Time  Nick       Message
02:15 MTDiscord  <Jordach> first river algo prototype works
02:15 MTDiscord  <Jordach> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747163566800633906/959274687727296542/unknown.png
02:15 MTDiscord  <Jordach> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/747163566800633906/959274880522653746/unknown.png
03:49 rubenwardy Zughy, x2048: being able to customise the light curve is something that's requested a lot
03:50 rubenwardy Also, a saturation adjustment post effect doesn't feel like a lighting thing
04:46 yzziizzy   Not sure if this is the right channel, but 5.6.0-dev-3dd7d7867 (pulled a few minutes ago) seems to duplicate then leak global variables from mods in lua
04:46 yzziizzy   It appears to do this in relation to generating new chunks
04:46 yzziizzy   https://pastebin.com/pfS16Tg1
04:47 yzziizzy   Fly into ungenerated areas and you can see the memory usage rise. In a few minutes the game crashes with an error saying Lua went over its memory limit
04:47 yzziizzy   ... or maybe I'm missing something.
04:49 yzziizzy   The example uses 40mb all at once just for demonstration. It also happens for me eventually with lower usage.
04:51 yzziizzy   This is a fresh install. I've only jacked up the default graphics settings, and adjusted default_privs for development convenience
06:07 Zughy[m]   override_day_night_ratio makes MT crash if no argument is passed. It makes sense with the documentation (https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L7004), but shouldn't `none` be accepted as well - like in many other `set` functions? In case I can make a PR
06:09 Zughy[m]   I mean, yes, it's called `override`, but it looks like a normal `set` function to me
06:09 Zughy[m]   Like `set_sky` etc
06:10 Zughy[m]   (with `none` I mean no parameters at all)
06:46 sfan5      yzziizzy: its pretty much impossible that such a bug was introduced accidentally
06:47 sfan5      so it'll be something about your Lua environment that causes this
06:51 erle       Zughy[m] i see no benefit in changing the function signature here. it introduces an incompatibility with past versions and adds permanent variable arity for literally no benefit than help people who can't be arsed to read the documentation.
06:51 yzziizzy   Any tips for where to start looking? I'm using system LuaJIT on gentoo.
06:52 erle       Zughy[m] given that reading the documentation is the first thing someone would do before using that function, how did you even encounter the bug?
06:52 erle       “bug”
06:53 sfan5      which version is it? also check if the GC64 option is enabled at buildtime
06:57 yzziizzy   2.05-r3
06:58 yzziizzy   But.... https://bugs.gentoo.org/685010
06:58 yzziizzy   Looks like this is exactly a known issue.
06:58 yzziizzy   Thanks. I''s recompile with the bundled version
07:27 sfan5      2.0.5 is very out of date, you want at least 2.1.0-beta3 or better git HEAD
07:27 sfan5      upstream doesn't make releases anymore
07:29 yzziizzy   Ah. I just got the latest git version and it seems to level off around 1.7gb of memory usage, but doesn't crash anymore.
07:29 yzziizzy   For the record, /should/ GC64 be enabled or disabled for minetest?
07:34 sfan5      it should be enabled so that luajit can properly use all memory available to it
07:35 yzziizzy   ok
07:37 yzziizzy   2022-04-01 07:33:07: ERROR[Main]: Current Lua memory usage: 1003 MB
07:37 yzziizzy   With it enabled, I get this crash.
07:38 yzziizzy   Do I need to bump up some memory limit in minetest config?
07:42 Zughy[m]   erle: how exactly is avoiding a crash an incompatibility? By the way, I encountered the crash because - as I was messing with the celestial vault as well - I was expecting it to behave like set_sun, sky etc.
07:45 erle       Zughy[m] so you did not read the documentation i guess
07:45 erle       before using the function for the first time
07:46 erle       Zughy[m] the incompatibility is that new code using the new-argument form will not work in older versions, for no good reason IMO – as functionality is the same if passing nil.
07:46 Zughy[m]   Yes, I did, and when I read `nil` I thought "ok, it works like the others"
07:46 erle       hmm, is this maybe a function argument misunderstanding?
07:46 erle       i thought missing arguments were indeed taken as nil
07:47 Zughy[m]   no, lua C++ library differentiates between no arguments and nil
07:48 erle       are you proposing that every function that can have nil as a singular argument also should have a form where it does the same with no arguments?
07:49 Zughy[m]   on a Lua scripting point of view, it makes sense, as there is no difference between no arguments and `nil`
07:49 Zughy[m]   this is the line by the way: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/cf650fcaac33af2c60af3880f9b28358e30d75a4/src/script/lua_api/l_object.cpp#L2212
07:50 erle       i am not sure if this is a good general principle
07:51 erle       (i think if you were coding erlang or elixir it would be obvious that it is a bad general principle, at least in those languages)
07:52 Zughy[m]   I think it is, as modders are not expected to know that C++ treats `nil` and none differently
07:54 erle       i guess you don't care about the incompatibility then
07:55 erle       i think it is actually good UX to enforce arity
07:59 yzziizzy   Looks like LuaJIT is just a broken, abandoned project, based on all the forums. Back to regular Lua it is...
07:59 yzziizzy   Thanks for your help, sfan5
08:00 sfan5      > Do I need to bump up some memory limit in minetest config?
08:00 sfan5      no such thing
08:01 sfan5      LuaJIT works fine but you need to take care to use a recent enough version and not accidentally configure it wrong
08:01 sfan5      2.1.0-beta3 with GC64 enabled should have none of these issues
08:03 yzziizzy   That's the version I'm using, with GC64 enabled. Various forums say that it's still limited to 1gb on Linux, apparently. The universal workaround it to use regular Lua.
08:04 yzziizzy   Something to do with the 32-bit address range flags passed to mmap()
08:05 Zughy[m]   <erle> "i guess you don't care about the..." <- I care about having a fluid experience, and Minetest is not some software used to launch people into the space anyway
08:08 erle       Zughy[m] what do you mean with “fluid experience”?
08:10 erle       Zughy[m] say i accept your argument that functions that set stuff should mirror functions that get stuff. then override_day_night_ratio() should take EXACTLY the arguments that get_day_night_ratio() spits out. which is a single value that represents a ratio or is nil.
08:10 erle       Zughy[m] there is no way to get *no* value out of get_day_night_ratio()
08:11 sfan5      GC64 is the exact thing that lifts the 1/2GB limit
08:11 sfan5      but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
08:13 yzziizzy   Who knows. I'll fiddle with it more when I have more time to see if I can flush out the issue.
08:29 Zughy[m]   erle: what, does get_day_night_ratio() return the current ratio of the day if not overridden?
08:29 Zughy[m]   it says "returns the ratio or nil if it isn't overridden", so no
08:29 Zughy[m]   and again, no difference between nil and no argument at all. Or am I wrong?
08:35 Zughy[m]   also, passing a non existing table field (like player:override_day_night_ratio(a_table.non_existing_field)) apparently doesn't crash the game nor actually reset the player day night ratio. Just, nothing happens
08:37 Zughy[m]   nevermind about the last one, my bad
15:42 Pexin      question: at what point in the dev cycle is protocol version expected to bump?
15:42 sfan5      at any point when necessary, as often as necessary
15:44 Pexin      mm. well #11939 has gotten no attention, and I don't know if it's because simply core devs have no time, if core devs hate it to death, or if it's just waiting for proto version bump
15:44 ShadowBot  https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/11939 -- Restore and enhance bouncy behavior by pecksin
15:44 Pexin      I'm assuming mostly notime available
15:45 sfan5      yes
15:46 Pexin      ok
15:47 Pexin      (the scope of that PR has grown since created btw, and is definitely more "feature" than "bugfix" now - though it really is both)
15:52 MTDiscord  <luatic> Zughy: No, nil is not the same as "no arguments" in Lua; you can very well differentiate between the two. But I agree, in most cases it's the same. Unfortunately our docs often say "returns nil" when they actually mean "returns nothing". Luckily this doesn't matter in expressions or when assigning to variables.
15:55 MTDiscord  <luatic> Most Lua builtin funcs which work on varargs do care about nils. There's select("#", nil) == 1 vs. select"#" == 0. There's math.min(1, 2, 3) which will work just fine and math.min(1, 2, 3, nil) which will throw an error. ("%s"):format() will throw an error while ("%s"):format(nil) won't.
16:05 Zughy[m]   what do you suggest?
16:06 MTDiscord  <luatic> nothing
16:07 MTDiscord  <luatic> as in, return nothing instead of an explicit nil
16:07 MTDiscord  <luatic> but also accept nothing as an argument and don't require an explicit nil
16:07 MTDiscord  <luatic> would you write return nil in Lua? probably not
16:08 MTDiscord  <luatic> some_func(nil, nil, ...) feels about as odd
16:08 rubenwardy I do
16:08 rubenwardy `return nil` can be clearer about intent than `return`
16:17 Zughy[m]   so you're basically agreeing with me about the override function?
16:23 jwmhjwmh   If a function is documented as returning nil, it should definitely return nil explicitly. See the problem described here: #11666
16:23 ShadowBot  https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/11666 -- Make MetaDataRef:get() return nil instead of nothing by TurkeyMcMac
17:18 MTDiscord  <luatic> jwmhjwmh: agreed, I'd just prefer it if we could fix the docs instead (pretty sure the intention was to say it returns "nothing" and not "nil" and the author just deemed the two synonymous); although I guess technically that's breaking and has to wait for a major release
18:55 Desour     :+1: for treating none and nil the same in override_day_night_ratio(), like in (almost?) all other minetest api functions...