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IRC log for #minetest, 2015-01-06

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Time Nick Message
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00:41 SegFault22 Does anyone understand the purpose of builtin.lua in itest mod? It's kinda confusing
00:41 WindHero itest mod?
00:42 SegFault22 IndustrialTest mod from ages ago. Nore was working on it, but now works on Technic
00:42 SegFault22 It's been abandoned and I'm going to use it to make a different tech mod
00:42 SegFault22 kinda
00:43 WindHero If I were to guess...
00:44 WindHero it looks like builtin.lua makes small changes to the regular placing, digging, etc. mechanisms
00:44 SegFault22 mkay
00:44 SegFault22 thx
00:45 WindHero yeah, definitely to allow special functions to run when a itest node is dug
00:46 SegFault22 I think I'll just use the whole file in my experimentation for now, maybe change it up later
00:46 WindHero don't see why it would hurt
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11:43 jojoa1997 Hi
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12:12 kaeza mornings
12:12 sfan5 morning (it's 13:12 but who cares)
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13:11 catninja_ morning! but it's 2pm here and soo dark
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14:46 ziggy909 is there an adventuretest server?
14:47 ziggy909 it's a game, not a mod, does that mean you need the game files?
14:47 marktraceur ziggy909: Clients automatically download files from the server on load.
14:48 ziggy909 for games too?
14:48 ziggy909 subgames*
14:50 rickmcfarley it does for Lord of the Test, I think it should for others
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14:52 Wayward_One ziggy909, the game files are included in the download, if that's what you mean
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15:17 MinetestBot [git] Sapier at GMX dot net -> minetest/minetest: Fixes for android 083d19b http://git.io/U9lnWA (2015-01-06T16:13:39+01:00)
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16:28 Peon501_ hi u have to fix stuff loading, when you look around, it lags when it loads, but if u high in sky u see more and it dont lag
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16:37 marktraceur Well formulated bug report.
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16:38 exio4 marktraceur, it works but it doesn't but it also does
16:39 marktraceur New issue: I don't have enough diamonds
16:39 marktraceur Give me more diamonds please
16:39 marktraceur But I don't really need diamonds
16:39 marktraceur But still.
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16:42 hoodedice !seen Jordach
16:42 MinetestBot hoodedice: jordach was last seen at 2014-12-23 19:16:47 UTC on #minetest
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17:21 Sherghan Hi
17:21 Sherghan I'm fairly new to minetest. I've created a few worlds, but sometimes a world appears without trees. Is there a command I call (like say in chat or some kind of console) that would add a sampling to my inventory ?
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17:22 Calinou Sherghan, /giveme sapling
17:22 Calinou /giveme sapling 10
17:22 Calinou for 10 saplings
17:22 Sherghan great
17:22 Sherghan thx
17:23 acerspyro Calinou: No saplings for you.
17:23 Sherghan it works !
17:24 Sherghan I've also heard there is a new type  of  tree - pine.
17:25 Sherghan how to call a pine sapling?
17:25 acerspyro Sherghan: give it a cell phone.
17:25 acerspyro I'm feeling for bad puns today.
17:26 acerspyro pine_sapling?
17:26 acerspyro sapling_pine?
17:26 marktraceur Isn't it in moretrees?
17:26 marktraceur moretrees:pine_sapling maybe
17:27 Calinou marktraceur, no, in default
17:27 Sherghan ok, I got it
17:27 VanessaE that reminds me, guess I'll need to make a minor change to moretrees.
17:28 Sherghan giveme default:pine_sapling 10
17:28 Sherghan it works
17:28 Sherghan thx
17:30 acerspyro Any important changes in Minetest lately?
17:32 acerspyro also, minetest crashes if you start it while your wireless network is up, but there's no internet connection going thru it.
17:32 VanessaE chedck the chagelog :P
17:32 VanessaE -d
17:33 acerspyro I am doing that
17:33 acerspyro I see nothing interesting
17:34 PilzAdam the changelog is only updated on new releases
17:35 acerspyro PilzAdam: I am checking the Git changelog
17:35 acerspyro Well, commit log
17:35 acerspyro https://github.com/minetes​t/minetest/commits/master
17:35 acerspyro This shit
17:35 VanessaE I meant the real changelog
17:35 VanessaE http://dev.minetest.net/Changelog
17:35 acerspyro oh
17:36 marktraceur Ah.
17:36 acerspyro slow to load...
17:36 VanessaE it's a big page (that really should be split up)
17:37 VanessaE maybe just move all the pre-0.4.10 stuff to another page or so.
17:37 acerspyro Last time I played on the servers, what version was it?
17:37 acerspyro About maybe a week ago
17:38 VanessaE probably 0.4.10
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17:38 VanessaE oh, then 0.4.11
17:38 acerspyro I was using git
17:38 acerspyro so not much has changed.
17:38 acerspyro I saw a big performance boost, but it is still very far away from what you would expect from a program that renders cubes.
17:38 PilzAdam everything changed
17:38 PilzAdam cubes are round now
17:39 acerspyro lol
17:39 VanessaE PilzAdam: well, apples are in dreambuilder ;)
17:39 acerspyro "Cubes are subdivided in 16x16 for our pleasure."
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17:45 rubenwardy Hi all!
17:45 VanessaE hi
17:46 acerspyro I refuse!
17:48 Calinou acerspyro, Minetest renders a lot of cubes and hacks around Irrlicht a lot
17:48 PilzAdam Calinou, hacks?
17:48 acerspyro Why use irrlicht if you gotta hack with it?
17:49 PilzAdam Calinou, what hacks?
17:49 Calinou because it'd work the same way with all other rendering engines
17:49 Calinou no graphics engines are really made for that kind of stuff
17:49 Calinou PilzAdam, ask in #minetest-dev
17:49 PilzAdam Calinou, I ask you
17:49 Calinou there are tons of CPU bottlenecks in general
17:50 Calinou some of them probably can't be fixed
17:50 rubenwardy PilzAdam, lighting
17:50 Calinou the lighting doesn't take much to render
17:50 rubenwardy Minetest doesn't render cubes, it renders a mesh which represents lots of cubes. Just to clarify
17:50 Calinou what takes a lot is computing it
17:50 PilzAdam rubenwardy, lighting is not done in a hacky way
17:51 rubenwardy Lighting is usually done by shaders or hardware, rather than brighting or darkening textures.
17:51 PilzAdam it's done by shaders in MT too
17:51 acerspyro Also, it would be nice if MineTest would not render cubes it can't see.
17:51 rubenwardy Wow.Since when?
17:51 PilzAdam since shaders were added instead of using the fixed rendering pipeline?
17:51 rubenwardy acerspyro, it doesn't. Frustum culling
17:51 rubenwardy Except for underground caves
17:51 Calinou in most games, lighting is brightening or darkening textures ;)
17:51 Calinou acerspyro, it already uses occlusion culling since 0.3.1 (2011-11)
17:52 acerspyro Calinou: Then why can you briefly see caves while mining?
17:52 Calinou occlusion culling is disabled if your head is inside solid geometry, so it's transparent for the user
17:52 Calinou because it isn't perfect?
17:52 Calinou no OC system is
17:52 Calinou perhaps it could be made more agressive, but then expect visible geometry to disappear
17:52 rubenwardy I made a 3D rendering engine in Javascript and HTML5
17:52 rubenwardy Today./
17:52 acerspyro rubenwardy: Easy shit
17:52 rubenwardy Admittedly, it's only wireframes
17:53 acerspyro When you know where you're going*
17:53 est31 also when you go on a server to spawn and then to your home and enable full viewing range, you see spawn far away even if its 100% sure there is something in between
17:53 acerspyro rubenwardy: Just scale and morph pics to fit vertices.
17:53 acerspyro I did a 3D cube in CSS
17:53 rubenwardy The hardest part was interpreting the wikipedia article on 3d projection
17:53 acerspyro Animated and everything
17:53 rubenwardy No, Canvas
17:54 rubenwardy !g 3d projection wikipedia
17:54 MinetestBot rubenwardy: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3D_projection
17:54 Calinou 3D in CSS is possible, but an hack
17:54 acerspyro a*
17:54 Calinou Canvas + JavaScript is better
17:54 Calinou but the ideal is WebGL
17:54 acerspyro Calinou: It ran pretty smoothly in Chromium
17:54 Calinou so that you use hardware acceleration
17:54 acerspyro But it ran like shit in Firefox
17:54 Calinou not all hacks are slow
17:54 PilzAdam rubenwardy, what you probably meant was that we "hardcode" lighting into the mesh
17:54 PilzAdam but that isn't hacky at all
17:55 Calinou we don't use deferred rendering
17:55 rubenwardy No, what I meant is I projected 3d points onto the 2d screen. I didn't use opengl, or any framework.
17:56 PilzAdam rubenwardy, here, the lighting is applied in shaders: https://github.com/minetest/minete​st/blob/master/client/shaders/node​s_shader/opengl_fragment.glsl#L109
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18:01 rubenwardy http://rubenwardy.github.io/html5_3d_projection/
18:01 rubenwardy Calinou ^
18:02 rubenwardy WASD, arrow keys
18:02 rubenwardy https://github.com/rubenwardy/html5_3d_projection
18:03 rubenwardy space, shift
18:08 PilzAdam rubenwardy, now do proper rasterization!
18:10 rubenwardy XD
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18:23 tb01110100 is it possible to create a minetest mod that implements something like SEUS shaders in minecraft?
18:23 rubenwardy Not a lua mod
18:23 rubenwardy You can make in C++ Mod in the same sense as a Minecraft mod
18:23 rubenwardy But you might as well contribute it to the source
18:24 rubenwardy Minecraft mods are just patches the the main code. Minetest mods are plugins.
18:24 Krock meow
18:24 rubenwardy Hi Krock.
18:24 Krock hi, did the world end without letting me know?
18:25 rubenwardy Why would you think that?
18:25 Krock I thought it would end today.. maybe I'm wrong
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18:29 CWz is buildbot broken?
18:31 Krock depends if sqlite3 has been removed from src already or not
18:31 CWz "../buildwin32.sh: line 79: cd: minetest: Too many levels of symbolic links"
18:36 sfan5 rubenwardy: weird things happen if you look up from inside the pyramid
18:36 rubenwardy Yes
18:36 rubenwardy Those are /0 errors, probably.
18:37 sfan5 CWz: i can reproduce your issue
18:37 est31 you dont have to look up for weird things to happen. being inside is enough
18:49 MinetestBot [git] sfan5 -> minetest/minetest: Fix buildbot (was broken by 04a1a446cf845a0db80d39fd0e42771aa07e4492) efdb9da http://git.io/BYXcTw (2015-01-06T19:43:21+01:00)
18:49 sfan5 ^ CWz: fixed it
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18:55 CWz thanks :)
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19:35 Calinou cleaned up my mods
19:35 Calinou fixed mg More Ores bug
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20:52 russia_nekto hi every1
20:52 russia_nekto is anybody alive?
20:52 russia_nekto i want to know how to make skins for menus in minetest?
20:56 marktraceur Hi
20:56 marktraceur russia_nekto: IRC is a very idle-heavy medium, you may need to wait :)
20:56 pitriss russia_nekto: read topic.. "Responses may take a while, so be patient." and stop spam in dev channel. :)
20:57 russia_nekto spam?
20:57 russia_nekto too easy to call this spam
20:58 marktraceur Not much we can do about that
20:58 marktraceur Apart from put more letters in the word "spam"
20:58 marktraceur spacaonsethnthqtnqhjurcuheolamoeum
20:58 marktraceur Stop spacaonsethnthqtnqhjurcuheolamoeumming the dev channel.
20:58 russia_nekto what core gives to players?
20:58 marktraceur russia_nekto: What?
20:59 russia_nekto beauty renders and gameplay . and thats all.
20:59 russia_nekto core - what trying to do on dev channel.
21:00 russia_nekto so i ask the core team to realize that
21:00 marktraceur Coherently?
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21:00 russia_nekto and get "we dont care, move away".
21:00 marktraceur Because I still have no idea what you're saying.
21:00 russia_nekto hm
21:00 russia_nekto ok another POV
21:01 russia_nekto i want to tell to devs that minetest must have easy to use skin engine.
21:01 marktraceur Fair enough
21:01 marktraceur Did you open a GitHub issue?
21:01 russia_nekto to let artist make beauty to minetest
21:01 marktraceur Because that's how we say that things should be done.
21:01 marktraceur You don't need to be flowery about it
21:02 marktraceur "Hey it would be cool if we could customize the menus" should suffice
21:02 russia_nekto ) no no you think pull request is all what we need?
21:02 marktraceur I didn't say "pull request", I said "issue"
21:02 marktraceur File a bug.
21:02 pitriss russia_nekto: it is not so easy.. :) you need to take in mind that MT can run on multiple devices from PC to cell phones.. so.. I don't think that modable main menu is good idea
21:02 russia_nekto no u a want make things simple)
21:03 LazyJ russia_nekto, study VanessaE's "Dreambuilder's" interface for Unified Inventory and her HDX-64 texture pack.
21:03 russia_nekto pitriss: i talk about skins not mods.
21:03 LazyJ Both of those change menu appearances in Minetest.
21:03 LazyJ Study them to see how it is done, then make your own changes.
21:03 russia_nekto but different degree
21:04 pitriss russia_nekto: yes. but still you can'ŧ change font size just because it must fit also on cellphone screen.. you can'ŧ use too wide images there and so on.
21:04 LazyJ Bundle those changes into a small, limited, very specific texture pack, then share on the forums and GitHub.
21:04 pitriss it is not so easy..:)
21:04 russia_nekto the path of universal it not a path for MT.
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21:04 marktraceur russia_nekto: Back to not making any sense I see.
21:05 russia_nekto dont get u
21:05 LazyJ It's not easy communicating in a language that is not your own.
21:05 russia_nekto yeah
21:05 marktraceur True.
21:06 russia_nekto just wait ) doesnt practice too much
21:07 russia_nekto LazyJ: i dont want to dig to code. artist want to know where to place texture atlas and make test how it looks
21:07 russia_nekto to see how it looks
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21:07 LazyJ russia_nekto, at Minetest's current stage of development, it is not ready for artist's ease.
21:08 russia_nekto what drives a game forward?
21:08 LazyJ The "art" is what players create inside a Minetest world.
21:08 russia_nekto LazyJ: yes. i got this. and i walk to core team to tell them about this.
21:09 russia_nekto LazyJ: player cant create gray art:)
21:09 russia_nekto the player wants brushes to create art
21:09 LazyJ Higher priority, at the moment, is to make Minetest run better.
21:09 russia_nekto but there are too hard to make brushes(texture and skins)
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21:10 russia_nekto LazyJ: better than what?
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21:10 marktraceur I'm sure sculptors would disagree with your statement about gray art.
21:10 russia_nekto marktraceur: we talk about plane screens.
21:10 russia_nekto and players with mouse and keyboard.
21:10 * marktraceur is walking away now
21:10 russia_nekto so sculptors are wrong in that context
21:11 LazyJ Minetest is not ready for "themes" or "skins" like a web browser or a desktop background.
21:11 pitriss russia_nekto: better than it is running now.. MT is atm painfully slow and can't handle too much players even on high end servers..
21:12 marktraceur Yay singleplayer.
21:12 russia_nekto LazyJ: yes i got it. but nobody wants css and html in MT UI.
21:13 russia_nekto pitriss: what is "atm"?
21:13 LazyJ russia_nekto, before artists can make Minetest beautiful, someone has to do the code work.
21:13 russia_nekto LazyJ: yes! and that why i walk to core team , but here.
21:13 LazyJ Only an artist would understand what the code needs to do, so Minetest needs an artist to make the code.
21:14 LazyJ Minetest's developers are gifted programers, not visual artists.
21:14 russia_nekto LazyJ: remember quake 1 ?
21:14 LazyJ Their "art" is in the skill of writing code.
21:14 russia_nekto LazyJ: yeah!
21:14 russia_nekto and that why i start to talk for them about beauty!!!!
21:15 brothersome Minetest needs threading and priority in its kernel
21:15 LazyJ So, if you want beautiful Minetest, *you* have to write the code that allows that and help Minetest become what you seek.
21:15 LazyJ Minetest is opensource.
21:15 LazyJ It needs the help of many people of many different talents.
21:16 LazyJ Those with code talent have gotten it this far.
21:16 russia_nekto LazyJ: how about change priority of the core devs or interest them in that?
21:16 brothersome I got it from github, I will search for those things that introduces the lags
21:16 LazyJ Now those with art and code talent are needed to write the code to make Minetest beautiful.
21:16 russia_nekto i have on simple idea. the more u have inspiration the more u create.
21:16 LazyJ *But*... those artistic coders have not come forward.
21:17 LazyJ russia_nekto, this is your opportunity to learn code to help Minetest become the "beauty" you seek.
21:17 russia_nekto LazyJ: and they dont. they must route core team to do this.
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21:17 LazyJ What often seems to be a simple idea is not so.
21:18 russia_nekto LazyJ: yea my. and i have a choice to get it through code writing or talking with people, uh?
21:19 LazyJ The developers are hit with many wants and ideas and everyone expects the developers to do it all.
21:19 russia_nekto nothings inspirite developer like a well known and populatiry of the product he creates.
21:19 russia_nekto LazyJ: beauty is not a wants or some idea .
21:20 LazyJ Instead of telling the developers what work they should do for you, help the developers by doing the work yourself.
21:20 russia_nekto players eyes only see beauty and gameplay.
21:20 LazyJ That is how opensource is supposed to work.
21:20 russia_nekto no no. your opensourse thesis doesnt work well here.
21:20 LazyJ Many demands, too few developers.
21:21 russia_nekto its not about opensourse. its all about talking with people.
21:23 russia_nekto more beauty player sees more players you have
21:23 russia_nekto more players creates wants to have tuned server code.
21:24 russia_nekto but 100 players never wants to have a super puper tuned server code
21:25 russia_nekto they even doesnt know about each other :)
21:25 pitriss russia_nekto: players want a lot of mods on server without lag.. so yes, they want super tuned server:)
21:25 russia_nekto nobody want even to know the word MOD from players.
21:26 russia_nekto its more easy. only beuaty and gameplay
21:26 russia_nekto or as u sees the things:
21:27 russia_nekto mods with no lags VS beauty with gameplay ?
21:27 russia_nekto what will win?
21:27 VanessaE russia_nekto: go try a Dreambuilder server sometime
21:27 pitriss russia_nekto: mods without lags.. thats what affect gameplay
21:27 VanessaE or download the game and play it locally
21:27 pitriss when you will be not able to even dig smoothly graphisc part will be useless there
21:28 russia_nekto pitriss: but why do u think that gameplay is there?
21:28 Ritchie bugs in minetest has higher priority than some art in menu
21:28 russia_nekto pitriss: u ever seen how kids play in minecraft?
21:29 pitriss Ritchie: exactly..:)
21:30 e1z0 joined #minetest
21:30 russia_nekto why diablo 3 was borned dead?
21:30 LazyJ Ritchie, bingo!
21:31 pitriss russia_nekto: you need to be able play to use graphics.. now, it is laggy, slow and really not comfortable to play.. it needs to be faster.. Do you even tried to play on some more populated server? Did you experienced blocks that you dig placed back due high lag?
21:32 LazyJ ^^ and try to do all that with a high-res texture pack.
21:32 russia_nekto stop stop
21:32 russia_nekto not so fast
21:33 russia_nekto i simply download minetest and try to play. nothing inspire me to go to play servers.
21:33 russia_nekto because then u try minecraft and sees minetest beauty u dont want even play singleplayer
21:33 LazyJ Then don't play Minetest yet. Wait for it to mature.
21:33 pitriss lol.. minecraft? beauty?
21:34 russia_nekto yes.
21:34 pitriss where? in which galaxy?
21:34 russia_nekto pitriss: in minecraft galaxy
21:34 LazyJ Minecraft has Microsoft's billions of dollars. Minetest doesn't even have a budget for decent coffee.
21:35 pitriss LazyJ: +1
21:35 crack joined #minetest
21:35 russia_nekto money changes nothing here
21:35 LazyJ Heh. Try telling that to your landlord.
21:35 russia_nekto money cant inspirite
21:37 russia_nekto lets start from begining
21:37 russia_nekto why core team does something?
21:37 e1z0 joined #minetest
21:37 russia_nekto anybody knows a true?
21:38 pitriss russia_nekto: lol.. ok again: code that skinnable menu or go to play beautiful minecraft.. there are no other options for you at the moment.
21:39 russia_nekto the "move away" like a "opensource" so doesnt apply this words. they are nothing .
21:39 russia_nekto pitriss: do u know the true?
21:39 pitriss As many people here stated before.. Minetest have more serious issues than some "ugly menu" (which is not so simple as I like its simplicity)
21:39 LazyJ We all would like to skin Minetest to our tastes, but right now, at Minetest's current phase of development, much work still needs to be done to make it function better.
21:40 LazyJ It's like a building a new type of car.
21:40 russia_nekto why do u think so ?
21:41 LazyJ The beautiful interior and sleek styling are no good if the engine, frame, and suspension has yet to be created.
21:41 russia_nekto u think that inspiration in core team enough to make @it function better@ even u dont know what inspiration is for them?
21:41 LazyJ All you would have is a pretty, but empty, shell.
21:41 pitriss russia_nekto: graphics part is not priority.. Imagine brand new chasis of ferrari with engine from lawn mover.. that is what you are trying to create
21:41 Ataron joined #minetest
21:41 LazyJ The core team creates the tools for others to build with.
21:41 Ataron joined #minetest
21:42 LazyJ Mods were not possible.
21:42 russia_nekto pitriss: u mix things. u musnt.
21:42 LazyJ The developers had to create the tools to make mods possible.
21:42 russia_nekto LazyJ: and ? what it gives?
21:43 russia_nekto what it gives to MT?
21:43 russia_nekto popularity
21:43 russia_nekto ?
21:43 russia_nekto or what?
21:43 LazyJ Skinnable interface is not a tool the devs have created yet because they are focused on bigger problems in Minetest's functions.
21:43 russia_nekto problems?
21:44 russia_nekto r u sure that devs have enought inspiration to resolve this problmes?
21:44 MinetestBot [git] Sapier at GMX dot net -> minetest/minetest: Implement X11 dpi autodetection 0f1d339 http://git.io/ObbOWw (2015-01-06T22:41:07+01:00)
21:44 LazyJ Problems: memory leaks, language support, improved networking code, etc.
21:44 LazyJ Sapier just added a small improvement.
21:45 LazyJ Many little, but important, steps still have to be done.
21:45 LazyJ The 'beauty' of Minetest will have to wait till Minetest can handle it.
21:45 russia_nekto ok ok
21:45 russia_nekto u cant get  the simple thing
21:45 russia_nekto i try to explain
21:46 LazyJ At the moment, lots of players get disconnected or their clients crash because the code isn't quite right for their operating system.
21:46 russia_nekto what is the first egg or chicken?
21:46 russia_nekto what was created first
21:47 LazyJ russia_nekto, you might have more success if you spoke to the Russian developers or posted in the Russian threads of Minetest's forums.
21:47 pitriss russia_nekto: no you still don'ŧ understand.. Without work of core devs.. your skin for main menu will stay in your ms paint for eternity
21:47 LazyJ Several, non-Russian speaking people here have tried to explain to you as you have tried to explain to us.
21:48 LazyJ But language is proving to be a large obstacle.
21:48 russia_nekto pitriss: without inspiration core devs wont work.
21:48 LazyJ I suspect pitriss has a point.
21:49 russia_nekto and the main thing u dont know what inspirite them.
21:49 LazyJ Then you have to inspire them, russia_nekto. You have to step up, do the work, and submit the code to make it possible.
21:50 russia_nekto u hope that they can resolve problems. its just hope. nobody can guruantee that devs can to that.
21:50 pitriss I'm giving up.. Discussing with someone who didn'ŧ even tested 20% of MT possibilities is pointless...
21:50 russia_nekto LazyJ: you really think that only code changes thigns?:)
21:50 Ritchie i have no problem with minetest main menu, it is simple, functional and fits into minetest style
21:50 russia_nekto Ritchie: its not about problems:)
21:50 Ritchie russia_nekto: you are the first person who came here with skinnable menu
21:51 Ritchie why many players and developers didn't mention skinnable menu earlier?
21:51 russia_nekto Ritchie: skinnable menu just a part of
21:51 russia_nekto Ritchie: nice question
21:51 LazyJ russia_nekto, create a painting *without* a canvas, without paint, without a paintbrush.
21:51 Ritchie are you sure that every game has skinnable menu?
21:51 russia_nekto Ritchie: and the main thing u dont know what inspirite them - this question like yours. but nobody knows.
21:52 LazyJ Not possible. You need the tools to create the painting. For Minetest, those tools are the code.
21:52 Ritchie is this important part for a project?
21:52 LazyJ Without the code, no "paintings" are possible.
21:52 russia_nekto LazyJ: what creates code?
21:53 Ritchie answer to my question is that nobody needed skinnable menus
21:53 LazyJ That is what you have to do, russia_nekto, create the code.
21:53 russia_nekto Ritchie: its not about skinnable menu.
21:53 russia_nekto LazyJ: why?
21:53 Ritchie so what is this discussion about?
21:54 LazyJ russia_nekto, from what you've described, what you want is not possible because Minetest lacks the code to make it happen.
21:54 russia_nekto LazyJ: make something that force me to create code, please
21:54 russia_nekto LazyJ: ok it lacks.
21:54 LazyJ You've already made it yourself.
21:54 russia_nekto LazyJ: i agree it lacks.
21:55 LazyJ You want this "beauty"? *That* is the inspiration to make it possible.
21:55 LazyJ You have to inspire yourself.
21:55 russia_nekto LazyJ: there are more routes to achieve it
21:56 russia_nekto LazyJ: i understand that your only route @making code@ :)))
21:56 LazyJ Just another poet wanting someone else to write the poetry for them. (sigh)
21:56 russia_nekto no no
21:56 russia_nekto if i do , i will ask about some API for mods
21:56 pitriss LazyJ: of course and for free..:D
21:56 LazyJ My time has run out.
21:57 russia_nekto you cant answer what makes devs to create the code
21:58 Ritchie LazyJ: about MC's $$$ from MS, +1 too
21:58 russia_nekto complaints makes them upgrade server code.
21:58 russia_nekto but what makes them to raise populatiry of Mt?
21:58 pitriss quality of code
21:59 pitriss quality of code is what is best advert for Minetest:)
21:59 russia_nekto i mean populatiry among players:)
21:59 russia_nekto pitriss: lol))
22:00 pitriss yes me to
22:00 pitriss *too
22:00 russia_nekto pitriss: print this advers on MT site and count players :)))
22:00 pitriss because it means also modding possibilities, thus more diversity on servers..
22:00 Ritchie how long someone want to look at a menu if he want to play on his favourite server(s)?
22:01 pitriss because it also means that people can create their own games in quite easy way..
22:01 e1z0 joined #minetest
22:01 pitriss thats all is about quality of code..
22:02 russia_nekto Ritchie: its not about menu. i talk about beauty in MT visual style.
22:03 acerspyro joined #minetest
22:03 Ataron joined #minetest
22:03 pitriss lol, textrew packs are possible already..
22:03 pitriss *texture
22:04 russia_nekto pitriss: possiblities not means inspirations.
22:04 Ritchie beauty is attitudinal term
22:04 acerspyro I think I said it earlier today, but I'll repeat
22:05 russia_nekto pitriss: the possibility to be a president is here. but u have no inspiration to be a president.
22:05 acerspyro If you start minetest while being connected to a hotspot that has no internet access via wireless, Minetest crashes on startup
22:05 pitriss lol: but core devs DON'T MAKE GAMES.. They provide tools for people to create their own games..
22:05 acerspyro Core devs develop cores.
22:06 pitriss russia_nekto: so your "inspiration something" is pointless.. Make your own game, inspired by what you want, do textures themed as you want..
22:06 acerspyro Apple cores, orange cores, CPU cores, fission cores...
22:06 russia_nekto pitriss: its a mistake to divide ppls like u do.
22:06 russia_nekto pitriss: MT is not a commercial products .
22:06 Ritchie NO
22:07 pitriss russia_nekto: yes it isnt..
22:07 russia_nekto pitriss: "move away  " not a route. disscussion is a route :)
22:08 pitriss russia_nekto: and learn something about developement of programs.. then think, and maybe come back to discuss here.. Because core devs make tools for creating games.. nothing more..:)
22:08 russia_nekto pitriss: so u cant force core devs to do only core code. anytime they can change mind and stop working .
22:08 Ritchie core developers provide minetest engine and tools, modders creates mods, someone creates textures and texture packs
22:08 pitriss MT is alive just because people make games and share them..
22:08 russia_nekto really u see things like this?
22:09 russia_nekto you divide , diviide and hopes it gives results?
22:09 acerspyro Division by zero
22:09 pitriss Devs only provide possibilities.. community provide games..
22:09 pitriss thats how MT works.. You can't change that..
22:10 russia_nekto u cant prove this :) what why u cant predict what will be with MT.
22:10 acerspyro Fun fact: MT are my initials :D
22:11 pitriss lol.. sorry pal, but you must be 10 years old kid..
22:11 pitriss ..over and out..
22:11 russia_nekto creating is all about insipiration. so i repeat my Q: anybody knows what inspirate developers of MT?
22:12 WindHero joined #minetest
22:12 Ritchie how it anybody can know?
22:13 russia_nekto ask devs:) they knows
22:13 Ritchie acerspyro: about crashes.. did you look into debug.txt?
22:13 acerspyro Ritchie: It just tells me it can't resolve a hostname
22:13 russia_nekto acerspyro: so type IP address:)
22:14 acerspyro russia_nekto: No, it crashes before it even starts
22:14 Ritchie acerspyro: it is weird
22:14 acerspyro Try opening a wireless network on a connectionless laptop, and connect to that network with another laptop, and start Minetest
22:14 Ritchie acerspyro: it should wait for timeout and then it should inform you with error
22:15 Ritchie acerspyro: what version of MT are you using and what operating system do you have?
22:16 acerspyro I was on Ubuntu, I had the Git version, about a week ago
22:16 Zaynah joined #minetest
22:17 Zaynah left #minetest
22:17 russia_nekto everyone who talks with me today send me to write code. they thinks that code changes things. but at the same time that ppls doesnt know what force developers work. is it strange ?
22:17 acerspyro Reformulate plz
22:17 whatsupdoc joined #minetest
22:18 whatsupdoc hey everybody how's the android port coming along? any recent breakthroughs?
22:20 Ritchie whatsupdoc: hi, i don't have android so i cannot tell you anything but maybe someohe here uses android port
22:20 Zelenavoda joined #minetest
22:20 Ritchie but i think android port is unofficial port (correct me please if i am wrong)
22:22 Ritchie acerspyro: i know what do you mean with wifi network without connection to the internet
22:23 Ritchie but i didn't met this problem yet
22:23 Ritchie i can try it
22:23 acerspyro That's because you never encounter local networks.
22:24 acerspyro Here, we have two routers: A gateway, upstairs, and my router. I need a second router to plug all my computers in, and so that my parents can control my online hours just by unplugging the wire on their router, which leaves my router in local-only mode.
22:24 Ritchie nope
22:24 Ritchie i encountered many local networks
22:25 acerspyro Ritchie: With no access to the net whatsoever?
22:25 Ritchie but i knew them if that network are usable before i ran MT
22:25 russia_nekto where is Vanessa that must told to your guys move to another channel :)
22:26 acerspyro russia_nekto: ?
22:26 russia_nekto :) dont get it?))
22:26 whatsupdoc that ought to be reconsidered. android is one of the two most popular operating systems in the world. developers of this software in particular need to realize that and begin taking steps to make the …
22:26 whatsupdoc …android port a 'first class citizen.' otherwise, we will be eternally plagued by ad-laden ripoffs in the play store.
22:26 acerspyro Sorry, it's a real challenge for me to read bad english syntax :/
22:26 Ritchie acerspyro: russia_nekto's blables are meaningless, nothing to find here
22:27 russia_nekto acerspyro: so ? go and read:)
22:27 acerspyro I tried :P
22:27 russia_nekto i can understand everything u write, but u cant ?
22:27 acerspyro "Where is Vanessa, who should have told you guys to move to another channel?"
22:27 acerspyro russia_nekto: That's because my syntax is correct :P
22:28 whatsupdoc it wasn't the first time
22:28 russia_nekto acerspyro: u got sense) thats why u can write with correct syntax.
22:29 * acerspyro feels bad about telling people about the quality of their English.
22:30 russia_nekto acerspyro: be simplier:)
22:30 acerspyro Meh, don't wanna.
22:31 Ritchie acerspyro: i will try latest git client now
22:31 VanessaE russia_nekto: the reason people tell you to "code it" is because you can't have art in a computer program without code to back it up.
22:31 VanessaE you don't put graphics on the screen without having a rendering engine to paint them
22:32 acerspyro VanessaE: What new channel was russia_nekto talking about?
22:32 VanessaE acerspyro: he came into -dev asking all these general questions, I sent him here.
22:32 acerspyro lol
22:32 Ritchie VanessaE: please what do you think about acerspyro's problem? is this some problem in engine?
22:33 acerspyro No, just something that the game aborts if it can't contact the DNS server when a network is up
22:33 russia_nekto Ritchie: acerspyro must check tracert and after that talk about MT problems.
22:33 VanessaE what'd I miss?
22:33 VanessaE oh that, I have no idea :)
22:33 acerspyro lol
22:34 acerspyro I can't afford disconnecting myself just to test right now, but I will try to get you guys a backtrace.
22:34 Ritchie i will try latest git client how it behaves with misconfigured wifi
22:34 russia_nekto acerspyro: maybe u must call to microsoft ?:)
22:34 acerspyro russia_nekto: I run OpenSUSE
22:34 VanessaE Xubuntu here.
22:34 russia_nekto acerspyro: so to call OpenSUSE
22:35 acerspyro If I would call Microsoft, I would have to start off by asking them what's the record size of client fucking they achieved.
22:36 VanessaE acerspyro: it's down by a few percent this past quarter ;)
22:36 acerspyro lol
22:37 e1z0 joined #minetest
22:39 acerspyro I stopped using Ubuntu, and my battery life extended, and performance magically increased.
22:39 acerspyro How magic.
22:40 russia_nekto VanessaE: you don't put graphics on the screen without having a rendering engine to paint them
22:40 russia_nekto i know this
22:40 russia_nekto or that
22:43 russia_nekto VanessaE: answer what thing inspire u to do something for MT?
22:44 VanessaE the fact that I just like to create things that other people can use
22:44 acerspyro voxelophilia
22:44 VanessaE and minetest is a good outlet for that.
22:44 acerspyro I want to learn Lua someday
22:45 russia_nekto VanessaE: and where u see how much ppl use the things u create?
22:45 VanessaE I don't.
22:45 acerspyro She doesn't
22:45 VanessaE nor do I necessarily care.
22:45 VanessaE however,
22:45 VanessaE I do have a stats page for my servers:
22:45 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/va​nessa/hobbies/minetest/stats.html
22:46 acerspyro VanessaE: If you want blocky apples someday...
22:46 VanessaE it's how I track general health of the machine and the minetest server instances running thereon
22:46 acerspyro I'll gladly make them for you.
22:46 russia_nekto stats?
22:47 VanessaE that ^^^ and the Minetest forum tracks views on topics (like any forum software does), but that's about as far as I go with finding out how interested people are in what I do.
22:47 VanessaE acerspyro: no thanks :)
22:47 acerspyro D:
22:47 kaeza joined #minetest
22:47 acerspyro I heard people saying that your servers lagged?
22:48 prozacgod joined #minetest
22:48 VanessaE acerspyro: they do.  partly because the game itself gets slow at times, partly the machine is more heavily-loaded than it should be (as far as Minetest is concerned), and mainly the network is slow
22:49 russia_nekto VanessaE: you inspirates from that your server do cycles in another words?
22:49 kaeza greetings
22:49 VanessaE russia_nekto: that statement does not make sense.
22:49 VanessaE greetz, kaeza
22:50 acerspyro russia_nekto: told you.
22:50 FR^2 joined #minetest
22:51 Ritchie acerspyro: i tried it just now
22:52 acerspyro And?
22:52 Ritchie acerspyro: i did fresh git clone, compile, i wrote some minetest server addres (domain name)
22:53 acerspyro Crash or no crash?
22:53 Ritchie acerspyro: i configured network to have misconfigured dns server on my laptop on wifi connection
22:54 acerspyro Yeah, same as me, the connection is pointed to 8.8.8.8, which is no longer accessible.
22:55 Ritchie acerspyro: mt client properly run, tried to resolve domain name, timeout ran out and then mt client said error than couldn't resolve address: unknown name or service
22:55 VanessaE O_o
22:55 Ritchie 8.8.8.8 should work, i will try it now
22:55 acerspyro Try checking the public list checkbox
22:58 Ritchie with checked public list checkbox it doesn't show any server and doesn't crash
22:58 acerspyro weird
22:58 acerspyro Thanks, I'll see myself and get a backtrace if it crashes.
22:58 russia_nekto so/
22:58 Ritchie try to run minetest from a terminal
22:58 russia_nekto any resolution?
22:58 acerspyro Installing freetype takes really long
22:59 Ritchie it should write here reason why it crashes
22:59 Ritchie in debug.txt should be something too
23:00 Ritchie i only changed one thing in my network setup to simulate connectionless wifi - set dns server address to non existant in laptop config
23:00 bjrohan_ joined #minetest
23:02 Ritchie i am using debian wheezy but i think linux distribution doesn't matter in that basic things, maybe if something has bad config..
23:02 Lunatrius` joined #minetest
23:03 Ritchie acerspyro: " I need a second router to plug all my computers in, and so that my parents can control my online hours just by unplugging the wire on their router, which leaves my router in local-only mode."
23:04 Ritchie acerspyro: router shouldn't be needed, maybe you mean switch
23:05 acerspyro Ritchie: I need to have my own wireless network
23:05 Ritchie wifi ap should be enough
23:05 Ritchie or wifi bridge
23:06 Ritchie but it should be set by someone experienced in networks to avoid problems
23:06 acerspyro Me :P
23:07 acerspyro There's no problem, my parents only have to unplug one single ethernet wire to disconnect both my laptop and tower.
23:08 zat joined #minetest
23:09 Ritchie acerspyro: i tried 8.8.8.8 as dns server just now and it works
23:09 marktraceur acerspyro: Or just use the existing network, and they can block your devices' MAC addresses at certain times.
23:09 acerspyro Ritchie: we'll get better results if we use the real environment.
23:09 acerspyro marktraceur: ?
23:10 acerspyro It's my network, it didn't block my laptop
23:10 n4x oh, look, it's a bunch of cool people
23:10 n4x how is it going minetesters
23:10 marktraceur Where?
23:10 n4x look at the mirror!
23:10 acerspyro Mirror's cool.
23:12 MinetestBot [git] Sapier at GMX dot net -> minetest/minetest: Fix andorid build error 42f3515 http://git.io/gK5yyA (2015-01-07T00:10:21+01:00)
23:15 Ritchie cool is air outside of my house, everything is frozen there
23:15 acerspyro here too
23:15 acerspyro Slippery and dangerous
23:17 crazyR MEET_BLOCK_NODE_METADATA_CHANGED  <-- what does that mean?
23:17 y joined #minetest
23:17 acerspyro It wants you to meet a guy called BLOCK_NODE_METADATA_CHANGED?
23:17 acerspyro Shitty guess
23:18 russia_nekto it measn some ENUM
23:18 russia_nekto peace of information :)
23:18 air map edit event type = meet
23:19 air https://github.com/minetest/min​etest/blob/master/src/map.h#L59
23:19 crazyR what i meanis if the server is continually dumping that to the log every 1-2 seconds, should i be worried lol
23:20 air same block?
23:24 loggingbot_ joined #minetest
23:24 Topic for #minetest is now Welcome to #minetest, the official channel of Minetest | Happy new year | Version: 0.4.11 (2014-12-26) | Responses may take a while, so be patient. | Rules: http://wiki.minetest.net/IRC#Rules | Development: #minetest-dev | Server list: http://minetest.net/servers | IRC logs: http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/
23:24 VanessaE there is no "mostly".
23:25 acerspyro It's a brainless sandbox game engine.
23:25 russia_nekto for whom?
23:25 marktraceur I dunno about brainless.
23:25 acerspyro You need Lua programmers to give it a brain and a point.
23:25 russia_nekto lol))
23:25 marktraceur Oh, sure.
23:25 VanessaE it's an equal mix of people who want to build stuff, people who want to fight, people who want to code, and people who want to...I shit you not ... find lovers :-/
23:25 * marktraceur is brainless.
23:25 marktraceur VanessaE: I could have gone MY WHOLE LIFE without knowing that
23:25 marktraceur BUT NO.
23:25 acerspyro VanessaE: this is what Minecraft is about aswell lol
23:25 VanessaE marktraceur: too late.
23:25 * marktraceur storms off
23:25 VanessaE lol
23:26 VanessaE I could have said it a LOT less delicately. :P
23:26 acerspyro Because people have time to waste in sandbox games
23:26 marktraceur #minesext
23:26 acerspyro Since it's a lot of walking.
23:27 acerspyro marktraceur: You can't be offended without a brain.
23:27 russia_nekto and talking
23:27 VanessaE why did I start?  I wanted to play around with redstone but without spending money on Minecraft.  so I found this + mesecons.  Now I write mods, maintain a game, a bunch of texture packs, and like 7 servers.
23:27 acerspyro dead people talk
23:27 russia_nekto money for minecraft?
23:27 acerspyro I think I found MT in my repos
23:28 russia_nekto where do you live?
23:28 Fusl joined #minetest
23:28 VanessaE sure.  Minecraft costs money, though I forget how much.
23:28 acerspyro $30
23:28 russia_nekto really?
23:28 acerspyro yup
23:28 VanessaE jeez, that much now? O_o
23:28 acerspyro I have a MC account
23:28 russia_nekto shit:) implaying for free
23:28 acerspyro I bought it for $27
23:28 russia_nekto up my server and play with my childrens
23:28 acerspyro I wanted to be able to play online
23:29 VanessaE russia_nekto: see, that's the thing - I don't pirate software.  I use only free software wherever possible.
23:29 marktraceur Wasn't it $15 once upon a time?
23:29 russia_nekto VanessaE: oh!!! we are using only pirate software:)
23:29 marktraceur I think that's what I paid.
23:29 acerspyro it was
23:29 acerspyro russia_nekto: That's because you're russian!
23:29 acerspyro Har har har...
23:29 marktraceur Oh indev. You buggy piece of shit.
23:29 russia_nekto yeah))
23:30 russia_nekto but i can pay 30 buk
23:30 VanessaE marktraceur: old version.  or freeminer?
23:30 russia_nekto but i dont want play online)
23:30 russia_nekto i want play homeonline :)
23:30 russia_nekto i want like a Vanessa see stats on my server:)
23:30 VanessaE no thanks.
23:30 VanessaE not interested in Minecraft/.
23:31 russia_nekto really?
23:31 VanessaE really.
23:31 russia_nekto minecraft doest give u felling of creating?
23:31 VanessaE commercial software does not interest me at all.
23:31 VanessaE Minetest can do everything substantial that Minecraft can do
23:31 VanessaE and I can make it do more, myself, without having to hack the code or do something illegal.
23:31 russia_nekto there is a Forge mod that makes a hole to other ppl who wants create in minecraft
23:32 Tiktalik lieeeeees
23:32 Tiktalik minetest can't do infinite worlds
23:32 VanessaE Tiktalik: neither can minecraft.
23:32 russia_nekto minecraft can:)
23:32 VanessaE no, it can't.
23:32 russia_nekto can
23:32 VanessaE it just has a much larger world size limit
23:32 russia_nekto i test it
23:32 EvergreenTree joined #minetest
23:32 Tiktalik minecraft worlds are practically infinite
23:32 VanessaE coords are 64-bit signed integers or some such
23:33 russia_nekto it doesnt matter
23:33 Tiktalik yeah, you know how big that lets you make your worlds?
23:33 russia_nekto infinite in computer galaxy
23:33 Tiktalik bigger than your hard drive can fit
23:33 VanessaE minetest could do the same if the devs here cared to make it do so, but they don't see a reason to.
23:33 VanessaE Tiktalik: same with Minetest.
23:33 Tiktalik VanessaE: wait, seriously?
23:33 VanessaE I calculated it once, it would take some 200 TB to fit a full minetest world if you managed to use every last block.
23:33 Tiktalik i thought it was something like
23:33 Tiktalik 30000 in each direction
23:33 Ritchie it's $19.95 and the same amount in €
23:33 Ritchie so 19.95 €
23:33 acerspyro We get Russian temperatures, with social benefits. We like to call it Canada.
23:34 VanessaE Tiktalik: 62km cubed.
23:34 Tiktalik that's pretty good
23:34 VanessaE yeah
23:34 Tiktalik and i guess it's unlikely that anyone's gonna go mining everything in a world
23:34 amDOGE|away joined #minetest
23:34 russia_nekto minecraft creates a felling of infinitive world, minetest cant :) that correct
23:34 Tiktalik esp. with how deep it is... so going further out for more resources isn't a concern
23:35 Tiktalik eh
23:35 Tiktalik okay
23:35 Xack joined #minetest
23:35 away joined #minetest
23:35 * Tiktalik would still be happier with 124km cubed.
23:35 VanessaE russia_nekto: minecraft worlds are not infinite. and you can't get any more "infinite feeling" than "too big to fit your hard drive"
23:35 VanessaE both programs can theoretically make maps that big
23:35 russia_nekto VanessaE: feeling infinitive
23:35 Tiktalik VanessaE: but how big is the actual part of the world you want to explore (the upper crust)
23:35 ShadowNinja russia_nekto: No.  You're not going to practically use all of a Minetest workd.  It would take like 100TB.
23:35 marktraceur VanessaE: Indev was Minecraft in...2010? 2011? I'm not even sure.
23:35 marktraceur It was tiny.
23:35 russia_nekto all games about feeling something:)
23:36 acerspyro Minetest has no vertical limit, does it?
23:36 VanessaE Tiktalik: I'm not sure I understand the question?
23:36 marktraceur acerspyro: The cube is the same all the way around
23:36 ShadowNinja russia_nekto: On the contrary, MC has a very restrictive height limit.
23:36 russia_nekto acerspyro: no. doesnt.
23:36 acerspyro ok
23:36 marktraceur x,y,z axes all have the same limits.
23:36 VanessaE acerspyro: from ~ -31k to +32k, with the land centered at +0
23:36 acerspyro None of that MC bullshit
23:36 VanessaE er +31K
23:36 * y ,x,z
23:36 y :D
23:36 russia_nekto VanessaE: new map format has bottomless option
23:36 VanessaE russia_nekto: so?
23:36 marktraceur I would /nick x but I know it's taken.
23:37 acerspyro I want it topless too
23:37 acerspyro I want MC bar strippers.
23:37 russia_nekto VanessaE: it makes me feels infinitive :))))
23:37 marktraceur What the hell.
23:37 russia_nekto lol)))
23:37 y marktraceur: no, it isn't taken
23:37 kaeza y, U NO HUG??
23:37 marktraceur It's not?
23:37 * y hugs kaeza :3
23:37 marktraceur Oh, it's registered but not guarded maybe
23:37 VanessaE what does it matter?  the map can fill a hard drive.  all that is needed is better handing of the vertical parts of the map now.
23:37 marktraceur Wait what
23:37 VanessaE (since it's already been decided that it won't be made wider)
23:37 pitriss http://pastebin.com/6F4GbGSK this is how sfan calculated MT world
23:37 y no, x isn't marktraceur
23:38 Tiktalik VanessaE: I mean, how big is the horizontal part
23:38 y you can't /nick to it
23:38 pitriss i had it stored
23:38 marktraceur Lame
23:38 Tiktalik though I suppose
23:38 Tiktalik can you uh
23:38 Tiktalik have a single character across multiple world files in minetest?
23:38 VanessaE pitriss: wow, even bigger than I remember the calculation.
23:38 VanessaE Tiktalik: not yet.
23:38 Tiktalik hm, ok
23:39 marktraceur But over half of that map is air blocks
23:39 VanessaE Tiktalik: but there's nothing that fundamentally prevents it.  someone just has to decide it's worth the effort to code it.
23:39 Tiktalik fair enough
23:39 marktraceur Maybe you could compress the storage somehow
23:39 VanessaE marktraceur: over half is un-generated, rather.  also don't forget floatlands and similar mods
23:39 marktraceur Ah, yes.
23:39 VanessaE marktraceur: leveldb implements some basic compression
23:40 VanessaE does around...ohh... 1.5:1 or so
23:40 crazyR hi guys is it possible to remove already registered buttons on the unified_inventory mod from outside of the mod
23:40 VanessaE crazyR: I don't think so
23:44 crazyR hmm shame i need to modify the home buttons due to a change in my game
23:44 crazyR but i dont want to modify the inv mod itself
23:44 VanessaE shouldn't you modify your game to work properly with the home buttons then?
23:45 VanessaE they use the same file format as the standard sethome mod as I recall
23:45 acerspyro There's no opensuse package for irrlicht...
23:47 russia_nekto whyminetest doesnt allow D3D render?
23:47 VanessaE it uses directyx
23:47 VanessaE directx*
23:47 russia_nekto where?
23:47 VanessaE in the Settings menu
23:47 russia_nekto on winfows set opengl
23:47 acerspyro Does it?
23:47 air acerspyro: dont use opensuse :)
23:47 VanessaE on windows, yeah
23:47 VanessaE on linux, opengl
23:47 acerspyro air: not a solution
23:47 crazyR the new home function within my game contains new features VanessaE
23:48 acerspyro I'd have sex with opensuse
23:48 russia_nekto on windows i cant select D3D from combobox
23:48 VanessaE ...
23:48 russia_nekto there is OpenGL , SOftware , burningvideo
23:49 russia_nekto no D3D
23:49 acerspyro wtf is burningsvideo anyways
23:49 VanessaE russia_nekto: it would be DirectX, not D3D.  and if it is missing, well maybe your video driver is busted.
23:49 air acerspyro: do you have a compiler?
23:49 acerspyro air: are you seriously asking this
23:49 russia_nekto my video driver runs every game on my HDD:)
23:49 russia_nekto and all of them D3D
23:50 VanessaE russia_nekto: turn shaders off then, maybe that's blocking access to DirectX.
23:50 air acerspyro: you could manually compile a package
23:50 acerspyro I could
23:50 acerspyro but I'd rather look online for it first
23:50 russia_nekto VanessaE: where ?
23:50 VanessaE russia_nekto: Settings menu
23:50 air does opensuse have the option to install other package managers, likt apt?
23:51 russia_nekto VanessaE: no result
23:51 VanessaE russia_nekto: try setting it in your config then
23:51 russia_nekto only that 3 options
23:51 VanessaE video_driver = directx
23:51 VanessaE in your minetest.conf
23:52 VanessaE if that doesn't work, then minetest can't use directx on your box
23:52 VanessaE or maybe it's directx8, directx9
23:52 acerspyro air: Nope, but there's a big collection of RPM packages out there
23:52 kaeza direct3d8 *
23:52 VanessaE AH
23:52 kaeza (and direct3d9)
23:52 VanessaE that's right
23:52 acerspyro found it
23:52 VanessaE derp
23:53 VanessaE video_driver = direct3d8 or -9
23:53 russia_nekto works) direct3d9
23:53 russia_nekto but combobox doesnt know about direct3d9
23:53 russia_nekto it shows empty item
23:53 Ritchie air: opensuse has zypper, this is something like apt
23:53 air acerspyro: what is this? http://software.opensuse.o​rg/package/libIrrlicht1_8
23:54 acerspyro This is it
23:54 ShadowNinja VanessaE: Minetest compresses the big parts of the mapblock with ZLib, which brings air blocks down to something in the area or 20 bytes.  LevelDB aditionally does Snappy compression.
23:54 VanessaE ShadowNinja: ok
23:54 VanessaE russia_nekto: well there you go, but remember, no shaders in that mode
23:54 acerspyro VanessaE: Why would one use D3D over OpenGL?
23:54 russia_nekto VanessaE: looks the same
23:55 VanessaE acerspyro: because they're masochistic? :P
23:55 acerspyro Not surprising from a Windows user
23:55 VanessaE russia_nekto: probably just not being used then
23:56 kaeza D3D had better performance than OpenGL here (crap Intel GMA)
23:56 pehjota joined #minetest
23:56 acerspyro russia_nekto: why would you use D3D over OpenGL?
23:56 russia_nekto checkbox = true on Shared in OpenGL, but it looks the same as in D3D
23:57 russia_nekto acerspyro: kaeza right:) drivers for D3d works much better
23:57 Sokomine joined #minetest
23:57 russia_nekto because D3d are king on windows:) because it has super puper dev tools :) and debug too
23:57 ShadowNinja VanessaE: sfan's calculations assume about 78 bytes.  Less compressible Mapblocks can be over 16000 bytes though.
23:57 VanessaE russia_nekto: then you're not really in direct3d mode, it probably defaulted back to opengl
23:57 russia_nekto VanessaE: irrlight says it in D3d:)
23:58 air printf is the only debug tool anyone should need
23:58 ShadowNinja So those assumptions are pretty much for an empty map.
23:58 VanessaE russia_nekto: your build of Minetest may not even HAVE direct3d support
23:58 kaeza VanessaE, there's no "default back to opengl". it either works, or aborts
23:58 VanessaE kaeza: hrm, ok
23:58 VanessaE but his shadersa re impossible
23:58 VanessaE are*
23:58 VanessaE opengl shaders do not work in directx mode, period
23:58 kaeza true that
23:59 russia_nekto irrlight support d3d or opengl not MT
23:59 VanessaE last I knew both had to.

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