Time Nick Message 00:01 paramat do you know how to upgrade to the new perlin map functions? i can help you out, edit your mod if you want 00:02 Peacock didn't notice that hte perlins had changed, i noticed the ore choosing part changed, though im not sure how my 7 ores fit into that structure 00:02 * paramat is in full effect! ;} 00:02 Peacock heck i might not even be done defining ores, im up to 6 or 7 machines lol; 00:03 Peacock i may need to add a non-energy crystalline 00:04 paramat my mods are very perlin heavy ... multiple 3D noise which is very processing intensive, so the new faster perlin functions will help a lot 00:04 Peacock well vmanip helped alot with the old version too, since it's asteroids and not a full landscape 00:05 Peacock ill have to do a side-by-side to get the new perlins in, will that change my current map though? 00:05 paramat umm i think it will be a seamless match 00:06 paramat ... across chunk boundaries if you upgrade mid-world 00:07 Peacock cool, the last big hurdle will be finding solid ground to dump new players on lol 00:08 Peacock though i could probably register a few positions in a file as the asteroids generate 00:08 Peacock either that or pick a static spawn point and let the players build out /explore 00:14 paramat btw non-flowing liquid is done by this in 0.4.7 'liquid_alternative_flowing = "air",' in the node definition 00:14 paramat (0.4.7stable), in 0.4.7dev: 'liquid_range = 0' 00:15 Peacock well i think its the range that causes the lag and cpu load, it only started when it was added 00:15 proller _range prepared for remove 00:15 Peacock good luck with PA :p 00:16 proller he agreed 00:16 Peacock ah good 00:16 kaeza why? 00:16 Peacock honestly i could see the difference between range and viscosity 00:16 Peacock *couldn't 00:16 proller its will be replaced with "levels" 00:16 proller how it works can see in -next 00:17 Peacock well can't we just leave the normal liquids classic? 00:17 proller they leave 00:17 Peacock there was like, 0 lag before, you could make waterfalls and whatnot 00:17 proller but you can define number of levels in any liquid 00:17 proller no lag with finite now 00:18 Peacock yeah but i dont want finite and i dont want classic liquids to behave like it lol 00:18 proller and with finite you make dynwmic waterfalls 00:18 proller nobody removes classic 00:18 Peacock and this gentlemen, is why i moved on to a game with 0 liquids lol 00:18 paramat so liquid with 2 levels will look abstract and blocky? 00:19 paramat ... and process fast? 00:19 proller paramat, no, they use same render as now 00:19 proller VERY fast 00:19 Peacock my algea farm takes ice or snow and converts it to water in texture only lol 00:19 paramat proller, please post more screenshots of your stuff :) 00:19 proller also 1-level liquid already used for sand and gravel 00:20 proller try it yourself https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7033 00:20 proller ^ its all-stuff-in-one 00:20 paramat i saw your old video of drifting clouds, it is awesome 00:20 proller with -game 00:20 proller no, its not mine 00:20 proller its 2-years old and unmerged 00:21 paramat ah okay 00:21 proller but my goal near this video 00:21 proller clouds too hard for now, need client-server sync and more 00:21 proller other already works 00:21 paramat ah because clouds are client side 00:22 Peacock i wish minetest had a tool like remastersys for making custom builsd 00:22 Peacock *builds 00:23 kaeza not everyone cares/wants finite liquids 00:24 paramat also proller, please could you fix the floatlands in indev :} they are a bit embarassing for me because of the flat sides and the non-continuity across chunk boundaries :} its a very quick and easy fix 00:24 kaeza for whatever reason 00:24 proller paramat, show diff ;) 00:25 proller kaeza, old will be always here 00:25 proller but if you want dynamice weather - only finite support it 00:26 Peacock what kaeza said (+1) 00:27 Peacock the more certain things are forced onto people/modders/server admins, the more they're inclined *not* to update MT 00:28 proller all my new stuff disabled by default 00:34 paramat proller, posts 36 to 38 here https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=76760#p76760 i did warn you about the flat edges heh :D 00:34 proller i tried to fix as explained, but nothing 00:34 proller was flat again 00:35 paramat oh okay 00:35 proller can you try change-build? 00:35 paramat i'll look at your code and provide you with diff 00:36 proller end of mapgen_indev.cpp 00:36 paramat SEEDDIFF1 + minp.x * 100 + minp.y * 100 + minp.z * 100 00:37 paramat seed should be dependant on y only 00:37 paramat (seeds) 00:38 paramat i'll go look at the code ... 00:45 Peacock well im gonna go download some beer before tackling the litter, dishes and custom craft guide XD bbl 01:05 paramat where in the code are seeds defined for floatlands? 01:05 proller minetest.conf 01:05 OldCoder Hmm 01:06 OldCoder Somehow I missed Sapier again 01:07 paramat thanks, i mean where did you add the x, y and z dependancy of the seeddiff (seeddiff = SEEDDIFF1 + minp.x * 100 + minp.y * 100 + minp.z * 100)? 01:13 proller something in mapgen_indev.cpp:140 01:13 * paramat looks 01:16 MinetestBot GIT: 4Evergreen4 commited to minetest/minetest: Add wrapper for minetest.rotate_and_place. 1d856b734b 2013-11-07T17:14:26-08:00 http://git.io/45fsjw 01:18 MinetestBot GIT: 4Evergreen4 commited to minetest/minetest_game: Add 6d facedir to logs. 3653859961 2013-11-07T17:16:54-08:00 http://git.io/7YhBPQ 01:19 * EvergreenTree Dances dances joyfully around the room 01:23 EvergreenTree Update: Minetest now has horizontal logs! (thanks to VanessaE's 6d facedir prediction routine) 01:23 paramat cool 01:24 VanessaE :D 01:24 EvergreenTree I wasn't expecting to create a function for just making horizontal logs, but whatevs 01:25 Peacock damnit, finished all the dishes, cleaned the kitchen.... found my wife's coffee cup behind her screen lol 01:25 VanessaE actually, your wrapper will probably find some use elsewhere too 01:27 paramat its good to see hmm-mm helping to get 0.4.8 out fast 01:27 Peacock i think he just got sick of putting it off lol 01:27 Peacock everytime it was about to come out, bam, new milestone lol 01:27 kaeza ^ 01:28 Peacock though i dont know how many bugs they expect to fix with a 1 week feature freeze, or if anything at all will even get done during that period lol 01:28 kaeza 0.4.7 is what, half a year old? 01:29 OldCoder Does kahrl httpfetch make it in? 01:29 VanessaE almost, kaeza 01:29 VanessaE 5 months, thereabouts 01:29 kaeza we are not Debian!™ 01:29 VanessaE haha 01:30 us|0gb Wait, we're Debian? Hold the release then. We aren't due for it yet. 01:30 * Peacock roots for debiarch, or archian XD 01:31 VanessaE ha 01:31 VanessaE ha! 01:31 Peacock something with the testing and package management of debian, but the up-to-dateness of arch 01:32 Peacock unfortunately my dists thread didn't reveal an OS i haven't tried :( lol 01:33 paramat proller, 'mapgen_indev.cpp:140' defines the perlin offset, nothing to do with seed :) i'll continue to search ... thanks for the help 01:39 us|0gb Debian's testedness and Arch's cutting edgeness are opposites. Asking for both is like asking for a pixel that is both #ff0000 and #00ff00. 01:40 Peacock oo, slackware 14.1 released, critics reassessed StarShip Troopers, and the ECB cut it's interest rate 01:40 Peacock ogb well in other words, id take an arch version that makes sure they don't push changes that will instantly bork my system 01:40 zat us|0gb: what about #ffff00 01:41 Peacock what looks like a few innocuous updates end up being a wasted saturday night 01:41 us|0gb That isn't both colors though. It's an addition of those values. 01:42 Peacock though i guess arch assumes most of their users don't have social/sex lives lol 01:52 Peacock lol http://www.reddit.com/r/talesfromtechsupport/comments/1g5wny/security_and_hubris_or_what_drove_me_to_perform/ 01:53 zat Peacock: sounds like you have a problem with Arch= 01:53 zat ? 01:53 Peacock *had* im using #! tho thats got its' own drawbacks (debian repos ) lol 01:54 zat #!? 01:55 Peacock crunchbang 01:56 zat so what waas your issue with Arch? 01:57 Peacock the dual nature of pacman/aur repos, and updates borking shit almost each time 01:57 paramat i wanna fix floatlands in time for 0.4.8 =/ 01:58 zat Peacock: like what? 01:58 zat sounds like could not handle its package management? 01:59 Peacock like what? like glibc, like x, like a number of different things that drops me to shell instead of login screen lol 01:59 paramat ... so far my guess is something to do with seeddiff, farscale, farspread and how they interact ... 02:00 zat so you could not setup a graphical session correctly Peacock? 02:00 Peacock thats not my job, when i run sudo pacman -Syu i expect shit to be working when i restart 02:01 zat that was your problem... expecting it 02:01 Peacock yeah, and thats why people who's time is worth something go with the commercial offerings too :P 02:01 zat Pacman gives notes as it updates, telling you what files you must mix in order to update your configs. 02:02 zat or people that just cannot handle a real operating system ;) 02:03 Peacock a real operating system just works, it requires less attention and time, not more of both 02:04 Peacock people who use their computers for work, games, or doing something other than hacking at bash scripts, prefer a functional setup over one that requires constant fixing ;) 02:05 Peacock when devs get that, linux may be taken more seriously in the consumer and corporate markets :P (other than server setups) 02:05 EvergreenTree Well, I'm out. It was a very productive day 02:05 zat I must be crazy, for I have user Archlinux for five years for everything. 02:05 zat (And my mother too) 02:10 Peacock mother/aunt/grand-mother, ive heard that from every linux apologist :P doesn't change the fact they have to wait for the l3E7 expert to return to update the system lol 02:13 zat well, I have not updated her system in two years now that you say 02:14 zat and whatever you say... it doesn’t change the fact that they will always expect someone else to do it for them even on “simple” things like windows. 02:14 zat where it is usual to want a fresh install rather than an update. 02:14 zat and where system updates are scary and sluggish lol 02:18 Peacock dunno, ive had the exact opposite experience, when i first started using linux, i tried to convert people too, and they all invariably asked me to switch them back within a week 02:18 Peacock be it shitty flash, shitty office rendering, shitty graphics, bad itunes replacements lol 02:18 zat users are resistant to changes 02:18 zat they feel strange in something else that is not exactly what they are used to 02:19 Peacock thats what the gnome devs said and look who still uses that lol 02:19 zat A lot of people use gnome 02:19 zat what makes you think otherwise 02:19 Peacock no one i know in these circles lol 02:19 zat that is your circle 02:20 zat my girlfriend, right next to me now, she uses gnome 02:20 Peacock aiight, ask the on the forums who uses gnome3 02:20 zat and like five more people I know 02:20 zat your experience is no more relevant than mine 02:20 kaeza first time I introduced my sister to Linux, I shower her a VBoxed Ubuntu under Windows... the thing crashed so hard that she was like "fuck no" 02:20 Peacock my sister, mother and friends all hated it 02:21 zat like Windows didn crash LOL 02:21 Peacock one told me "linux is for people with more time than money on their hands" lol 02:21 Sokomine anyone here who know enough of blender to rotate a model? 02:21 Peacock XP and 7 never crashed for me, i dualboot 02:21 zat Sokomine: there is a button for that, maybe the R key as shortcut I think. 02:21 zat Peacock: Archlinux never crashed for me, XP always crashed for me. 02:21 zat My experience has more relevance. ;) 02:21 Peacock the only reason i tried linux was because WinME seriously sucked, but that was a long time ago, and while windows has advanced, lin has been somewhat going in circles 02:22 Sokomine hmpf. i don't know blender. i just need a model rotated. and i don't know weather 90 or 270 degree would be right 02:22 zat In respect of what Peacock? 02:22 Sokomine if you're happy with windows, then use it. as long as you force no one else to use that *censored* :-) 02:22 Peacock in respect to constantly swapping components that work to the detriment of bugs and missing features 02:22 zat Peacock: your experience. 02:23 zat highly biased also 02:23 Peacock yeah and what experiences do the zealots use? lol 02:23 Peacock biased because i dualboot? lol 02:23 * Peacock senses M$ shill comment coming 02:23 zat biased because you only present your opinion as the absolute truth for everything 02:23 zat Your sense fail, sorry 02:23 Peacock no i present my opinion, your confusing me for the FSF lol 02:24 zat I don’t even talk about MS, it doesn’t worry me. 02:25 Peacock you implied that windows crashes (alot?), though im not sure that compensates for updates completely borking a system or missing features 02:25 zat Peacock: your experience~ 02:25 Peacock yeah, so? lol quit saying, what are you basing all your own statements on? 02:25 zat I have not had a buggy update in probably two years. 02:26 Peacock in your experience 02:26 zat Why is your experience more relevant than mine? 02:26 zat ;) 02:26 Peacock well you keep saying my opinions are based on my experience, im simply returning the favour :-) 02:27 zat Well, so give me an objective argument. 02:27 Peacock your grandma or mine? because no one i introduced to linux though it was objectively better then what they had before 02:28 zat that is not objective 02:28 zat you only talk about experiences 02:28 zat and experiences of inexperienced people that are scared of new things naturally 02:29 Peacock so anyone that doesn't like linux is either a moron or scared, gee where have i heard that before lol 02:29 zat I didnt say that, you are saying that. 02:29 Peacock im platform agnostic, im simply pointing out that windows has caught up in the last few version while linux has been somewhat stuck in a ditch, with even the newer android overtaking it in popularity 02:30 dafull97 Craigy here? 02:30 Peacock linux isn't new btw lol 02:31 Peacock linux (1991), a unix-like (1969) system 02:33 Peacock and i dont totally hate arch, i like it for awhile, i just wish it wasn't a high maintenance girlfriend lol 02:34 zat Peacock: Windows has caught up... I would not call it that considering that Microsoft heavily invests in making manufacturers sell computers with Windows preinstalled so users learn it is the standard. 02:34 zat To misinform users and make privative file formats so they can make look other office suits are not good. 02:35 Peacock what do hardware manufacturers have to do with the OS itself being more usable and stable than it was in the 90s? 02:35 zat All systems become more usable/stable with time. 02:36 Peacock well i had the best of times with lin around 06-07 (old-school ubuntu), its been slowly but steadily increasing in maintenance requirements since 02:37 zat The funny thing, users are extremely critical and intolerant about issues happening in GNU/Linux systems, like they are unforgivable. 02:37 Peacock and btw, linux computer sold in store cost more than windows computers because they can put a shitton of bloatware on win computers to more than subsidize the cost of the license 02:37 zat They don’t complain that Windows normally degrades and has to be installed from zero every few months. 02:38 Peacock what you think windows and mac don't take shit for their bugs? lol it's only lin devs that say "its free, you cant complain" lol 02:38 zat what are bugtrackers for then 02:38 Peacock every few months... what do you think distro-hopping is? either shit got borked or the user got fed up with whatever dist they were using 02:39 us`0gb That's why I kept switching. 02:39 Peacock i seriously do hope linux gets better, but i also recognize so long as it's fanboys are unwilling to look at it critically, shit won't get fixed 02:40 us`0gb I plan to switch again once Guix is stabilized. 02:40 Peacock Guix, thats a new one? 02:40 us`0gb It is indeed. 02:40 us`0gb Not yet ready for everyday use though. 02:42 Peacock im holding out hope for a slightly more stable version of archbang, or a truly freer debian (or nonfree depending who you ask) 02:42 Peacock i still have a hard time with mint :/ 02:42 zat The only thing I criticize, I do not like most desktop environments. 02:43 Peacock seems xfce on *buntu is slower than xfce on debian or arch 02:43 zat other than that, what can I criticize? 02:43 SmugLeaf xfce on gentoo 02:43 SmugLeaf master race 02:43 Peacock well zat, ive been using linux for nigh onto 10 or 12 years, ive had a long list of issues over those years but i wont start posting it all here now for everyone's sake lol 02:44 zat I really cannot believe you have been for 10 or 12 years and you call it linux. 02:44 zat The name of the OSes are the name of the distributions. 02:45 SmugLeaf what 02:45 SmugLeaf no 02:45 SmugLeaf linux is linux 02:45 Peacock its linux, not GNU linux, not Ubuntu, its linux lol 02:45 SmugLeaf well specifically linux is the kernel 02:45 zat Right SmugLeaf, just the kernel. 02:45 Peacock yes if people want to be anal, linux is the kernel, but none of it would exist without linux lol 02:45 SmugLeaf you could kind of get away with refering to the userspace as the distro name 02:45 Peacock thats why we call it linux 02:46 Peacock distro is simply a combination of different components 02:46 SmugLeaf since the distros use such different userspace configs 02:46 Peacock most of which hinge on the package manager and DE 02:46 zat Peacock: there are distros that can optionally use BSD or Hurd. 02:46 us`0gb Actually, GNU existed long before Linux and convinced Torvalds to release Linux under the GNU license. 02:46 kaeza HURRD 02:46 Peacock yeah ive heard of Arch Hurd, never tried that tho 02:46 SmugLeaf hurrrrrrr 02:46 SmugLeaf portage on freebsd 02:46 SmugLeaf gentoo master race 02:47 zat Originally GNU project was going to use Hurd as kernel. 02:47 Peacock yes GNU existed before linux, but it still took longer to finish hurd 02:47 SmugLeaf does the GNU kernel boot anything yet? 02:47 SmugLeaf it's still dead right? 02:47 Peacock and torvalds didn't really care about GNU 02:47 Peacock "I'm doing a (free) operating system (just a hobby, won't be big and professional like gnu)" - Linus 02:48 SmugLeaf shit 02:48 SmugLeaf I started with linux in highschool 02:48 SmugLeaf that makes it close to 10 years now 02:48 SmugLeaf i'm so old 02:48 SmugLeaf ;_; 02:48 SmugLeaf RIP binge drunking 02:48 Peacock though that didn't stop stallman from muscling in on the credit and trying to take over a few critical projects like glibc (http://www.redhat.com/archives/redhat-install-list/2001-August/msg00346.html) 02:49 us`0gb Hurd works sort of, but not really. BUt you can't say "without Linux, we wouldn't have" any more than you can say that about GNU. 02:49 us`0gb GNU contributed much more to the system. 02:49 Peacock GNU needs linux more than linux needed GNU, that's what it boils down to :P 02:49 SmugLeaf ^ 02:49 us`0gb And the GNU project is the one that assembled the pieces, nit the Linux team. 02:49 Peacock without Linus, none of it would have taken off 02:49 zat If there was no linux, there would be other kernel. 02:49 SmugLeaf android uses a non-GNU userspace 02:50 SmugLeaf zat: how old was the GNU userspace before linus made a kernel? 02:50 Peacock and i wouldn't place my faith in a man like stallman who thinks paedophilia, necrophilia, and eating shit off your feet is OK 02:50 zat SmugLeaf: I dont know 02:51 us`0gb Actually, the GNU team fought tooth and nail to make this happen. Linux was only the final piece of the puzzle. 02:51 dafull97 us`0gb 02:51 dafull97 pm please 02:51 us`0gb Peacock: I think some of what Stallman thinks is garbage. But that doesn't mean it all is. 02:51 Peacock i think he's mentally ill 02:52 Peacock i also think the FSF is a cult, its got a guru, dogma, followers, and it asks for money 02:52 Peacock neither the leader or it's followers seem terribly mentally stable 02:52 zat Peacock: so what are the problem with GNU/Linux distros? 02:52 zat only how stable are the packages they push to repos 02:52 zat ? 02:53 us`0gb The open source group asks for money as well. I think the Linux FOundation does too. 02:53 Peacock yeah but all the zealots i meet are from the fsf 02:53 Peacock thats the difference between a nonprofit and a cult 02:54 us`0gb I've seen many Windows zealots. I haven't watched for Linux ones, but it's not only GNU. 02:54 Peacock linux, linus, BSD licenses, they believe in mixing and coexistence, the fsf and the gpl don't lol 02:54 kaeza ^ 02:54 zat Wat, the worst fanboys ever are Free-BDS and Python ones. 02:55 zat BSD* 02:55 Peacock funny, even though windows makes up a much bigger market share, i meet fewer of it's zealots than i do linux zealots, (not saying they dont exist, i also hate mac fanbois) 02:55 us`0gb Peacock: That's because of what we believe. We believe that those things are bad, and therefore, mixing with them isn't something we desire. 02:56 kaeza "bad"? 02:56 zat Windows users are normally users that cannot define what operating system means. 02:56 kaeza you make it sound way worse than it is 02:56 Menche I once told my uncle, who uses Windows, that I use linux. His question: "Linux? Is that sort of like Explorer?" 02:57 us`0gb Actually, I was putting it lightly, not making it out like it was as big of an issue as I feel it is. 02:57 Peacock ogb: key word being "believe", and thats why i treat you guys as a cult lol 02:57 zat Menche: once I was asked: “I heard you use a Windows linux, how is it like?” 02:57 Peacock notions of good, evil, bad, good, those are religious concepts 02:57 kaeza yes, I won't say that M$ are some kind of holy man, 02:58 Peacock naw, MS is a business, like mac, they're in it for the money, does that make them evil? 02:58 us`0gb I used that word to seem less like I'm telling you off. 02:58 us`0gb It's not about money. 02:58 kaeza but you are putting the hobbyist programmers, who release binaries but not the source ("freeware") in the same bag as the "evil" people 02:58 zat Not evil exactly, but their strategy to try keeping market share are bad. 02:58 dmitryk1 Hi All 02:58 Peacock yeah well like alot of guys before you, you talk to me about beliefs, good guys and bad guys, it all sounds terribly dogmatic 02:58 zat Microsoft likes misinforming users. 02:58 kaeza dmitryk1, hi 02:59 us`0gb kaeza: Exactly. 02:59 Peacock zat most people live in countries where there are monopolies over one industry or another 02:59 zat Peacock: ???? 02:59 us`0gb Peacock: Morality is subjective. I don't know what you want in that regard. 02:59 dmitryk1 Has anybody debug minetest in VS2010? Can help me? 03:00 Peacock Russia is an energy producer, do you decry Gazprom? 03:00 zat I cannot keep discussing now, I need to sleep. 03:00 Peacock the US is IT and defense, obviously theyre going to have big players too 03:00 Peacock *and finance 03:01 zat EH sorry, before a leave... 03:01 kaeza dmitryk1, what problems are you having 03:01 kaeza ? 03:01 kaeza hi again zat :P 03:01 zat Please someone try my damn new rollback!!!!! 03:02 zat kaeza: ::) 03:05 dmitryk1 kaeza, I get all sources from git, get irrlicht jthread and zlib, get from old and run minetest.vcproj and get errors about not found some file 03:06 dmitryk1 example: error C1083: Cannot open include file: 'irrTypes.h': No such file or directory 03:07 dmitryk1 but it put in minetest\irrlicht\irrlicht-1.8\include\irrTypes.h 03:08 dmitryk1 May send me working vss project and sourses? 03:09 dmitryk1 I have error after install mods and want look why 03:11 kaeza well, you could have started with that 03:11 dmitryk1 I very small understand c++ and hope can find error reason 03:11 kaeza what is the error you get from the mods (and which mod(s) are we talking about)? 03:11 kaeza (look at the end of debug.txt) 03:12 Peacock i usually get warnings about irrtypes.h too when i compile, but it proceeds anyways :S 03:12 dmitryk1 In thread 2448: ..\..\src\minetest\src\nodedef.cpp:500: CNodeDefManager::set: Assertion 'c <= 0xfff' failed. Debug stacks: DEBUG STACK FOR THREAD 2448: #0 main 03:13 kaeza dmitryk1, too many mods installed 03:13 kaeza (actually, too many items defined) 03:14 dmitryk1 I find htis in forum byt hope what it my mistake 03:14 Peacock didn;t they pull V's fix for the node count? 03:15 kaeza Peacock, I think that only fixes the "dummy" nodedefs for unknown items 03:15 kaeza not "real" items 03:15 kaeza not sure :P 03:15 zat ok thx 03:15 zat cya 03:16 kaeza night zat 03:17 kaeza dmitryk1, can you paste a listing of your mods ( http://pastebin.com ) ? 03:17 dmitryk1 i read about around 2000 nodes. it very small 03:18 dmitryk1 kaeza, directory? 03:18 kaeza minetest\mods\ 03:23 dmitryk1 http://pastebin.com/RW4yxGRY 03:24 Peacock tabarnacle, thats a full file list lol 03:24 VanessaE uch. backslashes for path elements.... a travesty. 03:24 VanessaE :)_ 03:25 NekoGloop VanessaE, I'm taking an operating systems class, and after the DOS section? I agree. 03:25 kaeza wait... 03:25 kaeza 0.4.5 ??? 03:25 VanessaE NekoGloop: yep. Now you know why they went that way. stupid, wasn't it? 03:25 us-0gb I remember 0.4.5. That one was a good one. 03:25 Peacock and why run minetest from \Backup\? 03:25 Peacock 0.4.6 was the best :P 03:25 NekoGloop let's use - 03:26 Peacock NG you should do network admin, lots of jobs 03:26 us-0gb I liked 0.4.5 better than 0.4.6, but I like 0.4.8 (?) better than both. 03:26 Peacock or android dev, but ugh, java lol 03:26 VanessaE the latest homedecor and moretrees now require git from this evening btw. moreblocks and ilights will also if my pulls go into those two repos :) 03:26 dmitryk1 :) it's global backup 03:26 Peacock odd, i had more bugs/performance issues with 0.4.5, but 0.4.6 was smooth as data's bottom 03:27 kaeza dmitryk1, try updating to some latest build for windows 03:28 kaeza this seems to be one of the most recent: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=1523 03:28 kaeza ... 03:28 kaeza dat avatar sfan5 03:28 dmitryk1 VanessaE, I look like you mods 03:29 Peacock he should go with one of the my little pony avatars XD 03:29 dmitryk1 kaeza, I download latest version... Or no? 03:29 VanessaE you what? 03:29 kaeza dmitryk1, yes 03:29 Peacock btw, one of the moderators handy with GIT, what would you say about an archive thread of the various minetest versions? 03:31 kaeza at least PA and sfan have an archive AFAIK 03:31 kaeza including some forks 03:32 dmitryk1 VanessaE, sorry for my english :) 03:32 VanessaE it's ok :) 03:33 Peacock or maybe the minetest website could have previous version DLs of the source? 03:34 VanessaE It used to. 03:34 Peacock alot of projects do 03:35 Peacock id like to test my space game on 0.4.6 but i dont know the appropriate git hieroglyphs lol 03:39 dmitryk1 I found 0.4.7 minetest. Is it only 2000 nodes too? 03:40 dmitryk1 0.4.7 is crash too 03:41 dmitryk1 is has plan to lager max nodes count? 03:42 dmitryk1 and what about VS project? 03:51 Peacock try removing some of the bigger mods first and see if you still have problems 03:52 VanessaE VS? 03:53 Peacock im wondering about that too lol 03:53 VanessaE and yes, later versions have more than 2000 nodes. current 0.4.8-git has 32766. 03:53 dmitryk1 VS-Microsoft Visual Studio 03:54 VanessaE I doubt it. 03:54 VanessaE minetest aims to be platform-agnostic 03:54 VanessaE (unless that's MSVC, in which case yes) 03:55 Peacock Microsoft Vietcong? 03:55 VanessaE wait, visual studio is visual basic, yes? 03:55 dmitryk1 VanessaE, yes, but you can write platform-agnostic on ms product. 03:56 VanessaE hm 03:57 dmitryk1 VanessaE? Ha! Yes. And Visual C++, J++,Java,Jscript,C# and others 03:57 VanessaE well, there is an MSVC hook of some kind. 03:57 VanessaE but as a Visual Studio project? doubt it. 03:58 * VanessaE will stick to Linux :) 03:58 dmitryk1 You not like developers on windows? 03:58 VanessaE I don't like windows at all 03:59 Peacock im curious about the differences between cpp and c#, since i find cpp to be a mess 03:59 VanessaE but the decision to allow for MS product support is not mine, that's up to the core dev team 03:59 VanessaE Peacock: C# bears more resemblance to Java than to C, as I'm told. 03:59 dmitryk1 Sorry. I Think I can halp You to write this good game. 04:00 VanessaE dmitryk1: help is always welcome 04:00 VanessaE but you'll have to work within the current framework for now I guess 04:01 dmitryk1 I think what c++ code can write on any platform and late compile on another. 04:02 dmitryk1 linux only+minetest in develop so strange 04:02 Menche strange? 04:02 Menche how? 04:03 dmitryk1 Its "platform-agnostic" 04:03 VanessaE minetest isn't linux-only. 04:04 VanessaE that's just what most of the devs use, but some folks develop it on windows too 04:05 dmitryk1 And then i try ask about Win develop You joke about it :) 04:05 Menche why can't you develop it on Win? 04:05 VanessaE well, to be fair, windows is a bit of a joke ;) 04:05 VanessaE oh, Menche... --> msg 04:06 dmitryk1 Yes. Can anybody windows developer help me to start? Can you give me some contacts? 04:08 dmitryk1 VanessaE, I understand, you not like windows :) 04:09 * VanessaE pokes at NekoGloop 04:09 VanessaE he knows windows fairly well, but not core dev stuff 04:09 * NekoGloop yawns 04:09 Peacock V, if windows were a joke howcome we're a fraction of windows users? :P 04:10 kaeza dmitryk1, the only one I know that compiles natively on Windows is BlockMen (search the forums) 04:10 kaeza other devs crosscompile from Linux 04:12 Peacock and why would (professional) game devs take it more seriously than they take us lol 04:15 dmitryk1 kaeza, thank I try to find him. 04:16 VanessaE Peacock: because it's THAT big of a joke? :) 04:16 us-0gb I wonder how hard it would be to write an auto-respond script for when someone mentions my name on IRC .... 04:17 Peacock if you thought that many people were dumb you wouldn't believe in democracy :-) 04:17 us-0gb I guess it would depend on the IRC client. 04:17 VanessaE Peacock: dumb + democracy = USA. 'nuff said? :D 04:17 * us-0gb nods 04:17 Menche technically, representative democracy or republic. different things. 04:18 Peacock well if you don't like free markets and democracy your fellow americans could suggest places you might enjoy more, like north Korea or the middle east :P 04:18 us-0gb So we are a country of dumb people who can't vote directly. 04:18 VanessaE free market? what's that? 04:18 VanessaE oh 04:18 VanessaE you mean that thing we allegedly have, but don't in actuality? 04:19 us-0gb Yeah, that. 04:19 VanessaE . 04:19 Peacock well if you really believed that you'd apply for refugee status in China 04:20 NekoGloop VanessaE, what is this, doodle god? 04:20 NekoGloop how do I make dumb and democracy 04:20 VanessaE ? 04:20 us-0gb Not really. Life here is more comfortable than in China. 04:20 VanessaE I poked you because you know windows, and dmitryk1 needs help with minetest dev under that platform 04:20 Peacock it amazes me how people who receive generous benefits from their government can also rail against their own countries 04:20 Menche a new forum member with 1 post just reported a post by a moderator. the reason he gave: "Dont Care!" (sic) 04:21 VanessaE ? 04:21 kaeza wat 04:21 NekoGloop VanessaE, i was talking about "dumb + democracy = USA" 04:22 NekoGloop well ok i know that but uhhh how do i get dumb and democracy 04:22 VanessaE NekoGloop: you can't argue against the fact that the vast majority of voters in this country leave their brains at home when they go to the polls 04:22 NekoGloop what elements to i combine 04:23 Peacock in any case you're much more likely to have a tea-party dictatorship than a left-wing dictatorship, so i'd thank my lucky stars you have democracy lol 04:23 VanessaE NekoGloop: mix one part congresscritters with three parts attack ads, then carefulyl fold in two parts money and a dash of television. bake at 350 for 4 months. 04:24 VanessaE Peacock: don't get me wrong, I'm glass we have the system we have (to a degree; it's a republic, not a democracy), but if you watch what goes on here from our perspective, well...its just going to shit :( 04:24 Peacock and you think the 70s werent bad? 04:24 Peacock the US has always rebounded 04:24 VanessaE and the voters cast their ballots from emotion and party lines, not intelligence. 04:25 VanessaE I'm sure it'll rebound, but when? 04:25 Peacock i mean, you get benefits, you have a house, thats more than i have working 04:25 Peacock so the US cant be that bad a place 04:25 VanessaE I have a house I pay $720 USD a month for, and it's a rental. 04:26 Peacock thats more than i could afford on benefits 04:26 VanessaE I have benefits I earned every penny of, that wouldn't even pay the rent + electric if Abe and I weren't together. 04:27 Peacock well i do contracts, my wife does hours, and we only have a decent flat, though i dont rail nearly as much against my own country lol 04:27 Peacock and trust me, you ain't seen monopolies until you've been to Canada 04:27 VanessaE I rail against the government, not the country. 04:28 VanessaE (as do most others here :) ) 04:28 Peacock there aren't enough consumers here with the territory we have to justify as many players as the US has 04:28 Peacock so we get fucked on wireless, phone, cable, gas 04:28 us-0gb That distinction is a good point. 04:28 Peacock we even pay more for cars and any product you can think of that the US has 04:29 us-0gb THat's not the government lowering the prices though. 04:29 Peacock naw, the last time the US tried to lower prices (homes, subprime) you got the great recession, so i'd say thats a BAD idea lol 04:30 Peacock the plain fact is i couldn't survive on welfare, and barely survived the one time i was on unemployment, thats why id rather take *any* job than ever go back on unemployment lol 04:31 VanessaE that was private industry doign that, Peacock 04:31 VanessaE subprime referred to the interest rates, not the actual raw cost of the homes 04:32 Peacock im pretty sure the subprime thing was Bush's doing 04:32 VanessaE maybe he had a hand in it, but it was all private industry actually doing it 04:32 VanessaE lenders and the like 04:32 Peacock http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Government_policies_and_the_subprime_mortgage_crisis 04:32 VanessaE the rules for lending got relaxed 04:32 VanessaE private industry abused them 04:33 VanessaE bubble -> burst 04:33 Peacock yeah, so when the gov't sets the rules rather than private industry, you got disaster, but you still rail against private industry, explain lol 04:33 VanessaE um, no 04:34 VanessaE if the government says "you can give up to 5 kilos of cheese to each customer each month" and you give 4 when you can only safely sustain 4, what's gonna happen? 04:34 VanessaE er give 5 when you can sustain 4. 04:34 Peacock bush wanted to help americans buy homes, that lead the gov't to back risky loans, and the banks said wtf, why not.... surprised? 04:34 dafull97 VanessaE 04:34 VanessaE yes, dafull97 04:34 dafull97 can you do a big favor for me =) 04:35 VanessaE Peacock: not surprised at all, because it was the *banks* that chose to *abuse* the options made available to them 04:35 VanessaE dafull97: what? 04:35 dafull97 next time you see craigydavi in here 04:35 dafull97 tell him to talk to me in my email 04:35 Peacock thats like blaming the drug addict even though he had plenty of enablers around him 04:35 VanessaE dafull97: sure. 04:35 dafull97 since we work different times 04:35 VanessaE Peacock: blame the pusher as much as the addict. 04:35 VanessaE but don't blame the cops for arresting them both. 04:36 Peacock so you admit the government is no better than industry in setting policy, yet you lay the blame at industry's feet 04:36 dafull97 thanks VanessaE.. 04:36 VanessaE the government sets the rules, private industry finds ways to *abuse* the rules. loopholes and the like. 04:36 VanessaE I blame the ones who actually caused the problems, not the ones who loosened the rules. 04:37 VanessaE loose rules are not a license to abuse the syste, 04:37 VanessaE system* 04:37 VanessaE but that's exactly what private industries do 04:37 VanessaE all the while raking in huge profits, and claiming at the same time that they're "losing" money 04:37 Peacock private industry does what is profitable, if the government backs risky loans, then it's a no-brainer 04:37 VanessaE (yeah, "losing", as in "I made a million less this month" == "I lost a million this month") 04:38 VanessaE you mean like fannie mae? those are private. 04:38 VanessaE or they were 04:38 VanessaE now they're government-owned, in response to the crisis 04:39 Peacock id propose that the fault isn't industry or the gov'ts, its the boomer voters who voted in people who made all that possible, and even then, i dont think it's a reason to deprive smarter generations of their democracy because of boomer mistakes 04:39 VanessaE that's part of the problem too. 04:40 VanessaE which is why I said the voters leave their brains at home. 04:40 Peacock and now boomers want their benefits, and leave the kids to pay for it all 04:40 VanessaE but remember, voters == private industry also. 04:40 Peacock depends on which voters you're talking about 04:40 Peacock i sincerely think the boomers should be made to pay their debts 04:41 Peacock young people aren't stupid, they know they wont get as many benefits as boomers did, all while we pay taxes to support theirs 04:41 VanessaE and those debts would be... what exactly? 04:41 Peacock do you seriously think pensions and medicaid will still be there in 20 years? 04:42 VanessaE pensions are a private industry thing. 04:42 Peacock not here 04:42 VanessaE here they are. 04:42 VanessaE maybe you mean retirement. 04:42 VanessaE and yes, because every working american pays into a separate fund for that, called FICA. 04:42 VanessaE it's totally and completely separate from the general fund, which is the one you hear all the noise about. 04:43 Peacock point is, the greatest generation (ww2 generation) built the great society, and the boomers took advantage of it while reducing their own burden in paying for it, and their children will be the ones left to pay for it, while they get nothing 04:43 Peacock though because the boomers were dumb in their own choices, you think democracy is stupid by consequence 04:44 Peacock though young people have access to way more information than boomers ever had 04:44 VanessaE those boomers are paying in as well, you realize. 04:44 VanessaE were/are 04:44 VanessaE don't fall for the scare tactics 04:44 Peacock boomers fucked the west, and we'll be the ones to rebuild it lol 04:45 Peacock paying for it how, by deferring their retirement by 2 or 3 years? 04:45 Peacock some of my friends don't think they'll ever be able to retire 04:45 VanessaE I mean in taxes. 04:46 Peacock the boomers have been cutting their taxes since the 80s 04:46 Peacock though no one alive today thinks they can go anywhere but up 04:46 VanessaE from the age of 21 until 60-65 or whatever, a portion of their pay still goes to FICA, and that portion has not decreased, afaik. 04:47 Peacock and i pay for pension programs which will probably be insolvent by the time i reach retirement 04:47 Peacock at least the boomers will get theirs 04:48 Peacock if youre looking for someone to blame, dont blame industry or the government, blame the voters of the 70s,80s and 90s 04:49 VanessaE you mean the same voters that, surprise! run private industry now? 04:49 VanessaE private industry doesn't just spring forth from the ground like weeds. there are real voters at fault. 04:50 Peacock it takes a majority to vote in a government, last time i checked, its not 51% of the pop. that runs industry 04:50 Peacock most CEOs believe in balancing the books 04:50 VanessaE it takes a majority to vote, but our electoral system doesn't count the popular vote. 04:51 VanessaE a 60% majority of voters can turn into a 45-49% minority when the electoral college votes are counted. 04:51 Peacock so your solution is to abolish democracy and private industry? 04:51 Peacock why not move to a country that's already done it? 04:51 VanessaE when did I say that? 04:52 Peacock or if you dont wanna move, why not start a Coop? 04:52 VanessaE the correct solution would be to get money (most of which comes from private industry) out of politics, so as to level the proverbial playing field. 04:53 VanessaE without the attack ads, people would have little choice but to make up their minds for themselves. 04:54 VanessaE If you advertise, don't tell me what your opponent didn't do, tell me what you will do. 04:54 VanessaE 99% of the ads of that flavor are candidate A attacking B directly, with as many scare tactics as they can cram into a 30 second commercil 04:54 VanessaE commercial* 04:55 Peacock so, removing attack ads would fix it all, or? 04:55 VanessaE the actual clean, attack-free political commercial is a rare bird 04:56 us-0gb VanessaE: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&ved=0CDEQtwIwAQ&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D6TiXUF9xbTo&ei=uG58Ur60IqH9iwLC9IGQDw&usg=AFQjCNHxsacQiaW8l9fh2fOTmF2pLhzg-w&bvm=bv.56146854,d.cGE (Sorry for the long URI, I'm not on my usual system, which would have cleaned that garbage.) 04:57 Peacock well, the last time i checked even negative political ads are free speech, so long as you don't advocate people committing crimes i don't see a problem 04:57 us-0gb Oops, that's the wrong URI anyway. 04:58 us-0gb Never mind, that was the right URI. 04:58 Peacock lol 04:58 VanessaE Peacock: freedom of speech does not mean freedom to attack. 04:58 VanessaE "You can't yell 'fire!' in a crowded theater" 04:58 Peacock freedom of speech means being able to say whatever the fuck you want, no matter how dumb 04:59 VanessaE us-0gb: care to summarize? not really in the mood to watch a video. 04:59 Peacock if people are dumb enough to commit crimes based on that, then they should be jailed, none of that liberal BS about good behaviour letting them out early 04:59 * paramat may have just solved the core floatland discontinuity bug =) 04:59 VanessaE Peacock: sure, but freedom of speech needs some limits, otherwise it devolves to anarchy 04:59 VanessaE those same dumb people are who VOTE and when they do that, they affect ME. 05:00 VanessaE your freedom of speech stops where my wallet begins. 05:00 Peacock dunno, the same people who thinks there should be limits on free speech seem to think the general populace is too dumb to make up their own minds about what's right and wrong 05:00 VanessaE yeah, because those people are *kept* dumb. Not that they're naturally stupid. 05:01 VanessaE try living in this country for say 10-15 years. you'll change your tune real quick :) 05:01 Peacock id hate to live in a country that tells me what i can and can't say because some people might be too dumb to interpret it correctly 05:02 VanessaE paramat: I've been wondering.. how much of your work can (will) be translated into new C++ mapgen features? Some of the shit you do is just plain awesome. 05:02 VanessaE Peacock: you mean the same country that says money == free speech? 05:02 Peacock i think actual crimes should be prosecuted, correctly, without the liberal bias, and not bother the state with thoughtcrime 05:03 VanessaE I agree there. 05:03 us-0gb VanessaE: Basically an attack on another candidate. An example of what you were talking about. 05:03 Peacock well limits on free speech is essential thoughtcrime 05:03 VanessaE us-0gb: right. exactly my point then. 05:03 Peacock and thoughtcrime is subjective on the person(s) in power not agreeing with the message 05:03 us-0gb paramat: Awesome! 05:03 paramat V, all of it can, but im hesitant to get that deeply involved in the core, as a modder i can work alone and freely :) 05:03 VanessaE Peacock: getting on TV and influencing MILLIONS to some particular action that leads to the further downfall of this country is not a thoughtcrime 05:04 VanessaE paramat: fair enough :) 05:05 paramat heh i was about to learn C++ but then LVM came along, i may be able to do everything i want in lua mods and games 05:05 Peacock well the only thing i can recommend to the US is to change to a system that allows more than 2 parties 05:05 VanessaE Peacock: the system DOES allow more than two. there are about half a dozen. 05:05 VanessaE problem is getting them into higher officies. 05:05 Peacock though i can understand that after being a colony of the UK you wanted nothing to do with the parliamentary system 05:05 VanessaE offices* 05:06 VanessaE I think at present there are one or two independents in the House, out of 532 total (there are 3 empty seats) 05:06 VanessaE the secondary problem is some of those third-party candidates are just bat-shit insane :) 05:07 Peacock well parliamentary systems help with the formation of new parties 05:07 Peacock if you prefer coalition gov'ts as i do, then proportional rep also helps 05:08 Peacock though you wont change anyone's vote by telling them it's industrys' or govts' fault 05:08 VanessaE Right now we have the Dempcrats, Republicans, the Tea Party, Libertarians, Green Party, and one or two others that I don't remember right now 05:08 Peacock if anything you'll drive them to the tea party 05:08 VanessaE Democrats* 05:10 VanessaE hell there are couple dozen in total actually. 05:10 VanessaE the Constitution party was the other major one. 05:11 Peacock so, essentially, you dont think there's anything wrong with industry, its more the political system that sticks you with two choices that have a chance of winning? 05:11 VanessaE it's both. 05:11 VanessaE the private industries support the two main parties, who support them, in a self-reinforcing cycle. 05:11 Peacock well if you wanna change things id pick 1 goal and work at it 05:12 VanessaE the end result is third-party candidates have little to no chance at higher offices and virtually zero chance at getting into a proper televised debate. 05:12 Peacock hell, you americans can recall some of your representatives, we can't even do that in Toronto with our crack-smoking mayor 05:13 VanessaE I wish we could. problem is no one's got enough gumption to do it. everyone's got their 6-packof bud and american idle. 05:14 Peacock well then democracy's not the problem, the voters are 05:14 VanessaE I vote for whoever makes the most sense, from a purely rational standpoint, but I am one person out of around 130 million. 05:14 VanessaE (who vote) 05:15 Peacock well in the last few years i've been voting separatist since i dont like the direction Canada's been taking 05:16 VanessaE two things would fix the problem: get rid of the winner-takes-all, first-past-the-post system of electoral votes, and repeal/overturn Citizens United. 05:17 VanessaE 49 of the 50 states give all their electoral votes to only one candidate or the other, regardless of the popular vote in that state, so if 50.0001% of the voters in a state go republican, let's say, then the whole state does, rather than giving (int(50% of electoral votes) + 1) to that party and the rest to whoever else. 05:17 VanessaE (the exception is Nebraska, who did exactly that) 05:18 us-0gb The whole electoral college thing is a bad idea. 05:18 us-0gb It's not just the implementation. 05:18 VanessaE it was a good idea when votes took weeks to count and there were only 13 colonies. 05:18 VanessaE now it's just stupid 05:18 us-0gb Weeks to count ... ha, we don't have that anymore. 05:19 paramat hmmmm, would you be interested in fixing the core floatlands bug together with proller and myself? i believe the bug is caused by an incremented noise index in a [x[z[y]]] mapgen loop, which of course creates discontinuous terrain across chunk boundaries 05:20 paramat ... https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/mapgen_indev.cpp#L347 05:21 VanessaE in fact the 2012 election was a perfect example. 336 vs 206 electoral votes, in favor of obama. That's 50% more for obama vs. rmoney. the popular vote tells a different story: they were separated by only about 4 percent (in favor of obama) 05:21 Peacock well judging from the 1st bush election it still tooks weeks to count lol 05:21 VanessaE had the electoral votes at least been counted by district than by state, the results would have more closely matched the popular votr. 05:21 paramat noise index needs to be calculated per node instead of incremented +1 each time 05:21 VanessaE vote* 05:22 VanessaE (not that the outcome would have changed) 05:22 VanessaE ok bush's first election was a clusterfuck :) 05:22 VanessaE I'll grant you that 05:22 Menche i forget which, but there have been a few elections where the winner of the popular vote lost the electoral vote 05:23 VanessaE yes 05:23 VanessaE in fact wasn't one of bush's elections like that? 05:24 VanessaE yes 05:24 VanessaE the 2000 election 05:24 Peacock though in the end, just because voters are dumb and the system needs an update, doesn't mean i think democracy should be abandoned 05:24 VanessaE 48.4% of the popular vote went to Gore (vs. 47.9% to Bush), but Bush won the electoral college by 5 votes. 05:25 Peacock if people aren't happy with that system theres always china were politics and industry is regulated by the state 05:25 Peacock *where 05:25 paramat hmm-mm, it should be a quick fix, i'm sure it can be done in time for 0.4.8 05:25 VanessaE people have no ability to change the system anymore 05:25 VanessaE it's too ingrained. 05:25 Peacock and they have more power in leftist china? 05:25 Peacock we've seen left governments all throughout history, they had even less freedom 05:27 VanessaE just because country A is bad and country B is better doesn't mean country isn't also bad. 05:27 * paramat sits back with popcorn ... 05:27 VanessaE it just means country A is worse. 05:28 Peacock so knocking country B's institutions to make them more in line with country A's doesn't make things better either 05:28 Peacock ideally people should teach their kids to be better judges of character, because no matter what system you have, you'll always have people willing to take advantage of the situation 05:30 Peacock no matter where the power rests, you'll always find parasite there 05:30 Peacock *parasites 05:30 VanessaE yep 05:30 Peacock at least in a democratic system, you can vote them out 05:31 Peacock even shareholders can 05:31 VanessaE if you're lucky enough to get a chance to vote them out. 05:31 Peacock well you have to become part of the equation 05:31 VanessaE we have a secondary problem: do you vote for the garbage, or the trash? 05:32 paramat in the UK democracy is the illusion of choice, the parties can change very little, and are virtually identical, the system is in power and cannot be voted out 05:32 Peacock well if you think all the choices are bad, why not try to support someone you think is good, or become a candidate yourself? at least then you can say you tried 05:32 VanessaE Peacock: did I not already say that I do exactly that? 05:32 Peacock well by support i mean more than just vote 05:32 VanessaE I vote for whoever makes the most rational sense, I don't give two shits about parties. 05:32 VanessaE I do what I can, which is not much. 05:33 Peacock well you're good with computers and the net, that's something all politicians need 05:33 Peacock these days half the campaigns are waged online 05:33 VanessaE that's what facebook is for :) 05:36 hmmmm paramat, he cannot do what he's doing 05:37 Peacock well if i met a politician i could actually believe in, i'd give my time, but since i think the system could only be made worse by the present lot, i dont bother, thought i dont advocate abolishing freedoms and rights either 05:37 hmmmm x, z, y order is not unit stride for either 2d or 3d noise 05:37 hmmmm there is absolutely no surprise the result is screwed up 05:37 paramat yep 05:37 hmmmm in order to fix the 2d, what he can do is flip z and x 05:37 paramat funny its related to what we were discussing 05:37 hmmmm but it'd be a better idea to just calculate the 3d and only increment the 3d 05:38 paramat okay 05:38 hmmmm i am looking at the source right now and there's no reason in particular why you'd need to iterate in the y direction with the innermost loop 05:38 paramat correct 05:38 hmmmm so what I'd suggest is changing the loop order to z, y, x, keeping the increment on the 3d noise index 05:39 paramat the loop order only needs to be [x[z[y]]] in my lua mod version 05:39 hmmmm then for the 2d noise, calculating in by z * scanline_size + x 05:39 hmmmm s/in/it/ 05:39 paramat yes 05:40 hmmmm zstride = node_max.X - node_min.X + 1; 05:40 hmmmm so int index2d = z * zstride + z; 05:40 hmmmm + x 05:41 paramat ive added comments to the closed pull request https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/555 05:41 hmmmm so like, proller wrote that and decided, "yep this works good enough, I have no need to fix it before committing" 05:41 hmmmm see I rely on his own word that his stuff works 05:41 hmmmm but evidently that's not the case 05:41 paramat i warned him in my flolands mod thread about the flat edges :) 05:42 paramat before he merged it 05:42 hmmmm do you use the indev mapgen personally? 05:42 paramat yes 05:43 paramat the big caves underground have faceted edges like a gem, they look really out of place :) 05:43 hmmmm see, the reason why I can't take it as a serious mapgen is because it's something already established + his wacky own random ideas that aren't really part of the game, hardcoded in 05:43 paramat other than that i think the farlands are beautiful 05:43 hmmmm for big caves he should be using negative 3d noise 05:44 hmmmm his approach to large caves by just abusing the hell out of the current cave functions...... that's bad 05:45 paramat so im gonna try get this fixed for 0.4.8 05:45 paramat LOL 05:46 paramat thanks for the help 05:48 hmmmm np 05:56 MinetestBot GIT: VanessaE commited to minetest/minetest_game: Allow cactus to lay on its side also. 4bd6bce86e 2013-11-07T21:56:20-08:00 http://git.io/9oApxA 06:06 kaeza hrm... I get SIGSEGV when pressing enter while on a formspec using the textlist[] element 06:06 kaeza and gdb is being stupid 06:07 VanessaE using shadow's pcall_errfunc patch? 06:08 kaeza nope 06:08 VanessaE huh. weird. 06:08 kaeza but this is SIGSEGV, not a random Lua error 06:08 VanessaE true 06:09 VanessaE but I did have one or two cases where a segfault arose from Lua code 06:09 VanessaE took a few runs before I was able to get some error output 06:10 kaeza Program received signal SIGSEGV, Segmentation fault. 06:10 kaeza 0x0955e3e4 in ?? () 06:10 kaeza thanks Obama^Wgdb 06:10 VanessaE haha 06:10 VanessaE that error is about as useful as tits on a bull :) 06:10 VanessaE ok, I'm off to bed now. 06:10 VanessaE night all 06:10 arsdragonfly_ is that 10x server performance PR really that effective? 06:10 kaeza nite 06:11 arsdragonfly_ night 07:12 reactor \m/ 07:28 VanessaE meh, so much for sleep. 07:40 OldCoder Hey 07:40 Rhy5 Hi there! 07:41 OldCoder o/ 07:41 OldCoder kahrl, Hi 07:41 Rhy5 Thats a pretty strange way to spell 'Karl' or 'Carl 07:42 Rhy5 #minetest-mods 07:42 OldCoder It is the nick he uses 07:51 kahrl hey 07:52 VanessaE hey 07:52 Rhy5 Hey 07:52 Rhy5 Pay 07:52 Rhy5 Say 07:52 Rhy5 Day 07:52 Rhy5 French for ya. 07:52 Rhy5 xD 07:53 OldCoder Hey Pay Day is Far From Gray Say Tell Me the Way to Pay Day I Pray For Pay 07:53 Rhy5 Jesus man! 07:53 OldCoder Heh 07:55 kahrl jesus was a girl 07:55 VanessaE haha 08:09 Peacock that would account for the long hair :P 09:39 VanessaE hi 09:48 JamesTait Good morning all; happy Friday and happy X-Ray Day! :-D 10:16 JamesTait john_minetest, coincidence? I think not! Put on your tinfoil hat immediately, they're on to you! 10:24 * john_minetest uses a lead hat because tinfoil isn't that safe 12:36 sfan5 hi everyone 12:39 EvergreenTree Someone needs to update the changelog: dev.minetest.net/changelog 12:39 EvergreenTree Whoops, I mean: http://dev.minetest.net/Changelog 14:05 EvergreenTree Quick question: Is there already an option to disable bones in minetest_game? 14:05 pitriss EvergreenTree: how about remove it from game? 14:06 EvergreenTree No, I was just thinking about giving the player that option 14:06 EvergreenTree Since it is just in mineteset_game you can just remove it though... 14:06 EvergreenTree Probably not necessary 14:07 EvergreenTree If you don't like it, just rm -r minetest/games/minetest_game/mods/bones and be done with it 14:10 EvergreenTree Hi ruben 14:17 reactor R TBON CЛYLA R TBON PAБOTHNK 14:17 zat Robotnik? :D 14:18 reactor I mean, o/ 14:18 zat PIngas. 14:20 reactor zat: tell me more about that. 14:26 zat reactor: pingas pingas pingas pingas pingas pingas pingas pingas pingas pingas 14:26 reactor zat: please go on. 14:26 zat while (1) pingas; 14:26 zat interpret it. 14:26 reactor I'm not sure I understand you fully. 14:28 zat reactor: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LyM1UGD8sqM 14:28 reactor !title 14:28 MinetestBot reactor: SNOOPING AS USUAL I SEE - YouTube 14:29 reactor Do you say Snooping as usual you see for some special reason? 14:29 zat SnooPINGAS usual I see... 14:30 reactor Can you elaborate on that? 14:30 zat No. 14:30 zat It cannot be elaborated further. 14:30 zat It is just as it is. 14:31 reactor Does this make you feel unhappy? 14:31 zat Yes. 14:32 reactor I see. 14:40 reactor zat: is something else troubling you? 14:40 zat Yes. 14:40 reactor Please go on. 14:41 zat No. 14:42 reactor Does this make you feel unhappy? 14:44 zat Yes. 14:44 reactor Why don't you tell me a little more about this. 14:44 zat No. 14:49 reactor Are you saying no just to be negative? 14:51 rubenwardy Hi all! 14:52 reactor Hi rubberwardy. 14:56 rubenwardy ... 16:02 PilzAdam Hello everyone! 16:03 AspireMint Hello 16:09 Jordach hello PilzAdam 16:09 Jordach looks like we both get in about the same time 16:09 * Jordach gets home at 4pm 16:10 Jordach oh, btw, at the next computing lesson I will suggest pilztest and minetest-0.4.8-dev 16:10 Jordach you heard that. 16:10 PilzAdam I still need a proper name for pilztest 16:11 Jordach PilzTest is fine 16:17 dafull97 Hello Guys, VannessaE present? 16:19 Jordach currently here but not active 16:23 OldCoder dafull97, Jordach, PilzAdam hello 16:23 VanessaE hi 16:23 OldCoder PilzAdam, as you may not do much with the world, but just test it, PilzTest seems fine 16:24 OldCoder PilzAdam, I think I asked you about a trivial anti-lava mod that you or sfan5 did a year ago. You didn't recall. Does it sound like something he would have done? 16:24 * sfan5 doesn't think he did an anti-lava mod 16:24 VanessaE anti-lava? 16:24 OldCoder VanessaE, Somebody requested of me that I request of one of those two the following: 16:25 us^0gb OldCoder: Are you talking about the one that erases lava above sea level? 16:25 dafull97 Hey OldCoder, when you get a sec can you meet me in my channel?? 16:25 OldCoder us^0gb, No; I will take a minute and write what I remember 16:25 VanessaE erlehmanmn (sp) did an update to his sponge mod that included a lava-absorbing iron sponge, a few months ago... 16:25 OldCoder dafull97, Yes after done with this 16:25 dafull97 ok thanks 16:25 OldCoder VanessaE, this was very simple and useful. I will write what I remember... 16:27 OldCoder The person who requested it had me pass a short spec. Lava was no longer allowed to be poured or to flow (I don't recall) vertically. There may have been other constraints. sfan5 or PilzAdam (I am reasonably sure) whipped up a simple mod in minutes. Regrettably things became confused after that and the mod is lost. It was just a few short blocks of Lua code. 16:27 OldCoder If it does not ring a bell, never mind 16:28 OldCoder On a separate note, I would be appreciate if somebody might advise Sapier that I have been looking for him for a week. I wish to have Animals again. 16:28 OldCoder * appreciative 16:31 dafull97 CraigyDavi 16:31 sfan5 !seen sapier 16:31 MinetestBot sfan5: sapier was last seen at 2013-11-07 22:50:14 UTC on #minetest 16:31 CraigyDavi dafull -_- 16:32 dafull97 pm so we can finish discussing from yesterday... 16:32 CraigyDavi no use query 16:33 EvergreenTree Just use /msg 16:35 CraigyDavi Oh we don't need to message. Everyone can see this. It needs no explanation. This is the matters me and dafull are descussing. http://pastie.org/pastes/8465846/text 16:37 OldCoder sfan5, Thanks. I can't seem to find him. 16:47 OldCoder reactor, Hi. Contact me this weekend for next steps if any. 16:48 OldCoder 16:48 OldCoder Regarding the paste above: 16:48 OldCoder http://pastie.org/pastes/8465846/text 16:48 OldCoder Yeah, *that's* mature :P 16:48 OldCoder 16:49 CraigyDavi yeah 16:49 CraigyDavi just spoke to him 16:49 OldCoder Oh? 16:49 reactor OldCoder: ? 16:49 OldCoder He timed oout 16:49 CraigyDavi didnt answer my question 16:49 CraigyDavi and left 16:49 OldCoder reactor, next steps regarding Pripyat 16:49 OldCoder CraigyDavi, I think he lost his connection 16:49 CraigyDavi hmm 16:49 CraigyDavi ok 16:49 OldCoder He was here via the web gateway 16:49 OldCoder It will probably be sorted out later 16:50 OldCoder Good luck with the rebuilding or rollback 16:50 * OldCoder must leave for work now 16:50 OldCoder 16:50 reactor OldCoder: mkay 16:50 reactor OldCoder: I think Nether may be turned off safely. 16:51 reactor Only the default buildings depend on it. 16:51 OldCoder It is only a few textures; no rush 16:51 reactor And I'm going to replaced them anyway. 16:51 OldCoder That is fine 16:51 reactor s/ced/ce/ 16:51 OldCoder Have fun; let me know what you wish next 16:51 reactor How's textures, by the way? 16:51 reactor Last time I tried it, I got default Minetest textures. 16:51 OldCoder reactor, not sure what question means. And others... will somebody consider talking to Sapier about serialize sdata nil error? 16:52 OldCoder reactor, I put them in worldmods as instructed 16:52 reactor OldCoder: eh? 16:52 OldCoder If you don't see them, ask others to report too 16:52 OldCoder reactor, others g2g 16:52 OldCoder c u 16:52 reactor o/ 16:52 reactor I am slow as hell. :( 17:09 harrison i don't wish to quibble -- but i must point out that hell isn't slow 17:10 Jordach rubenwardy_, dat pint 17:10 Jordach ping* 17:10 rubenwardy_ huh? 17:10 reactor harrison: s/hell/PDP-11\/20/ 17:10 rubenwardy The internet is pretty terrible for me now 17:11 reactor Russia? 17:11 rubenwardy Englande 17:11 rubenwardy s/-e 17:11 reactor Weird. 17:11 reactor I thought Russia has the worst consumer Internet access. 17:11 rubenwardy The government is upgrading the wires to fibreopic to houses, so I blame them 17:11 rubenwardy speed, not access 17:12 Jordach reactor, russia is good depending if you live near a city 17:12 daful9l7 Craigy query me again, it wa lunch time sorry 17:15 Jordach [17:13:46] oh wait, the operators are already removed 17:15 Jordach PilzAdam, you have two eyes, use 'em 17:17 harrison You are not counting the pineal or 3rd eye? 17:17 reactor Jordach: 100 km from a city. 17:17 harrison The one which looketh within? 17:18 reactor Jordach: it's rather near. 17:18 Jordach reactor, you're going to be bad, thexyz afaik has a good one 17:18 Jordach i live just around ~7 km from my nearest city - and i happen to get 8MB per second 17:19 reactor oh 17:20 PilzAdam Jordach, is the server up? 17:20 Jordach oh shit 17:20 Jordach im making a desert eagle 17:21 Jordach now it is 17:21 Jordach same ip btw 17:43 sfan5 YAY! Novarm made a free version of DipTrace 17:43 CraigyDavi Does anyone know how to change someone's password using auth.txt? 17:44 sfan5 why not use /setpassword 17:44 sfan5 if you still want to base64(sha1(username + password)) 17:46 Jordach !sha sfan5 boobs 17:46 CraigyDavi ah thanks 17:46 Jordach cmon 17:46 sfan5 why would my password be boobs? 17:47 Jordach sfan5, random 17:48 sfan5 Jordach: 'wlI8q8J70PYmf42yfUbyxVoUBL4=' 17:50 Dan_D What would I change in default furnace abm so that it only needs fuel to be active, and doesn't need a cookable item to start? 17:50 sfan5 wait what? 17:50 sfan5 localdoma.in goes to google.com 17:51 sfan5 s/.com/.se/ 17:54 Dan_D Hello? 17:55 reactor ? 17:56 Dan_D Does anyone actually know how the furnace abm works? 17:56 reactor ...why? 18:02 sapier I suggest looking at code to find out how it works ;-) or do you have a little bit more precise question Dan_D? 18:02 Dan_D Ok: How do I make 18:02 Dan_D The furnace abm even run when there is nopthing in the input slot, so that it can be uses as a stove of sorts? 18:03 sapier ok I don't understand what you mean with "stove of sorts"? 18:04 Dan_D So that you can use it as a fireplace 18:04 Dan_D Without needing items to cook 18:04 sapier are you talkin about the animation only? 18:04 Dan_D No 18:04 Dan_D I mean, can I make it consume fuel 18:05 Dan_D Without needing to put something in the input slot 18:05 sapier can't tell for sure sorry you'll have to look at abm 18:05 Dan_D Ok 18:07 MinetestBot GIT: PilzAdam commited to minetest/minetest: Fix typo in lua_api.txt 1afd359550 2013-11-08T09:16:08-08:00 http://git.io/btrqqw 18:09 reactor Dan_D: I could tell you how it works... 18:12 reactor john_minetest: How do you do. 18:14 reactor You want me to start the server? 18:14 PilzAdam oO Ilmenau is greyscale IRL? 18:14 reactor Heh. 18:14 reactor I see. 18:14 reactor We've missed that orange bit. 18:17 Jordach john_minetest, is that your campus (afaik) 18:18 PilzAdam sapier has 666 posts 18:18 PilzAdam coincidence? 18:19 sapier you're not the first to recognize pa ;-) 18:21 NekoGloop He's a vivillon! 18:21 Jordach fuck sakes NekoGloop 18:21 Jordach there's like, what, 20 18:21 NekoGloop 26 18:21 NekoGloop iirc 18:21 NekoGloop 2 of which are unobtainable as of yet 18:22 Jordach someones onto us: wow, looks like blockman writes those scripts for us. 18:24 * john_minetest puts a kitten on NekoGloop's head 18:24 NekoGloop meow 18:25 * Jordach puts john_minetest on PilzAdam's head 18:25 * PilzAdam puts #minetest on Jordach's head 18:26 IceCraft hello 18:26 Jordach hai IceCream 18:27 IceCraft oh yes i forgot 18:27 PilzAdam Jordach, what do you think about Pilztest? 18:27 Jordach notbad.png 18:28 PilzAdam couldyougiveamoredetailedreview.?.ogg 18:30 Jordach ? is a disallowed character 18:31 PilzAdam not in ext4 18:33 sapier why? ntfs isn't a bad fs ... btw some of the limitations are enforced by explorer not by fs 18:35 sapier file attributes are a outdated feature 18:35 VanessaE how do I check (in lua) if a player is online? 18:35 PilzAdam VanessaE, when minetest.get_connected_players() contains it 18:35 VanessaE ah 18:35 sapier ntfs acl have been copied for unix fs ;-) yet not a very good copy 18:35 PilzAdam is the improvement for it merged yet? 18:36 dafull97 Hey guyss 18:36 sapier I know ntfs supports all of this but not based uppon limited ONE user ONE group and eveyone else 18:38 sapier you can specify rights for multiple users and groups in ntfs yet this can't be mapped correct to limited unix user rights 18:39 sapier I don't know if ntfs supports symlinks yet windows doesn't so no use for them 18:40 sapier actually ntfs seems to support symlinks http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_symbolic_link 18:41 sapier and as of vista even windows does support em 18:44 sapier if you read it there is written about unix transition I guess this is a unix driver issue 18:45 sapier if you want to read a linux fs on windows you need a windows driver for this fs as far as I know there is at least a ext3 driver for windows 18:45 sapier ntfs is very well documented by now yet its security concept was too advanced to be used in linux for some time 18:45 PilzAdam its not a matter if its good or not, Microsoft gets a lot of money for it, thats enough 18:45 sapier and of course noone wants to risk patent issues 18:47 sapier microsoft did many bad things long time ago but they have lost power to do so long ago 18:47 sapier today evil corporations are google and apple 18:48 sapier LOL 18:48 sapier apple is worse microsoft has ever been 18:48 sapier yet google at least releases some of its work while apple code is completely closed 18:48 PilzAdam why do we even talk english in here? 18:49 sapier it's not minetest-german ;-) 18:49 PilzAdam I mean, is anyone reading this who doesnt know german? 18:49 us^0gb I am. 18:50 us^0gb I can leave though. 18:50 sapier it's logged so you can't rule out someone will read it ... and don't forget nsa spys the need to translate if we talked in german 18:50 PilzAdam they can use google translator 18:50 PilzAdam that way google could steal all the data from the nsa 18:50 us^0gb Google Translate gets it wrong a lot. 18:51 sapier I guess nsa translator is way more advanced yet requires more cpu power 18:51 sapier ao only thing was wasting more electricity ;-) 18:51 PilzAdam the nsa translator translates everything into "I am a terrorist so its totatlly valid to steal all my private data" 18:52 us^0gb PilzAdam: That explains SO much. 18:52 sapier the really sad thing is that these most likely aren't jokes but pure truth 18:53 us^0gb The NSA really does spy on our communications, if that's what you mean. 18:53 Calinou or GIMPed on 18:53 Calinou but the NSA needs to spy on themselves too :> 18:54 Jordach afaik 192.168.*.* are whitelisted 18:54 sapier yes that's what I mean ... we knew they'd had possibility to do for some time but yet everyone assumed they didn't do it ... now we know they actually do 18:54 reactor john_minetest: that's lame. 18:54 us^0gb The worst part is that the NSA tries to weaken encryption algorithms to make them easy for them to break later. And that exposes us to non-NSA threats as well. 18:55 MinetestBot john_minetest: Linux Sets You Free - YouTube 18:55 PilzAdam the only sad thing is that the german government doesnt do anything about it 18:55 sapier they can't they'd reveal their knowledge about this and our own security involvement 18:56 Jordach https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=117478#p117478 18:56 Jordach post of the YEAR 18:56 sapier NSA doesn't spy on american ppl this is done by GH?? (can't remeber that short) ... and of course results of spying are transfered to a single database 18:57 sapier this way NSA is telling truth when telling "We don't spy on us citizens" 18:59 sapier nsa plz send me a copy of this log in a month ... not in doc format please 18:59 us^0gb .odt would be nice, if possible. 19:01 sapier does anyone know the telphone voice of mirsosoft netmeeting "this could be recorded" ... I guess now we know what was actually meant by it ;-) 19:01 sapier they told us for years ... we can't even blame them ;-) 19:03 PilzAdam Snowden: "hey, the NSA spies all your phones"; Angie: "So what?"; Snowden: "Even your phone, Angie"; Angine: "OMG that was totally unexpected!" 19:11 sapier politicians are far from having recognized what nsa spy actions really are 19:12 us^0gb Wow. I need to install 78 new packages to compile Minetest .... 19:12 sapier I guess you only need to if you want all features 19:12 dafull97 Hey guys 19:13 reactor Hey dafull97. 19:13 us^0gb Speaking of features, which LevelDB package do I need to add LevelDB support? It isn't listed in the README.txt. 19:13 us^0gb Hello! 19:13 reactor john_minetest: FAT doesn't allow for links. That's onle of the reasons it sucks. 19:13 reactor So does NTFS. 19:14 reactor Seriously, Windows is a limited toy. 19:14 us^0gb Actually, FAT sucks also because it is prone to both data loss and fragmentation. Issues shared by NTFS, by the way. 19:15 sapier ntfs is as prone to data los as ext3 and ext4 are too 19:16 PilzAdam us^0gb, which distro? 19:16 reactor ext has its problems, too 19:16 PilzAdam its libleveldb-dev for *buntu 19:16 us^0gb The exts are effected? Great, that's reassuring. Maybe I'll look into other file systems. 19:16 reactor us^0gb: exactly 19:16 sapier if your drive crashes all fs have problems with data consistency ;-) 19:16 reactor ext is better than ntfs anyway 19:16 dafull97 *To all* What is the fastest linux OS in your opion? 19:16 sapier no it isn't 19:17 us^0gb PilzAdam: Thanks! I'm on an Ubuntu derivative, so that's probably the package I need. 19:17 sapier ext3/4 are pretty same level as ntfs 19:17 reactor dafull97: Linux is bloated and huge. 19:17 dafull97 indeed 19:17 * Jordach agrees 19:17 dafull97 what is the fastest in your option? 19:17 sapier ext3 is below while fat is hmmm something between minixfs and ext2 19:17 reactor Try any of them BSDs, dafull97. 19:17 * Jordach can't bring himself to installing BSD 19:17 PilzAdam dafull97, the one that you will set up to fit your hardware 19:17 sapier there isn't a fastest fs this depends on what you're doing 19:18 reactor and what sapier said 19:18 reactor But bloat-wise, BSD is better. 19:18 reactor For most Linux distros come full of shit programs. 19:18 us^0gb Security-wise, OpenBSD is the best, I hear. 19:18 sapier yes :-) if there isn't that much released for a os it can't get bloated ... I gues os/2 is even better in this aspect ;-) 19:18 dafull97 ok cool, since i am still nub to linux, say i install ubuntu server and installed minetest could i see the minetest GUI> 19:19 dafull97 or not? 19:19 reactor Well. I heard ubuntu server is at least not as bad as ubuntu desktop. 19:19 sapier ubuntu is good for beginners yet it's not better than windows 19:19 Jordach dafull97, minetestserver doesnt have a gui 19:19 us^0gb Ubuntu Server has no desktop, so no, you can't see the Minetest GUI on it. 19:19 dafull97 ok im meaning could i play the client... -_- lol 19:20 reactor Why are people so addicted to GUI? 19:20 dafull97 ok us got what i meanat 19:20 dafull97 ease of use 19:20 sapier imho atm there's not a good recommendation for beginners ubuntu desktop is that heavyly modified by canonical it's almost as crapy as windows 19:21 sapier and debian is often quite old and beginner unfriendly 19:21 dafull97 yes, i use Cbuntu 19:21 dafull97 yes, i use Xbuntu*** 19:21 us^0gb I'd go with Trisquel, but if you really want *buntu, Xubuntu is nice. 19:21 us^0gb Oops, I was too slow. 19:21 dafull97 haha 19:21 dafull97 yes -P 19:21 dafull97 ** and playing games 19:22 dafull97 =-P 19:22 us^0gb And web browsing. And file editing and .... 19:22 sapier games on linux? only steam games will work 19:22 reactor dafull97: or man up and use BSD right away. 19:22 sapier and some rare games that work using wine 19:22 reactor dafull97: you don't have to go through all the shit to be there. 19:22 us^0gb And Minetest. 19:23 sapier but don't expect wine games to run at more then half windows performance 19:23 reactor dafull97: believe me, you will end up using BSD after 5 years. 19:23 dafull97 sapier, i play minetest on there, minecraft, and openarena with no steam 19:23 sapier I wouldn't believe reactor I'm on linux for more than 15 years now ;-) 19:23 reactor Very fine, they should worm. 19:23 dafull97 how is free bsd? 19:23 reactor It's good. 19:24 sapier yet don't even think about games ;-) 19:24 us^0gb I used to have a ton of GNU/Linux games before I left them behind for free software. 19:24 dafull97 u love linux 19:24 reactor It's somewhat problematic to configure for the first time, but then it's not as. 19:24 dafull97 it is fully customizeable 19:24 us^0gb Free games are a bit limited, but GNU/Linux games, not so much anymore. 19:24 dafull97 and been on it for 3 yrs 19:24 reactor sapier: I don't get it how you managed to use it for that long. 19:24 reactor sapier: what distribution? 19:25 sapier actualy I switched from suse to self built to ubuntu and now that ubuntu is broken to debian 19:25 sapier stopped building linux when x-server split to hundreds of packets 19:26 dafull97 Xbuntu has been very flexable and fast 19:26 reactor sapier: I never got anything to build in Debian. 19:26 sapier yet none of the current linux distrubutions support multi gpu anymore 19:26 reactor I only managed to compile smalll things here and there. 19:27 sapier no idea what you did wrong reactor 19:27 reactor I somehow attract catastrophes. 19:27 reactor May be it. 19:27 us^0gb I do as well. 19:27 reactor Well, I haven't had any problem with compiling on BSD. 19:28 sapier only thing difficult on debian is using badly written bleeding edge software 19:28 reactor Oh. I forget. I was using debian testing. 19:28 reactor And used to break something after each update. 19:28 reactor That was a terrible experience. 19:29 sapier I updated my servers from debian 5 to current version by now 19:29 reactor Rather, I used to run a distro based on dtesting. 19:29 dafull97 *TO ALL* What are your best programs or script that you have created? 19:29 dafull97 that you are proud of** 19:29 reactor dafull97: /dev/null. 19:29 sapier same was ubuntu while they kept close to debian 19:30 sapier dafull97 by some time you'll realize you can't create a really good program on your own 19:31 us^0gb dafull97: Aside from my Minetest Lua scripts, I just build simple scripts. 19:31 dafull97 sapier, actually i agree, i was asking just your own projects 19:31 dafull97 and nice john_minetest 19:32 sapier come on john not even applying some patches or sed modifications? ;-) 19:32 dafull97 ohh, dang.. well thats good 19:34 dafull97 all here still> 19:36 sapier of course ;-) 19:36 reactor Oh. 19:36 reactor I remember. 19:36 reactor dafull97: my automated internet radio feed. 19:36 PilzAdam john_minetest, personally I think that good code is as important as the functionality 19:36 reactor But I'm not running it anymore. 19:36 dafull97 reactor, really? 19:37 dafull97 that sounds good... lol i couldnt f\do that 19:38 reactor dafull97: ? 19:39 dafull97 reactor, was you talking about coding still ? 19:40 reactor 01:29 < dafull97> *TO ALL* What are your best programs or script that you have created? 19:40 dafull97 yes, i said that was good, i couldnt do that 19:40 dafull97 lol 19:40 reactor mk 20:10 harrison only thing difficult on debian is using badly written bleeding edge software 20:11 sapier incompatible to even last version of a required lib ;-) 20:11 harrison this is horribly insensitive!~ some of us prefer the bleeding edge which does not heal and we should not be made fun of 20:13 sapier *handling some plasters to harrison* 20:13 harrison ow 20:17 us^0gb I doubt this is possible, but I figure there's no harm in asking just in case. Is there a way to dismantle a Lua function from another script to alter it a bit? 20:19 sapier you're talking about runtime ? 20:22 us^0gb Yeah. 20:23 us^0gb So one module would be able to slightly alter another module's function without containing the full code of the original function. 20:23 us^0gb Instead, it would only contain the alteration itself. 20:23 sapier no I don't think this is possible ... even if it was this'd be very very very bad style ... even worse than goto 20:24 us^0gb You do have a good point there. I'm not sure what else to do though. 20:24 us^0gb I'll see what other options I can come up with. 20:25 sapier while self modifying code may be very smart it's almost not maintainable ;-) 20:25 harrison when one first suspects that our own consciousness modifies itself in just such an unsafe way, it is as if the fog lifted to reveal that the path we tread falls away to an abyss on either side ... 20:25 harrison lifts 20:26 us^0gb Containing a full copy of the function would mean that any updates to that function that go noticed would not make it to the modified version though. 20:27 us^0gb Plus, this is meant as more of a patch than a full function rewrite. 20:27 sapier maybe you can make the one writing the function add callbacks to it that allow some modification? 20:28 us^0gb I tried submitting pulls to this, they were rejected in favor of hacky code. 20:28 ShadowNinja us^0gb: Yes, it is possible. 20:29 ShadowNinja local old_func = func 20:29 ShadowNinja function func() 20:29 sapier that's replacing function 20:29 ShadowNinja -- Do custom things 20:29 us^0gb The modification is mid function, a wrapper like that won't work. 20:29 ShadowNinja old_func() 20:29 ShadowNinja end 20:29 ShadowNinja Hmmm, well no then. 20:30 us^0gb I figured as much. 20:30 us^0gb I'll look at other options. 20:30 harrison Most rappers won't work, unless you count streetlevel sales. 20:30 us^0gb s/at/for/ 20:31 us^0gb Can I tell what function calls another function? Sort of like a debug trace? 20:31 us^0gb But without the error, and it only needs to go one function up. 20:32 sapier with debug lib you can do almost anything but if by some time we add at least minimal security capabilities your code will be broken 20:32 us^0gb Yeah, if it's going to be broken by security code, that's probably not a good option. 20:32 ShadowNinja us^0gb: You can parse the string returned by "debug.traceback()". 20:33 us^0gb Okay, that sounds doable. I'll experiment with that. 20:33 sapier debug traceback uses debug lib so it might be better to do it direct ;-) 20:34 us^0gb Okay, I'll look at both options. See what works best. 20:35 us^0gb I wonder if I can fix this with a Minetest pull ... 20:44 us^0gb Okay, this function is in C++, I can't figure out what it's doing. But it gives me an idea, I think I can pull this of by simply redefining the can_dig() of four nodes. Thanks for the help! 21:11 Jordach Good news everyone: dwarves will be updated before 0.4.8 21:12 harrison what is the best kind of parrot? vote now 21:17 us^0gb john_minetest: It sounds like I have plenty of time to finish up this game then. 21:18 us^0gb It's probably a triple leap year of something. 21:18 us^0gb *or 21:19 Menche too bad the date will revert back to December 1901 in January 2038 21:19 us^0gb Why does February not have 30 days (31 on leap year)? It should, to match the other months. 21:20 us^0gb Drats. I forgot about the UNIX time loop. 21:20 Menche but it will be all fine if you use a 64 bit system. 21:20 us^0gb Oh, good. That's what I have. 21:20 Menche those use a 64 bit int for the time right? 21:20 us^0gb Probably. 21:21 Menche the predicted death of the sun comes before the time will overflow out of a 64-bit int 21:21 us^0gb Meh, everyone knows Windows isn't safe. 21:23 Menche now if that screwed up WGA so all the windows computers in the world were marked as pirated and disabled 21:23 us^0gb GNU/Linux servers at Microsoft Headquarters? Those hypocrites. 21:24 Menche :D 21:24 * Menche wonders if anyone uses Windows Server for anything serious 21:25 us^0gb My school does. A school I'm switching away from, by the way. 21:25 sfan5 ugh 21:25 sfan5 even my school knows they should use linux for serious things 21:25 * Jordach can make good use of Windows Server 21:25 Jordach by replacing it with Arch Linux 21:26 sfan5 hah 21:30 Jordach i can use windows server for one thing, screwing up with malware then replacing it with arch 21:32 * Jordach screams in rage 21:32 Jordach I update to LO 4.0.5 21:33 Jordach and GET the NEXT FUCKING UPDATE as a HELP FILE UPDATE. 21:33 Jordach Jordach:system_core_dump(fuck, this, shit) 21:34 us^0gb I find myself pulling to minetest_game again .... I said I was going to leave minetest_game alone, but here I find myself. 21:35 us^0gb Not sure. 21:35 PilzAdam john_minetest, he still works on it 21:35 PilzAdam there are still bugs and settings missing 21:36 Jordach -and settings missing 21:36 Menche there're bugs missing? 21:36 PilzAdam Jordach, hm? 21:37 Jordach PilzAdam, anything RBA codes is a broken wreck 21:37 Jordach see technic 21:37 Jordach and unified inventory 21:39 Menche the serverlist already knows which servers have creative mode, pvp, passwords, etc. on 21:39 Menche would be nice if it could sort into categories with those 21:40 Menche instead of the somewhat cryptic set of letters before the name 21:40 PilzAdam the whole menu is coded in Lua, you can change it even without compiling Minetest 22:30 kaeza greetings 22:32 kaeza LOL https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=117478#p117478 22:32 us^0gb Greetings, kaeza! 22:32 kaeza hey us^0gb 22:32 * kaeza sends to trash 22:33 PilzAdam kaeza, why? 22:33 us^0gb Wow, that's just ... odd. And that's her only post, too. 22:34 PilzAdam kaeza, is offtopic not allowed in offtopic section? 22:34 kaeza PilzAdam, first post and posting totally offtopic stuff? 22:35 us^0gb PilzAdam does have a point though. She did post it in the correct forum. 22:36 PilzAdam kaeza, there are a lot more people who post offtopic all the time, even outside of the offtopic section 22:36 kaeza okay okay 22:40 zat1 :D http://www.telepizza.cl/contacto.php 22:41 kaeza dat phone number 22:41 zat They urgently need an expert developer to fix it 22:41 kaeza dose errors 22:41 zat read it as: adding @ in front of every function call 22:42 zat doze 22:47 ShadowNinja Hmmm, so kaeza's a mod now. When did that happen? 22:59 PilzAdam bye 23:05 paramat hi proller :) last night i solved the flat-edge bug in core floatlands, see https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/989 please read last night's minetest channel logs 05:19 to 05:40 23:07 paramat i will now provide you with my best attempt at the correct mapgen code, but i cant test it, would you be able to test the code? i would very much like to fix this for 0.4.8 23:09 paramat eh i missed mr mushroom again :/ 23:09 us^0gb Yup, just barely, too. 23:10 sfan5 good night everyone 23:10 us^0gb Good night. 23:44 Jordach hey paramat 23:45 Jordach you're a day sleeper aren't ya 23:45 paramat sometimes :) 23:46 paramat oh Peacock is up! :) 23:47 Peacock yeah, got up a bit earlier today, 17hrs XD 23:47 Jordach nono, Peacock is the nickname nazi 23:47 Jordach you are his bitch on his server 23:47 Peacock guten morgen mein herr 23:47 Jordach eg, no numbers, no stupid shiyt 23:47 Jordach shit 23:47 paramat \o/ 23:48 Jordach Peacock, have you filtered out "YouTube" 23:50 Peacock youtube? 23:51 Peacock http://youtu.be/pEsZkTTgydc 23:51 Menche !title 23:51 MinetestBot Menche: GET YOUR HANDS OFF MY PENIS! - Epic Australian Man Arrested - YouTube 23:51 Peacock http://youtu.be/P7Jy312JCUQ 23:51 Menche !title 23:51 MinetestBot Menche: DJ Steve Porter - Rob Ford Crack Remix - YouTube 23:53 paramat epic guy in that vid 23:53 Peacock yeah lol 23:54 Peacock getting arrested - like a sir 23:54 paramat ...eo 23:56 paramat btw thanks for introducing me to femen, surprisingly i rather like them *^_^* 23:56 Menche "And you sir, are you waiting to recieve my limp penis?" lol