Time Nick Message 01:43 MTDiscord :thonxel: 14:25 kilbith @x2048 for me it's very simple; shaders enabled -> use OIT, otherwise fallback to the less efficient BSP-tree implementation 14:34 MTDiscord kilbith: A BSP-tree implementation isn't necessarily less efficient; the main problem is that it can hardly get some cases right, especially with our mapblock meshgen (mapblock mesh vs. entity or particle sorting might require splitting the generated mesh). 14:36 kilbith not an expert but I believe that GPU does sorting more efficiently, we are too tied to CPU 14:39 MTDiscord not an expert either but I doubt that, considering that GPUs lack branching 14:39 [GK]FrostDragon hi all 14:40 MTDiscord this IRC is for engine dev 14:40 [GK]FrostDragon i have an issue 14:40 [GK]FrostDragon i want to reort it 14:40 MTDiscord the efficient sorting algorithms I know that take O(n log n) all require branching 14:41 [GK]FrostDragon report* 14:41 MTDiscord then do so on GitHub please, and do it immediately (don't ask to ask) 14:41 [GK]FrostDragon well i wanted to find out what was the best channel 14:41 MTDiscord dev IRC is fine for bug reports 14:41 [GK]FrostDragon guthub? fine thx, that's what i came for 14:42 [GK]FrostDragon well to me this is a bug, but to you maybe not.. i am not a dev im not sure what constitutes a bug 14:43 MTDiscord kilbith: the OIT approach doesn't even sort, it just replaces the composition operator to be able to apply order-independent blending: "One approach to avoid the cost of storing and sorting primitives or fragments is to alter the compositing operator so that it is order independent, thus allowing a pure streaming approach." 14:43 [GK]FrostDragon i don't think github is the place for this issue either. it's not to do with the installation or the files. i'm talking about the game itself 14:43 MTDiscord Minetest Game? 14:44 [GK]FrostDragon well yes 14:44 MTDiscord There's a GH issue tracker for that too: https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/new 14:45 MTDiscord Feature requests etc. are also allowed (but extremely unlikely to get implemented and very likely to be closed). 14:45 [GK]FrostDragon yeah i don't think it's that kind of issue. can i talk to someone about the game pls? or can i report this to someone who is involved with the game or who will forward it to someone who is 14:45 MTDiscord I am involved with the game. 14:45 [GK]FrostDragon ok i will pm you 14:46 MTDiscord Where? You can't PM me through the bridge I believe. 14:50 rubenwardy You can ask here 14:58 MTDiscord kilbith: Interesting, one of the authors seems to be working for roblox: "Morgan McGuire - Roblox & University of Waterloo" 14:59 kilbith I should be contributing to Roblox for real 15:47 rubenwardy merging #12093 in 10 15:47 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/12093 -- Fix broken dependency enabling due to missing `enabled` field by rubenwardy 16:48 erlehmann kilbith thanks for the OIT pointers. it's really cool! 17:44 kilbith @x2048 new PR: https://github.com/MultiCraft/MultiCraft2/pull/41 17:46 kilbith and ofc numberZero ignored appgurueu's comment on the OIT PR 17:46 kilbith he stopped collaborating with us 17:47 kilbith historically, those russians are not really willing to collaborate 17:48 kilbith they're either forking and making "hostile" moves from upstream 17:49 MTDiscord it's always the russians isn't it 17:52 MTDiscord also the fact multicraft upgraded their license to LGPLv3 so it's incompatible (?) with upstream minetest feels really scummy 17:53 kilbith that's only the top of the iceberg you know 17:53 erlehmann Sublayer plank no one forces minetest do stay LGPLv2+ instead of LGPLv3+ 17:53 MTDiscord no, the reason that they upgraded is to be "legal" in the appstore 17:53 erlehmann the appstore does not like old licensing? 17:53 MTDiscord at least that is there view to the gpl and app store mess 17:53 MTDiscord NAL 17:53 kilbith I can tell you that the Multicraft owner is hostile toward MT 17:53 kilbith c55 can certainly tell more 17:54 kilbith that was the same story with xyz and proller at the time 17:54 erlehmann yeah, but the licensing thing seems to have an easy workaround, unless minetest contains LGPLv2-only code (which would be a problem in itself) 17:54 erlehmann xyz and proller upgraded to LGPLv3 and that is why their contributions needed special approval afterwards to get into minetest proper? 17:55 kilbith to GPL 17:55 kilbith not LGPL 17:55 MTDiscord erlehmann: well true, nobody is forcing us to stay on LGPLv2.1... but wouldn't we need permission from every contributor to upgrade? 17:55 erlehmann not if it was licensed lgplv2+ from the start 17:56 erlehmann > LGPL (version 2.1 or later) 17:57 erlehmann sublayer plank you only need to get permission if you do something that goes contrary to the “or later”-suggestion by the FSF 17:57 kilbith anyway that's BS to think that MultiCraft can sue MT, this is not in their interest and there's no benefit to get from that 17:57 erlehmann in fact, linus torvalds put a doo doo into his licensing info by doing this GPLv2-only thing 17:57 erlehmann kilbith debian or others would care for compliance reasons 17:58 kilbith 0.1% of our userbase, sure 17:58 kilbith if not less 18:00 kilbith MultiCraft is a rogue "company", not even paying their workers legally 18:01 erlehmann kilbith wdym, tax evasion? 18:01 kilbith it's all under the table 18:01 erlehmann oh, tax evasion 18:01 kilbith sure, MoNTE48 have to leave from place to place in Europe and now in Cypprus to evade taxes 18:01 erlehmann well, if you wanna take them down and have inside info, ig you can snitch 18:01 erlehmann lol 18:01 MTDiscord uh oh 18:01 MTDiscord lol 18:02 kilbith and he has no allowed to get back in Ukraine (its home country) anymore 18:02 kilbith as I said, you only see the top of the icebarg 18:02 erlehmann rubenwardy, i saw you added one approval, but it's not your own approval, right? just a cleanup? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/12089 18:03 erlehmann kilbith arguably, it's a bad place to be anyway as of … about this morning or so :( 18:05 kilbith what you don't know also is that some Minetest core-devs have profited of this system without letting the community know about that 18:07 erlehmann well, you can surerly write an article on that if you think it is important 18:08 kilbith no, I'll let them speak about that on their initiative until I get pissed off 18:10 erlehmann ah, you keep it as kompromat? 18:11 erlehmann doesn't make you seem *nice*, but i already know you do not care about that hehe 18:12 MTDiscord oh a conspiracy? 18:13 kilbith I do still have all the logs and screen captures 18:14 kilbith I've been working with MultiCraft during 6 months and been on daily contact with MoNTE48 18:14 erlehmann would be wise to have good backups ig 18:15 definitelya_ c: 18:17 definitelya_ Interesting... I'll go back to trying to install Arch now. 18:32 definitelya_ hmm that makes me sound a bit pathetic, sorry it's an anxious day for all right? 18:34 MTDiscord every day is an arch installation day