Time Nick Message 01:22 * sofar is just surprised nobody challenged his math skills this afternoon 01:25 RealBadAngel yeah? telll me what is the very last digit of PI then ;) 01:27 jomat pi = 3 01:28 sofar RealBadAngel: your password is in pi 01:28 sofar clearly visible 01:28 sofar to all of us 01:32 RealBadAngel sofar, you have removed that inventory cube stuff for lava? 01:35 RealBadAngel but with my patch or without? 01:36 sofar I removed the inventory_cube lines in minetest_game for those nodes, and ran without your patch 01:37 sofar just to see if we can remove those lines from minetest_game already preemtively 01:37 RealBadAngel i see 01:37 RealBadAngel that means that proper cubes could be here long time before but code was not fixed for it 01:37 sofar the darkness I think is due to lava being light-emitting 01:38 sofar normally it would be full lit 01:38 sofar can we make sure that nodes are fully lit in the inventory mesh? 01:38 RealBadAngel idk, on my client it rendered properl 01:39 sofar I'm on nividia/linux 01:39 VanessaE sofar, also check default:glass 01:39 RealBadAngel me too 01:39 sofar VanessaE: as said in the PR, glass was fine (bright, not dark) 01:39 VanessaE ok. didn't see that. 01:39 sofar obsidian is just... dark anyway 01:39 RealBadAngel but whats the point in fixing things which my patch is makin obsolete? 01:39 sofar VanessaE: well, the picture showed it was fine :) 01:40 sofar just making sure it doesn't break old clients too much 01:40 VanessaE I didn't see the picture :) 01:40 RealBadAngel code which was used to produce that darkened lava is trashed by my PR 01:40 VanessaE (I only tried the code with otherwise unmodified subgames/mods) 01:42 RealBadAngel this picture show only what user will see if will connect with old client to server that runs modified minetest_game 01:42 RealBadAngel server can be old too, it doesnt matter 01:43 RealBadAngel if newer client will join old server user will see flat lava image 01:44 RealBadAngel if game will be modified, then real cube 01:44 RealBadAngel the PR is only side change 01:45 RealBadAngel *client side 01:45 RealBadAngel but mods can support it 01:51 RealBadAngel btw, any comments on performance? does it affect fps or drawtime? 02:02 RealBadAngel sofar, its kinda same situation like with your stone walls, if you will connect to server that has that mod running, with older clients, do you expect to see the walls at all? 02:04 RealBadAngel in such cases theres no backwards compability or fixing things 02:49 sofar RealBadAngel: nah, I was hoping it would be prettier, but I can live with it 05:50 Hijiri When I put an item in a custom group, can the associated values be non-numbers, as long as the users of the group aren't expecting numbers? 05:51 Hijiri and have no bad effects, and be able to retrieve them later 05:51 Hijiri I'm guessing you would be able to, since it's just put in the node definition, but I want to be sure 06:03 sofar I wouldn't do that 06:03 sofar why can't you use numbers? 06:04 sofar put them in a custom field then 07:26 kaeza is there a formal approval process for translations or should I just go ahead and click "accept" on those I deem correct? 07:26 kaeza on Weblate I mean 07:29 kaeza there are 426 untranslated strings for es ;_; 08:09 sofar I blow up.... https://youtu.be/ug_Wv6_n3YM have a good night! 08:25 Hunterz nice... its better than minecraft tnt 08:47 Hijiri sofar: ok, that makes sense 08:48 Hijiri I don't know why I wanted my data in a group instead of just the node definition 08:48 Hijiri it didn't even occur to me to put it somewhere else, lol 09:42 RealBadAngel wtf is that?? http://i.imgur.com/h3zeZOU.png 09:42 everamzah happens often enough. it's related to the fetching of the public server list 09:42 everamzah doesn't happen if you have that unchecked. 09:43 everamzah i usually do "t t " three times to remove it hehe 09:55 RealBadAngel no matter the error, but it looks like shit 09:55 RealBadAngel such things should go to console only imho 09:56 RealBadAngel fps dropped to 5fps with that for quite long moment 10:45 kaeza the rotating wield items are great 10:46 kaeza err, inventory items 12:34 lezzy nice tabbed inventory guys :D looks like someone liked my idea and used it in the mainstream 13:09 everamzah craftingpack did it first, i think 16:29 RealBadAngel hi 16:29 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3612 16:31 RealBadAngel that kind of effect can be done without postprocessing, so here you go 16:32 RealBadAngel it works unlike others per single pixel, so it doesnt need whole rendered image to work on 16:33 RealBadAngel imho it enhances the gameplay a lot, world seen through HDR eyes is quite different ;) 16:35 kaadmy how difficult would SSAO be? 16:36 Calinou what's the point of SSAO when blocks already have AO? 16:36 kaadmy it's postprocessing tho, can mt handle that? 16:36 Calinou good AO, without noise… 16:36 kaadmy Calinou: nodeboxes, meshes, models? 16:36 Calinou "uncharted2tonemap" 16:37 Calinou RealBadAngel, did you extract it straight from disassembly? at least don't state it… 16:37 Calinou it's illegal 16:37 RealBadAngel no 16:37 RealBadAngel its public 16:37 RealBadAngel everybody around is using it, ask google 16:38 RealBadAngel its called like that because author of the algorithm made it for this game 16:38 sofar you still have two unused vars 16:39 RealBadAngel so we do have tonemaps: Reinhard, Uncharted2 etc 16:40 RealBadAngel its like you were using Gausian blur and was afraid to be sued because you have used something made by Gauss 16:42 sofar do I need to compile with ENABLE_TONEMAPPING? 16:42 RealBadAngel no 16:42 RealBadAngel use setting in menu 16:43 sofar ah shaders 16:43 sofar yes, I did that 16:43 sofar having a hard time seeing effect, tho 16:43 RealBadAngel ENABLE_TONEMAPPING is internal shaders flag used when compiling shaders 16:43 RealBadAngel open two instances of mt, one by one 16:44 RealBadAngel you will see the differences in contrast 16:44 sofar Oh, no 16:44 RealBadAngel dark and bright things are redistributed equally 16:44 sofar I had tonemapping enabled but shaders disabled 16:44 RealBadAngel oops ;) 16:45 RealBadAngel but, explaining is worth shit 16:45 RealBadAngel you HAVE to see it 16:48 sofar it's... very subtle 16:49 RealBadAngel open two instances side by side 16:49 RealBadAngel and compare 16:49 sofar I did 16:49 RealBadAngel also fly around a bit in valleys mapgen with new effect 16:49 sofar sorry, maybe it would help if you posted some screenshots as well, so people can see what they're supposed to see 16:49 RealBadAngel then go back 16:49 RealBadAngel you will feel something like loosing focus 16:50 RealBadAngel those effects are about percepting the colors 16:50 RealBadAngel it may vary from one to another 16:50 RealBadAngel i find this a huge difference 16:51 RealBadAngel everything gets right contrast, light seems to be spreading further and smoother 16:51 sofar contrast is improved 16:52 sofar that's the one thing I can see 16:53 RealBadAngel thats the main point 16:53 RealBadAngel to see both dart and light things equally good 16:53 RealBadAngel wrr 16:54 RealBadAngel dark and bright 16:54 RealBadAngel anyway, this one is only the one of the possible to come 16:54 RealBadAngel there are several other methods to pick from 16:55 RealBadAngel personally my eyes found it the best one 16:55 Amaz Both your tonemapping and your inventory meshes pulls are awesome RealBadAngel! 16:55 RealBadAngel maybe you will find another better fitting your eyes 16:56 Amaz (I really like the spinning items) 16:56 RealBadAngel but still, i hardly recomend playing with tonemapping for quite a while 16:56 RealBadAngel and return to non modified 16:57 RealBadAngel i can quarantee you will not want to play without it anymore 16:58 RealBadAngel Amaz, thx 16:59 sofar I saw you fixed the meshes being too light, too 17:16 Amaz A before/after screenshot of the tonemapping: https://i.imgur.com/imE3POs.png (imo, it's soooo much better now!) 17:18 Calinou difference is not really visible 17:38 RealBadAngel Calinou, ive added some shots to the PR to compare 17:39 sofar Amaz: very, very subtle difference, I can't see them side to side 17:39 RealBadAngel look at the trees in my post 17:40 RealBadAngel top is effect on/bottom off 17:40 sofar I had to overlay the images in gimp and flick in between them to see 17:41 RealBadAngel best to open both screenshots fullsized and toggle between 17:41 Fixer very subtle difference 17:41 RealBadAngel original one is fuzzy 17:41 Fixer what about caves? 17:41 RealBadAngel thats the whole point, everything gets equal contrast 17:42 RealBadAngel theres a series in caves too 17:43 RealBadAngel also, theres a paramter i used to compensate snow becoming too bright 17:43 RealBadAngel gamma 17:44 red-001 RBA what does #3016 do? 17:44 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3016 -- [0.4.13-RC] Bumpy Item Textures 17:44 red-001 I mean #3612 17:44 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3612 -- Filmic HDR tone mapping by RealBadAngel 17:46 Fixer https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2350 this issue should probably be closed 17:51 RealBadAngel red-001, see screenshots and preferably just play with the effect on 17:52 RealBadAngel it changes the perception of the world 17:59 sofar red-001: fyi I sent fixes to mesecons for the new door API. 18:00 Fixer !tell paramat https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2350 this issue should probably be closed 18:00 ShadowBot Fixer: O.K. 18:15 RealBadAngel Fixer, indeed 18:16 RealBadAngel sofar, btw: http://image.slidesharecdn.com/hablejohnuncharted2hdrlighting-100331075253-phpapp02/95/hable-john-uncharted2-hdr-lighting-144-728.jpg?cb=1270022334 18:19 RealBadAngel with the last sentence i can argue, its worth a try 18:30 Fixer RealBadAngel, i'm not sure why it changes my life completely it is very-very subtle difference 18:32 RealBadAngel hehe, it changes the feeling 18:33 RealBadAngel for my eyes, without it, mt is just washed out 18:33 RealBadAngel fuzzy 18:33 RealBadAngel hard to focus on details 18:33 Fixer RealBadAngel, feels more balanced 18:34 RealBadAngel exactly 18:35 RealBadAngel i will later on add more filter defined by other folks 18:35 Fixer RealBadAngel, have you noticed slight difference with snow node rendering behind lone water block here? https://cloud.githubusercontent.com/assets/2177790/12558742/8aa84d7a-c391-11e5-9b10-09c1b5974c18.png 18:35 RealBadAngel ive picked this one first because its seems to be the most popular 18:36 Fixer RealBadAngel, how much is fps decline? 18:36 RealBadAngel doubt if any 18:36 RealBadAngel code is quite simple 18:37 RealBadAngel i cant see any difference with and without 18:37 sofar we should really have a demo/minebench 18:38 sofar fixed seed, fixed settings, start up and run a certain scene and draw frames 18:38 sofar without vblank 18:38 RealBadAngel yeah 18:38 RealBadAngel that would be useful 18:38 sofar RealBadAngel: great idea! when are you making it 18:38 sofar it was your idea... 18:38 RealBadAngel what? the benchmark? 18:39 sofar yes 18:39 RealBadAngel lol 18:39 RealBadAngel good try 18:39 sofar oh come on, nobody would believe me if I would claim to come up with anything new 18:39 Fixer mt does have --benchmark iirc 18:39 sofar everyone knows I steal code ;) 18:40 Calinou Minetest is a terrible benchmark 18:40 Calinou Fixer, no? 18:40 sofar Calinou: not meant to benchmark hardware, meant to test performance difference of patches to minetest 18:41 Fixer minetest --speedtests 18:41 sofar that doesn't render 18:41 RealBadAngel idea is good, but then you will have to face dev who is using freebsd as a gaming platform 18:42 sofar data is always good, and good data is even better 18:42 RealBadAngel long time i was wondering why hmmmm is getting such small framerate 18:42 Fixer hmmm uses freebsd? 18:42 RealBadAngel yeah 18:42 Fixer ._. 18:42 RealBadAngel there are no real drivers for it 18:43 Fixer there are some progress actually 18:43 RealBadAngel some for nvidia, completely nothing for amd 18:43 Calinou the NVIDIA proprietary driver for FreeBSD is the same as the one for Linux 18:43 Calinou it's just updated less often 18:43 sofar it's not relevant, even 18:43 RealBadAngel i wont discuss it, googling about it is an answer 18:44 sofar there is no way to measure impact of patches right now 18:44 sofar any way is better than none 18:44 RealBadAngel yes 18:44 RealBadAngel for that we could have sample world 18:44 sofar just pick seed 0 18:44 RealBadAngel fixed database with fly around 18:45 RealBadAngel keep it small 18:45 sofar you may want to generate terrain during the test 18:45 RealBadAngel no need for regular world 18:45 sofar but, a fixed world may be good too 18:45 Fixer fixed seed, emerge blocks, wait a little, fly around a little, ???, profit! 18:45 Calinou a regular world should be used, to be close to real-world conditions 18:45 RealBadAngel it can be pre generated 18:45 sofar hmm 18:45 sofar pre-generated is fine 18:45 RealBadAngel that would be even better 18:45 sofar we can test emerge separately easy enough 18:45 RealBadAngel you wont be measuring mapgen or disk 18:46 sofar can we hard-code a demo path? 18:46 RealBadAngel and as a bonus you can use it as main menu background 18:46 sofar speaking of settings, I'd want it to actually use the current settings 18:46 sofar so you can compare setting performance 18:47 sofar it should even be a UI button 18:47 sofar "TEST ME" 18:47 RealBadAngel put there "fps" stamp and if its ok next one "approved" 18:47 RealBadAngel ;) 18:47 sofar click it and a 60 second demo runs, then displays results 18:47 sofar or have it run permanently 18:47 sofar loop, perhaps 18:47 RealBadAngel if running as background? why not 18:47 sofar you don't want a random path 18:48 sofar it should be hardcoded 18:48 RealBadAngel anything could be better than clouds 18:48 RealBadAngel recorded rather 18:48 sofar first things first, a separate demo mode 18:48 RealBadAngel pretty nice fly by 18:48 sofar a simple map can be quite large 18:48 sofar we may want to package it separately 18:49 sofar can we embed a path into the world? 18:49 sofar so that demos can be downloaded separately? 18:49 sofar e.g. map+path embedded? 18:49 sofar load demo file? 18:50 sofar maybe /demos? 18:51 sofar RealBadAngel: right, scenic hill top flyovers, dive through some river valleys, into a cave 18:51 kaadmy hmm 18:52 kaadmy maybe a flyby of the world to-be with the mapgen? 18:52 kaadmy with the current seed? 18:52 sofar RealBadAngel: could be fun adding manually crafted blocks and making buildings and structures to demo what can be done in minetest and to test various node types 18:52 kaadmy would be interesting but hard to implement afaik 18:53 sofar kaadmy: generating is faster than making another way to to "play" it 19:07 Fixer make benchmark subgame ._. 19:11 sofar Fixer: hmmmm, but subgame can't load a predefined map, that still requires the user to 'play game demo with map demo' 19:11 sofar but yes, that is one way to hack it together 19:12 Fixer will be nice to have option to generate map chanks like in game, to test stutters 19:12 sofar to test that, just test the game 19:13 sofar I really want to test frame rate in an environment where I can eliminate mapgen and network issues 19:15 Fixer problem is that mapgen and network issues have big effect on fps :) 19:16 sofar problem is that we can test those already 19:16 sofar but we have no way to test framerate 19:18 Fixer two options: with mapgen and pregenerated 19:18 sofar I'm also convinced that the buggy minetest.after() implementation currently is causing havoc massively everywhere 19:18 sofar but it seems my PR's to fix it are not getting the right review 19:30 RealBadAngel taklkin bout reviews, what about film filter? 19:42 Calinou what about Instagram filter? 19:42 Calinou turns everything blue-ish 19:42 sofar hahahaha 19:42 sofar do eeeet 19:47 hmmmm btw 19:47 RealBadAngel you may laugh, but with irrpp theres a filter called I See Red 19:47 kaadmy is it called D3D? 19:47 RealBadAngel guess what is it doing ;) 19:48 hmmmm if you're seriously going to make minetest use a deferred shading strategy, check out far cry 2 19:48 hmmmm they used deferred shading and it works o.k. for the most part, if you're fine with indoor and underground areas looking bad and pixelated shadows 19:50 hmmmm i think, ultimately, we're going to need better heuristics of whether or not something is underground/inside 19:50 RealBadAngel hmmm, thats quite easy and almost done 19:50 RealBadAngel see lightbanks 19:50 hmmmm static landscape games can do this rather trivially by allowing the level designers to set a region around what is supposed to be considered indoors 19:51 RealBadAngel night holds everything artificial 19:51 hmmmm the best we can do, though, is somehow optimize a flood fill algorithm to determine if something is indoor/outdiir 19:51 RealBadAngel day - both 19:51 Calinou hmmmm, shadows being pixelated has nothing to do with deferred rendering 19:51 Calinou some forward renders have shit shadows, like Godot's 19:51 hmmmm shadow mapping? 19:51 RealBadAngel 3rd bank is needed that would hold only sun affected areas 19:51 hmmmm shadows being pixelated has to do with the performance tradeoff necessary 19:51 Calinou good shadow mapping (like Variance Shadow Mapping), when blurred + anti-aliasing, will look great 19:52 Calinou it's fully doable on today's mid-end systems 19:52 hmmmm in any case 19:52 RealBadAngel i can blur + fxaa the final result 19:52 RealBadAngel i do have postrpocessing by now 19:52 hmmmm I'm thinking maybe this flood fill I'm talking about would be done on map generation, and the results would be updated per setnode 19:52 hmmmm maybe we can steal a bit from somewhere 19:52 hmmmm node_is_indoor/outdoor 19:53 RealBadAngel hmmmm, baw is using floodfill too 19:53 Calinou FXAA would be nice to have, though SMAA is better 19:53 hmmmm man I don't care what BAW is doing 19:53 hmmmm a few years later, where are they right now? 19:53 RealBadAngel i know but they are using irr 19:53 hmmmm a heavily modified version 19:53 Calinou BAW? 19:53 hmmmm build-a-world 19:53 RealBadAngel they were in similar situation like us 19:54 hmmmm they modified irrlicht. 19:54 hmmmm that is a lot of work you know 19:54 RealBadAngel not really 19:54 hmmmm maintaining a new package? 19:54 hmmmm of our own 19:54 RealBadAngel for per pixel lighting to work i just need that 3rd exclusive for sun(moon) bank to make it all work 19:55 hmmmm what do you mean 3rd exclusive 19:55 RealBadAngel we do have 2 19:55 RealBadAngel night one is torches 19:55 hmmmm you mean you want to add a third light bank? 19:55 RealBadAngel 2nd is sun + torches 19:55 RealBadAngel i NEED one only SUN 19:55 hmmmm I was thinking of getting rid of the concepts of light banks entirely 19:56 RealBadAngel look 19:56 hmmmm I don't see the value in it 19:56 RealBadAngel problem with HW light ray is that its an fucking xray 19:56 RealBadAngel it shines on everything 19:56 RealBadAngel no mater indoor, surface or cave 19:57 hmmmm that doesn't sound quite right 19:57 RealBadAngel tell me how not to shine the caves with sun then 19:57 RealBadAngel above is my idea 19:57 hmmmm look I don't know, but hardware dynamic lights shouldn't do that as long as the overhead mesh is there 19:58 RealBadAngel no 19:58 RealBadAngel it goes through 19:58 hmmmm why 19:58 RealBadAngel thats how it works 19:58 hmmmm i don't buy it 19:58 hmmmm that's not how it's supposed to work 19:58 RealBadAngel hehe 19:59 RealBadAngel believe it or not, but thats how it works 19:59 hmmmm are you continuously changing the light's position or something..? 19:59 RealBadAngel no matter if i do that or not 19:59 hmmmm ehh.. 19:59 hmmmm I'm gonna try it myself 20:00 RealBadAngel only thing that counts is the surface normal 20:00 RealBadAngel when you need to stop the ray, you have to do it on your own 20:01 RealBadAngel thats why i wanted lightlevels 20:01 RealBadAngel if i pass them on vertices i can allow lightsource to act (or deny) 20:01 RealBadAngel btw, HW lighting is about using shaders 20:02 RealBadAngel almost all advanced materials are made with shaders 20:02 hmmmm i'm talking about hardware dynamic lights 20:02 RealBadAngel all the calculations are done in shaders 20:03 RealBadAngel irrlicht support those shaders 20:03 hmmmm really 20:03 RealBadAngel if you or anybody turns off shaders in mt, you think irr is not using them? 20:03 hmmmm so irrlicht has a set of default shaders that it uses when you enable a hardware dynamic light 20:03 RealBadAngel what a suprise ;) 20:03 RealBadAngel yes 20:04 RealBadAngel if you decide to use your own you have to do calculations on your own 20:04 RealBadAngel btw, bumpmapping, parallax are native irrlicht materials 20:05 RealBadAngel those shaders are just built in 20:06 RealBadAngel if you let material to be lit by hw light and dont enable mt shaders, built in engine shaders will do that for you 20:06 RealBadAngel if you enable shaders for your materials, you have to do the math 20:07 RealBadAngel and then lightsource becomes just a moving point, and you need just its position 20:07 RealBadAngel i do have all the math in shaders for the long time already 20:08 RealBadAngel what i dont have (working reliably) is when i should let the sun/moon shine in and when i should deny it 20:08 RealBadAngel in fact current system is ok, until i lit a single torch 20:09 sofar I wish the moon wasn't in the L2 lagrangian point in minetest 20:10 RealBadAngel i can split them, using Fiat Lux.py lib 20:10 RealBadAngel thats no problem 20:10 hmmmm RBA, are you sure that's how dynamic lights work in irrlicht? 20:11 RealBadAngel yes 20:11 RealBadAngel do you need code to test? screenshots? 20:11 hmmmm http://sourceforge.net/p/irrlicht/code/HEAD/tree/trunk/source/Irrlicht/COpenGLDriver.cpp#l3023 20:12 RealBadAngel yes 20:12 hmmmm so where is irrlicht's dynamic light shader code? 20:12 RealBadAngel that just is passing light source pos to shaders 20:12 RealBadAngel then you can read pos ambient etc in shaders 20:13 RealBadAngel grep sources 20:13 RealBadAngel shaders are partially compiled 20:13 RealBadAngel similar to assembly 20:13 hmmmm yes but where are they 20:14 RealBadAngel i will find that for you, but gimme half an hour, cooking now :) 20:14 hmmmm really cause i can't find them 20:15 RealBadAngel make that: 20:15 RealBadAngel enable lighting 20:15 RealBadAngel disable final color blend on both 20:15 RealBadAngel cpu and gpu 20:15 hmmmm i think you're talking out of your ass 20:15 RealBadAngel really? 20:15 hmmmm yeah sorry man 20:15 RealBadAngel i will just upload my branch 20:15 RealBadAngel you will see on your own 20:27 RealBadAngel hmmm, the code yuo have pasted from irr, is making this possible: https://www.opengl.org/sdk/docs/tutorials/ClockworkCoders/lighting.php 20:28 RealBadAngel whatever refers to light, like vec3 L = normalize(gl_LightSource[0].position.xyz - v); 20:28 RealBadAngel vec4 Idiff = gl_FrontLightProduct[0].diffuse * max(dot(N,L), 0.0); 20:28 RealBadAngel is because of the code you have highlighted 20:29 RealBadAngel theres no black hardware magic for lights 20:29 RealBadAngel there are just shaders :P 20:30 RealBadAngel you have set the material, have moving source 20:30 RealBadAngel its coordinates are passed to shaders 20:30 RealBadAngel be it one, or many, they are processed one by one 20:31 RealBadAngel per each pixel 20:31 RealBadAngel or vertex if you like (that would be very similar to our smooth lighting) 20:44 hmmmm like I said; I don't buy it 20:44 hmmmm you have no idea what's going on at the driver level 20:44 hmmmm on AMD cards this is probably true. on nVidia, probably not so much. 20:44 RealBadAngel https://github.com/Paulus/Irrlicht/blob/1.7/source/Irrlicht/CD3D8ParallaxMapRenderer.cpp#L21 20:44 RealBadAngel shut up and read example 20:45 hmmmm OpenGL is mostly implemented on the silicon with nvidia cards 20:45 RealBadAngel this is parallax shader with lights 20:45 RealBadAngel and i expect you will say sorry at least 20:45 hmmmm yeah, for d3d8 20:46 RealBadAngel https://github.com/Paulus/Irrlicht/blob/1.7/source/Irrlicht/COpenGLParallaxMapRenderer.cpp 20:46 RealBadAngel here you go 20:46 RealBadAngel wheres the "sorry" 20:46 hmmmm nowhere 20:47 hmmmm you're showing me something completely unrelated and telling me it proves your point 20:47 RealBadAngel "# transform the light vector 2 with U, V, W \n"\ 20:47 hmmmm yes, lots of fragment shaders transform light 20:47 RealBadAngel do you think what are the lights here? 20:47 RealBadAngel those are your HW lights 20:48 hmmmm maybe if you're using the parllax map renderer 20:48 RealBadAngel shaders are GPU code, your hardware 20:48 RealBadAngel awww, cmon 20:48 RealBadAngel i thought youre smarter 20:48 RealBadAngel go dig for yourself 20:49 RealBadAngel when go back, we can talk again 20:49 hmmmm so you admit you can't find the thing you were telling me exists 20:49 hmmmm in other words you were full of bullshit 20:49 hmmmm it's just that nobody else ever calls you out on it 20:49 RealBadAngel you want regular material 20:49 RealBadAngel ok 20:50 hmmmm I don't think it's too farfetched to believe that hardware lights are implemented in the hardware on at least some cards 20:50 hmmmm others, maybe the driver has the shader code 20:51 ssieb hmmmm: are you saying that "lights" are going to be automatically blocked by geometry without the shader having to do anything? 20:51 hmmmm on at least some nvidia cards there really is dedicated hardware light hardware thogh 20:53 RealBadAngel hmmm, why you cant you just enable lights in minetest and see how it works? 20:53 kaadmy hmmmm: afaik no gfx cards support hw lights yet 20:53 hmmmm that's what I'm doing 20:53 RealBadAngel ok 20:53 RealBadAngel nothing better than find things on your own 20:54 kaadmy hmmmm: so you want mt to have lighting only on nvidia? 20:54 hmmmm huh? 20:54 hmmmm no i said that nvidia probably has support for hardware dynamic lighting right in the silicon, whereas amd cards implement it with a shader built into the driver 20:54 RealBadAngel btw, i do have lighting working flawlessly, with sun/moon cycle 20:55 hmmmm but it certainly does NOT happen at the level of abstraction that rba is saying it does 20:55 VanessaE RealBadAngel: link to the code? :P 20:55 RealBadAngel just cant block reliably the ray to not shine interiors or caves 20:55 hmmmm yeah you keep telling us about it, and you told me that you were going to upload it 20:55 hmmmm but where is it 20:56 hmmmm ssieb, yes, isn't that the point of a dynamic light? 20:56 RealBadAngel its a huge mess with shitload of pieces here and here, gimme hour or two and i will upload essential parts to get it working 20:57 VanessaE translation: I have a lot of polishing to do, expect it in 1-2 weeks 20:57 VanessaE :P 20:57 RealBadAngel now im going to eat with my wife or she is going to kill me 20:57 hmmmm she'll grind you up and stuff you into a kielbasa 20:57 RealBadAngel VanessaE, please dont mark something partially workin as rdy for PR 20:58 RealBadAngel hmmmm, or worse 20:58 VanessaE RealBadAngel: I'm not. compileable, runnable code or it's all just a bunch of mockups. :) 20:58 RealBadAngel im outta here, be back a bit later 21:08 ssieb hmmmm: I'm pretty sure that there is no triangle intersection code build into the hardware like that... 21:08 ssieb can you show any evidence for it existing? 21:13 ssieb and assuming that information did get created, how would it get passed to the shader? 21:46 RealBadAngel VanessaE, problem is my playground is a mess, theres irrpp, irrrenderer and some other small things merged 21:46 VanessaE yeah yeah sure ;) 21:46 RealBadAngel im trying to get them all to work 21:46 RealBadAngel but 21:46 RealBadAngel ive sent hmmm a pm with steps to reproduce what i was talking about 21:46 RealBadAngel quite simple ones 21:47 RealBadAngel http://pastebin.com/54W9ABiP 21:49 RealBadAngel this way you will see when you will modify default irrlicht materials by adding own shaders to them, we do disable irrlicht ligthing 21:50 RealBadAngel also, you will notice that every surface is lit, no matter if something is between 21:54 RealBadAngel Re: Build A World - new massive game, using Irrlicht 21:54 RealBadAngel Postby sodandk » Fri May 02, 2014 6:11 pm 21:54 RealBadAngel Hi. The look of the game is a mix of different things. This is my first 3D game, so at start I thought that each light would just be a hardware light and shadows would automatically be shown... but got wiser :-) 21:54 RealBadAngel First of all, hardware light just goes through everything and shadows are not automatic, and neither is AO (Ambient occulusion) , and the game needed thousands of lights... in case of for example a volcano, each blocks is a light block and there are maybe 50.000 lights ... 21:54 RealBadAngel So, instead this is how its done: 21:54 RealBadAngel Each block and the sun can emit light, and a specialized software floodfill fills around with light and shadow and light are applied to the vertices on the go, and also AO is computed on the fly, so basically most of the light is made by software (maybe we move that code to the GPU with OpenCL). DevSH (user here on Irr) has made a number of Shaders for water, reflections, fire, smoke etc. For the player's headlamp and the rotator lights we d 21:54 RealBadAngel o use hardware lights... 21:55 RealBadAngel This is a fast rough simple description of how light is done in BAW. It might change radically later on, but the real challenge is to have 10.000 lights or 100.000 lights in a scene, and still have it running in realtime. 22:51 Calinou https://github.com/minetest/minetest.github.io/issues/57 22:51 Calinou :/ 23:06 celeron55 eh what 23:06 celeron55 how did that guy find his way there without finding my email address or something first 23:06 celeron55 that's literally the worst place to post that question