Time Nick Message 00:02 paramat i'm happy with #2598 now and will push in a few hours. Code cleanup, some changes, some bugfixes, lots of checking terrain against master branch mgv6, and have added some comments in the thread 00:02 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2598 -- Mgv6: Add optional snow biomes by paramat 03:02 est31 hmmmm, what do you know about shebangs on freebsd? 03:03 est31 because there is a "#! /bin/sh" 03:03 est31 and jenkins doesnt want to build because of "configure: error: cannot run /bin/sh /usr/local/jenkins/jobs/minetest - FreeBSD - Official/workspace/src/gmp/src/config.sub" 03:04 est31 according to internet, this points to problems with either the shebang or +x permissions. 03:04 est31 but +x is there 03:08 paramat will push 2598 in a few minutes 03:09 est31 what does taiga look like below? 03:10 paramat below surface? 03:10 est31 snowblock, then dirt with snow I guess 03:10 paramat yes 03:10 est31 ok 03:11 paramat snowblock at surface level, dirt_with_snow below 03:17 hmmmm est31, i'm pretty sure you can have a space between the shebang and the shell command 03:18 hmmmm just tested, the space makes no difference 03:19 est31 ok 03:19 hmmmm I'll download gmp 5.1.3 and try to compile it myself and see what happens 03:19 hmmmm it's possible that the port version has a makefile patch 03:19 est31 yes 03:20 hmmmm where'd you download it from? 03:20 hmmmm ah nevermind found the mailing list announcement 03:20 est31 https://gmplib.org/download/gmp/ 03:20 est31 https://gmplib.org/download/gmp/gmp-5.1.3.tar.bz2 03:21 est31 The according PR is #2620 03:21 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2620 -- SRP based login by est31 03:22 hmmmm I just did ./configure && make 03:22 hmmmm no problems here 03:23 hmmmm wha... 1774 files... 03:23 hmmmm oh my 03:25 hmmmm maybe we could use mini-gmp 03:25 paramat now pushing 2598, will notify when done 03:25 hmmmm it's not as high performance as the entire libgmp, but it's one single file that we can include just like that 03:26 hmmmm and then we'll have an option for the 'full' version of libgmp... sound good?? 03:26 est31 yea 03:26 hmmmm we can totally sidestep this horrifying autoconf build system and the incredible amount of bloat 03:27 est31 "The performance target for mini-gmp is to be at most 10 times slower 03:27 est31 than the real GMP library, for numbers of size up to a few hundred bits" 03:28 est31 but yes rather something slow than this kind of bloat 03:28 hmmmm in practice people are gonna want libgmp 03:28 hmmmm but in a pinch this works fine 03:28 est31 its analogous to the lua and luajit 03:28 hmmmm right 03:31 est31 aaaaaand it compiles 03:31 est31 wow 03:31 est31 now lets test the performance 03:32 est31 normal libgmp is ~40 ms 03:32 hmmmm we're definitely going to want the full libgmp for servers, but it's not such a necessity for clients 03:32 est31 yes 03:32 est31 that should be documented somewhere 03:33 est31 (my PR currently misses a README change for libgmp) 03:33 paramat push complete 03:34 est31 wow 1815 03:34 est31 1815 ms 03:34 est31 thats not quite fast 03:34 est31 also, its not factor 10 03:36 est31 so the "performance target" isn't reached 03:39 hmmmm maybe it's not such a good idea to bundle libgmp 03:39 hmmmm this is pretty horrifying 03:40 est31 I think mini-gmp is enough for the start 03:41 est31 (and permanent too) 03:41 hmmmm well 03:41 hmmmm you wanted 'slow' for auth 03:41 hmmmm there you have it 03:41 est31 lol 03:43 est31 I'll add mini-gmp.{c,h} into util/ and adjust the cmake. 03:44 hmmmm okay =] 03:48 VanessaE I hope that extra 1800 ms is compensated for by figuring out why some people have trouble with long sign-on times for servers that ought to be fast (e.g. lightly-modded). :) 03:48 est31 VanessaE, they just compile minetest with real libgmp, and its fast as hell 03:49 VanessaE (not trying to pour cold water on y'all's work here, just warning based on users' complaints we've all heard of before) 03:50 est31 They will complain, but what should we do? 03:50 VanessaE for mini-gmp, nothing. 03:50 VanessaE I'm talking about other parts of the sign-in process. 03:50 VanessaE you know, post-auth stuff 03:50 est31 ah 03:51 VanessaE you've already made it past auth, now you hypothetically wait like 10 seconds on some servers for reason that's not clearly spelled out in the progress display, that sorta thing. 03:51 est31 ah 03:52 VanessaE (I've been lucky not to get hit by that very often, and when it does happen, it's more like only a few seconds usually) 04:25 paramat updated, compiled and tested, taiga was missing most of it's pinetrees, will push the fix soon 04:41 paramat will push the fix #2621 when checks are done 04:41 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2621 -- Mgv6: Fix taiga, allow pine tree spawning on snowblocks by paramat 04:50 paramat now pushing 2621 04:54 paramat done 05:13 est31 very weird 05:13 est31 the build is somehow unreliable 05:14 est31 once it works https://travis-ci.org/minetest/minetest/jobs/58130277 05:14 est31 once it doesnt https://travis-ci.org/minetest/minetest/jobs/58130278 05:15 est31 so gcc likes it clang doesnt 05:40 hmmmm you got minetest working with freebsd/gcc? 05:40 hmmmm jeez 05:40 hmmmm well, rather should i ask, did it merely compile or is the resulting object file able to be executed 05:40 est31 https://travis-ci.org/minetest/minetest/builds/58130274 05:41 est31 windows claims to have not found the .h file I have no idea 05:41 est31 perhaps we have to link against a .lib file 05:41 est31 hrm I think that dependency isnt needed at all 05:42 hmmmm for Linux, you mean the 'undefined reference to '? 05:42 est31 yes 05:43 hmmmm i know what the problem is 05:43 est31 ? 05:43 hmmmm you need to add extern "C" { } around the definitions in the mini-libgmp.h 05:44 est31 there is 05:44 est31 #if defined (__cplusplus) 05:44 est31 extern "C" { 05:44 hmmmm oh, hrmm 05:44 hmmmm well the object file is clearly being made 05:44 hmmmm generated rather 05:45 hmmmm is there some sort of __declspec__((export)) or equivalent 05:45 est31 wut? 05:45 hmmmm like some kind of compiler directive for external linkage 05:45 hmmmm whatever the gcc equivalent is 05:45 est31 regarding the windows failure? 05:45 hmmmm hmm well i'm looking at it right now 05:46 est31 win failure should be fixed now 05:46 est31 (removed the include, we dont need it anymore) 05:46 hmmmm yeah I don't know 05:47 hmmmm I wonder if __cplusplus is being defined as it should be 05:47 hmmmm add an #error "yep, __cplusplus is defined here" inside that if directive 05:49 est31 ok windows works 05:55 est31 hmmmm, it doesnt trigger the #error 05:56 hmmmm welp there's your problem 05:56 est31 so, what happened? 05:56 hmmmm uhhh 05:56 hmmmm i don't know yet :( 05:58 hmmmm oh duh 05:58 hmmmm srp.c is the thing that includes mini-gmp.h which is also .c 05:59 hmmmm of course it's not going to have that defined 06:00 est31 it doesnt like the forced extern at all: https://travis-ci.org/minetest/minetest/jobs/58132367#L660 06:01 hmmmm right, as expected 06:01 hmmmm i don't know, this got a whole lot tougher 08:58 Krock Updated #2618 08:58 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2618 -- 20s timeout when connecting to server by SmallJoker 10:01 est31 *****FACEPALM**** 10:01 est31 *****FACEPALM**** 10:01 est31 Those functions the linker can't link are my own 10:01 est31 I have defined them 10:01 est31 in that file 10:02 est31 I just wonder what the compiler didnt like about them 10:30 est31 added a "static" now it compiles 10:30 est31 very fine 16:15 Krock hmmmm and est31: Are there any comments for #2618 ? 16:15 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2618 -- 20s timeout when connecting to server by SmallJoker 16:25 hmmmm i have a general comment on Game::connectToServer) 16:25 hmmmm the assumption that things are going on in a separate thread in a certain order is mostly invalid unless special precautions are being taken 16:26 hmmmm everybody should read this: http://www.cs.ucla.edu/~todd/research/snapl15.pdf 16:28 Krock > Java is an unsafe language 16:29 hmmmm i kind of agree with the comments in that PR that a configurable setting isn't all too useful 16:29 hmmmm under what circumstances is somebody ever going to want to modify it? 16:30 hmmmm I can't believe the client currently just hangs there and freezes up if the server never times out 16:30 Krock It wasn't meant serious. I wondered if they also would request a minetest.conf setting for something simple like this 16:31 hmmmm 20 seconds is kind of long too, maybe 10 would be better *shrug* 16:31 hmmmm why did you choose 20 16:31 Krock because 30 was too long 16:31 Krock 10s is fine 16:32 VanessaE I'd have suggested 10 also. 16:36 est31 quicky scanned that paper, and I think the issues are not that serious 16:37 est31 its mostly complaining that low level programmers have to insert fences 16:37 VanessaE that paper makes me wanna go back to BASIC. :P 16:37 est31 doesnt help either 16:38 est31 I'm not sure which kind of reordering the paper targets: the hw one or the compiler one 16:38 VanessaE looks like both. 16:38 est31 basic would only target the compiler one 16:38 est31 :) 16:39 VanessaE I Was joking, and besides BASIC isn't multi-thread capable :) 16:39 est31 and it doesnt have float typed line numbers 16:39 VanessaE haha 16:39 VanessaE of course the whole paper starts off from a false premise - that all languages are surely as bad as Java 16:40 VanessaE C++ can't possibly be THIS bad can it? 16:40 est31 Java has advantages c++ has its advantages 16:40 est31 for example, build systems for C are like real shit 16:41 est31 with .dll .so .al .a and all that stuff 16:41 est31 java only has class files, and then it zips them to jar files 16:41 est31 simple and clean 16:41 VanessaE I'll agree with you there, to a degree - but dll, .so, etc is OS-level stuff, not language-level 16:41 sfan5 what is an .al file 16:42 est31 .al is for autolinker or so 16:43 sfan5 you mean .la probably 16:43 sfan5 that belongs to pkg-config and is optional 16:43 est31 perhaps yes 16:44 est31 VanessaE, portability is one of java's advantages 16:45 VanessaE write one, pray everywhere :P 16:45 VanessaE once* 16:45 est31 lol 16:45 est31 also, c++'s API is very basic and trimmed down 16:46 Krock est31, ah and c++ ain't portable? 16:46 est31 Krock, basic c++ programs yes 16:47 est31 but already simple things as fetching the current time lead to a port mess 16:47 est31 "mess" 16:47 Krock That's because everybody wants his own C++ version/API and no-one cares about Java 16:48 est31 ? 16:50 Krock nvm. This theme is too deep to start with. 16:58 Calinou if we used C++11, C++ would be better 16:58 Krock so, what's the status of that PR? Is there any rewrite required? 16:58 Calinou else, Java beats C++ 16:59 Krock Calinou, afaik, there are still supported OS's which don't support it. 16:59 Krock s/it/C++11/ 16:59 Calinou yeah, like Ubuntu 12.04 16:59 Calinou noone should use that anymore 17:00 Krock Same goes with Windows XP :P 17:00 Calinou Windows XP is not a supported OS 17:00 Krock oh well, it's not suportted anymore 17:01 Krock I feel like I've shot myself into the knees. 18:10 hmmmm Windows XP is still supported 18:10 hmmmm I think we dropped windows 2000 support 18:24 Krock hmmmm, we were talking about the official support by developers, not about Minetest. 19:17 hmmmm oh 19:17 hmmmm my bad, didn't read the whole thing 19:17 hmmmm yeah.. the price you pay for having such an expansive base API such as Java's is that it's extremely difficult to port to other architectures 19:17 hmmmm and you do pay 19:18 hmmmm if you want to run Java on INTEGRITY OS, it costs $200k a pop 19:18 hmmmm and it doesn't even support the full SE library 19:19 hmmmm i ran up against this problem at my last job, and when we discovered the incredible cost and deficiencies, we were happy we went with C instead 19:23 Krock C was already enough? 20:25 hmmmm it might be a good idea to show a stack backtrace on printing to the errorstream from within the lua api 20:25 hmmmm there's no other way to identify which call in your mod was failing 20:41 hmmmm https://github.com/kwolekr/minetest/commit/de60b340b06ef07f2656979cf59bbb898da25a6c 20:41 hmmmm PTAL^ 21:35 kahrl_ PTAL = ? 21:35 kahrl_ Paramat, Take A Look? 21:45 kilbith s/Paramat/Please 22:54 paramat hmmmm perhaps you should look at this PR #2561 i don't see any comments from you so just letting you know 22:54 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2561 -- Add mapgen specific flags to create world dialog by srifqi 23:08 paramat thanks for the serialize schematic commit 23:11 paramat also, there is a request for mapgen flags to be the same in all subgames #2585 and i agree. i would like to move the jungles and dungeons flags out of mtgame and make them engine defaults 23:11 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2585 -- Add the default settings of mg_flags by Rui914 23:11 paramat bbiab