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IRC log for #minetest, 2015-11-28

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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00:05 rubenwardy I'm looking for moderators for CTF (minetest.rubenwardy.com:3000)
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00:09 STHGOM what kind of things would a moderator do there?
00:09 STHGOM only work against spam and cussing, right?
00:12 rubenwardy give warnings then temp bans for sabotage, excessive swearing and dating.
00:12 rubenwardy well
00:12 rubenwardy warnings for accidental swearing
00:12 rubenwardy temp-ban for repeated
00:12 rubenwardy I don't count stuff like "damn" and "penis" as swearing
00:12 rubenwardy unless used in a sexual context
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01:41 bleak_fire_ hi
01:41 bleak_fire_ i updated my mods yesterday, and just ran across a problem with pipeworks
01:41 bleak_fire_ note that today will be difficult and laggy as my internet connection is always dial-up-speed unusable on black friday
01:42 bleak_fire_ but it's still do-able
01:42 bleak_fire_ pictures load like dial-up where you had them drop like the shade
01:42 bleak_fire_ butg
01:42 bleak_fire_ this is my error
01:43 bleak_fire_ it seems to focus on item_drop
01:43 bleak_fire_ Runtime error from mod 'pipeworks' in callback environment_Step(): /usr/share/minetest/builtin/game/item.lua:338: attempt to index local 'dropper' (a nil value)
01:44 bleak_fire_ stack traceback:
01:44 bleak_fire_ (preventing mirc from reading the slash)           /usr/share/minetest/builtin/game/item.lua:338: in function 'item_drop'
01:45 bleak_fire_ ERROR[main]:       ...st/games/minetest_game/mods/p​ipeworks/item_transport.lua:252: in function 'on_step'
01:45 bleak_fire_ ERROR[main]:       ...inetest/games/minetest_game/m​ods/pipeworks/luaentity.lua:347: in function <...inetest/games/minetest_game/m​ods/pipeworks/luaentity.lua:312>
01:45 bleak_fire_ ERROR[main]:       /usr/share/minetest/builtin/game/register.lua:355: in function </usr/share/minetest/built​in/game/register.lua:335>
01:46 bleak_fire_ ok
01:46 bleak_fire_ so while i dont intend to actually put back the old version of pipeworks or start the server, due to my internet speed issue
01:46 bleak_fire_ this is the error i am having
01:47 bleak_fire_ github loads partially so i can do someting there
01:47 bleak_fire_ but i'd thought i'd report it here
01:47 bleak_fire_ also, i dont know what file it's supposed to be
01:47 bleak_fire_ item_transport or luaentity
01:48 bleak_fire_ my guess is that it's item_transport
01:48 bleak_fire_ because it was recently updated
01:48 bleak_fire_ but i dont know
01:48 bleak_fire_ if you can tell me here i will file a bug report
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01:52 DI3HARD139 Question: How would I go about making a node for minetest
01:53 DI3HARD139 Im mainly trying to add ontop of HomeDecor
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02:03 rubenwardy http://rubenwardy.com/minetest_modd​ing_book/chapters/nodes_items_craft​ing.html#registering-a-basic-node
02:08 DI3HARD139 ty rubenwardy
02:08 bleak_fire_ i cant replicate the problem based on what he did
02:08 bleak_fire_ to cause the crash
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02:10 bleak_fire_ i dont know much about pipeworks but the only pipeworks thing i saw is him placing a node breaker
02:10 bleak_fire_ i dont know what that does, but i've been able to place nodebreakers, and pipes, with no problems
02:12 bleak_fire_ and a blinky plant
02:12 bleak_fire_ i just placed a few of those and it didnt crash like when he did it
02:13 bleak_fire_ so you think i should let this slide or file a report?
02:13 bleak_fire_ i'm doing exactly what he did, no crashes
02:16 DI3HARD139 How can I correct this: Server::ProcessData<>: PacketError: what=String too long ??
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04:08 bleak_fire_ well no more crashes so i'll let it go this time
04:08 bleak_fire_ bye
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06:05 swift110-phone Hey
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06:40 OldCoder Pro Tip: VanessaE_ rewriting a MT DB with page_size = 4096 speeds up MT *and* cuts large world sizes by 1GB
06:40 OldCoder ruskie, sfan5_ ^
06:42 LazyJ_2 What is/are the trade-off(s)?
06:42 LazyJ_2 How do I have a LazyJ_2??
06:43 LazyJ_2 Relogging...
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06:46 LazyJ Is this page_size stuff something for us knuckledraggers or does it require full working knowledge of SQLite?
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07:10 OldCoder LazyJ, in between; I know you're interested in optimization
07:10 OldCoder Can discuss after I study further
07:10 OldCoder Size definitely drops 1GB for some worlds
07:10 OldCoder Performance will depend on different factors, need to study that
07:11 LazyJ
07:11 OldCoder Speed may improve in general
07:11 OldCoder Probably 10MB higher memory requirements
07:12 LazyJ Speed is nice, but longevity and stability are valued more.
07:12 LazyJ At least for me.
07:12 LazyJ LG's RAM isn't being taxed much.
07:12 LazyJ
07:14 LazyJ My memory, on the other hand,... :0)-
07:14 LazyJ Shorter than the hairs on my bald head.
07:14 LazyJ
07:19 OldCoder Yep
07:20 OldCoder LazyJ, answer a foolish question...
07:20 OldCoder Formspecs aren't stored in the DB data, right?
07:20 OldCoder Just the data is stored
07:20 OldCoder The wording of a formspec should change if you change a mod?
07:21 LazyJ Sorry, OldCoder, but I have no understanding of formspecs and how they work with databases.
07:21 OldCoder kkty
07:23 LazyJ What little I know about coding is only what I've struggled to learn to fix more immediate problems that looked like stuff I could do something about.
07:24 LazyJ Coming in to Minetest, I had no coding knowledge other than very, very rudimentary html.
07:25 LazyJ I became addicted to Minetest enough, and had invested a lot of time creating in a server, that when things on the server began to be neglected, I stepped up from being a normal player to someone who took care of things.
07:26 LazyJ Ok, enough reminiscing "the good ol'days" from this cranky old fart.
07:26 LazyJ
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11:32 Obani rubenwardy, would you like me to look for others mapgenerations ?
11:32 rubenwardy huh
11:32 rubenwardy oh, you sent something to me, didn't you
11:33 Obani Yesterday ?
11:34 Obani I did send you something two days ago
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11:46 Obani rubenwardy, you didn't anwer me :p
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11:55 rubenwardy I think  it was too days ago
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12:17 Obani rubenwardy, I was talking about if you wanted me to search for others map seeds
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12:26 rubenwardy I don't like how they have to scale a cliff. Ideally I like a map where both teams are on either side of a valley with lots of rocks and ditches
12:26 rubenwardy and trees
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12:31 Obani rubenwardy, the problem is that you break the spirit of the game you wanted to take sinpiration on ;)
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13:13 Calinou https://lut.im/ytnbZXDicm/oL3jJW9agraMovre.png
13:13 Calinou Doomsday stable compiles fine, but not master branch…
13:18 Krock > 101%
13:19 Calinou you can have up to 200% health/armor
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13:26 * Fixer is redcrabbing right now
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13:51 passerbye hello
13:58 passerbye so
13:58 passerbye i found this on the forums and
13:58 passerbye https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=92
13:58 Krock hi
13:59 passerbye the link to the guy's repo is dead
13:59 passerbye so I was wondering if there's a way to find it or
13:59 Krock yeah see all those dead links
13:59 Calinou obviously, it's 4.5 years old :P
13:59 passerbye well i found anther repo of his but
13:59 Calinou you should join the Classic Quake community, where 90% of links are dead
13:59 passerbye not sure if it has the double wield feature
14:00 Krock gawd, how that would smell there..
14:00 passerbye should i keep searching for it or do you think it's easier to just redo it myself :P
14:00 Krock remove the dead links before their virus spreads and causes more dead links :<
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14:05 * Fixer runs with screwdriver
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14:10 Darcidride please move ASAP this mod https://forum.minetest.net/viewto​pic.php?f=11&amp;t=10418#p199912 (posted today, released since 6 months and more), in WIp, that's not serious =)
14:15 Calinou license needs to be stated in mod topic
14:15 Calinou (code preview doesn't count, it's not obvious)
14:15 Calinou also, dependencies
14:17 Darcidride it's true, let me 2 minutes
14:19 Darcidride license, dependencies, and optional dependencies added : https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.ph​p?f=9&amp;t=13659&amp;p=199910#p199910
14:23 Darcidride Calinou ^
14:24 Krock !title
14:24 Krock MTB!
14:24 Calinou moved
14:24 Krock sfan5, MTB is gone, please bring her back :(
14:26 passerbye hey can anyone think of any problems that might come up with implementing dual wielding:?
14:35 est31 passerbye, it would require changing the client too
14:35 est31 so a larger project
14:35 passerbye hmm
14:36 passerbye i guess i'll delay it till after finals then
14:37 passerbye wouldn't there also be a conflict with items that require two mouse buttons?
14:38 passerbye maybe an "action" mode where each item would have one use function...
14:38 passerbye how does that sound?
14:39 est31 yeah
14:39 est31 I doubt however whether we want dual wield mode in minetes
14:39 est31 t
14:39 passerbye it can be quite handy when shields are involved
14:40 est31 the shields implementations I see manage it as armour
14:40 est31 so you change shields only by changing armour
14:41 passerbye you're right
14:41 passerbye also
14:41 passerbye i was thinking about magic mods but
14:41 passerbye they might as well have a small different UI for setting the spells
14:43 passerbye new project: magic mods :D
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15:04 Fixer new projects: fixing liquid and rendering bugs!!1111
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15:11 rubenwardy why do people feel the need to pretend to be admins
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15:11 Fixer i don't know
15:12 alket rubenwardy: that and dating I don't understand
15:12 Fixer I usually "lol" at that
15:12 rubenwardy and dating too
15:12 rubenwardy <GirlyGamer####> ruben Shakur said i love you to me!
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15:15 Fixer haha
15:15 rubenwardy > when you tell players that they can ping you by saying "ruben" in the chat :'(
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15:17 Fixer it is on CTF server?
15:17 rubenwardy yes
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15:24 * Fixer fixed so much slabs -> want to throw up
15:24 * Fixer thanks Calinou
15:28 Fixer lol
15:28 Fixer wall with red cross on white background with a sign "not a football team"
15:33 * Fixer runs with screwdriver all over the place like an idiot
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15:39 Fixer why nobody visits old coder's redcrab? it is amazing peace of history
15:39 est31 peace?
15:39 * est31 grammar pedant
15:40 Fixer oh damned
15:40 Fixer place*
15:40 Fixer sorry
15:41 exio4 hi
15:41 rubenwardy piece*?
15:43 Fixer or piece
15:44 Fixer yes
15:44 Fixer that was right
15:44 Fixer >_>
15:50 Obani Fixer, that's not
15:50 Obani For me, redcrab is 0.3.1
15:50 Fixer i remember it too
15:51 Obani The time you couldn't hit peoples :D
15:51 Obani The time where everyone had fly+fast, and noclip was a developper dream :D
15:53 Fixer red crab 0.3 was beginning of minetest
15:54 Obani And it was so cool ^^
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15:56 Fixer fast mode was funny
15:56 Fixer it works differently now iirc
15:56 Fixer at first you can run fast + jump but without flying
15:56 Fixer by pressing K iirc
15:59 Fixer 0.4 redcrab is immense
16:00 Fixer minetest has very good build in general
16:10 STHGOM you still can go fast without fly
16:11 STHGOM use key
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16:16 Fixer i will try again
16:16 Fixer OldCoder, world looks good, some areas need slab/panel fix as usual (with reset)
16:29 Fixer last farmap commit was 14 days ago, ugh
16:29 Fixer wonder, where is c55...
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17:30 hoodedice so the join dates are WRONG on the forum
17:31 hoodedice never mind
17:31 hoodedice am silly
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19:01 Obani Hey
19:01 Obani I just compiled last git commit
19:01 JohnnyComeL8ly And it is amazing?
19:01 Obani And I've a segmentation error when launching minetest
19:01 Krock It is amazing
19:01 Obani I can't even see the menu
19:02 Krock #minetest-dev would be happy about a gdb output
19:02 JohnnyComeL8ly Obani, you need to provide more info than that.
19:02 Krock (or however that tool's called)
19:02 Obani And I don't even know why
19:02 rubenwardy !mod playlife
19:02 Obani I have no logs
19:02 Krock rubenwardy, MTB is still dead
19:02 rubenwardy Obani, Linux based?
19:02 JohnnyComeL8ly Obani, then specify a log file.
19:02 Obani The only log I have in my terminal is Loaded texture: ../../minetest_game/menu/header.png
19:02 Obani Then, segmentation error
19:03 Obani rubenwardy, yes : Debian Jessie (stable)
19:03 hoodedice someone didn't malloc(9001)
19:03 rubenwardy sudo apt-get install gdb && cmake . -DCMAKE_BUILD_TYPE=Debug && make -j2 && gdb bin/minetest
19:03 hoodedice malloc(9001) fixes everything
19:03 Krock rofl
19:03 Calinou hi hoodedice
19:03 Calinou the .tscn/.tres parser (which will allow to load those files in Godot) is almost finished
19:03 hoodedice elo
19:03 Obani rubenwardy, it always worked, why wouldn't it work now ?
19:03 Calinou (new format, to replace XML)
19:04 hoodedice Godot is soon going to be a pain to learn haha
19:04 hoodedice because they invent the wheel for everything
19:04 Calinou XML is often criticized, even by Linus Torvalds
19:04 Calinou Godot's philosophy is, "if there is nothing good, invent it", and I kind of agree with it
19:04 JohnnyComeL8ly Obani, you need to just do as rubenwardy said.
19:04 Calinou it's similar to Blender's
19:05 Obani JohnnyComeL8ly, ok, but first I'll update my packages versions :)
19:05 Obani 52 updates ^^
19:05 JohnnyComeL8ly Calinou, I like it... that is how git came into being.
19:05 JohnnyComeL8ly Obani, that could be part of the problem.
19:06 Calinou JohnnyComeL8ly, well, .tscn/.tres are text formats, they are VCS-friendly just like XML
19:06 Calinou they are INI-style
19:06 Obani Calinou, heard the roll sounds ? :p
19:07 Calinou not yet
19:08 JohnnyComeL8ly Calinou, VCS = version control system?
19:08 Calinou yep
19:08 VanessaE_ I thought that was some old model of atari computer? :)
19:08 * Krock connects atari computer with the worst game ever, E.T.
19:09 Obani Worst game ever ? THere is worst :D
19:09 Krock hmm?
19:09 hoodedice VanessaE_, pls
19:10 hoodedice also,_
19:10 Obani This update takes soooo long...
19:10 hoodedice Calinou, I *am* starting a project in godot after my finals
19:10 JohnnyComeL8ly Atari VCS is a real thing, but I knew it wasn't it... context told me so.
19:11 hoodedice Obani, not as bad as MS updates
19:11 JohnnyComeL8ly hoodedice, no kidding!
19:11 hoodedice heck, at least they don't suddenly pull updates #Win10NovemberUpdate
19:11 Obani hoodedice, I shall have updated earlier :/
19:11 hoodedice I feel bad about w10m
19:11 hoodedice they removed a lot of stuff I liked in w8.1m
19:12 Obani hoodedice, remove Windows :p
19:12 JohnnyComeL8ly Yeah.
19:12 hoodedice Calinou, gonna be a third person hack and slash inspired by TLoZ series and ape escape =D
19:12 hoodedice Obani still have use for it
19:13 Obani hoodedice, for what? League of Legends ? :p
19:13 JohnnyComeL8ly lol
19:13 hoodedice and wifi actually works, unlike xubuntu where it loves to turn off every 15 minutes
19:13 Obani hoodedice, remove xubuntu :p
19:13 JohnnyComeL8ly That is a problem with proprietary (bad) hardware.
19:14 hoodedice realtek 8188EE?
19:14 hoodedice this is generic af
19:14 Krock Intel has proprietary parts IIRC
19:14 hoodedice this should work
19:14 hoodedice but it doesn't
19:14 hoodedice because someone did sizeof(array) in rtl8188 in the kernel
19:14 hoodedice (IIRC)
19:16 JohnnyComeL8ly hoodedice, http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2218962
19:16 hoodedice JohnnyComeL8ly, just so you know, performance is actually better (thank God) as compared to 14.04
19:17 hoodedice it was unusable in 14.04 and required compilation for every kernel update
19:19 exio4 VanessaE: hi
19:19 exio4 I thought we were here, not in #-dev
19:20 exio4 VanessaE: yes, it's exactly like that
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19:20 VanessaE it's still relevant to -dev
19:21 VanessaE besides it's not like there's any actual coding chat going on right now
19:21 hoodedice you mean to say I can spam dev if no one is talking?
19:22 VanessaE nope.
19:23 JohnnyComeL8ly "You are giving me permission to break the rules?"
19:28 hoodedice awww
19:28 JohnnyComeL8ly *Nawww
19:37 exio4 Fixer: you should look at argentine politics, they're so much fun!
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19:45 Fixer exio4, lots of ukrainians emigrated to Argentina in 192* (after Soviet invasion iirc)
19:45 Fixer exio4, i believe there are similarities in those countries
19:46 exio4 heh, argentina got lots of people, specially in those years :P
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20:02 Fixer how much coding expertise i need to at least understand minetest code?
20:03 exio4 a lot because it's a mess
20:03 Calinou much more than eg. Godot probably
20:03 Fixer I've coded very little in turbo pascal (in school), and made small functions in python (that's all) %)
20:05 Fixer turbo pascal was in dos of course, and that was 10 years ago i think
20:05 Fixer looks like, I need compleat reintroduction to coding
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20:11 Calinou Fixer, try making games with Godot, it is a nice way to learn programming
20:11 Calinou http://godotengine.org/projects/godot-engine
20:12 Calinou you write your games in a language called GDScript, which is similar to Python
20:14 Obani rubenwardy, how to use gdb ?
20:14 Obani I don't even know what is it useful for ^^
20:20 Fixer it is for debugging
20:21 Fixer to look how program works and detect errors in more detail if i understand it correctly
20:21 Fixer i've used it few times for backtraces
20:21 Fixer "A backtrace is a summary of how your program got where it is"
20:22 Fixer usually before crash
20:43 rubenwardy when it loads, Obani, type run
20:43 rubenwardy when it crashes, type "bt full"
20:43 rubenwardy it will give a back trace
20:44 rubenwardy press enter until if stops asking you "press enter to continue" or something
20:44 rubenwardy then paste the log in a paste bin
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21:13 Fixer have you seen a bug where crops stop growing?
21:13 hoodedice Calinou, pls
21:13 hoodedice ohayou sfan5
21:14 est31 I think its one of paramat's "speedup" commits where he disabled catchup for the ABMs in mtg
21:14 Fixer it is not that
21:15 * sfan5 paws hoodedice
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21:15 Fixer that's ESM City server bug, i will ask admin, I keep standing and nothing grows (it worked fine not long ago)
21:15 hoodedice lol est
21:17 Fixer paramat speedup is actually a speedup
21:18 Fixer it disables catch up for some things like growing grass, lava cooling, etc, unloading the server
21:19 Fixer crops are not affected
21:22 est31 as if nobody had a grass farm, or flower farms.
21:23 * Calinou farms Mese
21:23 Fixer who on earth had a grass farm?
21:24 est31 well, flower farms are the better example
21:25 Fixer _it is not related to paramat patch in any way_
21:25 Fixer it is 0.4.13 mtg with mods
21:25 Fixer ok, cactus is growing fine
21:27 hoodedice Calinou, have you messed around with lighting and other artwork stuff in godot?
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21:30 Calinou nope, I used 2D lights & shadows for a bit though
21:31 Calinou works okay, but the shadows are infinitely sharp
21:31 hoodedice okay, thanks
21:31 Calinou (and they aren't anti-aliased)
21:31 hoodedice sharp is low performance, right?
21:31 hoodedice as in, easy on the computer
21:31 Calinou sharp shadows (stencil or similar techniques) are cheaper in 2D
21:31 hoodedice okay
21:31 Calinou in 3D, those are likely to be slower than shadow maps now
21:32 Calinou (in many cases)
21:32 hoodedice hmm
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21:32 Calinou eg. with DarkPlaces I have less FPS with stencil shadows than shadow maps
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22:44 * Fixer slaps everybody with a large bug
22:45 Obani No, I do
22:47 JohnnyComeL8ly lol xD
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22:50 koz_ What sort of improvements could I expect to see if I compile Minetest to use LuaJIT?
22:50 rubenwardy usually a lot faster
22:51 rubenwardy http://luajit.org/performance.html
22:51 koz_ rubenwardy: I get that - would it make the graphics performance any better, or is this purely a GPU thing?
22:51 JohnnyComeL8ly *CPU
22:51 rubenwardy It may make graphics better if you're playing singleplayer
22:52 rubenwardy due to not blocking mapgen or whatever
22:52 rubenwardy but mainly it makes Lua mods, callbacks and stuff faster
22:52 rubenwardy but, [citationneeded]
22:52 Fixer stutter will be anyway
22:52 koz_ rubenwardy: OK, I see. JohnnyComeL8ly: I said it right - graphics are handled by the GPU.
22:53 rubenwardy Lua won't effect the GPU
22:53 koz_ Yeah, I know.
22:53 rubenwardy and in Minetest, most of the graphics is down on CPU
22:53 koz_ Oh?
22:53 rubenwardy eg: mesh generation, texture generation
22:53 rubenwardy lighting
22:53 * koz_ did not know that.
22:54 rubenwardy However, that only happens when you dig or place something - vertices are drawn on the GPU
22:54 rubenwardy again, afaik
22:54 koz_ Well, that's news to me. Thanks!
22:54 rubenwardy RealBadAngel will know more about this, and will be able to correct me
22:54 JohnnyComeL8ly I was saying Lua is done on CPU.
22:54 Fixer of course
22:54 koz_ JohnnyComeL8ly: Indeed.
22:55 koz_ Alrighty, thanks for that everyone1
22:55 koz_ s/1/!
22:56 JohnnyComeL8ly So, after all that, you'll most likely see much better performance using LuaJIT.
22:56 RealBadAngel koz_, luajit will make your mods make faster
22:56 Calinou koz_, LuaJIT is ~3 times faster than plain Lua
22:56 RealBadAngel server side
22:56 Calinou but on the other hand, there is no support for Lua 5.2/5.3 features (which we don't use), and portability is worse
22:56 Calinou (the author of LuaJIT is against implementing Lua 5.2/5.3 entirely)
22:56 RealBadAngel it wont affect client performance at all
22:57 RealBadAngel more complex the mod is gain will be greater
22:57 RealBadAngel we dont talk here about simple one node registration mods
22:58 RealBadAngel but those which actually do something
22:58 RealBadAngel technic, piperworks, mesecons
22:58 RealBadAngel if you dont use them, dont bother luajit
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23:22 JohnnyComeL8ly Obani, I'm working on a "clean" fresh compile... I'll see if I get any errors.
23:22 Obani Ok ^^
23:27 JohnnyComeL8ly Obani... none whatsoever.  It flew when loading a vanilla singleplayer world.
23:28 Obani Well I still got the same errors
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23:31 JohnnyComeL8ly Obani... I don't know what to tell you.
23:32 JohnnyComeL8ly You don't get any compilation errors?
23:32 Obani no
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23:32 JohnnyComeL8ly Did you do a fresh folder, and then git the latest?
23:33 Obani Yes...
23:34 rubenwardy My server's first youtuber: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8hX15dWVS7E
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23:50 Fixer damn, kids know how to record video
23:51 Fixer it is laggy somewhat
23:51 Fixer wonder how that people record HD videos from BF4 or so without slowdowns
23:52 VanessaE probably by using paid-for or cracked programs and recording to huffyuv or another raw format
23:52 VanessaE then compress it to AVI etc later
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23:52 Fixer that need shit-tons of storage
23:52 Fixer gigabytes
23:52 VanessaE yep.
23:52 VanessaE 1 gig a minute or something, as I recall
23:52 Fixer yeah
23:54 Fixer looks like he is recording in kindergarten or school
23:54 rubenwardy yeah, sounds like it
23:54 Fixer back in my times we played Quake II in school
23:54 Fixer on Win98SE
23:54 Fixer no net though
23:55 Fixer and no internet
23:55 rubenwardy best bit: https://youtu.be/8hX15dWVS7E?t=4m30s
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