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IRC log for #minetest, 2014-11-04

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 freelikegnu cool
00:00 VanessaE there are water turbines in technic and in mesecons
00:00 freelikegnu see how litttle I know
00:00 VanessaE RealBadAngel: that reminds me, now with mesh nodes we can have REAL water turbines/water wheels yes?
00:00 VanessaE and they could turn, too, once you get animated meshes working
00:01 freelikegnu I put mesecons pack in my server after calinou removed it during update...
00:01 RealBadAngel with animated ones we will have to wait a bit
00:01 VanessaE right, I know
00:01 RealBadAngel thats rather a massive change
00:01 RealBadAngel but definitely will be done
00:02 RealBadAngel im still learning irrlicht ;) i just need some time :)
00:02 freelikegnu where did the name mesecons come from?
00:03 VanessaE mese conductors
00:03 VanessaE pretty sure that's what it means
00:03 RealBadAngel and mese is an alien stuff ;)
00:04 RealBadAngel some have reported that remains of the crashed UFO could be found in Finland
00:04 freelikegnu yeah I had a hard time figuring out why mese is called mese
00:04 freelikegnu google had no idea
00:08 freelikegnu ok now I'm confused.... there is this project with similar name: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=8059
00:09 freelikegnu you can put some nodes together define and area and ride them around
00:10 freelikegnu RealBadAngel's mod converts meshes to nodes, and Stu's modes converts nodes to a rideable mesh
00:12 VanessaE and then there's my script that converts nodebox defs into .obj files :)
00:12 RealBadAngel voxels area entities are on todo list
00:13 VanessaE ( https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=9&t=10428 - in the spoiler under "convert and update old stuff")
00:15 exio4 supporting windows is so painful
00:15 RealBadAngel even Gates doesnt support xp anymore ;)
00:15 VanessaE exio4: eh, just use a piece of broomstick.  those usually work for the heavier windows.
00:17 exio4 I wrote ugly code, somehow, with lots of love, it worked
00:17 exio4 https://github.com/EXio4/zyflex
00:17 freelikegnu mesh slopes are nice :D
00:17 exio4 and the remaining love I had, was wasted in compiling the stuff for windows
00:19 VanessaE freelikegnu: they are but in this case I was specifically pointing out the script :)
00:20 VanessaE there are tons of good nodebox models out there that just need converted to proper .obj files so they can be re-meshed and textured properly
00:23 marktraceur freelikegnu: IIRC mese is a nickname for MSN Messenger.
00:23 marktraceur Slash a nonsense word.
00:24 * marktraceur finds immense irony in saying that, having an FSF cloak, talking to someone referencing GNU in their nick
00:24 freelikegnu :D
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00:27 freelikegnu it was hard to find a nick repesenting support of things GNU, I suppose gnudist is another alternative
00:28 freelikegnu could also be a nice akward name for a minimal herd distro
00:29 VanessaE hey mark, been a while since I seen you around :)
00:29 freelikegnu hurd distro
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00:32 marktraceur Oh no I've been spotted!
00:32 marktraceur VanessaE: I decided to join because I'm thinking about doing a project, as per usual, terrible idea
00:32 VanessaE heh
00:33 marktraceur Not tonight, though!
00:33 marktraceur Tonight is beer and lots of cooking night.
00:33 freelikegnu also have to check out the phonics block mod... I think my 5yo might enjoy that
00:34 freelikegnu virtually building words seems like fun
00:35 marktraceur They might get hooked, though. Watch out for that.
00:35 freelikegnu I've heard about that marktraceur
00:35 marktraceur There were all those PSAs in the 90s
00:35 VanessaE freelikegnu: I just got an image in my head of "Conjunction Junction" from "Schoolhouse Rock(y)"  heh
00:35 marktraceur Cue the Family Guy cutaway
00:36 freelikegnu the addictive nature of phonics and minetest combined might stand a chance against her attention span
00:36 VanessaE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ODGA7ssL-6g
00:37 VanessaE eh, that one loses the audio part way through.
00:37 freelikegnu oh the possibilities of word carts in minetest
00:37 VanessaE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4AyjKgz9tKg
00:37 VanessaE there we go.
00:37 freelikegnu Sesamesecon Street
00:42 VanessaE dear G*d I grew up with this stuff.
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00:42 marktraceur VanessaE: Yes my child?
00:42 VanessaE :P
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00:49 hisforever Hi I downloaded skins where do I put them to get to use them?
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00:52 VanessaE hisforever: dreambuilder_game/mods/player_textures/textures
00:52 VanessaE name them as player_xxxx.png
00:52 VanessaE where xxxx is the player name you want to assign them to
00:52 hisforever ok ty
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00:59 exio4 lol, just realized I got hmmmm's "scam about scams" email too
01:04 hisforever Sorry VanessaE butWhere do I find the skins in game?
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01:04 VanessaE hisforever: the mod that dreambuilder uses is intended for server use, so you don't see the skins in the game.
01:05 VanessaE you pick one, name it something like:  player_singleplayer.png  and put it in the folder I described
01:05 hisforever gotcha
01:05 VanessaE then you can see it when you go into 3rd person view with F7
01:05 VanessaE (after you restart)
01:16 exio4 coursera is nice
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01:57 hisforever VanessaE its too hard to read on server so when I want to build on server I'll just go on to laptop
01:57 VanessaE hisforever: just ignore the chat if it gets too active ;)
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01:58 VanessaE or you just mean this one machine you were trying to use is hard to read?
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02:02 hisforever actually I would like to be on the bigger monitor its just that the fonts are so small and I don't read fast enough to get tghe commands right on the game grid
02:07 VanessaE oh, you can adjust the fond size
02:07 VanessaE font*
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02:07 VanessaE in your minetest.conf, do something like:
02:07 VanessaE font_size = 17
02:07 VanessaE mono_font_size = 17
02:07 hisforever VanessaE I have to get to bed So I'll try to get into server via irc tomorrow night if that will be ok with you ?
02:07 VanessaE (but tweak the numbers as needed)
02:07 VanessaE sure, I might be here.
02:07 VanessaE hey Taoki
02:07 Taoki hi
02:07 hisforever ok God bless see you tomorrow
02:13 Taoki God bless Minetest :)
02:13 Taoki And hi... been a whle since i've beena ctice on IRC. Again :P
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02:53 AgentFire So Minetest
02:56 AgentFire I need a little help with Minetest
02:56 AgentFire I can't seem to fly
02:56 Enke joined #minetest
02:57 AgentFire When I hit k
02:57 AgentFire It says
02:58 Enke "free move enabled (no fly privs)"?
02:58 AgentFire Yes
02:58 Enke If you're in singleplayer, type /grant singleplayer fly
02:58 Enke If you're in multiplayer, you're probably out of luck.
02:58 Enke :-/
02:59 AgentFire Okay, good to know
02:59 AgentFire Thanks Enke
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02:59 Enke If you want all privs in a singleplayer world, you can use /grant singleplayer all
02:59 AgentFire Sounds like something to do
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03:08 AgentFire Is there a way to update your gamemode without exitting the world?
03:15 VanessaE nope
03:15 VanessaE you have to exit to update mods/games
03:15 AgentFire Okay then
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03:27 freelikegnu is there a way to set the admin user on a headless server?
03:28 VanessaE freelikegnu: name = foo
03:28 VanessaE in minetest.conf
03:28 VanessaE the user named "foo" is automatically the admin then
03:29 freelikegnu so I have to shut down the server after it is created to set
03:29 VanessaE no
03:29 VanessaE you can just  /grant <username> all  as well
03:30 VanessaE if you currently already have admin privs on the server.
03:30 VanessaE eg. if you started the world in singleplayer,   /grant singleplayer all   and then  /grant <the other user> all
03:31 VanessaE then <the other user> will be considered the admin for all intents and purposes.  meanwhile, add that line to the .conf anyway
03:31 VanessaE since sooner or later you're gonna restart for some reson
03:31 VanessaE reason*
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03:35 freelikegnu I started the game with minetestserver since it is a headless system on a vps
03:36 VanessaE oh right, you did say headless
03:36 VanessaE derp
03:36 VanessaE well do,  name = whatever  and restart it.
03:36 VanessaE then immediately log in as that username
03:37 freelikegnu cool thanks :D
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03:45 AgentFire Okay, I have another question
03:46 AgentFire Does anybody wanna play Minetest with e?
03:46 AgentFire *me?
03:46 * VanessaE is brain dead for the night :P
03:47 freelikegnu do you have a server up AgentFire ?
03:55 AgentFire Unfortunately no, I'm not sure how to set one up
03:56 freelikegnu you can join mine if you like
03:56 freelikegnu freelikegnu.org 30000
03:57 freelikegnu I'm running 4.10 with Carbone+Mesecons+animals
03:59 AgentFire Okay, I don't have Animals or Carbone. I only have More Blocks, More Ores, and Mesecons
03:59 freelikegnu it will add all the mods you need when you join I think
03:59 AgentFire Okay, good
04:00 AgentFire So, how did you hear about Minetest?
04:00 freelikegnu searching for minecraft alternatives
04:00 VanessaE AgentFire: play on one of my servers then
04:01 VanessaE (I don't have any that run Carbone, or the animals mod though)
04:01 AgentFire VanessaE: Maybe another time c:
04:03 compunerd_nick Hey, freelikegnu, how does your server run with animals mod? My first server ran ok, but server output was giving me error messages from the animals mod, since then I've started a carbon server with technic, mesecons, homedecor, money, etc and it seems to be working pretty good.
04:03 freelikegnu you probable need adv_spawn with animals
04:04 freelikegnu if you are usings sapiers animals modpack https://github.com/sapier/adv_spawning
04:04 compunerd_nick I had that, it just kept spawning them numerously all over the place, over loading and lagging the system down
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04:05 freelikegnu it did that the first server I ran, but its ok now for some reason
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04:08 compunerd_nick hmm, weird... I'll have to try it again...
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04:33 compunerd_nick Hey, freelikegnu, do you have to manually grant interact priv on your server? I'd like to try it out...
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05:11 OldCoder Animals are broken
05:11 OldCoder Sapier has told me so
05:12 OldCoder For another month or two, use kpgmobs
05:12 OldCoder Also, Carbone can be compiled with other mods; I am now running two hybrid worlds
05:12 OldCoder VanessaE, compunerd_nick, freelikegnu ^
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05:25 cg72 where is the api for mapgen v7??? i cant find "minetest.register_biome"
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06:43 paramat sfan5, https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/336 =)
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06:54 freelikegnu OldCoder: will try that looks good
06:54 freelikegnu gn folks
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08:40 Zeno` roar!
08:42 hisforever Hi Zeno how are you?
08:42 FR^2 joined #minetest
08:42 Zeno` good thank you
08:42 Zeno` how are you?
08:43 hisforever a little tired but great otherwise
08:43 Zeno` :)
08:43 Zeno` Can't complain then
08:44 hisforever nope just love minetest
08:44 Zeno` it's fun, hey
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09:55 Fritigern I just submitted an issue to the issue tracker, then realized that i neglected to ask others if they are having issues with the latest version from git. Specifically, double-tap flying.
09:58 Zeno` What's the issue?
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10:03 Zeno` I found it. Looking into it now Fritigern
10:04 Fritigern Thank you. And as i said, i neglected to ask if anyone else was having the same issu with 0.4.10-174-g96fcca4-dirty
10:05 Fritigern And to be clear, double-tap fly stopped working for me with this version.
10:05 Zeno` it's something I've done wrong
10:05 * Fritigern slaps Zeno`wrist. BAD!!!
10:06 Fritigern Am i convincing as a wrist-slapper? ;-)
10:07 Amaz Fritigern, slightly :P
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10:08 Amaz If you had slapped his(?) wrist with a ruler, that would have been more convincing :)
10:08 Zeno` actually, that's weird
10:08 Fritigern BTW, if anyone has issues with the  markers mod, specifically occasional crashes, then make sure that the last placed markers are not placed in a straight line. That crashes my server every time.
10:09 Zeno` doubletap_jump is being set to false every time I run the game
10:09 Fritigern Zeno`: I take it this is a "hmmm... it should be working..." moment/
10:09 Fritigern ?
10:09 Zeno` Fritigern, can you test? Add doubletap_jump = false to minetest.conf and run the game
10:10 Zeno` err add doubletap_jump = true
10:10 Zeno` then see if it's reset to false after you launch, play and exit the game
10:10 Fritigern The GUI shows me that it is currently true for me. The checkmark is set
10:10 Fritigern I will play with the conf
10:12 Fritigern Zeno`: doubletap_jump is already true in my conf
10:13 Zeno` where is g96fcca4?
10:14 Fritigern Right here: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/96fcca4ea0a9ac0cec1ef48d5baeed78120f62e9
10:16 Zeno` k thanks
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10:20 Fritigern All i see is that at line 2486 MinetestApp::toggleFreeMoveAlt was changed to Game::toggleFreeMoveAlt, and that's the only think that has anything to do with doubletap_jump.
10:23 Zeno` Yeah, I'll fix it
10:23 Zeno` thanks for the report
10:23 Fritigern You're welcome. I was thinking that perhaps the issue stems from an earlier commit, so i am looking at those now.
10:25 Zeno` it's from the previous refactor_the_main commit probably
10:27 Fritigern LArge commits confuse the heck out of me. I find it exceedingly hard to follow what does what, as i try to read it all as if it were regular text. I do not sufficiently understand C with any number of plusses or a hash to read it with any kind of ease
10:28 Fritigern Oh, new info: Unsetting doubletap_jump from the GUI does NOT update the conf.
10:31 RealBadAngel commits are not news
10:31 RealBadAngel for code to understand you need to read whole functions, not just the changed parts
10:32 RealBadAngel if you will meet dude who claims he understand diffs you can freely call him stupid
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10:36 Zeno` Fritigern, fixed. Will make a PR soon
10:37 Zeno` as for the <Fritigern> Oh, new info: Unsetting doubletap_jump from the GUI does NOT update the conf., that has nothing to do with my commit but I'll look at that as well
10:39 Zeno` Fritigern, the commit is very large because I squashed many commits. I'll push the unsqaushed commits (for reference) soon as well
10:40 Zeno` And that commit is probably the largest you'll see in a while (almost 3000 lines changed)
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10:45 Fritigern Well, such is the nature of the refactoring process. Lots of little changes, and hope to high heaven that nothing breeaks. :-)
10:49 Zeno` well this was a BIG refactor
10:49 Zeno` and I would have been very surprised if nothing broke :)
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13:51 FourFire greetings
13:55 iqualfragile joined #minetest
13:57 iqualfragile anybody online?
13:58 Aragas joined #minetest
13:58 Amaz Everyone is offline, why?
14:00 iqualfragile i need somebody to help me test some code
14:00 iqualfragile can you compile minetest?
14:02 shadowzone joined #minetest
14:02 iqualfragile hi ShadowBot
14:02 ShadowBot Hello iqualfragile!
14:02 iqualfragile godfuckingdamnit
14:02 iqualfragile hi shadowzone
14:02 shadowzone Hi
14:03 iqualfragile can you compile minetest?
14:03 shadowzone Yep
14:03 iqualfragile want to help me test a patch i wrote to support mumble positional audio?
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14:04 shadowzone Um..
14:04 shadowzone I don't know.
14:05 Amaz I can....
14:05 Amaz But only in about an hour.
14:05 Amaz :/
14:06 kaeza greetings
14:06 iqualfragile hi kaeza
14:06 iqualfragile do you want to help me test a patch?
14:07 kaeza hm?
14:08 Amaz iqualfragile, can I have the code?
14:08 iqualfragile patch: http://sebsauvage.net/paste/?292b210c5058b031​#UAr+2QXuKG/3+6Sa/dnXE9sc0jt+PMMcDySxBEOwEdU=
14:08 Amaz No sooner the word than the deed :P
14:09 Amaz Can you remind me how I apply it please?
14:10 iqualfragile git apply file
14:10 iqualfragile i think
14:10 iqualfragile i am horrible at git
14:10 Amaz Okay.
14:11 iqualfragile works?
14:11 Amaz Nope.
14:11 iqualfragile cool
14:11 Amaz Have you got a repo I can clone it from?
14:11 iqualfragile no
14:11 Amaz Okay!
14:11 iqualfragile patch -p0 < mumblepositionalaudio.diff
14:11 iqualfragile should work
14:11 Amaz Okay...
14:11 Amaz 2 mins.
14:12 Amaz Clone Minetest again
14:12 Amaz *Cloning
14:13 iqualfragile ah, wait
14:13 iqualfragile needs to be -p1 obviously
14:13 Amaz Ah!
14:14 Amaz Works :D
14:14 iqualfragile great
14:14 iqualfragile now you only need a mumble client
14:14 iqualfragile and we need to choose a minetest server to meet on
14:15 Amaz What's a mumble client?
14:15 iqualfragile its like a team speak client, but open source
14:15 Amaz Ah, okay.
14:19 Zeno` If that works I'll be happy
14:19 Zeno` will have made the refactor worth it heh
14:20 iqualfragile absolutely
14:20 iqualfragile Zeno`: wana help test?
14:22 Zeno` for sure, but not right now (12:30AM here)
14:22 Zeno` about to go to sleep :(
14:22 iqualfragile ah, ok
14:22 iqualfragile where are you from?
14:23 Zeno` Australia
14:23 Zeno` you?
14:23 iqualfragile ah, ok
14:23 iqualfragile germany
14:23 Zeno` that's across the ocean :D
14:23 iqualfragile yeah, more or less around the globe
14:23 Zeno` hehe yep
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14:23 Zeno` the code looks good (by just scrolling through it)
14:24 iqualfragile mostly copyed
14:24 Zeno` yeah but that's ok
14:24 iqualfragile i should move the name setting code to the init part
14:26 Zeno` hmmm
14:26 Zeno` I don't think that's a big issue
14:26 iqualfragile well, its suboptimal performance
14:27 iqualfragile don't think its a big hit, as its only executed once per frame
14:27 Zeno` which line are you talking about?
14:27 iqualfragile but it could be executed once
14:27 iqualfragile last thing that happens in updateMumblePositionalAudio
14:28 Zeno` maybe
14:29 Zeno` you know more about that than me :)
14:29 iqualfragile i think i will move it later no
14:29 iqualfragile but first i need to find out if it actually works :D
14:29 Zeno` I'm not sure it can be in init though... what happens if players leave?
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14:29 Zeno` yeah, get it working first and then optimise :)
14:30 iqualfragile it is only about the local player name
14:30 Zeno` premature optimisation is the root of all evil (Knuth)
14:31 someguy_irc hai
14:31 someguy_irc you know something
14:31 someguy_irc i was on a chat site for 15 hours.
14:31 Zeno` I know nothing!
14:31 someguy_irc :3
14:31 someguy_irc lol
14:32 * Zeno` waves goodbye. I'll idle for a while ;)
14:32 someguy_irc Tushe.
14:32 someguy_irc .-.
14:33 someguy_irc touché
14:34 Zeno` someguy_irc, you made a funny 'e'
14:34 someguy_irc hmm.
14:34 someguy_irc .-.
14:35 shadowzone joined #minetest
14:35 Zeno` ok, now... tell me... what does the .-. smiley mean?
14:35 someguy_irc lol
14:35 someguy_irc Akwardness
14:35 someguy_irc :P
14:35 someguy_irc .-.
14:36 Zeno` hmm, ok... it's been bothering me for days lol
14:36 Zeno` .-.
14:36 kaeza :| -> ._. -> .-.
14:36 shadowzone Like your eyes squinting you and your cheeks looking flushed.
14:36 someguy_irc hmm
14:37 someguy_irc shadowzone
14:37 shadowzone Yeah?
14:37 someguy_irc i wrote a Smiley bot for MPP today XD
14:37 shadowzone Uh oh...
14:37 someguy_irc -.-
14:37 Zeno` de gads!
14:37 Zeno` what is -.- ???????!
14:38 someguy_irc adds a [smiley] button near the chatbox like FB or Gmail.
14:38 someguy_irc -_-
14:38 someguy_irc http://puu.sh/cCXhL/0b671decd4.jpg
14:38 someguy_irc shadowzone , ^
14:38 shadowzone hmm
14:39 someguy_irc (¬_¬)
14:39 Zeno` =+=
14:39 someguy_irc (◔_◔)
14:39 someguy_irc lol
14:39 someguy_irc ◕‿↼
14:39 someguy_irc :3
14:40 Zeno` [[..]]-=/,.<>
14:40 shadowzone ©¸©
14:40 someguy_irc lol
14:40 kaeza ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
14:40 shadowzone °¸°
14:40 someguy_irc .
14:40 shadowzone UGH I HATE IT WHEN HE DOES THAT ONE!
14:40 someguy_irc Zeno` this will help you.. http://unicodeemoticons.com/index.htm
14:40 someguy_irc -_-
14:40 someguy_irc Lolo
14:40 someguy_irc XD
14:40 Zeno` nah I don't wanna look!
14:40 Zeno` I refuse
14:40 someguy_irc ಠ‿ಠ
14:40 someguy_irc (;一_一) ok Zenie.
14:40 Zeno` brb, going off to sulk
14:40 shadowzone /人 ◕ ‿‿ ◕ 人\
14:40 someguy_irc lol
14:41 someguy_irc (。◕‿‿◕。)
14:41 someguy_irc u know what?
14:41 someguy_irc ▄︻̷̿┻̿═━一
14:43 zat <3 http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_Sah87Hs0SAI/TH2_LOZt5PI/​AAAAAAAAAFg/DfCoN4KBtp4/s1600/Fast%2525252525252BF​ive%2525252525252BCars%2525252525252B%2813%29.jpg
14:44 cities joined #minetest
14:45 shadowzone >:)
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14:53 someguy_irc im afk adding more smiles to my bot (ಠ⌣ಠ)
14:57 FourFire hey, I'm interested in testing positional audio with mumble
14:57 FourFire I have mumble
15:00 FourFire kyubey...
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15:13 iqualfragile_ FourFire: sounds great
15:13 iqualfragile_ newest patch: http://sebsauvage.net/paste/?63df7a70e6123145​#bX/OTiY40upAp24uKYwcUxKmu2lZrAeNgzjQhiMyjxo=
15:13 iqualfragile_ save into mumble.patch
15:13 iqualfragile_ apply to minetest sources with
15:13 iqualfragile_ patch -p1 <mumble.patch
15:17 FourFire ok
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15:20 FourFire I got the following error can't find file to patch at input line 5
15:20 FourFire Perhaps you used the wrong -p or --strip option?
15:20 FourFire The text leading up to this was:
15:20 FourFire should I have it in a specific directory iqualfragile ?
15:23 sol_invictus curl http://sebsauvage.net/paste/?63df7a70e6123145​#bX/OTiY40upAp24uKYwcUxKmu2lZrAeNgzjQhiMyjxo= | patch -p1
15:23 sol_invictus ^ try this
15:23 iqualfragile FourFire: you need to be in the minetest source root directory
15:23 FourFire "patch: **** Only garbage was found in the patch input."
15:23 iqualfragile and i just tested with Amaz
15:23 iqualfragile it worked
15:23 FourFire oh right, I don't know where that is lol
15:24 iqualfragile well, you have cloned the minetest sources, right?
15:24 FourFire found it
15:26 iqualfragile does it work?
15:29 FourFire got the following error: "patch: **** Only garbage was found in the patch input.
15:29 FourFire "
15:29 FourFire so no
15:29 iqualfragile ok, so you did:
15:29 iqualfragile git clone http://github.com/minetest/minetest.git minetest
15:29 iqualfragile cd minetest
15:29 iqualfragile <save paste into mumble.diff>
15:30 iqualfragile patch -p1 < mumble.diff
15:30 iqualfragile cmake .
15:30 iqualfragile make -j 4
15:31 SylvieLorxu sol_invictus: Are you sure you want to send a curl for that URL?
15:31 SylvieLorxu I see a # in it which seems like it runs a Javascript function
15:31 FourFire sorry my git clone was incorrect
15:31 FourFire redoing
15:31 SylvieLorxu If it is one of those "secure paste" services, that could be the issue
15:32 sol_invictus SylvieLorxu, not at all
15:32 SylvieLorxu Hmm, okay
15:32 sol_invictus people should stop using such services for patches
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15:34 zlsa sol_invictus, it's an html page
15:34 sol_invictus zlsa, I see now
15:34 FourFire cd
15:35 zlsa you can just go to the URL in a browser, click 'raw text', then copy-paste
15:35 zlsa because raw text is still html, you can't just save the page
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15:37 FourFire I get the following error from the last command: " git clone http://github.com/minetest/minetest.git minetest"
15:37 FourFire sorry, : "make: *** No targets specified and no makefile found.  Stop."
15:38 zlsa are you in the minetest directory?
15:38 kaeza did `cmake .` run OK?
15:38 FourFire it seemed to
15:39 FourFire wait, no, it actually kicked an error too
15:39 Amaz Try git apply patchname
15:40 FourFire "error: patch failed: src/game.cpp:70
15:40 FourFire error: src/game.cpp: patch does not apply
15:40 FourFire error: patch failed: src/game.h:151
15:40 FourFire error: src/game.h: patch does not apply
15:40 FourFire was kicked by ShadowBot: Paste flood detected. Use a pastebin like pastebin.ubuntu.com or gist.github.com.
15:40 kaeza ...
15:40 FourFire joined #minetest
15:40 FourFire sorry about that
15:40 FourFire I'm not very experienced in the terminal
15:41 kaeza FourFire, what was the error from cmake?
15:41 FourFire yes
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15:41 FourFire oh too late, I already refreshed the terminal, i'll attempt to redo
15:43 FourFire actually, nevermind, you already had a tester succeed right iqualfragile
15:43 iqualfragile FourFire: correct
15:43 FourFire then you don't need my help in testing
15:43 iqualfragile that is correct
15:45 Zeno` more people testing is better
15:46 iqualfragile that, too is correct
15:46 Zeno` kaeza likes testing
15:47 Zeno` lol :)
15:47 VanessaE sure, just goad him along ;)
15:47 iqualfragile goad?
15:47 Zeno` VanessaE likes testing as well
15:47 VanessaE kaeza that is :P
15:48 VanessaE Zeno` yeah, about as much as I like a root canal :P
15:48 VanessaE iqualfragile: to push along, grudgingly
15:48 iqualfragile ah, ok
15:49 Zeno` canal? gondola? romantic evening floating along sipping mountain dew? Doesn't sound all that bad
15:49 VanessaE haha
15:51 Zeno` VanessaE, Fritigern found another bug today. I wouldn't have found these things (at least for a long time) without so many testers
15:51 VanessaE double-tap?
15:51 Zeno` fortunately they're minor
15:51 Zeno` yeah
15:51 VanessaE saw that in the logs
15:52 Zeno` tap dance is working again now though
15:52 VanessaE well that's why it's called a "development" build and not "stable" :P
15:52 VanessaE :)
15:52 alket joined #minetest
15:54 shadowzone I'll test.
15:55 shadowzone and Zeno`  nice job with the gondola thing got me laughing.
15:56 Zeno` hehe shadowzone
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15:57 Amaz Zeno` I thought you were going to bed... :P
15:58 iqualfragile shadowzone: do you need help with testing?
15:58 shadowzone Maybe.
15:58 shadowzone I just need to get it on github.
15:58 Zeno` I am in bed. asleep as well
15:59 shadowzone http://www.mediafire.com/download/​m4jc2nn1v0ruh0e/shadowtest.tar.gz
16:00 shadowzone If you could just download that and test it for me that'd be awesome.
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16:01 shadowzone You might have to compile it.
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16:10 FourFire VanessaE: I have a question about your texturepack
16:11 VanessaE hm?
16:11 FourFire why is the hand a freaky picture?
16:11 DFeniks joined #minetest
16:11 VanessaE explain
16:11 dhasenan joined #minetest
16:12 FourFire the hand on your texturepack is photorealistic, this puts me off as a player
16:12 VanessaE er, HDX is supposed to be photorealistic all the way through.
16:12 FourFire playerhand, image
16:13 FourFire oh well, uhh can you point me to a 128px-256px texture pack which is not photorealistic and up to date?
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16:15 Zeno` night all
16:16 VanessaE I don't know off the top of my hand what is "up to date" but sphax is nice
16:16 FourFire ok
16:19 VanessaE that reminds me...  just pushed an update for the hand (the wrist was still extruding out, but it's only visible on wide screens.  fixed.)
16:19 iqualfragile_ joined #minetest
16:22 VanessaE there, fixed in smaller sizes too.
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16:32 kaeza VanessaE, Zeno`, I can only test server stuff currently, due to VM fecking crashing if MT opens a display
16:33 kaeza (and too lazy to troubleshoot)
16:34 VanessaE eick
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17:32 rubenwardy joined #minetest
17:32 rubenwardy Hi all!
17:33 ElectronLibre Hello rubenwardy :D!
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17:45 rubenwardy !seen Wuzzy
17:45 MinetestBot rubenwardy: wuzzy was last seen at 2014-11-01 23:24:02 UTC on #minetest-de
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17:48 rubenwardy Just spent half an hour working on a false bug report on https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=47&amp;t=5831
17:48 rubenwardy :(
17:48 kilbith joined #minetest
17:52 iqualfragile i need testing on windows
17:52 iqualfragile https://gist.github.com/iqual​fragile/bc0864e1cc9830d40e0a
17:55 rubenwardy Added stack trace back to the craft recipe checker - https://gist.github.com/rubenwardy/5504537
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17:56 ElectronLibre iqualfragile, are you trying to create a kind of mumble client inside minetest?
17:56 iqualfragile ElectronLibre: no
17:56 ElectronLibre So what is it exactly?
17:58 ElectronLibre Oh, I see, I've read the title xD. I can't help you sorry, not able to compile on Windows.
17:58 Calinou Mumble positional audio support
17:58 Calinou very good
17:58 Calinou make a PR
17:59 iqualfragile Calinou: first i need testing for crappy platforms
17:59 iqualfragile like mac and windows
17:59 iqualfragile would not get accepted otherwise i think
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18:00 Calinou Mac isn't a platform though (-:
18:01 zat Calinou: its a hardware platform =D
18:01 Calinou OS X
18:05 zat That isnt a hardware platform
18:05 iqualfragile darvin
18:05 VanessaE zat: it is if you allow for old enough Mac's.
18:05 VanessaE (as I recall, older versions of OS X were rather specific to the underlying hardware)
18:08 Calinou builds for OS X are quite version-specific
18:08 Calinou a lot of software is 10.8+
18:08 Calinou some is 10.9+
18:08 Calinou thankfully, updates are free of charge now
18:09 iqualfragile its only about shared memory
18:09 iqualfragile don't think that changed
18:09 raffahacks joined #minetest
18:09 VanessaE Calinou: if the OS will run on your hardware.
18:10 shadowzone joined #minetest
18:10 zat I compile my kernel so its hardware specific to my laptop
18:10 Calinou all Macs > 2006 are Intel, so no problem
18:11 VanessaE this old PowerPC-based Mac we have here only runs 10.4.11 at most; support was dropped for PPC after that.
18:12 coagen Calinou: 10.10 apps are supposed to have "continuity" built in
18:12 * sfan5 meows at VanessaE
18:12 VanessaE meow
18:12 coagen Calinou: this works by uploading ur files to apples servers! :D
18:13 * shadowzone meows
18:13 coagen upgrade to 10.10 now! all ur filez are applez
18:14 SylvieLorxu I prefer 7
18:14 SylvieLorxu (What 10.10 are we talking about?)
18:14 SylvieLorxu Oh, OS X
18:14 stakewinner00 joined #minetest
18:15 coagen http://soylentnews.org/commen​ts.pl?sid=4571&amp;cid=110429
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18:18 Calinou VanessaE, you can make it run recent Ubuntu/Debian
18:18 Calinou (Ubuntu is unofficial though)
18:19 zat systemd is so good, I just cant understand the clueless techs that dislike it
18:19 ImQ009 joined #minetest
18:22 VanessaE Calinou: Abe says he's not sure he'd want to..  feels kinda funny to overwrite it; wants to learn OS X a bit first.
18:22 coagen zat: systemDOOM owns you
18:22 coagen zat: if you cant understand, then you may need to do some more reading, if you want to understand that is
18:23 coagen zat: join #debianfork or just read the comments on these articles: http://soylentnews.org/search.pl?query=systemd
18:24 zat coagen: I know a lot of it
18:24 zat and I am right
18:24 coagen zat: also, for myself, I would hardly call 16+ years of linux admin experience, "clueless"
18:25 Krock joined #minetest
18:25 Calinou that's the proble
18:25 Calinou “old fart” (no offense) admins are the primary whiners
18:25 zat Calinou: +1 :P
18:25 Krock Oba di, oba da, let's go on..
18:25 Calinou so a vocal minority is whining about it endlessly – to no avail
18:25 Calinou get up-to-date
18:25 VanessaE Krock: "..life goes on"
18:26 Krock VanessaE, whatver. you see what I mean
18:26 coagen Calinou: https://xkcd.com/743/
18:26 zat while the admins that really find it useful just use it instead of making noise
18:26 Calinou see http://forkfedora.org/ for good satire
18:26 VanessaE thou shalt not misquote The Beatles.
18:26 Krock yeah. *sits onto a dark edge*
18:27 Calinou there are other, more worth-it things to whine on
18:27 coagen Calinou: the experienced admins are not whining. they are doing something about it
18:27 Calinou their so-called “fork” will get no traction – it's predictable
18:27 coagen Calinou: for example #manjaro-openrc is a project to use gentoo's openrc init w/manjaro and it is progressing rapidly
18:28 coagen Calinou: at this point I think they are still waiting to decide if a debian fork is necessary
18:28 Calinou is it the default? nope
18:28 Calinou init system is completely invisible to most users
18:28 Calinou (even some distribution contributors…)
18:28 VanessaE coagen: and THAT will have me a little worried if they fork...
18:28 coagen Calinou: if an init choice is not present in the installer, then seperate isos with sysv will surely be created
18:29 coagen Calinou: incorrect, the init system is what makes things work, when it doesn't users notice
18:29 Calinou forking also divides people
18:29 Calinou see Freeminer
18:29 Calinou intentional anti-competitive practices
18:29 iqualfragile what dumbfolds me is that people fail to understand that systemd is the greatest init system ever
18:29 coagen forking is a necessity sometimes
18:29 coagen iqualfragile: it is not.
18:29 iqualfragile there is literally no problem with systemd as init system
18:29 iqualfragile its logically as fast as it can get, also robust and shit
18:30 Calinou forking is a necessity when software goes proprietary
18:30 zat what I like the most of systemd is that I say what I want and not what I want plus how to have it, normally with a huge bunch of suboptimal and repeated spaghetti code
18:30 Calinou that's the only serious reason I find, also with software being bought by an evil company
18:30 coagen iqualfragile: what is great about injecting 250k+ lines of new, untested, binary code into your init system instead of 30+ years of 10k lines of rock solid code?
18:30 Calinou other reasons are a luxury
18:30 VanessaE I don't give a rat's ass, two shits, a fuck, or a fart whether the init system is SysV, systemd, or something else, as long as there's at least one logical place for me to insert my own startup scripts, and it just works.
18:30 Calinou binary code?
18:31 Calinou VanessaE, a Carbone's rat ass?
18:31 shadowzone joined #minetest
18:31 coagen Calinou: systemd is written in C, so errors can be exponetially greater than errors in sysv, a series of bash scripts
18:31 iqualfragile coagen: hmm, well, maybe that it replaces the ugly mess that startup scripsts are
18:31 VanessaE Calinou: not even a NOSTALGIA GAME rat's ass :)
18:31 iqualfragile and provides a lot more functionallity
18:31 iqualfragile additionally: is that the line count for the whole systemd project?
18:31 coagen zat: suboptimal, or easy to debug?
18:31 iqualfragile or just the init daemon?
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18:32 zat coagen: suboptimal and hard to debug
18:32 coagen RedHat means to force its init system into all other distros, to create one Linux/SystemD... this will doom other distros in a sense as they'll always be trying to catch up to SystemDeath
18:33 zat one thing that I find interesting is that old admins complain about mighthappens and hardly ever about reality
18:33 iqualfragile coagen: shh, you go to #fucksystemd and rant on, ok?
18:33 Krock I'm alone there -^
18:34 coagen iqualfragile: startup scripts are a beautiful melody played by the bash violin, not a crypic mess of un-reusable code that breaks on every version of increasing internal system kleptofication
18:34 shadowzone joined #minetest
18:35 coagen zat: incorrect, bash is easy. if you do not wish to learn it, then enjoy SystemDeath
18:35 Zephlon joined #minetest
18:35 iqualfragile > bash
18:35 iqualfragile > easy
18:35 iqualfragile welly, yes
18:35 coagen zat: incorrect, it has happened in reality, and worse is coming.
18:35 iqualfragile it is easy to just run python
18:35 iqualfragile and do your shit in there
18:35 zat coagen: I dont need a procedural language for stating my non procedural desires
18:35 coagen iqualfragile: come to #debianfork and lets rant
18:35 iqualfragile but creating complex programms in bash is a horrible mess
18:35 Calinou Bash is a rather strange programming language, but does what it should do very well compared to Windows' Batch ;)
18:36 coagen zat: procedural lang's exist for a reason. because they're reliable
18:36 coagen I <3 bash
18:36 sol_invictus it's you rather strange, Calinou :D
18:37 iqualfragile yeah, besides that litle bit where you could make bash run functions defined in env vars
18:37 coagen iqualfragile: right! the beauty of open source code, the community found it and fixed it.
18:38 coagen iqualfragile: right now redhat is funding systemDoom, what happens when the money dries up?
18:38 iqualfragile coagen: well, systemd is open source, too
18:38 iqualfragile also you have not answered my question
18:38 zat coagen: procedural exists for a reason, for procedural algorithms... would you code css in a procedural way for its more reliable? mixing pears and apples that is.
18:38 iqualfragile is the systemd line count for the init daemon or the whole project
18:38 iqualfragile otherwise you are comparing directx to opengl
18:39 coagen iqualfragile: it doesn't matter because the init daemon was the original goal, and now it has eclipsed that and is infecting everything, if it were still only about init, then we could have that discussion
18:39 VanessaE Calinou: strange?!  you heretic!
18:39 stakewinner00 joined #minetest
18:39 VanessaE :)
18:40 VanessaE bash is the perfect language :P
18:40 VanessaE (maybe not)
18:40 iqualfragile coagen: riiiiight, i totally forgot it was impossible to not use the other parts of the systemd project
18:40 iqualfragile oh, wait, i am!
18:40 Calinou AFAIK, Red Hat is far from bankruptcy
18:40 Calinou they could save a lot of money
18:40 coagen I find that only the young and dumb readily jump on the systemDeath bandwagon. may they all get ebola
18:40 stakewinner00 joined #minetest
18:40 coagen :|
18:40 zat coagen: if you dont like that its taking over about too much, then do something about that... attacking its declarative nature is out of context here
18:41 coagen iqualfragile: you know they complie in everything by default, don't act like its not true
18:41 iqualfragile coagen: well, then better go and tell "them" no to, eh?
18:41 coagen iqualfragile: with each consumption of a reliable gnu app, they say "systemd has a new feature!" ... fucking stupid
18:42 iqualfragile coagen: no, dude, you don't seem to understand
18:42 iqualfragile the init daemon is not the same as the systemd-project
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18:42 Calinou usage of GNU stuff is on the decrease, like it or not :/
18:42 iqualfragile just don't use the rest of the systemd project and its ok
18:42 Calinou people are fullfilling their “mission”
18:43 coagen zat: I am doing something about it. We have an open discussion forum in #debianfork about the subject, and we are working on plans of action, #manjaro-openrc already has two isos, a net install and an openbox version, you too can test a SystemD free iso today! :D
18:44 coagen iqualfragile: its not ok, as SystemDeath has infected other projects through coercement other other means of collusion.
18:44 iqualfragile explain
18:44 iqualfragile also i kinda refuse taking you seriously as long as you call things names
18:44 iqualfragile right cootie?
18:45 zat coagen: I have tried them long before SystemD came to existence, and I dont miss them at all
18:45 coagen Calinou: and why is gnu stuff on the decrease? because systemDeath is claiming that their new infections are "features" that replaced reliable gnu apps
18:45 Calinou calling projects or hardware names is unprofessional, avoid doing it
18:45 Calinou coagen, it's not linked to systemd
18:45 Miner_48er joined #minetest
18:45 Calinou but usually, non-GNU stuff ends up being more convenient… or more permissively licensed (not the case of systemd here)
18:45 Calinou (reason 2 being quite prevalent these days)
18:45 coagen iqualfragile: and I kinda refuse to take you seriously because you've drunk the kool-aid
18:46 iqualfragile tl;dr cooties dislikes systemd has no real arguments but is enraged and professional
18:46 iqualfragile can we now move on?
18:46 coagen zat: openrc is amazing, so much better than SystemDeath
18:46 SylvieLorxu OpenRC <3
18:46 Calinou OpenRC is the LXDE of init systems
18:47 coagen Calinou: i'll call it what it is
18:47 SylvieLorxu coagen: Lightweight and does the job?
18:47 coagen SystemDeath, SystemDoom, SystemDestroyer of all things good in the world
18:47 SylvieLorxu *Calinou
18:47 coagen SylvieLorxu: damn straight
18:47 zat coagen: declarative or procedural? if the latter then I dont want
18:47 Calinou SylvieLorxu, does the job… not for everything
18:47 coagen SylvieLorxu ^5
18:48 SylvieLorxu Calinou: What does it not do? It boots up my desktop, what more should an init system do?
18:48 SylvieLorxu Well, enable you to restart deamons and so, does that too
18:48 Calinou not enough flexibility for some admins
18:49 Calinou desktop user's usage of init systems has nothing to do with a server
18:49 coagen iqualfragile: the only reason I spoke up was because zat said "13:19 < zat> systemd is so good, I just cant understand the clueless techs that dislike it"
18:49 SylvieLorxu ...Like?
18:49 coagen iqualfragile: I decided I must respond to it
18:49 SylvieLorxu The only thing that's not flexible enough for me is systemd
18:49 zat a good list of benefits of systemd https://bbs.archlinux.org/view​topic.php?pid=1149530#p1149530
18:49 SylvieLorxu zat: a list of some of the bad of systemd: http://boycottsystemd.org/
18:50 coagen Calinou: I asked the #manjaro-openrc guys for a xen script for openrc, they had it done in 2 hrs. I still haven't had time to test it and that was three days ago
18:50 SylvieLorxu It ever corrupts your log files
18:50 SylvieLorxu Just, amazing
18:50 SylvieLorxu Reimplementing things in such a way they get broken that they couldn't possibly break in before
18:50 coagen Calinou: reliable init systems that do the same thing and attempt to adhere to a specific set of goals is just as important on the server as the desktop
18:51 zat SylvieLorxu: looks more like a compilation of ideological arguments
18:51 SylvieLorxu zat: Have you even read it?
18:51 SylvieLorxu You must be a fast reader
18:51 zat SylvieLorxu: I read it like half a year ago
18:51 coagen zat: a good list of how those are falacies: http://judecnelson.blogspot.com/201​4/09/systemd-biggest-fallacies.html
18:52 SylvieLorxu "Journal corruption" also sounds very "ideological"
18:52 SylvieLorxu "6. systemd's size makes it a single point of failure. As of this writing, systemd has had 9 CVE reports, since its inception in March 201010. So far, this may not seem like that much, but its essential and overbearing nature will make it a juicy target for crackers, as it is far smaller in breadth than the Linux kernel itself, yet seemingly just as critical."
18:52 SylvieLorxu ^ That's horrible
18:52 SylvieLorxu s/201010/2010/
18:53 zat I still have to see how any of those alleged issues happen, never ever had a single issue with systemd... could it be that the rest world uses another software called the same?
18:53 coagen zat, iqualfragile, Calinou: do you want your system hacked?
18:53 coagen if so then use systemDeath
18:53 SylvieLorxu 9 CVEs is really bad
18:53 VanessaE zat: the rest of the world gets windows viruses.  yet there's always that ONE guy who doesn't.
18:53 zat or someone tell me how to reproduce a bug
18:53 VanessaE do viruses for windows exist or not?
18:53 Calinou systemd is always in development
18:53 coagen zat: read the CVEs, THATS WHAT THEY'RE FORE
18:54 coagen *for
18:54 Calinou like most free software projects, like Wikipedia
18:54 Calinou it is a stability tradeoff in order to be always able to be changed
18:54 Calinou you don't want completely frozen software, do you?
18:54 SylvieLorxu https://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bi​n/cvekey.cgi?keyword=systemd <- There's 7 bugs here they have managed to make that allowed people to take over your PC in 4 years
18:54 SylvieLorxu That's a lot
18:55 coagen Calinou: right, one day a systemDeath system has 8 CVE's and one day it has 11+, such great software choice!
18:55 coagen Calinou: no one wants frozen software, what people want is reliable, safe software, that has a clear set of goals
18:55 iqualfragile no remote problems
18:55 coagen and stops at those goals
18:55 coagen and no more
18:55 iqualfragile 90% not in init
18:56 iqualfragile no problem there
18:56 iqualfragile or actually, there is not a single problem in the init, is there
18:56 VanessaE bbl
18:56 coagen iqualfragile: ok, so then 90% in the "features" that for some reason replace standards adhering gnu apps that did not need to be replaced
18:57 iqualfragile coagen: yeah
18:57 iqualfragile see, no problem
18:57 SylvieLorxu That's the whole problem with systemd
18:57 SylvieLorxu The unnecessary bloat
18:57 SylvieLorxu Making it an easy target
18:57 coagen iqualfragile: incorect, that is the problem, those features are enabled by default
18:57 zat omfg there were some bugs, nobody should ever use that software ewer again. :P
18:57 coagen iqualfragile: are you not paying attention or something?
18:57 SylvieLorxu Hell, it has a BUILT IN WEB SERVER
18:57 SylvieLorxu How do they come up with these things?!
18:58 coagen zat: bugs are important to resolve, SystemDeath has only added more bugs when before there was a stable init platform
18:58 zat thats why I sometimes like throwing flames... theres always someone that will ignite. LOL
18:59 Calinou even games have CVEs
18:59 coagen zat: so you're a troll then?
18:59 Calinou PulseAudio had a lot of bugs too; users reporting bugs (and not just whining about them) helped fix it
18:59 zat coagen: probably :)
18:59 coagen Calinou: yes, of course
18:59 SylvieLorxu I don't know of any game that allows people to delete random files of other users and so
18:59 Calinou now PulseAudio is good
18:59 SylvieLorxu PulseAudio still doesn't work on my desktop
18:59 Calinou it's a necessity to use some preliminary-state software, sometimes
18:59 SylvieLorxu It's pathetic
19:00 coagen Calinou: PA is still shit, several distros refuse to package it, and BSD's stay the hell away from it
19:00 zat SylvieLorxu: why blaming the software?
19:00 coagen SylvieLorxu: actually there were some bugs in quake that allowed stuff like that
19:00 SylvieLorxu zat: Because it's the software that's not working
19:00 SylvieLorxu ALSA works fine
19:01 SylvieLorxu lol, clear troll
19:01 zat SylvieLorxu: what if its your fault?
19:01 SylvieLorxu "Why blame the software for the software not working?"
19:01 SylvieLorxu Haha
19:01 coagen lol
19:01 zat its common between certain admins to ever blame selectively.
19:01 * coagen puts a SystemDunce hat on zat, Calinou, and iqualfragile
19:02 * coagen dances
19:02 alexxs joined #minetest
19:02 Jordach joined #minetest
19:02 zat well, you cant teach new tricks to old dogs...
19:03 * coagen pushes the button to start the SystemDummy car crash test!
19:03 zat the resistant to change stays in the road
19:03 coagen rofly
19:03 zat sooner or later
19:04 coagen no, SystemDummys crash and make things bad for everyone else
19:04 coagen thats the whole point
19:04 zat and by the way of https://cve.mitre.org/cgi-bi​n/cvekey.cgi?keyword=systemd
19:04 zat -> https://cve.mitre.org/cgi-b​in/cvekey.cgi?keyword=init
19:04 coagen if you don't care about the choice of init system, then you won't care about other important things
19:05 zat such as getting the work done? :P
19:05 coagen thats why you need to pull over and stop before you crash into the wall of SystemDoom
19:05 SylvieLorxu zat: The first result is already not related to an init system
19:06 Calinou <SylvieLorxu> ALSA works fine
19:06 coagen zat: exactly, ready the wikipedia page about the original sysv init, a single file, rc.conf. it did just that. got everything up an running so people could get work done
19:06 Calinou management of multiple sound sources is poor
19:06 Calinou good GUI applications are scarce
19:06 Calinou there are reasons as to why PulseAudio was made, like systemd – see its Wikipedia page
19:06 Calinou describes it well
19:06 coagen Calinou: then improve upon working code, dont re-invent the wheel!!
19:06 Calinou USB headsets and such are also on the rise
19:06 Calinou they have their own built-in sound card
19:06 Calinou sometimes you have to recode something entirely
19:07 Calinou if we didn't do this for Minetest, we wouldn't have Freetype fonts for instance
19:07 Calinou or meshnodes
19:07 coagen zat, Calinou: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Init
19:07 zat systemd: "it is hotplug capable: systemd assumes that all resources may appear and dissapear at any time"
19:07 tadni` joined #minetest
19:07 zat try achieve that with bash scripts
19:07 zat and coordinate a big tree of dependant proccesses
19:08 coagen Calinou: of course, but that something, should be preceeded by a clear set of goals and standards, then those implemented, and nothing more
19:10 coagen zat: *nix systems have devices as files, so of course they may be added/removed, and udev helped to make this dynamic
19:10 zat but I want to declare the architecture of my services...
19:11 coagen zat: but since being absorbed into SystemDeath, the gentoo project has reconised this problem and now maintains eudev, which is used by manjaro-openrc
19:11 zat not to code it in bash
19:11 Cacatoes joined #minetest
19:11 coagen zat: openrc init does not make you code it in bash, but allows you to fall back safely onto sysv init as it does not run as pid 1
19:12 coagen zat: whereas systemDeath requires it be pid 1 and refuses to function any other way, so there is no fallback, no safety
19:12 zat I wonder now... why isnt a init daemon like systemd a module for the kernel?
19:13 coagen zat: it may be in the future if RedHat and the SystemDerps have their way, I would not be surprised if they fork the kernel
19:13 coagen zat: to be honest, I hope they do, and leave the rest of the world, who want a stable, reliable, functioning system, alone.
19:14 zat joined #minetest
19:19 zat a module for that would be quite stable
19:19 Krock !seen Esteban
19:19 MinetestBot Krock: esteban was last seen at 2014-05-20 23:46:41 UTC on #minetest
19:19 Krock !seen Esteban_
19:19 MinetestBot Krock: esteban_ was last seen at 2013-12-11 19:30:46 UTC on #minetest
19:19 coagen zat: right, with the history of the SystemD project and its ever fluxuating functionality? lol
19:19 Krock !tell Esteban :< 666 posts
19:19 MinetestBot Krock: I'll pass that on when Esteban is around
19:20 zat I am talking about a declarative init daemon
19:20 zat btw, why its bad that systemd has pid  1?
19:21 Jousway joined #minetest
19:22 coagen zat: <14:21 < zat> btw, why its bad that systemd has pid  1?> .... http://judecnelson.blogspot.com/201​4/09/systemd-biggest-fallacies.html
19:22 zat coagen: care to explain?
19:24 coagen zat: i'll not paste it here, we've discussed it enough
19:24 coagen zat: if you want, join #debianfork and we'll discuss further
19:25 coagen zat: thanks for giving me this oportunity to help educate others on the dangers of SystemD
19:26 shadowzone joined #minetest
19:26 coagen zat: I'm the only one there active anyway... :|
19:27 zat see minetest people? you all just got educated!
19:28 * ElectronLibre is happy to get educated.
19:29 hmmmm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UIz48gG5hV4
19:29 ElectronLibre !title
19:29 MinetestBot ElectronLibre: Saturday night fever in Russia - YouTube
19:30 Krock hmmmm, a a a staying alive¨!
19:31 Krock oh noes
19:31 * Krock facedesks
19:32 Krock purrfect. YT loads days again..
19:36 exio4 joined #minetest
19:52 rubenwardy y are you names y?
19:52 rubenwardy y are you named y?
19:52 y y not
19:53 * ElectronLibre looks at y and say : "I like this nickname".
19:53 y thanks
19:53 y I know I am a beauty
19:55 sol_invictus hmmmm, lol'd at the video
19:57 Chicken_shadow joined #minetest
20:01 Krock http://i.imgur.com/5O8nuky.png
20:01 Amaz My eyes!
20:01 Krock trololo
20:02 ElectronLibre Too many colors to me x-x
20:03 Krock only 260
20:03 Chicken_shadow holy...shittake mushrooms.
20:03 Chicken_shadow My eyes fell out of my head.
20:03 Krock !c 6**3
20:03 MinetestBot 216
20:03 Krock 216 actually
20:04 Calinou yes
20:04 Krock I could use #RRGGBB too... would be interesting
20:04 Calinou I know 2³ by heart
20:04 Calinou 6³ I meant
20:04 Krock Y?
20:04 Calinou I know powers of 2 up to 20 (and 2^24) by heart :P
20:04 Krock k
20:05 Krock !c 1**999999
20:05 MinetestBot 1
20:05 Krock I know powers of 1
20:05 Krock and 0
20:05 y I like that
20:05 Calinou heh, you got Axew's name
20:05 Amaz !c 0**583828
20:05 MinetestBot 0
20:11 shadowzone joined #minetest
20:28 hmmmm I opened a company selling landmines disguised as prayer mats.
20:28 hmmmm Prophets are going through the roof.
20:29 ElectronLibre What?! xD
20:30 kilbith can I be your employee, hmmmm ?
20:31 ElectronLibre You're gonna explode kilbith, be carefull with these landmines...
20:32 kilbith but it's a noble cause
20:33 Amaz So, when you used a prayer mat, you would be blown up?
20:33 hmmmm lol
20:33 kilbith you have not understand
20:34 hmmmm just a silly pun
20:34 ElectronLibre You would be blown up if you leave the mat.
20:34 shadowzone joined #minetest
20:35 ElectronLibre (would? No, you will be blown up when you will leave the mat)
20:40 Erthome joined #minetest
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20:53 hisforever joined #minetest
20:53 hisforever changed puters
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21:19 MinetestBot [git] ShadowNinja -> minetest/minetest_game: Fix fire blocking sunlight dcce6e9 http://git.io/7ynmqw (2014-11-04T16:17:56-05:00)
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21:27 MinetestBot [git] ShadowNinja -> minetest/master-server: Fix locking of removeServer a835362 http://git.io/fQM-Fw (2014-11-04T16:25:44-05:00)
21:28 * ElectronLibre cannot understand why y.
21:29 y y not!
21:30 ElectronLibre You've joined the private club of the bottom-of-the-list nicknames ^^.
21:31 Amaz Only in 4th place.
21:32 y I have nicks from all the spectrum
21:33 ElectronLibre Yes from A to Z I guess.
21:33 kilbith !seen BlockMen
21:33 MinetestBot kilbith: blockmen was last seen at 2014-10-25 12:47:39 UTC on #minetest-de
21:33 y e, k, i, l, h, y, n
21:35 Amaz Generally, threatening to close the pull requests makes devs who like it stand up and merge ;)
21:35 Amaz kilbith ↑
21:36 kilbith i dont like to threat the devs...
21:36 Amaz I did it for the dungeons pull, merged the same day ;P
21:37 Viper168 joined #minetest
21:37 Guest86013 huh?
21:40 CraigyDavi joined #minetest
21:41 ElectronLibre Amaz, it's not a very good way to make code merged... :|
21:41 Amaz Nope.
21:41 Amaz But, it works :D
21:41 kilbith not anymore now ;)
21:44 ElectronLibre Devs are not kids with just the privilege to push and merge code... :|
21:44 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
21:45 Amaz The thing was, two devs had approved it, and it was still being left to rot...
21:45 freelikegnu remember when all the "good" shampoos had jojoba in them?
21:45 ElectronLibre Amaz, I see.
21:46 ElectronLibre freelikegnu, it's was not a long time ago. Why?
21:46 hisforever how do I clear this screen of old text?
21:47 ElectronLibre hisforever, /clean
21:47 CraigyDavi or /clear
21:47 ElectronLibre Oops, thank you CraigyDavi.
21:48 freelikegnu jojoa1997's nick just caused a flashback
21:48 hisforever thanks that worked
21:48 jojoa1997 freelikegnu like what?
21:48 freelikegnu here some more text that will be old soon
21:48 hisforever lol
21:48 Matrixiumn joined #minetest
21:49 freelikegnu I dont need this text either
21:49 ElectronLibre hisforever, you can also try the /ignore command on users, like freelikegnu x).
21:49 freelikegnu jojoa1997: like GNU... I should fix my nick
21:50 jojoa1997 no i meant what was the flashback [16:48:04] <freelikegnu> jojoa1997's nick just caused a flashback
21:50 hisforever well its kind of nice to have it up to go back too just in case you forgot something lol
21:51 ElectronLibre jojoa1997, I think he remembered about shampoos containing jojoba.
21:52 FreeLikeGNU jojoa1997: you came into the channel, and I read your nick and immediately thought of some of the shampoo commercials I saw as a kid (about 30 years ago) and the shampoos would advertise the ingredient Jojoba promoting "healthier" hair
21:52 y joined #minetest
21:52 FreeLikeGNU not sure how you make a dead thing healthy
21:53 FreeLikeGNU though I'm sure hair has a microbiome that requires some kind of nourishment
21:54 FreeLikeGNU minetest could probably benefit from jojoba
21:54 kilbith with all those chimical components, the hairs become more dependant of that 'nourishment'
21:54 FreeLikeGNU kilbith: agreed
21:54 iqualfragile anybody willing to test a patch on windows?
21:55 FreeLikeGNU I stopped having acne problems when I started rinsing my face with water instead of using all kinds of goofy soaps and medicated cleansers
21:55 kilbith i dont use industrial shampoos since years, and my hairs are not anymore 'oily'
21:56 FreeLikeGNU I like the natures gate shampoo... herbal, makes good body wash too
21:56 kilbith same for toothpaste, i prefer use the clay now
21:56 iqualfragile nah, i need to use a proper shampoo, to keep my hair nice and glorious
21:57 FreeLikeGNU charcoal works well too
21:57 FreeLikeGNU disclaimer: I have less hair on my head then elsewhere
21:57 kilbith charcoal is more coarse, less refined and less abrasive than clay
21:58 kilbith but less expensive and more DIY-able
21:58 DuDraig joined #minetest
21:58 FreeLikeGNU I keep a cedar chip under my arm
21:58 FreeLikeGNU keeps the moths aways
21:59 hisforever lol
22:00 hisforever have more hair on my chest than on head hehe
22:01 FreeLikeGNU my chest has like three or four lonely hairs
22:02 hisforever lol
22:02 FreeLikeGNU I thought about naming them but I dont want to get too attatched in case I lose them
22:02 kilbith heh
22:03 hisforever I love my manjaro linux os no viruses
22:03 hisforever feel your nuts jk
22:03 FreeLikeGNU somedays windows will go away
22:03 ElectronLibre And ALL the viruses will get recoded for GNU/Linux :s
22:04 carlvelleri joined #minetest
22:04 FreeLikeGNU but at least the patch will happen the next day
22:04 FreeLikeGNU script kiddies wont be able to keep up
22:04 rcmaehl joined #minetest
22:04 rcmaehl joined #minetest
22:05 y http://xkcd.com/1180/
22:06 FreeLikeGNU maybe everyone is not looking at every part of the kernel all the time, but I think it would be really hard to keep any exploit intentionally secret for long
22:06 FreeLikeGNU even ones that may have accidentally existed for years
22:06 * ElectronLibre agrees with y
22:07 y I have to say "all viruses recoded for linux" is in the first circle
22:09 FreeLikeGNU now what about virii that exploits a WINE installation...
22:10 FreeLikeGNU its a great vector, because you can crash the executable easily and it will seem not unusual to the user, no?
22:10 Zebetus joined #minetest
22:10 carlvelleri thanks FreelikeGNU now i want some wine...............
22:11 FreeLikeGNU there are lots of known and documented ways that windows programs crash in wine that may never be fixed
22:11 carlvelleri true
22:12 kilbith FreeLikeGNU : Wine doesn't have an access to the kernel/drivers
22:12 FreeLikeGNU and many times folks use a nocd executable just to get the app to run in WINE
22:13 FreeLikeGNU you can still do all kinds of stuff without access to the kernel or root
22:13 FreeLikeGNU botnet node for instance?
22:13 FreeLikeGNU you can gather all kinds of personal information as well
22:13 ElectronLibre left #minetest
22:14 Valley_Cat joined #minetest
22:14 kilbith not if your personnal folder is crypted
22:14 iqualfragile kilbith: well, yes, absolutely
22:15 iqualfragile when you are logged in your personal folder is uncrypted
22:15 FreeLikeGNU how many people in your life encrypt their data.  also, what do you do with your encrypted data when you want to view it?
22:17 FreeLikeGNU good thing we dont have to run minetest in WINE :D
22:17 coagen encrypt all the things
22:17 coagen its the only way to stop spying
22:18 FreeLikeGNU unfortunately that is not the case coagen
22:19 coagen FreeLikeGNU: check w/RMS plz kthx
22:19 FreeLikeGNU other folks have access to your information, tapping them is probably the more likeley route of someone interested in spying on you I think
22:19 kilbith you can also isolate the system folders of wine elsewhere...
22:20 NemoMT joined #minetest
22:22 H-H-H joined #minetest
22:22 FreeLikeGNU RMS would tell you that you will never know you are being spied on because the techology you use has proprietary firmware and backdoors
22:23 coagen FreeLikeGNU: Coreboot FTW!
22:23 FreeLikeGNU and you must avoid leaving your cell phone on
22:23 FreeLikeGNU if you must have one
22:23 FreeLikeGNU he see the problem down to the hardware level
22:24 coagen FreeLikeGNU: RMS doesn't carry a cell phone
22:24 lycide joined #minetest
22:24 FreeLikeGNU iirc I heard in an interview that he does, but only turns it on when it is needed.... will have to get source..
22:25 kilbith don't care of spying if you're not a terrorist ™
22:26 FreeLikeGNU ah he does state that he does not use one of his own..
22:26 coagen kilbith: only terrorists encrypt!
22:26 FreeLikeGNU https://stallman.org/rms-lifestyle.html
22:26 Scall joined #minetest
22:26 iqualfragile joined #minetest
22:28 kilbith wow, rms speaks french
22:28 * kilbith feels proud
22:28 FreeLikeGNU but as you can see that he will use another persons card or phone
22:28 FreeLikeGNU and he thinks that he avoids being tracked in this way
22:29 FreeLikeGNU at best he may avoid spam and targeted advertising
22:31 FreeLikeGNU also he says he would prefer to take the train over flying but asks us to boycot amtrak because the require ID
22:32 FreeLikeGNU I dont really understand that logic
22:32 coagen FreeLikeGNU: yeah... that seems bad :\
22:32 FreeLikeGNU because he says: I have a credit card, but I use it as rarely as possible. Effectively, only for airline tickets, car rental, and hotel checkin ? because they demand identification anyway.
22:33 FreeLikeGNU you dont even have to use a credit card for a train ticket iir
22:33 FreeLikeGNU also I dont think you have to show ID when you board a train... most of the time you just get in and sit and post your stub above the seat
22:34 FreeLikeGNU sometimes you just show your stub as you board
22:34 coagen Whats funny is that they have all these sec mechanisms to attempt to verify id, and then some random guy figures out how to print fake boarding passes right from their website... (that was a few years ago, but these vulnerabilities don't go away forever)
22:35 coagen they just come and go over time
22:35 FreeLikeGNU I dont think boycotting an already struggling subsidized railway is going to make it better
22:36 FreeLikeGNU except to make it die completely and the whole rail system gets upgraded (in my dreams)
22:36 coagen FreeLikeGNU: google "why is amtrak shitty" fun results
22:37 FreeLikeGNU hehe
22:37 coagen a quote: "Riding Amtrak is like riding a Greyhound bus for the cost of an airline ticket."
22:37 coagen damn
22:37 FreeLikeGNU I've taken long train rides on amtrak and had had several inconvenient things happen, but I still enjoy and find it less stressful than dealing with airports (I like thy actuall flying part)
22:38 coagen FreeLikeGNU: heh, if I had train access daily.. would use it
22:38 FreeLikeGNU on a train, you can leave the smelly person you are sitting with and enjoy the rid in the obs car
22:38 coagen FreeLikeGNU: was in DC once a few years ago, the subway there is so easy to use
22:38 FreeLikeGNU cant to that on a bus of plane
22:38 coagen hah, true
22:40 FreeLikeGNU I lived in Chicago for over 10 years, moved from LA and drove to chicago when I moved... my car was parked on the street for months then I let it get towed as I did not need it
22:40 FreeLikeGNU should have sold it, but thought I might need it... lame
22:41 coagen hah
22:43 FreeLikeGNU it was great to take the "L" around town
22:44 FreeLikeGNU no car payment, insurance, parking, tickets, maintenance, gas, etc
22:44 FreeLikeGNU I do miss that
22:45 FreeLikeGNU I really hope rail transit is more popular than cars in minetest
22:47 iqualfragile in germany we have trains everywhere
22:47 iqualfragile like literally every city is connected by train
22:47 iqualfragile and most villages, too
22:48 FreeLikeGNU very smart
22:50 FreeLikeGNU I wish I had a train pass that I could use in US, Canada and Mexico and just travel whenever
22:50 FreeLikeGNU like you have in Europe
22:51 iqualfragile well, its not cheap
22:51 FreeLikeGNU maybe there will be such a system for self driving cars in the bizzarro future US
22:51 FreeLikeGNU cars are very expensive, I know that
22:52 iqualfragile the bahncard 100 which allows you to ride all trains for free for a year costs 4.090€
22:52 FreeLikeGNU thats less than the yearly cost of a car, even when car is paid for
22:53 iqualfragile yes, and it allows you to use busses and "street-trains" in many cities
22:54 iqualfragile also includes price reductions on rental cars
22:56 FreeLikeGNU super bargain in my book
22:57 Zephlon joined #minetest
22:57 FreeLikeGNU i think a car might be cheaper if you were driving a bunch of adult family members around.... maybe
22:57 iqualfragile ah, yes, you can also bring your children for free
22:58 shadowzone joined #minetest
22:59 FreeLikeGNU for instance if I visit LA from SF by myself I get on a plane for about the same price as drive, and I save a few hours both ways, but putting a family of two adults and three older kids on a plane or train becomes FAR more expensive than road trip
23:00 FreeLikeGNU apologies for completely hijacking this channel with off topic banter
23:00 iqualfragile lel
23:00 iqualfragile this is #minetest
23:00 iqualfragile there is no ontopic
23:01 OWNSyouAll joined #minetest
23:04 coagen hehe
23:05 LittleJoe joined #minetest
23:05 coagen iqualfragile: as much as we disagreed, know that I enjoyied our dicussion about systemD earlier
23:05 iqualfragile i was just trolling
23:05 coagen iqualfragile: haha
23:06 FreeLikeGNU could minetest not benefit from systemd integration?
23:06 iqualfragile FreeLikeGNU: it could, absolutely
23:06 coagen lol
23:06 iqualfragile to be more precise: socket activation support
23:06 iqualfragile that would allow to start and stop servers as needed
23:06 iqualfragile and thereby allow a single server to serve potentially hundreds of maps
23:07 FreeLikeGNU fortunately minetest seems pretty well behved when idle
23:07 iqualfragile yes, but it still eats memory
23:07 iqualfragile not much, but a bit
23:08 FreeLikeGNU I guess I would worry about spikes if I was running a bunch of server
23:09 shadowzone joined #minetest
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23:10 LittleJoe hey cg72 : )
23:10 cg72 hi
23:10 FreeLikeGNU as there are spikes as soon as someone is active and exploring anyways
23:12 iqualfragile FreeLikeGNU: yeah, but you can put the daemons in cgroups and ignore the spikes
23:16 OldCoder viewing_range_nodes_max = 200
23:16 OldCoder Does that have any effect when it is in a server side conf file?
23:25 FreeLikeGNU iqualfragile: that is cool
23:26 FreeLikeGNU I suppose that one could also have one server binary running many concurrent worlds
23:26 FreeLikeGNU as a webserver or many other servers work
23:28 FreeLikeGNU put your world folder in the "active" servers folder and it starts up when someone taps that address:port
23:28 FreeLikeGNU would be pretty sweet
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23:46 FreeLikeGNU welcome back
23:47 iqualfragile OldCoder: not that i know of
23:47 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
23:47 iqualfragile but you can limit the range of sent nodes

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