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IRC log for #minetest, 2015-10-26

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Time Nick Message
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00:06 Sokomine Guest6635: inside a mod, it'd usually be minetest.chat_send_all(text)  havn't played with luacontrollers yet
00:07 Guest6635 great, thanks!
00:08 Guest6635 "attempt to index global..." etc
00:08 Guest6635 most of the lua is restricted in a lua cntroller
00:08 Guest6635 controller*
00:08 Guest6635 you can't use most loops
00:08 Guest6635 for/while are disabled
00:08 Guest6635 as well as a few other things
00:09 Sokomine sounds reasonable. after all it would be pretty insecure otherwise
00:10 Sokomine but why don't you write a mod as such? modding is very easy in minetest
00:10 Elench What are mods written in?
00:11 Elench C++?
00:11 Sokomine in lua :-)
00:11 Elench Gosh, even less of a clue :þ
00:11 Elench Sorry for interrupting your conversation, it's just I'm thinking of making a mod
00:13 rubenwardy ;) http://rubenwardy.com/minetest_modding_book/
00:13 Elench You wrote a book about a subject that interests me, thanks
00:15 est31 btw rubenwardy it needs an update
00:15 est31 the rendered lua_api.txt page
00:15 rubenwardy a month out of date XD
00:17 rubenwardy updated
00:17 est31 thanks
00:17 rubenwardy and 123 commits in repo
00:17 rubenwardy It's literally running a python script then commiting
00:18 est31 minetest has 5099
00:18 rubenwardy yeah
00:18 rubenwardy but not 123 or 1234
00:19 rubenwardy ;)
00:20 rubenwardy My biggest project, NBE, has 294
00:20 rubenwardy anyway, gtg
00:20 est31 bye
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01:31 Guest6635 im ight look into it.  my son has really been enjoying things and it'd be fun to extend
01:31 Guest6635 i know a little lua already from previous work
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03:08 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: SAPI: Mark all Lua API functions requiring envlock 54f1267 http://git.io/vWwgw (2015-10-25T23:06:48-04:00)
03:41 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: SAPI: Throw runtime error instead of if l_get_mapgen_object called in incorrect thread d69ef6a http://git.io/vWwwN (2015-10-25T23:15:57-04:00)
03:45 MinetestBot [git] est31 -> minetest/minetest: Remove some abort() calls 5f342aa http://git.io/vWwoi (2015-10-26T04:45:00+01:00)
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07:49 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: SAPI: Move core.get_us_time() to Util module 306b067 http://git.io/vWrLT (2015-10-26T03:46:36-04:00)
07:49 Calinou hi
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08:08 MinetestBot [git] kwolekr -> minetest/minetest: SAPI: Fix seed parameter truncation for LuaPseudoRandom constructor bc0318d http://git.io/vWrYC (2015-10-26T04:04:52-04:00)
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09:46 JamesTait Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy OK Corral Day! 😃
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11:46 fireglow Is there any inventory mod that will display the node:name in the tooltip?
11:49 Elench Are there any mods that make books useful, editable and copyable?
11:50 Elench I can't find any, but I don't want to reinvent the wheel
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13:06 PilzAdam https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=3&t=13485
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13:46 CWz I could add Hebrew translation
13:51 PilzAdam CWz, here you go: https://hosted.weblate.org/pr​ojects/minetest/minetest/he/
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13:53 PilzAdam CWz, I would suggest you translate the "most important" strings first, by using the search function
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14:26 MinetestBot [git] BlockMen -> minetest/minetest: Fix typo 2c25107 http://git.io/vWoAp (2015-10-26T15:14:22+01:00)
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14:43 * Teckla humbly requests the following be added to "vanilla" Minetest: (1) more ores  (2) fix the bronze recipe
14:43 Teckla Is there a way to officially request that so that the developers may consider it?
14:44 VanessaE post an issue against minetest_game github repository
14:45 PilzAdam the thing you should be asking for is not "more ores", but "I have this cool new gameplay mechanic that can be added (P.S.: that requires new ores)"
14:45 PilzAdam ores without original uses are basically useless
14:45 VanessaE Teckla: just don't request anything that isn't a perfect cube ;)
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14:50 Elench I'd like a tesseract please
14:51 VanessaE I was implying a 3d cube :P
14:51 Elench That's perfecter than normal cubes IMO
14:51 Elench hehe, fair enough
15:00 Elench How about requsting fractally divided cubes?
15:00 Elench I'm guessing that'd get me a slap…
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15:01 VanessaE heh
15:01 Elench It's a useful idea that I might use for some of my projects, but not really suitable for MT
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15:05 Teckla PilzAdam: I just think the vanilla recipe "iron + copper = bronze" is a crime against humanity  ;)
15:05 VanessaE PilzAdam: honestly, there's nothing inherently wrong with adding items that don't yet have a gameplay benefit.  even then, tin is needed to make bronze the *right* way (and you no doubt remember my objections from before), so it would be perfectly acceptable to add.
15:07 PilzAdam Teckla, just rename "Bronze" to something else then
15:07 PilzAdam the idea was to add something that could enhance the normal steel
15:07 Teckla PilzAdam: In the real world, does iron + copper actually make something?
15:07 VanessaE bronze is softer than forged steel...
15:08 PilzAdam it was not the plan to add "bronze"; that was just a name that many people can understand
15:08 VanessaE (it is, however, harder than iron)
15:08 PilzAdam let's name everything "Material 1", "Material  2", etc. because real world names are too unrealistic then
15:12 VanessaE ...
15:12 * Elench bangs his head repeatedly against Lua and hows ‘Why aren't you Lisp‽’
15:12 Teckla It would be easy to make the recipes real and the durability of various metals and composites real too
15:13 Teckla But, at the very least, I think it makes sense to make the recipes real.
15:13 VanessaE PilzAdam: why are you so against adding a few extra nodes here and there?
15:13 Teckla So that we don't have children worldwide th inking iron + copper = bronze  :)
15:14 VanessaE where is the DISadvantage?
15:14 PilzAdam VanessaE, I am against adding so many nodes that all do the same
15:14 VanessaE why?
15:14 PilzAdam it's just boring
15:15 PilzAdam if I find new stuff I expect it to add something new to my gameplay experience
15:15 PilzAdam not just "You found a new ore that is 100% the same as iron; have fun!"
15:16 VanessaE by that same token, most of vanilla game is boring then
15:16 CWz Reach a problem with translation
15:16 CWz *reached
15:16 VanessaE oh, you found iron!  you can make...um...some tools and a steel block.
15:16 PilzAdam VanessaE, indeed, it is
15:16 * Teckla is sorry he brought it up  :(
15:16 VanessaE Teckla: don't be,
15:17 PilzAdam VanessaE, and the best mods for minetest game are the ones that add new gameplay concepts, like mesecons or carts
15:17 VanessaE to a degree perhaps
15:17 Teckla As the father of a Minetest player, perhaps I'm just overly sensitive to Minetest "teaching" my daughter "recipes" that are just plain wrong, heh.
15:18 CWz as far as i know there is no translation for Client in this context
15:19 Teckla Speaking just for myself, I like "more ores" -- it adds "depth" and "fun" to the game for me.
15:19 PilzAdam Teckla, Minetest is not a chemistry simulation
15:19 VanessaE PilzAdam: on the other hand, homedecor doesn't add anything "new gameplay", yet it's among the most popular mods available.
15:19 PilzAdam it adds / expand the "decoration" gameplay mechanic
15:19 Teckla PilzAdam: Yep, and I'm okay with there being purely fantasy-based materials, but I think Minetest would be doing a good service to its users if the non-fantasy ones were correct.
15:20 PilzAdam a maybe interesting new ore would be something that could fertilize plants, so they grow faster
15:20 VanessaE G*d no
15:20 VanessaE next you'll be suggesting bone meal
15:20 PilzAdam VanessaE, aren't we talking about ores, currently?
15:21 VanessaE we are.
15:21 VanessaE but have you ever heard of an ore that makes plants grow faster?
15:21 VanessaE either real or fictional
15:21 PilzAdam I could imagine an ore, that you can craft together with dirt to make a better soil
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15:22 PilzAdam VanessaE, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fertilizer#Cadmium
15:22 Teckla Home Decor is my daughter's favorite mod  :)
15:22 est31 its called loess
15:22 est31 VanessaE> but have you ever heard of an ore that makes plants grow faster?
15:23 CWz i really statring to dislike Weblate
15:23 CWz *starting
15:23 PilzAdam https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cadmium <- it even has a cube in the picture!!!
15:24 VanessaE hm, never thought of that.
15:24 Teckla PilzAdam: Are you a Minetest developer?
15:24 PilzAdam yes
15:24 Teckla PilzAdam: In that case, thank you for making something that's both awesome and free  :)
15:24 Teckla I'd think about contributing if I didn't have an irrational fear of C++  ;)
15:25 VanessaE (loess on the other hand, isn't an ore.  it's a mixture of dirt, clay, silt, sand...)
15:25 PilzAdam Teckla, there is Lua, too
15:25 Teckla PilzAdam: Yeah, my daughter has been pestering me to learn Lua, and perhaps create a few mods
15:25 est31 CWz, what's the problem?
15:26 PilzAdam VanessaE, it doesn't need to be realistic, we could call it... Growium, because it makes stuff grow
15:26 CWz weblate
15:26 est31 yes
15:26 VanessaE meh
15:26 Teckla haha, Growium is an awesome word, sounds like something a chemical company would call their MiracleGrow competitor
15:27 CWz i think i got most of the important ones
15:27 PilzAdam VanessaE, you see, I want this kind of discussion instead of "More ores"
15:27 CWz Is there any other way I can translate it
15:28 rom1504 I think I already asked here one time but : is minetest protocol documented somewhere ? only thing I could find is http://dev.minetest.net/Network_Protocol which links to cpp files, not really a doc
15:28 PilzAdam CWz, you can download the .po file, edit it yourself, and the upload it to weblate again
15:28 PilzAdam CWz, you can use a texteditor then, or some other programs like poedit (I think it's called poedit)
15:29 VanessaE PilzAdam: I think of things from not only a gameplay perspective, but also from a "what can a third-part mod do with this material" standpoint.
15:29 CWz Okay this will make things easier
15:29 VanessaE third-party.
15:30 rom1504 I guess I could automatically extract it from https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/​master/src/network/serverpackethandler.cpp but that's a bit annoying
15:30 PilzAdam VanessaE, ideally, we add stuff that is good for both of our views
15:30 PilzAdam just adding stuff because it's good for mods is not enough to justify addition to minetest game
15:30 CWz can minetest even read/display Hebrew characters?
15:30 PilzAdam rom1504, sorry, I don't think there is additional doc
15:30 est31 rom1504, I do admit that minetest's network doc isn't really good.
15:31 est31 CWz, it works for russian ones
15:31 PilzAdam CWz, that depends on the font you tell it to use; with the proper font: yes
15:31 VanessaE I don't expect hebrew will work correctly -- it's a right-to-left language
15:31 rom1504 okay
15:31 PilzAdam rom1504, https://github.com/minetest/minet​est/blob/master/doc/protocol.txt
15:32 PilzAdam that's only the handshake, though
15:32 Teckla PilzAdam: Well, you're right, I don't want "more ores" (the mod), I just want tin, so the bronze recipe can be fixed, heh
15:32 rom1504 yeah that's not all the packets
15:32 PilzAdam rom1504, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/b​lob/master/util/wireshark/minetest.lua
15:33 est31 there is networkprotocol.h
15:33 PilzAdam rom1504, this is outdated, though, I guess
15:33 est31 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/bl​ob/master/src/network/networkprotocol.h
15:33 est31 it contains most important stuff
15:33 VanessaE bbl
15:33 rom1504 ah yes networkprotocol.h seems good, is it up to date ?
15:34 est31 basically everything, on its level of abstraction
15:34 est31 yes it is up to date
15:34 rom1504 okay thanks
15:35 PilzAdam who hasn't voted yet? https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=3&amp;t=13485
15:35 est31 and it even contains a history of how the protocol evolved
15:35 rom1504 (I've been working on a minecraft protocol serializer/parser and we're trying to generalize it these days, so I'm looking for binary protocols to experiment it on)
15:35 est31 nice
15:36 est31 perhaps that topic can be made sticky
15:36 est31 Calinou ^
15:36 PilzAdam est31, do you know of a way to remove comments from weblate?
15:36 JohnnyComeL8ly joined #minetest
15:41 est31 there is a delete button, no?
15:41 est31 or is that only shown to admins
15:41 Teckla PilzAdam: Speaking of things that make Minetest better: I'd say making "vanilla" Minetest more interesting/compelling than "vanilla" Minecraft would be very good for Minetest  :)
15:41 est31 wait I'll make you an admin
15:41 est31 your password is secure ?
15:41 est31 (not a throwaway pw)
15:41 Teckla PilzAdam: Because if vanilla Minetest is more fun/interesting/compelling than vanilla Minecraft, you get more users, and more mods, and more word of mouth, etc. etc. etc.
15:42 CWz tried to add FreeSans.ttf
15:42 PilzAdam est31, I signed in via Github, so yes
15:42 est31 nice, added.
15:42 est31 dunno whether you have to login/logout or do sth else to get it working
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15:44 PilzAdam est31, ah, I see it now
15:44 PilzAdam thx
15:44 PilzAdam (I made a bunch of "too long" comments on the source string, not he translation)
15:45 est31 ok
15:45 CWz is it even possible to use custom fonts with minetest
15:46 est31 I think so
15:46 PilzAdam CWz, sure, font_path setting IIRC
15:46 CWz "font_path = fonts/FreeSans.ttf" gives me crash
15:46 PilzAdam CWz, also set the "needs_fallback_font" translation string to "yes", and see if it works
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15:52 CWz http://pastebin.com/k6C5v1Ff
15:52 PilzAdam CWz, set it to an absolute path
15:55 PilzAdam est31, http://dev.minetest.net/Trans​lating#Once_every_translation you need to be admin on weblate to go to the "repo maintenance"
15:55 PilzAdam it should be stated in that page and there should be a list of the admins
15:57 est31 okay added.
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16:05 CWz hmm language = he doesn't seem to work. add  a folder called he in the po directory as well as recompiled minetest
16:05 Dead_Thinker left #minetest
16:07 * CWz looks in the dev wiki
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16:09 PilzAdam CWz, can you see that the language is detected in the build process?
16:10 CWz [  1%] mo-update [he]: Creating mo file.[  1%] mo update
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16:11 PilzAdam is your system language set correctly?
16:11 CWz does that mean yes
16:11 CWz my system language is English
16:11 PilzAdam and you have gettext support compiled in?
16:11 CWz yes
16:12 PilzAdam do you use run_in_place?
16:12 CWz yes
16:12 PilzAdam have you restarted after adding "language = he" in minetest.conf?
16:12 CWz Yes
16:13 PilzAdam can you look at the verbose output and see if there is something about it?
16:25 CWz PilzAdam, http://pastebin.com/hv6dMEgq
16:25 CWz Message locale is now set to: LC_CTYPE=en_US.UTF-8;LC_NUMERIC=C;LC_TIME=he_​IL.UTF-8;LC_COLLATE=en_US.UTF-8;LC_MONETARY=h​e_IL.UTF-8;LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8;LC_PAPER=h​e_IL.UTF-8;LC_NAME=he_IL.UTF-8;LC_ADDRESS=he_​IL.UTF-8;LC_TELEPHONE=he_IL.UTF-8;LC_MEASUREM​ENT=he_IL.UTF-8;LC_IDENTIFICATION=he_IL.UTF-8
16:26 CWz ^ seems odd
16:26 PilzAdam "LC_MESSAGES=en_US.UTF-8;"
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16:26 PilzAdam can you manually sat LC_ALL env variable for Minetest?
16:26 PilzAdam s/sat/set/
16:27 CWz no idea how
16:28 PilzAdam run Minetest via: LC_ALL=he_IL.UTF-8 ./minetest
16:29 CWz Ok
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16:31 CWz still seem to have not worked
16:33 PilzAdam maybe it doesn't find the he language files and sets it back to en?
16:33 CWz perhaps
16:34 CWz could this be related 2015-10-26 18:33:06: ERROR[Main]: Couldn't find a locale directory!
16:34 PilzAdam probably
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17:01 STHGOM !seen jin_xi
17:01 MinetestBot STHGOM: jin_xi was last seen at 2015-10-18 08:19:08 UTC on #minetest
17:04 STHGOM anyone know how to get this mod: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=2588
17:08 VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?id=2588#p173033
17:08 VanessaE (see also the post after that one)
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17:19 Krock JESUS THIS NOISE
17:19 Krock Hello people :)
17:19 TheWild Hello Krock
17:19 fusion44 joined #minetest
17:19 Krock A wild most used word appears!
17:21 Ingar Jesus us not impressed by your noise
17:21 Ingar *is
17:21 Krock Oh, that's sad. At least I hope he enjoyed the entertainment
17:25 Calinou they deleted me from your system
17:25 Krock who's celeron56?
17:26 CWz what with this dangerlist
17:26 Krock Also, that's sad cuz I wanted to lock you into my system
17:26 Krock punishment for a lifetime
17:26 Ingar I have to run AVG at work, that's punishment enough
17:27 Krock Oh noes! Princess Luna was removed from my system :(
17:40 STHGOM VanessaE, how does one use xxyz's painting mod?
17:40 VanessaE no idea.,
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17:43 Nemin Hi! Would someone please help me? Is it possible to run a chat command from a mod? For example, if i punch a block, the player will teleport to a specified position.
17:44 Calinou Nemin, yes, use Mesecons Command Blocks
17:44 Calinou https://duckduckgo.com/?q=mesecons
17:44 Calinou heh, first result
17:44 Calinou this http://mesecons.net/
17:45 STHGOM VanessaE, how about HybridDogs?
17:45 VanessaE no idea how to use that one either, STHGOM
17:49 Nemin Calinou: Thanks
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17:53 swift110 hey all
17:56 Krock Hello!
18:01 rubenwardy joined #minetest
18:04 swift110 how are you Krock
18:04 Krock I'm fine, swift110 :) And how about you?
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18:34 swift110 im great
18:34 swift110 what ya up too
18:40 Krock claiming the world as mine
18:44 swift110 ok thatsx ool
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19:06 MinetestBot [git] BlockMen -> minetest/minetest: Fix jittering sounds on entities (fixes #2974) 8a6e921 http://git.io/vW6Qx (2015-10-26T19:40:26+01:00)
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19:13 Leoneof oh
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19:33 Tank_ACiD_ ok, so I've looked everywhere and still have not seen an acceptable answer: How do I make minetest render more nodes from any given position? I don't mean view distance with the 'r' setting, I mean, generating nodes within the player's viewshed. I don't want to fly around to expose the landscape
19:34 PilzAdam Tank_ACiD_, block generate and transfer distance; search for that in mintest.conf.example
19:42 Tank_ACiD_ thanks, went through the conf must have missed those
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19:49 Tank_ACiD_ thats much better thanks! it still fails to render some nodes, but oh well, much better distance, thanks
19:51 PilzAdam !next
19:51 MinetestBot Another satisfied customer. Next!
19:52 Krock ^^
19:54 Leoneof why i'm here
19:56 est31 !next
19:56 MinetestBot Another satisfied customer. Next!
19:56 est31 !next
19:56 est31 !next
19:56 est31 was kicked by ShadowBot: Message repetition flood detected.
19:56 est31 joined #minetest
19:56 est31 not nice
19:56 est31 lol
19:57 est31 what I did wasnt nice either :)
19:57 Leoneof yes, that's why they kicked you
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20:06 hoodedice Calinou
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20:06 Calinou hi
20:06 hoodedice I'm gonna use Godot for my game, given that I want greater control over the physics, and that I
20:06 Calinou cool
20:06 hoodedice 'I'm restarting development
20:06 Calinou I want to write a graphics benchmark in Godot.
20:06 Calinou but I'm waiting for 3D rewrite
20:06 hoodedice > 3D rewrite
20:06 Calinou I know how to animate camera around already
20:07 Calinou it will happen next year
20:07 Calinou using OpenGL ES 3.x or Vulkan
20:07 hoodedice whoa, so should I put off using the thing, or will it not affect an "end developer" much?
20:07 hoodedice and are you contributing to the source?
20:07 Calinou it won't, especially if you do 2D games
20:07 Calinou nope, I just provide support on IRC
20:07 hoodedice I'm doing 3D
20:07 Calinou and am waiting for translation support to translate to French :P
20:07 hoodedice ah, so you're the Godot's hoodedice
20:07 hoodedice =P
20:08 Calinou https://lut.im/a5E7W7PkRp/bd70PbMca3g3ySem.jpg
20:08 hoodedice except not AWOL
20:08 Calinou engineer pls come n build cmdpost
20:08 Calinou kthx
20:08 hoodedice that's that wolfenstein game, right?
20:08 hoodedice I played it once
20:08 Calinou it's been 2 minutes since I destroyed command post, nobody rebuilt it
20:08 Calinou waiting nearby, disguised, playing dead
20:08 Calinou yeah it is
20:08 hoodedice yeah, the game is kinda dead
20:08 Calinou using http://www.etlegacy.com/
20:08 Calinou nah, pretty alive
20:08 Calinou hundreds of players, if you go to the right servers
20:10 Calinou hoodedice, so yeah... if you have questions, join #godotengine and/or #godotengine-devel
20:10 Calinou reduzio is the engine developer
20:10 hoodedice yeah, I'll hang around
20:10 hoodedice it would be nice if the vehicle documentation was written, but I guess I'll be the one to write thtat
20:10 Tux[Qyou] joined #minetest
20:11 Calinou also, I think making a benchmark program is not very hard
20:11 Calinou but it needs a good and detailed GUI for settings, + graphics presets
20:11 Calinou and you need nice assets to make it look good
20:11 Calinou (but I'm learning Blender...)
20:11 hoodedice but say Calinou, how would you rate it vs unity3D as per features? I want an unbiased opinion
20:11 Calinou it is not as advanced as Unity3D.
20:11 Calinou the 3D part is currently way worse, but usable
20:11 hoodedice you could actually convince Jordach, but I don't think he hangs around here much, eh?
20:12 Calinou not really
20:12 hoodedice I will hope that it picks up in about 3-5 years
20:12 hoodedice the 3d side of things
20:12 Calinou https://lut.im/mYfsCHede5/Gr8iZ2klUt8fiEiA.png
20:12 Calinou this is a cone I made in Blender
20:12 hoodedice how is MT development coming along?
20:12 Calinou chest: https://lut.im/7QKEr7lm3o/q9ahLUtnLoTohW9k.png (some bugs)
20:12 Calinou concrete bumper: https://lut.im/wUgBHr4VGu/QbTo6YXYh2JncpEJ.png
20:13 hoodedice In blender, I know how to do models well
20:13 Calinou grave: https://lut.im/JngMYbykoT/suOFbR5ThmSaLEUf.png
20:13 Calinou barrier: https://lut.im/HUMbRzgSTy/CKq4XrAafpq2upYs.png
20:13 hoodedice but I'm still a noob at texturing
20:13 Calinou and much more :)
20:13 hoodedice so you are already quite ahead of me
20:13 Calinou quite proud of this one: https://lut.im/KPBqRfBOEZ/Il18TR77a4bThWgo.png
20:13 Calinou people in #blender helped me make it, in ~1 hour
20:13 Calinou also this is a texture I made from a CC0 source, https://lut.im/RLlWBOrcYa/HD6Z6A2vUZJ4MXPM.png
20:13 Calinou tileable, has normal/height/specular maps
20:13 Leoneof Calinou: and you are xfce guru? :]
20:13 hoodedice "people in #blender helped me"
20:14 hoodedice I find that hard to believe
20:14 Calinou Leoneof, yes, using it since 2012
20:14 Leoneof :}
20:14 hoodedice which program is it, the last one?
20:14 Calinou hoodedice, Minetest development is still going strong, 0.4.13 has minimap
20:14 Calinou the program is AwesomeBump
20:14 Calinou https://github.com/kmkolasinski/AwesomeBump
20:14 Calinou free/libre program to make normal maps, PBR maps, and more
20:14 hoodedice I reviewed the 0.4.13 RC
20:14 Calinou (Godot 3D rewrite will hopefully support PBR. This will make AwesomeBump very useful)
20:15 hoodedice so I know about that one
20:15 Calinou (PBR = Physically Based rendering)
20:15 hoodedice thanks for showing me AwesomeBump tho, it will be quite useful
20:15 hoodedice yeah, PBR is the shit in unity
20:16 hoodedice also why making AA games is possible at all now
20:16 Gael-de-Sailly joined #minetest
20:16 hoodedice unity4 without PBR, yeah, UE was better, but now the pros and cons are quite matching in Unity5 vs UE4
20:16 Calinou there isn't any open source game engine supporting PBR right now
20:16 Calinou Godot will likely be the first
20:16 hoodedice and with Unity5 giving away many of the previously "pro" features, it puts the weight on Unity's side
20:17 hoodedice I'm quite happy with Unity, but it is just that if I use an engine that I can mess around with, that means less pain down the road in later stages of development
20:18 hoodedice I think I'll just spend my free time blending assets, that way I can have a steady stream of assets to use by the time godot becomes usable
20:21 Calinou I haven't learned 3D animation yet
20:21 Jordach hoodedice, Calinou I HEARD THAT
20:22 hoodedice no you didn't
20:22 hoodedice you saw it
20:22 Jordach oh yes i did
20:22 hoodedice ok
20:22 hoodedice now gib me gtav
20:23 Jordach am i made of money or what
20:23 Jordach ;)
20:26 swift110 joined #minetest
20:26 hoodedice > new shiny Cherry MX Red mechanical keyboard
20:26 hoodedice > dual monitor set up
20:26 hoodedice > British
20:26 hoodedice Tell me Jordach, how you are not rich
20:27 VanessaE I'm poor as folk, but I still have three 20", 1600x1200 panels and a keyboard using cherry MX brown switches.
20:27 VanessaE he does it like I do - save up.
20:27 hoodedice See, being an American college student is bad enough
20:28 hoodedice imagine being an international student in an American college
20:28 VanessaE I can only imagine.
20:28 hoodedice that being said, I do have a nice mech with Kailh switches
20:28 hoodedice it is also something I don't tell people, because they tend to shout at me. /r/mechanicalkeyboards hate me
20:28 Calinou hoodedice, I bought a new laptop today, will arrive tomorrow
20:29 Calinou 17" Full HD, i7-4720HQ, GTX 960M, 8 GB RAM, will put my own SSD in it
20:29 hoodedice I still have my Celery™
20:29 Calinou good enough for 60 FPS Minetest
20:29 hoodedice specs: http://wiki.minetest.net/User:Hoodedice
20:29 swift110 hey all
20:30 hoodedice hello
20:31 hoodedice VanessaE: in case you are wondering, it is a Razer Blackwidow Stealth, $85 before taxes
20:31 Calinou I have a Logitech G11 keyboard (5 years old), I can type 111 WPM
20:31 Calinou http://10fastfingers.com/typing-test/english
20:31 Calinou anyone up for a duel? :p
20:31 hoodedice I can type without looking at the keyboard
20:31 Calinou me too
20:31 hoodedice that's... about it
20:31 hoodedice okay, gimme a sec
20:32 hoodedice I'm up
20:33 Calinou just did it in English, 106 WPM
20:33 Calinou You are better than 98.65% of all users (position 1925 of 142839 - last 24 hours)
20:33 hoodedice 45
20:33 hoodedice =(
20:37 hoodedice consistently 45 ayyy
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20:39 iqualfragile Calinou: are we going for 100% correct here?
20:39 Calinou nope
20:39 Calinou I did 2 wrong words
20:40 PilzAdam "He is currently training to become a core engine developer." – http://wiki.minetest.net/User:Hoodedice
20:40 PilzAdam how do you train?
20:40 Leoneof hoodedice: you have celeron cpu?
20:40 Calinou he plays Ninja Training, PilzAdam
20:40 PilzAdam and what do you train?
20:40 hoodedice 15 push ups
20:40 hoodedice 20 crunches
20:40 Calinou https://github.com/KOBUGE-Games/ninja-training
20:40 hoodedice 9001 squats
20:40 hoodedice and one session of kendo per week
20:40 hoodedice Leone, yes
20:41 hoodedice dual core celeron from 2014, it is adequate, actually
20:41 iqualfragile ṕlol
20:41 Leoneof hoodedice: are able to play minetest? :]
20:41 iqualfragile i get about 70 wpm
20:41 hoodedice but Pilz, I know C now, so I'm halfway to becoming a core developer =P
20:41 hoodedice Leone, yes
20:41 PilzAdam yeah, only ++ missing now
20:42 Leoneof hoodedice: what's your vcard, ram? :}
20:42 rubenwardy Best way to "train" is to do stuff: https://github.com/minetest/minete​st/commits/master?author=hoodedice
20:42 Leoneof PilzAdam: i know cout + cin
20:42 rubenwardy I've been using C++ for roughly 5 years, and am still not close to being a core dev
20:43 iqualfragile rubenwardy: maybe thats because you are using c++
20:43 rubenwardy it's not so much about the language itself, but the technical details of compilers, oses, and algorithms.
20:43 rubenwardy ...
20:43 rubenwardy I use C too
20:43 hoodedice ruben, have been awol from MT for quite a while =P
20:43 iqualfragile "awol"?
20:43 rubenwardy away w/o official leave
20:43 hoodedice away without leave =P
20:44 hoodedice or that
20:44 hoodedice leone, the in built iGP, HD 2500
20:44 Leoneof interesting *_*
20:44 hoodedice ram is 4+2 GB, it says it on the wiki page
20:44 Calinou Skylake is so expensive. :(
20:44 hoodedice MT is heavily CPU limited if nothing big happened in the last year
20:44 Calinou I wanted a Skylake laptop, but I threw up at the price
20:45 hoodedice skylake is also unnecesay
20:45 hoodedice *unnecessary
20:45 Calinou it brings 15-20% performance improvement over Haswell CPU-wise, and ~30% GPU-wise
20:45 Calinou it's 2 generations newer
20:45 hoodedice I would rather wait it out
20:46 hoodedice but then again, I'm an AyyyyMD fanboy
20:46 Calinou the laptop I bought is Haswell.
20:46 Calinou kinda bitter - I bought a 2013-era CPU in 2015
20:46 hoodedice I think mine's from the Ivy generation
20:46 hoodedice they actually gimped the processor in the newer Celeron models
20:46 Calinou that laptop might have similar performance to my i7-2600K + GTX 570 desktop
20:46 Calinou same screen resolution too
20:46 Leoneof i have oldest generation :]
20:46 hoodedice mine went for $450 at stock pricing, newer laptops with base celeron do $250
20:47 hoodedice and
20:47 hoodedice they are clocked higher (2.13 vs 1.90), but have lesser cache
20:47 Viper168 joined #minetest
20:47 hoodedice and every other person with these laptops has tons of problems with it
20:47 rubenwardy joined #minetest
20:48 iqualfragile high clock rates mean nothing but high power use
20:48 hoodedice wb ruben
20:48 iqualfragile you can't measure performance with that
20:48 hoodedice yeah iqual
20:48 hoodedice ikt
20:48 Calinou this is my dream full desktop build: http://www.topachat.com/pages/configomatic.php?c=F​UOmfEjkxdRQ79O%2BlpM1l08RWP1ukdEdWdw%2FCVYrzNo%3D
20:49 rubenwardy What don't you like about C++, iqualfragile? Is it the OOP?
20:49 Calinou €1527, no graphics card... :/
20:49 Calinou the CPU alone costs €430
20:49 Leoneof O_O
20:49 iqualfragile Calinou: that is what you get for living in a communist state, taxes on everything and no pay
20:49 rubenwardy ... France?
20:49 PilzAdam rubenwardy, do you know anyone who doesn't dislike C++'s OOP?
20:50 iqualfragile rubenwardy: oh, there is so much wrong with it, but its mainly that there is no good reason to use it, its just not a nice language
20:50 iqualfragile rubenwardy: yes, france, socialist country, its almost communist
20:51 rubenwardy I've come to the realisation
20:51 rubenwardy that all languages are terrible
20:52 iqualfragile lojban!
20:52 hoodedice but usually average people don't
20:52 hoodedice for example, I searched for a laptop for my friend in the $500 range
20:52 hoodedice found an acer with a 2.2GHz i5 proc, and an nVidia gtx 940
20:53 iqualfragile itanium best architecture
20:53 hoodedice his roommate, who happens to be studying for a masters in computer science, said the clockspeed was too low
20:53 iqualfragile rubenwardy: seriously tho, rust looks quite nice to me
20:53 Tux[Qyou] joined #minetest
20:53 rubenwardy Rust does
20:53 hoodedice he also owns an alienware, so that speaks for itself
20:53 rubenwardy but it doesn't have that many libraries, from what I could see
20:54 iqualfragile rubenwardy: quite a few libs have been popping up
20:54 hoodedice ruben, C# is not all that terrible *runs away*
20:54 iqualfragile what do you need
20:54 Tank_ACiD_ I set time_send_interval = 0 ..yet time still progresses, wtf
20:54 rubenwardy a 3D renderer and a 2D renderers
20:55 rubenwardy I don't like dealing with raw opengl
20:55 hoodedice ...unity3d
20:55 hoodedice or godot
20:55 hoodedice or irrlicht
20:55 iqualfragile pitchfork emporium, get your pitchforks to hunt hoodice here, we got all the models, the classic --E, the fancy --{ and our new model the euro --€
20:55 hoodedice found the leddit user
20:55 iqualfragile rubenwardy: got you covered
20:55 hoodedice also, "hoodice
20:55 iqualfragile thats what i said
20:55 hoodedice no
20:55 hoodedice that's what
20:56 hoodedice she
20:56 hoodedice said
20:56 iqualfragile i can't see peoples sex in here, so that statement would be quite hard to verify
20:56 iqualfragile anyway, rubenwardy: https://github.com/tomaka/glium/
20:56 iqualfragile makes dealing with gl less of a pain in the ass
20:57 Calinou that's what it said
20:57 iqualfragile or a whole game engine?
20:57 Calinou Tank_ACiD_, it's time_speed = 0
20:57 Calinou not time_send_interval = 0
20:57 iqualfragile http://www.piston.rs/
20:57 Calinou hoodedice, the laptop I ordered is €950, it was on sale
20:57 Calinou I might ask for Windows refund, which will drop the price by €40. but I'm not sure if I have to send the whole laptop for it
20:58 hoodedice gl with that
20:58 Calinou I hope I have to send the HDD only, or better, nothing
20:58 iqualfragile communist countries and their taxes… horrible
20:58 hoodedice but Merica isn't communist amirite?
20:58 Jordach ogliarch more like ;)
20:58 iqualfragile nope
20:58 Jordach paid for by the highest bidder
20:59 iqualfragile murica is the land of the free
20:59 Leoneof Q) minetest will still use irrlicht? or there are plans to change it?
20:59 hoodedice will always use irrlicht
20:59 Jordach MT is stll using irrlicht
20:59 rubenwardy Not necessarily
20:59 Jordach ;0
20:59 hoodedice unless someone brave enough will rewrite it in a better engine
20:59 iqualfragile srsly? https://github.com/flosse/rust-os-comparison sombody has to stop them
20:59 rubenwardy One of the core devs has made efforts to abstract Irrlicht away
20:59 hoodedice like ogre3D *runs away*
20:59 Calinou Urho3D!
20:59 rubenwardy apparently they succeeded, and replaced it with ogre3D to prove it
21:00 hoodedice wtf
21:00 hoodedice really
21:00 rubenwardy but code never materiallised
21:00 Calinou http://urho3d.github.io/
21:00 Calinou tried the HTML5 samples and NinjaSnowWar, pretty solid engine
21:00 Leoneof :\
21:00 iqualfragile open scene graph?
21:00 rubenwardy blender game?
21:01 Calinou BGE is dying, so no
21:01 Calinou OpenSceneGraph, maybe
21:01 hoodedice d'aw about BGE
21:02 rubenwardy Not so keen on languages which use let or :=
21:02 Calinou let my our var $pony = "Hello",;
21:02 hoodedice HI I CAN HAS X IZ EQUAL 10
21:02 rubenwardy $ is even worse
21:02 Calinou we learn PHP at uni
21:02 hoodedice $ sudo apt-get install minetest
21:03 hoodedice ?
21:03 iqualfragile $ for variables
21:03 hoodedice oh
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21:03 iqualfragile rubenwardy: whats the problem about let?
21:03 hoodedice BASIC ayyy
21:03 iqualfragile hoodedice: well, bash uses $ for vars, so does php
21:03 rubenwardy I don't know
21:03 rubenwardy dogma
21:04 rubenwardy only a mild irritation
21:04 Calinou CubeScript uses $ for variables too
21:04 iqualfragile Calinou: like you have a course called "the php home page programming language"?
21:04 hoodedice I don't think semantics are a big problem with languages
21:04 Calinou iqualfragile, no
21:04 hoodedice I care more about the implementation of the language
21:04 Calinou "PHP by example", our teacher calls it :P
21:05 iqualfragile see thats what communist countries are like, no freedom to choose your favourite language
21:05 hoodedice in our college, we did java before C, and now everyone in my class hates pointers. I only hate it because it is anti-modular code
21:05 iqualfragile c is anti modular code?
21:05 iqualfragile wut?
21:05 Calinou Java makes for ugly GUIs that are RAM-heavy :/
21:05 iqualfragile or pointers?
21:05 hoodedice if you write modular code, then you are throughing pointers all over the place
21:05 Calinou I tried learning C++ for a bit, but gave up. but well, I know what <vector> is now
21:06 Calinou too much arsing over static/dynamic
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21:06 hoodedice and I have the feeling that the less pointers I use, the cleaner my code is
21:06 hoodedice wait, you are confused about static/dynamic?
21:06 Calinou no
21:06 Calinou but I feel tired every time I have to declare type and such by hand :)
21:06 Calinou especially of arrays
21:06 iqualfragile hoodedice: please tell me exactly why you need significant amounts of pointers to write modular code in c?
21:07 iqualfragile Calinou: rust guesses the type by default^^
21:07 hoodedice imagine I have a big block of data I need to pass around to every function in my code
21:07 iqualfragile ah
21:07 hoodedice and every function I write, acts on the actual data
21:07 iqualfragile that kind of pointers
21:08 PilzAdam hoodedice, you do realize that all objects in Java are behind pointers, right?
21:08 Calinou http://svgporn.com/
21:08 iqualfragile PilzAdam: nah, those are "references" you cant't do maths on them
21:08 Calinou I wonder if I could pull request Minetest logo there :D
21:08 Calinou (it is safe for work)
21:08 hoodedice the thing that ends up is something like function(block data, variable about size of data, variable about sort of data, variable about what function needs to do, etc)
21:09 hoodedice I actually never thought much about pass by reference/value until I started C
21:09 iqualfragile well, you should, because thats important^^
21:09 hoodedice yeah, I am forced to think about it now =P
21:09 hoodedice and that is why I like C
21:10 hoodedice it makes me think about what I'm doing
21:10 PilzAdam null-terminate your block data and all problems are gone
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21:11 iqualfragile PilzAdam: except that you now have o(n) accesses
21:11 hoodedice java, I sort of enter that mode when you are driving home after work: you zone out, and then only wake up when you either reach your house (finish the project) or crash (ArrayIndexOutOfBounds Exception)
21:11 iqualfragile i would be so much happier if strings were not null terminated
21:11 iqualfragile PilzAdam: and you can never use null in your data
21:11 hoodedice also, Pilz, something funny about Null termination
21:11 PilzAdam iqualfragile, for what?
21:11 iqualfragile you were being sarcastic, right?
21:11 hoodedice so our C professor assigned a project in which I had to make a clone of ls
21:12 iqualfragile PilzAdam: everything, string concat is o(n+m) in best case
21:12 hoodedice and he gave us an explicit function declaration to use, which was like function(data, flag)
21:12 hoodedice see how it is missing stuff about the data
21:12 hoodedice and the data was type const char *
21:12 hoodedice char * [ ]
21:13 hoodedice structs were not allowed. I had to sort that thing. And to sort, I would need to know the size of the data block. How do I get that? Well, I put the last index as NULL, then did a while !NULL, count++
21:14 hoodedice I had to put in another loop, just to count the data.
21:15 PilzAdam if you have a fixed data-type for a function signature then just cast everything
21:15 PilzAdam that way you can shove anything into it
21:15 hoodedice but isn't that undefined behaviour or something?
21:15 PilzAdam no
21:16 hoodedice anyway, what my friend did was more ingenious
21:16 hoodedice he shifted the whole data block to the right using bitwise ops, and filled the inital 8 bytes or something with the stuff about the data, like size, etc
21:17 hoodedice f-ing insane. I'm ashamed I suck at bitwise in C
21:18 iqualfragile i don't really see the "bitwise" there
21:19 hoodedice ?
21:19 hoodedice I'm not sure about his actual method of implementing it. He did pass me the code, but I haven't looked at it yet
21:19 iqualfragile 8 bit are a byte
21:22 hoodedice iqualfragile: https://gist.githubusercontent.com/hood​edice/8c906657b40209189310/raw/c4980276​8257dab1b96d9fca788da5b08713d4dd/bit.c
21:26 hoodedice I'll be off, had fun with y'all
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22:20 JBB is somebody using jabber / xmpp to
22:20 JBB ?
22:21 Ingar irc for life
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23:21 iqualfragile gn8
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