Time Nick Message 00:00 paramat funny how i'm still learning how to use LVM properly 00:00 paramat all comments? 00:00 hmmmmm not all of them 00:00 paramat ok phew 00:00 hmmmmm yeah 00:00 hmmmmm i'm gonna be honest, i mostly quit because of nerzuhl 00:00 hmmmmm can't stand that guy 00:02 paramat hm you're not in MT organisation 'people', so you didn't remove yourself 00:02 hmmmmm I think I did that 00:02 paramat ok 00:02 hmmmmm otherwise the only one who can remove/add people is celeron 00:03 paramat you're welcome to be there, there are long absent inactove people there like pilz and kahrl, and c55 heh 00:03 paramat *inactive 00:03 hmmmmm oh yeah i'm probably going to stay inactive 00:03 hmmmmm i've got totally different projects these days 00:04 hmmmmm getting more into electronics 00:05 twoelk model the electronics in mt 00:05 hmmmmm but the minetest spirit sorta lives on, one of my projects i put on hold because i got sick of ogre3d is a real time strategy game with dynamically generated terrain 00:05 Teckla Thanks all, my first little experiment is working. 00:05 Teckla clear_area(pos1, pos2) -- clears an area (all nodes = air) using LVM 00:05 Teckla I appreciate the help. 00:08 paramat and of course, you're always welcome to drop in somewhere and comment on anything. i've restrained myself from asking advice because i got the impression you needed a break 00:09 paramat (don't blame you heh) 00:09 hmmmmm ask me for sure 00:09 hmmmmm but minetest is its own project these days, i dunno if i can just pick up and start working on it again 00:09 paramat ok, luckily it hasn't become essential to bug you, yet 00:10 hmmmmm i mean i don't play it, i haven't loaded up the project in my IDE in years, never mind run ./minetest 00:10 paramat yeah there's no expectation of your return, no pressure 00:11 hmmmmm lol thanks 00:12 paramat CSM is sort of progressing, client side is done, server-provided mods to be done 00:14 paramat and i've been experimenting with a new core mapgen for 3 years now, it's tough going when you become numb to it 00:14 hmmmmm what do you mean when you say numb 00:14 hmmmmm you're fizzling out too? 00:16 twoelk hopefully not 00:16 Shara He's not allowed to :) 00:19 paramat lol 00:19 paramat i mean, when you work on something so much you get fed up even though it's probably good 00:20 paramat i can understand how you got fed up with mgv7 00:20 hmmmmm in the end it turned out to not quite be what i wanted it to be 00:21 hmmmmm i still want to try out that radical new idea of generation where each map chunk has a "stage" of generation 00:21 twoelk it hade a mind of it's own 00:22 hmmmmm for a given map chunk to generate at stage N, all the bordering map chunks need to be at least stage N - 1 00:22 hmmmmm like for example you start off with no chunks, stage 1 generation would be basic terrain shape with water 00:22 hmmmmm nothing else gets done 00:23 paramat and there's the issue of when to make a PR instead of endlessly redoing it better and better. anyway maybe for 0.5, then further improvements after (if people like it =/) 00:23 hmmmmm once a map chunk is surrounded by all stage 1 generated chunks, then it progresses to stage 2, where biomes are generated 00:23 hmmmmm and then stage 3 would be adding decorations 00:23 twoelk doesn't that cascade out of memory soon? 00:23 hmmmmm it might 00:23 hmmmmm i dunno 00:24 hmmmmm but this kind of generation broken into stages would gracefully handle the border problem 00:24 paramat yes 00:24 paramat and have interesting possibilities 00:25 erstazi woohoo! used minetest.remove_node(digpos) instead of minetest.dig_node(digpos) 00:25 twoelk sounds like rivers would be more logical 00:25 erstazi the old mod was using minetest.dig_node(digpos) 00:26 hmmmmm either that, or use current day minecraft-style generation where the entire map shape and features are predetermined 00:26 rubenwardy I like the idea of fractal / planned generation, to give an continental earth style map with seas, oceans, gulfs, and peninsulas etc 00:26 hmmmmm and as as you 'zoom in' you add more detail 00:26 rubenwardy continental plate simulation 00:26 hmmmmm lol ruben that's exactly what i was just talking about 00:27 rubenwardy It's the simulation dream in me talking 00:27 rubenwardy The desire to simulate all the things 00:27 hmmmmm because with the current style of generation, stochiastic processes are limited to the size of a map chunk 00:27 rubenwardy Yeah 00:28 hmmmmm you need to be able to determine a map feature at a specific point in O(1) time as it stands right now 00:28 hmmmmm like if i give you coords (X,Y,Z) the algo must be able to tell you if that's air, water, or stone 00:28 hmmmmm whereas a fully stochiastic process means that would be impossible 00:29 hmmmmm unless you were to iterate through each step of the generation 00:29 twoelk mega structures such as km-long mountain ridges would be cool 00:29 hmmmmm so 00:29 hmmmmm ultimately I think the minecraft style generation is the winner 00:29 rubenwardy This is the sort of thing I'd be interested in doing as a master's 00:30 rubenwardy But will probably end up doing lang eng or something with kernels 00:30 rubenwardy But yeah 00:31 rubenwardy As new mapgens go, that's probably the most rewarding new one imo 00:33 paramat i'm intent on MT being able to 'do space'. i think about mapgen with cubic planetoids of varying sizes scattered throughout a MT 'world' 00:33 hmmmmm I guess I never implemented a mapgen like that because it was too different and i thought i might've been able to do it a different way 00:33 hmmmmm lol dammit 00:33 hmmmmm i wanted MT to do space years ago and it never happened 00:33 hmmmmm :( 00:33 paramat i remember 'a space game' 00:33 rubenwardy Years ago I wanted to implement gravity using that law 00:34 Shara Cubic planets are weird, because gravity. 00:34 hmmmmm all the big ideas just went away 00:34 hmmmmm notice that? 00:34 rubenwardy This is before I learned cpp 00:34 rubenwardy Lol 00:34 paramat anyway first step is biome-defined air nodes, working on that now 00:34 hmmmmm thought we already had that 00:34 Shara I wish we did :) 00:34 hmmmmm the current stone/air/water are supposed to be placeholders 00:35 paramat .. where "air" is no longer the default 'void', nodes have a nodedef 'is_air_equivalent = bool' instead to act like "air" 00:35 hmmmmm for the biome pass 00:35 paramat yes "air" will still be the placeholder 00:36 hmmmmm ahh 00:36 hmmmmm and even if you did this, you'd need to put in place a new biome system where it takes hints from the mapgen 00:36 hmmmmm i remember i was supposed to make a mapgen like this based off of an edge detection algo 00:36 hmmmmm i sorta got bored with it tho 00:37 twoelk would it be actually be possible to run several mapgens at the same time on the same worldfile? as in stacked realms 00:37 paramat it's here https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/7241 00:37 hmmmmm if you can code it you can do anything 00:38 paramat wrote a simple planetoid mapgen to test it 00:38 hmmmmm this sorta makes me want to work on my game 00:39 hmmmmm heh 00:39 paramat and yes, cubic planets with 1 gravity direction, like small versions of current worlds 00:39 Shara Asteroids are much better 00:40 hmmmmm I have an idea of how to implement gravity 00:40 paramat finally a way to use the vertical space, i've sort of skipped over stacked realms, which are still good of course 00:40 hmmmmm you could maintain an R+ spacial index tree on rectangular regions to a gravity normal vector 00:41 Shara Planets with one gravity direction are really silly. 00:41 hmmmmm e.g. if user is inside of the region [(x1,y1,z1), (x2,y2,z2)], apply (0, 1, 0) gravity 00:44 twoelk will throwing/arrows work with that? 00:50 paramat https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/images/16/sep/planets4.jpg that game that used to be called planets cubed 00:51 paramat gravity would flip as you jumped over an edge 00:51 paramat now called 'stellar overload' 00:51 Shara Doesn't look good to me 00:53 Shara You know I want space badly, but planets are massive things that don't come in cubes even in MT (or world wouldn't have hills) 00:54 paramat that image makes the planet look tiny, larger in the game 00:55 Shara Given generally low max viewing range in MT... I just can't see cube planets looking good 00:55 Shara If you ever want space in MTG, please go with asteroids. It's much less silly 00:56 paramat yes, MTG would likely be something different if it does space 00:57 Shara okay :) 00:59 paramat .. since it's much more about a conventional full-width world 01:00 Shara Yes, this is my thought 01:00 paramat my thoughts would require a new game 01:01 Shara Well we do need some of them as well :) 01:54 stormchaser3000 according to my web browser, the minetest.net website SSL secutiry certificate has expired 01:56 Unit193 "The certificate expired on June 5, 2018, 9:30 PM. The current time is June 5, 2018, 9:56 PM" Yes. 02:20 erstazi stormchaser3000: they must have not setup certbot to auto renew 02:21 erstazi they are using Let's Encrypt so it is a free cert so certbot could auto-renew it without issue 02:21 erstazi paramat, VanessaE, Shara (someone!): minetest.net needs the SSL cert renewed with Let's Encrypt 02:28 paramat celeron55 might do it tomorrow Finland time 04:42 unclouded is it possible to store state on tools? 05:19 IcyDiamond unclouded: use metadata 05:20 unclouded is that on the itemstack for the tool, i.e. itemstack:get_meta()? 05:26 ANAND unclouded, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L2003 05:35 unclouded nice :) thank you. do I have to set_meta() or something? my changes don't seem to be persisted between on_use invocations 05:36 ANAND I don't think a set_meta is needed 05:36 ANAND ...or is it? 05:38 ANAND nope, not needed 05:39 unclouded whoops, sorry. my bad. it *is* being persisted between invocations 05:39 ANAND :) 05:39 unclouded brilliant. I had been storing data on the player, which seems wrong 05:43 fadetime testing 05:47 unclouded got it: it's only persisting when I `return itemstack` from the `on_use` method 05:47 unclouded not otherwise 06:00 ANAND ah yes, itemstack should be returned by the on_use method 10:36 entuland oh silly me, I've been rolling my own deep table copy and minetest provides table.copy() :P 10:37 entuland I see no trace of facilities for copying files over (instead of moving them with os.rename()), just trying: do we have such a file copy facility and I simply fail to find it? 10:37 entuland otherwise I'll roll my own copy function 10:56 MinetestBot 02[git] 04nerzhul -> 03minetest/minetest: CSM/SSM: Add on_mods_loaded callback (#7411) 13ccc3af1 https://git.io/vh0fV (152018-06-06T10:53:59Z) 11:18 sovetskiy knock-knock! http://i.imgur.com/jHIQ9qP.jpg 11:25 entuland ahahah nice one 11:25 Krock general reposti 11:26 entuland could anyone link me to where I should download 0.5 from? is that the master branch in gitlab? 11:26 Krock I believe it had less compression artefacts when I saw it on /r/programmerhumor 11:26 Krock master branch yes. 11:26 ANAND on Github 11:26 Krock git clone, cmake, make. run. 11:27 ANAND entuland, not on Gitlab 11:27 entuland okay 11:27 Krock gitlab is synced with github, so you could grab the binary from the pipeline there 11:28 Krock unless building it yourself is wanted 11:28 entuland uhm yes I think I need the binary from the pipeline 11:28 entuland I grab the latest passed one from https://gitlab.com/minetest/minetest/pipelines correct? 11:29 ANAND Krock, isn't the Gitlab repo generally a couple of days behind the Github repo? 11:29 Krock yes. However, I don't know whether the linux binaries are RUN_IN_PLACE or system-wide 11:29 Krock ANAND, check the repo state again. it's fresh as baguette 11:30 ANAND ohhh! nvm.. 11:30 Krock > Updated 5 minutes ago. 11:30 entuland I think I'll be fine with the latest passed build on gitlab, after all I just need to repro #7416 on 0.4.17 and 0.5 11:36 entuland uhm... 11:36 entuland running my wesh mod on 0.4.17 11:36 entuland WARNING[Main]: /!\ You are using old player file backend. This backend is deprecated and will be removed in next release /!\ 11:36 entuland 2018-06-06 13:35:14: WARNING[Main]: Switching to SQLite3 or PostgreSQL is advised, please read http://wiki.minetest.net/Database_backends. 11:36 entuland I think I'll have to change something to run it on 0.5, we'll see 11:36 Krock yet it's a warning, not an error 11:39 entuland uhm... not sure why those warnings are there for me though. I only enabled my mod and I am using the new mod_storage facilities... I think I'll find out in a minute when I'll run it on 0.5 - I'm not aware of using a player file backend nor SQLite 11:41 entuland no error on loading on latest 0.5.0, but I forgot to enable creative mode... hitting ESC to go back and enabling it froze it :P 11:43 entuland nvm, it didn't do that again 11:49 entuland neat, the heavy mesh with more than 14K vertices renders fine in 0.5.0 :P 11:51 Krock !tell sovetskiy One repost cycle later with improvements: https://i.redd.it/0sti776fa7211.jpg 11:51 MinetestBot Krock: yeah, sure, whatever 11:51 Krock <3 MinetestBot 11:51 MinetestBot <3 Krock 11:52 entuland I don't recall the exact name for the last kill there (the red / white icon) 11:53 ANAND Whoa! :O 11:55 entuland the door count could be far higher than that: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mergers_and_acquisitions_by_Microsoft#Acquisitions 11:56 ANAND haha 11:56 Krock but it does not apply to all of them that they went downhill afterwards 11:57 entuland still can't find the last one before github 11:57 ANAND I forgot the name too, looks very familiar tho 11:58 entuland I thought about lionhead but that's not the right one, unless they changed the logo 11:59 * entuland does an image search 11:59 * entuland fails to get meaningful results 12:03 Krock https://tineye.com/search/e10448a9a1f1975a82231b899fb8d32dd9fbda67/ 12:03 Krock entuland, ANAND. Mojang. 12:03 ANAND Ahhhh! 12:33 MinetestBot 02[git] 04tukkek -> 03minetest/minetest: Stop autoforward on BACKWARD key-press (#7417) 139f8582d https://git.io/vh0sq (152018-06-06T12:31:34Z) 12:33 entuland eh, with my whopping 5 hours grand total of minecrafting no wonder I coulnd't recognize it 13:39 BBmine https://www.minetest.net/ says "Your connection is not secure" 13:40 Krock 304 issue already exists for that 13:41 BBmine oh 13:41 BBmine thanks 13:41 serp looks like it's just expired 13:42 ANAND http://irc.minetest.net/minetest/2018-06-06#i_5323569 13:45 Ruslan1 Hi celeron55 13:52 celeron55 oh crap 13:52 rubenwardy Pls use wildcard 13:52 rubenwardy And add it to dev.minetest.net 13:52 Fixer wat 13:52 rubenwardy XD 13:53 Fixer can confirm it has expired 13:53 Fixer the bomb has been planted 13:53 Fixer you have 45 seconds to renew your cert 13:53 celeron55 i recently added a cert for minetest.net and the cronjob added for renewing it overwrote the cronjob for renewing the www.minetest.net one 13:54 celeron55 hopefully it works after fixing this 13:54 rubenwardy cerbot renew 13:54 rubenwardy Done 13:55 Fixer he is procrastinator2000 13:55 celeron55 i'm fully expecting this old openbsd set-up to explode one day due to things being too old for anyone to support them 13:55 celeron55 what's certbot 13:55 Ruslan1 celeron55: do you know I open 2 Minetest and 1 show gray. Do you know way to fix it 13:55 Fixer 100 years later, minetest is dead, but minetest.com is still running! yay! 13:55 celeron55 i'm using acme-client for openbsd 13:56 celeron55 _a_ version of it that happened to work a long time ago 13:56 rubenwardy Certbot is the name of the software that letsencrypt is aliased to 13:56 rubenwardy alias letsencrypt=certbot 13:56 Fixer Ruslan1: please post an issue here https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues or if you have acc on minetest forum, ask there, or wait on IRC, maybe someone answers 13:56 rubenwardy I belueve 13:57 Fixer Ruslan1: celeron55 does not maintain it much anymore, other people do 13:58 celeron55 www.minetest.net is renewed now 13:58 Ruslan1 Fixer: thanks you 13:59 celeron55 i guess i'll do dev now that i'm at this 13:59 celeron55 i mean dev.minetest.net 14:04 rubenwardy Please may you add hsts too? 14:05 celeron55 no, i don't like hsts 14:05 rubenwardy :'( 14:07 celeron55 it's very inconvenient when things fail due to browsers being so difficult to get to ignore it 14:08 rubenwardy Curl is a good tool for debugging that 14:08 rubenwardy curl -I URL 14:11 celeron55 also it's impossible to remove tls then 14:11 rubenwardy Well 14:11 rubenwardy A good thing imo 14:11 sfan5 iirc chromium actually plans to deprecate HSTS for this reason 14:11 celeron55 just use https everywhere 14:11 celeron55 or similar 14:12 celeron55 and ask your preferred browser developer to include such by default 14:14 rubenwardy Can't find any sources for Chrome removing hsts 14:15 sfan5 oh it has HPKP, not HSTS 14:15 sfan5 s/has/was/ 14:32 celeron55 now dev.minetest.net has a certificate 14:35 Genshin Howdy 14:40 rubenwardy Thanks! 15:04 erstazi celeron55: thanks 15:52 MinetestBot sovetskiy: Jun-06 11:51 UTC One repost cycle later with improvements: https://i.redd.it/0sti776fa7211.jpg 15:55 sovetskiy Krock, yeah. Unenviable future of M$ products 15:59 VanessaE I don't recognize the icon on the closest open door 16:00 rubenwardy Mojang 16:00 VanessaE oh 16:00 sovetskiy VanessaE, minecraft company actially 16:00 VanessaE yeah I Know 16:00 VanessaE just didn't recognize their logo 16:02 Krock VanessaE, see logs. I also had to put it into a reverse image search engine 16:03 Krock ..to enlighten the other people who didn't know it 16:03 VanessaE mehg 16:03 VanessaE meh 16:03 ANAND Krock: Mojang? 16:03 Krock ANAND, no, Gnajom 16:04 ANAND hehe 16:04 sovetskiy GNOME 16:08 Krock VanessaE, https://i.redd.it/7b87it6t0b211.jpg 16:14 rubenwardy Kek 19:44 azarus Hey guys, is there a mailing list or similar where I can subscribe to, to be notified of new releases? Thanks. 19:44 garywhite azarus: Do you use Reddit? 19:44 azarus garywhite: not really 19:45 garywhite oh, cause they post it on Reddit at r/minetest 19:48 azarus Also, encountering this error with minetest_game: https://i.imgur.com/1UVWZtO.png 19:48 azarus here the debug.txt: http://ix.io/1cwy 19:48 azarus ah, I see it 19:49 azarus it's the irrlicht engine version, right? 19:49 Krock azarus, wrong minetest_game version 19:50 azarus ah, okay. 19:50 Krock download the 0.4.17 version (stable-0.4) branch 19:51 azarus Krock: My distro will get 0.4.17 very soon. 19:51 azarus in a couple of hours, most likely 19:51 azarus (currently, it's 0.4.16) 19:52 Krock you can also git clone minetest_game, which will also work on 0.4.16 19:53 azarus Ah, works now, thanks. 21:00 longerstaff13 oops 21:06 entuland oh crap 21:06 entuland size[6,6]field[1,1;2,1;meshname;Enter the name for your mesh]button_exit[4,1;0,0;capture;Capture]button_exit[4,2;0,0;cancel;Cancel]field_close_on_enter[meshname;false] 21:06 entuland 2018-06-06 23:04:20: WARNING[Main]: invalid use of unpositioned "field" in inventory 21:06 entuland 2018-06-06 23:04:20: WARNING[Main]: field/simple: use field_close_on_enter[name, enabled] instead of the 4th param 21:06 entuland this is my form: size[6,6]field[1,1;2,1;meshname;Enter the name for your mesh]button_exit[4,1;0,0;capture;Capture]button_exit[4,2;0,0;cancel;Cancel]field_close_on_enter[meshname;false] 21:06 entuland I don't see really why I am getting those errors 21:06 rubenwardy try adding a final ; 21:06 rubenwardy maybe 21:07 rubenwardy wait no 21:09 sovetskiy why your buttons have zreo width and height? 21:10 entuland I didn't recall whether it had an autosize feature setting them to zero, I'll try changing that 21:11 entuland buttons appear 21:11 entuland as does the form 21:11 entuland but the error is still there 21:11 entuland and my field has "2,1" as label 21:11 entuland maybe "meshname" is a reserved name? 21:12 entuland buttons appear _after_ that I set them to 1, 1 insteado of 0, 0 21:12 sovetskiy format of field is 21:12 sovetskiy field[,;,;;