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IRC log for #minetest, 2016-01-22

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:02 rubenwardy joined #minetest
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00:04 kaeza joined #minetest
00:04 kaeza o/
00:18 wowamane hey why *am* i here anyhow
00:19 Ronsor wowamane: idk
00:19 Ronsor because i am?
00:19 wowamane no i dont think thats it
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00:39 kaeza such a mane
00:39 kaeza very wow
00:39 rater193 hello everyone
00:39 kaeza hello rater193
00:40 rater193 anyone here mod minetest?
00:40 kaeza yes
00:40 rater193 do u know anything about entities?
00:40 kaeza what are you interested in, exactly?
00:40 rater193 more specifically, animations
00:41 rater193 im having an issue with my obj file, it says that it cant use set_bone_position because it isnt a mesh type
00:41 rater193 give me a sec, i will get the error
00:41 rater193 *skinned mesh
00:41 rater193 No mesh, or mesh not of skinned mesh type
00:42 rater193 it renders in the game, just dosnt want to set the bone position
00:42 rater193 its a rig i use in unity, so i know it works
00:43 kaeza can you pastebin your code?
00:43 rater193 sure
00:44 kaadmy rater193: are you using the .obj model format?
00:44 rater193 http://pastebin.com/agy11sQK
00:44 rater193 yes
00:45 kaadmy afaik only .b3d and .x work for animated meshes
00:45 kaadmy .obj works only for static models
00:45 rater193 oooo ok
00:45 rater193 so use directx?
00:45 kaadmy try using .b3d instead
00:45 rater193 ok
00:45 kaadmy .x works, but animations work badly
00:45 rater193 good to know, thanks!
00:45 kaadmy np
00:45 rater193 btw im going to use code to manipulate the bones
00:45 rater193 so no animating needed
00:46 kaadmy it'll be slow server-side
00:46 rater193 so all i have to do is put in the bone names of other rigs
00:46 rater193 to make it tranisition over
00:46 rater193 im going to make it run on its own coroutine
00:46 kaadmy then the network lag will cause the animation to be as slow as the ping
00:46 rater193 oh
00:46 rater193 darn :/
00:47 kaadmy where a 50 ms ping would cause 20 fps animations which is still too sloa
00:47 rater193 that sux D:
00:47 rater193 is there a way to run code on client side?
00:47 kaadmy there's already mods that add scripted animations, but they're sloa
00:48 rater193 good to know....
00:48 kaadmy currently there's no way to do client-side scripting, but it's on the todo list
00:48 rater193 ill just use animations then
00:48 rater193 itl look sexier that way anyway
00:48 kaadmy heh
00:48 kaeza rater193, not currently; you'll need to use true animations
00:48 kaeza as in mesh-based animations or however it's called
00:48 rater193 yeah
00:49 rater193 thats what i was going to do
00:49 rater193 having it handled server side like i was going to do would just look choppy
00:49 rater193 choppy gfx = crappy mod
00:50 kaeza also, lots and lots of bandwidth used sending the "move bone here" commands ;)
00:50 rater193 good to know, im on a hotspot atm so that would have killed my bandwidth xD
00:50 rater193 5gb/month :/
00:51 kaeza hey, that's 2.5x more than me lucky guy
00:51 rater193 ouch xD
00:51 kaeza "ouch" indeed :(
00:51 rater193 just wondering, what is the communities stance on minecraft?
00:52 kaeza varied, from "meh" to "burn the witch"
00:52 rater193 XD
00:52 rater193 lol
00:52 rater193 well, i am a fan of minecraft, i was working on adding in all the features from minecraft, into 1 modpack
00:52 rater193 each "feature" would be its own mod
00:53 rater193 so they like certain hostile mobs, just disable the mod for the ones they dislike
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00:53 rater193 welcome back ekem
00:59 kaeza rater193, you may want to look at some subgames like MiniTest ( https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=2589 ) which intended to provide MC-like gameplay. if only to start from something
01:00 rater193 i want to code everything
01:00 rater193 it was going to be its own game mode
01:00 rater193 *its own game
01:00 rater193 even the world gen would be re-written
01:01 rater193 to be better, more minecraft like
01:01 Ronsor thats way too hard
01:01 Ronsor trust me
01:01 Ronsor you dont want to
01:01 Ronsor win 16
01:02 kaeza Windows 16? and thought they skipping 9 was weird
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01:06 rater193 btw
01:06 rater193 they skipped windows 9 because of namespacing
01:06 rater193 it was conflicting with 98
01:07 shadowzone it's 10 :P
01:07 kaadmy heh
01:07 shadowzone so I can see how you skipped 9
01:09 rater193 1 thing minetest is missing to make it better, is high quality voxel models
01:09 rater193 for enemies
01:09 rater193 it would make it SOOO much better
01:09 rater193 winch is what i plan to add :P
01:09 rater193 after i get my core api finished
01:09 rater193 and get minecraft coded
01:10 kaadmy good luck :)
01:10 rubenwardy Two things make good mods: believable behaviour and believable animations
01:10 rubenwardy and speed, ofc, but that should be given
01:11 rater193 i agree
01:11 rater193 luckily ive spent the past 14 years programming, and modeling :P
01:11 kaeza problem is we lack decent ·D, and texture artists (without offense to anyone; my textures are also crap)
01:11 kaeza ·D? 3D
01:11 shadowzone XD
01:11 rater193 btw i can make some amazing textures:P
01:12 rater193 ive been doing art longer than i spent coding
01:12 rater193 been doing art since the age of 6
01:12 rater193 and coding since 9
01:12 shadowzone I've been coding since 10(I'll be 14 in march) and art since I knew how to hold a pencil
01:13 rater193 lol nice :P
01:14 Ronsor i've been coding since i was 8
01:14 Ronsor nevermind that
01:14 shadowzone and I'm learning 3D animations currently
01:14 rater193 here's a tip
01:14 rater193 dont bother cracking 3ds
01:14 rater193 just use blender
01:14 rater193 its free, and better
01:14 kaadmy ^
01:14 rater193 just more complicated
01:14 Ronsor can confirm i have it
01:14 Ronsor but its not easy
01:14 rater193 <rater193> just more complicated
01:14 rater193 :P
01:14 shadowzone I use Blender
01:15 kaadmy complicated is easy to use after you learn it
01:15 rater193 yup
01:15 rater193 besides you can just make custom python plugins for it to make it "easier" to use
01:16 shadowzone yeah
01:16 shadowzone I've gotten pretty good
01:17 shadowzone https://forum.minetest.net/vi​ewtopic.php?f=50&amp;t=13758 this is something me and a friend have been working on for about a month now
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01:25 rater193 *dead chat*
01:26 shadowzone ikr :D
01:27 rubenwardy Not really
01:27 rubenwardy a few minutes is nothing in IRC
01:28 rubenwardy Even ##security, with 1,300+ members is silent for 10s of minutes at a time
01:36 DI3HARD139 ^Tis true
01:38 Glorfindel yeah
01:39 Glorfindel only busy channel is freenode and #ubuntu lol
01:39 Glorfindel support channels
01:40 lambda-11235 Glorfindel: and #haskell. They're almost never quite.
01:40 Glorfindel *quiet
01:40 Glorfindel never been in that channel
01:40 Glorfindel though actually there are a few game channels that are always going too...
01:42 lambda-11235 On some channels I post the same question ten hours apart and feel like I'm spamming it.
01:42 Glorfindel lol
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01:58 rater193 how many people are on the minetest development team?
02:00 rubenwardy Depends what you mean by the development team
02:00 rubenwardy Minetest is open source so anyone can develop the game
02:00 rubenwardy and contribute changes
02:00 rubenwardy however, there is a core team which have the right to vote on which changes get merged
02:01 rubenwardy https://github.com/orgs/minetest/people
02:01 rubenwardy Calin_u and I are just website maintainers, we aren't part of the core team
02:01 rubenwardy * core dev team
02:01 rubenwardy So: 12 peopl
02:02 rater193 sry
02:02 Ronsor hi
02:02 rater193 i was afk
02:03 rater193 hello
02:05 Ronsor is there a way to have "client-side" mods for minetest even in multiplayer
02:05 Ronsor e.g. commands, aliases, etc
02:06 rater193 atm, if you want "mods" for the server, there is no way to make it run client side code
02:06 rater193 however, its on their to do list
02:06 Ronsor hmm i'll just patch minetest
02:06 Ronsor probably implement something with dlls
02:07 Ronsor and bundle a linker
02:07 rater193 well, if u put it that way than pretty much anything is possible :P
02:07 rater193 i thought u ment like a server mod
02:07 Ronsor it wouldn't be lua, but would work
02:07 rater193 *meant
02:07 Ronsor its a client mod
02:07 Ronsor that runs in multiplayer
02:07 Ronsor the server need not install it
02:07 rater193 ah
02:08 rater193 #hax
02:08 Ronsor it would be stuff like pseudo-mesecons via iron
02:08 rater193 ah
02:08 Ronsor autobuilder (cheating?)
02:08 rater193 so, auto crafting
02:08 rater193 and lol
02:08 Ronsor and other stuff lile you see in minecraft hacked clients
02:08 Ronsor only more ethical
02:08 rater193 btw
02:09 rater193 you can also just code a "client" to forward all the data to and listen for keyboard input or a gui button
02:09 rater193 to "change" or "force send" certian packets to the server
02:09 rater193 *certain
02:09 Ronsor a proxy?
02:09 rater193 yup
02:09 Ronsor slightly harder
02:09 rater193 well, without connecting to someone else
02:09 Ronsor of course there could be a wrapper for minetest
02:09 rater193 just a small "server" on ur computer
02:09 rater193 yup
02:10 rater193 didnt want to say wrapper
02:10 rater193 :P
02:10 Ronsor that sends keypresses etc
02:10 rater193 anything that uses the internet, could have a "wrapper"
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02:10 Ronsor i'd still rather just build it in
02:10 Ronsor less confusion
02:10 Ronsor less protocols
02:10 rater193 yeah it would be easier too
02:10 rater193 just decompile/recompile a dll
02:10 rater193 done
02:11 Ronsor i'd probably bundle a linker app or something with it
02:11 Ronsor so at runtime, it links the dll
02:11 Ronsor and the mod loads
02:11 rater193 using dll "cracks" is no fun i would just make a wrapper :P
02:11 Ronsor i could also find a way to take advantage of lua
02:11 Glorfindel minetest crashing... http://paste.ubuntu.com/14594494/
02:11 rater193 so if they make a update, it "most likely" wouldnt break it
02:12 Ronsor lol what if i made "patches"
02:12 rater193 welp then im screwed
02:12 rater193 :P
02:12 Ronsor and the dll shouldn't break
02:12 Ronsor considering i will update stufd
02:12 rater193 if they change something with the dll u done
02:12 rater193 you would have to recompile
02:12 Ronsor well it would use my own api thing
02:13 rater193 ah
02:13 Ronsor for compatibility
02:13 rater193 nice
02:13 Ronsor e.g. a /dll command to run dll functions
02:13 Ronsor /dll build schematic.sqlite
02:13 Ronsor or /dll flyhack on
02:13 rater193 i get what u mean :P
02:13 rater193 *hax*
02:14 Glorfindel lol
02:14 Glorfindel so 1337
02:14 Ronsor it would be a hacked client basically
02:14 rater193 lol
02:14 Ronsor it'd bundle a patch manager to install the patches
02:15 Glorfindel I would love client side mods
02:15 rater193 i dont like making "hacked" clients, i always get carried away then they make 1 sutle change to mess up everything
02:15 Glorfindel then I could run mods that would lag the server, but at the same time aren't necessary for everyone to have installed
02:15 Glorfindel *lag the server if installed on the server
02:16 Ronsor honestly id like a lua api for this
02:16 rater193 client side mods should have "limited" power
02:16 Ronsor you CANT limit the,
02:16 rater193 for example, able to receive packets, but not send packets
02:16 Ronsor they may do whatever the client can
02:16 rater193 if they force it lua side
02:16 rater193 they can
02:16 rater193 lua only has the power the engine gives it
02:17 rater193 so they can "limit" the power they give
02:17 Ronsor maybe i'll just do dlls
02:17 rater193 lua by itself is actually quite weak
02:17 rater193 it by default dosnt even have file support
02:17 rater193 you have to install seperate modules
02:17 Ronsor lua by itself is more or less only useful for shell scripts
02:17 Glorfindel I'd rather they had done python, though I have no idea if that is possible
02:17 rater193 yup
02:17 Ronsor it is possible
02:18 Ronsor but python embedded just feels weird
02:18 rater193 python->lua would be like html->javascript
02:18 Ronsor personally im partial to tcl, but would use python or lua
02:18 rater193 2 completly different syntaxes
02:18 rater193 html is just basically config
02:18 rater193 while javascript is an actual script
02:18 Ronsor yeah
02:19 Glorfindel really?
02:19 rater193 even the way you declare variables in pythin is different
02:19 rater193 *python
02:19 Glorfindel how does that make it "basically config"?
02:20 Glorfindel I don't think I'm understanding
02:20 rater193 what i meant is that python is entirely different from lua
02:20 rater193 python is faster, and lighter on ram
02:20 rater193 but (imo) has less power than lua
02:20 Glorfindel oh
02:20 Ronsor python has more power
02:21 Ronsor depends on how you use it
02:21 Glorfindel I guess I've never used lua, but I would say python is more powerful
02:21 rater193 depends how u use it
02:21 rater193 xD
02:21 Ronsor lua is lighter and faster IMO
02:21 rater193 phython is.....unsafe....compared to lua
02:21 Ronsor yeah thats true
02:22 Ronsor btw does anyone know how to define commands in cpp
02:22 Ronsor e.g. /blah
02:22 kaadmy python has too much global variable access
02:23 kaeza I don't see why Lua needs change. IMHO it's perfect for our purposes
02:23 kaadmy lua is safer but less powerful
02:23 kaadmy python is far more powerful afaik
02:23 rater193 lua, when given the right libraries
02:23 rater193 can be pretty powerful
02:23 rater193 but the same can be said for python
02:23 kaeza and Lua is (or may be) as powerful as Python, or any other language, feature-wise
02:23 rater193 its all down to how u use the two languages
02:24 kaeza and no, list comprehension and all that is just syntactic sugar
02:25 Glorfindel kaeza: minetest is crashing with your firearms mod and a few others, could you look at the terminal output?
02:25 Glorfindel I don't know if it's the firearms or something else right now
02:26 kaeza Glorfindel, known issue. too lazy to fix
02:26 kaeza blame kaeza
02:26 Glorfindel lol
02:26 Glorfindel ok
02:27 kaeza *ahem* if you really feel something important is missing from the Lua API (stdlib or Minetest API), it's better to suggest an addition (and make a compelling argument for it)
02:27 kaeza that looked shorter on my end...
02:27 rater193 XD
02:27 rater193 lol
02:28 * DI3HARD139 goes back to making a multi-OS install drive
02:28 * kaeza wonders how multi-OS installs can drive
02:29 DI3HARD139 HDD/drive
02:29 rater193 lol
02:29 DI3HARD139 heh
02:29 Glorfindel lol
02:29 Glorfindel I use usb :P
02:29 rater193 raspberry pi ftw!
02:30 rater193 Plug-N-Install
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03:00 rubenwardy Glorfindel, I recommend shooter mod
03:15 rater193 what are the best mods for minetest?
03:15 rater193 im going to put together a modpack for sp
03:18 kaeza define "best" :)
03:23 kaeza anyway, it's almost 1 AM, sooo...
03:23 kaeza o/
03:28 Glorfindel rubenwardy: if you see this... I was thinking I'd probably get that one too :) Thanks
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03:56 rater193 oh wow
03:56 rater193 i found a bug
03:56 * sofar claps
03:58 rater193 if you declare a table for textures for a block outside the scope that the block is being registered in, for example, having 1 mod register the block with a function while another uses that function with a texture table as an argument, it will use the "invalid node" texture
03:59 rater193 a way around it:
03:59 rater193 just copy the contents of the table to a new table
03:59 rater193 and done
03:59 rater193 just make sure they have different instance pointers
03:59 rater193 if you just use the variable in the table, it will just bug out
04:00 rater193 so use "tostring"
04:00 rater193 or ""..variable
04:04 DI3HARD139 Someone just literally started messaging me about islam..... Must be a bot
04:05 sofar report to a staffer
04:06 sofar rater193: you shouldn't ever have node registration run parallel with something else
04:06 sofar rater193: how did you manage to pull that off?
04:18 rater193 sry
04:18 rater193 i was afk
04:18 rater193 because im a master of lua :P
04:18 rater193 its a simple bug to work around
04:19 rater193 you can "read" variables from outside the scope
04:19 rater193 you just cant use them with userdata
04:19 rater193 however]
04:19 rater193 if you "duplicate" the instance
04:19 rater193 you can then use
04:19 rater193 *you can then use it
04:24 rater193 sofar
04:28 sofar right
04:43 kaadmy heh
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05:15 rater193 anyone still awake?
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06:17 YewAga Help
06:19 kaadmy huh
06:19 kaadmy some people don't understand irc
06:19 kaadmy gnite
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07:28 Calinou https://github.com/superpowers/superpow​ers/wiki/This-Week-in-Superpowers-%231
07:28 Calinou CC0 assets! :D
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07:43 everamzah /giveme air
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08:04 Megaf Yesterday was a good day for my server, finally got a day when for the most part of the time the server was full
08:04 Megaf full == ~6 players
08:04 Megaf :D
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08:21 Megaf Good morning OldCoder
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08:23 OldCoder Megaf, o/
08:24 Megaf 1`qAS LO=
08:26 Megaf Oops, I was cleaning my laptop's keyboard
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10:02 JamesTait Good morning all!  Happy Friday, and happy Answer Your Cats' Questions Day! 😃  🐈
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10:43 giho Just say "Mew" back?
10:49 JamesTait "No, it's not feeding time."
10:49 JamesTait "Still not feeding time."
10:49 JamesTait And so on....
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11:10 everamzah fwiw, Megaf, i'm thoroughly convinced that if you want a populated server, just don't put any mods on it
11:10 everamzah (only half-serious)
11:11 everamzah i do believe less is more, in that regard
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11:44 fireglow is there a way to (temporarily) turn off the generation of new biomes? Some special null mapgen or something?
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13:16 Thomas-S hi
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13:22 MinetestBot [git] paramat -> minetest/minetest_game: Default/mapgen: Remove unused 'mapgen_air' alias 4b8410a https://git.io/vzaCo (2016-01-22T13:21:26Z)
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14:02 H-H-H hey guys how would i update a value in a formspec without reloading it? would i have to do it via an abm?
14:03 everamzah i think it has to be reloaded (the formspec string) in order to updte
14:03 H-H-H yeah i was just looking at how furnace works and from what i can see its reloaded via an abm
14:04 everamzah ye cuz of the swapping prolly.  or the nature of the thing.  are you just trying to get a formspec to update its display on some event?  like a button press?
14:05 H-H-H it will be for a user to press a button and spend 10 credits for example and the formspec has the total amount of credits displayed and i want to update the total after the user presses the button , if that makes sence
14:06 everamzah on receieve fields perform action and minetest.show_formspec at the end?
14:06 everamzah if THAT makes sense
14:06 everamzah basically, whatever action is happened, have it, when it's done, show_formspec
14:07 H-H-H yeah it does ty :)
14:07 everamzah oh that's not it?  then i got nothin' sorry if i got ur hopes up heh
14:08 H-H-H i just said yeah thanks lol how did you get thae conclusionn it wasnt helpfull (im confused)
14:12 everamzah text barrier
14:12 everamzah <-- easily confused
14:12 everamzah ^5
14:16 H-H-H im now implementing your idea and will see what happens
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19:18 swift110 hey guys
19:21 Calinou hi
19:21 Calinou jetpack in Platshoot: https://transfer.sh/ITI5d/reco​rding-2016-01-22-19.20.56.webm
19:21 Calinou (maybe will be disabled in some levels)
19:21 swift110 how are you Calinou
19:22 Calinou fine, I likely passed my semester at university :)
19:22 Calinou 15,03/20
19:22 Calinou (based on my own calculations, hence the "likely")
19:23 swift110 good
19:24 swift110 what ya up too
19:24 Calinou swift110, developing my game
19:24 Calinou see video above
19:24 Calinou working on a second level, jetpack, level exits…
19:26 swift110 thats cool
19:26 swift110 do you also work on minetest
19:27 Calinou not really these days :/
19:31 Fixer liquid flow gives to F5 distinct heart beat look
19:31 Fixer Calinou, but does it have random?
19:32 swift110 why not
19:34 Calinou Fixer, random?
19:35 Fixer Calinou, random generator
19:39 Calinou Fixer, Godot has random number functions
19:39 Calinou it's used for weapon spread :p
19:40 Calinou PSA: More Blocks, More Ores, Map Tools are now hosted on https://github.com/minetest-mods
19:40 Calinou for easier community contribution
19:40 nrzkt i like godot in google
19:40 Calinou also, I reached 3000 posts
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20:17 Ronsor soon i will present my client patches for a better minetest:
20:17 Ronsor including aliases
20:24 sofar don't save them up, make them small and submit them one at a time!
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20:25 sofar Ronsor: ^^
20:25 Ronsor i will do that
20:25 sofar Ronsor: and make them separate PR's if they are unrelated
20:25 Ronsor i need to add aliases to be saved and loaded first
20:25 sofar what kind of aliases?
20:26 Ronsor command aliases, client side
20:26 Ronsor useful for teleporting for example
20:26 sofar have you considered previous PRs that discussed the same and were rejected?
20:26 sofar chat command aliases have been requested to be kept mod-side
20:27 Ronsor well, I haven't seen those yet, i guess i'll have a seperate project
20:27 Ronsor with patches
20:27 sofar also, check out https://github.com/rubenwardy/aliases
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21:16 kaeza o/
21:20 Fixer o\
21:25 * Jordach meows at kaeza
21:25 * kaeza purrs at Jordach
21:27 MinetestBot [git] pickardjoe -> Uberi/Minetest-WorldEdit: Added a WorldEdit wand item that can be used to select areas with worldedit. 4771284 https://git.io/vzVxR (2016-01-22T22:24:17+01:00)
21:30 Thomas-S bye
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22:48 Ronsor Ok
22:48 Ronsor i have more reports
22:48 Ronsor TelePortHack, a client-side teleport command works on some servers ( just tested on Xanadu ), good news is anticheat should stop it
22:48 Ronsor still working on a flyhack patch
22:51 sfan5 working on a fly hack patch?
22:51 sfan5 you literally just have to add return true;
22:54 Ronsor sfan5: yeah, not that simple for a server
22:54 Ronsor you have to check if there's a block below them
22:54 Ronsor and how long they've been in the air
22:54 Ronsor and whether they are falling, or not
22:57 sfan5 oh that
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23:16 Hijiri if mods change gravity or jump height you would want to account for that too
23:17 Ronsor yeah
23:17 Ronsor that's not simple
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23:54 Hijiri I got Purescript -> Lua compilation sort of working
23:54 Hijiri maybe this can be useful for modding
23:55 Hijiri it's still quite buggy though
23:56 rom1504 then you can run purescript in the browser http://kripken.github.io/lua.vm.js/lua.vm.js.html :p
23:56 Hijiri you already can
23:57 Hijiri purescript originally compiles to JS
23:57 rom1504 not fun :p
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