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IRC log for #minetest, 2015-09-14

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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01:12 Hisforever HOW FAR DOWB DO YOU HAVE TO GO BEFORE YOU REACH LAVA?
01:12 VanessaE depends where you are
01:12 VanessaE you might find some after a few tens of meters, or if you're really unlucky you might miss it for 2 or 3 km.
01:12 Hisforever i'M IN SINGLE PLAYER MODE
01:12 asl97 Hisforever: cap lock
01:13 Hisforever sorry for the caps
01:13 VanessaE I meant it depends where you are in your map./
01:14 asl97 VanessaE: iirc, underground biome isn't done is it?
01:14 VanessaE "isn't done"?
01:14 Hisforever VanessaE last yeaer you gave me a link to
01:14 VanessaE maybe on mv7
01:14 VanessaE mgv7*
01:14 asl97 implemented
01:14 VanessaE but most maps are mgv6 and there's lava underground there.
01:14 Hisforever munetest paghe for copntrols?
01:15 VanessaE Hisforever: the controls are in your main menu.  Settings -> Change Keys
01:15 VanessaE or in your ESC/Pause menu
01:15 Hisforever ok thanks
01:16 Hisforever I've been digging for an hour straight down
01:17 Hisforever Question is there a way to get fonts bigger in here?
01:19 asl97 VanessaE: the above ground biome doesn't affect where lava generate does it?
01:19 VanessaE asl97: not as far as I know
01:20 Hisforever ty VanessaE
01:20 VanessaE Hisforever: about the fonts in here, that depends on your IRC client.  as for digging to find lava, in a normal mgv6 world, you can find lava ...
01:21 asl97 hisforever left already
01:21 VanessaE ... at around -50 meters.
01:21 asl97 i only left for a few weeks/months, i doubt underground biome is implemented
01:21 VanessaE yea, I know.
01:21 VanessaE asl97: in mapgen v6 it's been implemented like that since forever.
01:21 VanessaE if His is not finding lava, then either (s)he's on mapgen v7 or there's a regression.
01:22 asl97 i am talking about a new biome system for underground, it was talked about when i last left
01:22 VanessaE I don't know anything about a new underground biome system.
01:23 asl97 so it doesn't depends on where you are in your map yet
01:23 asl97 s/your/the
01:30 VanessaE it DOES depend on where you are on your map
01:30 VanessaE because it's still perlin based
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01:31 VanessaE you can be in a bad spot in the map where there just isn't any lava to be seen for hundreds or even thousands of meters on down
01:31 VanessaE because it's all in caves
01:31 asl97 imo, when people talk about where on the map/world, it's about which biome you are in
01:31 VanessaE I remember once I was digging down, didn't hit lava till I was somewhere more than 1 km deep.
01:32 VanessaE no, I don't mean what biome, I mean where you are physically located on the map.
01:32 asl97 and i mean what biome
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02:21 asl97 there was talk about an underground biome which would be calculated once at mapchunk column top (ie: base on above-ground biome)
02:21 asl97 which could be use for adding underground biome like crystals, forest, glowing mushroom, lake, waterfall, etc etc
02:21 asl97 where it is possible to say what can and can't spawn in it (like lava)
02:21 hmmmm btw, question for people who play minecraft
02:21 hmmmm is there ever terrain where you have an overhang over a river?
02:23 asl97 like a bridge?
02:24 hmmmm no, like a cliff
02:24 asl97 google say yes
02:24 est31 man this is really really super dumb from us
02:24 est31 we update blocks depending on sunlight
02:25 hmmmm could you link me??
02:25 hmmmm est31, what do you mean
02:25 est31 hmmmm, I'll have to research more
02:25 est31 this can't be true
02:25 asl97 just image google `minecraft overhang over a river`
02:26 hmmmm does minecraft PE have biomes?
02:26 asl97 iirc, 4
02:28 asl97 eh... my info is outdated
02:28 asl97 http://minecraftpocketedition.wikia.com/wiki/Biome
02:28 hmmmm ah
02:28 hmmmm so it seems like it uses the same biome system as regular minecraft
02:29 hmmmm i wonder then, in those screenshots, what biome the terrain *on* the overhang is considered
02:29 hmmmm river or something else?
02:29 hmmmm and if they are two different things, how would that be compatible with the anvil file format?
02:31 hmmmm ugh
02:31 asl97 anvil file format < that's a new term for me, looking up on it now
02:31 hmmmm i found a video of some kid exploring a map with terrain like i described... of course, he has the debug info disabled
02:41 est31 man, worldformat.txt is in a really bad shape
02:42 est31 at the start we say that its about format versions 22... 25
02:42 est31 later below we say "this one is version 22"
02:43 est31 then we say "if map format version == 24: (NOTE: Not released as stable)"
02:43 est31 which is totally wrong
02:43 est31 first its >= not ==
02:43 est31 then 24 is already released
02:43 est31 long ago
02:43 est31 perhaps they are different serialisation versions
02:44 est31 that might be
02:44 est31 but I doubt it
02:49 est31 okay
02:49 est31 might make sense
02:49 est31 in the retrospect
02:51 est31 bc it seems that node timers were first added there
02:51 est31 then after they were added at another place
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02:58 LinuxGamer Hey everbyody, I'm a linux gamer trying to minetest but it says no such child process because no such directory 'minetest' can be found after installation. Why's that?
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03:01 est31 LinuxGamer, can you put the precise error message to a pastebin?
03:01 LinuxGamer I can paste it here,
03:01 est31 only good if its shorter than 3 lines
03:02 LinuxGamer "Failed to execute command "minetest"." Failled to execute child process, "minetest" (no such file or directory)
03:02 LinuxGamer To which I meant, yeah it's shorter than three liens
03:02 asl97 minetest isn't in the PATH
03:02 est31 ah
03:03 est31 LinuxGamer, which distro are you on
03:03 LinuxGamer Debian 8
03:03 asl97 installed using apt?
03:03 LinuxGamer Yes or the full 'aptitude' command
03:07 LinuxGamer I fixed it. Shortcut didn't link to the correct file
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03:14 swift110-phone Hey
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04:59 MinetestBot [git] gravgun -> minetest/minetest_game: Better bucket textures 0004c5e http://git.io/vZXrb (2015-09-14T06:58:19+02:00)
05:03 MinetestBot [git] est31 -> minetest/minetest: Serialisation: documentation fixes, clarifying renames and whitespace fixes 283bf97 http://git.io/vZXol (2015-09-14T07:02:15+02:00)
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05:54 MinetestBot [git] est31 -> minetest/minetest: Fix "make install" and add underscore to doc file name 8acccf4 http://git.io/vZXXb (2015-09-14T07:51:31+02:00)
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06:12 zat http://i.imgur.com/x84e138.jpg
06:29 MinetestBot [git] Rui914 -> minetest/minetest: Minor tweaks handle_settings_buttons 620dcdd http://git.io/vZXSs (2015-09-14T08:29:15+02:00)
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07:05 MinetestBot [git] paramat -> minetest/minetest: Firelike drawtype: Improve code 8e9c9e3 http://git.io/vZX5k (2015-09-14T08:04:01+01:00)
07:17 waressearcher2 why there is no "wet" block type ? I mean if you pour liquid on say sand it can become darker, wouldn't it be nice feature ?
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07:23 Viper168 that could open the possibility for adding urination
07:24 waressearcher2 "Write documentation as if whoever reads it is a violent psychopath who knows where you live" --Steve English, as quoted by Peter Langston
07:27 est31 we have no "block types" Minecraft has them, but also very very limited
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08:07 HulkSmash heya
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08:21 Hisforever how do I clear nodes?
08:22 rubenwardy with worldedit, //set air
08:22 Megaf That's extremely dengerous...
08:23 rubenwardy that's what he's asking
08:24 rubenwardy it's the same as using rm folder -r
08:24 Hisforever I set a row of cobbrl stone how do I clear the node set? I hope this is clear
08:24 Megaf Out`Of`Control: Did you manage to make carts work?
08:26 Hisforever went into worldedit and set nodes how do I clear the node edit?
08:26 Megaf Hisforever: you can select what you want to remove with //p set (then punch two cornes in diagonal) and then //replace default:cobble air
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08:27 Hisforever ty Megat thats what I needed
08:27 Out`Of`Control Megaf:  hey, no, i try boos_cart of Krock. Server does not crash but carts don't move either hehe
08:28 Out`Of`Control Hisforever:  /replace default:stone air
08:29 Megaf Out`Of`Control: well, I already said that, and its cooble, not stone ;)
08:29 Out`Of`Control Megaf:  a bit lag here
08:30 Out`Of`Control i see now hehe
08:30 Hisforever is there a page with these commands on it?
08:30 Megaf [14.09.15-:09:30:17] * Received CTCP-PING answer from Out`Of`Control with 291 milliseconds round trip time
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08:30 Megaf Hi JamesTait
08:30 Megaf And today is?
08:31 JamesTait Good morning all; happy Monday, and happy Eat a Hoagie Day! 😃
08:31 Megaf Happy Eat a Hoagie Day! JamesTait :D
08:31 Megaf JamesTait: whats a Hoagie?
08:31 Megaf !g hoagie
08:31 MinetestBot Megaf: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine_sandwich
08:32 JamesTait Tasty, if it's made right. 😝
08:32 Megaf oh, we just call that sub here
08:32 Megaf And so that's subway is called subway :P
08:33 nrzkt Sokomine ?
08:33 JamesTait Yeah, Hoagieway doesn't have the same ring to it.
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08:49 Hisforever sorry for not being able to say what I need :)
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08:51 TheWild !about
08:52 Hisforever ok I just set a row of cobble stone with //p set, how do I get rid of the black marks between blocks 1 &2
08:52 rubenwardy /reset
08:52 rubenwardy //reset
08:52 TheWild Just was curious who made MinetestBot, but is is not likely to talk with me.
08:53 rubenwardy MinetestBot!
08:53 MinetestBot rubenwardy!
08:53 rubenwardy It's sfan5
08:53 Hisforever ty rubenwaedy
08:53 rubenwardy !help
08:53 MinetestBot https://github.com/sfan5/minetestb​ot-modules/blob/master/COMMANDS.md
08:53 TheWild oooooh. Thanks
08:55 waressearcher2 kahrl_: thanks for the link, also that article from 2000 and since then world changed a lot especially how programms are written, like C is not used so much as in 2000, everything virtual, everything depends on garbage collectors and so forth, but on the other hands many still prefer to use "sendmail" just because of its
08:55 waressearcher2 old-used-and-tested-and-fixed code base in compare to modern mail servers where you can't know for sure when new bug will be found
08:55 kahrl_ waressearcher2: yeah, it's from 2000, but just as valid as when it was written
08:56 waressearcher2 kahrl_: but there are exist such times when you really have to rewrite stuff
08:56 waressearcher2 even if realy rare
08:56 waressearcher2 because of new technologies
08:57 rubenwardy It's talking about not doing it from scratch
08:57 rubenwardy Rewriting parts is fine
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09:46 waressearcher2 is it possible to make hanging block of sand ? I mean can you put say dirt then sand on top of it then remove dirt, will that sand block stay hanging ?
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09:46 est31 no
09:46 waressearcher2 so there is no way to created handing block of sand that I can then touch and it falls ?
09:47 est31 but if you make enough sand to fall your minetest will start hanging lol
09:47 est31 there is
09:47 est31 worldedit
09:47 est31 //pos1
09:47 est31 /pos2
09:47 est31 //set default:sand
09:47 est31 voila
09:48 waressearcher2 that is the why I'm asking, I read that: "100-1000 falling nodes now makes server very slow, 10000+ cause segfault. To test - make sand floating island via mapgen, touch it", so this is the way to crash any server ?
09:48 est31 hah
09:49 est31 you dont control the mapgen of "any server"
09:49 TheWild Let's make segfault then. Also, good idea to test your connection speed (because of entity updates)
09:49 waressearcher2 yes, but I'm asking of legit way to make hanging block of sand
09:50 waressearcher2 or is there other way to have lots of node updates other than falling sand ? water ? lava ? decayed or burning trees ?
09:51 waressearcher2 say make a field of wooden cubes 128x128 and then burn them with lava ?
09:51 est31 are you seriously asking how to take a server down
09:51 waressearcher2 128*128 is more than 10000
09:51 est31 ask the owner
09:51 est31 they'll perhaps take it down if you are nice
09:53 waressearcher2 no I'm asking why there are no optimisations to prevent such things to happen say limit of 1000 block updates at a time so if there are 1000 falling sand block you can't make another block to fall
09:54 waressearcher2 otherwise that makes is really easy to crash server right ?
09:55 est31 there are limitations
09:55 est31 if you arent close
09:56 est31 then the server doesnt have that part of the map loaded
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10:34 waressearcher2 why don't mobs fall down on the ground instead they just dissapear
10:37 israuor moin
10:42 TheWild Take it real - a world built out of cubes isn't such a big invention, so it looked very odd to me that nothing cube-like existed before Minecraft.
10:42 TheWild I've been searching the internet and at first I found this:
10:43 TheWild http://theinstructionlimit.com/behind-fez​-trixels-and-why-we-dont-just-say-voxels
10:43 TheWild Fez. Development started in 2007 and finished in 2012, so I'm not sure whether it does actually count.
10:43 TheWild Hey, wait... I remember I've seen something on youtube years ago. Was that a "Grow" written on a cube? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wz9FYRZdrlc
10:43 TheWild I continued the search and finally
10:44 TheWild https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmWRrMENBVs
10:44 TheWild And please note, this was released in 2004! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cube_2:_Sauerbraten
10:46 waressearcher2 TheWild: fez developer said he remastered it 3 times that is why it took 5 years
10:49 waressearcher2 I like first "cube" engine, I tryed it few years ago on my back then "celeron 466" with "riva tnt 8MB" and I had no lag 20-50fps
10:51 waressearcher2 especially music
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10:52 Fritigern This was the direct inspiration for Minecraft: https://en.wikipedia.org/wik​i/Zachary_Barth#Infiniminer
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10:54 TheWild I knew about Infiniminer but thanks
10:54 waressearcher2 how many people tryed Infiniminer later just because it was inspiration for Minecraft
10:55 waressearcher2 can you build and craft all that stuff in infiniminer by the way ?
10:55 TheWild I tried to run it but unfortunately it crashed AFAIR.
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12:28 Hisforever how do I mack this channel a favorite?
12:29 Hisforever make
12:29 rubenwardy right click on left bar
12:30 Hisforever ty
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12:31 Hisforever ok now thats fixed I'm puting on a roof and using //p set can I rotate blocks in a group or do I need to do them 1 by 1?
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13:16 waressearcher2 is minetest's code modular or its just a bunch of files, I mean is there any structure in it ?
13:16 asl97 iirc, the mods are fairly structure but i don't know about the engine
13:18 treetrunk waressearcher2: you can look at the engine's source code here: https://github.com/minetest/minetest
13:19 treetrunk and the game is here: https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game
13:21 waressearcher2 treetrunk: I don't want to make a step in it until I know its structured in some way or another
13:22 treetrunk Yeah, you can look through the files on github without ever downloading them. Its a good way to find out if they are structured the way you expect or not.
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13:23 treetrunk I know that the mods (and the second link is technically a huge mod) are stuctured pretty well, like asl97 though, I don't know much about the engine.
13:25 asl97 i may not know the code structure but i know the engine structure, it's all in the dev wiki
13:25 asl97 http://dev.minetest.net/Engine_structure
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13:32 waressearcher2 treetrunk: by the way about that "minetest_game", its sort of base set of stuff you will get without mods right ? who decides what is included here ?
13:32 waressearcher2 there are mods that have very useful addition but why they are separate mods
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13:37 rubenwardy no, the engine isn't that modular
13:37 rubenwardy in that, it's quite coupled together
13:37 rubenwardy however, it is split into sections at least
13:38 est31 that still doesnt mean one has to fear it
13:38 est31 just ask questions you have here, we try to help waressearcher2.
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13:40 rubenwardyy <rubenwardy> Minetest Game is the core developed official subgame. It's just a collection of mods.
13:40 rubenwardyy <rubenwardyy> <rubenwardy> seperate mods means modularity and easier to customise
13:40 rubenwardyy <rubenwardyy> <rubenwardy> as said above, core developers decide
13:40 rubenwardyy resend ^
13:40 waressearcher2 allright
13:41 rubenwardyy core devs: https://github.com/orgs/minetest/people
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13:42 rubenwardyy it's quite easy to do trivial changes to Minetest, but real changes that make a (big) difference require quite a lot of expertise and experience
13:42 est31 minetest has high quality and high quality requirements
13:43 est31 a comparatively large userbase, it has
13:44 rubenwardy do you mean * low quality and high quality requirements?
13:45 est31 I do think that our current quality is quite good for an open source game
13:45 est31 but still its bad
13:46 waressearcher2 if say some of you apply to some programming job do you mention that you are developing minetest ? is it helpful ?
13:47 est31 If they dont know minetest? yes, you can tell them its the most popular open source minecraft clone. If they know minetest? the interview is over :p
13:47 rubenwardy I wouldn't for too reasons
13:47 rubenwardy *two
13:47 rubenwardy 1. I haven't done that much
13:47 rubenwardy 2. Minetest is so unstable
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13:49 Teckla Single player Minetest has been very reliable for me.  Minetest Server has been very reliable for me, too, with a limited number of mods (3 or 4).
13:49 Teckla Some of the public Mintest servers with dozens of mods loaded tend to crash regularly.
13:49 asl97 the default game has more than 4 mods
13:49 est31 hrmm perhaps I'm on the wrong irc network
13:49 Teckla OK, when I said mods above, I mean non-default mods.  :)
13:50 est31 I should head over to efnet, where the optimists are lol :)
13:50 rubenwardy Minetest has been getting better
13:50 rubenwardy My server hasn't crashed in a while
13:50 est31 never been there
13:50 * Teckla left the cesspool that is EFNet years ago, and doesn't miss it a bit.
13:50 Megaf Anyone using Debian Sid?
13:51 Megaf I'm going from Debian Stretch do Debian Sid right now
13:51 rubenwardy With the current upstream, stableness isn't so much of a problem at the moment
13:51 est31 just dont install irrlicht 1.8.2 lol
13:52 * Teckla continues to be blown away at the quality and breadth and community of Minetest.  :)
13:52 est31 if it crashes at startup and you have irrlicht 1.8.2 its irrlicht fault
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13:54 est31 is sid == testing?
13:55 Megaf Jessie = Stable, Stretch = Testing, Sid = Ever unstlable, Experimental = Madness
13:56 est31 ah
13:56 Megaf Unstable*
13:57 est31 ah the bug seems to be fixed: http://irrlicht.sourceforge.net/forum/viewto​pic.php?f=2&amp;t=50942&amp;p=295052#p295052
14:00 Megaf hm
14:01 Megaf That's good
14:01 Megaf I wish I could play Minetest with Wayland, it plays, but mouse will act as a joystick or something like it
14:02 est31 celeron55 has a branch
14:02 est31 head over to #mt-dev and ask for it
14:02 est31 or msg
14:06 FreeFull Megaf: Wayland doesn't have pointer locking or pointer warping, that's why
14:07 est31 if it indeed doesn't have, then gaming is dead on wayland
14:08 Megaf FreeFull: I see, so we will ever be able to play Minetest under wayland?
14:08 FreeFull There are plans to add it to wayland
14:08 FreeFull So, eventually
14:09 Megaf So at the moment is impossible
14:09 est31 you know, if they bring up security arguments then I understand it
14:09 Megaf !up Megaf
14:09 MinetestBot Megaf: invalid address
14:09 est31 but they should do it like firefox does
14:09 Megaf !server Megaf
14:09 MinetestBot Megaf: Megaf Server v4.0 | mt.megaf.info:30003 | Clients: 0/11, 0/1 | Version: 0.4.13-Megaf / MegafXploreNext | Ping: 7ms
14:09 est31 there is a locking mouse pointer API for the web
14:10 est31 and the user is asked on firefox first whether to lock the mouse pointer
14:10 est31 simple as that
14:10 nm0i !help
14:10 MinetestBot https://github.com/sfan5/minetestb​ot-modules/blob/master/COMMANDS.md
14:10 est31 but totally disabling... thats dogmatic
14:10 Megaf http://www.phoronix.com/scan.ph​p?page=news_item&amp;px=MTMxMjQ
14:10 nm0i I have to ask... Why MinetestBot is not in lua >.>
14:11 Megaf and then this one https://www.phoronix.com/scan.ph​p?page=news_item&amp;px=MTg1MjY
14:12 est31 nm0i, minetest had a history in python. e.g. the first world generation minetest had was implemented in python.
14:12 asl97 minetest mapgen in python?!
14:12 est31 but now the game itself is completely free of python
14:12 est31 asl97, look at commit c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:13 Megaf !server ping:less
14:13 MinetestBot Megaf: No results
14:13 Megaf !server ping
14:13 MinetestBot Megaf: No results
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14:14 asl97 uh.... that doesn't look like much of a mapgen
14:14 est31 yeah
14:15 est31 there was also a mapper written for minetest in python
14:15 est31 its still in the util subdir
14:16 est31 and there is some commented out python code inside src/light.cpp
14:16 Sokomine nrzkt: yes?
14:16 Sokomine nrzkt: it's always better to say what's up (or send a msg) so that i can answer when i check irc
14:17 est31 well gotta go bye
14:18 nrzkt Sokomine, mg_villages talks a lot in the default log mod, is this normal ?
14:18 rubenwardy !g Wayland
14:18 MinetestBot rubenwardy: http://wayland.freedesktop.org/
14:19 Megaf !g github minetest minetest commit c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:19 MinetestBot Megaf: No results found for 'github minetest minetest commit c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1'.
14:20 Megaf !g minetest commit c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:20 MinetestBot Megaf: No results found for 'minetest commit c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1'.
14:20 BrandonReese joined #minetest
14:20 rubenwardy !g c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:20 MinetestBot rubenwardy: No results found for 'c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1'.
14:20 rubenwardy !b c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:20 asl97 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:20 rubenwardy lol
14:21 Sokomine asl97: take a look at the caverealms mod. it is very good and creates impressive underground caves with lots of crystals and special nodes. it is awesome to explore. you don't need a new biome system for that; just install the caverealms mod
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14:22 Sokomine nrzkt: hm, it talks particulary much if in debug mode (which is the case for me most of the time). can you put up a temporary pastebin and post an example of what it spams your log full with?
14:22 asl97 i know i don't need a new biome system, i can just use a lua mapgen for it,  i just say that there was talks about a new biome system
14:23 Sokomine btw, i've included paramats highlandpools into mg_villages to a degree. it still needs some optimization for this particular case, but at least the reading and writing of the node data is already be done
14:23 Megaf 2015-09-14 09:15:52: ACTION[Server]: Server: SanDisk supplied empty password
14:23 Megaf lol
14:23 Sokomine asl97: ah, yes. i don't think it progressed as far as that particular mod yet. even if it did - it won't have those nice decorative glowing-in-the-dark-nodes that make the caverealms so impressive
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14:24 Megaf !b sokomine github caverealms
14:24 Megaf !g sokomine github caverealms
14:24 MinetestBot Megaf: https://github.com/VanessaE?tab=repositories
14:24 asl97 lol
14:24 Sokomine no, caverealms is by someone else :-)
14:24 Sokomine i just like that mod :-)
14:25 Megaf hm, !b != bing | !g = Google ?
14:25 Megaf !g github caverealms
14:25 MinetestBot Megaf: https://github.com/HeroOfTh​eWinds/minetest-caverealms
14:25 Sokomine look here: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=9522
14:25 asl97 is there even a !b?
14:25 Megaf [14.09.15-:15:20:30] <rubenwardy> !b c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:25 Megaf [14.09.15-:15:20:31] <asl97> https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/c18af6e728fc15ccec65c5c3c8a5c44f0d0a86a1
14:25 Megaf oh
14:25 asl97 https://github.com/sfan5/minetestb​ot-modules/blob/master/COMMANDS.md
14:26 Sokomine and use this for searching for mods: http://nimg.pf-control.de/MTstuff/modSearch.php (krocks search page)
14:26 rubenwardy !bing hi
14:26 rubenwardy !mod food
14:26 MinetestBot rubenwardy: Food [food] restructuring by rubenwardy - https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=2960
14:26 rubenwardy :3
14:26 Sokomine in contrast to the normal forum search, that page above actually finds the mods you're looking for :-)
14:26 Megaf !mod morechests
14:26 MinetestBot Megaf: Morechests by Daraku - https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=635
14:26 Megaf !mod pixel
14:26 MinetestBot Megaf: Could not find anything.
14:26 Megaf !mod pixels
14:26 MinetestBot Megaf: Could not find anything.
14:26 rubenwardy Krock's mod search powers !mod
14:27 Sokomine rubenwardy: aaah. that's good to know!
14:27 nrzkt Sokomine: http://pastie.org/10419259
14:29 asl97 Megaf: i ain't a bot :|
14:29 asl97 i just posted that link cause the channel was starting to get annoyingly spammy
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14:49 Sokomine nrzkt: update mobf_trader
14:50 Sokomine nrzkt: an old version of that did log too much debug output. the newest version ought to be fine. so...mg_villages, handle_schematics and mobf_trader (and, of course, cottages) ought to be newest versions each
14:52 nrzkt Sokomine, thanks for the review, will test it :)
14:53 exio4 I didn't know people actually used wayland, any reason for using wayland more than being hipster?
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14:57 sfan5 asl97: you're not a bot?
14:57 sfan5 .
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15:03 Sokomine btw, i'm working on a trees_lib. the intention is to have one lib/api for registering those things that tend to grow from saplings - and to be able to react to a tree growing, or to add nodes for all wood types etc
15:04 CraigyDavi joined #minetest
15:05 Sokomine mods sooner or later tend to add trees of some form. trunk, wood and leaves are usually present; and the things grow from saplings (which requires special handling depending on which method they use)
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15:14 waressearcher2 is it possible to reuse multicores from mod's lua code ? if say mod requires intensive calculations to spawn separate processes ?
15:15 waressearcher2 I mean can mod on its own use more cores
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15:17 asl97 iirc, lua doesn't have multithreading ability builtin
15:18 asl97 you could use a third party library though
15:18 waressearcher2 its like I have to tweak minetest source code for that ?
15:19 asl97 if it is embarrassingly parallel (ie: the new thread doesn't need to access minetest stuff directly)
15:19 asl97 it would be more messy than useful though
15:20 H-H-H and you dont have to do anything you are free to download something else and play with that
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15:48 nm0i Can't find anywhere in docs how remote_media= directory structure should look like. Anywhere to read?
15:50 asl97 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/b​lob/master/minetest.conf.example#L608
15:50 nm0i Comment has no relevant info on question asked, sorry.
15:51 asl97 Specifies URL, $filename should be accessible from $remote_media$filename via cURL, end with a slash
15:52 nm0i What is $filename in given context? Cache hash?
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15:55 asl97 should be sha1 hash
15:56 nm0i Thanks.
15:56 BrandonReese https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=​3&amp;t=9260&amp;hilit=remote+media#p141005
15:56 BrandonReese ^^ Remote Media Info
15:57 asl97 your remote media link is no longer accessible, aka forbidden 403
15:57 BrandonReese The last post from sfan5 specifically
15:58 BrandonReese w/ link to script to create media folder
15:58 nm0i He refers to https://gist.github.com/sfan5/6351560
15:58 nm0i Thanks
15:58 nm0i So in addition to sha1 filenames you need index too.
15:59 BrandonReese looks like that is the case
15:59 asl97 i highly doubt the engine need the index
15:59 sfan5 "highly doubt lol"
15:59 sfan5 the index was designed because it makes stuff way easier for the engine
15:59 BrandonReese I don't think sfan5 would have written a script to create an index if it wasn't needed
16:00 asl97 doesn't the server send a list of hash and the client just request them using $remote_media$filename?
16:00 sfan5 indeed
16:00 sfan5 thats the old way
16:00 asl97 that is what the doc says
16:00 sfan5 it has a lot of downsides
16:00 asl97 someone need to update it then
16:00 sfan5 e.g. what if the file you got does not have the hash you expect the file to have?
16:01 sfan5 what about multiple versions of the same texture with the same name? (e.g. replacements)
16:01 sfan5 also you can't share a cache folder between servers because of name collision
16:01 * nm0i sighs and writes `make deploy`
16:01 asl97 name collision? doesn't it use sha1?
16:02 sfan5 yes
16:02 sfan5 but if you request the files by filename where is the sha1?
16:02 asl97 the filename should be the sha1 hash isn't it?
16:02 asl97 now it's just confusing
16:02 sfan5 the old way is to request http://example.com/remote_medi​a/default_dirt_with_grass.png
16:03 asl97 it isn't http://example.com/remote_me​dia/sha1_somethingsomething ?
16:03 sfan5 the new way is to download index.mth, check which files the remote_media server has, download those over http by requesting http://example.com/remote_media/sha1hashhere, download the others over the MT protcol
16:03 sfan5 nope
16:04 asl97 so it like http://example.com/remote_media/e750​9a8c032f3bc2a8df1df476f8ef03436185fa
16:05 BrandonReese So the index prevents the client from doing a http request for every file and if it gets a 404 it downloads from mt server
16:05 sfan5 yes
16:05 sfan5 yes
16:05 sfan5 (1st yes is for asl97, second for BrandonReese)
16:06 asl97 so the index isn't really needed, it would just get a 404 if it doesn't exist and just download from the server
16:07 BrandonReese Using the 404 shouldn't be part of the protocol. Depending on how the server is setup after so many 404s it could block your connection alltogether for security reasons.
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16:08 asl97 the index isn't documented though
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16:09 sfan5 asl97: correct, it's not really absolutly needed
16:09 sfan5 it's useful though
16:13 asl97 i think i am wrong or the document is wrong
16:14 asl97 If index.mth is not found, assume that the server contains files named like the original files (not their sha1)
16:15 asl97 also: Do NOT check for any particular response code (e.g. 404) here
16:15 asl97 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/​blob/master/src/clientmedia.cpp#L317
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16:19 asl97 hmmm.... seem like it could be abuse for ddos
16:20 asl97 is that anything that would prevent it?
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16:34 BrandonReese For there to be a ddos you would need to coordinate lots of simultaneous logins to a server with a large amounts of media with an improperly setup remote media server
16:35 asl97 it doesn't need to be an improperly setup remote media server does it?  it could be any url on the web
16:36 BrandonReese Oh you're saying use minetest to cause a ddos on another server.
16:36 BrandonReese I suppose that's a possibility.
16:37 asl97 as for the large amount of media, one can easily make a for loop to register lots of node that has something like nodeX.jpg where x is a number
16:37 nrzkt joined #minetest
16:37 asl97 as the texture
16:39 BrandonReese You would still need a significant number of logins to the server with the malicious remote_media url.
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16:48 nm0i sfan5, asl97 thanks, sha1 hashes worked
16:49 nm0i In addition, client tries to ask for files by name after it.
16:49 asl97 nm0i: with the index.mth?
16:49 nm0i *after sha1 fails.
16:49 nm0i Yes.
16:51 sfan5 indeed it does
16:51 sfan5 fallback
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17:03 twoelk is index.mth compared to what is present in the local cache?
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17:07 waressearcher2 is there any encryption in use in between client and server ?
17:12 sfan5 waressearcher2: no
17:12 sfan5 twoelk: yes
17:15 waressearcher2 there is no need for encryption ?
17:16 everamzah it's just a big password hash, right?
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19:00 * cheapie notices that Irrlicht 1.8.3 has arrived in Debian sid
19:00 * cheapie un-holds 1.8.1 and tries it
19:02 * Krock holds cheapie on his shoulders and points on yesterday's log
19:02 * cheapie peeks in the scrollback
19:02 * nrzkt thinks cheapie is cheap
19:03 * Krock thinks that nrzkt needs more vocals
19:04 cheapie Yep, 1.8.3 works, so anybody with a fully-patched Debian sid system should be fine MT-wise once again.
19:05 * twoelk , whenever he reads cheapies nick, hears the old refrain of chirpy, chirpy cheapcheap
19:05 Krock Middle of the road?
19:06 twoelk yup
19:06 cheapie I've been using this name so long (at least 10 years) that I can't even remember why I chose it.
19:06 Krock better than rekt
19:07 cheapie Better than "Ekdohibs" or whatever nore is now, at lease.
19:07 cheapie least*
19:09 israuor joined #minetest
19:11 Krock xD
19:14 * cheapie watches his server's hard drive grind away updating stuff
19:14 cheapie I really need to reboot that thing one of these days for the kernel updates and whatnot.
19:14 cheapie 14:14:27 up 91 days,  9:31,  1 user,  load average: 1.66, 0.81, 0.35
19:15 nrzkt 9:15PM  up 726 days, 21:35, 1 user, load averages: 0.40, 0.45, 0.41
19:15 swift110-phone joined #minetest
19:15 cheapie nrzkt: Heh, and the people in #debian-offtopic were complaining about *my* box not being rebooted often enough.
19:16 nrzkt i didn't use Debian, it's too cheap. I use FreeBSD :p
19:18 cheapie I did play with FreeBSD once, but got bored rather quickly.
19:18 swift110 joined #minetest
19:18 nrzkt which version ? FreeBSD 10 with pkg is far better than FreeBSD with oldpkg :)
19:18 cheapie It's also quite strange to me, since it's like Linux but ever so slightly different....
19:18 nrzkt (for users which doesn't whan to use port)
19:19 nrzkt BSD is older than Linux
19:19 cheapie I can't remember what version, but it was a few years back.
19:19 * cheapie digs through his file server
19:20 cheapie I have a 10.0 release and 10.1 RC3 disc in there.
19:20 nrzkt 10.2 is out :p
19:24 * twoelk just recently stumbled over some MS-Windows 3.1 setup floppy-disks and wondered wether there exists a disk drive to read them into a modern pc
19:26 cheapie twoelk: They do make USB floppy drives.
19:26 asl97 i got them drives xD
19:27 cheapie I used to have one of the "2X" USB floppy drives.
19:27 cheapie Being USB, they don't *appear* to the computer as floppy drives, but rather plain old mass storage.
19:28 Hijiri joined #minetest
19:28 cheapie It's a bit strange seeing your floppy drive at /dev/sdb.
19:28 twoelk do the still make all that noise?
19:29 cheapie Floppy drives do tend to make noise, yes.
19:29 cheapie (at least I haven't *seen* any with a voice coil actuator, short of the LS120 and such)
19:30 swift110 hey all
19:30 cheapie Hi.
19:30 swift110 how are you cheapie
19:30 * twoelk looks up at that dusty case sitting on the wardrobe full of old floppies and diskettes
19:30 * cheapie is.... still in existence?
19:32 FreeFull joined #minetest
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19:35 * cheapie waits for FreeBSD 10.2 to finish downloading
19:45 Player_2 joined #minetest
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19:56 waressearcher2 are PS4 owners also FreeBSD users ?
19:59 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
20:03 Jordach topkek
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20:34 nrzkt <waressearcher2>: yes
20:35 nrzkt like MAC OSX users :)
20:35 nrzkt but MAC OSX didn't use the freebsd, only the userland part and some parts of the low land part like packet filter
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20:50 swift110 'ok
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21:39 cimbakahn VanessaE.  Are you there?
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22:13 MinetestBot [git] CraigyDavi -> minetest/minetest_game: Remove beds/Changelog.txt & farming/API.txt b6c1201 http://git.io/vZSdO (2015-09-14T23:08:52+01:00)
22:13 MinetestBot [git] MT-Modder -> minetest/minetest_game: Change obsidian glass drawtype to glasslike_framed_optional f5c8f88 http://git.io/vZSd3 (2015-09-14T23:08:37+01:00)
22:16 swift110 how are you guys addingmods
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