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IRC log for #minetest, 2013-11-04

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 dafull97 ShadowNinja, ^
00:00 ritchie joined #minetest
00:05 Taoki joined #minetest
00:05 dafull97 VanessaE, you can do clustering with Ethernet alone?
00:06 VanessaE yes
00:06 VanessaE it's unideal, but possible.
00:08 dafull97 what do you normally use?
00:11 VanessaE well I don't cluster, but I just have gigE between the two PCs
00:11 VanessaE I used to use distcc if that matters :
00:11 VanessaE :P
00:12 dafull97 English please? hahaha, explain
00:12 dafull97 =) please
00:12 VanessaE gigE:  gigabit ethernet.  distcc:  distributed C compiler, for using multiple PCs to compile stuff
00:13 dafull97 ok, thanks... havnt used alot of C/C++ and i thought gigE meant that, wasnt sure
00:14 VanessaE sure
00:14 dafull97 will python be good for networking and all, im wanting to be network admin or Network Engineer when i get out of high school and college
00:15 OldCoder dafull97, Yes
00:15 OldCoder dafull97, You must learn several other languages too
00:16 OldCoder dafull97, Perl PHP5 Python HTML5 CSS3 JS some Java and a few others
00:16 OldCoder Many are very similar
00:16 dafull97 yes, i am working on it
00:16 OldCoder Good
00:16 kahrl network admin in a unix environment? bash is probably what you'll be encountering most
00:16 dafull97 Oldcoder you know about clustering and you in networking
00:16 kahrl or some other shell
00:17 dafull97 OldCoder, ^^
00:23 * dafull97 is going afk for a few mins
00:23 Renoki joined #minetest
00:26 Miner_48er joined #minetest
00:30 dafull97 joined #minetest
00:30 dafull97 ok im back
00:31 dafull97 VanessaE, can you do me a favor
00:32 VanessaE hm?
00:33 dafull97 will you tell me the last board i was talking about? i got on a different computer
00:35 VanessaE https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A​20/A20-OLinuXino-MICRO/open-source-hardware
00:35 VanessaE you were leaning toward that one over the RPi.
00:35 dafull97 thanks, yes i know
00:35 dafull97 i couldnt remember the name totally
00:35 Menche you can look at the chat history at http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/today
00:36 dafull97 ohh, yea i forgot that
00:42 dafull97 VanessaE, Clustering shares video cards? or no?
00:42 Megaf dafull97, Hi there
00:42 Exio4 i hate reallife
00:42 Exio4 why is it so busy
00:43 dafull97 Megaf, what up? got some questions for you... =)
00:43 Megaf ok
00:43 Megaf shoot
00:43 Megaf =)
00:44 dafull97 so your the one with the raspberry pi servers correct?
00:44 Megaf yep
00:44 Megaf dafull97, VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7603
00:45 VanessaE dafull97: it could share video computing resources e.g. GPGPU/OpenCL or whatever it's called, if the clustering software allows for it, but not general video card performance.
00:48 dafull97 so if i conneted a monitor to the master would it have better video performance, such as video memory?
00:49 Megaf dafull97, ok, lets start from the begiining
00:49 Megaf what do you want?
00:49 dafull97 im thinking about getting a board like raspberry pi, https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A​20/A20-OLinuXino-MICRO/open-source-hardware and cluster them together and use as minetest server
00:50 VanessaE dafull97: no, it would not, unless the program you are running is CPU-bound AND capable of full multi-threading.
00:50 dafull97 mpi, would that be one?
00:50 VanessaE but as a minetest server, it would be mostly pointless
00:50 Megaf dafull97, not worth it
00:50 VanessaE the server is not multi-threaded enough to work well under those conditions
00:50 troller dafull97, will ok with 0 players
00:51 dafull97 troller, stop...
00:51 troller stop what?
00:51 Megaf dafull97, use a single Raspberry, it will do really ok with 6 players
00:51 Megaf using the minimal game
00:51 Megaf dafull97, join to my server and see for yourself
00:51 troller i use odroid. ant its ok with lisuid_finite=1 ;)
00:51 dafull97 i cant right at the moment but i will later
00:52 dafull97 Megaf, why would it not be worth clustering?
00:52 EvergreenTree New mod:  https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7637
00:52 EvergreenTree \o/
00:52 Megaf dafull97, clusters doesnt work like that
00:52 VanessaE dafull97: because the server is not multithreaded enough to work for that.
00:52 Megaf dafull97, and minetest server is not really multithread yet
00:53 dafull97 ok so it would work that good?
00:53 Megaf it depends on what you want
00:53 Megaf whats your objective
00:53 Menche it would probably only be able to use the one master board
00:53 Megaf and if you have an objective
00:53 VanessaE a good cluster needs to have more network bandwidth between its nodes than what any two random processes could possibly want to use to send data to one another, and the program must be fully multithreaded.
00:53 harrison everybody wants to rule the world
00:54 VanessaE Megaf: to run a fast server on minimal hardware.
00:54 Megaf fast is relative,
00:54 Megaf Raspberry Pi is pretty fast for minetest server, really responsive
00:54 Megaf up to 6 players and with the minimal game
00:55 Megaf that the 256 MB of ram version and without overclock
00:55 Menche would probably run minetest-classic even better
00:56 ShadowNinja EvergreenTree: What do you use to generate the bedrock layer? My bedrock mod?
00:57 dafull97 Megaf, idk... i need some time to think... haha
00:57 EvergreenTree Just minetest.register_ore
00:57 EvergreenTree I did it from scratch
00:57 MinetestBot GIT: proller@github.com commited to minetest/minetest: Masterserver show privs and js autoload 4a8a50a2a2 2013-11-03T16:56:39-08:00 http://git.io/xaE44w
00:57 ShadowNinja EvergreenTree: And the screenshot doen't seem to show anything specific to the mod.
00:57 Menche what's the purpose of blocking digging below -1000?
00:57 EvergreenTree There isn't anything specific
00:58 EvergreenTree The sword has a larger wieldview
00:58 ShadowNinja EvergreenTree: Mine is better. :-) It uses the VM. And it generates at -30914, the limit.
00:58 EvergreenTree You can place logs with 6d facedir
00:58 troller Menche, if using indev - more huge caves
00:59 Megaf I little help would be much appreciated on my rpi server to build a castle
00:59 EvergreenTree I'll add something to settings.txt so you can configure how low the layer is
00:59 Menche troller, EvergreenTree's game *blocks* digging below -1000
00:59 EvergreenTree IT's not a game, its a mod
00:59 dafull97 is minecraft multithreaded?
00:59 Megaf dafull97, so you want a server that burns little energy and costs little money
00:59 EvergreenTree And like I said, I'll add a setting for that later
00:59 Megaf thats it?
00:59 dafull97 yea, basically
00:59 VanessaE EvergreenTree: ah so you liked that lib_6d code eh? :)
01:00 EvergreenTree Yep[
01:00 EvergreenTree *Yep
01:00 Megaf dafull97, you can use Raspberry Pi yes,
01:00 VanessaE just saw your 'tweaks' post
01:00 Megaf the one with 512 MB of ram
01:00 dafull97 i was thinking https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A​20/A20-OLinuXino-MICRO/open-source-hardware
01:00 dafull97 1gb ram
01:00 dafull97 and cheaper
01:00 Megaf dafull97, then put a Class 10 SDCard and a fast USB thumb drive
01:01 Megaf dafull97, thats cheap
01:01 dafull97 the board?
01:01 EvergreenTree Anything you dislike about minetest, I'll try and make a fix for it in my mod
01:01 Megaf dafull97, yep
01:01 EvergreenTree *minetest_game
01:01 dafull97 Megaf, ik
01:02 dafull97 Megaf, that why i want it.... and i was gonna get 2 and cluster it
01:02 Megaf well, just forget about cluster
01:02 dafull97 it would help to have experiance too... im wanting to get into networking after college
01:02 harrison EvergreenTree: can you make it raytraced instead of rasterized?
01:03 Megaf if you want cluster, then you need a 64 bit server with gigabit ethernet
01:03 EvergreenTree No, something I can do in a mod.  :P
01:03 dafull97 64-bit? why 64-bit?
01:03 troller btw big help to old hardware = https://github.com/minetes​t/minetest/pull/895/files
01:05 Megaf troller, now we just need an easy way to use that
01:05 troller its already here https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7033
01:10 troller building minetest +minetestserver on odroid x2: real    6m13.652s
01:10 troller
01:10 troller show me pi result 8)
01:19 Peacock pi result http://i500.listal.com/image/1189040/500full.jpg
01:24 EvergreenTree Hey VanessaE, what would you suggest for a mid range CPU?   (less than 130 USD)
01:24 VanessaE I wouldn't know, to be honest.
01:24 VanessaE my Phenom II X6 1055T was inexpensive enough
01:24 VanessaE but I got it as part of a package deal
01:25 EvergreenTree Does it server you pretty well?
01:25 EvergreenTree *serve
01:25 VanessaE oh yes, for the most part quite well
01:25 VanessaE it's only where Minetest is involved that it sometimes lacks a bit :P
01:25 EvergreenTree What problems did you have with it?
01:25 VanessaE best to start at pricewatch,  http://www.pricewatch.com/cpu/
01:26 VanessaE the only problems I ever have are all software-related.  you know, inefficient code and the like :)
01:30 EvergreenTree Would you say an Intel Core i3-3220 would be a good choice?
01:30 VanessaE I'm afraid I couldn't say at all
01:30 EvergreenTree OR would the amd phenom be better?
01:30 EvergreenTree hmm
01:30 EvergreenTree Anyone have an intel core i3?
01:31 * ShadowNinja has a i5.
01:32 ShadowNinja "Phenom" is far too unsecific, some of those will be better than some i7s, some worse than some i3s.
01:32 ShadowNinja (Assuming you've decided on sandy/ivy bridge if you chose intel)
01:33 VanessaE he's comparing to my Phenom II X6 1055T I guess
01:33 troller 20 bots on odroid, ant it still playable
01:33 ShadowNinja Um, I think yours is better...
01:33 Ikkiko joined #minetest
01:34 ShadowNinja troller: Maybe commit the lag redistribution patch?
01:34 troller i'm ready
01:34 EvergreenTree VanessaE, what kind of software problems did you have?
01:35 VanessaE EvergreenTree: nothing I could blame on the hardware.
01:35 EvergreenTree Okay, good
01:35 VanessaE I was trying to make a joke that Minetest tends to be slow in places :)
01:37 EvergreenTree Ah
01:38 troller slowest part now is mapgen
01:39 troller but slill playable if not use fast
01:39 troller who have ipv6 - can try
01:40 troller my server at top 8)
01:40 EvergreenTree sfan5, update your incorrectly formated mod topic
01:40 EvergreenTree *I mean, run your bot that finds incorrectly formated topics and reports them
01:45 ShadowNinja EvergreenTree: +1
01:45 OldCoder R
01:45 OldCoder Sorry I missed his question
01:46 OldCoder I have so many channels I no longer see highlighting
01:46 NekoGloopMkII joined #minetest
01:48 ShadowNinja OldCoder: Use tab view is you aren't already and enable notifications/beeps.
01:48 ShadowNinja if*
01:48 OldCoder Tab View doesn't work for 70 tabs though?
01:48 OldCoder And sound not applicable if come and go from PC
01:49 OldCoder We need an IRC client that displays tabs at the top
01:49 OldCoder based on criteria
01:49 OldCoder Maybe I can patch one
02:21 ecube joined #minetest
02:26 EvergreenTree Lol, I go onto ##hardware and I almost get torn limb from limb by the guy who stole my nick
02:27 VanessaE heh
02:27 MrBeNNy joined #minetest
02:28 VanessaE have you tried complaining to freenode staff?
02:28 VanessaE noting he registered the nick only 20 hours ago
02:29 EvergreenTree They thought I was a troll, and I stole his nick
02:29 EvergreenTree almost got into a flamewar
02:29 EvergreenTree Nah, not really worth it
02:31 EvergreenTree lol, didn't notice OldCoder was on #hardware
02:31 OldCoder Hi!
02:31 OldCoder I am not there
02:32 OldCoder Is there an OldCoder in #hardware?
02:32 * OldCoder is confused
02:32 EvergreenTree Yes
02:32 OldCoder !
02:32 * OldCoder joins #hardware
02:32 OldCoder There is only me
02:32 * OldCoder remains confused
02:34 VanessaE ##
02:35 OldCoder VanessaE, ?
02:35 * OldCoder is even more confused
02:35 VanessaE I believe he means ##hardware
02:35 OldCoder No
02:35 VanessaE two #'s
02:35 OldCoder I see him in #hardware
02:36 VanessaE oh
02:37 OldCoder No you are correct
02:38 OldCoder There is a ##hardware and I see people I know there
02:38 OldCoder But only one of me and I have been online for nearly 10 hours
02:38 OldCoder As the nick is registered, I am not sure how he could have seen "me" there
02:39 * VanessaE shrugs
02:41 VanessaE OldCoder: there are plantlife and farming_plus updates you will need to pull in btw
02:45 OldCoder VanessaE, I will do so with alacrity
02:45 OldCoder Who has farming_plus now, again?
02:46 VanessaE pilzadam does, but somehow I've been elected to maintain it :)
02:46 VanessaE https://github.com/PilzAdam/farming_plus.git
02:46 VanessaE er, maybe you want the ssh link.  git@github.com:PilzAdam/farming_plus.git
02:48 dafull97 joined #minetest
02:48 dafull97 hey
02:49 ShadowNinja https is better for just pulling as no certs are needed.
02:49 VanessaE hi
02:49 ShadowNinja Hello.
02:52 dafull97 Does minecraft support multithread?
02:52 VanessaE no clue; minetest does but only to a limited degree
02:57 sandman joined #minetest
02:58 zat It is dangerous walking around here alone, take one of these: https://fbcdn-sphotos-a-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-​ak-ash3/1456625_254627107994426_964071069_n.jpg
02:59 dafull97 VanessaE, clustering would that share RAM usage?
03:00 VanessaE dafull97: to a degree, but just forget about it :)
03:00 VanessaE zat: ha!  are those pokémon at the bottom? :)
03:01 zat yes those are called pokémon lol
03:01 dafull97 nah, im wanting it to use both devices RAM so it would be like 1 machine some what
03:01 VanessaE dafull97: forget it.  it ain't worth the effort.
03:01 dafull97 well im wanting experience in it for later
03:02 dafull97 if i could manage to do that i could have a 2gb ram server for minetest would make awesome performance
03:02 VanessaE it won't work for minetest
03:02 VanessaE it isn't multithreaded enough
03:03 ShadowNinja dafull97: Um, 2gb doesn't mean "awesome performance".
03:04 dafull97 ik, but compared to a 512mg ram
03:04 ShadowNinja dafull97: It might even be slower because of the netio.
03:04 VanessaE indeed not.  I have 16GB on my machine and that doesn't really help the servers much at all
03:04 dafull97 i have 30mbps
03:04 VanessaE (it's helpful for the client though)
03:04 dafull97 i would make with 1gb eth
03:04 VanessaE nope
03:04 VanessaE you need CPU power, and a lot of it.
03:04 ShadowNinja dafull97: That has nothing to do with the connection between nodes, unless they will be in different locations.
03:05 VanessaE that means a single, fast processor perhaps with 2-4 cores.
03:06 ShadowNinja dafull97: Point is: Well... that this is pointless.
03:07 dafull97 why would it be pointless? i honestly dont understand why... not trying sound mean, etc.
03:07 dafull97 just wondering
03:07 ShadowNinja dafull97: Because it won't be faster. In fact it will be slower.
03:09 us_0gb Did I just flash off the network for a bit?
03:09 VanessaE us_0gb: nope
03:10 dafull97 ShadowNinja, can you please explain like why it would be?
03:10 us_0gb Hmm. I seem to have on the other IRC network. I also lost connection to my meeting during a critical argument.
03:10 ShadowNinja dafull97: I cannot parse that sentence.
03:11 VanessaE ShadowNinja: why would it be slower with a cluster, he means.
03:11 dafull97 yes ^^
03:11 ShadowNinja dafull97: Because of NetIO.
03:14 dafull97 true, but it would give it more RAM, and it would still be processing on the master?
03:15 VanessaE it doesn't work like that.
03:15 VanessaE programs have to send data to one another and to RAM, and that takes upwards of hundreds of megabytes/second to a few gigs a second.
03:15 VanessaE that's something a network device just can't do.
03:15 us_0gb There's this thing called a bottle neck. If one part of the system is too limiting, it doesn't matter how well the rest of the system works.
03:16 dafull97 ohhh, ok i see so not enoguh cpu power to do that effiently?
03:16 us_0gb Lots of RAM, no way to send enough data to it to actually make use of the RAM.
03:17 dafull97 efficiently*
03:17 VanessaE dafull97: not enough network bandwidt
03:17 us_0gb I don't know the situation, but I don't think it has to do with the CPU.
03:17 VanessaE gig ethernet can only sustain 100MB/sec and that's if you can keep it full.
03:18 dafull97 really??? i tohught it could contain 1gb... since it is a gig eth, hahaha.... welll that is odd
03:19 VanessaE gigaBIT.  not gigabyte.
03:19 dafull97 ohhh, hahaha i always wondered what the difference was
03:19 VanessaE the rule of thumb is 10 bits to one byte (including network overhead)
03:19 dafull97 ok...
03:20 VanessaE (though on modern networks it's very close to 8:1)
03:20 dafull97 so it isnt worth if you jsut do 2 clustered together
03:20 VanessaE nope
03:20 VanessaE even if you had 10 of them it wouldn't be worth it.
03:20 us_0gb It could be a fun experiment though, if you just want to learn to cluster.
03:21 dafull97 idk about that VanessaE, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLJuJw1eN94
03:21 VanessaE clustering is intended for applications where all processes being spawned consume roughly equal resources - say a rendering job.
03:21 ShadowNinja But Minetest isn't a good app to test it with.
03:21 VanessaE "three node supercomputer"
03:21 VanessaE hah
03:21 us_0gb Yeah, probably not Minetest.
03:21 VanessaE no.
03:22 dafull97 they named it that becasue they now have over 60
03:22 dafull97 that was a project they worked on
03:22 dafull97 look at the performance differance between 1 and 3
03:23 VanessaE no need.
03:23 VanessaE supercomputing/clustering only works well for applications designed for it,
03:23 dafull97 ok, so it wouldnt share ram?
03:23 VanessaE that's why Pixar runs a render "farm".  they have a bunch of PC's running the same software, all of them clustered together to get the job done much faster
03:23 VanessaE no.
03:24 VanessaE I forget, how big is their farm now?
03:24 VanessaE 12,500 CPU cores.
03:25 dafull97 wow!
03:25 dafull97 dang
03:25 VanessaE uh huh.  and they run software that's designed to scale like that
03:25 dafull97 so what is clustering used for mostly now
03:25 VanessaE so it takes full advantage.
03:25 VanessaE stuff like that ^^^^, or folding@home, or compiling, etc.
03:27 VanessaE almost anything where you can divide a job up into discrete units that don't depend on one another and don't require a lot of cross-communication could benefit.  Minetest is not one of those things.
03:28 dafull97 so it would be best just to stick with buying one with suffient ram itself
03:28 VanessaE you could hand off a thousand frames of a movie to a thousand separate cores, for example, and let each core render that frame, then collate the results.  Keep feeding frames to cores as they become idle.
03:28 VanessaE you need CPU power, not RAM.
03:28 VanessaE 512MB is enough,
03:29 VanessaE what you need is a single, very fast CPU with 2 or so cores.
03:29 dafull97 would a Raspberry pi or  * https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A​20/A20-OLinuXino-MICRO/open-source-hardware *
03:29 dafull97 be faster and better for minetest/minecraft server
03:30 VanessaE buy both and see which performs better?
03:31 VanessaE turn the other into a router or something :P
03:32 Exio4 VanessaE: about the threaded part, there are a lot of things that could be "threadized" but the job for doing that is.. way too big
03:32 VanessaE yep I know
03:32 VanessaE the eternal problem with SMP :-/
03:32 Exio4 nope
03:32 VanessaE nope?
03:33 Exio4 it is because the program wasn't thought was a "multithreaded one"
03:33 VanessaE eh, well maybe
03:33 Menche would making it perform better on more cores make it perform worse on a single core machine?
03:33 dafull97 yea i might, Megaf raspberry pi performs nicely im on his server now
03:33 VanessaE but some problems just can't be divided up reasonably.
03:33 VanessaE Menche: probably not enough to become visible
03:33 VanessaE modern OS's are pretty good at delegating processes to cores
03:33 Exio4 Menche: the overhead would be too small
03:33 VanessaE (or to one core)
03:36 Exio4 i'm pretty c55 never thought about minetest being played for more than two guys in nonwhere that he knew
03:36 Exio4 pretty sure*
03:36 VanessaE haha
03:36 Exio4 no? :P
03:36 VanessaE no. :)
03:37 Exio4 did he say, some time ago, "I will make the minecraft-like game, with modding support and in C++!"?
03:38 VanessaE idk, I wasn't here :)
03:38 VanessaE but I'm pretty sure he had some idea that people would use it :)
03:38 Exio4 was k4hrl the one that coded the lua-support?
03:38 * VanessaE pokes kahrl
03:38 Exio4 nah
03:38 Exio4 bad girl, it was just curiosity and lazyness from my side :P
03:39 Exio4 for not looking around
03:39 VanessaE hah
03:39 VanessaE I ain't afraid to ping him.  He has the option of not answering :)
03:41 kahrl nah, c55 coded it, I just moved over the crafting recipes
03:42 Exio4 really?
03:43 kahrl almost :p
03:48 kahrl I did code the whole itemdef/craftdef manager and stuff like that but adding the lua interpreter was c55
03:49 OldCoder VanessaE, It look like I'm using Zeg9's farming plus ATM. Will things break if I continue to use that one?
03:49 Exio4 ah
03:50 Peacock farming ATM... money that grows on trees? wicked! :D
03:50 OldCoder Heh
03:54 VanessaE yes, things will break.
03:54 VanessaE use pilzadam's.
03:55 Peacock but be sure to buy him dinner and a movie before using him :P
03:55 VanessaE a function it depends on was changed in minetest_game's farming.  pilzadam's has the fix, zeg9's does not.
03:55 VanessaE haha
03:56 OldCoder VanessaE, t y
03:56 us_0gb Does anyone here know how Minetest weather works?
03:57 * VanessaE pokes troller
03:57 VanessaE he does ;)
03:57 Peacock black magic i suspect :p
03:57 us_0gb Okay, thanks! I'll make a note to ask him next time I see him.
03:58 us_0gb Peacock: More specifically, I need to know what to do about weather, and how to make use of it. Not the literal method in which it works.
03:58 us_0gb Most computers run using black magic. That's common knowledge.
03:58 Peacock i think you need to have finite on
03:59 VanessaE us_0gb: and magic smoke ;)
03:59 dafull97 VanessaE, i may go ahead and get 2 boards and cluster them and use them for several things
03:59 us_0gb Finite? As in finite liquid? Drats. No weather for me then.
03:59 dafull97 then build them up to i get like 30, haha
03:59 VanessaE us_0gb: at any rate it depends on an extra mod, and yes finite lquids I think.
03:59 dafull97 maybe host one as a router/DCHP
04:00 Peacock no need for router/dchp, IP-over-pidgeon is the wave of the future
04:00 us_0gb VanessaE: I'm writing the modules though. Most of the ones I'm using. Needing extra code won't be an issue if I know what needs to be added.
04:01 us_0gb Any idea why weather would depend on liquid finateness? It seems to involve freezing and melting.
04:01 VanessaE https://github.com/proller/min​etest-mod-weather/tree/weather
04:01 VanessaE you need that
04:01 VanessaE plus the engine patches
04:02 VanessaE and you have to turn it on in your config also
04:02 VanessaE (the feature, not the mod)
04:02 us_0gb The copy I'm developing on is from sometime today, though not the latest.
04:03 VanessaE probably best to use proller's "next" fork
04:03 VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7033
04:04 * dafull97 is about to goto sleep
04:04 us_0gb Hmm. I'm trying to make something that will be used on main Minetest. Would developing with a fork be helpful to that?
04:04 Peacock goto's are not permitted
04:04 us_0gb Good night, dafull97.
04:04 OldCoder dafull97, Night. dafull97 You had a question for me earlier?
04:04 OldCoder VanessaE, Zeg9 suggests his craft guide is much improved over others. But he notes...
04:05 OldCoder that it will leave unknown blocks
04:05 VanessaE us_0gb: it might, because his patches will probably go into mainline sooner or later, though when is uncertain.
04:05 OldCoder Is there consensus about whether or not to use Zeg9 craft guide?
04:05 VanessaE OldCoder: well I use Unified Inventory, which has a crafting guide also
04:05 Peacock which craft guide works da best?
04:05 dafull97 OldCoder, i did, are you in networking
04:06 us_0gb Cloud hight? That's settable? I need to fix my cosmic module then, it assumes the default height.
04:06 VanessaE us_0gb: idk, is it?
04:06 VanessaE last I knew that was a client-side feature only?
04:07 us_0gb THat module you linked me to uses it. THough then again, that doesn't make it a real setting, necessarily.
04:07 VanessaE hm, maybe it works now :)
04:07 OldCoder dafull97, I have done a lot of networking projects
04:07 OldCoder And I am working on a Cloud Service presently
04:08 OldCoder I started in networking, technically, about 37 years ago
04:08 us_0gb VanessaE: According to the example conf, yeah, it's a client setting. I don't know why a server module would be using it.
04:08 VanessaE maybe proller implemented it
04:08 dafull97 OldCoder, really? could you help me in networking? i asked VanessaE already but the more help the better
04:08 OldCoder dafull97, what is it that you need?
04:08 OldCoder A basic understanding? Not too difficult
04:09 OldCoder I believe you can code network scripts in Lua
04:09 OldCoder as well as Perl and Python
04:09 dafull97 OldCoder, well, in overall just assistance if i need it
04:10 VanessaE OldCoder:  he wants help with outside-of-minetest network e.g. hardware/driver level
04:10 OldCoder Driver level? Huh
04:10 dafull97 yes, and coding networks itself... =D
04:10 OldCoder All the way down to registers?
04:11 us_0gb It doesn't make sense to use that setting though, as a single client/server machine could want different settings.
04:11 OldCoder dafull97, Big field. Ask questions later on if they occur to you.
04:11 VanessaE OldCoder: he wants to cluster two or more Raspberry Pis together
04:11 OldCoder Ah!
04:11 us_0gb Client settings should not interfere with what the server is doing.
04:11 OldCoder I will not be much use with that
04:11 OldCoder But dafull97 feel free to ask about TCP/IP and server client in general
04:11 VanessaE us_0gb: I can see an argument for it:  different planet, different limit to cloud altitude, ergo different actual placement of them
04:12 dafull97 OldCoder what is your input on 2 pi clustered together to make RAM usage shared?
04:12 us_0gb VanessaE: Yes, but that should be a separate setting.
04:12 VanessaE I'd like to see an option to disable clouds entirely and replace them with a moving image of some kind
04:13 Menche don't only specially made programs benefit from clusters
04:13 VanessaE (e.g. a static image that is slowly scrolled over the sky, e.g. a rendering of clouds rather than blocky clouds)
04:13 us_0gb For example, cloud_hight and server_cloud_hight.
04:13 VanessaE Menche: yes, generally.
04:13 Peacock you can disable clouds, tho not replace them
04:14 OldCoder dafull97, I know little of portable devices. THis is off-topic but there are others who will comment. PM please.
04:15 OldCoder dafull97, I have PMd
04:22 us_0gb Hmm. Whether isn't what it seemed to be. I think I'll leave it out.
04:23 Peacock *weather
04:23 Peacock :P
04:23 Peacock (i get the two mixed up as well XD)
04:23 us_0gb Nothing can freezemelt at 0 degrees? That's odd, considering that's water's freezemelt temperature.
04:24 us_0gb Peacock: My apologies. Spell check doesn't catch when I spell the wrong word but I spell it correctly.
04:24 Peacock thats why i often get it wrong too lol
04:25 us_0gb Ha ha, nice.
04:25 us_0gb I've always had issues with spelling. About a year ago though, I learned why.
04:25 Peacock lysdexic?
04:25 us_0gb We tactile learners are just naturally bad at spelling.
04:26 us_0gb I'm slightly dyslexic as well, but that's a separate issue for me.
04:26 Peacock im more photographic than oral learner
04:27 Peacock takes me a tenth of the time to learn something reading about it that sitting in a classroom
04:27 us_0gb If I recall, my oral learning scores were low.
04:27 Peacock i also detested anything to do with languages or the arts lol
04:28 Peacock which, let's face it, leads to a career of teaching languages or the arts lol
04:28 us_0gb Everything is an art. Even science is an art.
04:28 Peacock well art is pretty suggestive, but in science, every question only has 1 answer
04:28 Peacock *subjective
04:28 Peacock not suggestive lol
04:29 us_0gb Well, some art is pretty suggestive. Have you seen the Greek sculptures?
04:29 Peacock yeah but that's pron lol
04:29 us_0gb Technically, no.
04:29 Peacock i meant to say art can be interpreted many different ways lol
04:30 us_0gb It's just the beauty of the human body, in stone form.
04:30 Peacock yeah ive seen pics of it, never been to greece tho
04:30 Peacock seems to guys were last in line when god was handing out the equipment lol
04:30 Peacock *those
04:31 * dafull97 is going to bed...
04:31 us_0gb *Zeus
04:33 Peacock in any case the notion that you can grade someone's art or their interpretation of it seemed ridiculous to me in school, thats why i hated it lol
04:33 Peacock at most, you can grade someone on their knowledge of art history
04:35 OldCoder Peacock, Representational art...
04:35 OldCoder They graded based on the ability to follow conventional rules
04:36 OldCoder So not Art really per se but mechanics
04:36 Peacock well i dont know how that would work with modern and postmodern art lol
04:36 us_0gb Postmodern? That sounds like future art.
04:36 Peacock postmodern art started around the 70s
04:37 OldCoder It would not work
04:38 OldCoder Too limiting
04:38 OldCoder And every era believes that it is post-modern
04:38 OldCoder We are always the cutting edge; the ones who are different and special
04:39 Peacock since when have artists not self-aggrandized lol
04:39 us_0gb No one is special. We all are replaceable, and will be replaced when they inevitably die.
04:40 Peacock you could say everyone is unique, but special implies better than the rest
04:41 Peacock tho treating every kid as special since the 90s' firmly convinced me not to have any lol
04:42 * Menche wonders what will come after "postmodern"
04:43 Peacock depends what state society's in
04:44 us_0gb Menche: Post-postmodern.
04:44 Peacock bedpostmodern lol
04:44 us_0gb Peacock: No children? Nice, me neither, but mostly for other reasons.
04:44 Peacock interesting read if you ignore the source: http://www.atlassociety.org/why_art_became_ugly
04:45 Menche who names "eras" anyway... and who decides how long eras are, lol
04:45 us_0gb As an asexual, the process of child creating ... is more than I want to deal with.
04:45 Peacock could still adopt, though i dont know what youre chances would be being single
04:45 us_0gb Slim, yeah.
04:46 Peacock i just dont want any kids lol
04:46 Peacock even if you raise em right, they'd still pick up the habits of all the other kids
04:47 OldCoder us_0gb, But we tell ourselves that we are special
04:47 us_0gb I sort of want children, to raise them right and better the world, but it seems like it would be such a hassle. I think I'll be happier without them.
04:48 us_0gb OldCoder: Yes, most people tell themselves they're special, but that doesn't make it true.
04:48 Peacock well the way the world is going, they might resent you for it lol
04:48 OldCoder us_0gb, Of course. That is the point.
04:49 us_0gb The children would resent me for raising them?
04:49 * OldCoder looks forward to upgrading more worlds soon
04:49 OldCoder g2g
04:49 Peacock no for bringing them into the world lol
04:50 Peacock they'll probably be working longer, earning less, paying more for everything, and paying high taxes
04:50 Peacock *higher
04:50 Peacock yeah i can get a cheaper TV made in china than what my parents could back in the day, but on the flipside, i'll be paying a heckuvalot more for a house to put it in
04:53 Peacock and while our parents could keep the same appliances for 20 years, we're lucky now if they last the warranty lol
04:55 paramat joined #minetest
04:56 paramat Peacock, new commit with perlin-varied size and persistence, ores still very simple https://github.com/paramat/asteroid
04:56 Peacock are you gonna make more changes? if so i should wait
04:57 paramat yes more changes coming
04:57 paramat no more SNOOFF, but a new parameter ICET heh
04:58 Peacock ICET sounds like isset :P
04:58 paramat http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice-T
05:00 Peacock sweet, i love law and order lol
05:02 paramat i renamed dust to 'regolith', also, it now completely covers the stone, instead of being patchy
05:03 Peacock well im gonna have to change a few things anyhow, which is why im thinking of modularizing the whole thing at my end
05:03 Peacock so all i need to swap out in the ongen module
05:04 us_0gb Peacock: I am unable to bring them into the world, I can only (maybe) adopt.
05:04 ShadowNinja paramat: 1) Use proper git commits, not just v1, v2, v3, etc. 2) Use the LVM, 0.4.8 will be released soon and it will take time to learn.
05:04 * paramat also doesnt want kids
05:05 Peacock cuz i use the asteroid dust for two things: in the kiln for terracotta, and smelting to obtain silica and then kiln glass with it
05:08 paramat ShadowNinja, i thought commit messages could be anything, are version numbers not allowed? Also, i have already learnt LVM and new perlin map functions, just waiting for 0.4.8 stable :)
05:09 ShadowNinja paramat: Commits are designed for individual concepts, eg, "Cache settings". Tags are designed for versions and the like.
05:10 us_0gb paramat: I'm holding off too, though I want to use that Settings() feature pretty badly. Even if not for its intended purpose.
05:10 ShadowNinja Git *works* with commits like that. But that isn't really the way it's designed to be used.
05:11 paramat okay thanks, still a git newbie
05:11 Peacock dont worry, 3 years and i still have no clue how it works lol
05:11 ShadowNinja us_0gb: What Settings() abuse do you have in mind?
05:12 us_0gb ShadowNinja: I use it to parse some information out of map_meta.txt. Chunk size, water level, and I think one other thing.
05:13 ShadowNinja paramat: The docs at git-scm.com and the "Pro Git" book on it are helpfull.
05:13 us_0gb Information I need to know to set my modules correctly.
05:13 ShadowNinja us_0gb: Ah, that should be fine.
05:14 us_0gb Yeah, I'm not using it maliciously, just not for its intended purpose of module-based configuration files.
05:14 paramat thanks SN
05:15 ShadowNinja YW.
05:15 us_0gb ShadowNinja: I might also use it to store player currency, and some other non-configuration things.
05:15 us_0gb Just because it would be easier.
05:16 Leoneof joined #minetest
05:16 ShadowNinja us_0gb: minetest.serialize, or serialize_json(if we get it) sounds better for that. -- If it doesn't need to be human-readable that is.
05:17 reactor joined #minetest
05:17 ShadowNinja That way you can add other data like tables.
05:17 us_0gb Better how? And no, it probably does not need to be human readable.
05:18 us_0gb The amount of money player ShadowNinja has doesn't need to be represented as a table.
05:19 us_0gb I wouldn't know how to represent it that way if I tried. THough I could put it in a table, I guess.
05:19 ShadowNinja Yes, but you can later store data other than money in the file.
05:32 paramat Peacock, possibly useful ... see my 'spacetime' mod for code that sets and fixes time to midnight, hopefully custom skies come in 0.4.8 and you wont need it
05:32 Peacock what i did was easier: /set -n time_speed 0 and /time 0
05:32 reactor paramat: there is already a setting that fixes time.
05:33 reactor Yes, that, Peacock.
05:33 reactor Orthogonality is good.
05:33 Peacock aiight, i got a smelter for seperating ores, a forge for making ingots, an assembler (5x5 workbench) and a kiln for making glass/terracota... anything missing? lol
05:34 paramat wow cool
05:34 Peacock probably a protein/chemical synthesizer, ill need that for chemical lights and batteries
05:35 reactor Protein batteries? That's something new.
05:35 Peacock and an algea-pod for making food (algea paste)
05:35 Peacock chemical batteries :P
05:35 Peacock sortof star-trekish replicator, cuz there's no other way i can think of coming up with chemicals
05:35 paramat i want to make 'air' nodes drownable and have moonrealm-mod type breathable atmosphere nodes
05:35 Peacock i dont want pools of liquid in asteroids lol the mess and all
05:36 reactor I still wonder why people still use non-reghargeable batteries.
05:36 reactor s/still w/w/
05:36 reactor s/gh/ch/
05:36 Peacock i was thinking of making the air drownable too, tho im saving that for last since historically, the airgen bit was the trickiest
05:36 reactor Does space mod also remove gravity?
05:36 paramat certainly was :/
05:37 Peacock havent touched gravity or air genning yet, still working out the resource tree heh
05:37 Peacock asteroids you get 4 basic resources: dust, stone, ice, and ores... and i have to find a way to make everything with that lol
05:37 Peacock hence the abundance of machines
05:37 reactor Free_move would probably be enough.
05:37 paramat i have a mod for custom gravities 'multigrav'
05:37 reactor but need to force it on
05:37 Peacock yeah i downloaded the first and latest multigrav, haven't tested it yet tho
05:37 reactor How are you gonna model the Earth?
05:37 Peacock no earth
05:37 reactor Oh, you're not orbiting anything?
05:38 Peacock game is Deep Space, just asteroids
05:38 Peacock ive pretty much gutted default of everything
05:38 reactor I was thinking about replicating ISS in MT.
05:38 Peacock re ISS, i was thining of making an inflatable pod for my tek mod in the game
05:39 Peacock so you could assemble a station with the modules
05:40 us_0gb I thought about making air drownable too. Or making it hurt you like lava. Or both.
05:40 Peacock drowning makes more sense cuz of the air bubbles
05:40 paramat ... in 'asteroid' mod i will extract oxygen from local materials, and craft air generators
05:41 reactor fill the rest of the map with water.
05:41 reactor oh.
05:41 reactor no
05:41 reactor bad
05:42 reactor or why not
05:42 reactor do it
05:42 reactor but replace water texture with transparency
05:42 Peacock well ill just go with pure air gen machines, underwater extraction makes more sense
05:42 Peacock but with normal liquids in the state they are, i haven't bothered with the waterworld map in weeks
05:43 khor joined #minetest
05:43 paramat ah i wondered how waterworld was going / not going
05:44 Peacock well the normal liquids take ten minutes to flow, air holes take longer to fill up
05:44 Peacock im glad i dont have to deal with liquids at all in the asteroid map lol
05:52 paramat im gonna keep asteroid mod mapgen-orientated with just very simple items / crafting / machines, just basic airgen. i prefer to leave developing that stuff to others who can build on my mods mapgen
05:53 OldCoder joined #minetest
05:53 darkrose joined #minetest
05:54 OldCoder I like the new entry message
06:01 ShadowBot joined #minetest
06:04 VanessaE bbl
06:05 reactor Tour to Pripyat, anyone?
06:10 OldCoder reactor, Hi!
06:10 OldCoder reactor, I am actually trying to run mcedit now
06:10 reactor o/
06:10 reactor Good.
06:10 OldCoder I will let you know
06:10 OldCoder retrying setup
06:11 OldCoder Could not get dependencies earlier
06:11 reactor Mkay.
06:11 reactor What OS, again?
06:14 OldCoder My Linux distro
06:14 OldCoder working on this now; will report back soon
06:15 reactor What package manager?
06:15 reactor And which package repository do you use?
06:15 OldCoder Heh
06:15 OldCoder I said... *my* Linux distro :-)
06:15 OldCoder As in, me
06:15 reactor Also, how come? You got disappointed in all Linux distros?
06:15 OldCoder I created it
06:15 OldCoder Ah
06:15 OldCoder I will link you to the story
06:15 OldCoder You can glance at it while I try to get mcedit up
06:16 reactor You would probably like to try FreeBSD.
06:16 OldCoder Heh
06:16 OldCoder reactor I was there when BSD was created
06:16 OldCoder I was one of the guinea pigs :-)
06:16 OldCoder
06:16 OldCoder http://oldcoder.org/distro/distrohistory.html
06:16 OldCoder
06:16 OldCoder 20 years ago
06:16 OldCoder I tried to get CSRG to move the free BSD variations along
06:17 OldCoder They were afraid of AT&T
06:17 OldCoder and decided to wait
06:17 OldCoder Linus stepped in and filled the void
06:17 OldCoder The link above is the answer to your question
06:17 OldCoder Hope it is interesting
06:17 OldCoder
06:18 OldCoder easy_install is building a bunch of dependencies. This will take a few minutes.
06:18 OldCoder Others, this is about converting MC maps to MT
06:19 reactor I see.
06:19 reactor Well, eh.
06:19 reactor Linux was a substitute for UNIX in the days it was undergoing relicensing.
06:20 OldCoder More than that
06:20 OldCoder The time was right...
06:20 reactor I don't see any reason to be sticking with a clone when you have the original OS for free now.
06:20 OldCoder There was going to be a Free PC UNIX
06:20 OldCoder Heh
06:20 OldCoder It is not a "clone"
06:20 reactor It's a badly written one.
06:20 OldCoder It is *my* OS and does as I wish
06:20 OldCoder Hm?
06:20 reactor The Linux kernel is.
06:20 OldCoder As I said, this is *my* version
06:20 OldCoder It does what I wish it to
06:21 OldCoder Here is a little white paper:
06:21 reactor I see. I'm talking specifically about the kernel.
06:21 OldCoder http://oldcoder.org/distro/distronotes.html
06:21 OldCoder Yes
06:21 OldCoder Linux and distros are not the same
06:21 OldCoder
06:21 OldCoder Hmm
06:21 OldCoder Running mcedit
06:21 OldCoder ImportError: No module named pymclevel.minecraft_server
06:21 reactor By the way. Nice site. Text-only-browser friendly.
06:21 OldCoder Yes
06:21 OldCoder Not mobile friendly yet
06:21 OldCoder It is sort of a 2003 layout
06:21 reactor Oh. Hang on. I used to get the same error.
06:22 reactor Well, screw mobile.
06:22 OldCoder reactor, mcedit needs MC?
06:22 reactor No.
06:22 OldCoder It is OK
06:22 reactor I only use my mobile to SSH into my system, to use links(1) from there :D
06:22 OldCoder That is sensible
06:22 reactor s/, to/, and/
06:22 OldCoder Should I google about the error?
06:22 reactor Mobile browsers are awful pieces of shit.
06:22 OldCoder Heh
06:22 reactor Googling didn't tell me anything.
06:22 OldCoder They are finicky this is true
06:22 OldCoder What did you do?
06:23 reactor I had to solve it myself.
06:23 reactor I can't seem to recall it. That happens a lot :(
06:23 reactor Need to think.
06:23 * OldCoder chuckles
06:23 OldCoder OK
06:23 reactor Probably my attempts at voluntary forgetting.
06:23 OldCoder Oh my
06:24 reactor pymclevel... Uh.
06:24 OldCoder Hmm
06:24 OldCoder A JAR file?
06:24 reactor No.
06:24 reactor you probably haven't got something.
06:24 reactor check the depends again
06:24 reactor I remember I had to fidget with dependencies.
06:24 OldCoder Ah
06:24 OldCoder Missing folder
06:24 reactor Got something?
06:24 OldCoder No
06:24 OldCoder I have all the depends
06:25 OldCoder It looks like the tarball omits something at GitHub
06:25 OldCoder Reviewing
06:25 reactor Yes.
06:25 reactor try and update from git
06:25 OldCoder Yes
06:25 OldCoder https://github.com/mcedit/p​ymclevel/archive/master.zip
06:25 OldCoder Probably this
06:25 reactor Oh. I see. I recall I had to download something separately... was it pymclevel?
06:25 OldCoder Probably
06:26 OldCoder Ugh, as the kids say...
06:26 OldCoder ImportError: No module named Cython.Distutils
06:26 OldCoder OK So I need Cython...
06:26 OldCoder I shall add Cython
06:27 reactor Cython?
06:27 reactor Something to do with C in Python?
06:27 OldCoder It is needed by pymclevel
06:27 OldCoder yes
06:27 OldCoder Building Cython now
06:28 OldCoder I want my distro to have all of this anyway
06:28 OldCoder Hmm... any way to make setup.py use multicore?
06:28 OldCoder I am pegging just one CPU
06:29 reactor Mcedit is really a bitch to handle with tiling WM.
06:29 OldCoder We will see
06:29 reactor idk hmm
06:29 OldCoder Coming along
06:29 reactor probably need threaded python
06:29 OldCoder Yep
06:29 OldCoder OK Cython built
06:29 reactor That's why I like to set all ports options myself.
06:30 OldCoder Building pymclevel
06:30 reactor This may seem like PITA, but heck, I only have to do it once.
06:30 OldCoder Running mcedit
06:30 OldCoder TypeError: ("No array-type handler for type <class 'ctypes.c_ulong'> (value: c_ulong(0L)) registered", <OpenGL.converters.CallFuncPyConverter object at 0x81f97ac>)
06:30 OldCoder Exception AttributeError: "'Texture' object has no attribute '_texID'" in <bound method Texture.__del__ of <glutils.Texture object at 0x965cfcc>> ignored
06:30 OldCoder (ENV)whitestar:/ip/reactor/mcedit-master#
06:30 OldCoder Heh
06:30 OldCoder PITA is right. This may be meant to be... Reviewing
06:31 OldCoder Some sort of PyOpenGL problem...
06:31 reactor Oh. I wanted to ask.
06:31 OldCoder Hm?
06:31 reactor How does one avoid Windows-bound jobs?
06:32 OldCoder Explain briefly
06:33 OldCoder 60,000 hits for that error message
06:33 OldCoder That is not promising!
06:33 reactor I wouldn't like to spend a decade or more working with a bad OS.
06:34 reactor Am I safe from it if I stick to theoretical physics?
06:34 OldCoder OH
06:34 OldCoder You mean jobs as in employment?!
06:34 reactor Yes.
06:34 OldCoder Wait; let me consider
06:34 reactor I would really lose my mojo and become bald if I had to work with that shit.
06:34 OldCoder reactor, That is silly... there will be UNIX jobs in many fields
06:34 OldCoder Heh
06:35 OldCoder Here is what I did
06:35 OldCoder In September my Windows 7 laptop got virused
06:35 OldCoder They could not fix it
06:35 OldCoder The MANUFACTURER came out and said we do not know what to do
06:35 OldCoder Even they could not fix it
06:35 OldCoder Some type of firmware Windows problem
06:35 OldCoder I.T. reformatted the disk
06:35 OldCoder STILL could not fix it
06:36 OldCoder I was without a PC for a week
06:36 reactor Aha. The virus had flashed it.
06:36 OldCoder I said, never again
06:36 OldCoder Possibly... not even sure malware
06:36 OldCoder But probably
06:36 OldCoder So when the machine was rebuilt
06:36 OldCoder I VM'd the damn thing
06:36 reactor Oh.
06:36 OldCoder I now run MY LINUX distro
06:36 reactor That might work.
06:36 OldCoder and Windows is just another... Window :-)
06:36 OldCoder Windows and all the software is just a big file
06:37 OldCoder Works great!
06:37 reactor Yes, with hardware virtualisation and stuff that might be a solution.
06:37 OldCoder Yes
06:37 reactor But eh.
06:37 OldCoder I am reviewing the OpenGL issue...
06:37 reactor I wouldn't like to even touch it.
06:37 reactor Even from a virtual machine.
06:37 OldCoder Eh back... tradeoffs
06:37 reactor Because heck, it's nasty to work with, that's it.
06:37 OldCoder Well, be a webdev
06:37 reactor I can't get anything done under it.
06:37 OldCoder Lots of work and you can set up Debian VPSes for people
06:38 reactor Oh. Probably.
06:38 OldCoder Hang on. I need to look at this mcedit issue. May not be solvable.
06:38 reactor Or... I could install and adminster BSD on my friend's hosting.
06:39 reactor What kind of issue?
06:39 OldCoder TypeError("No array-type handler for type <class 'ctypes.c_ulong'> (value: c_ulong(0L))
06:39 OldCoder That type
06:40 OldCoder 60,000 hits in Google and no fix
06:40 OldCoder It is some type of OpenGL wrapper issue
06:41 reactor I haven't encountered it here.
06:41 OldCoder Yep
06:41 OldCoder It may be Xorg dependent
06:41 reactor Hell, I am confused now.
06:41 reactor I think... I'll port it myself, and meanwhile... shall I give you the incomplete thing, to try it out?
06:42 OldCoder Yes; I think I can't handle it. Sorry.
06:42 OldCoder I gave it a shot.
06:42 reactor No problem, at least you've tried.
06:42 OldCoder Ah
06:42 OldCoder Other people DO have this issue specifically with mcedit...
06:42 OldCoder Moment...
06:43 reactor Brb, my WM has had a fritz.
06:44 reactor joined #minetest
06:44 reactor I'm back.
06:44 OldCoder Hi
06:45 OldCoder Sorry, this one is beyond me
06:45 OldCoder It is a weird OpenGL wrapper issue
06:45 reactor mk
06:45 OldCoder If you can convert, I can host
06:45 reactor mk
06:45 reactor meanwhle, would you like to see the map in MT?
06:45 OldCoder Looking further at traceback
06:45 OldCoder Sure
06:45 reactor ok, I'll start the server, brb
06:46 Hunterz joined #minetest
06:47 reactor While I'm starting it, OldCoder, could you show me the multiworld setup?
06:47 reactor I have it, too, but mine is kludgey.
06:47 OldCoder reactor, I did not plan to run a client tonight...
06:47 OldCoder When a map is available, I'll put it up myself... regarding multi world...
06:47 OldCoder falling asleep but basic setup goes like this
06:48 OldCoder /opt/minetest047/... is tree
06:48 OldCoder Standard not in place setup
06:48 OldCoder Until yesterday
06:48 OldCoder I had separate games per world in the share/minetest/games folder
06:48 OldCoder Dropping back to minetest_game
06:48 OldCoder With about 100 mods in share/mods
06:48 OldCoder mod selection set by configuration lines in world.mt
06:49 OldCoder Each world is run in a script by a line like this:
06:49 OldCoder $P zegaton      minetest       30015
06:49 OldCoder The full set looks like this:
06:49 OldCoder $P angelfury    same       30000
06:49 OldCoder $P tuxworld     same       30001
06:49 OldCoder $P skyblock     same       30002
06:49 OldCoder $P calinou      same       30003
06:49 OldCoder $P octuteam     same       30004
06:49 OldCoder was kicked by ShadowBot: Message flood detected.
06:49 reactor Pwned.
06:49 OldCoder joined #minetest
06:49 OldCoder $P oldtux       same       30008
06:50 OldCoder $P ispuzzle     same       30009
06:50 OldCoder $P marktwain    same       30010
06:50 OldCoder $P xiphos       same       30011
06:50 OldCoder $P holamundo    same       30012
06:50 OldCoder was kicked by ShadowBot: Message flood detected.
06:50 Ritchie joined #minetest
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06:50 reactor Oh.
06:50 OldCoder Um hi?
06:50 OldCoder The bot does not like long text :-)
06:51 reactor Yes.
06:51 OldCoder reactor, I had best prepare the scripts for you separately
06:51 OldCoder But basically
06:51 OldCoder each line invokes a Bash subroutine
06:51 OldCoder Which runs a loop
06:51 OldCoder The loop restarts an instance of the MT server
06:51 OldCoder With a number of parameters and using a per world configuration file
06:51 OldCoder There is code to handle damage caused by aborted runs
06:52 OldCoder For example, damaged player configuration files are repaired
06:52 OldCoder If a world crashes there is an auto-restart
06:52 OldCoder and there are a number of other tweaks
06:52 OldCoder There is also a shutdown script
06:52 reactor Oh. I have a simpler setup. An rc script calls a shell script that spawns all servers in a certain directory in a loop. But it doesn't allow for restarting servers by one, only all of them.
06:52 OldCoder That makes an attempt to close all running worlds down gracefully
06:52 OldCoder So we have similar scripts and you may review mine
06:52 OldCoder But things are in transition
06:53 OldCoder I am now falling asleep
06:53 reactor Good night?
06:53 OldCoder Just as you did about 11 hours ago
06:53 OldCoder Pretty close to it
06:53 reactor Where are you from?
06:53 OldCoder Nice talking to you
06:53 OldCoder Silicon Valley
06:53 reactor Oh.
06:53 OldCoder In a specific sense
06:53 OldCoder
06:53 reactor And I'm from Russia
06:53 OldCoder In a broader one:
06:53 OldCoder Ah
06:53 OldCoder I am half Slavic
06:53 reactor Opposite sides of the Earth :D
06:53 OldCoder Not so far
06:53 OldCoder PM
06:53 reactor Idk who I am.
06:56 Miner_48er OldCoder may I see those scripts as well?
06:57 OldCoder Yes of course you may
06:57 OldCoder And I will help set up new servers
06:57 OldCoder Including such Linuxes as CentOS
06:57 OldCoder But one step at a time
06:57 OldCoder Tonight I am falling asleep
06:58 Miner_48er ok thx
07:23 codehero joined #minetest
07:24 reactor Something happened to my mcedit.
07:24 reactor I can't control the view for shit.
07:31 reactor joined #minetest
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08:20 reactor Uh.
08:20 reactor With proper cooling, this machine does process the map faster.
08:48 reactor Hope what that TheLastProject guy is doing is really his last project.
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09:17 MinetestBot GIT: proler@github.com commited to minetest/minetest: Masterserver fixes cf0786dc9d 2013-11-04T01:02:42-08:00 http://git.io/85I9BQ
09:22 smoke_fumus joined #minetest
09:22 reactor So. Eh.
09:23 reactor What's the name of the program that draws top views?
09:28 thexyz minetestmapper.py
09:33 pitriss thexyz: why not the cpp one?
09:35 reactor mk
09:37 andrew3 joined #minetest
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09:40 arsdragonfly hi there
09:40 kaeza mornings
09:41 arsdragonfly the development seems to have sped up drastically :-P
09:45 reactor Mcedit... broken amphoboan shit.
09:52 JamesTait Good morning all; happy Use Your Common Sense Day! :-D
09:59 reactor Or Guy Fawkes Day?
09:59 reactor .-1s/mphob/mphib/
10:00 reactor .-1s/boa/bia/
10:00 reactor Fucking bitch my right ring finger is.
10:17 Megaf joined #minetest
10:28 reactor Where do I get libgd?
10:28 reactor I mean, what does it provide?
10:36 kaeza reactor, http://libgd.bitbucket.org/pages/about.html
10:37 reactor ty
10:39 arsdragonfly_ joined #minetest
10:48 reactor joined #minetest
10:49 reactor Where were we?
10:53 reactor ld can't find libgd on BSD.
10:53 monkeycoder joined #minetest
11:30 reactor joined #minetest
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11:40 VargaD joined #minetest
12:29 reactor ?
12:32 OldCoder reactor, is it present?
12:32 OldCoder And does BSD have anything comparable to LD_LIBRARY_PATH ?
12:33 reactor ?
12:34 reactor OldCoder: I've replaced the -rpath argument of CXX with -L/usr/local/lib
12:34 reactor and it compiled.
12:34 reactor That's a kludge, but eh.
12:34 OldCoder Very well
12:34 reactor Also, I'm porting the map by pieces.
12:35 OldCoder Well again. Excuse fragment responses. It is 4:35am.
12:35 OldCoder Slept about 4 hours. Debating another hour or two.
12:35 reactor Also, what is present?
12:35 OldCoder The library
12:35 OldCoder It is, apparently
12:36 reactor Debating with whom?
12:36 OldCoder Myself. I have won the debate. Yes, I believe a bit more sleep is advisable.
12:36 reactor Good.
12:36 reactor Sleep tight, man.
12:52 Evergreen_ joined #minetest
12:55 EvergreenTree joined #minetest
12:56 EvergreenTree Oh, so we have channels for different languages now, cool
12:57 reactor EvergreenTree: you know Russian?
12:57 EvergreenTree No
13:00 dafull97 joined #minetest
13:00 dafull97 Hey guys
13:00 EvergreenTree Heyo
13:02 dafull97 EvergreenTree, you mod correct?
13:04 kaeza EvergreenTree, the channels have existed for quite some time now, but not so "officially"
13:05 dafull97 kaeza, PM'ed you
13:08 EvergreenTree dafull97, ?
13:08 codehero joined #minetest
13:08 dafull97 EvergreenTree, you are a Modder?
13:08 EvergreenTree Yes, I 'spose so
13:09 dafull97 what that suppose to mean?
13:11 EvergreenTree Yes, I quess you can call me a modder
13:11 EvergreenTree *guess
13:11 EvergreenTree Is English your first language?
13:12 NakedFury joined #minetest
13:13 dafull97 yes, i just woke up so it may be a little confusing hahah
13:14 dafull97 why?
13:15 EvergreenTree Never mind, what did you need?
13:16 dafull97 i was asking if you modded minetest, sorry if i am confusing :/
13:16 dafull97 just woke up as  i said...
13:18 hmmmm joined #minetest
13:19 EvergreenTree Oh so that is all you wanted to know?   Usually when someone asks that, they need help with a mod
13:19 dafull97 ohh, no i figured them out already, i hosted a server for like a week and decided it wasn't fast enough... i hosted it on a VPS
13:20 dafull97 132mb ram...
13:20 dafull97 :/
13:21 EvergreenTree Bleh, rpi has more ram then that
13:21 EvergreenTree *rbpi
13:21 dafull97 yea, i know
13:21 dafull97 that what im plainning on getting, or somthing similar
13:21 dafull97 planning*
13:29 reactor joined #minetest
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13:54 Tux[Qyou] joined #minetest
13:55 reactor OldCoder: awake yet?
13:55 Wuzzy joined #minetest
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15:09 reactor Is it me or mcedit only uses one processor?
15:11 harrison There is no "bitch" in the word "bitcoin"
15:12 harrison but almost
15:13 reactor Bitchoin
15:13 reactor Bitcoin is waste of coal.
15:14 reactor Literally, you make money not by mining for some valuable material, but by heating the Universe.
15:15 reactor They could at least use not just functions for bitcoin mining, but useful computations like protein folding.
15:18 sfan5 hi everyone
15:20 reactor o/
15:21 harrison no, they couldn't. your point has been addressed before by others, so i will just add a new thought: the "uselessness" of the computation bitcoin requires is the point, and this has an analogy in ethology. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Signalling_theory
15:22 harrison http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Handicap_principle
15:23 harrison The theory predicts that a sexual ornament, or any other signal, must be costly if it is to accurately advertise a trait of relevance to an individual with conflicting interests. Typical examples of handicapped signals include bird songs, the peacock's tail, courtship dances, bowerbird's bowers, or even possibly jewellery and humor. Jared Diamond has proposed that certain risky human behaviours, such as bungee jumping, may be expressions o
15:23 harrison instincts that have evolved through the operation of the handicap principle. Zahavi has invoked the potlatch ceremony as a human example of the handicap principle in action. This interpretation of potlatch can be traced to Thorstein Veblen's use of the ceremony in his book Theory of the Leisure Class as an example of "conspicuous consumption".[30]
15:23 iqualfragile joined #minetest
15:23 harrison The application to bitcoin is left as a trivial exercise.
15:24 harrison QED
15:24 OldCoder reactor, Hi
15:24 reactor o/
15:24 OldCoder reactor, slept about 2.5 hours more. Preparing for work.
15:25 OldCoder Heh I almost said preparing for "wok"
15:25 OldCoder Wok is good
15:25 harrison Wok the dog.
15:25 reactor harrison: that still doesn't resolve the problem
15:25 reactor harrison: we're only wasting resources, not producing anything.
15:25 reactor I mean, they're.
15:25 reactor OldCoder: mk
15:26 reactor Where do you work?
15:26 harrison http://bitcoin.stackexchange.com/questions​/5617/why-are-bitcoin-calculation-useless
15:26 harrison Why don't we use calculations that are also useful for some other purpose?
15:26 harrison To provide security for the Bitcoin network, the calculations involved need to have some very specific features. These features are incompatible with leveraging the computation for other purposes.
15:27 reactor YEs.
15:27 reactor s/YE/Ye/
15:27 OldCoder reactor, East Bay Area in Silicon Valley. About half an hour to drive. 45 minutes to an hour in heavy traffic.
15:27 reactor That means, bitcoin is useless and can nto be cured.
15:27 reactor s/nto/not/
15:27 OldCoder I am told that Bitcoin will fade now because of GPUs...
15:27 OldCoder Ordinary computers can't compete
15:28 harrison i agree, it is so useless in fact that i don't want any bitcoins, but i am such an altruist that you can get rid of any bitcoins that you have by sending them to me
15:28 reactor I still would like it if someone proposed currency based on useful computation.
15:29 harrison why is establishing a cryptocurrency "useless"?
15:29 reactor Because you only waste electricity this way.
15:29 reactor When you mine gold, you produce it.
15:29 reactor When you calculate crypto functions for bitcoin, nothing is produced.
15:29 harrison why is establishing a cryptocurrency "useless"?
15:29 reactor But electricity is wasted.
15:29 reactor Because you produce nothing.
15:29 reactor Nothing. Zero.
15:30 harrison This is turning into Seinfeld.
15:30 Hunterz joined #minetest
15:30 reactor Define.
15:31 harrison "The show about nothing".
15:32 reactor It entertains some.
15:32 reactor It has audience.
15:32 reactor But bitcoin does not produce anything.
15:32 harrison why is establishing a cryptocurrency "useless"?
15:32 reactor You're going in circles.
15:32 harrison why is establishing a cryptocurrency "not producing anything"?
15:33 reactor And not listening to me. I've already said it above.
15:33 reactor I'm not gonna repeat myself.
15:33 harrison http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dXBC6R_rxk
15:33 reactor OldCoder: the map is already about 40M.
15:33 reactor !title
15:33 MinetestBot reactor: Seinfeld Lost Episode - Kramer At The Laugh Factory - YouTube
15:34 OldCoder reactor, We look forward to it. Do not rush.
15:34 OldCoder Have fun
15:34 reactor I'm sorry, I can't process the video at the moment.
15:34 reactor OldCoder: I mean, is it okay to host?
15:35 reactor I think of trimming it some more, actually.
15:35 reactor Because the surunding forest is made up by the author, too.
15:35 reactor s/run/round/
15:35 reactor s/ndd/nd/
15:40 OldCoder reactor, I can host a 400MB world if you like
15:40 OldCoder Will that be enough?
15:40 harrison am i invited or is it only for the "in crowd"?
15:41 OldCoder reactor, you do not need to trim anything and harrison come on in the water is fine
15:41 OldCoder reactor, you should only "trim" the parts you consider to be unneeded and uninteresting
15:41 OldCoder
15:42 harrison sr@box ~/minetest> git pull
15:42 harrison Already up-to-date.
15:42 harrison it never updates
15:42 reactor OldCoder: mk
15:43 harrison perhaps i am pointed at the wrong repo
15:43 reactor OldCoder: I think I will trim what I find not realistic at all
15:43 harrison anyway, would you post a server address?
15:43 OldCoder harrison, there is one world up presently out of about 20
15:44 OldCoder I am in the process of upgrading
15:44 OldCoder Here is a compatible Windows client:
15:44 harrison windows? do you never tire of insulting me?
15:44 OldCoder http://minetest.org/clients/minetest-131102.zip
15:44 OldCoder It is for others who may observe this interactiont oo
15:44 reactor :D
15:44 OldCoder The Windows client is for both 32 and 64 bits
15:45 OldCoder I have not built Linux clients
15:45 OldCoder The worlds, 20 of them, are at server minetest.org
15:45 OldCoder When they are running - which is NOT today
15:45 OldCoder The ports are 30000 to about 30015 to 30020
15:46 OldCoder Right now only 30015 is up and it is out of sync... I will shut it down and restart with different mods this morning
15:46 OldCoder
15:46 OldCoder There are screenshots of all the worlds but I need to rejigger them
15:46 reactor OldCoder: any ideas what themap can me used for?
15:46 reactor s/me/be/
15:46 reactor Apart from just walking around.
15:46 OldCoder I ask for help to edit some of the worlds and merge them
15:46 OldCoder Done
15:46 OldCoder reactor, why... for building?
15:46 reactor uilding what.
15:46 OldCoder For any MT purpsoe?
15:46 reactor s/ui/Bui/
15:46 OldCoder Whatever MT people wish to build
15:47 OldCoder If it is very interesting, two copies will be maintained
15:47 OldCoder The original for review and a live copy to build on
15:47 OldCoder
15:47 OldCoder harrison, ^ Done
15:47 reactor building houses in a contaminated area
15:47 OldCoder Can it be fixed?
15:48 OldCoder Throw it open for group discussion later
15:48 OldCoder Perhaps when you wake up tomorrow morning which will be tonight here
15:48 OldCoder In the U.S. that is
15:48 reactor I was thinking deathmatch.
15:48 OldCoder Good idea
15:48 OldCoder Combat is fine too
15:48 reactor Deathmatch, looting, setting up traps in buildings.
15:49 harrison i am logging in to 300015
15:49 harrison 30015
15:53 OldCoder harrison, The first connect may take 20 minutes
15:53 OldCoder Unless you use a client with a preloaded cache
15:53 harrison Media...
15:53 OldCoder My clients will all have a preloaded cache
15:53 OldCoder If you get in, save a copy of it
15:54 OldCoder harrison, I will restart this world in 1 to 4 hours with a different set of mods
15:54 OldCoder Therefore you will be interrupted
15:54 OldCoder But ultimately a number of worlds will be running
15:54 harrison oh, i won't stay that long anyhow
15:54 OldCoder 24 hours a day again except for network outages
15:54 harrison not all at once
15:55 harrison i want to look at what you have done
15:55 Jordach joined #minetest
15:55 OldCoder I do not have the credit
15:55 harrison i give you none
15:55 OldCoder harrison, that world belongs to people like Zeg9 and john of minetest
15:55 OldCoder Then what do you mean by
15:55 OldCoder <harrison> i want to look at what you have done
15:55 OldCoder ?
15:55 harrison the server
15:55 harrison i want to look t it
15:55 harrison and also
15:56 OldCoder Anyway I g2g bbl and have fun.... plus harrison I *have* made my small contributions
15:56 OldCoder also what?
15:56 harrison i do give you a bit of credit after all
15:56 harrison for doing whatever it is that you do
15:56 OldCoder very well c u i a b and do not worry about unknown blocks world is under reconstruction
15:56 OldCoder Heh
15:56 * OldCoder laughs out loud
15:56 OldCoder When I understand what I do I will explain it
15:57 Jordach ChanServ, SHUT UP
15:57 * Jordach already dislikes the entry message
16:02 * Jordach pokes sfan5
16:02 SmugLeaf joined #minetest
16:09 Jordach today was good day
16:09 Jordach http://imgur.com/a/VyiEf
16:13 thexyz I wonder if windows will ever get a sane terminal emulator
16:14 thexyz the one which you can copy from, or the one you can resize
16:14 * sfan5 pokes Jordach
16:14 thexyz also, consider "elseif"
16:17 dafull97 joined #minetest
16:18 dafull97 hey all back
16:18 Jordach thexyz, my method works
16:18 Jordach function deal_with_it (mother, fucker)
16:19 Jordach thexyz, > 118 lines too
16:19 troller thexyz, standart have copy in deep menu
16:20 Jordach LuaTerminal in gist form; https://gist.github.com/Jordach/6932906
16:21 Jordach some lines are currently random because i havent finished the,m
16:21 Jordach them*
16:21 FreeFull joined #minetest
16:23 thexyz I'm not sure what's the point of this
16:24 Jordach https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/981
16:24 Jordach thexyz, we don't have cmd at sixth form
16:24 Jordach os.execute works in almost the same way
16:25 sfan5 what if I write an os that uses | to seperate paths
16:26 Jordach sfan5, detectable too
16:26 Jordach elseif package.config:sub(1,1) == "|" then
16:26 sfan5 what if I run lua on an os without a filesystem?
16:26 Jordach sfan5, impossibru
16:26 sfan5 nope
16:27 sfan5 that is entirely possible
16:27 Jordach wait, embedded systems
16:27 Jordach uhm, we would even be able to run the code in that case :P
16:27 sfan5 embedded systems usually use linux
16:27 Jordach Windows CE
16:27 Jordach OH SHIT
16:28 Jordach btw, that issue was found on the sky server
16:29 * Jordach wonders if Jordach can make a Python terminal and start that with the Lua Terminal
16:29 Jordach i put a terminal in your terminal :D
16:39 Jordach pitriss, +1
16:40 pitriss Jordach: thanks, but what i did?:D
16:40 Jordach multispaw
16:41 Jordach +n
16:42 pitriss Jordach: oh thanks:)
16:42 pitriss It is my first (i hope) useful mod:)
16:44 Calinou joined #minetest
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16:54 kaeza Jordach, it's a bad idea to use until command ~= nil
16:54 kaeza nil is used for EOF :P
16:55 sapier joined #minetest
16:55 Jordach kaeza, command is assigned nil until it has data into it
16:55 VanessaE hi all
16:56 kaeza Jordach, if you redirect stdin from a file, and somehow you reach EOF, that loop will keep executing indefinitely until you kill the interpreter
16:56 Jordach kaeza, i = 0
16:56 Jordach start up sets i = 1, because that's how the double repeat works
16:57 kaeza https://gist.github.com/Jordach/​6932906#file-luaterminal-lua-L27
16:58 Jordach kaeza, some users might just press enter
16:58 Jordach or just spaces
16:58 Jordach it's just guarding against the inevitable
16:59 kaeza ...
17:00 * Jordach doesn't like idiots
17:00 Jordach i've basically made it foolproof
17:01 Zeg9 joined #minetest
17:01 kaeza lel
17:01 kaeza http://pastebin.com/tGVaX7vQ
17:01 kaeza BTW, one of my cores was at 100%
17:02 Gethiox2 joined #minetest
17:02 Jordach kaeza, not on Lua 5.1.4
17:03 kaeza $ lua5.1 # Lua 5.1.4  Copyright (C) 1994-2008 Lua.org, PUC-Rio
17:04 Zeg9 Hello
17:05 Miner_48er joined #minetest
17:05 kaeza Jordach, trim whitespace around `command' and compare to ""
17:05 kaeza hey Zeg9
17:09 Jordach kaeza, http://i.imgur.com/CtcFz6V.png
17:09 EvergreenTree Hi Zeg9
17:09 Jordach when task manager starts i always get 100 cpu
17:10 kaeza Jordach, are you redirecting input from a file?
17:10 Jordach kaeza, when Returned to Lua Terminal is printed the loop starts again
17:10 Jordach my terminal allows it's stdin to be shared with other apps
17:10 kaeza k
17:11 Jordach i don't have that cpu issue, wasn't even found on a 64bit dualcore
17:12 noob joined #minetest
17:12 noob why minetest
17:12 VanessaE why not?
17:12 Guest51309 swag
17:13 VanessaE same reason people write open source projects for other program categories.
17:13 Guest51309 no
17:13 VanessaE because someone saw a need and it came about.
17:13 Guest51309 NO
17:13 VanessaE no what?
17:13 dafull97 joined #minetest
17:13 Guest51309 hello
17:13 kaeza wat
17:13 Guest51309 can you talk
17:13 BlockMen joined #minetest
17:14 VanessaE ehm..
17:14 Jordach wut
17:14 VanessaE uh.  yeah.
17:15 kaeza so confuse much noob
17:15 OldCoder joined #minetest
17:15 Jordach he's not in the forums
17:22 Hunterz joined #minetest
17:32 * Jordach wtfs
17:35 BlockMen joined #minetest
17:37 dafull97 hey VanessaE
17:38 VanessaE hi
17:40 dafull97 im npt good in hardware, can you check somthing for me?
17:40 Menche joined #minetest
17:41 dafull97 https://www.olimex.com/Products/OLinuXino/A​20/A20-OLinuXino-MICRO/open-source-hardware -- the cpu in this? like the power Nd
17:41 dafull97 and how good **
17:43 rubenwardy joined #minetest
17:44 deltib joined #minetest
17:45 * VanessaE looks
17:46 VanessaE I couldn't say, I just don't know enough about ARM architecture.
17:46 VanessaE troller and Megaf know more than I do
17:46 rubenwardy Can I make it so I dont get "New posts" for stuff in other language forums
17:47 VanessaE I just ignore those forums altogether
17:47 troller dafull97, odroid.
17:48 VanessaE http://www.hardkernel.com/renewal_2011/main.php
17:48 VanessaE oh that's that fancy dual-CPU board
17:48 Menche https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Com​parison_of_single-board_computers
17:53 dafull97 joined #minetest
17:53 Calinou rubenwardy: I don't think so
17:53 Calinou except if we removed access to these forums for you :P
17:53 rubenwardy lol
17:54 JackGruff joined #minetest
17:54 troller i want board on MediaTek 8-core not-released cpu
17:55 Calinou few things are multithreaded
17:55 MinetestBot GIT: xyzz commited to minetest/minetest: Fix masterserver README.md 7be18657b1 2013-11-04T09:54:25-08:00 http://git.io/Y5helg
17:56 troller Calinou, make -j8
17:57 PilzAdam joined #minetest
17:57 * Jordach is busy with the Lua Terminal
17:57 PilzAdam Hello everyone!
18:00 OldCoder PilzAdam, Hi!
18:00 VanessaE hey adam
18:01 PilzAdam VanessaE, animted gif as avatar: https://forum.minetest.net/vie​wtopic.php?pid=117029#p117029
18:01 VanessaE ok
18:02 Jordach VanessaE, Read Today 6:02:16 pm by Jordach
18:02 Jordach i beat you
18:02 thexyz i removed it
18:03 rubenwardy VanessaE responded at 18:01:51
18:03 VanessaE you didn't fix it though :)
18:03 VanessaE thexyz: isn't the policy to just replace it with a non-animted version?
18:04 VanessaE (interesting he mentioned me...I wasn't here two years ago :P)
18:04 thexyz well if you have much free time feel free to do whatever you want with it
18:04 EvergreenTree joined #minetest
18:04 thexyz deleting them is okay
18:05 Calinou troller: only for that a few other things
18:05 Calinou it won't improve Minetest client/server performance :p
18:05 VanessaE thexyz: ok.  well I already fixed it :)
18:05 troller server- maybe, using emerge threads
18:06 Warr1024 joined #minetest
18:07 rubenwardy Calinou: https://forum.minetest.net/vie​wtopic.php?pid=117051#p117051 correct?
18:09 monkeycoder joined #minetest
18:12 werwerwer joined #minetest
18:13 Calinou O_o no
18:13 rubenwardy ok :P
18:15 VanessaE troller: emergethreads lead to mapblock boundary collisions with on-genereated stuff e.g. chopped-off trees, square edges around snow biomes, etc.
18:16 troller need to split lua into threads
18:18 dafull97 joined #minetest
18:20 MinetestBot GIT: sapier at gmx dot net commited to minetest/minetest: Fix invalid use of pointer to temporary object in json2lua conversion 1a96987d0f 2013-11-04T10:11:11-08:00 http://git.io/YtWp3w
18:20 Menche chopped-off trees have been happening since 0.3 or earlier, don't think that's emergethreads
18:23 kaeza it's cavegen AFAIK
18:23 kaeza or was
18:26 * Jordach has been working on a Lua Terminal for a Computer Craft style mod
18:26 VanessaE Jordach: doesn't digilines mod already have one?
18:26 Jordach VanessaE, not like that
18:26 Jordach it doesnt have Lua Terminals, Luacontrollers are different
18:27 Jordach and My terminal is like your well loved bash shell
18:27 Jordach s/M/m
18:27 VanessaE nono, digilines.  not mesecons.
18:27 VanessaE brb
18:28 Jordach VanessaE, https://gist.github.com/Jordach/6932906
18:29 Jordach PilzAdam, i've been programming in Lua again :D
18:29 PilzAdam !pil Jordach
18:29 MinetestBot Jordach, someone thinks you need to brush up on or learn Lua, please go to: http://lua.org/pil/
18:30 Jordach PilzAdam, already done that
18:30 Jordach for the past 6 houts
18:30 Jordach hours*
18:30 kaeza !pilz adam
18:31 kaeza :<
18:31 Jordach PilzAdam, https://gist.github.com/Jordach/6932906
18:31 Jordach qhoops
18:31 Jordach s/that gist/http://imgur.com/a/VyiEf
18:31 RealBadAngel joined #minetest
18:33 Menche Sorry! We're busy running around with our hair on fire because Imgur is over capacity!
18:33 RealBadAngel hi
18:33 Menche hi
18:33 RealBadAngel sfan5, here?
18:33 Jordach !seen sfan5
18:33 MinetestBot Jordach: sfan5 was last seen at 2013-11-04 16:27:26 UTC on #minetest
18:33 Jordach :P
18:34 RealBadAngel i just pushed some changes to shaders, wanted him to check if hes still having errors
18:34 Menche Jordach uses Windows NT?
18:35 Jordach Menche, i cannot detect individual windows versions
18:35 Jordach but then again all windows are now decendants of NT
18:35 Menche yeah i know :P
18:35 Jordach i used a tiny trick in Lua to find if it's UNIX or Windows
18:37 Menche can determine if it's Windows NT as opposed to Windows 3.1x or Windows 9x?
18:38 Warr1024 that shouldn't be too hard
18:38 Warr1024 will minetest even run on 3.1?
18:43 * Menche has a Fedora Core 2 cd, wonder if that will run minetest.
18:43 Calinou probably doesn't have recent enough irrlicht
18:47 kaeza no love for DOS 5.0?
18:47 kaeza :<
18:48 Menche contest to see how old of an OS you can get minetest running on!
18:48 Warr1024 could be tricky to get djgpp to compile irrilicht, mt, etc. in an environment with no opengl...
18:49 kaeza Warr1024, there's OpenGL for DOS :P
18:49 kaeza well, Mesa
18:49 kaeza or whatever
18:49 Warr1024 hm,
18:49 OldCoder kaeza, Hi
18:49 Warr1024 sounds like an interesting challenge
18:49 Warr1024 freedos might be more conducive to actually working, though.
18:50 kaeza hey OldCoder
18:51 kaeza Minetest using CGA or EGA graphics would be interesting <.<
18:52 vitto joined #minetest
18:52 vitto is possible minetest on game consoles?
18:52 Warr1024 I don't see why not
18:52 Warr1024 if you can find a decent compiler
18:52 vitto on XBLA?
18:52 Warr1024 vitto: wouldn't you have to basically rewrite it in .NET for that to happen?
18:55 Jordach nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope nope
18:55 Jordach C and C++ are usually used on XBLA
18:55 Warr1024 ah, cool
18:56 Jordach !plz Adam :D
18:56 TheLastProject XBLA =/= XNA
18:56 Warr1024 then I guess it would depend on whether irrilicht can be built for XBLA?
18:56 Jordach should be
18:56 Jordach XBOX 360 uses D3D8
18:56 Jordach afaik
18:56 * Calinou hooves^Whands TheLastProject a ≠ sign
18:56 Calinou or !=
18:56 TheLastProject I'd prefer !=
18:56 Warr1024 y'all both wrong.  ~=
18:56 TheLastProject Unicode is bad, mang
18:57 TheLastProject EWWW
18:57 TheLastProject WHAT THE HELL IS THAT
18:57 Warr1024 lua
18:57 TheLastProject That looks like "is about"
18:57 Warr1024 I know, I don't like it either.
18:57 Calinou
18:57 Warr1024 it always bugs me switching between languages that use different != operators.
18:57 Warr1024 at least it beats the old <>
18:57 JackGruff at least it beats PHP :)
18:58 Menche -ne
18:58 Menche ^ bash inequality operator
18:58 Warr1024 ha
18:58 Warr1024 perl uses != for numerical/ordinal inequality, and ne for string inequality.
18:58 Menche well, for integers. != is for strings.
18:59 Warr1024 oh, yeah, that's awesome, perl and sh are backwards.
18:59 Warr1024 how could I forget.
18:59 khor joined #minetest
18:59 Menche hooray for standards
19:00 Warr1024 https://xkcd.com/927/
19:00 kaeza http://zachbruggeman.me/dogescript/
19:00 * Menche was actually thinking of that xkcd comic :P
19:01 Warr1024 kaeza: this is like a dialect of lolcat scripting or something?
19:02 kaeza Warr1024, dogescript :P
19:02 Jordach so well codede
19:02 kaeza such language so modern wow
19:02 Jordach !op
19:03 Warr1024 hey Jordach, maybe you need a DogeTerminal.
19:03 Topic for #minetest is now Website: http://minetest.net |  Rules: be patient, respect other users, here and in other channels | Core Devs: #minetest-dev | Servers: http://minetest.net/servers | IRC Logs: http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/ | Talk like a doge day.
19:03 kaeza so topick wow
19:03 Jordach such idea good
19:03 TheLastProject such topik
19:04 Jordach ...long see how long topick last
19:05 Jordach doge language difficult no
19:05 TheLastProject such Jordach
19:05 Jordach such TheLastProject
19:05 TheLastProject wow
19:06 TheLastProject good #minetest
19:06 Warr1024 hey, anyone know if I can minetest.register_node() a node to use 6d facedir instead of the 4d facedir by default?
19:06 Jordach good RE R34
19:06 Warr1024 (it's ok if you can't answer in doge)
19:06 TheLastProject such programming question wow
19:06 TheLastProject (I would answer but I have no clue)
19:06 Calinou we're still waiting for Minetest R34
19:06 Warr1024 I've been using an on_construct hack.  it's... hacky.
19:06 Calinou use your blender skillz for that
19:07 Jordach such Warr1024 check evergreen minetest tweak mode
19:07 mrtux joined #minetest
19:08 Warr1024 is this a fork or mod or something?
19:08 Jordach such mode yes
19:08 PilzAdam its a mod
19:09 thexyz it seems the quality of conversations in this channel dropped quite a bit
19:09 Warr1024 sorry ddg, I love ya, but google came through with this one...
19:09 PilzAdam thexyz, I blame you
19:09 thexyz PilzAdam: why?
19:09 PilzAdam random
19:09 thexyz ?
19:10 Warr1024 oh, I see.  Evergreen did it on the node placement hook.
19:10 PilzAdam we need to blame someone, so just picked someone random
19:10 thexyz I'm not doing stupid shit like "talking like this meme picture"
19:10 thexyz okay then
19:10 TheLastProject such thexyz
19:10 TheLastProject lol, sorry
19:10 TheLastProject It's addicting...
19:10 TheLastProject >.<
19:11 thexyz bad stuff is
19:13 * TheLastProject shares drugs with thexyz
19:14 vitto #gay
19:15 TheLastProject Oh, darling, if you only knew
19:17 harrison quote
19:17 harrison <thexyz> it seems the quality of conversations in this channel dropped quite a bit
19:17 harrison unquote
19:18 harrison i take full responsibility for it
19:18 harrison i was away for a bit
19:18 TheLastProject I'm sorry? :(
19:18 harrison and you see what happens when i drop the conversational ball (to use a metaphor)
19:19 harrison everything goes to pieces without me
19:19 harrison one's public is so demanding!
19:22 reactor joined #minetest
19:22 reactor o/
19:22 reactor OldCoder: there?
19:22 TheLastProject \o
19:22 TheLastProject \o |
19:22 TheLastProject \o []
19:22 TheLastProject |
19:23 TheLastProject (That was supposed to be someone saying hi and walking away through a door. Meh, fail)
19:23 OldCoder reactor, Hi
19:23 OldCoder Here for a couple of minutes
19:24 reactor mk
19:24 reactor TheLastProject: this is interesting. Please go on./
19:24 TheLastProject reactor: I'm done :|
19:24 reactor s/\///
19:24 OldCoder so present; very interested
19:25 VanessaE reactor: protip:   s:/::
19:25 reactor Eh?
19:25 VanessaE use any other char instead of / for the delimiter if you have to match a /
19:25 reactor Oh, I see.
19:25 reactor Would that work in classic ed?
19:27 Warr1024 s\#\\\#\#\\\\\#g
19:28 Warr1024 as in:  echo \# | perl -pne s\#\\\#\#\\\\\#g
19:28 VanessaE idk, I refer to it as in sed.
19:28 VanessaE I assume other progs that accept sed syntax will accept the full syntax.
19:28 Warr1024 I never liked sed.
19:29 dafull97 joined #minetest
19:29 Warr1024 it was such a PITA until I discovered "perl -pne"
19:30 Miner_48er joined #minetest
19:33 SpeedProg joined #minetest
19:35 khor joined #minetest
19:38 reactor So.
19:38 reactor minetestmapper-cpp cuts the map
19:39 NakedFury joined #minetest
19:39 reactor Can't see the edges.
19:46 dafull97 joined #minetest
19:47 dafull97 keep timing out? :/
19:51 reactor OldCoder: /notice'd you
19:51 OldCoder reactor, That seems to go to random screens for me
19:51 OldCoder I may not be able to find it; better to PM
19:52 reactor So, it's ready. I'm processing some more layers underground, to paste it later to prevent sand and such from falling down.
19:52 reactor Like that?
19:52 theTroy joined #minetest
19:53 dafull97 OldCoder, im bout leave school wont be home for about 1:30mins
19:53 OldCoder
19:53 khonkhortisan joined #minetest
19:56 twoelk joined #minetest
20:04 rubenwardy rector, minetestmapper.exe -help
20:04 Calinou joined #minetest
20:04 rubenwardy see bounds
20:06 Calinou You have a vision; in this vision, you see bounds is a villager!
20:06 PilzAdam may be traitor, though
20:06 Calinou PilzAdam: btw: ##werewolf
20:08 PilzAdam bye
20:08 Calinou PilzAdam, a traitor, has died of an unknown disease.
20:09 reactor A tractor?
20:09 Calinou a reactor!
20:09 reactor No.
20:10 EvergreenTree joined #minetest
20:17 reactor EvergreenTree: o/
20:26 TheLastProject joined #minetest
20:35 Peacock joined #minetest
20:36 Wuzzy2 joined #minetest
20:39 sfan5 meow
20:41 VanessaE woof.
20:41 Peacock moo
20:45 EvergreenTree bark
20:46 MinetestBot beep.
20:46 Peacock http://youtu.be/sh58h9kKp9w
20:46 cisoun joined #minetest
20:46 Jordach for once imgur isnt working D:
20:46 Jordach http://sfan5.dyndns.org/upl​oad/userdata/3/untitled.png KA-BOOWM!
20:47 sfan5 <3
20:47 thexyz bas080: btw the server crashed
20:47 Jordach i actually made the RPG at school, just finished it here
20:47 thexyz bas080: 00:04:23: ERROR[main]: ERROR: An unhandled exception occurred: ServerError: LuaError: error: /home/minetest/ocd/bin/../games​/OCD/mods/wield3d/init.lua:65: calling 'add_entity' on bad self (table expected, got nil)
20:47 sfan5 >at school
20:47 sfan5 wut
20:47 thexyz lol
20:47 thexyz 00:47:16: ERROR[ServerThread]: Serverlist at url servers.minetest.net error (Timeout was reached)
20:47 thexyz can't announce to localhost
20:48 sfan5 heh
20:48 Jordach sfan5, i take a flash pen loaded with blender, lua and some other shit
20:48 thexyz poor thing
20:48 Jordach they can't touch me
20:48 * sfan5 puts a kitten on Jordach which is trained to touch things
20:49 thexyz `touch Jordach`
20:49 sfan5 plol
20:50 Jordach meow
20:50 * Jordach pets MinetestBot
20:50 * MinetestBot purrs... <3
20:50 thexyz <3
20:50 * sfan5 hugs MinetestBot
20:51 thexyz
20:51 sfan5 I'm sure it would be pretty awkward if #minetest would meet in RL :D
20:51 Jordach Mesecon anyone
20:51 Jordach it's a Minetest Convention :D
20:51 sfan5 s/Minetest/MESE/
20:52 thexyz not going to happen, everyone is too far away
20:52 sfan5 yeah
20:53 sfan5 another problem would be that everyone would need to have time
20:53 Peacock or travel money, which judging by the android thread, doubtful lol
20:53 thexyz indeed
20:55 Peacock 3$ vs plane ticket and TSA groping for some... ;p;
20:55 Peacock *lol
20:55 Jordach i'd take the anal fisting over $3
20:55 sfan5 *cough*
20:55 Jordach plol
20:56 Peacock jordach http://youtu.be/yspHR4IxKiU
20:56 Menche !title
20:56 MinetestBot Menche: Beavis and Butthead Do America Cavity Search - YouTube
20:56 Jordach Menche, get Quassel
20:56 Jordach it's way better than fagchat
20:56 Peacock i prefer croissant
20:56 Peacock quassel sounds like a pastry
20:58 thexyz just use irssi
20:58 Menche what's a CTCP VERSION?
20:58 ShadowNinja I think irssi is dead.
20:58 thexyz because?
20:59 ShadowNinja Menche: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#ctcpversion
21:02 Peacock irssi "client of the future" but it looks like it was written to run on a terminal for old VGA screens lol
21:02 dafull97 joined #minetest
21:03 sandman joined #minetest
21:06 Peacock though i still prefer xchat to hexchat, hexchat has to be configured to use system colors :/
21:07 thexyz but it's cool
21:07 thexyz it can run on anything
21:07 thexyz and at the same time it's convenient to use
21:07 Peacock yeah but ...OCD lol can't have a bunch of apps with different visual styles lol
21:07 thexyz so I don't see anything wrong with it being "written to run on a terminal for old VGA screens"
21:08 Peacock like walking into a neighbourhood with semi-detached, bungalows, 2-stories and mcmansions all on the same narrow street lol
21:08 thexyz (I don't think it's true to start with)
21:08 thexyz well, I wasn't talking about xchat or hexchat
21:08 Peacock well i think the slogan could be something else, looking at screenshots it doesn't feel like the client of the future
21:09 thexyz hah
21:09 thexyz judging programs by screenshots is totally unnice
21:09 Peacock well its the first thing people do, that or look up it's wiki page
21:09 thexyz this doesn't mean it's the right thing to do
21:09 thexyz people do many crazy things
21:10 Peacock that's what the removal of safety labels is for - population control XD
21:12 Peacock well in Europe its the lack of speed limits, but it amounts to the same lol
21:12 thexyz we should deprecate irc and use xmpp
21:13 Peacock isn't that a linux music player?
21:13 thexyz (we as in "humanity")
21:13 thexyz nice joke but it's "Extensible Messaging and Presence Protocol"
21:13 sfan5 !g irc vs xmpp
21:13 MinetestBot sfan5: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/4149380/what​s-the-best-open-protocol-for-chat-room-software
21:13 Warr1024 xmpp "chatrooms" aren't really as mature/stable/full-featured as irc's.
21:14 Warr1024 xmpp's better for point-to-point than multicast
21:14 Peacock xmms, acronyms, keeping track of them is a fulltime job lol
21:15 Cerise joined #minetest
21:16 Peacock anyone heard the joke around 99' about the Millenial Year Assembly Software Suite?
21:17 Peacock slightly different version here: http://www.joke-archives.com/Y2k/newsoft.html
21:18 thexyz Warr1024: well, yeah; still it's got nice features IRC will never have
21:18 thexyz like decentralization
21:19 Peacock so netsplits dont happen?
21:20 thexyz of course something like this could happen if a big jabber server goes offline for some reason
21:21 thexyz not just "could", it happens; it's impossible to live without netsplits
21:22 thexyz but decentralization is good because you don't need multiple accounts, i.e. one at freenode, one at rizon, etc, etc
21:22 Warr1024 thexyz: you mean it's technically infeasible not to have them, or do you mean that you can't imagine the travesty that life would be without glorious netsplits?
21:23 Menche joined #minetest
21:23 thexyz Warr1024: the former
21:23 thexyz and you don't have hacks like "chanserv" or "nickserv"
21:24 thexyz because it's built into the protocol
21:24 sfan5 good night
21:25 Megaf joined #minetest
21:27 thexyz Warr1024: but the latter is somehow true too
21:27 thexyz because the only way to eliminate netsplits is to destroy the internet
21:27 thexyz and then all PCs
21:28 BlockMen left #minetest
21:28 roboman2444 joined #minetest
21:28 roboman2444 joined #minetest
21:31 Menche left #minetest
21:31 Menche joined #minetest
21:42 ganoo joined #minetest
21:55 Warr1024 hey, any reason why saplings aren't group:flora?
21:56 Warr1024 seems like all the other planted growing things are
22:05 Gronx joined #minetest
22:06 Gronx Does anyone know if ghostshell is still active in the community?
22:12 n4x joined #minetest
22:15 Leoneof joined #minetest
22:28 dafull97 kaeza, got a few questions
22:29 kaeza ...and?
22:29 kaeza do not ask to ask; just ask
22:29 dafull97 what happend to the low end server?
22:30 kaeza what server?
22:31 dafull97 mcbride.homelinux.net
22:31 kaeza !up mcbride.homelinux.net
22:31 MinetestBot mcbride.homelinux.net:30000 seems to be down
22:31 kaeza :?
22:31 kaeza the server's up though
22:32 kaeza kizeren must be having DNS issues again
22:32 Peacock my ISP's dns sucks even more, i use googles' now lol
22:33 Peacock for a long time i couldn't figure out why system updates weren't downloading until i changed dns's lol
22:34 VanessaE holy crap, I just tried out 0.3.3 just to check something...  IT IS INSANELY FAST compared to 0.4.x
22:34 Peacock isn't that what i said about mt classic? :P
22:35 Peacock and people say the old mapgen was slower (poppycock)
22:35 VanessaE I mean the rendering engine
22:35 VanessaE it's insanely fast
22:35 VanessaE it never drops below 60 fps even in situations that would make 0.4.x chokle
22:35 Peacock well do you have all the same mods you run on the latest version?
22:35 VanessaE choke*
22:35 dafull97 left #minetest
22:35 VanessaE I'm talking about open land with just dirt and trees, 0.4.x can't even begin to keep up with this
22:35 Peacock there were some 0.4.x versions where i got 60 FPS, but most of the versions, it's averaged around 20
22:35 VanessaE wtf went wrong?
22:35 dafull97 joined #minetest
22:36 Peacock either 0.4.3 or 0.4.4 was really fast for me
22:36 Peacock 0.4.5 no, 0.4.6 yes
22:36 Peacock which is why it took me a long time to update from 0.4.6 lol
22:37 Peacock as for what went wrong, who knows? lol try tracking down which new feature caused what lol
22:38 Peacock liquids (normal and not normal) are a major source of game lag for me now
22:40 sapier left #minetest
22:43 Peacock how do these algea pods look?
22:43 Peacock http://s23.postimg.org/5lixra​3rv/screenshot_625485183.png
22:43 dafull97 yes, look good
22:44 Peacock thining they should be a little more... round?
22:44 Peacock http://solar.calfinder.com/ass​ets/images/blog/algae-farm.jpg
22:57 FreeFull What in minetest is round?
22:58 Exio4 everything
22:58 Exio4 the blocks are round, fix your eyes!
22:59 Exio4 VanessaE: welp!
23:00 stormchaser3000 joined #minetest
23:00 stormchaser3000 hi
23:01 stormchaser3000 hunter
23:01 stormchaser3000 go to freenode.net then enter the chanel #stormchaser3000
23:03 dafull97-afk joined #minetest
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23:42 jecs joined #minetest
23:42 jecs were can i download minetest ?
23:43 ShadowNinja jecs: minetest.net/download
23:43 jecs thank you :)
23:47 rdwrer joined #minetest
23:49 rdwrer left #minetest
23:52 MinetestBot GIT: ShadowNinja commited to minetest/minetest_game: Revert dig time in creative mode to 0.5 1d4eb43f26 2013-11-04T15:46:39-08:00 http://git.io/ualq_g
23:53 Peacock http://youtu.be/WWaLxFIVX1s
23:54 Peacock actually i dont mind, but also, those infinite stacks are driving me nuts when im testing machines lol
23:55 ShadowNinja Yes, I use UI and creative so I get infinitestacks of 99.
23:55 ShadowNinja +' '
23:55 Peacock normally i have my fork of UI too, but my new space game is totally from scratch, and just noticed how infinite stacks are annoying lol
23:56 Peacock id rather creative stacks were like 1K instead of 99
23:58 kaeza https://forum.minetest.net/vie​wtopic.php?pid=117080#p117080 is this guy teaching paramat how to mapgen?
23:58 kaeza lol
23:58 Peacock he doesn't need help with the actual mapgen bits :P
23:58 Peacock though he could save alot of time by modularising certain bits he uses in all his mods (i noticed)
23:59 Peacock like how some mods are voxnipples and others use regular ongen
23:59 kaeza I've seen many mods containing stuff that could be useful to other mods as well, but is not "exported"

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