undo an explicit feature of the PR 15:16 Krock closed the set_list() bug. It works on master. At least one down. 15:17 srifqi i wouldn't say that 13849 is a bug, though. it is _different_ than the prev version indeed, but not in a bad way. the descibed action can be done with click + drag for example 15:17 Krock unfortunately grorp is not available today so that we could know what happened to #13885 to become a draft 15:17 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13885 -- Clean up and improve mainmenu theme / game theme code by grorp 15:17 srifqi i was going to ask about that, too 15:17 Desour before I opened it, I've looked how hard is it to fix 13849. I haven't found an easy way, due to how doubleclicking is handled. but I could craft together a hacky fix 15:20 Krock > Left-double-click to pickup up all of a selected item 15:20 Krock well I suppose we have to undo this 15:20 Krock fortunately there's shift click + listrings that make the movement easier 15:22 Krock how about the MTG debundling? 15:22 Krock #13850 improved on that a bit 15:22 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13850 -- Notify users that they need to reinstall MTG if they still want it by grorp 15:23 Desour I'm not sure if a revert is justified. I've added the bug label, but it's just changed input. my workflow of moving around items is not a documented feature. I mean, I would prefer a revert over no change, but idk how others feel about this 15:24 Krock sorry I did not mean an entire revert but to undo that particular feature 15:25 Krock theoretically the first click should not be counted if there's a selected item stack that will be or was dropped 15:26 Krock (first click is where you are about to drop the dragged itemstack onto another stack) 15:26 Desour (I didn't mean an entire revert either) 15:27 Desour the doubleclick is not handled by the item move code, but by some other code in guiformspecmenu, that triggers special doubleclick events, iirc 15:28 srifqi i tried to exclude that specific case, but hasn't succeed 15:28 Desour anyway, I'll try to come up with a dirty fix. refactoring can happen later 15:29 Krock also failed to find any relevant double-click code right now. anyway. I'd appreciate it if you could come up with a fix for that 15:30 Krock otherwise maybe OrgelGames has an idea on how to fix it 15:30 Krock -r 15:31 Krock next important open point is #13799 as a requirement for #13818 15:31 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13799 -- Allow games (just MTG?) to enforce lock-step upgrades with versions 15:31 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13818 -- Debundle Minetest Game by rollerozxa 15:32 Krock we've discussed this in the last meeting and it turned out that preinstalled games cannot be detected by CDB 15:32 Krock (or rather: their version cannot be detected) 15:36 erle given that both issue #13794 and PR #13877 are more downvoted than upvoted and TGA is in use and the only way some things can be done right now from a mod perspective, is there any support for PR #13877 ? 15:36 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13794 -- Remove TGA deprecation and put it in a ”do not deprecate again” list 15:36 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13877 -- Remove deprecation mark on TGA texture format in lua_api.md by corarona 15:36 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13877 -- Remove deprecation mark on TGA texture format in lua_api.md by corarona 15:37 srifqi Krock: i don't have any opinion on MTG debundle because i still can't get the idea or the effects it would be when it finally debundled, sorry 15:38 erle srifqi that sounds like “this should be deferred until the effects are clear, but mark it as deprecated” 15:38 Krock I suppose the easiest solution for the version detection is to rely on package managers so that MTG is removed automatically on update. And in the case of Windows users that they use a new directory rather than replacing files 15:38 erle by package managers you mean apt and stuff? 15:38 Krock what else would I mean? 15:39 erle i have no idea, which is why i am asking 15:39 erle uh, who was the debian maintainer for minetest again? 15:39 erle maybe other projects have experience with unbundling 15:40 sfan5 "preinstalled games cannot be detected by CDB" can someone fill me in (or add a link) for the context? 15:40 proller time to schedule merging https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/12142 ! 15:42 erle proller how does “NOT FINISHED, HAVE BUGS” and a locked PR that has commit messages like “fix”, “fixes”, “better” and “clean” (LOL) have anything to do with anything rn? 15:42 srifqi sfan5: i'm guessing it is the release field in game.conf. 15:42 Krock sfan5: CDB adds specific fields to mod.conf or game.conf so that it can detect which version is installed 15:43 erle Krock srifqi is anything keeping you from adding that field to the pre-installed version of minetest_game for exactly one minetest release? 15:43 Krock so the concern was that people with RUN_IN_PLACE=1 builds would carry over their previous MTG version through various methods (replacing files or moving games/ and mods/) so that they're forever stuck with an old version 15:43 Desour sfan5: that was discussed in last meeting, iirc. essentially, it's not possible to differentiate manual installations of mtg (e.g. with git instead of with contentdb) from shipped mtg installations (e.g. by windows users that decompress a zip to replace their old minetest installation) 15:44 sfan5 ah, I see 15:44 sfan5 can't really fix that can we? 15:45 proller erle: 1. switching to 32 should be disabled by default for first time 2. it have no bugs in old 16bit mode 3. its should be merged with squash 15:45 Krock we'd have to bundle "fake" CDB data for one or two Minetest versions including the bundled Minetest Game 15:45 srifqi the alternative might be releasing MTG first, then bundling it (from CDB) with the ZIP download 15:45 srifqi ah, wait, no 15:45 erle Krock that sounds like a plan? 15:46 sfan5 are we actually planning to remove MTG this release then? 15:46 Krock relevant history https://irc.minetest.net/minetest-dev/2023-10-01#i_6118957 15:47 Krock sfan5: I've seen this request being brought up many times but I am not sure how many different people actually care about it 15:47 erle proller query 15:47 Krock tbh I do not care whether or not MTG is bundled forever 15:48 Krock at least #9509 shows some interest 15:48 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/9509 -- Ship MTEngine with no games, choose and install from the Content Database (after main menu improvements) 15:48 sfan5 I thought the consensus was to do it but only when 15:48 sfan5 only a question of when* 15:48 erle i don't see how it is a bad thing if the transition can be done properly. with the exception that minetest_game would have to be backwards compatible (but it is not a moving target much) 15:49 sfan5 anyway the 'fake CDB data' approach could introduce new issues if we're not careful, e.g. MT trying to update data in a read-only place 15:49 srifqi the additional 2 weeks was added just for having enough time to debundle MTG (from last meeting) 15:49 sfan5 but really it doesn't seem like so much of an issue, package managers will remove old files and windows users are on their own anyway 15:50 Krock assuming that package maintainers follow the project path by not bundling MTG 15:50 Desour most package managers are probably reachable per e-mail 15:50 sfan5 if we remove it from our cmake scripts it should disappear 15:50 Krock but I'd support adding those fields by using build scripts, for example. 15:51 sfan5 I'd put a big note into the releases in addition 15:51 erle would special detection for .git folders for minetest game help anyone? 15:52 Krock normies do not clone. you can ignore that case. 15:52 srifqi bundled MTG does not have .git folder (at least on Windows) 15:53 erle developers of games do have git cloned stuff in their source dirs and i assume at least some of them are here 15:54 Krock sfan5: do you think debundling for 5.8.0 could work? 15:55 Krock erle: those people (should) know what they're doing, thus not a concern. it's their responsibility to be up-to-date 15:55 Krock I mean it also doesn't hurt to continue 5.8.0 the usual way 15:56 sfan5 I think it could work 15:56 sfan5 #13799 is not a critically important part 15:56 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13799 -- Allow games (just MTG?) to enforce lock-step upgrades with versions 15:56 Krock right 15:57 Krock based on that, I don't see any further required dependencies for #13818 - or are there? 15:57 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13818 -- Debundle Minetest Game by rollerozxa 15:57 sfan5 correct 15:58 sfan5 worst case some engine change does break MTG and users will have to manually check CDB and click the 'update' button 15:58 sfan5 (are update notifications planned?) 15:58 Desour actually, it should be enough to add a big note saying that mtg is no longer shipped with mt, and if users want an up-to-date mtg installation, they should remove their old installation to get it from contentdb. if someone manually upgrades minetest by downloading a file, the extra step of deleting the old mtg shouldn't be hard 15:58 sfan5 you'd add that note to www.minetest.net/downloads/? 15:59 Krock sfan5: it would be easiest to have those notifications done by CDB which has its own said problems 15:59 Desour sfan5: yes, but only where it's relevant, i.e. at the windows section 16:00 sfan5 Krock: a notification that a mod/game/txp installed from CDB has an update is what I meant, yes 16:00 Krock however I think the chances for breaking MTG by engine changes is rather unrealistic 16:01 Krock sfan5: don't those notifications already appear in the main menu? If they've installed MTG via CDB that's not a problem 16:01 sfan5 no idea 16:01 sfan5 anyway we can consider this point solved 16:02 Krock okay they do yet not show up directly in the mein menu but rather in the CDB formspec 16:02 Krock although I remember a PR that would add an asterisk and update indicator to the tab 16:02 srifqi it hasn't been merged 16:03 srifqi #13807 16:03 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13807 -- Add package update detection on Content tab by rubenwardy 16:04 Krock okay that would be nice to have 16:04 Krock not too important either, though. 16:06 srifqi about the black screen on Android, i can't do anything because i don't have any device that has that problem 16:07 Krock do we yet know which devices that are affected? or rather - which kind of hardware? 16:07 erle which issue is it? 16:07 Krock #13519 16:07 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13519 -- Android: Black Screen 16:07 sfan5 graphics related problems on android are often unfortunately a "lol no idea" situation since every vendor cooks their own soup 16:08 srifqi indeed, it heavily depends on the vendor 16:08 Krock I could try it on my smartphone but that's hardly relevant due to being a dinosaur at this point 16:08 erle Krock it might lead to new knowledge though 16:08 Krock is there a way to find out whether shaders failed to compile? 16:09 Krock in that case it might be possible to disable those automatically 16:09 erle wouldn't that show up in debug.txt? 16:09 sfan5 the log would show it 16:09 Krock checking 16:09 Krock ah okay 16:10 Krock there's however no relevant log entry here: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13519#issuecomment-1562600342 16:11 sfan5 it would be useful if there was a way to produce a verbose log on Android 16:11 sfan5 or wasn't that logged to logcat anyway? I don't remember 16:11 srifqi all log level are outputted to logcat 16:12 Krock did the Android build get removed from GitHub Actions? Those were pretty helpful to not compile it on my own 16:13 sfan5 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/actions/runs/6484455037 still there 16:14 Krock so it was smart enough to skip the build in commit 5e0f14266d42b5, which is why I was confused 16:14 srifqi isn't there a list of files to be changed to trigger a build? 16:15 Krock I'd assume that build system changes (e.g. CMakeLists.txt) is important enough. Such list would explain it, though. 16:16 srifqi the issue creator said that it happens in 5.7.0, so we can just download from Play Store/GitHub release to test it 16:17 sfan5 Krock: was probably forgotten since android now also uses cmake 16:17 srifqi fyi, 5.7.0 can run fine on BlueStacks: 16:17 MTDiscord https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747163566800633906/1163148713963823235/version-5-7-0-on-bluestacks.png?ex=653e85a7&is=652c10a7&hm=9bf50aa5662d6ced1ab93c159800473b63d0c04250cf08dea11dd2ae6ce506ed& 16:19 srifqi since it is not a crash, there might be no reports about it in Play Store dashboard 16:20 sfan5 I'm sure you could see it in user reviews however 16:20 erle regarding android, consider the following: https://github.com/gonetz/GLideN64/pull/2633 16:20 erle > Newer PowerVR devices need depth to be cleared every frame, otherwise most geometry is rendered behind the background. 16:20 erle > It also needs fragment based depth to be disabled, otherwise geometry has various depth glitches. 16:20 erle does this explain anything? 16:20 erle i mean it is not a black screen, but the results are like this: https://github.com/gonetz/GLideN64/issues/2108#issuecomment-581099066 16:22 Krock Works on Mali-T624 16:22 Krock that's all I can tell 16:23 erle well this particular PowerVR stuff seems to have been an issue for a bunch of projects. like godot engine also has bug reports about rendering fails. something is weird about it ig. 16:23 erle i mean the PowerVR GE8320 16:23 Krock in either case, that issue might be better placed in minetest/irrlicht 16:24 Krock unless it turns out to be a shader compiling error 16:25 Krock we don't have enough information or devices to actually reproduce this issue, hence I am not sure what to do with it 16:25 srifqi1 any shader error would result in a massive amount of errors in the debug.txt 16:25 sfan5 close as can't reproduce/can't fix? 16:25 srifqi1 shader compilation error* 16:26 Krock sfan5: keep it open. it's an issue that needs to be fixed. But I'm not sure whether to keep it in the 5.8 milestone 16:27 sfan5 IMO no 16:28 erle the issue has someone who posted just now 16:28 erle and can reproduce 16:28 erle or so it seems. i asked them to come to #minetest-dev 16:29 erle maybe one of you can help them to get the debug info out of the hardware 16:29 erle (i can assist them with adb logcat, but i can not interpret the logs) 16:30 srifqi ah, the device is not used anymore 16:32 erle so with https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13519#issuecomment-1763440866 being written, what's the next topic? 16:34 sfan5 going for a walk now, afk 16:34 Krock the other issues look rather minor 16:34 erle what about https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/13877 16:35 Krock erle: no objections. can be merged within the feature freeze if it gets the approvals 16:36 erle well, i was asking for approvals actually. since i don't want to do effort for nothing i'll basically stop work on everything that would be affected (i.e. every mod i made that does non-trivial things). 16:38 Krock ok 16:39 Krock this meeting is again dragging on for quite a while. I think the topic update for feature freeze will have to wait on someone who's got the MinetestBot permissions for that 16:39 Krock there's not too much important waiting from the milestone so I suppose it's about time for that 16:40 Krock I also have to leave now; feel free to discuss the remaining topics if needed but from what I can see the most important ones are done now 16:40 Krock thanks for participating 16:41 srifqi thank you for organizing 16:41 erle for reference, these are still open for the milestone: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/milestones/5.8.0 16:45 srifqi i'll leave for now, too 16:45 unbiquadium if my question is ontopic, will the two finger stack splitting solved? 16:46 unbiquadium in 5.8 i mean 16:47 unbiquadium every client i found is based on 5.8 dev and its getting frustrating 16:48 erle what issue? 16:49 Desour unbiquadium: if you're referring to #13822, that's on the milestone and should be fixed till next release. you could try out the PR that already exists 16:49 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13822 -- Regression in splitting inventory stacks on Android 16:49 erle for future reference, these are the milestone things right now https://web.archive.org/web/20231015164259if_/https://github.com/minetest/minetest/milestones/5.8.0 16:49 MTDiscord it should be fixed with #13872, though I haven't tested it myself 16:49 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13872 -- Formspec: Allow multiple mouse button click for touch-screen by srifqi 16:49 erle 13822 is on the list 16:49 unbiquadium yes that 16:49 erle for 5.8.0 16:49 erle so ig you are good unless that changes 16:50 unbiquadium also, can i hope that anything similar to @grorp's fork add will be 16:50 unbiquadium i mean virtual conteols android 16:51 unbiquadium i played a LOT with it and i really like that i can literally pvp with half limitations 16:57 unbiquadium forgive my english,just look at the screenshot, the leftclick and rightclick buttons are well requested https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13229 17:04 sfan5 are we in feature freeze now? 17:25 Krock sfan5: last week's plan was to enter it today 17:26 Krock however #13818 yet needs to be merged 17:26 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/13818 -- Debundle Minetest Game by rollerozxa 17:37 Krock rubenwardy: how come Android does not remove MTG on update? 17:37 sfan5 hopefully it actually deletes old files instead of overwriting, would be broken otherwise 17:38 sfan5 might just be a special casing for 'games' tho 17:38 rubenwardy There's no code to do so 17:38 rubenwardy Minetest game won't be in the archive any more, so it won't touch that directory 17:39 sfan5 so it has just been overwriting the old files all the time? 17:39 rubenwardy I don't think so 17:39 ROllerozxa ...yep 17:39 ROllerozxa it just extracts the assets zip into the data folder, it doesn't remove anything first 17:39 Krock that's stupid. I thought Android also had some sort of package manager to keep track of the installed files? 17:39 rubenwardy The android app copies the archive contents to the user data dir, there's no share directory 17:39 rubenwardy We're not using any package manager for this 17:40 rubenwardy This is just the android app extracting a .zip file 17:41 rubenwardy It would be better to somehow mount the archive so the data inside could be used like a share location, without having to copy it 17:41 Krock regardless on whether we keep MTG bundled or not - that approach of overwriting needs to be fixed 17:42 rubenwardy Even if it did delete the folders first instead of overwriting, that wouldn't have helped us here 17:43 Krock mount-zip (via fuse) on android 8) 17:43 rubenwardy Unless it somehow remembered what files were extracted 17:43 sfan5 sounds like we need an one-time special code that deletes MTG 17:44 rubenwardy Yeah, based on version code of the app? 17:44 Krock could we check the directory creation timestamp? 17:44 sfan5 maybe also switch to separating share/user at this opportunity 18:05 erle mods can't write to the game directory, right? only to world dir? 18:08 MTDiscord I think mods can write to their mod folder, at least during load time? 18:08 erle i just want to figure out if anything of value could get lost 18:09 MTDiscord "The following functions, which are not available to CSM / SSM-only, allow read-only access to all mod directories and write access to the current loading mod’s directory only while it’s loading (a handle with write access to a file within the mod directory can however be stored and used at a later time) and read & write access to the world directory excepting the worldmods and game subfolders" - 18:09 MTDiscord https://github.com/minetest/minetest_docs/blob/master/doc/environment.adoc 18:09 MTDiscord this was how i documented this a while ago, hope it's still accurate 18:09 erle yeah okay but is any mod in minetest_game doing it 18:09 MTDiscord in minetest_game? not that i'm aware of 18:10 erle should i take this as “i have not looked and am making it up” or “i would remember if that was the case”? 18:43 MTDiscord Sfan5 is right, we should delete mtg 18:49 ROllerozxa jordan4ibanez: working on it 18:50 erle delete mtg, the delete system32 of minetest 18:51 erle ROllerozxa so what's your opinion on the version hack thing 18:51 ROllerozxa ~~comparing it to system32 implies MTG is a critical component of minetest~~ 18:51 ShadowBot ROllerozxa: Error: You must be registered to use this command. If you are already registered, you must either identify (using the identify command) or add a hostmask matching your current hostmask (using the "hostmask add" command). 18:51 ROllerozxa registered to who 18:51 erle ~~what~~ 18:51 ROllerozxa anyways erle: what version hack? 18:52 erle ROllerozxa add a CDB version field to minetest_game for one or two releases 18:52 erle i mean to the included version 18:56 ROllerozxa manually adding a release field to the game.conf? 18:57 ROllerozxa I admit I haven't fully caught up on the current discussion as I was away during most of the meeting 19:01 erle “context is what scrolls away at the top of the window” ROllerozxa 19:17 sfan5 does someone maybe have a mac device and can test irr#252 19:17 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/irrlicht/issues/252 -- Backport upstream commits by sfan5