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IRC log for #minetest, 2014-09-17

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:10 erlehmann i was told this web page has a server list but it has not http://minetest.net/servers
00:10 erlehmann where is the server list?
00:12 erlehmann there is no server list :(
00:16 friti I see servers on that page!
00:17 friti And there is a link to http://servers.minetest.net/ which has even more servers
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00:24 hmmmm sfan5:  I recall the other day you mentioned something about .mts format being inefficient for large spaces?  what do you mean by that?
00:25 Sokomine hmmm: perhaps he was talking about importing entire mc maps
00:25 paramat Good grief so many newbies :) newbies, if you want to experience mapgen v7 with 9 biomes try this mod, start a new world with mapgen v7 selected, enable the mod in 'configuration' https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=11&t=7366
00:28 Sokomine i experienced some problems recently in combination with snow and mg_villages. somehow, schematics placed (via place_schematic) got lost in combination with snow. perhaps i ought to use voxelmanip only and not mix both methods
00:31 erlehmann girlfriend and first-time minetest player „i believe one of the success factors of these games is that you can destroy things“ (while hacking a tree to bits)
00:31 erlehmann i just saw the shader stuff on her computer
00:31 erlehmann awesome that it looks nice on her computer but still works on mine with all options off!
00:31 paramat Sokomine, set dependancies to run snow mod first? perhaps mapgen object vm is overwriting changes made before it
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00:33 Sokomine paramt: i had a soft-dependency on snow already. it worked fine for the voxelmanip based things. only the schematic-based buildings got lost somehow
00:34 Sokomine erlehmann: poor tree :-)
00:34 Sokomine erlehmann: give her some moretrees ,-)
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00:38 RealBadAngel paramat, what highlighting has to do with HUD?
00:44 Cylus joined #minetest
00:44 paramat hi RBA
00:47 paramat "Players will not want this highlighting on all the time the HUD is on"
00:48 nupacloud So.
00:48 nupacloud World 1. Punched a tree.
00:48 nupacloud I'm... optimistic.
00:49 nupacloud Anyone know if the weird choppy movement is my machine or just the current state of the engine?
00:51 Djohaal i'm tempted to say current state of the engine, because my compy is qutie high end and still is choppy
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00:53 tb01110100 Goodness gracious, how deep is a minetest world? O.o
00:53 VanessaE 30927 meters.
00:53 tb01110100 O.o
00:54 tb01110100 o.O
00:54 tb01110100 that's big
00:54 VanessaE rage, -30927 to +30912, with water being at 0/+1.
00:54 paramat choppiness? try reducing your view distance to around 64, and/or turn off some visual settings in the menu
00:54 nupacloud Where are the settings?
00:54 tb01110100 I'm assuming that 1 block = 1 m?
00:54 VanessaE nupacloud: press + and -
00:54 VanessaE tb01110100: yeah
00:54 nupacloud Oh man, you set water level to 0 in the coordinate system?
00:54 nupacloud I like that.
00:55 VanessaE mmhmm
00:55 paramat MT worlds are cubic (cubic cosmology), so 31000 in every direction
00:55 nupacloud About to join a modded server for the first time. Have not made any attempt to install the mods myself. Interested to see how this goes.
00:55 VanessaE you don't have to.
00:55 tb01110100 ooh, that's cool
00:55 nupacloud Does it just download them from the server?
00:56 VanessaE the server will send you the content automatically.
00:56 nupacloud Hell. Fucking. Yes.
00:56 VanessaE the "assets" as everyone seems to call them
00:56 VanessaE the code runs on the server, all your client has to worry about is displaying the world and whatever happens therein.
00:57 VanessaE (including your own actions of course)
00:57 nupacloud So, I'm checking this out mainly because the modding community is jumping ship WAY too pre-emptively and I want to learn this game on the offchance some of them move here instead.
00:57 VanessaE nupacloud: some of them already are moving here apparently :)
00:57 VanessaE welcome aboard :)
00:57 tb01110100 am I correct in saying that "/set -n time_speed 0" makes the days = 1 irl day?
00:58 nupacloud There are some other games that look like they'd love those modders to come work for them, but they're all ditching the nice organized block layout in favor of something with more polygons
00:58 VanessaE I think time_speed 1 will do that
00:58 VanessaE 0 stops time entirely.
00:58 tb01110100 ah
00:58 tb01110100 that makes sense
00:58 paramat erlehmann, my noonrealm mod has code to change gravity per-player depending on their co-ords
00:59 tb01110100 what is a "tod"
00:59 VanessaE tb01110100: a "tod"?  link please?
00:59 erlehmann flowers
00:59 erlehmann what did flowers do?
00:59 jojoa1997 is Tod the name for the player
00:59 VanessaE tb01110100: normally that would mean time-of-day
00:59 jojoa1997 no nvm that is Sam II
00:59 tb01110100 from the wiki:
00:59 jojoa1997 and back
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00:59 tb01110100 VanessaE: oh, ok
00:59 jojoa1997 erlehmann flowers give flowers
01:00 erlehmann and other stuff?
01:00 tb01110100 minetest is actually pretty darn coll
01:00 tb01110100 *cool
01:00 VanessaE flowers also are used to make dyes
01:00 jojoa1997 So VanessaE is the flood of people from MC coming over?
01:00 erlehmann VanessaE how to make dyes?
01:00 VanessaE erlehmann: just place a flower in the craft grid
01:00 tb01110100 I'm going to have to pay a little more attention to minetest
01:00 jojoa1997 Hehe Overcraft Origins finally has a real point
01:01 VanessaE jojoa1997: a few here and there to start with but haven't you noticed we have lots of new users in here?
01:01 jojoa1997 just 2?
01:01 VanessaE tb01110100: try Dreambuilder some time - it's a game mode for Minetest :)
01:01 erlehmann VanessaE cool. what can you dye with it?
01:01 VanessaE jojoa1997: more like 10 or so I've seen
01:01 jojoa1997 I was busy getting fatter and watching informational youtube videos ;)
01:01 tb01110100 VanessaE: still really new to mt, so still not sure what a game mode is
01:02 jojoa1997 there is no game mode in MT
01:02 VanessaE tb01110100: I will explain later.  just ask when you're ready to delve into that
01:02 jojoa1997 what do you mean?
01:02 VanessaE jojoa1997: subgames are sometimes called game modes also.
01:02 jojoa1997 WTF
01:02 VanessaE erlehmann: wool in the default game, lots of mods use them also
01:03 jojoa1997 I prefered 1.75 years ago when minetest_game was the main game and everything was SIMPLE
01:03 erlehmann VanessaE where do i get wool?
01:03 erlehmann are there sheeps?
01:03 * jojoa1997 sees MS buy MT in a year
01:03 VanessaE jojoa1997: everything is as simple as can be.  you want simple, play on my Nostalgia server ;)
01:03 jojoa1997 erlehmann you plant cotton seeds
01:03 VanessaE erlehmann: from cotton actually.
01:03 jojoa1997 VanessaE no I mean the community
01:03 VanessaE in minetest, cotton == wool
01:03 jojoa1997 no
01:03 VanessaE jojoa1997: well the community was bound to grow :P
01:03 jojoa1997 cotton --> Wool
01:04 nupacloud okay, question: how do I scroll chat? I can only see like the last 5 lines and it's annoying to keep up with
01:04 VanessaE jojoa1997: apparently they're directly equivalent now, ask pilzadam.
01:04 jojoa1997 nupacloud in what Minetest?
01:04 VanessaE nupacloud: press F10
01:04 VanessaE nupacloud: then use page up/down or mouse wheel I think also works
01:04 tb01110100 oh man, I love the debug options
01:05 tb01110100 MOAR debug options!
01:05 jojoa1997 nupacloud be careful with F10; It has been known to crash games
01:05 tb01110100 MWAHAHA
01:05 VanessaE tb01110100: yup.  check debug.txt too :D
01:05 Djohaal nupacloud: which modders jumped off the ship so far?
01:05 VanessaE jojoa1997: not anymore.  that's LOOOOONG since fixed.
01:05 Djohaal I'm not paying attention to the MC modding scene
01:05 jojoa1997 MC modding is fun for like the 5 minutes I play around with the mod
01:05 jojoa1997 then I go back to making slime tnt cannons
01:06 Djohaal modded MC is fun when you have at least 100 mods
01:06 jojoa1997 Oh VanessaE I am learning python now. I will finally be able to make python scripts for hexchat
01:06 jojoa1997 Djohaal not when your computer cannot handle it
01:06 Djohaal yeah usally mine does
01:06 Djohaal I just can't bear to play vanilla anymore. It is so boring and dumb
01:06 VanessaE Djohaal: try Dreambuilder.  79 mods in that subgame, over 11,400 defined items :D
01:07 Djohaal oh my
01:07 VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=15&t=9196
01:07 * jojoa1997 gives Djohaal  The Holy Sword Excaliber
01:07 jojoa1997 thats a new one :)
01:07 Djohaal that is an impressive mod ecology actually
01:08 erlehmann thank you VanessaE jojoa1997
01:08 Djohaal that's about as big as when modloader first came out, I'm impressed
01:08 VanessaE you're quite welcome erlehmann
01:08 Cylus jojoa1997: Sweet! Python is a great language to know.
01:09 jojoa1997 Djohaal you should play Dreambuilder with VanessaE's HD pack 512x ... VanessaE really? "If you can imagine it, you can build it." I can't code what I imagine!
01:09 Djohaal 512x? meh
01:09 Djohaal I prefer lo-res textures
01:09 Djohaal not as low as minecraft shitty x16, but x32 is a sweet spot
01:09 VanessaE HDX is available in multiple sizes.
01:09 jojoa1997 HDX shouild have 4px res VanessaE
01:09 jojoa1997 no 1x res
01:10 VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=4&t=1583
01:10 jojoa1997 wait ox
01:10 jojoa1997 that works
01:10 VanessaE 16/32/64/128/256/512
01:10 Cylus VanessaE: Do you have to redraw it at each resolution, or are you able to mostly just resize your textures from the highest resolution?
01:10 jojoa1997 VanessaE pretty much I miss the hours of talking about cats and fluffy squirels that made Minetest so funny
01:11 jojoa1997 Cylus you crazy; Her 32x is like 1gb. To redraw all that would be insane
01:11 Djohaal I am looking for a good font for my GUI mock-up
01:11 jojoa1997 If anyone wants a look at good mods https://forum.minetest.net/search.php?keyword​s=&terms=all&author=VanessaE&fid[]=11&fid[]=13&fid[]=15&sc=1&sf=titleonly&sr=t​opics&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search
01:12 Cylus jojoa1997: Okay, fair enough.
01:12 VanessaE Cylus: I have a script that resizes the textures starting from the 512px size, but mostly I mastered them at 2k or larger.
01:12 VanessaE Cylus: but in some cases, particularly in the 16 and 32px sizes, I hand-tweaked them where it was needed.
01:13 VanessaE photorealistic + lowres doesn't usually work too well together ;)
01:13 Cylus Yeah, I imagine not.
01:13 jojoa1997 It is ironic. My two biggest mods Overcraft Origins and Peaceful NPC I want to update the most but have no time.
01:15 VanessaE the 32px size is only about 25 MB without all the .git history stuff btw
01:15 jojoa1997 VanessaE 57 more posts and I will be back to fourth most posts unless you post more
01:15 Cylus I'm going to try that pack, it looks beautiful, but it probably won't last long. I'm not sure if my old machine will run with such high-resolution images. I suppose I can keep turning down the resolution until I hit a good render speed.
01:15 VanessaE jojoa1997: I still manage to average about one or two posts per day
01:15 jojoa1997 XD
01:16 jojoa1997 I have been gone for months and I have 4.44 posts per day
01:16 VanessaE Cylus: you'd be surprised!  64px for some reason actually seems to work better for some people than the default 16px textures, and I still don't know why that is.
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01:16 VanessaE I think maybe it changes how the engine batches up things to send to the GPU? idk
01:16 jojoa1997 When I was constantly posting I must have had 30 posts a day
01:16 VanessaE hey TriBlade9
01:16 TriBlade9 Heya
01:16 jojoa1997 o/ TriBlade9
01:17 TriBlade9 o/ jojoa
01:17 TriBlade9 Long time no see
01:17 jojoa1997 Well then again last year I would check all the time. There were times that every latest post was by me. Now I have not time to even play minecraft. MC with friends is fun
01:17 TriBlade9 :(
01:18 jojoa1997 I am sorry TriBlade9 but who are you? I think you might have changed your name since then.
01:18 jojoa1997 [21:16:23] <VanessaE> Cylus: you'd be surprised!  64px for some reason actually seems to work better for some people than the default 16px textures, and I still don't know why that is.
01:19 jojoa1997 You mean people actually get better fps with 64?
01:19 jojoa1997 I noticed around the same fps when I used either one
01:19 VanessaE yes
01:19 VanessaE it's the weirdest thing
01:19 VanessaE I don't understand it
01:20 bjrohan_ Can anyone help with spawning animals with animals modpack?
01:20 VanessaE remember my old Inspiron laptop?
01:20 VanessaE that old piece of shit dell I had?
01:20 VanessaE bjrohan_:   /mobf  and turn on "secondary spawning"
01:20 jojoa1997 Well VanessaE 64 is 32^2 so it probably does peice together better
01:21 bjrohan_ VanessaE: Thank you very much!
01:21 VanessaE jojoa1997: even that old dell could handle 64px HDX, believe it or not.  and it was a total piece of junk, as laptops go.
01:21 jojoa1997 VanessaE no but I used a dell Inspiron laptop recently
01:21 jojoa1997 to test for my extended essay
01:21 jojoa1997 my VM was faster than that
01:22 jojoa1997 This stinks
01:22 jojoa1997 Before I wouldnt get homework done because I was talking here. Now I cant talk here because I am getting my homework done, which takes ages
01:23 jojoa1997 well bbs need more spagetti
01:26 TriBlade9 mmm
01:26 TriBlade9 spagetti
01:26 TriBlade9 What is spagetti?
01:27 TriBlade9 I've only heard of spaghetti :P
01:28 Cylus VanessaE: That's very strange indeed (about 64px images rendering faster).
01:30 jojoa1997 TriBlade9 it is my own version of angle hair. It is angle hair in a tea cup!
01:30 bjrohan_ VanessaE: I turned that on, any idea hw long it will take?
01:31 jojoa1997 Don't ask me why but it is in a tea cup. Very convinient for eating
01:31 TriBlade9 Angle hair?
01:31 TriBlade9 How do you eat angle hair?
01:31 TriBlade9 Or do you mean angel hair? XXDD
01:31 jojoa1997 https://www.google.com/search?q=angel+hair+s​paghetti&amp;num=20&amp;rlz=1C1CHMO_enUS552U​S552&amp;es_sm=122&amp;source=lnms&amp;tbm=i​sch&amp;sa=X&amp;ei=a-QYVOEQ4avyAdTmgKAB&amp​;ved=0CAgQ_AUoAQ&amp;biw=1276&amp;bih=683
01:31 nupacloud Djohaal: apparently cpw, the guy who managed FML itself, decided he's done with minecraft, and he made a big deal of it. Most other modders seem to be taking a "wait and see" approach... although admittedly replacing cpw's role in the community will be even harder than replacing redpower's.
01:31 jojoa1997 Tonight is not my best night
01:32 Djohaal oh
01:32 jojoa1997 cpw's?
01:32 jojoa1997 And where is this said?
01:32 jojoa1997 I wanna read it
01:32 Djohaal i don't blame him, after all the work with forge knowing microsoft can (and probably will) toss a bucket of cold water on it, I understand
01:32 VanessaE bjrohan_: how long what will take?
01:33 jojoa1997 Wait so Minecraft might actually get a modding api since forge is gone? Brilliant work Microsoft!
01:33 jojoa1997 Already benefits
01:33 bjrohan_ VanessaE: for items to spawn after turning on secondary spawn in animals modpack
01:34 VanessaE OH
01:34 VanessaE I dunno offhand
01:34 VanessaE it's been a while since I last used MOBF
01:34 Djohaal jojoa1997: I highly doubt the APi will be as flexible or powerful as forge
01:34 jojoa1997 Maybe yes maybe not
01:35 Djohaal probably not, microsoft hasn't been overly supportive of modders on its latest releases afaik
01:35 jojoa1997 nupacloud where was the fml guy leaving posted?
01:35 jojoa1997 Djohaal or it could be setting up for a modding api
01:35 Djohaal a shitty one probably
01:36 jojoa1997 I mean modders would mod using forge. Yet forge had to update with Minecraft. Minecraft did not need to keep support for forge.
01:36 jojoa1997 Also you switched Microsoft with Minecraft
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01:37 Djohaal nope
01:37 Djohaal I mean microsoft's game releases
01:38 jojoa1997 This simple change shows how weak the Minecraft community was. I mean no one is waiting to see what will happen. Also I was confused cause bleh
01:40 jojoa1997 I havent playeds survival mintest in over a year
01:40 jojoa1997 only testing and stuff :(
01:40 RealBadAngel Minecraft? i think its Microcraft now ;)
01:41 jojoa1997 enough already with thos names
01:42 jojoa1997 Also only the founders of MC left. The original team still have their jobs.
01:43 jojoa1997 Hey RealBadAngel havent seen you in a while
01:43 jojoa1997 You still working on colored ligh?ts
01:43 jojoa1997 You still working on colored lights?
01:43 RealBadAngel from time to time
01:49 TriBlade9 O-o
01:49 TriBlade9 Server down?
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01:54 tb01110100 RealBadAngel: *minecrosoft
01:55 TriBlade9 Softocraft?
01:56 tb01110100 VanessaE: care to explain that "dreambuilder" thing you mentioned earlier?
01:57 Djohaal here's a simplified GUI prototype http://i.imgur.com/nooXWBk.png
01:57 Djohaal font sucks and it has scaling issues I still have to think trough
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02:03 VanessaE Djohaal: not bad looking.
02:03 VanessaE needs work but I see where you're going with it.
02:03 Djohaal has some serious issues with scaling tho, the font is awful
02:04 Djohaal plus if you want it to look crisp it has to scale at integer multiples of the base
02:04 VanessaE you're not using Freetype I guess?
02:06 VanessaE damn, tb signed off.
02:06 Djohaal a random open source font I found that looks minecraft-y
02:06 VanessaE I was gonna answer his question :P
02:06 Djohaal might as well make my own sprite-based font
02:06 VanessaE heh
02:07 VanessaE well make sure you're using freetype mode and hence a truetype font
02:07 VanessaE then scaling shouldn't be an issue
02:07 Djohaal not sure if photoshop can do that, but it's just a mock-up
02:07 Djohaal ideally text should be handled by the game as then it can be dynamic
02:07 VanessaE yes
02:08 VanessaE the widgets and stuff is the harder part
02:08 Djohaal it's more a matter of linking the text scaler to the GUI scaler. And figuring out how small should the primary GUI scale instance be
02:08 VanessaE you can get most of that but I've never taken it to the extent your mockup does
02:08 Djohaal minecraft's "pixels" are giantic on any sensible sized gui
02:08 Djohaal https://33.media.tumblr.com/84f2541fdccd85ac0590​d41c4a2024dd/tumblr_nbzlufQeSw1ruyarro1_500.jpg
02:09 VanessaE oh G*d
02:09 VanessaE please tell me it doesn't actually get like that in practice?
02:09 Djohaal who knows
02:09 Djohaal microsoft gotta milk 2 billion dollars out of it
02:09 VanessaE haha
02:12 duke needs a bing search
02:13 Djohaal and the paperclip
02:14 duke Oh yea, that can help you with crafting recipes
02:14 VanessaE omg
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02:22 paramat Sokomine, don't use the snow mod from splizard's repo, it's full of bugs, try my faster version instead that uses perlin maps https://github.com/paramat/wieldhandsam2/tr​ee/113f9f4aee4a87608eff34a653d305f78006245e
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02:27 * VanessaE sprays a can of Raid at Splizard's code ;)
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02:30 khonkhortisan Now why didn't I think of that?
02:37 jordan4ibanez I wish we could use the format tools in bbcode
02:38 jordan4ibanez And the youtube code
02:41 jordan4ibanez Wait, so the whole main menu is in lua?
02:44 VanessaE yes
02:46 jordan4ibanez What about the pause menu?
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02:46 jordan4ibanez Just wondering if that's hidden in there somewhere
02:47 VanessaE I think it is Lua also
02:47 jordan4ibanez Oh daaaaaaaaaaamn, that has infinite possibilities.
02:48 jordan4ibanez Can't wait until client side modding is possible, so we can maybe modify the pause menu. :)
02:48 VanessaE it's coming soon I think
02:48 VanessaE but when?  idk
02:51 TriBlade9 Who's developing it VanessaE?
02:51 TriBlade9 It doesn't count as "coming" until someone is working on it and has made progress.
02:52 VanessaE I don't know who will actually take on the main work of doing that but I guess sapier would be the one to talk to first
02:56 TriBlade9 Okay
02:57 TriBlade9 Imma try to fix chat colors freetype building today
02:57 TriBlade9 Probably not gonna work though xP
02:57 VanessaE good luck
02:59 TriBlade9 I'm gonna need it x[
02:59 TriBlade9 Thanks though
03:14 tanath how do you toggle damage?
03:15 VanessaE in the main menu
03:15 VanessaE "singleplayer" tab
03:15 tanath you have to exit?
03:16 VanessaE yeah
03:16 tanath isn't there a console command?
03:16 VanessaE it's technically a server setting
03:16 VanessaE so it's enabled at the menu
03:16 VanessaE you could try to set it
03:16 tanath ok
03:16 VanessaE /set enable_damage true
03:16 VanessaE (or false)
03:17 VanessaE but I don't know if that setting will take effect in realtime
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03:18 tanath seems to work. not sure i want to test though :P
03:18 tanath there's a creeper-looking thing
03:19 VanessaE what mod are you using that provides creepers? O_o
03:19 VanessaE last I knew we didn't have those :)
03:19 VanessaE I want a screenshot :P
03:19 tanath i can actually do that since i'm hiding in the wall...
03:20 VanessaE heh
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03:22 tanath http://picpaste.com/mt-creeper-blWkFsDy.png
03:23 VanessaE weird, I don't recognize that creature
03:23 VanessaE MOBF?
03:23 tanath i'm using sphax bdcraft texturepack
03:23 tanath nope
03:23 VanessaE which mod are you using to get this creature?
03:24 TriBlade9 Minetest Modding Contests, good idea or not?
03:24 VanessaE TriBlade9: might be a good idea.
03:25 VanessaE depends on the ultimate goal though
03:25 tanath not sure. i have carbone, animals_modpack, homedecor, mg, pipeworks, technic
03:25 TriBlade9 Same spirit as BlenderNation contests, winner gets to pick the next topic
03:25 VanessaE tanath: MOBF = animals modpack
03:25 tanath oh. i thought it meant mob framework
03:26 VanessaE same thing :)
03:26 VanessaE animals modpack got renamed at one point
03:26 tanath ah
03:27 VanessaE AH
03:27 VanessaE that's carbone producing that
03:27 VanessaE that's a "Tree Monster"
03:28 tanath scary as a creeper?
03:28 VanessaE dunno, I've never played that subgame :)
03:28 tanath why?
03:28 tanath lol
03:29 VanessaE my focus is on my own game  :)
03:29 tanath do it :P
03:33 TriBlade9 Is there a way on GitHub to search commits?
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03:35 bjrohan Hi all, just started using minetest today. I had a bukkit server for my son and I. I would like to set up a minetest server. When setting up the server, do mods that I install on the installation I am going to use as a server available on the server?
03:36 VanessaE TriBlade9: yeah, at the top of the page is a search widget
03:36 VanessaE you can limit it to commits I think
03:37 TriBlade9 bjrohan, What do you mean by that?
03:37 VanessaE bjrohan: whatever you put on the server will be sent to all clients that connect to you (your son included).
03:37 TriBlade9 Yes
03:37 TriBlade9 :D
03:37 VanessaE bjrohan: you do not need to install any mods on the client.  the server will take care of it.
03:38 VanessaE bjrohan: the way Minetest works, your server will run the game logic and it will send the textures, sounds, and other media (the "assets") to the client for display/playback.
03:38 kaeza another good thing about MT over MC <_<
03:38 VanessaE indeed so
03:39 VanessaE it has its drawbacks though since it makes it harder to "pre-load" a client
03:39 TriBlade9 What's the proper way to #ifdef for freetype?
03:39 TriBlade9 #ifdef ENABLE_FREETYPE?
03:39 VanessaE e.g. there's no graceful way to supply the cache data for a client that melds nicely with existing cache data
03:39 VanessaE TriBlade9: no idea, but that sounds right to me
03:40 TriBlade9 LEmme doublecheck
03:40 bjrohan VanessaE: Perfect, everything is server sided. Also I think the animal modpack is throwing an issue: MOBF  on_step trying to update lifebar but no luaentity present
03:41 VanessaE bjrohan: can you use pastebin and show us the last 20 or 30 lines of debug.txt please?
03:41 TriBlade9 Ah, #ifdef USE_FREETYPE
03:41 VanessaE it'll be in the same dir as your mods, worlds, etc dirs are located.  root of minetest if it's run-in-place, ~/.minetest otherwise
03:44 bjrohan VanessaE: http://paste.ubuntu.com/8362420/
03:45 bjrohan That is the timeline for the issue showing in the game
03:45 bjrohan VanessaE: There is more, as you can see it updates several times a second
03:46 VanessaE Ah
03:46 VanessaE ok
03:46 VanessaE first, ignore the on_step "errors"
03:46 VanessaE second,
03:47 VanessaE um, one moment.
03:47 VanessaE deprecated_lua_api_handling = legacy
03:47 VanessaE put that in your minetest.conf
03:47 VanessaE that'll shut up all of those "deprecated xxxx" calls
03:47 VanessaE meanwhile yell at sapier to update his code ;-)
03:48 VanessaE wait, not sapier
03:48 bjrohan in the animal modpack git, it talks about using luasocket, which I have not installed
03:48 VanessaE um, where'd you get the torches mod?
03:48 VanessaE is it this one?  https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=6099
03:49 bjrohan The torches mod was that one
03:49 VanessaE ok
03:49 VanessaE I'll yell at BlockMen to update his code
03:49 bjrohan ok
03:49 VanessaE if he's still interested in doing so - he's been wanting to get real 3d torches added to the engine
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03:51 VanessaE some of us... let's just say we disagree with the idea because the in-engine model used for torches, what we call a "drawtype" is also used for other stuff, so it has to be done exactly in a certain way to avoid breaking those other mods.
03:51 RealBadAngel https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=​Iz46MQeIUdw&amp;feature=youtu.be
03:51 RealBadAngel somehow a bit quiet
03:51 bjrohan VanessaE: Thank you very much. Should I add the luasocket? If so how. I am quite frustrated with myself, for not looking into a MineCraft alternative before my son purchased MineCraft about 6 months ago
03:52 VanessaE luasocket adds a high-resolution timer which helps provide more accurate process accounting
03:52 VanessaE you don't really need it in normal use
03:52 VanessaE hey RBA.
03:52 jordan4ibanez Does pilzadam ever show up in here?
03:53 VanessaE jordan4ibanez: yeah
03:53 VanessaE mid-morning to late afternoon EDT.
03:53 jordan4ibanez Awesome
03:54 VanessaE bjrohan: any chance you can "sell" that subscription to someone else?
03:54 VanessaE I hate to see a purchase go unused, even if it's for a competitor
03:54 VanessaE (I hate seeing money go to waste)
03:55 tanath um.... how deep does this damn game go?
03:56 VanessaE tanath: -30927 meters.
03:56 tanath holy. no wonder
03:56 VanessaE uh huh :)
03:56 tanath was digging down and started wondering why i hadn't hit bottom
03:56 VanessaE now you know :)
03:56 VanessaE the sky goes up to +30912 meters btw
03:56 VanessaE so the total vertical is about 62 km
03:57 VanessaE same for E/W and N/S
03:57 TriBlade9 How do I remove a source file from compilation?
03:57 TriBlade9 ifdef?
03:57 TriBlade9 In CMakeLists.txt
03:57 VanessaE TriBlade9: no idea :P
03:57 TriBlade9 ORite
03:57 TriBlade9 I should be in minetest-dev
03:58 bjrohan VanessaE: I am still not seeing and spawned animals from that modpack, any suggestions, the secondary spawning is checked
03:58 VanessaE bjrohan: I think you have to explicitly enable the MOBs to be spawned also
04:00 TriBlade9 If only this would compile faster >_>
04:00 bjrohan VanessaE: under the /mobf mobs tab, they are all green, indicating enabled
04:00 kaeza blame C++
04:01 VanessaE bjrohan: I am not sure then, I think you'll have to catch sapier tomorrow or send him a forum pm
04:01 VanessaE he's easy to talk to and quick to respond to bug reports
04:01 TriBlade9 <3 sapier :D
04:02 bjrohan VanessaE: ok, thanks.
04:04 TriBlade9 WOOT
04:04 TriBlade9 IT compiles and runs without freetype and works :D
04:04 VanessaE meanwhile I left a note for BlockMen about that torches issue
04:04 TriBlade9 Unfortunately it means color codes display in chat :/
04:04 VanessaE TriBlade9: um, I think you better fix that :)
04:05 TriBlade9 Well, Freeminer didn't :P
04:06 TriBlade9 Looks like this: fffffffHello!0000ffBlue text
04:06 TriBlade9 I'll look for a way to fix that
04:06 TriBlade9 At least now it compiles :P
04:06 TriBlade9 Even if I used way too many ifdefs
04:07 bjrohan VanessaE: Perhaps they aren't spawning very fast the info says 44 mobs spawnes by adv_spawning this session, however there are no active mobs :-(
04:07 bjrohan offline mobs 647
04:08 TriBlade9 bjrohan, which MT version are you using btw?
04:08 VanessaE TriBlade9: oh G*d, you gotta fix that.
04:08 TriBlade9 Yeah :/
04:08 bjrohan .4.10
04:09 TriBlade9 Dat useless zero doe
04:09 VanessaE bjrohan: maybe you DO need luasocket for that highres timer then
04:09 bjrohan VanessaE: Here is a screenshot of the info: http://tinypic.com/r/65vkvs/8
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04:09 bjrohan VanessaE: do you have an instruction for install on ubuntu?
04:10 VanessaE bjrohan: there's a PPA for that :)
04:10 VanessaE https://launchpad.net/~minetestd​evs/+archive/ubuntu/daily-builds
04:10 bjrohan ok
04:10 VanessaE just uninstall minetest, add that PPA, apt-get install minetest (not minetestc55) and you get the latest code
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04:11 VanessaE dev code is usually stable but once in a while it'll break
04:11 TriBlade9 Well this is awkward
04:11 TriBlade9 My macro failed :L
04:12 TriBlade9 So damn close
04:12 TriBlade9 See ya
04:12 TriBlade9 Gonna go eat
04:13 bjrohan VanessaE: Okay. I installed the minetestdev/stable ppa to installe minetestc55, as the repo had .4.09 for ubuntu. If I understand you correctly, uninstall the c55, then from the repo (now that ppa is added) install regular minetest
04:13 VanessaE correct
04:13 tanath why can't i give myself diamonds. all the strings i've found say unknown item
04:13 VanessaE the "c55" one isn't the normal build
04:14 VanessaE tanath: /giveme default:diamond
04:14 tanath diamondblock is supposely in default
04:14 VanessaE tanath: if that doesn't work, you're not running minetest_game :)
04:14 bjrohan VanessaE: I added the daily builds ppa, in my repo is still only gives the .4.9 version
04:14 VanessaE of course I think you said you had carbone, so that SHOULD be there.
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04:14 tanath it says [mod:] implying that bit is optional
04:14 VanessaE bjrohan: did you,  sudo apt-get update
04:15 VanessaE tanath: oh, no.  you need the mod: prefix for most stuff.
04:15 VanessaE "default" is actually a mod, part of minetest:game
04:15 riddim hey y'all, i always was on the look out 4 a open source minecraft, apparently it's been around 4 a while already haha
04:15 VanessaE when the mod: prefix isn's needed, it's because an alias exists somewhere in the code for that item.  stone and wood are like that
04:15 VanessaE hi riddim
04:16 VanessaE welcome to Minetest.
04:16 VanessaE this game has been around since late 2011 (November I think).
04:16 riddim if this runs on my shitty laptop my lil sis is gonna b so happy, she's always wanted this game
04:16 VanessaE riddim: it should run.  works on most stuff without incident.
04:17 ibloat 'this game' being minecraft :p
04:17 VanessaE if it fails, tell us so we can help try to fix it
04:17 VanessaE well this is Minetest, not Minecraft :)  so she'll have to settle for a free more-or-less-equivalent one :)
04:17 bjrohan VanessaE: well smarty pants, I updated the repos, it is now there, installing now :-)
04:17 riddim this laptop is an old intel centrino of some sort, i hope it can handle it
04:17 VanessaE bjrohan: heh ok :)
04:18 tanath what are the other 2 armor slots for?
04:18 VanessaE riddim: as long as you've got enough RAM and CPU you should be fine
04:18 riddim we run #! on it, xp is even 2 much honestly
04:18 VanessaE tanath: not sure
04:18 tanath head, feet, legs, chest. how do i fill the other 2?
04:18 tanath VanessaE, well you don't play carbone :P
04:18 VanessaE tanath: sheild and weapon? :P
04:18 ibloat VanessaE, the vanilla (minetest_game) experience is quite adequate methinks
04:18 VanessaE shield*
04:19 VanessaE ibloat: when you get bored with it, try another :)
04:19 ibloat for a first dip into block-based world-building
04:19 ibloat exactly
04:19 VanessaE oh sure
04:19 VanessaE minetest_game is good for that for sure
04:19 tanath well sword goes on hotbar
04:19 ibloat the next step is diving into the mods :)
04:20 VanessaE you can get a decent way with the default game.
04:20 riddim if this game runs and at least has the basic minecraft experience of building things and surviving i'd b more than satisfied. i haven't really even played normal minecraft
04:20 VanessaE ibloat: Home Decor. :)
04:20 tanath shield worked :D
04:20 VanessaE riddim: you will be satisfied I think.
04:20 bjrohan VanessaE: running the dev version now, what should I look for to see a difference, besides mobs appearing
04:20 VanessaE tanath: damn, I remember someone explaining what the other slot was for...
04:20 ibloat VanessaE, technic :D
04:20 jordan4ibanez Finally, I got around to doing this. Multistate fire, based on the nodes around it. http://imgur.com/NIB836m,sTVBW6P
04:21 VanessaE bjrohan:   speed, additional shiny features here and there, etc.
04:21 bjrohan ok
04:21 riddim oh man there's an android version even, tight
04:22 VanessaE riddim: yep.  https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=42&amp;t=9389
04:22 tanath VanessaE, looks like it should be bracers or something but i can't find a pattern
04:22 VanessaE bjrohan: just bear in mind that occasionally a dev version will have some bug.  you have to be ready to accept that or you can always fall back to the stable version (or you can download the sources and hack on it too :) )
04:24 riddim have y'all looked into hosting the android version on f-droid? it could b an easy way 4 ppl 2 update and such
04:25 VanessaE there has been some talk yes
04:25 VanessaE see,
04:25 VanessaE the problem is there's a clone out there already
04:25 riddim ahh
04:25 VanessaE Buildcraft, made by some guy goes by the name "playstarz"
04:25 VanessaE named for the Minecraft mod I guess
04:25 riddim splitters
04:26 riddim the bane of open source
04:26 VanessaE but in this case, it's also the name of a Minetest fork for Android, iOS and Kindle
04:26 VanessaE we've been kinda fighting to get rid of that build because it's always horribly outdated and broken
04:27 VanessaE that link I gave to Sapier's build is the official Android build
04:27 bjrohan VanessaE: Definitely grasp that, I've done some Beta testing for various android programs (SwiftKey, Mindquilt, etc).  Been playing since I updated, no spawned mobs :-(
04:27 VanessaE but getting it on e.g. Google Play Store costs money that I guess Minetest devs don't wanna spend :-/
04:27 riddim android has issues with shit like that happening often. i c similar stuff with various emulators
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04:28 VanessaE we don't have an official iOS build and we don't know yet how to get this Android build onto Kindle and the like just yet, but we're working on it.
04:28 VanessaE anyone who can help, we could sure use it
04:28 tanath VanessaE, are you sure it's not deeper than 31k?
04:28 VanessaE tanath: positive.
04:28 VanessaE -30927
04:28 tanath so freakin' deep
04:28 VanessaE beyond that is just a void.
04:29 VanessaE tanath: press F5 to see your coordinates
04:29 tanath ah, so void. you don't die from falling out of level?
04:29 VanessaE nope
04:29 VanessaE you just stand there
04:30 VanessaE well
04:30 VanessaE carbone might have bedrock down there, I'm not sure
04:30 VanessaE but the vanilla game just leaves a solid void
04:30 tanath you'd stand in void?
04:30 VanessaE blocks that have not been generated (or can't be) are treated as solid, so the void at the bottom is walkable
04:30 tanath i'm sinking down with noclip to find bottom by now :P
04:31 VanessaE stand *on* it yeah :D
04:31 tanath interesting
04:31 VanessaE yup
04:31 tanath will noclip go through it?
04:31 tanath or will i just stop
04:31 VanessaE sure, you can noclip through it, fly past the edge if you want
04:31 VanessaE we don't have things like...farlands was it called?
04:31 tanath yeah
04:31 VanessaE but the map won't generate past that point
04:31 VanessaE it just...stops :)
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04:32 VanessaE there was some effort to extend it even further, to about +/- 252,000 or thereabouts
04:33 VanessaE and there has been some talk about some kind of more official extension to the N/S, E/W direction but that would come at the expense of depth
04:33 VanessaE (the past proposal I saw was to stop at -8192 or so, in exchange for I think 8 times the horizontal distance)
04:33 VanessaE last proposal*
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04:34 VanessaE (the +/- 252,000ish idea was buggy, had problems that made farlands look like artwork, so it never made it past the prototype stage ;-) )
04:35 tanath dear zod
04:35 paramat eh ... the talk was that extending horizontally is not going to happen, and would be too much re-write to be worth it
04:36 tanath how high does the world go?
04:36 tanath 31k up too?
04:36 tanath fast zoomed down to 4k and i begin to see how deep 31k is
04:36 tanath it's crazy
04:37 paramat yeah a 62km ^ 3 cube
04:38 tanath what are area limits?
04:38 tanath i'm sure there's still farlands issues if you went out far enough
04:39 paramat extending the world horizontally to please minecrafters would not be wise legally
04:40 tanath first, huh?
04:40 riddim bout to try this android version on here
04:40 tanath second, i'm asking how far one can go
04:41 paramat there were issues near world edge but now every 200 nodes the 'world' is shifted relative to the camera
04:41 tanath i'm fairly sure there can be no legal issue with extending the world size. not relevant anyway though
04:42 VanessaE paramat: a 62 km ^ 3 cube?  (a 62 km cube cube?)  so what, it's a tesseract?
04:42 VanessaE ;)
04:42 tanath oh wait, that's the whole world? ~31k in every direction?
04:42 riddim damn it is incredibly hard 2 scroll on the public ip thing on the first splash page
04:42 VanessaE tanath: if you go to the edges of the map, which is -30927 to +30912 the map just stops generating there
04:42 VanessaE nothing special happens
04:43 VanessaE riddim: yeah that part needs some work
04:43 VanessaE tanath: there literally is nothing fancy at the edges.  the map just...stops. :)
04:43 tanath is that true of other terrain generation too?
04:43 VanessaE yep
04:44 VanessaE other mods that generate terrain like paragen and the like just stop, assuming they don't have explicit code to do something special at the edges
04:44 tanath but that wouldn't extend it right?
04:44 VanessaE nope
04:44 VanessaE the map just stops.
04:45 paramat i mean, to be careful with MS, MT shouldn't try to emulate MC
04:45 VanessaE paramat: there wouldn't be any problem legally-speaking.  the problem is coding it.
04:45 paramat yep
04:46 VanessaE paramat: the map limit does need to be extended past 31k.  people are going to need it.  mark my words. :)
04:46 * VanessaE hands paramat a Sharpie to mark said words with.
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04:47 TBC_x To be honest, I think that the small world problem originiates from no content in vertical space
04:47 riddim what's a good beginner server?
04:47 paramat nope theres no need
04:47 VanessaE riddim: try my Almost Vanilla server.
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04:48 VanessaE paramat: there will be
04:48 paramat sure but thats another game ...
04:49 TBC_x for example terraria
04:49 VanessaE paramat: the problem is you can't just "walk up"
04:49 VanessaE paramat: and we have no realms to make use of that extra vertical space
04:49 VanessaE certainly nothing by default
04:49 VanessaE so basically all that vertical space is useless
04:49 TriBlade9 PRoblem with reamls vanessa is shadows
04:49 TBC_x its world is pretty small, but it has tons of content so you never have time to think about it
04:49 VanessaE TriBlade9: that too.
04:50 TriBlade9 For me at least, infinitely deep mining is quite a turnoff
04:50 VanessaE indeed, there's only so deep you can dig before it is just too much
04:50 VanessaE but that's not the issue
04:50 tanath i suppose 62k^3 is sufficient
04:50 VanessaE the issue is all that sky
04:51 TriBlade9 Well, hell-deep realms are easier
04:51 VanessaE there's nothing UP there
04:51 riddim i found ur mostly vanilla server vanessae, is that the same thing?
04:51 TriBlade9 Sky, though, is totally different
04:51 VanessaE riddim: that's the one
04:51 paramat well hmmmm apparently has his own plans for core floatlands, and there are lots of good mods
04:51 VanessaE paramat: floatlands are nice and all but that doesn't solve the problem of getting people UP there in the first place
04:52 paramat thats just another interesting creative task for modders
04:52 VanessaE riddim: let me know when you're on and I'll grant interact
04:52 paramat new realms that allow vertical travel
04:52 VanessaE paramat: but wait, do you want people to just teleport (or otherwise transport) from sky island to sky island for the next 30 km?
04:53 VanessaE (going up)
04:53 VanessaE riddim: there you go, saw you join.  interact granted.
04:53 TriBlade9 Wings, jetpacks, and the like could help...
04:53 VanessaE pleas read the rules in the spawn area
04:53 VanessaE TriBlade9: ok, that's the first thousand meters, then what?
04:53 riddim yeah i logged in
04:54 VanessaE riddim: go ahead and play.
04:54 paramat shadows are only ever propagated downwards through continuous chunks
04:54 TriBlade9 The first thousand meters is progress :P
04:54 VanessaE this is a more-or-less vanilla server, with a few mods to make admin easier.  So find some trees, dig them, craft, and go from there :)
04:55 VanessaE paramat: shadows isn't the problem.  the problem is content.  what do you plan to do with the other 30 km worth of sky?
04:55 VanessaE paramat: 30 more realms?
04:55 TriBlade9 Boss towers?
04:55 TBC_x difficulty getting there should scale in a way
04:55 VanessaE (shadows aren't the problem because those can be solved somehow)
04:56 TriBlade9 If we could turn some of it into 0-gravity and space-like-sky, that would be nice
04:56 VanessaE TriBlade9: we can.
04:56 TBC_x or just the difficulty of the inhabitants
04:56 TriBlade9 VanessaE, then do it :P
04:56 paramat realms that have vertical structure reaching to the realm above
04:56 TriBlade9 That would allow asteroids and moon realms and stuff
04:56 paramat either as terrain, tower, mountain etc
04:56 TriBlade9 But there's no invert gravity yet tho
04:56 TBC_x skylands would make sense with portals of some sort
04:56 VanessaE paramat: but I'm trying to say that there's only so much of that you can do
04:57 TriBlade9 I tried portals once, epic fail
04:57 VanessaE you're talking a thousand meters tall mountains
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04:57 TriBlade9 wb ibloat
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04:59 paramat the vertical aspect of MT only creates fascinating new ways to build and generate, stuff that goes far beyond what MC can do =D
04:59 VanessaE I'll grant you that :)_
04:59 TriBlade9 And we can't think of anything to generate >:I
04:59 VanessaE you know that better than anyone
04:59 TriBlade9 trufax
04:59 riddim i'm drowning lol idk how 2 get out
04:59 paramat its also MTs unique character
04:59 TBC_x mapgen could use the dimensions of the world and generate gigantic mountains or deep chasms
04:59 TriBlade9 Your work paramat is amazing
04:59 VanessaE riddim: if you get stuck,  /spawn
05:00 VanessaE paramat: but the problem still remains that there's too much vertical space and not enough things to DO with it :)
05:00 TriBlade9 Anyone here know how to use #ifs properly in C++?
05:01 TBC_x i think that #ifs only evaluates #defines and -Defines
05:01 riddim i figured it out
05:01 VanessaE paramat: which is why I wouldn't be against dropping a bit of vertical space in exchange for more horizontal space if the result is a more balanced map layout
05:01 TriBlade9 ^^
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05:01 paramat good grief, thats down to a players lack of imagination
05:01 TriBlade9 31k just isn't a big enough map
05:02 paramat i have enough ideas and intentions for several lifetimes
05:02 ibloat TriBlade9, thanks :)
05:02 paramat all within 62km ^ 3
05:02 TBC_x 31k is not enough because the interesting stuff is only in horizontal plane
05:02 TriBlade9 I'm the guy that goes out 125k on an anarchy server to survive and never be found
05:02 VanessaE paramat: but can you fill 62x31x62 km worth of map with those ideas? :)
05:02 TBC_x down below is just minetest:stone
05:03 VanessaE TBC_x: well that's not how minetest works actually
05:03 paramat no one has filled the surface yet, when they do i'll point up and point down
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05:03 VanessaE there's LOTS of interesting stuff underground in a good game like Carbone or Dreambuilder
05:03 VanessaE minetest_game just doesn't put much down there is all
05:04 paramat the world is already balanced because it's cubic
05:04 VanessaE cubic != balanced :)
05:04 paramat just as c55 wants it, no bias to the current terrain at y = 0, flexible for space stuff
05:04 VanessaE it's just symmetric
05:04 VanessaE and hell, it isn't even that
05:05 VanessaE it's -30927 to +30912 :)
05:06 riddim my phone just barely can't handle it well enough 2 really b playable but it's cool still. it should run good on a real computer
05:06 VanessaE to me, less sky and more land makes more sense
05:06 paramat VanessaE, no 62km vertical is barely enough ... but enough
05:06 VanessaE you won't find a planet in this universe that has any other layout than this :)
05:06 TriBlade9 Welp, I'm back to my original problem >_<
05:06 VanessaE riddim: it runs quite well in fact.  with a half-way decent video card, you can get 30-40 fps and 240m view range easily.
05:06 VanessaE maybe 60fps
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05:09 TriBlade9 Depending on the mods ;)
05:09 VanessaE yep
05:09 VanessaE the less complex the objects on the terrain, the better it will perform
05:09 TriBlade9 Aaand 4px texture pack?
05:09 VanessaE nodebox models are slowest
05:09 TriBlade9 Hmm
05:09 TriBlade9 I wonder if there's a 1px texturepack
05:10 VanessaE texture packs can sometimes help, though with limits
05:10 * TriBlade9 glances at paramte
05:10 VanessaE TriBlade9: there is, yes
05:10 TriBlade9 *paramat
05:10 VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=8190
05:10 VanessaE there's one
05:10 TriBlade9 lol
05:10 TriBlade9 Do you think meshnodes will perform better than nodeboxes?
05:10 VanessaE yes, they will
05:10 TriBlade9 Yay
05:11 TriBlade9 And they're animatable :D
05:11 VanessaE because nodeboxes are apparently being converted into irrlicht meshes/vertexes in realtime, so the CPU is being used to do it
05:11 paramat several stacked realms each 4km thick, joined by towers, space elevators etc then space with mini cubic worlds, asteroids, then up near world top other dimensions sealed off within impassable barriers. 32km is barely enough
05:11 VanessaE that's a large part of why they slow the renderer down
05:11 TriBlade9 not surprising
05:11 VanessaE whereas meshes don't do that
05:11 TriBlade9 Is there particlespawner yet? or just add_particle?
05:11 VanessaE paramat: 4km?  wut?   realms were generally agreed to be 1km thick...
05:11 VanessaE TriBlade9: there is, but it sucks.
05:12 paramat lol 'agreed'
05:12 TriBlade9 :/
05:13 TriBlade9 How the fck do I pull this off?
05:13 riddim i'm on a debian stable distro, is compiling it my only option
05:13 paramat i would want a minimum 2km of both air and land in a realm, but some realms can be thin and simple
05:14 TriBlade9 Also, lua mapgen is still too slow
05:14 jordan4ibanez Whoa, why does an abm check something like 20 times before it changes the block?
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05:15 paramat yes its too slow
05:15 Aika Normal human here. Who is going to put directional/positional mumble voice chat into minetest for me? lol
05:15 VanessaE Aika: no one
05:16 ibloat has anyone knowing lua given http://terralang.org/ a look?
05:16 VanessaE that isn't a feature anyone has really looked at adding.
05:16 paramat watershed mod for me is 2 sec per chunk, stuff like that used to take 1min per chunk
05:16 khonkhortisan I read a little about it
05:16 Aika I knowwwwwww, whyyyy, i love voice chat. it gives me something to listen to besides the 3 sound effects. lol
05:16 ibloat might yield some speedups
05:16 khonkhortisan I still have to find the wayland channel
05:16 VanessaE Aika: because with voice chat comes latency, lots of code, slowness, childish people yelling at each other, and SWATting.
05:17 GrimKriegor joined #minetest
05:17 VanessaE Aika: you could always run skype or so, or run your favorite playlist in the background :)
05:17 paramat lua mapgen is okay for singleplayer, but the complex ones a little slow for a multiplayer server
05:17 Aika I'll give you childish people and code, code being the obvious big one, but latency isn't one with voice. basically undetectable.
05:18 VanessaE Aika: latency in the Minetest engine I mean
05:18 Aika Yeah, i just run mumble in background, positional audio was a "if I can dream" silly comment really lol
05:18 VanessaE adding voice sources would add latency to minetest's networking code even if it's Mumble handling the actual audio strea,m
05:18 VanessaE stream*
05:18 VanessaE I'm not saying it isn't doable
05:18 VanessaE it should be
05:19 Aika ah yeah. and thats really one of the best parts of minetest, (i should know as i play on a single core 1.7 intel graphics) lol
05:19 VanessaE you might even be able to do it with a Lua mod now
05:19 VanessaE e.g. writing positions to a log that your Mumble program could scrape
05:19 Aika It seems like being node-based would be able to work well with positional (normal person speaking, again...)
05:20 VanessaE paramat: one of the problems I've seen with plants_lib is that the mapgen hands a whole bunchs of blocks to it all at once - like 20 or 30 at a time
05:20 Aika If you've heard of teamspeak, its the open source version of it, using Speex usually.
05:20 VanessaE and it gets all bogged down generating those, leaving no time for the engine to do other stuff
05:20 VanessaE Aika: right.  the issue is getting the positional data out of the game and into a form that Mumble/Teamspeak/et al. can read
05:21 VanessaE you can probably do that with a mod
05:21 VanessaE but you will have to code something to run outside of minetest to read the data and tell the audio program how to pan the audio
05:21 jray541 joined #minetest
05:22 paramat bbl
05:22 paramat left #minetest
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05:23 jray541 VanessaE: thanks for the help last night i got my server up! :)
05:23 Aika While I'm hear, question... On single player, my view distance rapidly throttles from min to max constantly, and it's basically unusable. I've played with older version in the past and it was fine. Multiplayer is fine as well. Any idea whats up?
05:23 VanessaE jray541: good deal :)
05:24 VanessaE Aika: I'm not sure, but you can lock it to a certain range if necessary:
05:24 Aika by setting both ranges equal?
05:24 VanessaE viewing_range_nodes_min = 35
05:24 VanessaE viewing_range_nodes_max = 100
05:24 VanessaE for example
05:24 VanessaE yep, you can set them equal if you like
05:24 Aika why would 35/100 make them locked?
05:25 VanessaE those are just example figures.
05:25 VanessaE that would set the view range to be no less than 35 and no more than 100 meters.
05:25 Aika oh, right, i was saying they throttle between the two I set in config
05:25 VanessaE you could set them both to whatever value works well for you.  say, 50 if you want.
05:25 Aika k thx
05:26 VanessaE normally the game will ramp up and down according to what can be displayed; if it's ping-ponging then that's clearly a bug in the auto-tuner
05:26 VanessaE I've been complaining about the quality of that code for a while, but I don't have a better algorithm to suggest :-/
05:27 Aika Minetest 0.4.10
05:27 Aika Using Irrlicht 1.8.1
05:27 Aika Build info: VER=0.4.10
05:27 VanessaE I would suggest you file an issue on the bug tracker, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/new
05:28 VanessaE someone's gotta address this soon
05:28 VanessaE even with my badass machine, it's a bit of a problem too
05:28 Aika k, I think i saw others complaining as well
05:29 Aika Why does "just test" always have so many players? OR, another way of phrasing, why don't I understand what people do on that server? lol
05:29 VanessaE I haven't the foggiest clue - that damn server has us all completely perplexed.
05:30 VanessaE it's all stone for G*d sakes
05:30 VanessaE and bones.
05:30 Aika Ok good, so i'm not just a retard and think it seems terrible but always has tons of players?
05:30 VanessaE or it was when I was there last.
05:30 VanessaE the problem is the sort order of the master list
05:30 Aika yeah, no trees or dirt hardly
05:30 Aika i thought so too.
05:30 VanessaE it always puts the servers in order by number of users
05:30 VanessaE so top user count always stays at the top and gains more users
05:30 Aika so its just first because its first now lol
05:30 VanessaE self-reinforcing thing
05:30 VanessaE yep
05:31 VanessaE and I have bitched about this, too
05:31 VanessaE loudly.
05:31 khonkhortisan does doing that make someone a... nevermind.
05:31 VanessaE it does.
05:31 Aika lol
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05:31 VanessaE and I will admit to it.
05:31 khonkhortisan lol
05:31 * VanessaE <---- bitch, 100%.
05:31 VanessaE :)
05:31 tanath is there something special about obsidian glass doors? they strong or anything?
05:32 tanath or just that they're see-through?
05:32 VanessaE they're just dark and made from obsidian glass ;)
05:32 khonkhortisan I own two bitches. One's a weim, and I forgot what the other one was.
05:32 VanessaE to correspond with the regular glass doors.
05:32 khonkhortisan Well, I'm just borrowing it anyway. It's still a puppy.
05:33 Aika Who is at the very top of the minetest chain of command? Is there a top? IS it a single individual?
05:33 khonkhortisan I should know that.
05:33 khonkhortisan c55 is or used to be
05:34 khonkhortisan it might be community-driven by now
05:34 raffahacks joined #minetest
05:34 Aika I saw his/her blog, it has some cool stuff on it, didn't see minetest things though.
05:34 VanessaE it's basically balanced between all the devs now
05:35 VanessaE c55 used to head the project, now he prefers to stay off to the side.
05:36 raffahacks VanessaE, which part of mt did you develop?
05:37 VanessaE raffahacks: I've only done very little with the engine core.  the texture filters and some Lua stuff.
05:37 VanessaE I just do mods and a game, that's all
05:37 VanessaE and a lot of complaining :P
05:37 VanessaE RealBadAngel bounces ideas and code off of me a lot too
05:37 jray541 i always wondered why c55 was on some of the filenames
05:37 VanessaE but I don't write engine code myself anymore
05:37 raffahacks So you are a C++ dev too ;)
05:37 Aika And you have your name EVERYWHERE. When I'm looking for stuff, it seems like minetest belongs to you basically haha
05:38 khonkhortisan hostile takeover by commit spam
05:38 VanessaE raffahacks: no. I don't consider myself a C++ dev.  I couldn't code my way out of a paper bag, at least not in that language anyway :P
05:38 VanessaE Aika: wait, belongs to who..?
05:38 Aika VanessaE, you
05:38 VanessaE ME?  HAH!
05:39 VanessaE no fucking way
05:39 khonkhortisan if (PaperBag.contains(self)) { new PaperBag(self); } //oh wait, I'm still in one
05:39 VanessaE :)
05:39 Aika Yeah, like every minetest-ish site. And forum.
05:39 Aika haha
05:39 VanessaE I'm just a modder and texture author.
05:39 VanessaE wait what?
05:39 VanessaE "every minetest-ish site"?
05:39 Aika And even still, i get on irc, and here you are, talking haha
05:39 raffahacks Well, maybe she's just modest
05:39 VanessaE I'm only on here and the forum
05:40 Aika ugh, my new xchat isn't tab completing like i think it should
05:40 VanessaE (well here, the forum, and of course maintaining my servers and website, but I presume you didn't mean those)
05:40 Aika maybe i see your server a lot
05:40 Aika it gets mentioned quite a bit
05:40 VanessaE heh maybe :_)
05:40 jp joined #minetest
05:40 VanessaE aw shit
05:40 * VanessaE hides
05:40 Aika i still haven't logged into it
05:41 ibloat the 'guests' on that 'just test' server behave like simple bots, some of them anyway
05:41 VanessaE ^^^^ he has pull requests waiting to merge to Homedecor that I didn't get to today :)
05:41 jray541 whats an acceptable amount of resources for a 15 player server?
05:41 VanessaE jray541: 2GB RAM, as much CPU as you can spare (but 2 cores is enough), 10 GB of storage
05:41 Aika ive been playing on Liberty Land and checked out just test before that (what the eff...)
05:41 jp where did I put the horsewhip.........................
05:41 VanessaE anything more than that is overkill
05:41 raffahacks I feel so sad because i can't code in C
05:41 VanessaE jp:  haha
05:41 khonkhortisan depends on if they stay in the city or purposely roam around the entire map, generating everything
05:42 khonkhortisan One can learn anything. It's one of the fundamental features of a human being.
05:42 VanessaE jray541: the majority of that storage will be for the map, and most of THAT will be for future use - the initial map is only gonna be a few dozen MB for a while
05:42 khonkhortisan You can use multiple websites to learn C(++)
05:42 jray541 Vanessa: nice i just got a 2bg ram 4 core vps with 35gb and 2gb ssd swap
05:43 jray541 VanessaE: VPS for a year
05:43 * TriBlade9 wants a VPS .-.
05:43 VanessaE jray541: that's more than adequate, but pay attention to your disk IO.  even on a VPS with SSD, that can suffer if the hardware is overloaded.
05:44 VanessaE TriBlade9: I use a dedicated server for my minetest instances.  only cost me $29/mo but I got in while they were still "on sale".
05:44 VanessaE the host no longer offers that deal anymore, sadly
05:44 VanessaE (OVH, Canada datacenter, decent hardware, too)
05:45 TriBlade9 One problem
05:45 TriBlade9 Can't buy a VPS from China generally, online payment is almost impossible here
05:45 tanath i gave myself steel and got iron? o_O
05:45 VanessaE TriBlade9: even cryptocurrency like Pandacoin (PND) or so?
05:45 Aika Any tips on submitting github issue for switching between max/min view distance super frequently? I've never submitted one before, is what i'm saying.
05:45 VanessaE tanath: this is normal; in minetest iron is steel once it's cooked into ingots
05:46 VanessaE tanath: carbone probably equates one directly with the other
05:46 TriBlade9 VanessaE, No, I can use Bitcoins or something, but I can't convert money to bitcoins very easily
05:46 VanessaE TriBlade9: damn :(
05:46 foxipso joined #minetest
05:46 TriBlade9 Yeah, really sucks >_>
05:46 jray541 VanessaE: thats a good deal on a dedicated. I'll get a dedicated when i can host it myself. someday...
05:46 VanessaE TriBlade9: because of that exchange<->banks crackdown a few months back I guess?
05:46 TriBlade9 There was an old free VPS site, and it still works, but my IP is blacklisted due to spam from this area >:U
05:47 TriBlade9 Yep
05:47 TriBlade9 And the google crackdown
05:47 TriBlade9 Lots of libs are inaccessable, breaks most sites that use javascript encryption
05:48 VanessaE jray541: yep.  this one's a i3 dual core 3.4 GHz w/HT, 8GB RAM, 2TB storage (spinning rust), unlimited bandwidth over a 100 Mbps ethernet link
05:48 jordan4ibanez Who wants to see my super fire?
05:49 Aika Is "preload item visuals" good or bad for super old single core computer?
05:49 VanessaE bad
05:49 VanessaE always disable that
05:49 VanessaE it just wastes time having it turned on :)
05:49 VanessaE (and sometimes caused the game to act weird once you're in the world)
05:49 Aika Ohhhh k thanks. I'm sorry i'm treating this IRC like a pure question/answer bot lol I've had a lot of questions built up the past month.
05:50 VanessaE heh
05:50 VanessaE it's okay
05:50 VanessaE that's why we're here
05:50 VanessaE (well part of the reason)
05:50 VanessaE jordan4ibanez: what's it do?
05:50 raffahacks How much is for you a vps
05:51 VanessaE raffahacks: a good VPS will run around $10 a month or so
05:51 VanessaE maybe a bit more
05:51 VanessaE at least good relative to what's capable of running a Minetest server instance nicely
05:52 raffahacks Huh
05:52 VanessaE if you can deal with lag (and users complaining), and the storage is adequate, one of those super-cheap $5 deals that are floating around might suffice.
05:53 VanessaE but don't expect to run anything more than a vanilla server and some basic admin tools there
05:53 tanath shield goes in 1 hand. what goes in other?
05:54 ibloat how are user passwords stored on servers?
05:54 VanessaE tanath: nothing, just whatever you weild
05:54 VanessaE wield*
05:54 tanath then you can't use it
05:54 VanessaE your block, item, weapon, etc
05:55 VanessaE ibloat: in a file in the world dir, encrypted
05:55 tanath you can place whatever you want there, but it doesn't 'work'. i think only armour is supposed to go there
05:55 VanessaE tanath: OH that
05:55 VanessaE I still don't know; ask Calinou when you catch him next
05:55 VanessaE he ought to be on in the next few hours I guess
05:55 tanath i'll be gone
05:55 VanessaE send a forum PM then :)
05:56 tanath don't generally use forums
05:56 VanessaE the Minetest forums are a very good resource, you should consider browsing them
05:56 VanessaE mods, games, most of us can be reached there too
05:56 ibloat VanessaE, I see. so I have to trust the server operator hm
05:56 VanessaE ibloat: correct
05:56 tanath sure, i look, just don't want another account
05:56 VanessaE ibloat: but the server operator cannot read your password
05:57 VanessaE it is a one-way hash
05:57 VanessaE same concept as e.g. a Linux password
05:57 tanath that's what rainbow tables are for
05:57 VanessaE probably also the same concept as Windows uses
05:58 VanessaE tanath: I doubt that would work on a salted crypt like Minetest uses
05:58 ibloat thing is I can control access to my machines. MT server operators might dump the passwords in the clear with just a little patch
05:58 VanessaE ibloat: nope
05:58 tanath i've tried the wiki, i've tried obvious variations, but i still can't seem to get steel. just keep getting iron :(
05:58 VanessaE the password is not sent clear
05:58 VanessaE it's hashed and then sent to the server.
05:58 ibloat ah rigth
05:58 tanath VanessaE, ah, wasn't sure it was salted
05:59 tanath they often aren't
05:59 VanessaE tanath: I'm pretty sure it is anyway, I'd have to check
05:59 ibloat right, thank you for clearing that up
05:59 tanath VanessaE, actually, being the server operator they'd have access to the salt, so i don't think it'd matter
05:59 VanessaE SHA1
06:00 VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/vi​ewtopic.php?p=104175#p104175
06:00 tanath ah, well sha1 is weak anyway
06:00 VanessaE not sure if "slt" is supposed to say it's salted, probably yes
06:00 tanath should use sha3
06:00 VanessaE there has been talk of switching to a stronger algo
06:00 tanath even sha2 is weak
06:00 VanessaE but idk where that went
06:01 jordan4ibanez VanessaE: Right now, it's just an improved fire, I have to include the entity tomorrow, though.
06:01 VanessaE either way, the same level of trust would have to exist for any server operator regardless of the kind of service it is
06:01 VanessaE after all, there's nothing stopping a server operator from just outright resetting a user's password to whatever they want :)
06:02 VanessaE if I have root, you are fucked :)
06:03 ibloat it's not about the character on that server, more like people that are using the same user/password combination everywhere
06:03 VanessaE ah yeah
06:03 ibloat having their emails read/identity stolen
06:03 VanessaE well that's the same concern as using the same user/pass on a bunch of different websites
06:04 ibloat indeed
06:04 VanessaE like that "gmail leak" (that wasn't) recently
06:05 tanath this is why you don't reuse passwords
06:05 VanessaE if you have the password file, and a powerful enough machine, well..  brute force if you're bored.  botnet + brute force if you're an ass.  supercomputer + brute force if you're desparate
06:05 VanessaE desperate*
06:06 tanath it's really not hard to use a long random unique password for every site/service
06:06 * VanessaE throws a battery, a staple, and a horse correctly at tanath
06:06 VanessaE http://xkcd.com/936/
06:06 tanath yeah, that's bad advice and has been for a long time :P
06:07 tanath using dictionary words helps very little :P
06:07 VanessaE which, using line noise or xkcd? :)
06:07 lazers joined #minetest
06:07 tanath xkcd's password advice. it's a little better for avg joe is all
06:08 tanath neat trick throwing a horse though
06:08 ibloat tanath, people will be stupid on the internet/in games. if we can protect them some more with reasonable effort we should
06:08 VanessaE yeah, that damn nag was heavy ;)
06:08 tanath it's not reasonable to put unreasonable amounts of effort into saving them miniscule amounts of effort that would protect them so much bette
06:08 tanath r
06:08 tanath if they want better protection they'd use a damned password manager
06:08 diemartin joined #minetest
06:09 VanessaE I keep my passwords in a flat text file that is itself aes-encrypted.
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06:09 tanath keepass?
06:09 ibloat tanath, we know this. they don't. telling them afterwards they were stupid is not a good solution
06:09 VanessaE nope, just good old fashioned aespipe + nano
06:09 tanath yes it is, because we tell them before and they don't listen
06:10 tanath and if they continue after it's on them
06:10 VanessaE no need for a special program to handle it - I don't trust password managers.
06:10 ibloat we're in minetest does it says anything about passwords?
06:10 ibloat *where
06:10 tanath learn vim :P you're already on linux, you're halfway there
06:10 VanessaE vim?  why not just scoop my eyeballs out with a rusty spoon? ;)
06:11 Cylus I use KeePassX for most of my passwords, but I can't store Minetest passwords that way. Minetest pasting is broken.
06:11 VanessaE I'll stick to nano for shell stuff and gedit for everything else :)
06:11 tanath VanessaE, keepass is good. and you _are_ using special programs for it
06:11 tanath aespipe
06:11 tanath Cylus, that's what autotype is for
06:11 VanessaE well aespipe is generic enough that it doesn't know I'm encrypting a passwords file :)
06:11 Cylus SO I use the same stupid password that I can remember for every Minetest server. Very insecure.
06:12 Cylus tanath: Autotype? Is that in KeePassX or something else?
06:12 Cylus *so
06:12 Cylus *So
06:12 tanath keepass lets you autotype. on linux it uses xdotool. basically alt+tabs, types username, hits tab, types password, hits enter
06:13 tanath modifiable
06:13 tanath so click in username field, switch to keepass, perform autotype, done
06:13 ibloat will not work with all WMs if it really only alt-tabs
06:13 Cylus How do you switch to autotype?
06:13 tanath not really alt+tab
06:14 tanath huh? what does that mean? "switch to autotype"?
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06:14 tanath i don't know how keepassx works. maybe different
06:14 tanath it doesn't support some newer things
06:14 Cylus OH! This is KeePass. My bad.
06:15 Cylus I think KeePass is Windows-only, but I don't remember for sure.
06:15 tanath nope
06:15 tanath i use keepass on linux & android
06:15 ibloat uh mono
06:15 Cylus Okay, I don't know what application I was thinking of then.
06:18 tanath VanessaE, i get not trusting online password managers like lastpass. they've all been breached, for instance
06:18 VanessaE well folks, I think I'm gonna head off to bed now
06:19 tanath but keepass is offline only. no 3rd-party server to rely on. just you and your encrypted database
06:19 tanath g'night
06:19 Cylus Oh, wow. KeePass has a lot of dependencies.
06:19 sh4d0w28 joined #minetest
06:19 tanath worth it
06:19 VanessaE be back tomorrow morning
06:19 Cylus Night, VanessaE!
06:19 ibloat gn
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06:19 jp gnight
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06:20 TriBlade9 Good night Vanessa!
06:20 TriBlade9 Sleep tight ;)
06:20 TriBlade9 (Does she actually go offline? or does she just stay on IRC all night?)
06:20 VanessaE oh and if Aika returns, tell him I granted interact
06:20 jordan4ibanez Yo VanessaE  http://youtu.be/bDLtDaS29ns
06:21 VanessaE night all. --> out
06:21 Cylus Alright, I'm installing it. I hope it works with Minetest on my desktop. If it does, that would be a big improvement.
06:21 jordan4ibanez FIYA
06:21 Cylus TriBlade9: I think she stays logged in all night. I would too, if I didn't have overheating issues.
06:21 TriBlade9 Aww
06:21 tanath Cylus, just consider they keystrokes needed to log in. you can modify what it types in autotype tab if needed
06:21 TriBlade9 IDK why people do that, it's annoying to see people online but them not to read chat at all
06:22 tanath that's what /away is for
06:22 tanath one reason is some people don't register nicks, and it's a way to keep them
06:22 Cylus Some people get annoyed when I use /away . I haven't figured out why though.
06:22 tanath pfft. ignore them. they're silly
06:23 TriBlade9 What does /away do?
06:23 tanath it's far more annoying to change your nick to nick_away or something
06:23 tanath taht actually spams channel
06:23 Cylus It marks your client with some sort of "I'm not here" flag.
06:23 TriBlade9 Oh
06:23 TriBlade9 How do you undo it?
06:23 tanath TriBlade9, for me, in hexchat nicks turn to grey (dimmer)
06:23 tanath in user list
06:24 Cylus "/away" again, I think. It's been a while.
06:24 jordan4ibanez Goodnight
06:24 tanath or /back
06:24 tanath or start typing, usually
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06:24 tanath if autoreturn is enabled
06:25 tanath well g'night
06:25 Jonuz Does minetest use minecrafts textures?
06:25 TriBlade9 Not at all Jonuz, unless you use a texturepack that does so
06:26 Jonuz Ah ok, good
06:29 Cylus In KeePass, it is hard to read the menus (white text on a white background). Also, it refuses to let me open my KDB database, saying that it can only open such files on Windows.
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06:33 jp Jonuz : the textures are compatible, you have just to re-name them for minetest
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06:34 Jonuz I dont really care about that, just thought can microsoft sue minetest or someone for using their textures
06:35 jp Jonuz : you can't share the MC textures for minetest
06:38 drworman joined #minetest
06:43 drworman ,
06:43 drworman er, anyone awake?
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07:19 alket hi
07:19 alket what did i do , now im flying ?
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07:21 jp https://github.com/minetest/minetest  <-  +120 stars in 3/4 days 0_0
07:24 Jonuz someone shared it on reddit
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07:30 TriBlade9 New commit in the chat colors PR, fixed non-freetype building :D
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07:42 riddim thank u 2 all the ppl who worked on this and helped me out
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08:46 Megaf Hi all
08:47 TriBlade9 Hie
08:51 meldrian joined #minetest
08:51 MinetestBot meldrian: 09-15 18:23 UTC <Sokomine> du solltest deine englische welt auf mapgen v7 umstellen. sonst gibt es nur unmengen redwood und tannenartige baeume. mit v7 funktioniert ehtereal, und das stellt sehr schicke biome bereit, die zu erkunden sich lohnt
08:58 Megaf !tell Sokomine English please.
08:58 MinetestBot Megaf: I'll pass that on when Sokomine is around
08:59 Megaf !server Megaf
08:59 MinetestBot Megaf: Megaf Server v4.0 | minetest.megaf.info:30003 | Clients: 0/9, 0/0 | Version: 0.4.10-Megaf / MegafXplore | Ping: 1165ms
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08:59 TriBlade9 Dat ping doe
09:00 TriBlade9 Okay, I've got a PR that will make tons of Minecrafters want to give me a big hug <3
09:00 Megaf Is anyone here using the bees mod?
09:01 meldrian Megaf, it just tells me that i should use mapgen v7 with ethereal instead of mapgen v6
09:01 TriBlade9 Quick question
09:01 meldrian its kinda funny though
09:02 TriBlade9 Are things like mobs and item drops called entities or objects?
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09:17 sol_invictus farming:weed - anyone knows where is the definition?
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09:18 sol_invictus TriBlade9: they are entities
09:19 TriBlade9 Thank you
09:21 sol_invictus that's probably why they are called objects sometimes http://dev.minetest.net/ObjectRef
09:23 TriBlade9 .help
09:23 TriBlade9 !help
09:23 MinetestBot https://github.com/sfan5/minetestb​ot-modules/blob/master/COMMANDS.md
09:36 sol_invictus !up m.ayntest.net
09:36 MinetestBot m.ayntest.net:30000 is up (376ms)
09:37 sol_invictus !server addr:m.ayntest.net
09:37 MinetestBot sol_invictus: Liberty Land Minetest | m.ayntest.net | Clients: 6/45, 6/12 | Version: 0.4.10-dev / minetest | Ping: 72ms
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10:06 RealBadAngel sol_invictus, in farming mod
10:08 sol_invictus RealBadAngel: I can't find it
10:09 RealBadAngel are you sure about weed? not wheat?
10:09 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest_g​ame/blob/master/mods/farming/init.lua
10:09 lazers New to Mine{craft/test}, how do I install texture pack? http://wiki.minetest.net/Installing_Texture_Packs is terrible
10:09 lazers Basically, drop it in ~/.minecraft/textures ?
10:10 RealBadAngel yes, then select it in menu
10:10 RealBadAngel but in folder ofc
10:10 sol_invictus RealBadAngel: I'm sure, weed is the thing that grows over the soil nodes
10:10 RealBadAngel theres no "weed" in original farming mod
10:11 TriBlade9 Selection Box Line width PR: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1646
10:11 sol_invictus RealBadAngel: ahh, I finally found it. It's from farming_plus mod.
10:11 lazers RealBadAngel: ~/.minecraft... Phhft. (Moving it to minetest)
10:12 RealBadAngel lol, havent noticed that :P
10:13 lazers RealBadAngel: Thanks! I think I see the changes.... :)
10:15 heal joined #minetest
10:15 heal hi,I have a question....how I can install the mod
10:17 heal the daily package I cannot find the mods dir
10:17 adhoc joined #minetest
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10:17 RealBadAngel find your data folder ./minetest in your home directory
10:18 heal let me see.....
10:19 heal no such things
10:19 heal how comes....
10:20 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/dwimq23.png
10:22 RealBadAngel notice that folder is hidden, you cant see it in simple file managers
10:22 heal it don't have the mods dir and texture dir
10:22 RealBadAngel so create such folders
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10:22 RealBadAngel shall have such folders as on the screenshot
10:23 heal Ok...and put the zip file in the dir ?
10:23 RealBadAngel unzipped
10:23 heal ||-_-unzip failed
10:24 heal maybe their is something fualt
10:24 RealBadAngel link to the mod youre trying to install?
10:25 Taoki joined #minetest
10:26 lazers I have a feeling that minetest should create the empty directories (and create .ignore/.gitignore file inside them) to help potential minetest newcomers (as well as linux newcomers).
10:27 heal ....i am linuxer...
10:28 heal and a chinese whose english is not so well -_-||
10:29 meldrian joined #minetest
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10:30 RealBadAngel lazers, indeed, mt should get a little more newbie friendly
10:30 alexxs joined #minetest
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10:32 heal it doesn't have enough documents
10:32 heal and in china browser the google based website is very hard
10:33 heal it is too slow, or entirely cannot connected
10:33 lazers heal: I'm not familiar with minetest. It looks like you want to put the $MOD folder in ~/.minetest/mods/
10:33 heal be connected....
10:34 heal e,ye...
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10:42 heal RealBadAngel: i unzipped the zip package and mv the dir into the mod dir , failed.... the mod is not work
10:43 scourge joined #minetest
10:44 RealBadAngel name of the folder?
10:44 lazers heal: Install tree. Do $ tree -d ~/.minetest
10:44 RealBadAngel sometimes you need to change folder name for it to work
10:45 heal hupmap-master
10:45 heal ...
10:45 heal hudmap...
10:46 RealBadAngel skip -master in the name
10:46 heal ok...
10:46 RealBadAngel github adds that shit to mods folder name
10:47 heal doesnt work
10:47 heal ....
10:49 RealBadAngel have you enabled it?
10:50 heal enable?yes
10:50 heal but still not work
10:52 alexxs joined #minetest
10:52 lazers heal: I think RealBadAngel still want a link to the mod
10:53 heal hudmap, an mod to show a map
10:53 jp https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=9&amp;t=9901
10:54 jp you may need to generate an image somewhere to show the map (but not sure)
10:54 RealBadAngel !seen sapier
10:54 MinetestBot RealBadAngel: sapier was last seen at 2014-08-25 05:57:29 UTC on #minetest
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11:01 Megaf anyone using bees mod?
11:01 Megaf does it causes lag for you?
11:03 lazers heal: I'm getting the same thing. :o
11:03 lazers Mod loaded. /hudmap on # no work
11:04 RealBadAngel i think that mod need map file generated
11:05 lazers In README.txt, " Map images must be supplied by the server admin and configured in hudmap.conf."
11:06 heal what's mean of this!!!!!!!!!!
11:11 heal oh,yes,it worked
11:12 heal create a file,and copy the hudmap.conf.example into it,then name it hudmap.conf
11:12 heal then it worked!
11:12 heal when i putin /hudmap on
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11:47 fireglow Hi, with latest git I get the following error:
11:47 fireglow ERROR[CurlFetchThread]: servers.minetest.net/announce not found (Failure when receiving data from the peer) (response code 0)
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11:56 knobo Is there any scripting language supported?
11:56 knobo for creating mods
11:56 jin_xi knobo: yes, lua is used
11:56 knobo cool
11:56 knobo Any examples?
11:56 jin_xi yes, there are tons of mods in the forum, are you interested in anything specific?
11:57 knobo I'm just wondering about the posibilities
11:57 knobo Maybe I could get my son interested in programming
11:57 jin_xi https://raw.githubusercontent.com/min​etest/minetest/master/doc/lua_api.txt this is the api
11:57 jin_xi its really simple to add your own nodes for a start
11:57 jin_xi then make them do something
11:58 knobo cool
11:59 knobo so, a node is a block, then?
11:59 reactor knobo: try PilzAdam's Simple Mobs as a start
11:59 reactor They're really eegant.
11:59 reactor elegant, even
12:00 jin_xi yes in mt a node is whats a block in mc and a (map)block is a chunk
12:00 reactor By the way, why is MT using different terminology?
12:00 reactor It only confuses.
12:00 reactor This*
12:01 jin_xi idk why, but i think we need to deal with it
12:01 reactor Bet it may discourage switchers.
12:02 jin_xi its not such a big obstacle imho
12:02 reactor And MT does need more audience, especially on desktop. Because most tablet players suck.
12:02 knobo I just tried minetest out for a few minuts, and i think it's behaves a bit better then minecraft. The environment responds to events in a smoother way.
12:02 proller also mt have chunk and sector
12:02 jin_xi maybe a faq for people with mc experience would be enough to help
12:02 reactor Probably yes.
12:03 RealBadAngel term node comes from irrlicht engine mt uses
12:03 reactor Or a guide article, something "how to switch".
12:03 proller mut all mt term must be ranamed
12:03 reactor RealBadAngel: ah.
12:03 reactor That explains it, for I've been wondeing why "node".
12:04 RealBadAngel an object in irrlicht is scene node
12:05 knobo I guess recent events have boosted minetest's comunity (?)
12:05 proller no
12:05 reactor knobo: I might have missed that. What happened?
12:06 reactor New update to Minecraft made it less crackable?
12:06 reactor :)
12:06 knobo no, MS is buying mc
12:06 reactor Oh. *chuckles*
12:07 reactor Microsoft Cube Simulator
12:08 PjotrOrial_ Microsoft Visual Mining and Crafting Simulator 2014
12:08 jin_xi now kinect only
12:09 reactor The key word is Visual Mining.
12:10 reactor That'd also be a good nod to Chuck Norris.
12:11 chchjesus knobo: Has bought*
12:12 chchjesus Macro$haftcraft simulator
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12:18 Megaf sfan5: Hi there, are you aware of this? 09:13:17: ERROR[CurlFetchThread]: servers.minetest.net/announce not found (Failure when receiving data from the peer) (response code 0)
12:19 Megaf also, theres almost no servers listed here http://servers.minetest.net
12:19 reactor Megaf: DNS malfunction, again?
12:20 Megaf I dont think so, ai can open its website
12:20 Megaf I*
12:21 Megaf PING servers.minetest.net (212.38.181.18) 56(84) bytes of data.
12:21 Megaf 64 bytes from meow.minetest.net (212.38.181.18): icmp_req=1 ttl=53 time=215 ms
12:22 Megaf It seems quite healthy
12:22 Megaf 10 packets transmitted, 10 received, 0% packet loss, time 9010ms
12:22 Megaf rtt min/avg/max/mdev = 215.970/216.284/216.630/0.319 ms
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12:40 hoodedice MORNINGS!
12:40 Amaz Afternoon!
12:40 Amaz :P
12:41 hoodedice so... no new people today?
12:41 ElectronLibre Afternoon starting.
12:41 hoodedice Did the influx just die out in one day?
12:41 TriBlade9 Evenin!
12:42 hoodedice oh, ^ you're new
12:42 hoodedice HI!
12:42 Amaz Wait for the weekend.
12:42 meldrian joined #minetest
12:42 hoodedice why weekend, I am busy on weekends, and I am at home, which == shitty net
12:42 * Amaz thinks the next influx will come at the weekend.
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12:49 PjotrOrial_ hoodedice: joining late to the party, how large was the increase here in this channel due to the news regarding minecraft?
12:49 hoodedice dunno
12:49 hoodedice was here for an hour yesterday, because Jordach
12:50 hoodedice som four or five new members
12:50 Amaz There's 30-40 more people here than there were before the M$ buyout.
12:50 hoodedice list on side shows 150, which is yes, 50-60 more than usual (80-90)
12:50 * Amaz thought that there were normally 100-110...
12:52 ElectronLibre 50-60 more than usual? Oo I didn't notice it x)..
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12:57 reactor Woah!
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13:01 sruz25 I suppose there's isn't any bug tracker? Couldn't find anything on the wiki
13:02 ibloat srijay, issues are tracked on github
13:02 Amaz sruz25: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues
13:02 ibloat err sruz25
13:03 Amaz ↑ That's the bug tracker.
13:03 ibloat sorry for nick-spamming srijay
13:03 Amaz :P
13:03 sruz25 oh, thanks
13:04 Amaz np
13:18 hoodedice any core devs here?
13:18 hoodedice I forgot why Minetest doesn't utilize the GPU much
13:18 hoodedice was it because bottling?
13:18 hoodedice oh oh, yes, memory thing. GPU memory is not utilized.
13:19 chchjesus hoodedice: Read the topic
13:19 chchjesus You want #minetest-dev
13:19 hoodedice =/
13:19 hoodedice devs hang out here too
13:19 Amaz chch, hoodedice is an old member... He does know about that :P
13:20 chchjesus Yes but the other channel is called #minetest-dev
13:20 chchjesus lol
13:20 chchjesus Oh sorry
13:20 Amaz :P
13:20 chchjesus .///.
13:20 hoodedice and you don't want to bother serious chats
13:20 Amaz
13:20 chchjesus Fair enough
13:20 hoodedice Amaz, was that sarcasm?
13:20 Amaz Mope.
13:20 hoodedice kk
13:20 Amaz *Nope.
13:20 hoodedice Because I haven't seen chchjesus until today
13:20 hoodedice =P =P
13:21 Amaz XD
13:21 Amaz Yep!
13:21 Rasmez joined #minetest
13:21 Rasmez Helllo!
13:21 chchjesus Heh
13:22 Broam morning Rasmez
13:22 Rasmez someone here know a good program to edit minetest models?
13:22 Amaz Nodeboxes?
13:23 Amaz Or mob models?
13:23 Rasmez entity models, like the boat or mobs
13:23 hoodedice blender
13:23 hoodedice and there was this voxel editing program a while back
13:24 hoodedice there is also sproxel, I think
13:24 Rasmez but... blender can't even open the .x files
13:24 hoodedice !g sproxel
13:24 MinetestBot hoodedice: http://code.google.com/p/sproxel/
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13:24 hoodedice yes, you need to convert them to .obj first
13:24 Amaz hoodedice, does that do for mob models?
13:24 hoodedice if you're on windows, there is this thing called FreeX2OBJ
13:24 hoodedice yes, sproxel does work for entities
13:25 Rasmez i try that, it import the .obj, but when i export it, it isn't load in the game properly
13:25 hoodedice .obj doesn't load properly?
13:25 hoodedice export as x
13:25 hoodedice there is also VoxelShop
13:26 Amaz O.o
13:26 Rasmez the exported .x doesn't load, it load the old .x
13:26 hoodedice but if you want to edit a pre-made model, you can only use Blender
13:26 hoodedice did you overwrite the old .x file in the mod folder?
13:26 Rasmez yeah
13:26 * Amaz has been looked for a model editing program that was not blender!
13:26 hoodedice which mod is it?
13:26 hoodedice Amaz, blender is hard to master, but worth it
13:26 Rasmez the default "boats" mod
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13:27 Rasmez i know how to use blender
13:27 hoodedice hmm...
13:27 Rasmez i use blender since 2010
13:27 hoodedice I can only guess that you are not overwriting the thing properly
13:27 ElectronLibre left #minetest
13:27 hoodedice delete the .x file in the model folder, and put your .x in it
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13:28 Amaz hoodedice, I can't even understand the basics of blender :P
13:28 Rasmez i try that, no use
13:28 hoodedice =/
13:28 Jordach joined #minetest
13:28 hoodedice Jordach is here
13:28 hoodedice just when we needed him
13:29 hoodedice Jordach: Rasmez tried to use a different model for boats, but it is not loading in game
13:29 hoodedice the old file is loading up instead
13:29 Amaz Clear the cache?
13:29 hoodedice hmm, yes
13:29 hoodedice maybe
13:29 hoodedice try that
13:30 Rasmez i will try that again... w8 plz
13:30 hoodedice sure =)
13:30 hoodedice also, delete the /cache/ folder
13:31 Rasmez shit i delete the model XD
13:31 Rasmez i need to edit it again XD
13:31 adidik joined #minetest
13:31 Rasmez is a sutil mod so... it will take me 2 minutes
13:33 Jordach Rasmez, change https://github.com/minetest/minetest_ga​me/blob/master/mods/boats/init.lua#L37 to the mesh mode + file type
13:33 Rasmez i have another idea, someone know how the boat texture unwraps?
13:33 Jordach eg, newboat.b3d
13:33 Jordach (this model must be in the models folder)
13:34 alexxs joined #minetest
13:35 * Jordach pulls a success meme
13:35 hoodedice thatsexactlywhatisaid.jpg
13:35 hoodedice Rasmez: no idea. Best you UV it again
13:35 Rasmez i have been adapting and creating a master mod + texture pack for minetest, using the BDCraft textures, and some of my own, so far i can retexturize all the game but that friking boat
13:36 Jordach hoodedice, two students in my course want to use G9X models for their animation
13:36 hoodedice what is a G9X model
13:36 hoodedice ?
13:36 hoodedice !g G9x
13:36 MinetestBot hoodedice: http://www.amazon.com/Logitech-Programma​ble-Laser-Gaming-Precision/dp/B001NTFATI
13:36 * hoodedice slaps MinetestBot
13:36 Jordach unrelated hoodedice, but https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0vzOwHVRI8
13:36 Jordach https://www.dropbox.com/s/mqh5qp2kan​2io5g/G9M-SpecialProject.blend?dl=0
13:37 alexxss joined #minetest
13:38 kruug This is the one to go with: http://smile.amazon.com/Razer-Ouroboros-​Elite-Ambidextrous-Gaming/dp/B00EWEHI5K/​ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&amp;qid=1410961071&am​p;sr=8-1&amp;keywords=razer+ouroboros
13:44 hoodedice Jordach: face is BLAAAAACK
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13:48 Jordach wat
13:48 Jordach hoodedice, update yer blender
13:48 hoodedice 2.69 is OLD?
13:49 hoodedice kk
13:49 Jordach yes
13:49 Jordach 2.71 is out
13:49 Jordach (and 2.72 is coming)
13:49 hoodedice update == download and install from website?
13:49 Jordach yes
13:49 hoodedice k thnx m8
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13:54 chchjesus I'm running two instances of Minetest at once
13:54 chchjesus And I still get ~30fps on each
13:54 chchjesus Not bad
13:54 chchjesus I reckon minecraft wouldn't handle that as well
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13:59 hoodedice Need someone to proofread this: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.ph​p?f=10&amp;t=10134&amp;p=154378#p154378
13:59 Jordach chchjesus, hardware?
14:01 chchjesus Err
14:01 chchjesus I guess I'm kinda cheating
14:01 chchjesus Nvidia GTX760
14:01 chchjesus i3-2100 3.1GHz
14:01 chchjesus 8GB RAM
14:01 Jordach chchjesus, Minetest doesn't actually use the GPU as one would think (that's irrlichts fault)
14:01 chchjesus WD 500GB HDD (7200 RPM I think)
14:01 chchjesus Jordach: Wow, weird
14:02 Amaz hoodedice, seems good, I don't think hacked clients can get blocks though, as that is all done server side. They can get fly, fast and noclip though, I think, but as you said, beyond the reach of an 11 year old.
14:03 hoodedice Jordach: Show chchjesus that pic of your using Minetest inside Linux inside Windows.
14:03 hoodedice nono
14:03 chchjesus lol
14:03 Jordach chchjesus, same here but with shaders disabled, ~35fps https://cdn.mediacru.sh/w_Iw0xhT6mDM.png
14:04 chchjesus I have all the settings enabled
14:04 Amaz Ah. That wasn't how you wanted it proofread? Spelling then? :P
14:04 Jordach chchjesus, notbad.jpg
14:04 hoodedice nono, Amaz
14:04 hoodedice not 11 year old
14:04 chchjesus wait, I thought Irrlicht used GLSL
14:04 hoodedice it is "comitted 11-year-old shits with parents too concerned with basing Obama on FB to monitor their larvae"
14:05 Amaz yeah.
14:05 Jordach chchjesus, depends on the video driver in action
14:05 hoodedice Best thing I ever read in my whole life
14:05 Amaz XD
14:05 Jordach i get rediculous FPS with D3D enabled
14:05 Rasmez Minecraft will be dead soon guys, Crapsoft buys it, and you what they do to their games...
14:05 Nascher joined #minetest
14:05 Jordach spotify:track:0pfoWZtXbwryWv6oVaQG0g
14:05 Jordach "they defiled it, with dark magic"
14:05 hintss lol
14:06 hoodedice No Rasmez
14:06 hoodedice You don't want to stoop that low
14:06 hoodedice FUD is only for Microsoft
14:06 Rasmez u wanna bet hoodedice?
14:07 hoodedice well...
14:07 hoodedice let's just not do that now
14:07 Rasmez great quoute form HP, jordach, nice touch
14:07 chchjesus We should pull DirectX support and just use OpenGL
14:07 chchjesus lol
14:08 Rasmez yeah
14:08 Rasmez OpenGL rulez!!
14:09 Jordach https://cdn.mediacru.sh/eOoXEPRLaYp9.png + Dreambuilder
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14:11 DusXMT Rasmez: I don't thinkk minecraft will go away, even after the buyout, its fanbase is just rediculously big
14:11 CraigyDavi Why is servers.minetest.net so empty? :o
14:14 * hoodedice 's TOX 06EC0C8CA2D3C550159395189B16AFDD2E1A99​026D2CCF33622D06B1D653E61912BBD16F5BA6
14:15 Jordach meow
14:16 SylvieLorxu Heh, Tox is getting popular
14:16 SylvieLorxu At least among geeks
14:16 * Jordach pokes hoodedice
14:17 * hoodedice blames sfan5
14:17 Jordach don't blame the kitty
14:17 reactor Oh yeah. Invent a new bicycle.
14:17 reactor How is IRC not satisfying?
14:17 hoodedice people already did
14:17 SylvieLorxu reactor: Is that a real question?
14:18 * SylvieLorxu stretches
14:18 SylvieLorxu Okay, time to list it
14:18 proller joined #minetest
14:18 SylvieLorxu 1. IRC is client-server
14:18 SylvieLorxu 2. IRC is built in a way where, if only one person in the channel isn't using HTTPS, ALL channel chats are COMPLETELY in the clear
14:18 SylvieLorxu 3. IRC has no built-in encryption
14:18 SylvieLorxu 4. User account support is basically duct tape
14:18 SylvieLorxu 5. The server can read everything
14:19 SylvieLorxu 6. Server OPs can impersonate other users
14:19 SylvieLorxu I guess those are the main issues
14:19 hoodedice this is not #IRC
14:19 reactor Everythig but "1" and "5" can be fixed.
14:19 reactor Don't need to ditch the thing because of those.
14:19 SylvieLorxu (At 5, yes, server admins can read your /queries)
14:19 reactor DCC.
14:19 SylvieLorxu IRC works for systems like this
14:19 SylvieLorxu But for personal chatting, it's a complete mess
14:20 Rasmez Still the friking boat model doesn't load =(
14:20 hoodedice JORDACH !!!
14:20 SylvieLorxu Tox isn't in the same league as IRC, it's definitely worth the development time
14:20 hoodedice HIS MODEL DOESN'T WORK
14:20 bluej100 joined #minetest
14:20 Jordach eh
14:20 * Jordach can't do shit without a boats mod folder
14:20 Jordach that has been modified
14:20 SylvieLorxu It'd be better to compare Tox to something like Skype instead, as it wants to replace that, not to something like IRC
14:20 hoodedice Rasmez, the Brit has given you the Brit answer
14:21 reactor Also, no text interface?
14:21 Jordach hoodedice, the hat layer is black because blender interprets materials with alpha as black
14:21 reactor And how is that supposed to appeal to technical people?
14:21 Jordach you're supposed to cut it out like a paper snowflake
14:21 hoodedice but
14:22 SylvieLorxu Tox has a CLI client, "Toxic". There is also someone who is writing a Weechat plugin for Tox and you could use the WIP Pidgin plugin in Bitlbee
14:22 hoodedice I am not a special snowflake
14:22 hoodedice shall I start the drama?
14:22 SylvieLorxu Also, I'm a technical person yet I still like GUIs at times
14:22 hoodedice #GamerGate. Endless drama in one word.
14:22 Rasmez the boat mod folder is in minetest game forder, minetest-0.4.10-64bit (or whatever)/games/minetest_ga​me/mods/boats/models/boat.x
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14:23 hoodedice yes, Rasmez.
14:23 reactor If GUIs were more typis-friendly I wouldn't mind using them.
14:23 hoodedice paste your model as boat.x
14:23 SylvieLorxu reactor: https://wiki.tox.im/Toxic
14:23 reactor s/pis/pist/
14:23 reactor I see.
14:23 hoodedice reactor likes Excel 95
14:23 * reactor slaps hoodedice
14:23 hoodedice lel
14:23 reactor TeX.
14:23 hoodedice now I know why LibreOffice still has a shitty interface
14:24 SylvieLorxu I wouldn't use TeX, but LaTeX is nice
14:24 reactor I wouldn't also mind if there was a TeX typesetter for MS .doc.
14:24 hoodedice LaTex condoms are best.
14:24 * hoodedice runs away
14:24 chchjesus pls
14:24 hoodedice srry
14:24 reactor Because some assholes only accept .doc.
14:24 Jordach suddenly: Open Source Condoms from MS
14:24 Jordach now that would be a mindfuck
14:24 hoodedice Jordach, stahp
14:24 chchjesus reactor: Or worse: .docx
14:24 reactor Yeah.
14:24 hoodedice docx? Send them .txt s
14:24 Jordach it can even be worse
14:25 reactor It surely can. What if they make a new, completely proprietary format?
14:25 Jordach https://cdn.mediacru.sh/JUKYmyUeJx_L.png
14:25 reactor The whole "office" thing sucks.
14:25 reactor It's not "productivity suite", it's "counterproductivity suite".
14:25 reactor All those menus and buttons that do nothing. And manual formatting.
14:25 hoodedice reactor pls
14:26 hoodedice you don't understand accountants
14:26 Rasmez nice one reactor XD
14:26 DusXMT reactor: docx is fully propriotary, its standard is a 9000-page book that costs a shit-ton of money, and they can sue anyone who implements it
14:26 hoodedice they need pritti things
14:26 Jordach oh pls i did most of my sixth form work with GNU nano
14:26 hoodedice nano
14:26 hoodedice lel
14:26 reactor DusXMT: it is, but somehow OOffice supports it
14:26 Jordach ...on a windows system
14:27 hoodedice I still use LibreOffice, even when my final submission is in .doc
14:27 hoodedice I have to reformat the doc three times
14:27 reactor Accountants don't care what you feed them.
14:27 Jordach does lies count
14:27 hoodedice once in Libre, then in Drive, then in Office, before printing
14:27 reactor They may as well suck it up if you deployed the proper tools on them.
14:27 SylvieLorxu I'm pretty sure .docx is an Open Standard but that Microsoft purposely implements it differently in Word, causing incompatibility on purpose
14:27 hoodedice nah
14:28 hoodedice most accountants are a bunch of whiny jerks
14:28 chchjesus I used to work as a computer technician, and when we got customers' computers, and had to install Office for them, we would install Libreoffice
14:28 hoodedice and will whimper at the slightest mention of anything that is not Windows, not Office
14:28 chchjesus But when we had to install MS Office, we would force it to generate .doc or .xls files
14:28 chchjesus not .docx or .xlsx
14:28 Jordach hoodedice, ask Germany, France and most of Europe on OSS formats
14:28 hoodedice And that's why chchjesus does not have a job today
14:28 hoodedice =P
14:28 Jordach hint: they all use OSS compliant stuff
14:29 reactor SylvieLorxu: don't get me started on formatting and layout issues with that multitude of editors.
14:29 Rasmez here in venezuela is mandatory to use open format in public distribution of information from the state
14:29 TBC_x the .docx is just "so called open standard" MS had to hand over a lot of money to get it approved
14:29 hoodedice Well, Jordach, this is not Europe.
14:29 SylvieLorxu reactor: LaTeX is still the best, yeah
14:29 SylvieLorxu Just needs to be made simpler to use, but formatting is not something users should do
14:29 hoodedice heh, India uses .pdf s
14:29 reactor It's not perfect, especially doing something for the first time in it.
14:30 reactor Can spend a day heating the room before you realise what package is the most suitable.
14:30 reactor Guess it's facing the same problem as other areas: multitude of standards, none of which are complete?
14:31 reactor Formatting manually really sucks.
14:31 reactor And those "styles" they implemented in office aren't the first thing a new user would grasp.
14:31 reactor Most end up formatting everything by hand then reformatting again and again.
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14:39 proller joined #minetest
14:45 kruug ok, got a simple database set up...now to start putting in mods :)
14:47 DusXMT_ joined #minetest
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14:59 alket joined #minetest
14:59 alket where do i find all the cheat codes for /giveme ?
14:59 ^v joined #minetest
15:00 reactor alket: node defining lua files.
15:00 reactor s/de de/de-de/
15:00 reactor Or item-defining.
15:01 reactor My favourite /give items are "ignore" and "air".
15:01 alket thanks , whats that with lua files , where are them
15:01 alket i downloaded the Home Decor , but which is the lua file ?
15:01 _3SidedSquare joined #minetest
15:02 _3SidedSquare What up
15:02 reactor ${MINETEST}/mods/${MOD}/
15:04 alket got it thanks
15:04 reactor yw
15:06 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
15:06 jojoa1997 Hello
15:07 jojoa1997 Anyone remember where the stats for #minetest are?
15:07 Nascherr joined #minetest
15:09 DusXMT How many fps can one expect on a Pentium 3 machine with a non-3d capable graph. card? (guesses 1-2fps)
15:09 PjotrOrial_ celeron55: would you mind if I register minetest with https://scan.coverity.com/ ?
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15:10 Cylus joined #minetest
15:11 Jordach tl;dr /r/minetest is karma central
15:12 Jordach mmm mmhmm
15:13 reactor DusXMT: how do you mean non-3d-capable?
15:13 reactor Man, this is pointless.
15:13 reactor I remember trying to get MT to run on a machine without video drivers.
15:13 jojoa1997 techically all games on computers are 2d unless you have a 3d screen
15:13 reactor Burningsvideo (I believe that backend has been removed) with minimal settings.
15:14 DusXMT Yup, no OpenGL. I guess you're right, not even worth trying
15:14 reactor All I could get on that CPU renderer was 15 fps -- it was on a 2000 MHz machine.
15:15 reactor And many graphical artifacts, because I had disabled a lot of stuff.
15:15 reactor Leave that machine as a server ;)
15:15 reactor It can host a couple worlds no problem.
15:16 jojoa1997 I wish i could run a server
15:16 DusXMT Hmmm, MT server sounds light-weight
15:18 reactor God I wish they cancelled that stupid law about hosting services in Russia.
15:19 jojoa1997 bbl
15:20 Cylus reactor: What law?
15:20 lazers mc/mt newbie: Why can the guy kill me easily? And I'm unable to kill him back easily.
15:20 hmmmm joined #minetest
15:20 Jordach lazers, they may have been playing in that world before you
15:21 lazers Jordach: Ah. How do I build stuffs? I have nothing (bottom)
15:21 Jordach lazers, you may want to watch let's plays of minecraft
15:22 Jordach most stuff converts 1:1
15:22 _3SidedSquare Is there a wiki page about "Main differences between minetest and minecraft"?
15:22 DusXMT lazers: so basically, dirt -> trees -> stone -> ... -> mese
15:23 Broam _3SidedSquare: here's the first line " they're different games. abandon expectations that this is a straight-up clone. "
15:25 reactor _3SidedSquare: instead, embrace the fact it's so flexible you can turn it into virtually anything by writing or installing mods.
15:26 reactor Cylus: "the law about bloggers". Hipsters spread lies -- everyone must suffer.
15:26 jordan4ibanez joined #minetest
15:26 Broam _3SidedSquare: if you start one, here's a few things for you: no crafting tables. mining puts items in your inventory directly. no rot (by default). sticks are 1 plank, not 2.
15:27 Broam _3SidedSquare: anything flagged as a plant can be used for furnace fuel (coal smelts for 40 seconds, which is ~13 items). Good luck.
15:27 Calinou joined #minetest
15:27 Broam oh, and the one that'll drive you nuts the longest - to descend a ladder you have to use the crouch key.
15:28 Cylus reactor: So now hosting weblogs is illegal?
15:28 Broam only because unlearning is hard. I prefer minetest's setup
15:28 reactor Pretty counter-intuitive, why not make player climb the direction their camera is facing?
15:29 reactor Cylus: it's not illegal.
15:29 reactor But now anyone hosting any services must write a document and submit it to god knows where.
15:29 reactor I don't care enough to do that to host a game server.
15:29 Broam reactor: because it's a different game. different decisions. I like the idea that you can hang on a ladder infinitely.
15:29 reactor Broam: I didn't say the player must move on it.
15:30 reactor Just make the forward key move them wherever they're facing?
15:30 reactor Like on the ground?
15:30 lazers DusXMT: Dirt? Where can I find dirt? I see apples.
15:30 jray541 joined #minetest
15:30 reactor And reserve jump and sneak keys for exactly that?
15:30 PenguinDad reactor: You mean like in most FPSes?
15:30 reactor Yep.
15:30 Cylus Oh, joy. It seems like the real threat isn't going to follow that procedure anyway, so all it does is prevent legitimate services from being hosted.
15:31 reactor Cylus: exactly.
15:31 reactor That's like terrorism protection.
15:31 jray541 hey whats up with the server list
15:31 Calinou <Broam> oh, and the one that'll drive you nuts the longest - to descend a ladder you have to use the crouch key.
15:31 Calinou good thing
15:31 Calinou you can use aux1_descends anyway
15:31 jray541 most the servers are gone including mine off the list even though its active
15:31 reactor All those measures only make life of normal people harder.
15:31 Calinou if you're into pressing a weird key to descend
15:32 reactor And terrorists will find the way to blow 'em up anyway.
15:32 Calinou (and not being able to use both fast mode and ladder)
15:32 LemonLake joined #minetest
15:32 Calinou <reactor> Pretty counter-intuitive, why not make player climb the direction their camera is facing?
15:32 Calinou you have to aim up and down all the time
15:32 LemonLake 1/(1/2) = 2
15:32 Calinou it's good to use jump/sneak to move up and down, it makes sense
15:32 Calinou more than using viewing angle
15:32 Calinou <PenguinDad> reactor: You mean like in most FPSes?
15:32 adidik joined #minetest
15:32 Calinou most FPS allow both view angle and jump/sneak
15:32 reactor To move up while facing down, one could press "go backwards".
15:33 Calinou sometimes jump/sneak is exceedingly slow, so players use view angle
15:33 jray541 ERROR[CurlFetchThread]: servers.minetest.net/announce not found (Failure when receiving data from the peer) (response code 0)
15:33 Calinou in real life, you can climb a ladder while looking down and descend one while looking up.
15:33 reactor Damn it.
15:33 reactor So can you do that with the setup I'm suggesting.
15:33 PenguinDad LemonLake: Thanks I didn't know that :p
15:33 reactor Any direction, just relatively to the camera.
15:34 VanessaE good morning.
15:34 reactor Mowing, VanessaE
15:34 Jordach meowing
15:34 Calinou camera relativeness is bad for movement, IMO
15:34 reactor mourning
15:34 Calinou even when flying
15:34 Cylus Morning, VanessaE.
15:34 Calinou <reactor> To move up while facing down, one could press "go backwards".
15:34 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/va​nessa/hobbies/minetest/stats.html <--- I got DDoS'd! :D
15:34 Calinou that works, but then you have to “switch” your movement keys around if you're changing pitch angle
15:34 reactor Okay, let's make arrow keys move player relatively to the world coordinates.
15:35 Calinou reactor, as in, vertical camera (pitch)
15:35 reactor So do you have to do that while running on the ground or flying.
15:35 Cylus Why are you happy that you got DDoSed?
15:35 Calinou hey, the server and client still don't send pitch to entities
15:35 reactor Where it by some miracle isn't a big problem.
15:35 Calinou entities have no pitch, players have no pitch
15:36 reactor Hmm.
15:36 reactor Cylus: because who DoSes game servers. Honestly!
15:36 LemonLake a = b   | * b
15:36 LemonLake ab = b² | - (a^2)
15:36 LemonLake a(b-a) = (b-a)(b+a)  | / (b-a)
15:36 LemonLake a = b+a | / (b-a)
15:36 LemonLake a = a + a
15:36 LemonLake a = 2a
15:36 LemonLake 1 = 2
15:37 reactor LemonLake: can't divide by (b-a)
15:37 Cylus LemonLake: You can't divide by ... Drats, I was too slow.
15:37 reactor Even a schoolboy will tell you you first have to say that b <> a.
15:37 Cylus I need to learn to type faster.
15:37 jray541 VanessaE: i got some people in my server last night that had an explioted game client i think? hey do you know why most of the servers aren't showing up on the public server list? including mine? the error is ERROR[CurlFetchThread]: servers.minetest.net/announce not found (Failure when receiving data from the peer) (response code 0)
15:37 * reactor chuckles
15:38 LemonLake yes, I jsut realised
15:38 LemonLake some dude is trying to get me to weird you dudes out with math
15:38 LemonLake and he's getting it very wrong
15:38 reactor jray541: that seems like two different problems?
15:38 reactor LemonLake: rich imagination? ;)
15:39 jray541 reactor: yeah i banned the trouble makers thats not a problem anymore
15:39 jordan4ibanez Yo Calinou, did you see the crazy fire I'm making?
15:40 Calinou ?
15:40 Calinou <reactor> Cylus: because who DoSes game servers. Honestly!
15:40 Calinou suddenly: sauerbraten.org
15:40 Calinou it's getting like 1 DDoS every 2 months
15:40 reactor I mean. What's the point?
15:40 reactor That's not evil enough.
15:40 VanessaE Cylus: I'm not happy about it of course.  But I am amused because his attempt was such a miserable failure :)
15:40 Cylus What's the point of DDoSing any server? To be a pain in the neck for other people.
15:41 jordan4ibanez Calinou: http://youtu.be/bDLtDaS29ns
15:41 Cylus VanessaE: So you stayed up? Sweet!
15:41 reactor And exactly that fails when that pain in the neck gets laughed at, which VanessaE did correctly.
15:42 VanessaE Cylus: yeah, the hardware and minetest instances don't seem to have suffered any ill effects
15:42 Calinou how did you make a player count graph like that, VanessaE?
15:43 VanessaE Calinou: I scrape debug.txt
15:43 VanessaE see the "watchlogs" scripts in http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vane​ssa/hobbies/minetest/Server-scripts
15:44 nman3600 joined #minetest
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15:45 VanessaE Calinou: what I do basically is scrape debug.txt, write the count to a file, and another script comes along and logs that count into an rrdtool database, which is then graphed along with the others
15:45 VanessaE the file the count is written to is zeroed out when the server restarts (see minetestserver-xxxxx.sh) and during nightly backups
15:46 VanessaE each server has its own counter stored in a separate file, they're all logged separately, and then graphed at the end of it all.
15:47 VanessaE it's horribly non-scalable and hacky as all fuck but it works :)
15:47 nyuszika7h joined #minetest
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15:55 megaproxy do i have to create the config file?
15:55 megaproxy there is nothing in my ./minetest other than debug.txt
15:56 jordan4ibanez megaproxy: Did you compile it yourself/
15:56 jordan4ibanez ?*
15:56 megaproxy nope
15:56 megaproxy followed this http://wiki.minetest.com/wik​i/Setting_up_a_server/Ubuntu
15:57 Weedy joined #minetest
15:57 Weedy joined #minetest
15:57 VanessaE megaproxy: Minetest will create a minimal config file on its own I believe, but yeah you will need to set that up too.
15:58 Megaf joined #minetest
15:58 Calinou if installed with a package (which is clearly not RUN_IN_PLACE), the configuration will be written by the client in ~/.minetest/minetest.conf
15:59 Calinou on a server, it is unlikely that it'll be created on shut down
15:59 megaproxy well i ran the server, it started ok
15:59 megaproxy but didnt make a config
15:59 Calinou on shut down?
15:59 Calinou most programs write their configuration files on shut down
15:59 megaproxy it didnt seem to..
16:00 lazers I hide somewhere. Idle. Come back. I died. Is it because somebody killed me?
16:00 _3SidedSquare lazers: What?
16:02 Jordach lazers, yeah
16:02 Jordach most likely
16:03 Jordach depends if the world has mobs installed
16:03 reactor LemonLake: that'll teach you to not waste server side processing.
16:03 megaproxy configplzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
16:03 megaproxy where you hiding
16:03 reactor And player slots.
16:04 reactor I remember half players idling indefinitely until I introduced a script that would kick idlers.
16:04 lazers Jordach: Ah I see. I think I saw few mobs at nighttime. I was so far away from the spawn area and definitely in a rural tunnel with several rooms. Nobody were there.
16:04 lazers Jordach: Thanks for answering.
16:06 megaproxy i dont even  have a mods folder?
16:07 reactor megaproxy: man 1 mkdir
16:07 Calinou lazers, it can be a mob
16:07 Calinou or lava flowing on you then being removed
16:07 Calinou or someone dug under you and made you fall?
16:07 megaproxy i can mk the dir
16:07 megaproxy thats not the issue
16:07 megaproxy it should be auto made along with the config, as far as i can tell
16:08 Calinou (hint: once you are dead, you can't be moved, except if teleported by another player)
16:08 megaproxy and neither are being generated
16:08 Calinou megaproxy, yes, create the directory
16:08 megaproxy and the config?
16:08 Calinou same
16:08 reactor Someone teleported him to lava and then teleported back.
16:08 Calinou it's just a text file where you can write stuff
16:08 Calinou comments begin with #
16:08 megaproxy "This file is read every time the game starts and is always created/modified when the menu quits."
16:08 Calinou http://wiki.minetest.net/minetest.conf
16:08 Calinou all options are here
16:08 megaproxy mine isnt being created
16:08 NakedFury joined #minetest
16:09 Calinou that's by the client
16:09 megaproxy aaaaah, so not server
16:09 reactor "22:07 < reactor> megaproxy: man 1 mkdir" ;)
16:09 Calinou https://raw.githubusercontent.com/celeron​55/minetest/master/minetest.conf.example
16:09 Calinou this is a more complete one
16:09 Calinou you can use it, rename it to minetest.conf
16:09 Calinou uncomment the options you want to modify
16:09 megaproxy reactor: ls
16:09 megaproxy debug.txt  mods  worlds
16:09 megaproxy made it a while ago
16:09 megaproxy was just wondering why it wasnt there originally, or if it should be or not
16:10 megaproxy it should go in ./minetest/mods right?
16:10 reactor How long has it been since people unlearned to discover the structure on configs on their own?
16:10 shadowzone joined #minetest
16:10 reactor Come on, it's one of the easiest config files you'll ever see!
16:10 megaproxy im not having a issue with making one
16:10 megaproxy its the fact someone said a bit ago that it should be auot made
16:10 megaproxy so i was looking for it
16:10 megaproxy to change things
16:10 * megaproxy makes one now he knows
16:11 shadowzone Megaf?
16:11 Rasmez joined #minetest
16:11 reactor There should be one when you fetch the source.
16:11 reactor I don't know who had removed it on your machine.
16:11 megaproxy noon..
16:11 megaproxy noone*
16:11 megaproxy it was never there
16:11 reactor "nobody" is a user, too.
16:11 megaproxy haha
16:12 megaproxy oh yea, so mods in ./minetest/mods
16:12 LemonLake reactor: what will?
16:12 megaproxy it auto looks there?
16:12 reactor LemonLake: sorry, not you.
16:12 reactor lazers: 22:03 < reactor> LemonLake: that'll teach you to not waste server side processing.
16:12 reactor s/LemonLake/lazers/
16:13 reactor 22:04 < reactor> I remember half players idling indefinitely until I installed a script that would kick idlers.
16:15 tanath there should be an option for the world to wrap around
16:15 Rasmez Hi everyone
16:16 reactor tanath: I second that. Would prevent players from falling off finite worlds.
16:16 tanath apparently you don't. you just stand on the void
16:16 reactor Oh yeah?
16:16 tanath or walk into invisible
16:16 tanath wall
16:17 reactor Well tell that to those who did manage to jump out of my finite map and complained infinitely.
16:17 jordan4ibanez Ahh shit.
16:17 reactor I had to write up a kludge that would kill them.
16:17 jordan4ibanez How do I modify the terrain using the voxel manip without using on_generated?
16:17 Nascher joined #minetest
16:17 tanath you say finite map...
16:17 Mikeonline joined #minetest
16:17 Mikeonline hi
16:17 tanath my understanding was all maps were finite
16:18 shadowzone Hi Mikeonline, how are you?
16:18 tanath if you limited it to less than the existing limits maybe that's why?
16:18 reactor Theoretically, MT is supposed to be infinite-world. Practically, the maximum is 32x32 km.
16:18 Calinou ±30,912 in all directions
16:18 reactor That makes 60 km.
16:19 twoelk joined #minetest
16:19 tanath ~62km/side
16:19 rubenwardy joined #minetest
16:19 reactor yep
16:19 shadowzone Can I get a hostmask?
16:19 PenguinDad reactor: It's 61×61 kn
16:19 PenguinDad *km
16:19 reactor shadowzone: #freenode eh.
16:19 reactor shadowzone: nice address.
16:19 tanath 31+31=62
16:19 shadowzone Thanks.
16:19 rubenwardy Hi all!
16:19 reactor ;)
16:20 reactor rubenwardy: how's the rubber?
16:20 shadowzone huh?
16:20 Calinou shadowzone, you already have one
16:20 shadowzone I do?
16:20 Calinou you want a cloak, and for that you ask in #freenode
16:20 Calinou for the cloak to be optimal, log in using SASL
16:20 Calinou (requires a compatible client)
16:20 shadowzone Okay.
16:20 kruug i recommend irssi
16:20 shadowzone Is hexchat compatible?
16:20 tanath yes
16:21 Jordach https://cdn.mediacru.sh/7qO055cQdGcs.png
16:21 Jordach made a real skin for hoodedice
16:22 pokemon_shadow joined #minetest
16:22 shadowzone Give me a second.
16:23 shadowzone I'm configuring my hexchat,'
16:23 kruug oh...it's `hooded ice`...I thought it was `hoode dice`
16:23 khonkhortisan joined #minetest
16:23 reactor kruug: highfive
16:23 shadowzone Nice Jordach.
16:23 reactor But why does it read so?
16:24 twoelk megaproxy: the minetest.config is not created on installation. Easiest way to create is to go to settings tab and change something in the change keys section like double jump for fly and save the settings. The config file will be then created in the correct place
16:24 reactor People tend to cut the shortest possible words?
16:24 tester_ joined #minetest
16:24 megaproxy twoelk: is that client or server?
16:24 shadowzone joined #minetest
16:25 tester_ hy
16:26 shadowzone joined #minetest
16:26 twoelk ah you are setting up a server, well that may include manually adding it ;-P; my bad, if so
16:27 megaproxy aha np
16:27 megaproxy workuing my way through making one now
16:27 megaproxy while also tracking down a botnet
16:27 * Jordach puts $5 on markv
16:28 kruug reactor: i have no idea...maybe I'm just wired wrong :)
16:28 shadowzone Jordach, I think we all put $5 on him.
16:29 reactor That's okay. If you think about it, human brain is the biggest kludge ever. No wonder it creates other kludges.
16:29 twoelk creating your own game for the server by collecting all mods into a game folder may be advisable. A config file could be included there. You could study that by investigating a game
16:29 * PenguinDad puts $-5 on markv
16:30 reactor twoelk: how come it is advisable?
16:30 shadowzone Is hexchat compatible for a SASL?
16:30 twoelk easier maintenance
16:30 reactor But how?
16:30 trevin joined #minetest
16:31 shadowzone Okay I asked for a cloak on this network and a minetest GC needs to ask for me.
16:31 reactor Still have to update mods periodically?
16:31 shadowzone Due to it being affiliated with something.
16:31 Jordach shadowzone, go for unaffiliated
16:31 kruug shadowzone: are you wanting an unaffiliated cloak, like mine, or a Minetest cloak?
16:31 Jordach much better
16:31 shadowzone Okay.
16:31 Jordach shadowzone, the project must register it, and we said no
16:31 shadowzone Just a cloak.
16:31 shadowzone Okay.
16:32 twoelk yes but everything can be in one gamefolder that is of concern, including config files. Moving around is easier and the mods in the global mod folder can be kept appart
16:33 adidik joined #minetest
16:33 shadowzone So go with unaffiliated/shadowzone?
16:34 meldrian joined #minetest
16:34 Jordach yes
16:34 shadowzone Okay.
16:38 jray541 any insight on this error? ERROR[CurlFetchThread]: servers.minetest.net/announce not found (Failure when receiving data from the peer) (response code 0)
16:39 shadowzone I don't know what that is about but it is annoying.
16:40 PenguinDad joined #minetest
16:40 VanessaE jray541: odd error..
16:41 jordan4ibanez I just don't understand why this is wrong. http://pastie.org/pastes/9562664​/text?key=myx3je5nypjm4qwj4ywi0q
16:41 VanessaE that said, servers.minetest.net DOES work, but for some reason barely anything is showing up
16:41 jordan4ibanez Or doesn't work, I mean
16:41 VanessaE (in fact, about the only things I'm seeing there are my servers and about half a dozen others)
16:42 Xack :O
16:42 Xack minetest has been on GH trending for 2 days now
16:42 Xack nice
16:43 shadowzone Okay, what is GH?
16:43 Jordach Github
16:43 Xack GitHub
16:43 Xack Jordach'd
16:43 Xack :(
16:43 shadowzone Oh.
16:44 PenguinDad Xack: wow o.o
16:44 jray541 VanessaE: its really odd. my server is running fine besides that. all the other servers must be experiencing the same problem.
16:44 VanessaE I wonder wtf is going on
16:44 Broam hammered, I bet.
16:44 VanessaE I'm seeing a sudden up-tick in users on my servers again
16:45 VanessaE look at the stats page
16:45 Broam it's like an inverse attack of the clones
16:45 Broam s/of/on/
16:45 VanessaE it's going off the scale again
16:45 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/va​nessa/hobbies/minetest/stats.html
16:45 VanessaE (for my servers, this is "off the scale" :P )
16:46 jray541 VanessaE: is the culprit from a ukranian IP?
16:46 LemonLake up-tick?
16:47 shadowzone joined #minetest
16:47 shadowzone There we go I got a cloak.
16:48 VanessaE jray541: multiple IPs
16:48 VanessaE LemonLake: up-tick, noun, a notable increase
16:48 VanessaE :)
16:48 LemonLake I see
16:49 PenguinDad LemonLake: up-tick like up-quark but better :P
16:50 Calinou Xack, hi
16:50 Xack hey Calinou
16:50 Akien joined #minetest
16:50 Akien Hi there
16:51 Akien I built minetest with curl support, but I'm getting this issue when trying to retrieve the servers list:
16:51 Akien 18:50:16: ERROR[AsyncWorkerThread_3]: servers.minetest.net/list not found (Failure when receiving data from the peer) (response code 0)
16:52 _3SidedSquare joined #minetest
16:53 Akien I just wanted to know if the "response code 0" has a meaning that could give me some clues about what is wrong on my system
16:54 _3SidedSquare test?
16:54 rubenwardy No way. Trending on GitHub :O
16:54 _3SidedSquare Really?
16:54 Calinou yes
16:54 Calinou we're also on /r/linux frontpage, post with 1,140 karma
16:55 _3SidedSquare holy shit
16:55 _3SidedSquare minetest got big :D
16:55 Jordach we've had ~15% more IRC users as well
16:55 jray541 Akien: some other server operators including myself are experiencing the same error
16:56 Akien jray541: Ah that's good to know. Well, that I'm not the only one with the issue.
16:57 Akien My previous build was with curl 7.38.0, and it segfaulted when retrieving the server list. Now I downgraded to curl 7.37.1, and it just errors out, but no segfault.
16:58 Akien Ah actually yes it does segfault from time to time when ticking on/off the "Public servers list"
16:58 sfan5 Jordach: 170 ppl right now
16:58 Jordach sfan5, bots aren't sorta included
16:58 jray541 Calinou: explains the microsoft hackers messing with my server trying to discredit minetest :p
16:58 rubenwardy We need to work on user friendliness and guides and polish to stop the new users from running away.
16:59 rubenwardy For 'some things you may need to know' in getting started: "Minetest is built up of 'sub-games', usually refered to simply as [[Game||games]]. Minetest comes with a default sub-game called minetest_game."
16:59 rubenwardy Is that understandable?
16:59 _3SidedSquare Not really in laymans terms
16:59 _3SidedSquare an example maybe
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17:01 jray541 !ping
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17:01 twoelk rubenwardy: maybe using words such as minetest-the-engine and game-content
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17:02 rubenwardy that was the biggest netsplit I have ever seen
17:02 the0loko joined #minetest
17:02 rubenwardy aw fuck
17:02 rubenwardy not again
17:02 john_minetest joined #minetest
17:02 john_minetest hi
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17:03 rubenwardy Sorry for swearing, I didn't mean to type that. It just came out :/
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17:03 _3SidedSquare ok, what in the world happened there?
17:04 twoelk netsplit
17:04 rubenwardy "All the content in Minetest comes from Lua Mod Plugins. Most of the basic content comes from 'sub-games', usually referred to simply as [[Game||games]], which are collections of mods to make a basic game. Minetest comes with a default sub-game called minetest_game."
17:04 rubenwardy s/basic/base
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17:04 rubenwardy hmmm
17:04 rubenwardy I might comment it out for a later date.
17:05 jin_xi why insist on calling them sub games? theyre just games
17:05 _3SidedSquare to differentiate them from the minetest core
17:05 _3SidedSquare (I assume)
17:05 rubenwardy sub games are easier to explain, and c55 likes it
17:05 jin_xi oh
17:05 rubenwardy Although it is officially games
17:06 twoelk maybe lightweight-subgame to emphizise the limited gaming-content of Minetest-game
17:06 jin_xi idk i think we should just rename minetest_game to vanilla and be done with it.
17:06 _3SidedSquare nah, calling it a lightweight-subgame just gets more confuseing
17:06 _3SidedSquare I like jin_xi's solution
17:06 _3SidedSquare but I don't know how practical it is
17:07 rubenwardy * All the content in Minetest, such as blocks and tools, come from Lua Mod Plugins.
17:07 rubenwardy * Minetest is formed of a game engine and a vanilla game. A game in Minetest is a collection of Lua Mod Plugins which provide base content. A game can then be expanded by additional Lua Mod Plugins. Minetest comes with a default sub-game called minetest_game.
17:07 twoelk I really do think the word infinite should be avoided when describing minetest maps. It leads to wrong assumptions
17:07 rubenwardy oops, s/sub-game/game
17:07 jin_xi rubenwardy: now you have plugins subgames and games
17:07 jin_xi oh
17:08 rubenwardy * All the content in Minetest, such as blocks and tools, come from Lua Mod Plugins.
17:08 rubenwardy * Minetest is formed of a game engine and a vanilla 'game'. A 'game' in Minetest is a collection of Lua Mod Plugins which provide base content. A 'game' can then be expanded by additional Lua Mod Plugins. Minetest comes with a default 'game' called minetest_game.
17:08 rubenwardy s/Lua Mod Plugins/plugin Lua Mods/ ?
17:09 rubenwardy plugin should definitely be de-capitalised
17:09 jray541 i think its weird that microsoft buys mojang a few days ago. the minecraft community detests causing minetest to spike in popularity. the day after i have people exploiting my server. the public server isn't working correctly and VanessaE's server (major minetest host server) is getting DDos'ed???? wtf lol
17:09 twoelk vanilla=minetest_game?
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17:09 _3SidedSquare I don't even know if it's being ddos'd, or just not made to handel the influx of players
17:09 the0loko joined #minetest
17:10 rubenwardy * Mods in Minetest are plugins written in Lua.
17:10 rubenwardy * Mods in Minetest are on the server side. You do not need to install any mods when connecting to a server.
17:10 rubenwardy * All the content in Minetest, such as blocks and tools, come from Lua Mods.
17:10 rubenwardy * Minetest is formed of a game engine and a vanilla 'game'. A 'game' in Minetest is a collection of Lua Mods which provide base content. A 'game' can then be expanded by additional Lua Mods. Minetest comes with a default 'game' called minetest_game.
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17:11 _3SidedSquare Hey ruben, do you want to start a googledoc or something so peole can help you w/o useing the irc?
17:11 Broam etherpad
17:11 VanessaE jray541: it's gone from a DDoS to holy fuckballs I'm getting hammered by real users signing on because whatever's broken the master server list isn't enough to keep my servers from being de-listed
17:11 twoelk Maybe: The initial download of Minetest supplies the engine and a vanilla game called minetest_game
17:11 rubenwardy http://wiki.minetest.net/Getting_Started
17:12 _3SidedSquare *with a vanilla
17:12 twoelk more content (games, mods, textures) may be added by the user for use in singleplayer
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17:13 rubenwardy done
17:14 jray541 VanessaE: wooooow
17:14 _3SidedSquare how to add code blocks on the wiki?
17:14 _3SidedSquare I'm adding a bit to installing on gnu/linux
17:14 rubenwardy erm...
17:15 rubenwardy <source>
17:15 rubenwardy and </source>
17:15 twoelk looks good. Maybe we should add a section, especially for Linux, where to find important files and folders
17:15 rubenwardy so: <source>cmake . -DRUN_IN_PLACE = 1</source>
17:15 rubenwardy Yeah
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17:17 * twoelk should finish his folder trees (http://wiki.minetest.net/User:Twoelk/sandbox1)
17:17 sfan5_ joined #minetest
17:18 _3SidedSquare thanks,
17:19 _3SidedSquare I've forked minetest, and wanted to add more minecraft-like controls while in fluid, but looking at the source, it was obviously written so you need to explicitly controll yourself in the water
17:19 _3SidedSquare What's up with that?
17:19 Broam as in "water pushes you around"?
17:20 VanessaE _3SidedSquare: ask the folks in #minetest-dev
17:20 VanessaE you'll get a better answer there but be prepared to wait a little bit, an answer may not be as rapid as in here
17:20 _3SidedSquare no, as in you need to press control or space to go up/down in water
17:20 _3SidedSquare yo ucan't just look
17:21 _3SidedSquare I got class in about half an hour, I'll be back like 5:00 ish
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17:25 LemonLake what a netsplit
17:26 twoelk back from the other side?
17:27 kaeza joined #minetest
17:28 kaeza greetings
17:28 T4im joined #minetest
17:28 sslb anyone here played unturned?
17:29 Cylus Never heard of it. Is it free software?
17:29 sslb Yep, its like a minecraft game mixed with zombie survival
17:30 Cylus I'll have to look into that then.
17:30 sslb http://unturned.wikia.com/​wiki/Unturned_Bunker_Wiki
17:30 astralnebula why aren't all the servers showing up
17:30 Calinou we had 157 IRC users yesterday; today, we have 175
17:31 Calinou that's nearly 20 more in 1 day!!
17:31 sfan5 joined #minetest
17:31 astralnebula mmm the prophesy is fulfilling
17:31 * PenguinDad squawks at sfan5
17:31 Hobodium Sorry, I didn't mean to inflate the chat too much, I can go if there are too many people :y
17:31 Calinou <_3SidedSquare> no, as in you need to press control or space to go up/down in water
17:31 T4im sslb: thats not free software.. it's propritary
17:31 Calinou if you don't press any space, you sink
17:31 Calinou slowly by default, but minetest_game makes it very fasts
17:32 Cylus sslb: Where do you get it? I can't find a download link.
17:32 Calinou so sneaking is only slightly faster than not pressing any key
17:32 * sfan5 meows at PenguinDad
17:32 T4im cylus: it's proprtietary unity non-linux according to wikipedia
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17:32 sslb Cylus: you download it with Steam
17:32 Calinou hence non-free
17:32 Cylus Okay then, never mind. Thanks for the heads up, T4im!
17:33 Cylus Yeah .... Steam is a no go, for me. No source and way too much DRM.
17:33 T4im well source and steamness should usually be unrelated :P
17:33 Calinou Valve makes the Source engine, which is proprietary
17:33 Calinou irony
17:33 sslb ahh you guys are running linux huh
17:34 Calinou source code is available, but commercial use is not permitted unless you buy a license
17:34 T4im well.. still.. we have to thank valve for pushing linux as a game platform
17:34 Cylus Calinou: Ha ha, nice. I never made that connection.
17:34 Calinou not really, T4im
17:34 T4im valve might be the downfall of microsoft
17:34 T4im :)
17:34 Calinou I doubt it
17:34 Calinou <T4im> well source and steamness should usually be unrelated :P
17:34 Calinou they are almost always related
17:34 Cylus I doubt it too, but it's nice to hope.
17:34 Calinou Warsow is the only exception I know
17:34 Hobodium Microsoft will be the downfall of microsoft if it ever comes to that.
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17:34 sfan5 ^
17:34 T4im calinou: since they started their linux os based gaming platform, linux appeared apparently more often on the featured list of games.. and after all thats one of last stronholds of windows
17:35 SylvieLorxu It's not about Linux, it's about software freedom
17:35 Cylus That and firmware (if you're on a blob-free version).
17:36 T4im i mean.. basicly all reasons i ever heared to use windows would be gone.. useability? anything is more useable by now.. easier? theres easier.. business applications? everythgn available on other os'es.. games? thanks to valve too :)
17:36 Broam sslb: nearly all of us.
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17:37 SylvieLorxu Cylus: Trisquel on my laptop, deblobbed Gentoo on my desktop <3
17:37 T4im SylvieLorxu: but it might be a first step towards freedom, when more people start using linux, even if for proprtietary stuff at the beginning
17:37 Broam There is and will be for a while a very interesting clash of cultures in this channel...
17:37 SylvieLorxu T4im: It's a huge step in the right direction, yeah
17:37 Krock joined #minetest
17:37 Cylus SylvieLorxu: Sweet! How hard was it to deblob Gentoo, if you don't mind my asking?
17:37 Krock hay
17:37 Broam SylvieLorxu: linux-libre?
17:38 T4im deblobed? as in gnu hurd?
17:38 Calinou it's a paradox, SylvieLorxu: we used to run free/libre games and proprietary drivers, now we run free drivers and proprietary games.
17:38 T4im hehe
17:38 Calinou “we” = the average GNU/Linux gamer
17:38 Broam T4im: has to do with firmware blobs that are still around in various drivers etc
17:38 Calinou it's a sad thing
17:38 Calinou the former is a much better idea
17:38 T4im broam: i know what deblobbed means
17:39 T4im broam: i was asking for details :p
17:39 Broam Calinou: IMO if you have to choose the latter is. You can live without game software.
17:39 Calinou many people can't, according to them
17:39 Calinou gaming is quite an holy grail
17:39 rubenwardy Comments? http://www.minetest.net/download
17:40 T4im heading levels are hard to differ between each other
17:40 SylvieLorxu Cylus: Actually really easy. This is basically all you need to add to your package manager's config: http://paste.debian.net/plain/121506
17:40 SylvieLorxu Broam: Yeah, Linux-libre
17:40 chchjesus joined #minetest
17:40 Calinou colouring the headers is a good idea
17:40 Calinou wait
17:40 Calinou or just bold them
17:41 Cylus rubenwardy: Awesome! I didn't know the mobile version was on that page. I'll probably install that later today, to play on my breaks at work.
17:41 rubenwardy Yeah. Or putting them in boxes with the titles bolded
17:41 T4im or increase margin of the parent headings
17:41 T4im vertically margin that is
17:41 T4im more whitespace is a very subtle way to manage grouping
17:41 Cylus SylvieLorxu: Oh, wow, that is simple. It's great to hear it doesn't take a whole lot of effort to run it freely.
17:42 Cylus By the way, I'd love to see Minetest enter F-Droid at some point.
17:42 Calinou Cylus, fully free distributions lack 1) AMD graphic card/IGP support, 2) Intel and some Broadcom Wi-Fi…
17:43 Calinou the problems are huge and no one is willing to solve them
17:43 T4im hmm that pastebin had a suspcious tls certificate change for me :/ a change to a gandi certificate
17:43 astralnebula f-droid +1000
17:43 Broam someone just has to submit it really.
17:43 Broam f-droid will pull from source repos so it'll stay up to date too
17:44 T4im f-droid is solid.. buildin and signing their builds from the sources
17:44 Cylus Broam: Does it have to be the developer that submits it? If not, I can do that later.
17:44 T4im i dont think it has to, no :)
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17:45 Calinou T4im, Gandi is fine
17:45 Cylus Sweet. I'll probably do that later today or tomorrow then (or at least try to figure out how, I'm new to the process).
17:45 Calinou they're a well-known, French-based provider of certificates, hosting…
17:45 sfan5 joined #minetest
17:45 Calinou they partner'd with Mozilla (Thunderbird)
17:45 Broam Cylus: no.
17:45 sfan5 * SASL authentication failed
17:45 sfan5_ joined #minetest
17:45 sfan5 ffu
17:45 sfan5 wtf
17:45 Calinou they support many free software projects by giving them certificates (Ubuntu, Debian, GNU)
17:45 Calinou however, pastebin.com sucks :P
17:45 T4im hm ok..
17:45 jray541 whoa i just noticed the minetest port in android store
17:46 Calinou jray541, NOT legal
17:46 sfan5 joined #minetest
17:46 Calinou do NOT use it
17:46 Broam especially if paid.
17:46 sfan5 jray541: they are likely not legal and have ads
17:46 sfan5 use the official one instead
17:46 Calinou they are distributed without source code, made by random childish companies.
17:46 Cylus I use my own site for pastes ... but out of curiosity, why does pastebin.com suck, Calinou?
17:46 Calinou ads, takes long to load, illegal stuff in sidebar
17:46 Calinou also no released backend
17:46 Calinou and US-hosted
17:46 jray541 sfan5: you where right
17:47 sfan5 <Calinou> and US-hosted
17:47 sfan5 omg
17:47 Calinou suddenly: Patriot Act
17:47 Cylus Not being US-hosted might be a good thing, though the rest of that is problematic.
17:47 sfan5 why exactly is that bad?
17:47 sfan5 it's just a pastebin
17:47 sfan5 it's not like you store personal stuff there
17:47 kaeza ^
17:47 Calinou and increased lag for europeans
17:47 Calinou sfan5, some people do
17:47 astralnebula one does not simply be a pastebin
17:47 Cylus Oh, wait, I misread. Ignore my last statement.
17:47 kaeza Calinou, then... blame the people who do?
17:48 kaeza out of the four reasons you give, only "slow loading" is bad IMHO
17:48 Cylus I'm US-hosted, but I can't really do anything about that. At least I'm self-hosted.
17:48 Broam no, US-hosted can be bad if you're not in the US
17:48 dulrich joined #minetest
17:48 kaeza "Illegal stuff" as in?
17:48 T4im cylus: why cant you do anything about that? O_o
17:49 Hobodium But Cylus, how can you trust yourself? What if you are secretly making a deal with the NSA to give up your personal information?
17:49 LemonLake So my friend just made an application to find sequences of pi in prime numbers lower than 2^31-1
17:49 twoelk did he find anything?
17:49 astralnebula :D
17:49 Cylus T4im: Because moving my hosting elsewhere would mean losing my self-hosted status or moving out of country (moving might not be a bad idea, but I'm not up for it right now).
17:49 LemonLake well, it works on his machine
17:49 jray541 i wish we could get something legal on android. it would be easier to get friends on my server. anyways who wants to shell out cash for minecraft after the buyout
17:49 LemonLake however he messed up the buffer code lol
17:49 Cylus Hobodium: I might be. Crap. What do I do about that?
17:50 astralnebula post your personal information on craigslist as defence
17:50 kaeza jray541, there's an official port for Android...
17:50 Calinou <kaeza> "Illegal stuff" as in?
17:50 Calinou illegal downloads, NSFW stuff, etc
17:50 Calinou in the recent pastes
17:50 Calinou full of spam…
17:51 Cylus jray541: Something legal? As in a legal version of Minetest? We have that, apparently at minetest.net's download page.
17:51 twoelk jray541: you did look at all of http://www.minetest.net/download ?
17:51 T4im hmm if theres an illegal port in the store, why dont you notify google about it? that is some minetest comitter.. they certainly have no interest in keeping such a port there
17:51 Calinou <jray541> i wish we could get something legal on android. it would be easier to get friends on my server. anyways who wants to shell out cash for minecraft after the buyout
17:51 Calinou we have already, but it's not on Google Play
17:51 kaeza Calinou, that could be a problem with *any* pastebin BTW
17:51 Calinou do we want to give 25 bucks to Google?
17:51 Calinou and have it reviewed by a bunch of unfair people?
17:51 jray541 cylus: on android. there are illegal ports
17:51 Calinou kaeza, the ones with “recent pastes” stuff…
17:51 kaeza s/pastebin/user-generated-content/
17:51 Calinou completely worthless
17:51 sfan5 T4im: most of them are actually not illegal but just don't mention Minetest at all
17:51 sfan5 T4im: which is perfectly valid with lgpl
17:51 Calinou T4im, we did DMCAs but to no avail
17:51 sfan5 Calinou: no avail?
17:51 T4im well they do have to distribute the source don't they?
17:51 Calinou they are illegal, sfan5
17:52 T4im either distribute it or link to it
17:52 Calinou yes, LGPL requires derivative works to use the same licenses
17:52 Calinou they're forks
17:52 Calinou not library usees
17:52 Cylus jray541: True. But there is also a legal Android version.
17:52 Calinou -e
17:52 sfan5 google has so far complied with every dmca i sent
17:52 Calinou LGPL is not your new WTFPL
17:52 sfan5 e.g. https://cdn.mediacru.sh/2Mp2yZ3gETCL.png
17:52 jray541 Cylus: where can i find a legal port?
17:52 Calinou we should do more DMCAs then
17:52 LemonLake +1 for google's cooperation
17:52 sfan5 jray541: http://minetest.net/download
17:52 Calinou but I'm not a real contributor
17:52 Cylus jray541: <http://www.minetest.net/download>
17:53 Jordach https://github.com/minetest/minete​st/releases/download/0.4.10/Minete​st-0.4.10-android-armeabi.apk.zip
17:53 Jordach ^ ARM users
17:53 sfan5 ^
17:53 T4im LemonLake: google has a self interest.. its cheaper to just remove it than to get into any dispute with it
17:53 jray541 oh wow never had to scroll down that far
17:53 astralnebula more dmcas + get in f-droid
17:53 Jordach https://github.com/minetest/minetest/releases/dow​nload/0.4.10/Minetest-0.4.10-android-x86.apk.zip
17:53 Jordach ^ x86_64 uers
17:53 Calinou cool, x86 Android support
17:53 LemonLake T4im: still
17:53 sfan5 Jordach: w/o _64
17:54 T4im well sure.. they don't ignore it.. but that wouldnt have looked like google :D
17:54 T4im they are datagrabers, but polite ones
17:54 Calinou rubenwardy, can you add a warning about illegal builds on the download page?
17:55 rubenwardy ok
17:55 T4im so these piratebuilds happens a lot?
17:55 T4im O_o
17:55 Calinou “The builds found on the Google Play Store contain ads and are distributed under proprietary terms, without the source code. **They are illegal**. Please do not download them.”
17:55 Calinou ** marks bold
17:55 Calinou T4im, yes, block-based games are a lucrative business (kids… kids everywhere)
17:56 sfan5 Calinou: "most builds" not all of them
17:56 astralnebula Thank you RyDroid 2 days ago :D
17:56 sfan5 some have a link to the src code
17:56 Cylus Polite? THey flag my account as having committed abuse before I even have a chance to use it, then demand I give them a phone number, or they won't unsuspend my account. Every time, by the way. I don't see this as Google being polite.
17:56 kaeza "proprietary terms" mean nothing for the average user using those builds
17:56 kaeza +s
17:57 kaeza make the "ILLEGAL" part bold, all caps, and 200+ pt <_<
17:57 astralnebula red
17:57 T4im Cyclus, ouch O_o what did they think you did?
17:57 Calinou kaeza, source code availability is not enough in order to be legal
17:57 Calinou that's what I want to highlight
17:57 Calinou you can add it as a tooltip if you want
17:57 Calinou (something that appears when hovered)
17:57 sfan5 Calinou: no?
17:57 Cylus T4im: No idea. But they flag me during account creation (as in, I can't even finish creating an account).
17:57 Calinou sfan5, you can't just give the source code under proprietary terms
17:57 Calinou it'd still be a LGPL violation
17:57 rubenwardy added
17:58 T4im cylus: how many accounts do you have there? O_o
17:58 Calinou kaeza, people have to understand it's not free/libre software unlike Minetest
17:58 T4im well.. either way... theres no loss in having no google account :P just a big win
17:58 Cylus T4im: None. Every account I try to create is blocked unless I give a phone number. I haven't managed to create a single account.
17:58 sfan5 Calinou: which builds release the src under proprietary terms? (links pls)
17:59 Calinou none
17:59 Calinou but what if they do?
17:59 kaeza Calinou, my point is, they are mostly kids; they don't care about "source code availability". you gotta discourage them by saying e.g. "the builds are old, unsupported, and don't have the latest features"
17:59 kaeza (which is also true BTW)
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17:59 Calinou if they know about minetest.net, they probably are not the average mobile client user
17:59 sfan5 Calinou: they'd still be illegal
17:59 sfan5 Calinou: but as long as nobody did that you don't need to mention  it
17:59 PenguinDad Cylus: Google always thinks that I'm a bot :(
18:00 JTE_ so much to do...
18:00 T4im PenguinDad: but they have their own captcha system to deal with that problem :D
18:00 twoelk|2 joined #minetest
18:00 kaeza also, please don't cite any of their names (Streisand effect anyone?)
18:00 T4im :D
18:00 * sfan5 meows at kaeza
18:00 twoelk|2 rubenwardy: maybe >not yet available<
18:00 Cylus PenguinDad: Maybe they think I am too? I don't know. But if they want my phone number, they're going to have to perform a whois search on me like everyone else. I'm not handing it over, but I'm also not hiding it.
18:00 twoelk|2 ?
18:01 T4im sure, we all will throw minetest away and choose the proprietary one :p
18:01 rubenwardy added
18:01 twoelk|2 oh doppelgaenger me
18:01 * kaeza purrs at sfan5
18:01 * sfan5 meows at kaeza
18:01 Eater4 joined #minetest
18:01 Calinou <kaeza> also, please don't cite any of their names (Streisand effect anyone?)
18:01 Calinou yes we won't
18:01 * twoelk|2 waits for his other self to time out
18:02 jordan4ibanez Are particle spawners client side?
18:02 Calinou yes
18:02 T4im aren't the spawners on both sides, but the particles client side?
18:03 sfan5_ joined #minetest
18:03 T4im as in, that the server tells the clients via that spawner, where to spawn the particles client side? :)
18:04 twoelk thats better
18:04 jordan4ibanez Are particle spawners attached to a block?
18:05 rubenwardy When digging blocks the particles are 100% client side. Particles systems from the Lua API are both sides, but particles are client side. AFAIK, anyway.
18:07 Weedy joined #minetest
18:07 Weedy joined #minetest
18:07 diemartin joined #minetest
18:07 T4im makes sense that way, yea :)
18:07 diemartin teh duck is wrong with freenode lately
18:07 T4im jordan: https://github.com/minetest/minetes​t/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L2698
18:07 T4im for the lua added particle spawners
18:09 ImQ009 joined #minetest
18:09 nsfw note to self, when pasting something for Calinou, always use pastebin.com - calinou said pastebin.com contains nsfw stuff - nsfw is me!
18:10 PenguinDad lol
18:10 Hobodium You sure post a lot of stuff on the internet nsfw, everybody I know refers to you
18:10 * sfan5 meows at nsfw
18:10 nsfw i should buy a pro account just for pasting things for Calinou
18:10 sfan5 ^
18:10 sfan5 and you should buy a cat
18:10 The_Loko joined #minetest
18:11 Krock http://i.imgur.com/oz4Ds0y.png
18:11 JTE_ Tiny little cutie Krock~ owo
18:11 Krock the world is so BIG :)
18:11 rubenwardy wat
18:12 erlehmann i am writing an article about the assemblage commonly known as minecraft
18:13 jordan4ibanez Can I make particle spawners spawn infinitely?
18:13 trevin left #minetest
18:14 Jordach yes
18:14 PenguinDad Krock is in a big blurry world :D
18:14 VanessaE jordan4ibanez: once you set a spawner, it'll keep spawning until you shut it off.
18:14 Cylus It would appear that someone has already submitted Minetest for review by the folks down at F-Droid: <https://f-droid.org/forums/topic/minetest/>. Two days ago, actually.
18:14 Krock PenguinDad, the guy needs glasses-
18:14 T4im jordan: you shouldnt stop reading after that particle defintion i linked you :D the particlesystem definition is followed
18:14 T4im theres also a comment about how to spawn infinitely
18:14 Mlpearc|Away joined #minetest
18:15 VanessaE jordan4ibanez: but you gotta make sure the particle live time is set decently - too many particles left active at once will cause FPS sags
18:15 rubenwardy The Minetest cafepress store has made $3.04 from sales after about 2 years of being online.
18:15 kaeza woo
18:15 VanessaE rubenwardy: you're rich!
18:15 Hobodium Is there anything worth ten cents on there? I need to fix that number
18:15 rubenwardy www.cafepress.co.uk/+minetest+gifts
18:15 rubenwardy We don't get all the money, unfortunatel
18:16 rubenwardy y
18:16 jordan4ibanez VanessaE: If I comment out time and amount only one spawns
18:16 * Jordach tags a blender video nsfw
18:16 rubenwardy http://www.cafepress.co.uk/profile/minetest
18:16 * Krock is programming an stone -> special material generator
18:17 * sfan5 curls up to Jordach's lap
18:18 cooki3monsta joined #minetest
18:18 Jordach https://mediacru.sh/xLwbitFzGz77 (i'm not sorry)
18:18 Megaf VanessaE: Do you have the bees mod in your(any) server?
18:18 Broam bees?
18:18 Mlpearc|Away left #minetest
18:18 Megaf yes, bees
18:18 Calinou Bees, bees, bees!
18:18 Megaf they make honey and have hives
18:18 Calinou <22rubenwardy> The Minetest cafepress store has made $3.04 from sales after about 2 years of being online.
18:18 Jordach NOT THE BEES!
18:18 Calinou typical “online business”
18:18 john_minetest two bees or not two bees?
18:19 Broam <cards-against-humanity> Bees? </cards-against-humanity>
18:19 SmugLeaf joined #minetest
18:19 SmugLeaf joined #minetest
18:19 rubenwardy We get 10%, iirc, so it has sold $33.04
18:19 rubenwardy erm
18:19 rubenwardy yeah
18:19 sfan5 Jordach: O_O
18:19 sfan5 Jordach: now render that in 1080p
18:20 NakedFury joined #minetest
18:20 Megaf Well, I learned that bees is a mod that causes lots of lag
18:20 Megaf 156 seconds of lag to be more precise
18:20 sfan5 !g youtube dr. bees
18:20 MinetestBot sfan5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYtXuBN1Hvc
18:20 sfan5 !title
18:20 MinetestBot sfan5: DR. BEES - YouTube
18:20 sfan5 ^ relevant
18:21 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
18:21 Krock !g youtube bee gees - staying alive
18:21 MinetestBot Krock: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_izvAbhExY
18:21 sfan5 !titke
18:21 sfan5 !title
18:21 MinetestBot sfan5: Bee Gees - Stayin&#39; Alive (1977) - YouTube
18:21 * Jordach edits a post https://forum.minetest.net/vi​ewtopic.php?p=154396#p154396
18:21 Megaf Right now theres 0.10 seconds of max_lag, but if I enable bees mod it will climb up to 156 seconds and everyone will left thinking they timed out
18:21 Krock mhm. html codes
18:21 jordan4ibanez Lol sparkly http://i.imgur.com/8aZrLxd.png
18:22 * sfan5 reminds Jordach that IRC is not twitter
18:22 Jordach sfan5, my record of /me is insane
18:22 * Jordach is the one person for that record
18:22 jojoa1997 Hi
18:22 sfan5 I should maybe update the irc stats
18:22 john_minetest Jordach: w00t?
18:23 Jordach john_minetest, annoying hoodedice
18:23 Jordach with no standards
18:23 john_minetest Let the base kick.
18:23 Jordach (it just happened wubwubwub was going)
18:23 Calinou use a script to update IRC stats daily, sfan5?
18:23 jojoa1997 jordan4ibanez is that emeralds?
18:23 sfan5 Calinou: nah
18:23 jordan4ibanez Essence!
18:23 jojoa1997 Essence?
18:23 jordan4ibanez For magic tools. :D
18:23 john_minetest left #minetest
18:23 sfan5 jordan4ibanez: when will you release that mod/subgame?
18:24 Calinou release early, release often ;)
18:24 jordan4ibanez sfan5: You can already download it! https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=9&amp;t=10125
18:24 jordan4ibanez The magic mod isn't in there yet, though.
18:24 sfan5_ not again
18:25 Jordach http://paste.ubuntu.com/8366699/
18:25 Megaf can you suggest a mailbox like mod?
18:26 sfan5_ jordan4ibanez: nice
18:27 jordan4ibanez Thanks!
18:28 JTE_ I can't release, it's still woefully incomplete :< ... hummm...
18:28 twoelk Megaf: Tere are bees on VE-C and VE-S
18:28 Calinou if it works, release
18:29 Megaf jordan4ibanez: I like that fire
18:30 jordan4ibanez Thank you, I hope it makes it into the default game if I can optimize it enough.
18:30 astralnebula use isupon.us for hosting and sharing your screenshots etc
18:31 sfan5_ no no
18:31 sfan5_ use https://mediacru.sh
18:31 PenguinDad no
18:31 Krock imgur.com
18:32 PenguinDad Krock: no no no
18:32 Krock yes yes yes
18:32 astralnebula no no no
18:32 kaeza maybe maybe maybe
18:32 Krock NEIN NEIN NEIN NEIN
18:33 ecutruin joined #minetest
18:33 sfan5_ 9 9 9 9
18:33 twoelk jordan4ibanez: your game is allready included on the List of Games on the wiki
18:33 astralnebula 10 10 10 10
18:33 jordan4ibanez That's awesome. Can a moderator move it into Game modes yet?
18:33 Krock !c 'NEIN '*5
18:33 MinetestBot 'NEIN NEIN NEIN NEIN NEIN '
18:33 OldCoder sfan5, my server move is done after 5 months. Shall I try simply running 0.4.10 ? What basic changes are needed to games or worlds for 0.4.10 ? Should I rebuild current 0.4.10 as opposed to using the copy presently associated with MeowTest?
18:34 OldCoder * As opposed to 0.4.9 and 0.4.10
18:34 OldCoder BTW my new network is fast and it will be gigabit later this year
18:34 OldCoder Whoosh
18:34 sfan5 OldCoder: no changed needed for 0.4.10
18:35 sfan5 :D
18:35 sfan5 should work out-of-thebox
18:35 Jordach evening ecutruin
18:35 rubenwardy !seen hoodedice
18:35 MinetestBot rubenwardy: hoodedice was last seen at 2014-07-28 08:05:06 UTC on #minetest
18:35 adidik joined #minetest
18:35 OldCoder All right; and is current 0.4.10 git usable or any major problems?
18:35 OldCoder We have been using a 0.4.10 from a couple of months back I think
18:36 jordan4ibanez Oh snap, I forgot about "techduck" which was tech pack before lol.
18:36 OldCoder sfan5, ^
18:36 sfan5 OldCoder: current git should work
18:36 jojoa1997 back
18:37 rubenwardy We're getting outreach https://twitter.com/OperaAllNews
18:37 twoelk jordan4ibanez: correct any wrong or outdated info on the List of Games
18:37 kaeza "Infinite Adventure" has no license listed
18:37 kaeza jordan4ibanez, ^
18:38 jojoa1997 Why isnt my game on the wiki? :(
18:38 jordan4ibanez There are multiple in there, so should I just say multiple?
18:38 jray541 ls
18:38 jray541 oops
18:38 OldCoder sfan5, very well
18:39 adidik joined #minetest
18:39 jojoa1997 jray541 just dont type your password in
18:39 kaeza jordan4ibanez, I'd say put "See individual mods" and slap one to the ones you created
18:39 jray541 that would suck
18:40 twoelk jojoa1997: overcraft_origins?
18:41 jojoa1997 yeah
18:41 twoelk jojoa1997: add it. Look at Lord of the Test
18:41 twoelk it is in the list though
18:41 jojoa1997 please I dont have the time to learn how to use it
18:41 Bitgod joined #minetest
18:41 jojoa1997 and not it isnt. Link please.
18:42 JTE_ silly v7 mapgen.
18:42 pwd okay
18:42 jojoa1997 nvm
18:42 jojoa1997 I didnt see the larger list of subgames linj
18:44 Calinou hi jojoa1997
18:44 jojoa1997 hi Calinou
18:46 MinetestBot [Git] ShadowNinja -> minetest/master-server: Add license 7fff17b http://git.io/JLPjFg (2014-09-17T14:45:44-04:00)
18:46 jojoa1997|PC joined #minetest
18:46 jojoa1997|PC ok so for overcraft origins the  faithful texture pack has no license. I messaged  the topic creator and never got a response after months. So does that mean I dont have to put a license for it?
18:46 SylvieLorxu jojoa1997: That means you probably have no right to distribute it
18:47 SylvieLorxu No license = All Rights Reserved
18:47 jojoa1997 But they wont answer me back
18:47 Hobodium Yes, if you are not aware a license exists that means none exists :y
18:47 foxipso joined #minetest
18:48 jojoa1997 Then why does a mod require a license to be in the mod section?
18:48 SylvieLorxu jojoa1997: Doesn't matter. Copyright law defaults to "All Rights Reserved". If they don't give you a license, you're not allowed to share or share modified versions
18:48 twoelk no license defaults to all rights reserved and in no way to public domain
18:48 jojoa1997 hmm
18:48 jojoa1997 wait
18:49 jojoa1997 usage guidlines states what i needed to do to use it
18:49 jojoa1997 whcihc i did do
18:49 pwd UCC 1-308 (uniform commercial code)
18:51 twoelk eh?
18:52 pwd modern way of reserving rights
18:54 rubenwardy joined #minetest
18:54 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> http://www.reddit.com/r/feedthebeast/comments/​2gmmvl/what_are_peoples_thoughts_on_minetest/
18:54 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> even better: http://www.reddit.com/r/linux/comments/2giwyl/​in_light_of_microsoft_buying_out_mojang_heres/
18:54 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> I'll just let you guys use google :P
18:54 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> I agree with the comments, Minetest is a horrible name.
18:54 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> Unless the game was made more science-y in style
18:54 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> ie: Testing
18:54 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> "all it needs is good graphics, good music, good gameplay elements and a proper name."
18:55 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> Am I alone in here? :P
18:55 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> "Everyone on that project needs to pick up a good book or two on clean code, and I bet no one of them do C++
18:55 rubenwardy For some reason it wasn't sending to anyone :(
18:55 Krock eww spam
18:55 jojoa1997 spapsapsaSPA<
18:55 jojoa1997 fail
18:55 jojoa1997 2r3u4b5e6n7w8a9rdy don2t3 4s5p6a7m8!
18:55 rubenwardy no, it wasn't spam
18:56 rubenwardy I sent those with about a minute apart each, but they didn't send properly
18:56 rubenwardy So I resent
18:56 VanessaE ARGH, this is pissing me off.... is there SOMEONE who I can talk to about rrdtool?
18:56 jojoa1997 Yeah ,e
18:56 jojoa1997 me
18:56 jojoa1997 VanessaE what is rrdtool?
18:56 Jordach don't lick the dragon's tail
18:56 VanessaE jojoa1997: that would be a no. :)
18:56 PenguinDad rubenwardy: sorry but I don't aggree with these comments
18:56 sfan5 jojoa1997: rrdtool does graphs
18:56 rubenwardy the code is untidy
18:57 jojoa1997 The tyrant is home!\
18:57 YuGiOhJCJ joined #minetest
18:58 JTE_ alright now I have to account for falling sand...
18:58 YuGiOhJCJ hello, what to do on minetest when we are trapped into a hole without any way to get out of here please? Is there a suicide command or something like that?
18:58 VanessaE sfan5: I want to add an extra stanza to my rrdgraph script to generate another image from the player counts that graphs it as player joins per unit of time, but I'd prefer to do it from the existing database rather than creating a new database.
18:59 VanessaE I wanna see what today's traffic looks like graphed in that form
18:59 sfan5 YuGiOhJCJ: are you in singleplayer?
18:59 sfan5 VanessaE: use munin for that
18:59 jojoa1997 Can players still place blocks where they are standing?
18:59 YuGiOhJCJ I am playling in multi
19:00 YuGiOhJCJ munin ?
19:00 YuGiOhJCJ there are no other players to place blocks but I have blocks in my inventory so no problem... I just ask to know if one day it happens ^^
19:00 jojoa1997 YuGiOhJCJ actually there is no way
19:01 sfan5 there are no standard to commands to teleport you anywhere
19:01 sfan5 except you can teleport to your home if you set it with "/sethome" before
19:01 jojoa1997 and unlike minecraft  you cant break stone with bare hands
19:01 PenguinDad jojoa1997: you sadly aren't able to this anymore
19:01 PenguinDad + do
19:01 YuGiOhJCJ ok so I think the best way is to create an other player that will help the previous player :)
19:01 jojoa1997 I think every block should be able to be broken with bare hands eventually, also that is silly. I liked making towers. It was so much easier
19:02 T4im on some servers theres also a /spawn command
19:02 jojoa1997 someone should add a spawn command to minetest!
19:02 T4im there is
19:02 blaise so I read in the forums where PilzAdams cart mod is that people were talking about switching with mese and such
19:03 * sfan5 meows at blaise
19:03 blaise anyone know if this became a reality?
19:03 * blaise pets sfan5
19:03 * sfan5 purrs
19:04 blaise sfan5: I believe it was you that was inquiring about rail switches and stuff with mese
19:04 sfan5 me?
19:04 * blaise gets dragged outside by his wife
19:04 sfan5 Calinou: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/zpMKLMLHMnjQ.png
19:04 Benja_ joined #minetest
19:05 Benja_ Hi
19:05 sfan5 hi
19:05 Benja_ am I on IRC
19:05 sfan5 yes
19:05 jojoa1997 No
19:05 VanessaE maybe
19:05 jojoa1997 Benja_ you are inside my mind
19:06 Benja_ what jojoa1197
19:06 ThatGraemeGuy hrmmm the server list seems abnormally short :-/
19:06 Benja_ next to my name does it say IRC
19:06 Jordach sfan5, just read that on /r/feedthebeast
19:06 jojoa1997 Benja_ it is craxy in here
19:06 jojoa1997 no
19:06 VanessaE Benja_: you are a figment of jojoa1997's imagination, but he's a figment of sfan5's imagination, all of which is running on some Minetest server off in the Bahamas somewhere.
19:06 jojoa1997 it says "    "
19:07 sfan5 Benja_: just ignore what jojoa1997 says ;)
19:07 jojoa1997 :3
19:07 sfan5 VanessaE: bahamas? where is that?
19:07 jojoa1997 south of florida
19:07 VanessaE sfan5: off the coast of south Florida
19:07 * sfan5 facepalm
19:07 VanessaE north of Cuba
19:07 sfan5 https://www.reddit.com/r/feedthebeast/comments/2gm​mvl/what_are_peoples_thoughts_on_minetest/ckkrmqq
19:07 jojoa1997 like 30 miles away from the tipity tip of florida
19:07 sfan5 "Whilst the idea is nice, people need to take into account that this is written in C++ so you will be going from the slow [...]"
19:08 sfan5 oh wai
19:08 sfan5 t
19:08 VanessaE haha
19:08 sfan5 "bag of rape known as C++"
19:09 jojoa1997 ?.?
19:09 T4im he did a tradeoff bash, there's worse ;)
19:09 Benja_ Vanessa i have Minetest but how can i get on servers
19:10 VanessaE Benja_: client tab
19:10 Benja_ ?
19:10 VanessaE just pick one, make up a name and password, and connect.
19:10 Benja_ ok
19:10 jojoa1997 the name "client" for that tab is a bad one
19:10 PenguinDad You can put rape into bags o_O
19:11 jojoa1997 PenguinDad yeah
19:11 Calinou a game got shut down for implementing protocol? WTF?
19:11 TBC_x the "client" tab is pretty confusing
19:11 * jojoa1997 places PenguinDad into a bag and gives it to others
19:11 Calinou that's deceiving
19:11 TBC_x i must admit
19:11 jojoa1997 Calinou what do you mean?
19:11 VanessaE TBC_x: confusing how?
19:11 jojoa1997 VanessaE one would think server meant conect to server
19:11 jojoa1997 not host a server
19:11 Calinou according to asie, Manic Digger got shut down in 2010 for implementing Minecraft's protocol
19:11 asie Calinou: it did
19:11 asie exe was the dev
19:11 TBC_x VanessaE: for people that expect multiplayer
19:11 Akien I admit that I clicked on "server" first time I wanted to search for existing servers
19:12 Hobodium http://pictures.mastermarf.com/b​log/2008/081208-box-of-rape.jpg If you can put it in boxes, you can put it in bags
19:12 asie Calinou: essentially
19:12 asie Notch went on the channel
19:12 asie invited exe
19:12 asie and asked him politely to take it down
19:12 asie exe complied
19:12 asie that's it
19:12 emeralds im shiny
19:12 asie he removed the classic protocol code
19:12 Weedy joined #minetest
19:12 Weedy joined #minetest
19:12 * Krock notifies about https://github.com/SmallJoker/materials
19:12 asie of course, everyone copied the source
19:12 Calinou lol
19:12 TBC_x VanessaE: I think this was already mentoined on forum
19:13 * sfan5_ meows at asie
19:13 emeralds j
19:14 foxipso left #minetest
19:14 * sfan5 meows at asie
19:16 Miner_48er joined #minetest
19:17 emeralds w
19:17 Weedy joined #minetest
19:17 SmugLeaf joined #minetest
19:17 SmugLeaf joined #minetest
19:17 emeralds why wont my name change!
19:17 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
19:18 rubenwardy joined #minetest
19:18 Krock !tell emeralds try /nick
19:18 MinetestBot Krock: yeah, sure, whatever
19:18 rubenwardy hi all!
19:18 Megaf jp: Hi there
19:18 Megaf Hi rubenwardy
19:18 jp hi Megaf \o
19:19 Megaf jp: I'm still waiting for new homedecor items
19:19 jp VanessaE ^
19:19 VanessaE coming soon.
19:19 Megaf cool :)
19:19 jojoa1997 ok so sfan5 on that link
19:19 sfan5 what?
19:20 jojoa1997 Also consider this, the EULA (At least last time I checked) says that you cannot make money from your mods, no adfly, no pay wall, only donations at best. So wouldn't it be better to get a job developing Java software and be paid for your code regularly as opposed to once in a blue moon?
19:20 jojoa1997 Ok so that person is saying that Minecraft modding is all about the money!
19:20 Calinou donations are a way of… making money
19:20 Calinou jojoa1997, it can be
19:20 jojoa1997 I know it can be
19:20 jojoa1997 but this person is saying that it is be
19:21 * jojoa1997 also knows that is incorrect grammer but whatevs Americans speak horribly anyways
19:21 Calinou paid programmer jobs are not that common or easy
19:21 blaise sfan5: ah, you said "Moved back because forum Guidelines not followed"
19:21 Calinou not everyone has a degree
19:21 Akien left #minetest
19:21 Hobodium Well, that person may just value money more than output, but he is asking a question so you could easily just say "Well, being a developer would be more money, but I like making virtual blocks make fart noises."
19:21 sfan5 Calinou: europe has degrees ;)
19:22 jojoa1997 Calinou hence why I am in college right now to get a degree
19:22 jojoa1997 wtf i am doing it in highschool idk... shoot the class starts soon
19:22 blaise sfan5: you know if PilzAdam ever added switching rails with mese signals?
19:22 jojoa1997 I hate the online class part oif it cause it is SLOW
19:22 sfan5 blaise: no
19:22 blaise sfan5: or added the detector rail?
19:22 blaise sfan5: :(
19:23 * sfan5 wonders why blaise is asking him
19:23 PenguinDad jojoa1997: rewrite it to be faster :P
19:23 blaise so no powered carts other than manual or mese power rail?
19:24 blaise sfan5: becuase I haven't seen PilzAdam and you were the one recommending said features on the forum?
19:25 jojoa1997 PenguinDad no it is internet speed
19:25 jojoa1997 The college is streaming live videos from the class
19:25 blaise in reply to switch via mese he says See Version 16.
19:25 jojoa1997 The first class i decided to sit in but at home i cant speed up the internet
19:25 blaise so I suppose he implemented it in 16?
19:26 Calinou jojoa1997, as for your spelling, practice makes perfect
19:26 jojoa1997 Calinou I eat english
19:26 jojoa1997 speak english and write english
19:26 jojoa1997 i am going to eat an apple pie though ;)
19:28 jojoa1997 It was yummy
19:28 jordan4ibanez Calinou: In more ores, what does chunk size do?
19:30 jojoa1997 jordan4ibanez I think it is the max size of the box that ores spawn in per spawning. Example 3 = 3x3 box
19:30 jojoa1997 Does Minetest support biome definitions?
19:31 Calinou jordan4ibanez, the size of the area where ores generate
19:31 rubenwardy v7 does iirc
19:31 rubenwardy jojoa1997
19:31 Calinou v7, which is not the default mapgen
19:32 jojoa1997 I dont care if it is default
19:32 jojoa1997 I want my biomes!
19:32 jojoa1997 Also can anyone explain the different parts of the biome def. Or point to a mod that uses it?
19:33 blaise did PilzAdam just quit on carts after 2012 ?
19:33 jojoa1997 no
19:34 jojoa1997 I tensions rose between him and me in spring
19:34 jojoa1997 though how come he doesnt talk here anymore?
19:35 Jordach because he's a faggot
19:35 jojoa1997 Language man language!
19:35 Jordach u wanna get rekt m8 in a 1v1 m8
19:36 jojoa1997 Jordach I would crush you!
19:36 jojoa1997 Literally I would just sit on you and win ;)
19:37 Jordach jojoa1997, i weight about 75% of VanessaE
19:37 Amaz joined #minetest
19:37 Jordach i will crush you
19:38 jojoa1997 sure
19:38 jojoa1997 Nah I think we will both fight like Po
19:39 jojoa1997 Just put a dumpling in between us and FUN!
19:39 jojoa1997 https://www.youtube.com/watc​h?v=ijdhORfkOY0&amp;index=3 I HAVE TO BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND AND EXPLAIN THAT! I mean come on it is like obscurity's obscure secret
19:41 Benja_ ok jojoa1997
19:42 jojoa1997 Benja_ :)
19:42 PenguinDad !title
19:42 MinetestBot PenguinDad: 5.1.4 Deduce, via enthalpy level diagram, stabilities of reactants, products,signs  IB Chemistry SL - YouTube
19:43 jojoa1997 nononono
19:43 jojoa1997 Deduce, from an enthalpy level diagram, the relative stabilities of reactants and products, and the sign of the enthalpy change for the reaction
19:43 rubenwardy jordach, homophobia ruins lives
19:44 jojoa1997 That should be the real title cause that is the syllabus statement
19:44 Jordach wat
19:44 Benja_ guys watch this http://bit.ly/superluv
19:44 Jordach no
19:44 jojoa1997 !title
19:44 MinetestBot HTTP error 404
19:44 blaise would anyone have any good suggestions for minecarts in minetest?
19:44 Benja_ wrong link
19:44 jojoa1997 the minecart mod
19:44 jojoa1997 like the only one
19:45 Hobodium I suggest that minecarts should tilt comically when taking corners.
19:45 Benja_ guys watch the song called Superluv and surviving it
19:46 jojoa1997 what is it about
19:47 Benja_ they are two different songs but i won't tell  you what they are about
19:48 jojoa1997 then I wont trust the link
19:48 jojoa1997 also I dont have the time to watch songs
19:48 * jojoa1997 realizes he is wasting so much time typing in irc instead of doing homework
19:49 Benja_ they aren't viruses
19:50 jojoa1997 Yeah but I found out the jail program has been reactivated after I shut it down for the summer
19:55 Benja_ bye guys :-( gotta go
19:55 Benja_ left #minetest
19:55 rubenwardy use Linux! viruses are no longer a problem.
19:56 jojoa1997 that is a lie
19:56 jojoa1997 Use windows and be smart!
19:56 rubenwardy joined #minetest
19:56 * jojoa1997 goes away before another windows vs linux arguement starts
19:56 rubenwardy grr
19:56 shadowzone I love linux.
19:56 shadowzone I've used it for 2 years and never had a problem.
19:57 jojoa1997 Ubuntu is awesome though
19:57 shadowzone Now windows on the other hand.
19:57 shadowzone errr...I'm never using that again.
19:57 jojoa1997 shadowzone you get problems when your linux hard drive is connected via usb
19:57 jojoa1997 I decided to wait till ubuntu 14.10 so i just update it
19:57 shadowzone I don't need to hook it up via USB.
19:57 jojoa1997 Well you dont have controlling moms then
19:58 jojoa1997 Well you dont have a controlling mom then
19:58 shadowzone Oh.
19:58 rubenwardy I've just moved from windows to Linux a few month s ago. No problems.
19:59 DusXMT We, Ubuntu... I can understand you have hardware problems then, that's... well... not exactly the most reliable distro
19:59 Hobodium Just write your own OS, nobody will care to give you viruses then since you only have a userbase of 1
19:59 rubenwardy i would happyly never use win again, except that a lot of programs and games are only for windows
19:59 NakedFury ^ reason why I dont switch
19:59 jojoa1997 same
20:00 Calinou <jojoa1997> Use windows and be smart!
20:00 Calinou this is actually true
20:00 rubenwardy i dual boot
20:00 Hobodium That's why I run both
20:00 Calinou <shadowzone> I love linux.
20:00 Calinou I love a kernel too
20:00 shadowzone Lol.
20:00 NakedFury the problem I have is that I want to use linux but there is zero advantage for me to switch over
20:00 Calinou DusXMT, no problems here, even with non-LTS
20:00 NakedFury and that sucks
20:00 Hobodium But I feel it guys, I feel it in my gut. 2014 is year of the linux desktop! :y
20:00 shadowzone Almost no one copies what I say so that was different,
20:01 Calinou privacy/freedom, NakedFury
20:01 Calinou not having to pay on upgrades (if there are)
20:01 Calinou (it's not like Windows 9 will come too soon)
20:01 jojoa1997 Calinou yeah if you just dont go willy nilly not watching what you do you could have no virus protection and still be safe
20:01 NakedFury there is no privacy on the internet
20:01 Calinou I don't have an AV when I use Windows, jojoa1997
20:01 Calinou you can protect your privacy at least
20:01 jojoa1997 I know
20:01 Calinou good enough to not let random companies get all your data
20:01 jojoa1997 wait what?
20:02 jojoa1997 AV?
20:02 Calinou Antivirus
20:02 jp it's not only a matter of privacy, but also stability, performance, security on the linux side
20:02 Calinou more recent Windows versions are stable
20:02 Calinou they boot quickly
20:02 Calinou and are overall safer
20:02 blaise 15:02:11: ERROR[CurlFetchThread]: servers.minetest.net/announce not found (Failure when receiving data from the peer) (response code 0)                                                                                                                    │
20:02 blaise I've not seen that error before..
20:03 blaise is something wrong with the public server pool?
20:03 Hobodium Not to derail anything, I'm just honestly curious. Calinou, how much do you value boot times?
20:03 Megaf blaise: yes, there is
20:03 Megaf but nobody knows what
20:03 Calinou Hobodium, short boot times are important to not be afraid of rebooting
20:03 rubenwardy blaise: it is currently broken. sfan5is working on it.
20:03 Calinou you're also less tricked to keep your PC on (which wastes power)
20:04 blaise ah
20:05 Hobodium So would you value a shorter boot time but a higher need to restart over longer boot time but little to no reason to restart?
20:05 rubenwardy it is an awful coincidence that it comes with the MSCraft spike in Minetedt users
20:05 blaise kexec, never reboot again..
20:05 blaise XD
20:06 blaise some of us are firm believers in the lightbulb theory
20:06 rubenwardy expand?
20:06 jojoa1997 really!>
20:06 jojoa1997 MSCraft
20:07 jojoa1997 that is just wrong
20:07 rubenwardy thats my name for the event where ms bought mojang and got a load of people to fint mt
20:07 jojoa1997 no
20:07 rubenwardy well, not mine
20:08 kruug left #minetest
20:08 jojoa1997 Really just because ownership changes doesnt mean it is super bad now
20:08 rubenwardy no, but people think it id
20:08 rubenwardy is
20:08 jojoa1997 It just means Microsoft could ruin it but it also means Microsoft could make it better
20:08 rubenwardy so they look for alternatives
20:08 Calinou Minecrosoft
20:09 jojoa1997 but saying MScraft is supporting that idea
20:09 * jojoa1997 stabs Calinou
20:09 Hobodium I just know what I would bet on given Microsofts history. Although that is not why I decided to join.
20:09 rubenwardy yeah.
20:09 SylvieLorxu jojoa1997: I know, but I saw the same with WhatsApp
20:09 jojoa1997 I agree,
20:09 jojoa1997 SylvieLorxu what?
20:09 jojoa1997 what is WhatsApp
20:09 SylvieLorxu WhatsApp was always a privacy hell but then Facebook bought it and people went "OMG MY PRIVACY"
20:10 jojoa1997 Also Failtest
20:10 SylvieLorxu So Microsoft buying Minecraft is just a perfect moment to put alternatives in the spotlight
20:10 jojoa1997 how is that?
20:10 SylvieLorxu Even if Microsoft may possibly not ruin Minecraft, who knows
20:10 jojoa1997 The original team is still there
20:10 SylvieLorxu jojoa1997: WhatsApp is some proprietary, really awful, mobile IM application
20:10 Calinou you're supposed to pay for it after 1 year
20:10 jojoa1997 only Notch is leaving and he doesnt even develope miencraft anymore
20:10 Calinou it has no ads
20:10 rubenwardy i thought the original team quit
20:11 rubenwardy of mc
20:11 jojoa1997 no
20:11 jojoa1997 sec
20:11 jojoa1997 The founders: Notch, Carl, and Jakob are leaving.
20:12 jojoa1997 From the mojang post
20:12 T4im they are? i would have expected microsoft to make their staying for a certain time part of the salescontract O_o it's quite common
20:12 Hobodium The original team remaining doesn't mean very much when ownership changes, because the environment they need to adapt to can completely change everything. It just depends on how much and how bad the executive meddling is.
20:13 jojoa1997 or how good
20:14 asie joined #minetest
20:14 MinetestBot [Git] maciej.kasatkin@o2.pl -> minetest/minetest: Node highlighting. 58e6d25 http://git.io/DrbGtw (2014-09-17T22:06:13+02:00)
20:14 rubenwardy yay!
20:14 jp \o/
20:15 jojoa1997 ?
20:15 jojoa1997 Can someone show me a pic?
20:15 jp https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sX_rP-f6VCY
20:15 rubenwardy instead of the lines around a node, the node flashes
20:15 rubenwardy a vid is better than a picture
20:15 JTE_ how nice :3
20:16 RealBadAngel and gameplay even better
20:16 RealBadAngel enable_node_highlighting = true and youre good to go
20:16 jojoa1997 ugly
20:16 jojoa1997 can you like make it a different color
20:16 RealBadAngel ofc
20:17 jojoa1997 or maybe just adding a thin line around the box?
20:17 Amaz jojoa1997, wait till you try it out.
20:17 jp you can choose your color
20:17 jojoa1997 How does it look like with node boxes
20:17 RealBadAngel edit halo.png and make it any color you want
20:17 Amaz When I first saw it, I thought "ugh" but when I tried it, it is awesome.
20:18 jojoa1997 It is definitly better than the ugly outline
20:18 RealBadAngel in the future halo.png will support animations
20:18 jojoa1997 what good is that!?
20:18 RealBadAngel so you could add noise, sparkles or whatever to your halo
20:19 jojoa1997 wait wait wait
20:20 Amaz RBA, o.O
20:20 jojoa1997 Dont you mean " so you could add lag, lag or lag to your lag machine"
20:20 * jojoa1997 adds purple sparkles!
20:20 RealBadAngel jojoa1997, no it wont lag
20:20 jojoa1997 sure
20:20 jojoa1997 On your computer
20:20 jojoa1997 more textures = lag
20:21 jojoa1997 more animated textures
20:21 RealBadAngel if you dont know what youre saying better say nothing
20:21 Amaz [citation needed]
20:22 jojoa1997 RealBadAngel I know what I am saying
20:22 RealBadAngel obviously you dont
20:22 jojoa1997 Does it make sense well no cause now I am a bit confused
20:22 jojoa1997 I know what I said
20:22 RealBadAngel so please remain quiet ;)
20:22 Amaz What are the specs of your computer joja1997?
20:22 jojoa1997 RealBadAngel that is prejudice
20:23 Hobodium I don't think a single (probably very small) texture is going to have a significant performance impact unless something has gone extremely wrong.
20:23 jojoa1997 Hobodium I would make one that has like 50 frames
20:24 T4im 3d rendering runs anyway in a loop, rerendering everything everytime.. i doubt it makes a big difference that it renders one part of the texture in one go and another in another one or the same one twice
20:24 RealBadAngel you can make it 5000, it wont have any impact on performance
20:24 Hobodium You could, but at that point you have made a specific action to do so. Plus I'm assuming that node highlighting is client side, so other people can't force textures on you
20:24 jojoa1997 2.10GHz Dual core, 6GB RAM, dont really want to bother with other stuff
20:24 jojoa1997 RealBadAngel LIE
20:24 jojoa1997 um
20:24 RealBadAngel stfu already :P
20:24 JTE_ awwr, minetest.explode_table_event() isn't nearly as exciting as I'd hoped~ owo
20:25 * JTE_ puts the exploding tables away.
20:25 jojoa1997 I have one animated block in my world and it gets laggy
20:25 RealBadAngel and yes, its textureable, so it means you can overwrite it with your texture pack
20:25 jojoa1997 now you expect me to have an animated cursor block wont also cause lag
20:25 jin_xi aww JTE if i knew how to do that ascii i'd flip a table for you
20:25 Djohaal joined #minetest
20:25 jojoa1997 RealBadAngel just because it doesnt lag on your computer wont mean it will not lag on other computers
20:26 jin_xi (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ here we go
20:26 RealBadAngel just put all blue halo.png into your texture pack folder to get blueish highlighting
20:26 Amaz jojoa, my computer shows no difference in performance with the new pull request, and it is less than half as good as yours is.
20:26 jojoa1997 Amaz what OS?
20:26 Amaz Variant of Ubuntu, Peppermint.
20:26 scourge joined #minetest
20:26 jojoa1997 Also what programs are you running at the same time
20:26 parabyte joined #minetest
20:27 JTE_ Right, now to license my software so I can release it. owo
20:27 jojoa1997 Yeah use Windows and I have at least 4 tabs open doing stuff and that doesnt count the background and hidden things I have running
20:27 Amaz I have had it open with firefox, chromium, make using all the threads on my cpu.
20:27 rubenwardy cracks when digging are animated. no lag
20:27 Amaz
20:28 RealBadAngel actually cracks are most resource hungry animation
20:28 jojoa1997 But they dont run 24/7
20:28 rubenwardy ok
20:28 RealBadAngel they copy all the textures and add cracks on them
20:28 rubenwardy they don't lag visually.
20:28 RealBadAngel consuming resources all the time
20:28 rubenwardy really? oh yeah. bliting
20:28 jojoa1997 Im done arguing, RealBadAngel also not if you are not digging
20:28 Megaf oh dear, why is git using vim again here? How to I save/quite vim anyway!?
20:29 RealBadAngel more dug nodes more ram taken
20:29 PenguinDad jojoa1997: that halo doesn't run 24/7 too
20:29 RealBadAngel i mean unique ones
20:29 Megaf done,
20:29 Hobodium jojoa1997, the best way to prove your point is to test it and document it.
20:29 blaise gosh I wish we had a good minecart mod
20:29 rubenwardy joined #minetest
20:29 PenguinDad s/too/either/
20:29 T4im megaf: git just starts the default editor of your system.. change that and git will follow
20:29 jojoa1997 Hobodium it is also best not to put down opposition on a theory without testing it and documenting it
20:29 blaise I found the perfect place to put a hidden minecart station to store carts
20:30 T4im and how to leave vim? eh.. i like to use pkill/kill -9 :P
20:30 rubenwardy is the crack blittong on every tick, or when the animation frame changes?
20:30 jojoa1997 left #minetest
20:31 blaise mese/digi controlled rail switching would be very nice
20:31 RealBadAngel it is done per crack level
20:31 Hobodium I think they took that a little too personally
20:31 RealBadAngel and if its done for the very first time it takes lotsa time
20:31 RealBadAngel new texture is being made then
20:32 RealBadAngel and so on for each new node being dug and each crack level
20:32 rubenwardy what. it adds cracks to every texture when loading?
20:32 RealBadAngel thats why i will redesign cracks (i got that code partially ready)
20:32 RealBadAngel and now im makin pull req with setting to disable crack
20:33 rubenwardy why doesnt it just blit onto the texture when building the mapblock mesh uv map?
20:33 RealBadAngel it makes it on request
20:33 RealBadAngel otherwise it should add cracks, all the levels to all aviable node tiles
20:33 RealBadAngel which propably could take a few minutes
20:34 RealBadAngel and eat all aviable ram at the same time lol
20:35 RealBadAngel situation is bad when using 16px textures
20:35 * sfan5 meows at RealBadAngel
20:35 rubenwardy it takes only a few millisecs to blit one texture over another in sdl. why does it take so much longer?
20:35 RealBadAngel with 128x or more its a tragedy
20:35 rubenwardy *in mt
20:35 RealBadAngel rubenwardy, better read cracks related code
20:35 rubenwardy maybe I'll just read the code.
20:36 RealBadAngel its a diseaster
20:36 PenguinDad rubenwardy: rtfc :D
20:36 rubenwardy lol
20:37 RealBadAngel imho particles are way better
20:37 RealBadAngel and good enough, we dont need this minecraft artifact at all
20:37 rubenwardy it took me about 2 hours to find the player name text in the minetest code. the text the hovers over heads.
20:37 rubenwardy turns out it is in content cao.
20:38 rubenwardy i prefer particles
20:39 rubenwardy although particles dont show progress
20:39 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/b​lob/master/src/mapblock_mesh.cpp#L1101
20:39 Hobodium They potentially could. Like maybe the amount of particles could increase as you progress
20:39 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/b​lob/master/src/mapblock_mesh.cpp#L1261
20:39 RealBadAngel second link is animation
20:39 RealBadAngel here textures are made
20:39 RealBadAngel yuck!
20:39 JTE_ wait, wait... where is the falling sand entity defined? issit hardcoded too?
20:40 RealBadAngel in rendering time :) what an excellent idea ;)
20:40 * JTE_ sads.
20:42 Calinou <blaise> gosh I wish we had a good minecart mod
20:42 Calinou Kilarin's is nice
20:42 Calinou <RealBadAngel> and now im makin pull req with setting to disable crack
20:42 Calinou wtf
20:42 Calinou you can use a texture
20:43 Calinou why would you disable cracks
20:43 Calinou cracks are a very good idea to see progress
20:43 Calinou particles are an addition, not a replacement
20:43 Calinou we need a better crack animation, that's all
20:43 Calinou I've made a PR but you rejected it
20:43 Djohaal welp it is not like cracks could ruin performance. Unless blocks keep their half-broken state and you can have hundreds
20:44 Djohaal Calinou: I actually found the textures on minetest quite cute. I think the engine itself needs polish
20:46 Calinou they have 5 frames only
20:46 jin_xi guess who's polish
20:46 Calinou 16 frames would be good (Minecraft has 10)
20:46 RealBadAngel Calinou, i dont want a texture, i want to disable refreshing the mesh with cracks
20:46 RealBadAngel which is slow as hell
20:47 RealBadAngel and i dont want enormous resource usage by cracks
20:47 jp RBA : why not add the highlighting in the GUI settings tab ?
20:47 RealBadAngel ofc all as option
20:47 RealBadAngel jp, theres no place for new settings atm
20:47 PenguinDad Djohaal: translate it then :p
20:48 Weedy joined #minetest
20:48 Weedy joined #minetest
20:48 RealBadAngel Djohaal, im Polish
20:49 H-H-H joined #minetest
20:49 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
20:50 jordan4ibanez joined #minetest
20:50 RealBadAngel Calinou, cracks are one of the reasons why textures takes so much ram
20:50 jojoa1997 Yall are still talking about that?
20:50 SmugLeaf joined #minetest
20:50 SmugLeaf joined #minetest
20:50 JTE_ alright here's what I'll do, I'll iterate through all of the blocks and change all falling_node groups to falling_node2 and do it myself with a custom entity. ... maybe.
20:51 * H-H-H wonders if he should open his server up to the world for some free survival play lol
20:51 jojoa1997 Now that freeminer is done compiling
20:52 jojoa1997 I can test it because Minetest doesnt bother with making compiling easier on windows
20:52 H-H-H lol but i better remove the zombie chickens though :|
20:54 rubenwardy1 joined #minetest
20:54 rubenwardy1 jte_ it is in builtin some where
20:55 rubenwardy1 builtin/game/falling.lua i think
20:55 Weedy joined #minetest
20:55 Weedy joined #minetest
20:56 Calinou slow as hell? I've never had performance issues with any crack texture
20:56 Calinou RealBadAngel, no cracks means generally no easy-to-see progress
20:56 Calinou unless you eg. add a bar below the crosshair, which is unintuitive
20:57 jojoa1997 Maybe some things are inexplainable
20:57 jojoa1997 Like how VanessaE had a 64x texture pack run better than 32x on her old dell
20:57 VanessaE jojoa1997: not better.
20:57 rubenwardy joined #minetest
20:57 VanessaE about the same
20:57 VanessaE but others have had it run better.
20:57 jordan4ibanez This combination of pepsi and coke is vile
20:58 Calinou Megaf, *facepalm*
20:59 Calinou selection boxes are useful, read my comment
20:59 Calinou disabling them by default would be an huge loss
20:59 Amaz +Calinou
20:59 jojoa1997 Megaf didnt say anythin
20:59 jojoa1997 Megaf didnt say anything
20:59 Megaf Calinou: I know, there is other comment that suggest disabling them for entities
20:59 Megaf Im ok with that if you have a good feedback
21:00 Calinou Amaz, voice it using a comment, if you can
21:00 Calinou (with some arguments)
21:00 Amaz Okay.
21:01 Megaf by the way, take a look at my pull request please, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1648
21:01 chchjesus joined #minetest
21:01 _3SidedSquare joined #minetest
21:01 chchjesus Man
21:01 lag_ joined #minetest
21:02 chchjesus You can pick up a lot of bugs just by playing minetest for a few hours
21:02 chchjesus It's great
21:02 _3SidedSquare lol
21:03 rubenwardy joined #minetest
21:03 jin_xi chchjesus: if you pick up enough bugs you can craft a voxel engine
21:03 Djohaal RealBadAngel: I meant polish as in polishing. not poland
21:03 jojoa1997 afk
21:04 rubenwardy Djohaal: he was joking
21:04 rubenwardy i think more polish is needed
21:04 rubenwardy too
21:05 rubenwardy report those bugs. the reports will help. quite a lot of bugs get fixed soon after being reported.
21:05 LemonLake chchjesus: what bugs have you found, just out of curiosity?
21:06 chchjesus Lemme take a look at my notes
21:06 chchjesus You can mine blocks that don't belong to the tool you are using, and that tool takes no damage it seems
21:06 chchjesus i.e. pickaxe on wood
21:07 chchjesus Floating trees
21:07 chchjesus When there's a gap in the ground in the middle of a forest
21:07 LemonLake i'd consider that mapgen based
21:07 Jordach chchjesus, tools don't wear out if it's minable by hand (eg, if it doesn't improve on the digging speeds of the fist)
21:07 LemonLake more than the game itself
21:07 chchjesus LemonLake: Of course, but that means the map gen algorithm needs to be fixed
21:07 chchjesus So it's a bug
21:07 chchjesus Jordach: Oh
21:08 rubenwardy1 joined #minetest
21:08 rubenwardy1 those aren't bugs.
21:08 chchjesus rubenwardy1: What? Floating trees is a bug
21:08 LemonLake chchjesus: Most mapgens are made in lua for games nowadays
21:08 erlehmann joined #minetest
21:08 rubenwardy1 well, meh.
21:08 LemonLake though iirc minetest_game just uses plain old v6
21:08 chchjesus There is lag in the furnace
21:08 Hobodium Maybe trees just float. Adventures in the Heliumwood
21:09 LemonLake chchjesus: That's not lag
21:09 LemonLake that's how ABMs work
21:09 chchjesus No, there's definitely a bug.
21:09 LemonLake The ABM interval is limited to 1 second, so that's what all nodes have to work with
21:09 chchjesus in the furnace.
21:09 rubenwardy1 usually bugs imply crashes.
21:09 LemonLake ^
21:09 chchjesus What...
21:09 rubenwardy1 cancel what i said. it is still a bug
21:09 LemonLake I think the ABM limit should definitely be lowered, however I want to hear the devs reasons for not lowering this limit.
21:10 Hobodium I have to disagree. Bugs that crash are nice, but unintended effects are certainly bugs.
21:10 chchjesus With the furnace, when you take something off or put it on, it takes a while to appear
21:10 rubenwardy1 thank you for reporting. are you using a mod called moretrees? or any other mods?
21:10 LemonLake Yes, chchjesus that's ABM interval limit.
21:10 chchjesus >thank you for reporting
21:10 chchjesus LemonLake: Oh.
21:10 LemonLake The furnace and all other 'active' nodes use ABMs, and the interval is limited to 1 second. Thus, this is not a bug
21:10 chchjesus No mods.
21:11 rubenwardy1 there are plans to fix that using client side prediction. (furnaces
21:11 chchjesus Why?
21:11 chchjesus Seems silly.
21:11 LemonLake +rubenwardy1
21:11 LemonLake there's your reason.
21:11 chchjesus Also, when you take an item from the furnace, such as a smelted ingot
21:11 rubenwardy joined #minetest
21:11 chchjesus It will sometimes temporarily reappear in the furnace then go back to your inventory
21:12 LemonLake Yes, ABMs again
21:12 Calinou http://yourgameideaistoobig.com/
21:12 chchjesus That's really buggy behaviour.
21:12 chchjesus It shouldn't reappear back in the furnace then jump back to your inventory
21:12 LemonLake Yes, though like rubenwardy said this is planned to be fixed with client-side prediction.
21:13 rubenwardy joined #minetest
21:13 Calinou chchjesus, digging stuff with inappropriate tools is definitely not a bug
21:13 Calinou unlike Minecraft, no damage is taken by the tool, which is good
21:14 LemonLake chchjesus: The furnace thing is, like you said, buggy behaviour however isn't actually a bug.
21:14 LemonLake This is when I like to say, "that's a feature"
21:15 LemonLake Do you devs plan on lowering the limit, or will this be done with client-side prediction?
21:15 rubenwardy joined #minetest
21:15 chchjesus LemonLake: Oh, you're not a dev?
21:15 LemonLake chchjesus: No, I am not
21:16 chchjesus is rubenwardy a dev?
21:16 rubenwardy no
21:16 LemonLake I am a modder, but I have little understanding of the core engine. I plan to change that next year when I catch up with studies.
21:16 rubenwardy i am a senior member of the communiry
21:16 chchjesus I'm currently looking at getting some bugs fixed in core some time
21:16 rubenwardy i have contributed tiny changes to Minetest though.
21:16 LemonLake chchjesus: what bugs?
21:17 rubenwardy can you find that tree again? if it is too hard, then dont worty
21:17 LemonLake Oh my god, 40 more people than usual
21:17 rubenwardy it would be usefull to have the seed and pos
21:17 LemonLake People really are flocking due to the M$ stuff
21:17 rubenwardy or maybe not
21:17 chchjesus LemonLake: I'm looking at one on the scrollbar atm
21:18 LemonLake chchjesus: describe
21:18 jordan4ibanez Yo rubenwardy, do you know why this doesn't work? http://pastie.org/pastes/9565837​/text?key=ykmk7rnt0sd5qpfyjlw9ew
21:18 rubenwardy was 170 earlier. what is it now?
21:18 chchjesus Where if you double click it
21:18 chchjesus It selects the item in the list
21:18 LemonLake 158
21:18 jordan4ibanez I'm just trying to change a snigle block.
21:18 chchjesus "under" the cursor
21:18 LemonLake chchjesus: I see
21:18 LemonLake Definitely report that one
21:18 chchjesus ...
21:18 chchjesus It's already reported
21:18 LemonLake Ah
21:18 LemonLake jordan4ibanez: what's the issue?
21:19 rubenwardy area : index. doesnt look right
21:19 jordan4ibanez I don't understand the basics of voxel manip.
21:19 jojoa1997 back
21:19 LemonLake "local vi = a:index(x, yy, z)"
21:19 LemonLake is an example
21:19 rubenwardy yesh
21:19 LemonLake supply it with three coordinates
21:20 rubenwardy thats the right one.
21:20 Jordach bah
21:20 LemonLake a being your area
21:21 Jordach there's no decent RTS games on steam except Civ 5
21:21 Jordach and i don't have that sort of dosh atm
21:21 LemonLake In event of a mapgen generate function, make the area equivalent to the block edges
21:21 jordan4ibanez Wow as soon as I get this right I need to update the voxel wiki with a new example
21:21 LemonLake The example on the wiki is correct
21:21 jordan4ibanez For non mapgen code
21:21 LemonLake Ah
21:22 LemonLake I think you're just implementing it incorrectly
21:22 LemonLake If you're changing a singlenode, why not use minetest:set_node?
21:22 rubenwardy i guess he starting simply
21:23 rubenwardy he is
21:23 jordan4ibanez ^
21:23 LemonLake ahh
21:23 LemonLake your big problem is area:index(area)
21:23 LemonLake your are indexing an area with itself
21:23 LemonLake that is very facepalm
21:24 LemonLake you supply index with a set of coordinates. if you want to index an entire area that's what iteration is for
21:24 rubenwardy1 joined #minetest
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21:27 LemonLake would any of you know why i feel more tired in the morning when i sleep earlier?
21:27 rubenwardy joined #minetest
21:27 VanessaE how old are you?
21:27 VanessaE (honest question)
21:27 LemonLake rubenwardy: are you okay?
21:28 LemonLake VanessaE: 21, why?
21:28 VanessaE that's why.
21:28 LemonLake ...
21:28 rubenwardy joined #minetest
21:28 jordan4ibanez It's because you're a ghost
21:28 VanessaE scientific research figured it out some time ago, in that age range, you need to stay up later and sleep later
21:28 LemonLake VanessaE: i see
21:28 rubenwardy connection issues. i think I'll say good bye for today.
21:28 OldCoder joined #minetest
21:28 VanessaE something about how circadian rhythms work
21:28 LemonLake faggot scientists
21:28 Hobodium I wish society would accomodate that
21:28 LemonLake rubenwardy: cya
21:29 cemotyz09 joined #minetest
21:29 PjotrOrial_ http://www.reddit.com/r/linux_gamin​g/comments/2gkaio/discussion_minecr​aft_alternatives_for_linux/ckk3un4
21:29 cemotyz09 left #minetest
21:29 VanessaE from about early teens through I guess late 20's I think was the range
21:29 LemonLake thinking about it, that would make sense
21:29 VanessaE PjotrOrial_: we've been there already.  numerous times.
21:29 rubenwardy lemonlake, that it vile language. that word represents the general ignorance of members of the human race
21:29 LemonLake okay, ill just blame science for my issues
21:29 LemonLake rubenwardy: hush
21:30 PjotrOrial_ VanessaE: sorry for reposting
21:30 rubenwardy :S
21:30 VanessaE PjotrOrial_: oh, it's no worry
21:30 rubenwardy i hope you werent using it offensively.
21:30 VanessaE PjotrOrial_: it seems like the devs don't want to rename :)
21:30 rubenwardy anyway, bye.
21:30 LemonLake can you not tell it was a joke?
21:30 LemonLake lol
21:30 LemonLake cya
21:30 PjotrOrial_ VanessaE: I just thought the trademark thingy may speed up the renaming additionally ;)
21:31 VanessaE PjotrOrial_: perhaps so but then again if Mojang's existence wasn't enough, I don't thin MS will really be able to do much more
21:31 Amaz Mobs are really bad for one's blood pressure. (At least in my case!)
21:31 VanessaE Amaz: so stop eating them :P
21:31 LemonLake Amaz: but protein
21:31 Amaz XD
21:32 PjotrOrial_ VanessaE: sure, once a name is well known, you cannot really rename it as you'd loose all the people knowing it. It's just... I wondered if that trademakr thing, which I did not think about at all, may become relevant any time soon. Sorry again for posting
21:32 VanessaE PjotrOrial_: no worries about the repost
21:32 LemonLake you could slowly induce the name change
21:32 LemonLake change one thing at a time
21:32 Amaz It's more me giving them the protien!
21:32 LemonLake Amaz: :3
21:33 Jordach sigh
21:33 LemonLake either way, fuck science's sleeping studies
21:33 LemonLake im sleeping
21:33 LemonLake cya
21:33 VanessaE PjotrOrial_: but you're right that a new name is needed some time.  I don't think anyone really *likes* the name, but changing it now would be like the name of The GIMP changed.
21:33 Amaz Night!
21:33 PjotrOrial_ Night!
21:33 VanessaE PjotrOrial_: at one time, the engine was known as Mesetint :P
21:34 * Amaz votes for it to be called that again!
21:34 Hobodium Instead of changing the name, just have two names. What could possibly go wrong?
21:34 PjotrOrial_ VanessaE: sure. Minetest seems very mature too me, so I do understand the bad consequences of renaming as well. Because of the maturity I send some donation today :)
21:36 JTE_ <LemonLake> you could slowly induce the name change <LemonLake> change one thing at a time <-- rename minetest_game and its logo! :3
21:38 kaeza fun fact: minetest_game as it is now was originally named "minetest_next"; the older minetest_game was even more limited than it is now
21:38 kaeza minenext? :P
21:38 Hobodium nextest
21:38 jojoa1997 hehehe
21:38 jojoa1997 kaeza more limited is an understatement
21:38 kaeza probably <_<
21:39 kaeza if you want something complete, use *ahem* Dreambuilder >_>
21:39 kaeza install *ALL* teh mods!
21:40 JTE_ that's true.
21:41 jray541 Vanessa: what is about your servers (and the few others) thats making them pop up and not everyone elses?
21:41 VanessaE jray541: I haven't the foggiest clue.  Something in the master server list must have broke
21:41 * VanessaE pokes sfan5 and ShadowNinja
21:41 kaeza actually, minetest (the game, not the engine) was originally named "mesetint" IIRC
21:41 Hobodium It's an attempt to monopolize servers!
21:42 VanessaE I ain't complaining of course but I can't help but wonder just what it is
21:43 T4im i get other servers as well O_o
21:43 ShadowNinja jray541: VanessaE hacked the server list so that her servers would be more popular.  ;-)
21:43 T4im though, not as many as usually.. i guessed it's due to OldCoder's move, that the list is so short
21:43 VanessaE HAH!
21:43 VanessaE T4im: nope, OldCoder's servers aren't on the list at all afaik
21:44 T4im yea, he mentioned something about moving them around this time, didnt he?
21:44 ShadowNinja VanessaE: He has a few, not the full 20-something though.
21:44 VanessaE oh ok
21:44 proller joined #minetest
21:45 OldCoder T4im, I've held the full 20 pending (a) stable 0.4.10 (b) server move (c) assistance from the community to test
21:45 OldCoder VanessaE, ^
21:46 OldCoder Move was completed yesterday. I'll rebuild 0.4.10 today or tomorrow and restart some of the worlds.
21:46 jordan4ibanez Holy shit dude
21:46 jordan4ibanez http://pastie.org/pastes/9566108​/text?key=endmauqnx7zozfrmenu4a
21:46 kaeza is Krock the one in charge of http://nimg.pf-control.de/MTstuff/modSearch.php ?
21:46 T4im ah, there you go.. the moment you dont run your worlds, people think the masterserver is down ;-) hehe
21:46 OldCoder If people wish to be ops or assist, this will speed things up
21:46 jordan4ibanez All this for one node, but if it really has that much of a speed up, it's worth it!
21:47 OldCoder My new network is fast and will be gigabit later this year, I am told
21:47 kaeza ;_;
21:47 OldCoder kaeza, ?>
21:47 OldCoder kaeza, ? *
21:47 kaeza nothing
21:47 OldCoder ?
21:47 OldCoder Is all well?
21:48 kaeza !tell Krock can you make it so your site accepts things like "modSearch.php?q=foo|bar"?
21:48 MinetestBot kaeza: I'll pass that on when Krock is around
21:51 Mikeonline n8
21:53 jordan4ibanez lol "nate"
21:53 ShadowNinja Hah, 16000 particles in one node is a bit much for the Irrlicht particle system.
21:54 jordan4ibanez Why would you do that?
21:54 ShadowNinja I'm working on adding collision detection, but it isn't working so far... :-|
21:54 ShadowNinja jordan4ibanez: Irrlicht particles are a lot faster than out current system.
21:55 _3SidedSquare I always found irrlicht particals were a pain in the ass
21:55 jordan4ibanez Oh my
21:55 jordan4ibanez So we could have lightning bolts, and rain?
21:57 VanessaE ShadowNinja: wait, 16'000 particles in a node?  as in an irrlicht scene node or a minetest node?
21:57 ShadowNinja VanessaE: Minetest node.  It droped my fps to < 1.
21:58 VanessaE wow
21:58 VanessaE I wonder how many particles I was seeing in my brief tests
21:58 ShadowNinja 100-1000 is no problem though, but a few of those will take you into single digits.
21:58 VanessaE surely close to 5k
21:59 VanessaE 10 of jin_xi's streamers, fully visible
21:59 VanessaE how many particles is that? :)
22:00 ShadowNinja One with 5K particles takes my fps to about 12, but I'm calling collisionMoveSimple on all of those.
22:00 VanessaE wow
22:00 VanessaE well I meant his original code
22:00 ShadowNinja 5K without collisions is about 60 FPS.
22:01 ShadowNinja Er, it was about 8, not 12.
22:02 VanessaE I dare say if you tried that many particles with Minetest's existing system, you'd be in the minutes-per-frame range ;-)
22:02 ShadowNinja 40 spawners at 5K each without collisions gives me about 12 FPS.
22:03 VanessaE 20'000 particles?  holy moses
22:03 VanessaE that's a little much. :)
22:03 VanessaE in practice, I would guess only a few *dozen* individual particles need collision handling
22:03 VanessaE in a typical spawner
22:03 VanessaE if the videos I've seen of MC's rain are any indication
22:03 VanessaE most of the rain drops don't bounce, they just disappear
22:04 VanessaE only a few here and there actually bounce
22:04 VanessaE (and of course digging particles, same thing)
22:04 T4im but if you dont collision detect i would assume it would rain through roofs, VanessaE :D
22:04 VanessaE T4im: unless you set your particle's time-to-live to be JUST enough to get from the source location to the roofs ;)
22:04 VanessaE but you make a good point
22:05 Djohaal actually you just need to cull particles
22:05 Djohaal just do a check if the block they are crossing -can- see the sun (and not glass), otherwise cull
22:05 VanessaE how?
22:05 VanessaE hm
22:05 VanessaE true
22:05 VanessaE light level = 15.
22:05 Djohaal seems to be how MC does it. You can always check notch's source code for "inspiration" ;)
22:05 VanessaE anything less is not sunlight
22:06 VanessaE nope, can't do that.  must be totally clean-room
22:06 Djohaal nothing wrong with seeing how they implemented
22:06 VanessaE of course the question then is, what happens at night?
22:06 VanessaE there's no sunlight to guide the culling algo
22:06 Djohaal minecraft knows when a block can "see" the sky no matter what
22:07 Djohaal it has a seaparate check for that, is used for plants and whatnot
22:07 alket comon guys fix the cart xD
22:07 VanessaE yeah, minetest doesn't actually have anything like that
22:07 VanessaE though it wouldn't be hard to add I guess
22:07 VanessaE alket: what's to fix?
22:07 Djohaal gonna be useful for plants, also handling glass
22:07 alket Vadtec, LAG
22:07 T4im hmm isn't the lighting very aware of direct sun-light?
22:07 Cylus joined #minetest
22:07 VanessaE alket: you mean the carts going off rails etc?
22:07 Djohaal T4im: not only that, but it uses the sun line-of-sight to orient stuff
22:07 alket VanessaE, yes
22:08 VanessaE T4im: sure..in the daytime.
22:08 jordan4ibanez Whoa, I shouldn't be surprised at how fast voxel manip is, yet I still am, damn.
22:08 VanessaE alket: to be dealt with later.
22:08 Djohaal as I said, can probably hit up the minecraft source to see how it works
22:08 T4im VanessaE: if you dig straight down a few hundret meters it makes a huge lighting difference if you have even a single block over you or the clear nightsky over you
22:08 alket VanessaE, but its destroying all our worlds and taking our fun :p
22:08 jray541 to the server owners: I installed all 3 curl dev packages and my server made it back on the public list
22:09 Djohaal yeah minecraft traces a straight light beam from the sky. So you can dig like hundreds of blocks down but if it is unobtrused it'll be daylight
22:09 VanessaE jray541: yay :)
22:09 VanessaE Djohaal: minetest does something like that in the lighting algorithm also
22:09 VanessaE but it's actual light
22:09 jray541 VanessaE: maybe the list server got an update that broke something?
22:09 VanessaE not "the sky is visible"
22:10 VanessaE jray541: I have no idea O-o
22:10 VanessaE O_o
22:11 VanessaE Djohaal: that is to say, at night the light will drop very low, and a node will actually read low when you query it in a mod; there's no "can see the sky" property.
22:12 jordan4ibanez VanessaE: I think you'd like something like this for some of your plants https://github.com/jordan4ibanez/Infinite-Adventur​e/commit/530eacb24f6c6f5be64887bdda0ab835a299b5bc
22:12 jordan4ibanez Sparkle sparkle
22:12 jordan4ibanez Ignore that giant mass of spawners lol.
22:12 Broam Reminds me of a mod that implements a block that sparkles only on the 16x16 chunk boundaries
22:13 jordan4ibanez That could be useful actually...
22:14 Broam jordan4ibanez: https://gitorious.org/sztest/sztest/source/28c​d67b8b8333006bcff75c4be042a0184a46754:sz_cosmo
22:16 jordan4ibanez Thank you, Broam
22:16 Broam jordan4ibanez: not sure how much it depends on the 'util' classes.
22:16 Broam jordan4ibanez: but you can always email warr1024
22:17 ShadowNinja Not exactly how I thought setTexture worked...: http://i.imgur.com/RQQgyUZ.png
22:17 VanessaE ShadowNinja: um, oops?  haha
22:17 ShadowNinja VanessaE: The issue is, how do I set the texture the right way?  :-|
22:17 alket also old version :p
22:18 VanessaE ShadowNinja: I have no idea at all :)
22:18 Bitgod joined #minetest
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22:28 friti joined #minetest
22:29 jordan4ibanez So much code can be optimized with the voxel manip api, holy moly
22:33 bjrohan joined #minetest
22:33 est31 joined #minetest
22:34 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
22:34 est31 When connecting with servers, I have loading times of multiple minutes. Isn't minetest supposed to cache?
22:35 tanath how do you get steel in carbone? in particular steel doors?
22:35 VanessaE est31: turn off preload item visuals
22:35 paramat joined #minetest
22:35 tanath with /give or the like
22:35 NakedFury joined #minetest
22:35 est31 in menu or in some config file?
22:35 VanessaE in the menu, Settings tab
22:36 VanessaE tanath: /giveme doors:door_steel
22:36 VanessaE (or at least, it should be the same as in minetest_game anyway)
22:37 est31 only media is cached, right?
22:37 VanessaE all media is cached
22:37 est31 so node definitions too?
22:37 tanath ty
22:37 VanessaE no, not those
22:37 VanessaE just the "assets" as some people call them
22:38 VanessaE but node defs only take a moment to transfer
22:38 VanessaE (a matter of seconds)
22:38 est31 yes
22:39 est31 its faster now thank you
22:39 est31 what does this setting do?
22:40 VanessaE it runs all of the items through the extrude code (the thing that makes them 3d when you wield them) instead of letting the engine do them on demand
22:40 ImQ009 joined #minetest
22:40 VanessaE for big games this can take a few minutes
22:41 est31 and this isn't cached?
22:41 VanessaE the trade-off is that in-game, the 3d extrude can sometimes cause a tiny delay here and there
22:41 est31 I see
22:41 VanessaE no, the extruded results are not cached - but there has been some discussion to that end.
22:41 est31 ok
22:41 VanessaE RealBadAngel: you still want to do that?
22:42 VanessaE est31: eventually there will be an option added to turn the extruder off entirely, for very slow machines or those who use high resolution texture packs
22:43 est31 ok
22:43 VanessaE and there has been some discussion on how to improve the performance of that pirce of code also
22:43 VanessaE piece of*
22:43 VanessaE so we're working on it :)
22:44 est31 you're working on lots of stuff. minetest has good devs
22:45 Cylus I wondered what that setting did. No wonder turning it off speeds up connection.
22:45 grendal_prime joined #minetest
22:45 jojoa1997 what setting
22:46 Cylus jojoa1997: The "preload item visuals" setting.
22:46 RealBadAngel VanessaE, do what?
22:47 Cylus <VanessaE> no, the extruded results are not cached - but there has been some discussion to that end.
22:47 TriBlade9 joined #minetest
22:47 VanessaE RealBadAngel: about extruding wielditems and caching the result and reloading from cache in the future instead of always extruding all the time
22:47 Cylus RealBadAngel: ^
22:47 RealBadAngel Cylus, it doesnt speed up the connection. It just creates textures before game starts
22:47 VanessaE I could wear it was you who was in on that discussion
22:47 RealBadAngel VanessaE, yes, that code have to be fixed at some point
22:47 est31 VanessaE: when the extruder will be turned off, will all stuff be block shaped?
22:47 Cylus RealBadAngel: Not the actuall conection, but the time it takes for one to enter the game world.
22:48 VanessaE est31: no.  things will still be blocks, nodeboxes, or flat.  inventory items just won't be 3d in your hand is all.
22:48 VanessaE est31: so it won't change a WHOLE lot
22:48 VanessaE est31: there's good things to come, don't worry :)
22:49 est31 So chairs will still have chair shape.
22:49 VanessaE yep
22:49 est31 when built
22:49 jojoa1997 what extruder?
22:50 Freejack joined #minetest
22:50 VanessaE jojoa1997: the code that makes your wielded sword look thick and 3d
22:50 jojoa1997 ahh
22:50 tanath what's the item string for string?
22:50 VanessaE tanath:  farming:cotton
22:51 VanessaE (or farming:string, either one works)
22:51 bjrohan Is there a way to set the spawn point to where you are in minetest?
22:51 VanessaE bjrohan:   static_spawnpoint = 123,456,789
22:51 VanessaE in minetest.conf
22:51 bjrohan Also is there a time limit for gather items when dead?
22:51 tanath hm, now bow & arrow?
22:51 Cylus Broam_run: "/set -n static_spawnpoint <your coordinates>"
22:51 tanath are there any ranged weapons?
22:51 VanessaE bjrohan: bones expire in 15 mins I think
22:52 bjrohan Thank you
22:52 VanessaE tanath: you mean like a laser gun?
22:52 tanath hah, sure
22:52 Hobodium It was nice talking to everyone today. Later all
22:52 VanessaE tanath: there's a mod that adds bows and arrows, called "throwing".  also I think you can throw snowballs.  there is also a mod that adds guns
22:52 VanessaE (I forget the name of that one)
22:53 paramat you newbies are gonna exhaust Vanessa ;)
22:54 VanessaE haha
22:55 tanath then enable proper tab-completion :P
22:55 jordan4ibanez So what exactly do you index with the voxel manip?
22:55 jordan4ibanez I know it has to be in the table of content ids, but I tried indexing data and it didn't work. :/
22:56 jordan4ibanez Hmm wait a second..
22:57 diemartin joined #minetest
22:59 paramat the voxel index is the index of the flat array of the emerged voxel volume
23:01 bjrohan VanessaE: I went back to my death spot, and no bone, I am looking for a bone correct?
23:01 bjrohan For my items
23:01 VanessaE bjrohan: a black block with skeletons on it
23:01 VanessaE I think
23:01 bjrohan ah
23:02 _3SidedSquare holy shit, I just finished with calc homework I was supposed to be doing over the last week
23:03 _3SidedSquare I feel exhaused
23:06 grendal_prime so last week i went to this mincraft thing at my sons school...it sucked
23:07 grendal_prime they have slow interen connection..half the kids didnt have liscensencs...everyone was playing on some diffent server then they would get bounced.
23:07 tanath hm, i sometimes hear what sounds like a slime jumping around but i've yet to find or see one
23:08 grendal_prime so i told the instructor i could bild him a minetest server so im building now on top of a 14.04 ubuntu server.
23:08 grendal_prime there should be about 10 kids
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23:09 grendal_prime i think the box is a dual core duo so..4 cores i think and i think i have 2 gigs of ram lying around
23:09 VanessaE that should be sufficient
23:09 VanessaE just don't run a heavy game on it
23:09 VanessaE e.g. avoid mesecons, technic, that sort of thing
23:09 VanessaE (not hard to build "lag machines" out of that stuff)
23:10 OldCoder joined #minetest
23:10 grendal_prime is there a server management tool that i can use so that these guys can do the work without me?
23:10 grendal_prime i was going to install a desktop on it..so they can just remote into it and fire up a game in server mode
23:11 grendal_prime but...server doesnt have the greatest of video hardware.
23:11 _3SidedSquare grendal, do you want something more than just ssh?
23:11 Cylus Ssh is the only tool I can think of for remotely managing Minetest servers.
23:12 grendal_prime ya i can do that..but um, well they will have difficulty with this
23:13 _3SidedSquare VNC is the next step up
23:13 _3SidedSquare Do you know how to get programs to auto-start on whatever os you're useing?
23:14 grendal_prime ya, actually i would just put xrdp or vnc on the box... have them log in and then start a game in server mode
23:14 grendal_prime i can do that no problem.
23:14 grendal_prime i just though if there was  like a web interface for managing that would be bad ass...something in like php
23:15 _3SidedSquare I think I saw a web interface for ssh somewhere
23:15 _3SidedSquare One sec
23:15 _3SidedSquare actually
23:15 _3SidedSquare There's this thing called logmein
23:15 _3SidedSquare I think it's free for 1 computer
23:16 _3SidedSquare it's basically web-based vnc
23:16 VanessaE I just use SSH over a terminal session to manage my servers
23:16 grendal_prime web inerface for ssh?  no no dude i was thinking something where they could log in start up a minetest game by selecting from a list..that sort of thing
23:16 VanessaE grendal_prime: why do the users need a server management tool?
23:16 VanessaE OH
23:16 T4im why not just autostart the minetest server on system startup?
23:16 VanessaE yes, just do that
23:17 VanessaE that's a simple one-line function
23:17 _3SidedSquare Oh shit grendal
23:17 VanessaE easily done from /etc/rc.local
23:17 grendal_prime ya, i will but i wanted them to be able to creat worlds, you know that sort of thing.
23:17 VanessaE your players can create local worlds on their machines.
23:17 VanessaE is that a problem?
23:17 grendal_prime and then upload them right.?
23:17 VanessaE or could they migrate from machine to machine?
23:18 VanessaE worlds created in singleplayer stay on the machine they were created in
23:18 VanessaE I see where you're going though
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23:18 VanessaE that sort of function does not exist, but it wouldn't be hard to code it
23:19 grendal_prime Im thinking i could write something in php
23:20 VanessaE indeed, automating the upload of a world from a client machine to the server would be easy with a bit of scripting and rsync
23:20 grendal_prime web interface manager for just a server.  See im wondering if it is possible to run serveral worlds at one time.
23:20 VanessaE you don't really even need to be inside of Minetest for that
23:20 VanessaE however,
23:20 VanessaE the server instance can only run one world at a time
23:20 VanessaE so someone has to be there to switch worlds when players want to change
23:20 _3SidedSquare Can you run multiple server instances on multiple ports?
23:20 grendal_prime cant run multple server instances?
23:20 VanessaE _3SidedSquare: yes
23:20 VanessaE one server instance per world
23:20 grendal_prime bamn
23:20 _3SidedSquare Cool
23:20 Cylus You couls set it to run new worlds on new ports though.
23:21 VanessaE I run 8 server instances on my remote server, for example
23:21 VanessaE each points to a unique world
23:21 grendal_prime ok i need you guys to do that before friday. thanks ill be back in touch tomorro to check on progress
23:21 VanessaE so you could fire up a new server instance to run a newly-uploaded world
23:21 VanessaE that's easily scriptable too
23:21 grendal_prime what would have been really funny was if i loged off right after i said that. hahahaha
23:21 VanessaE it's just not something we ever thought about
23:21 ShadowNinja grendal_prime: You can run about 65535 servers at a time, per interface, but each can only handle one world at a time.
23:22 _3SidedSquare I would have totally had it ready for you too :P
23:22 grendal_prime wow you rock!
23:22 _3SidedSquare As long as you're not opposed to python
23:22 ShadowNinja (Unless you're on Windows, I think Windows has a limit somewhere in toe 100 range)