Time Nick Message 00:02 Megaf RealBadAngel, meh, thats indeed a block of useless code 00:03 Megaf kahrl, suppose we remove what RealBadAngel suggested and client tried to connect to old server, worst case scenario, what would happen? 00:04 RealBadAngel kahrl, http://i.imgur.com/1IvaaF3.png 00:04 RealBadAngel ^^ i can see wielded glitch on a system that was previously non affected 00:05 RealBadAngel only difference now is that im rendering to texture instead of directly 00:05 kahrl Megaf: I think you'd get lots of "WARNING: ClientActiveObject: No factory for type=..." and won't be able to see or interact with dropped items 00:05 Fixer RealBadAngel, yes, that is it 00:06 Megaf RealBadAngel, something similar happens to me when I hold a boat 00:06 Megaf but the axe looks normal 00:06 Fixer RealBadAngel, please find nearest snow biome with forest 00:06 Megaf (shaders off) 00:06 kahrl RealBadAngel: interesting 00:06 RealBadAngel ok 00:06 kahrl what is the difference between rendering to screen and rendering to texture? 00:06 Fixer I've tried it with literally ALL settings, and bug won't go away 00:06 Fixer including changing driver settings 00:07 Megaf and for me the thing on http://i.imgur.com/1IvaaF3.png is not even a bug, just a bummaping thing... 00:07 Fixer RealBadAngel, find some tree with snow on it, go above it, increase height, move mouse a lit, look when ripples on snow appear 00:07 RealBadAngel Fixer, ok 00:08 RealBadAngel ok i can see it 00:08 RealBadAngel hold on a sec 00:08 kahrl Megaf: that would be a pretty crappy bump map if you ask me :P 00:08 Fixer RealBadAngel, finally 00:09 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/ozXnPCT.png 00:09 Fixer RealBadAngel, can you post a pic? 00:09 RealBadAngel kahrl, those are not shaders related things at all 00:09 Fixer RealBadAngel, YES 00:09 Fixer RealBadAngel, that is that s--t 00:09 Fixer confirmed 00:09 sofar ugh crap, backface culling doesn't work for mesh nodes 00:09 Fixer RealBadAngel, so weild mesh problem is also related to texture tear, it seems 00:10 Fixer or it is the same problem actually 00:10 Fixer RealBadAngel, if you go higher above trees they will look more horrible 00:10 Fixer crappiness increases with distance 00:10 RealBadAngel i believe we set the materials somehow wrong way 00:10 RealBadAngel since now i can see the glitches i will find a reason 00:11 Megaf kahrl, low resolution, I never fully undestood all shaders and mapping for minetest 00:11 Megaf with such low res textures 00:11 Megaf minetest was never abut eye candy 00:11 RealBadAngel Megaf, actual texture resolution is not important in opengl 00:12 RealBadAngel texture coords are always 0-1, no matter its size 00:12 RealBadAngel so i can shade 1px texture or 2048x the very same way 00:12 Megaf now, speaking of OpenGL, couldnt we drop OpenGL and Direct3Dx and use only OpenGL ES 2.x? 00:12 RealBadAngel no we cant 00:13 Megaf about texture size, the memory use changes 00:13 Megaf GPU memory use 00:13 RealBadAngel ES is too limited 00:13 Megaf are you sure we need stuff from OpenGL? 00:13 RealBadAngel ES is meant for mobile stuff, not regular PC and powerful GPUs 00:13 Megaf I have seen lots of ES games and they look pretty awesome 00:14 Megaf and if it is menat for mobile, I think its more efficient 00:14 RealBadAngel ive developed ES version of shaders 00:14 sapier megaf it's hard enough to get working opengl drivers on some windows machines ;-) I doubt it'll be better if we'd use opengles 00:14 RealBadAngel we can have both versions 00:15 Megaf sapier, maybe if we used only a single version of OpenGL then? like 3.1 or 2.x 00:15 RealBadAngel sofar, you need backface culling for meshes? 00:15 Megaf (PS, I don't know what I'm talking about in case you didn't notice) 00:15 sapier for what I understand most of that stuff is done by irrlicht (except shaders of course) 00:16 sapier and as of windows there's still some gpu's out there where you can only reasonably use directx ... and I guess it's gonna get even worse as pc market started to fragment even more since microsoft force installs win10 00:16 sofar RealBadAngel: it's hardcoded disabled in minetest/nodedef.cpp#912 00:17 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3391 00:17 RealBadAngel sofar, this PR allows to define backface culling for each tile 00:17 sofar I don't need it per tile 00:17 sofar of course that's not a bad idea 00:17 RealBadAngel mesh textures are stored as a tile 00:18 sofar but I have only 1 texture 00:18 RealBadAngel so 1 tile 00:18 sofar IC 00:18 RealBadAngel then you could set the flags for that tile (material) 00:18 sofar all I want is backface_culling = true to apply to mesh nodes 00:18 RealBadAngel heres the code that does that and a few more things 00:19 RealBadAngel happily was rejected because of ability to force filters 00:19 Megaf RealBadAngel, I removed the code you said about CAO, could connect to my server, and my server is a now old build 00:19 Megaf no problem with dropped items 00:20 RealBadAngel Megaf, you should propably try to connect some ancient build 00:20 RealBadAngel something like at least 1-1,5 yrs old 00:20 Megaf meh, who uses that? 00:21 Megaf I actually have a 3 or 4 years old backup of an old server 00:21 Megaf somewhre 00:21 Megaf anyway, I believe we shouldnt worry about that 00:38 sofar RealBadAngel: there's so many arbitrary restrictions on node visual attributions :( 00:39 RealBadAngel i havent invented that 00:39 sofar can't we make mesh nodes default to backface_culling = false 00:39 sofar and allow nodedef's to enable it? 00:39 sofar I tried but I can't seem to get that to work 00:39 RealBadAngel best way is to enable defining that by mods 00:39 sofar that's what I want to 00:39 sofar but it's hardcoded disabled for mesh nodes 00:39 sofar which is dumb 00:40 sofar I mean, if it looks like shit, people won't use it 00:40 sofar but in my new door case, I need it, and it works 00:40 sofar it even shows a problem with one of my meshes 00:41 RealBadAngel either we can set default to false (but then propably some1 would like it to true) 00:41 RealBadAngel or merge my patch 00:41 sofar yeah but, this should be a 2-line change 00:41 RealBadAngel then the problem is gone 00:41 sofar your patch is... not a 2-liner 00:41 sofar 2-liners are easy to merge 00:41 RealBadAngel what if you will need backface culling set to true? 00:42 RealBadAngel you will make next 2 liner or revert previous one? ;) 00:42 sofar https://gist.github.com/sofar/971b26ffbff16e1183d4 00:42 sofar I was thinking something like that 00:42 sofar default to off, enable when mod tells it to 00:43 RealBadAngel but theres no way to do that without my patch 00:43 sofar I see backface culling work 00:43 sofar with my patch 00:43 sofar I just can't turn it OFF 00:44 sofar oh, hmm 00:44 RealBadAngel what? 00:49 sofar So ContentFeatures enables backface_culling at object creation 00:49 sofar nodedef.cpp disables it when NDT_MESH 00:50 sofar https://gist.github.com/sofar/363ea387e054f88c2b0c 00:50 sofar I'm thinking, once we see the "drawtype" == NDT_MESH, we set it to false 00:50 sofar and if it's then read to be true, enable it 00:51 sofar oh hum, probably needs to be serialized/unserialized too 00:51 RealBadAngel theres a case that already let that 00:51 RealBadAngel see water node defs 00:52 RealBadAngel my patch just extends that for regular tiles 00:53 sofar got it to work 00:53 sofar yeah I understand your patch 00:57 RealBadAngel funny, that texture tear is visible on top of snow slab, but not on regular snow node 01:00 sofar ugh why does blender make such a mess of meshes when I export them? 01:00 sofar somehow even recalculating normals it just doesn't do the right thing 01:03 RealBadAngel blender is weird, i was fighting with it a few hours lately to rescale and rotate stargate mesh 01:03 RealBadAngel this is really a tool for geeks 01:04 kaadmy if you know it ;) 01:20 luizrpgluiz which would be responsible for leaving the file faster minetest? 01:24 sofar luizrpgluiz: I can't make sense of that sentence 01:26 luizrpgluiz Paramat said that in minetest, when you leave the game options without leaving the most beautiful game like shaders, he has loss 20-70% drop frames per second 01:27 sofar right 01:28 luizrpgluiz I had an idea to try to resolve this issue it would load the shader as a non-binding option 01:30 luizrpgluiz because disabling all the graphics options of the game, it was to have a very good improvement in frames per second 01:33 sofar next up: replace chests with an animating chest! 01:33 * sofar giggles 01:53 RealBadAngel 70% fps drop, wow 01:54 RealBadAngel paramat is doing here excellent job at making chaos 01:55 sofar he's being misquoted 01:55 sofar please 01:56 RealBadAngel whatever 01:56 RealBadAngel fiddling now with wielded glitch, cant find a difference why the same node is displayed properly as entity and wrong in hand 01:58 RealBadAngel im not sure whats that in fact, frontface culling? 01:58 sofar hand culling 02:00 RealBadAngel but noticed something else 02:00 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/izVO2Ex.png 02:01 sofar why is it fuzzy? 02:01 RealBadAngel it looks like wielded mesh is somehow broken anyway, see that cube attached to the original one? 02:01 RealBadAngel fuzzy, because client started in window and then i rescaled it 02:02 RealBadAngel posprocessing works on the resolution set at the start, havent fixed that yet 02:03 RealBadAngel also im trying all the possible material flags one by one 02:04 RealBadAngel i think i will try another wield mesh generator 02:06 RealBadAngel heh 02:07 RealBadAngel looks like also cubes are displayed wrong way 02:07 RealBadAngel ive made series of screenshots to catch swinging the wield item 02:08 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/c62Jt8y.png 02:09 Fritigern Looks like the faces are displayed inside-out 02:10 RealBadAngel or some faces are missing 02:11 sofar did you mess up the normals? ;) 02:11 RealBadAngel no 02:11 RealBadAngel maybe i should recalculate them 02:24 RealBadAngel that doesnt help 02:43 paramat hmmmm (or anyone) minetest.place_schematic_on_vmanip() seems to cause a memory leak https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3566 03:11 hmmmm how was it determined to be the API itself? 03:11 hmmmm what if it's an error in the mod, holding onto references of the vmanip? 03:12 paramat it could be the mod 03:12 paramat i couldn't see an error though 03:13 hmmmm could you see an error in l_place_schematic_on_vmanip? 03:13 paramat not yet 03:15 hmmmm the standard method of determining a memory leak is by running minetest under valgrind 03:15 hmmmm i'd start with that 03:15 paramat ah ok 04:12 sofar heh, how well does it run under valgrind? I should try... 04:25 hmmmm in any case, i'm skeptical of the assertion that the API is bugged because it doesn't make any allocations except for schematic loading, but that's managed by the schematic manager and has very well-defined lifetimes 04:26 hmmmm it's much more likely that the mod is bugged by holding onto references or the author doesn't realize the GC just hasn't run yet 04:29 sofar holy crap can we tell valgrind to ignore luajit? 04:29 hmmmm yes, there is a way to do this 04:30 sofar yeah, I know ... just haven't done it myself 04:33 sofar well I'm glad my culling change is getting a quick thumbs up already 04:33 sofar otherwise I would have seen the doors rewrite strand pretty quickly 04:41 sofar possibly lost:124 bytes 04:41 sofar well now, that doesn't look so bad 05:00 sofar https://github.com/dear-github/dear-github 06:09 paramat 'Liquid flow: Prevent water spreading on ignore WIP' https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3581 06:10 sofar that's some progress 06:19 paramat hopefully. the abm i tried worked but to be lightweight would need a low chance, and therefore would take a while to have effect 06:22 sofar it doesn't need to fire often 06:22 sofar who cares if water takes a bit to self-repair? 06:22 paramat exactly 06:23 paramat i'll look into a new API for adding a liquid node to the liquid queue 07:52 paramat ahh there is already an API for adding a node to the liquid queue =) 08:04 paramat doesn't work, back to plan A 08:07 paramat actually it does, nice 20:09 paramat can anyone review this simple improvement for water on ignore? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3581 20:10 paramat will merge 3578 later 20:37 Fixer paramat, interesting, is ABM for liquid activation included in that patch? 20:38 paramat no, the ABM is hacky and experimental, and would be in mtgame anyway 20:39 paramat the ABM could be added by anyone in a mod though 20:40 Fixer nah, please make it included, those horrible liquid bugs should be fixed away from MT entirely 20:43 paramat if i can make the ABM work well i'll open a PR for MTGame 20:46 Fixer do you need some world 'production' copy with liquid bugs for testing? 20:47 paramat no thanks, luckily liquid bugs are super easy to create =) 20:48 Fixer try adding several water source and dump them over each other in different places ._. 20:48 Fixer i guess you know it anyway 20:48 Megaf I wonder if I could get the source code for all libs that the buildbot download and build them myself 20:49 Fixer paramat, there was also liquid bug that thin diagonal water 'slab' remained after some exting-ed flowes 20:49 Fixer i have no idea wth was that 20:51 Fixer paramat, ABM could be also tested in valleys caves that got planty of stuck lava over ignore, seen it yesterday a lot 20:51 paramat ah yes 20:52 Fixer with fixed flows that caves will be so hardcore to explore 20:58 sofar paramat: stuck with kiddos for a bit, can maybe test later 20:58 paramat no prob 22:00 RealBadAngel kahrl, here? 22:04 RealBadAngel wielded item glitch basically is zbuffer not working i think 22:05 RealBadAngel changing order of planes in extruded mesh buffers changes the visual effect 22:05 RealBadAngel if we add z+ and z- planes at the end of the buffer instead of at the start we get another looking wiedled item 22:07 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/8fiu26Z.png 22:08 RealBadAngel side of the item is now lookin correct 22:08 RealBadAngel but notice the waves on the inner one 22:09 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/DxmgIby.png 22:09 RealBadAngel especially visible on hand 23:54 est31 anybody want to fix https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/3512 23:54 est31 build failure is big bug, supporting future compilers is as important as supporting old ones. 23:54 sofar c++11 isn't something we want to avoid either 23:55 est31 keeping the bug in master ruins bisect once we switch to c++11 23:55 est31 requiring c++11 != being able to build with -std=c++11 23:55 RealBadAngel btw, i think i know the real reason for wielded glitch 23:56 RealBadAngel im pretty sure i will have working fix soon 23:56 RealBadAngel extruded mesh was broken 23:57 est31 if anybody wants to reproduce the build failure, run cmake with -DCMAKE_CXX_FLAGS="-std=c++11" 23:59 est31 I'll keep the offer to fix the bug around for one week, after that I'll try a fix myself