Time Nick Message 02:13 paramat working on improving night sky https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4146#issuecomment-221745654 02:33 * est31 is still working on the joystick thing 02:35 Zeno` paramat #3919 02:35 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3919 -- Add base64 encoding and decoding to the lua api. by red-001 02:36 Zeno` it's an "official" +1 if ShadowNinja's comment regarding newlines was addressed 02:36 paramat ok 02:36 Zeno` I think it has been 02:37 Zeno` hmmmmm's comment has been addressed as well 02:38 Zeno` it's been done in a strange way though (maybe they had a squash problem I dunno) 02:38 Zeno` yeah it's official, I'll update my comment 02:39 paramat nice 02:41 paramat labelled #4135 as high priority 02:41 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4135 -- Biomegen by kwolekr 02:42 est31 I guess it blocks lots of mapgen stuff 02:42 paramat hmmmm would like extra review for that due to size 02:43 est31 okay adding action needed label 02:43 est31 to track the required review 02:44 paramat yeah much more mapgen re-organization is coming 02:45 Zeno` can you change the name of biomegen? 02:45 Zeno` I stare at it for 2 minutes everytime I see it wondering wtf "bio megen" is 02:46 paramat lol 02:46 Zeno` seriously :) heheh 02:46 Zeno` bio is the much more common prefix in real life 02:46 est31 heh 02:46 Zeno` biome is never used as a prefix so I always read it as bio megen and can't shake the habit 02:47 Zeno` normally I don't mind contractions but this one makes a fool out of me everytime I see it! 02:48 Zeno` maybe it's because my background is in biology/botany/ecology I dunno 02:49 paramat as a mapgen bitch i always see biome gen 02:50 paramat anyway could you review that more? 02:50 est31 you are all english speaking peolpe 02:50 est31 your brains are just not wired for composite words 02:51 est31 you like the words to be two syllables or less xP 02:51 paramat i feel it almost has enough review now actually 02:51 est31 Rindfleischetikettierungsüberwachungsaufgabenübertragungsgesetz 02:51 est31 thats a nice word isnt it 02:52 Zeno` no, no... brain is wired to interpret a common prefix (bio) as a common prefix! 02:53 Zeno` geomegen would be just as confusing 02:53 Zeno` (for geomes) 02:53 Zeno` if they were such a thing 02:53 Zeno` sofar would know 02:55 hmmmmm Zeno`: is that a code review +1 or an approval of the concept for that PR? 02:55 Zeno` hmmmmm, I have no objection to the PR 02:56 Zeno` we already have the base64 stuff, why not let Lua use it? 02:56 hmmmmm I was sorta hoping to hear what the use case was from red-001 02:56 Zeno` there's a link in the first comment isn't there? 02:56 Zeno` (giving a use case) 02:56 hmmmmm "It would be cool to have this builtin" 02:56 hmmmmm "would be cool" 02:56 paramat there'a use case in the linked issue 02:57 hmmmmm oh, I see now 02:57 hmmmmm is our implementation of base64 the version that works with json params? 02:58 Zeno` I didn't know there was a specific implementation that JSON relied upon... 02:58 hmmmmm i'm not sure either 02:58 hmmmmm just being extra careful 02:58 Zeno` I know there are different implementations. Hmm 02:59 hmmmmm Zeno`: I just created that PR so that somebody was able to see all the individual commits merged together 02:59 est31 hmmmmm, go to the feature request issue 02:59 hmmmmm Biomegen is the name of the branch 02:59 est31 it has one use case outlined 02:59 est31 with the http api, they apparently want to send over binary data 02:59 hmmmmm est: yes I am looking at 3804 03:00 hmmmmm alright 03:00 est31 i dont know though whether its a really that good use 03:00 hmmmmm it's a fine use 03:00 est31 after all http never has been meant to be used with base64 03:00 est31 its a hyper TEXT transfer protocol 03:00 est31 made in ASCII 03:01 hmmmmm you can transfer binary too 03:01 est31 ah yeah 03:01 est31 now I remember 03:01 hmmmmm but we shouldn't even bother discussing how correct the usage is 03:01 est31 you can download pdf files as well over http 03:01 est31 or gif or sth 03:01 hmmmmm web development is a cesspit with incredibly bad design choices cemented on top of other bad design choices 03:01 est31 ++1 03:02 hmmmmm if somebody needs base64 for some web thing, then i don't doubt them 03:02 est31 but most of it is open source, and ITS SANDBOXES 03:02 est31 SANDBOXED* 03:02 est31 thats more than posix could ever dream of 03:02 hmmmmm so 03:03 hmmmmm 1). a C++ base64 implementation will always be faster than a lua version 03:03 Zeno` I was thinking of using base64 for something only a month or so ago (before I saw this PR which may not even have been PR at the time) for something not even related to web design heh 03:03 est31 hmmmmm, not sure about that 03:03 hmmmmm 2). a solid implementation of base64 already exists in the core 03:03 hmmmmm 3). it would be wasteful to duplicate functionality 03:03 est31 there is an overhead calling lua <-> c++ 03:03 est31 dont forget that its also copied twice 03:03 hmmmmm do you know how much overhead the call is? 03:04 est31 no 03:04 hmmmmm i actually tested it once 03:04 est31 do you know how much overhead doing it in lua is :) 03:04 est31 3) sounds convincing though, even though base64 is pretty simple 03:04 hmmmmm a lua-to-C call takes about 35 microseconds with -O0 on my modern processor 03:04 hmmmmm using luajit 03:04 Zeno` As far as overhead is concerned I'm not terribly bothered by it. BUT if people are going to start using base64 in mods (and one person already has) it would be better IMO that all mods use the same base64 implementation (the one we use) 03:05 Zeno` instead of every mod rolling their own base64 and us having one in C++ also 03:05 hmmmmm absolutely 03:05 est31 well okay then 03:05 est31 +1 concept approval 03:05 hmmmmm so i strongly approve of that PR after thinking about it 03:05 est31 no code review done though 03:05 hmmmmm i was already leaning toward it 03:06 hmmmmm well it already has more than enough code review +1s 03:06 hmmmmm just trust me. it's solid. 03:06 hmmmmm it's sweet and simple and does exactly what it needs to 03:06 est31 Zeno`, have you seen PM? 03:07 Zeno` which PM? 03:07 Zeno` oh 03:07 Zeno` hang on :) 03:08 hmmmmm actually whoops 03:09 hmmmmm it takes 35 nanoseconds, not 35 microseconds - i measured the time with 1000 iterations 05:46 paramat #4163 05:46 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4163 -- Sky: Darker, bluer sky at night by paramat 06:09 paramat hmmmmm i have explained a mapgen setting issue here #4164 06:09 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4164 -- Setting mapgen in a mod can result in incorrect ore/biome/decoration/nyancat registrations 06:10 hmmmmm i am aware of that issue 06:11 hmmmmm it's not that auto-setting in a mod is bad, it's just that your mod can't predict the future 06:13 hmmmmm maybe there can be a second pass at registration time where mapgen params are read only 06:13 hmmmmm maybe setting the mapgen should be disallowed from inside of the mod execution body 06:14 hmmmmm the preferred mapgen should be in like a dependencies.txt-type file that's read 06:14 hmmmmm and then how would conflicts be resolved? hmmm 06:15 paramat i'm not too worried due to the workaround explained at the end 06:15 paramat maybe a note in docs would be good 06:17 hmmmmm well that does work around the problem 06:17 hmmmmm while introducing new problems of its own 06:18 hmmmmm this is going to break everybody's mods 06:58 est31 https://github.com/est31/minetest/commits/gamepad 06:59 est31 What do you think: should I squash the two commits 06:59 est31 or work on keeping them separate 06:59 est31 the first commit doesnt touch any real functionality 06:59 est31 its just about moving stuff around 07:00 est31 but without the second commit, some of the changes of the first commit aren't really straightforwardly 07:00 est31 -ly 07:02 paramat i'm thinking keep seperate 07:03 hmmmmm what's the point in making GenericKeyList a template though..? 07:05 est31 its a remainder from me thinking that I need it later on in JoystickController 07:05 est31 but then I chose to go with bitset 07:08 est31 hrmm what was again the reason for that??? 07:09 est31 well it wont really make a difference I guess 07:09 est31 in speed 07:09 est31 because KeyType::INTERNAL_ENUM_COUNT is so small 07:10 est31 its probably faster to iterate the bitset than to bother with all the indirectness of a GenericKeyList 07:17 est31 hmmmmm, do you think I should make it a non-template again? 07:18 hmmmmm perhaps 07:18 hmmmmm you shouldn't make things templates just because 07:19 est31 https://github.com/est31/minetest/commit/11f64f9c0a84d547dc4aeaf75647a9319fc85f9a 07:20 est31 okay removing it, and above link will help me to find the commit hash should I ever reconsider 07:21 hmmmmm when i write something using templates i try writing it again without templates 07:22 hmmmmm and then i compare the two 07:22 hmmmmm the latter version almost always comes out nicer 09:04 paramat nore or mtgame devs, please can anyone review/approve game#1001 ? fairly simple and tested 09:04 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/1001 -- Fire: move fire node removal out of ABM. by sofar