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IRC log for #minetest, 2013-10-09

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:02 us}0gb Is there someone here who wouldn't mind helping me understand perlin noise?
00:03 JesseH Hi us}0gb
00:03 DMackey joined #minetest
00:03 JesseH I can help, whats up
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00:04 us}0gb Hello! Fancy seeing you in this channel.
00:04 us}0gb noise_params = {offset=0, scale=1, spread={x=100, y=100, z=100}, seed=0, octaves=3, persist=0.70}
00:04 us}0gb I have these noise parameters, but I don't know what any of them do.
00:04 JesseH Oh, I thought you meant perlin noise in general
00:05 JesseH MT has perlin noise api?
00:05 us}0gb If you could help me understand perlin noise in general, it would probably help as well.
00:05 us}0gb Minetest has at least a couple API features that use perlin noise.
00:06 us}0gb I'm trying to implement almost everything in the API to understand it better, so now I have to face the perlin noise that I was avoiding.
00:07 JesseH Well you generate random numbers, within a grid. There are many methods, but basically you create random numbers, and the surrounding numbers are randomized, then shifted and randomized some more based on other surrounding pixels and its just a whole mess of confusion which is explained  well here http://freespace.virgin.net/h​ugo.elias/models/m_perlin.htm and here http://webstaff.itn.liu.se/~stegu/TNM0​22-2005/perlinnoiselinks/perlin-noise-
00:07 JesseH math-faq.html
00:08 JesseH Perlin noise are used for like, terrain generators
00:08 us}0gb Okay, I'll start my search there. Thank you!
00:08 us}0gb Yeah, in this case, I'm using them to generate clouds.
00:09 us}0gb I figured out the cloud node, now I just have to place them in the sky.
00:09 JesseH Oh neat
00:10 JesseH I will know more about the api and such one of these days.
00:10 JesseH Just need to commit time to it.
00:10 us}0gb The noise parameters used as an example in the API documentation work well for this, but if I just copy the numbers, I haven't really learned anything.
00:11 JesseH Where is the documentation at for this?
00:12 us}0gb https://github.com/minetest/mine​test/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt
00:13 JesseH ty
00:13 us}0gb No problem.
00:33 us}0gb Whatever the "octaves" parameter is, setting it to 16 crashes the game.
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00:50 VanessaE I'm off to bed.  night all.
00:53 us}0gb Good night!
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01:32 zat there should be a way to make rollbacks more efficient
01:36 JesseH rollbacks?
01:37 zat yes I said that
01:37 JesseH Not sure what roll backs are
01:37 JesseH was wondering
01:39 zat /help rollback < can help
01:39 Menche rolling back player actions
01:39 JesseH Oh I see
01:40 Menche i think starting a new log file once it reaches a certain size would help
01:40 Menche and just search back through the files one at a time, newest first
01:56 ShadowNinja Menche: It needs more than that. grep is dozens of times faster than /rollback_check, and provides more usefull results.
01:57 ShadowNinja Maybe even 100x faster
02:01 Menche wonder why that is
02:03 us}0gb Maybe /roolback_check should implement grep whenever it is installed on the system and fall back to the current method if it isn't.
02:03 us}0gb */rollback_check
02:03 ShadowNinja Mebe because it loads the whole file in memory and then iterates overi
02:03 ShadowNinja t?
02:04 Menche split files should help if that is the case
02:04 ShadowNinja us}0gb: Very hacky.
02:04 us}0gb Hmm. My bad then.
02:04 ShadowNinja Menche: That isn't fixing anything, it will still be just as slow.
02:05 Menche it should be faster in some cases
02:05 Menche if the latest action for some node is in the latest file, the older ones wouldn't be checked
02:06 Menche if a player places a node, then later removes that node, does rollback store 2 actions?
02:06 ShadowNinja Yep.
02:07 Menche removing previous duplicate actions would make the file a bit smaller
02:07 Menche ofc the 2nd action should be kept if it's a different player
02:07 ShadowNinja But you can't afford to check the whole file on every action, or even recent ones.
02:08 us}0gb Hmm. It sounds like rollback itself might not be implemented well. Maybe bot hackily, but not well.
02:08 us}0gb *not
02:08 ShadowNinja All of these are similar: They don't actually fix it. The best idea is to just fix it.
02:09 us}0gb RIght.
02:09 us}0gb THough that would require having someone who cares enough to rebuild it, possibly from the ground up.
02:09 Menche what about separate log files for each player?
02:10 Menche then removing negated actions wouldn't be as slow
02:10 Menche and rolling back a specific player would only read from that player's log
02:11 Menche maybe make each action readable by minetest.deserialize()
02:12 Menche into a table with player, action, oldnode, newnode, and time fields
02:15 Peacock would there be apple pie?
02:17 ShadowNinja Menche: nonononono, That format is very verbose and slow.
02:18 zat ...grep
02:18 zat why not using SQL?
02:18 zat storing actions in a well indexed SQL table?
02:18 Menche ShadowNinja, slower than the current way?
02:18 ShadowNinja zat: Speed.
02:19 Menche ...why not a table
02:19 Peacock might as well add owner info and timestamp to map data :P
02:19 zat ShadowNinja: not using SQL because of ...speed?
02:19 zat MIND = BLOWN
02:19 Menche alongside map.sqlite
02:19 ShadowNinja Menche: Yes, likely hundreds of times slower.
02:19 Menche what, the table?
02:19 ShadowNinja Yes Menche.
02:19 Menche using a table like that would be slower than searching plain text?
02:20 Peacock would tables indexed by x,y,z be faster than blobs? mewonders
02:20 Menche storing it in a database using whatever backend is configured would probably be better
02:21 ShadowNinja Database maybe, but not the map db.
02:21 Menche in a db alongside the map db
02:21 zat In normal production environments I use to replace thousand of values, using nested queries matching at least five indexed columns. In seconds...
02:22 Peacock nested queries = oodles of fun :P
02:22 zat A SQL table, with proper indexes, is by far superior to anything plain-text based
02:22 ShadowNinja I once wrote a Lua rollback mod with luasql, but I needed to set nodes in unloaded areas.
02:22 zat rollbacking whole days might take seconds
02:23 Peacock map table: x,y,z,nodeid,nodemeta, nodeowner, timestamp, instead of the block/blob format
02:24 zat primary index: nodeowner, timestamp
02:24 zat index: x, y, z
02:24 zat index: nodeid
02:24 Peacock for a seperate table yeah
02:24 Peacock i was just musing about incorporating that data into the map table itself
02:24 zat yes I was thinking in the... log table
02:25 zat I think there should be a separate table for a historical log
02:25 ShadowNinja http://shadowninja.minetest.net/mods/rollback.tgz
02:25 zat the map table should always reflect the current state of the map
02:26 zat wtf I downloaded that at 7.8mbps D:
02:26 Peacock the map table reflects blocks and blobs if im not mistaken, which is why rollback takes until the second coming of jesus to complete
02:27 zat ShadowNinja: that file had nothing
02:28 zat it probably represents the current state of a SQL implementation? :DDDDDDDDD
02:29 ShadowNinja http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6212014/
02:30 ShadowNinja It worked, but ignored unloaded blocks.
02:30 Peacock doesn't LVM handle unloaded blocks?
02:31 ShadowNinja Peacock: Yes, but I need to set param1/2 and meta also.
02:32 Peacock hm, that sucks
02:32 Peacock so you'd have to run the thing in every area of the map
02:32 Peacock another way might be to learn and manipulate the map db directly, tho i dont see how that could be faster than default rollback
02:34 zat Peacock: what is the so big difference between querying a SQL table and greping a plain text file?
02:35 Peacock how do users get away with doing so much damage though? default interact?
02:35 ShadowNinja I could open map.sqlite, but that would mean a lot of code to load and save mapblocks, and sounds like a good way to corrupt a db.
02:37 Peacock this is why i limit douches to a small area of the map until theyve shown i can trust them, and even then i have 3 levels of interact
02:37 Peacock douche, not-a-douche, and admin areas
02:37 Naked its too easy to mess in minetest
02:38 Naked in this type of games
02:38 zat The slow part seems to be gathering all the actions the player did, isnt it?
02:38 Peacock yes, and the ridiculously inefficient ban system doesn't help
02:38 Peacock kaeza uses xban i think
02:39 Peacock zat prolly bigger logs than debug log yeah lol
02:39 NakedFury the problem is that we dont have an extra layer of security against douches
02:39 zat well then, save actions to a SQL table, and when rollbacking query all the actions from the table. I dont see the problem.
02:39 Peacock we need doucheguard
02:40 Peacock best thing i/anyone can do really is segregate users to different areas based on trust level
02:40 NakedFury requiring a forum account can help a little since the douche would need to waste time creating a new account.not definitive but helpful
02:41 Peacock yeah universal minetest credentials would help, along with some sort of user/admin rating/karma
02:41 zat NakedFury: yes, waste... when a server requires me to participate in a forum also, next....
02:41 NakedFury it would also help ingame if blocks placed/created by players took three or even four times as long to dig up by other players
02:42 Peacock zat well consider the most interesting servers instead aren't listed publicly, so you dont have to create a forum account, but you dont get to play'em either lol
02:42 NakedFury hey I didnt say the best but its better than the simple way we have now
02:42 zat so what about my last message about rollbacking from sql?
02:42 Peacock nakedfury ideally you dont want other players digging those blocks at all, but then again, you dont want them placing it all over your shit either
02:43 NakedFury then make it hard. five times as hard to dig up even with the best tool and impossible to build upon'
02:44 Peacock theres no perfect solution lol the multiplayer aspect of the game is good, but people make it suck lol
02:44 NakedFury yeah
02:45 Peacock having server passwords might fix that for invite-only servers
02:45 NakedFury it can help a lot
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02:46 NakedFury even better for player specific server passwords so a player cant just tell the password to a non invited player
02:46 Peacock course it has to be a password you can easily change in the server tab, but then youd still have your server listed at least (for dynamic ip and such)
02:47 NakedFury add a lock type icon for password protected servers
02:47 Peacock well, if you trust your players, you should trust who they invite, otherwise change the password and dont give it to either of them lol
02:47 zat so what about my last message about rollbacking from sql?
02:47 NakedFury every online multiplayer game with servers have this
02:47 NakedFury no idea about sql
02:47 NakedFury sorry that I cant help with that
02:48 Peacock me neither, dont see how setting up a seperate db is any faster than the default rollback
02:48 zat I know about SQL, though I just started with Lua and never implemented anything SQL with lua.
02:48 zat Peacock: querying the actions would be fast
02:49 zat in the current rollback implementation, the bottleneck is at gathering the data to rollback
02:49 zat with SQL indexes that bottleneck is giantly reduced, if not almost eliminated.
02:55 Peacock im not familiar enough with rollback to really say, i try to find ways to prevent douches from doing that much damage in the first place
02:56 zat ok if all rollback mechanism is purely Lua code I might try to implement a SQL log for rollback, and try it.
02:56 Peacock heck my server is only half creative, not everyone has the creative inventory
02:59 zat must go sleep kisses to all
03:00 us}0gb Good night!
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03:47 Khaaaaaaaaaaaan https://i.chzbgr.com/maxW500/7837163008/hED279960/
03:51 us}0gb Wow. Nice.
03:52 us}0gb I think I found some decent parameters to get cloud generation both in the sky and on the ground. The sheet ore type I'm using is a little strange, so it looks a little strange, but I think it works well enough.
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05:35 sfan5 noo
05:35 sfan5 MinetestBot is not there
05:36 * us}0gb begins searching under the couch cushions for MinetestBot
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07:45 GNADev|zRokh hi JesseH
07:45 JesseH GNADev|zRokh, :D
07:45 JesseH sup
07:51 VanessaE hi all
07:51 JesseH Sup VanessaE ^_^
07:51 JesseH How are you?
07:52 VanessaE I'm awake at ~4 am.  Nuff said? ;)
07:52 JesseH It's almost 4am for me :P
07:52 JesseH 8 more minutes! (or so)
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07:59 reacktor o/
08:00 reacktor Is it possible to do world-specific texture packs?
08:00 VanessaE not directly, but you can of course replace the various mods' textures
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08:11 JamesTait Good morning all; happy World Post Day! :-D
08:11 VanessaE hi
08:12 JamesTait Hey VanessaE! :)
08:14 reacktor o/
08:17 JamesTait VanessaE, I'm assuming minetest has absolutely nothing to do with OpenLDAP libraries, right?
08:18 VanessaE not that I know oif
08:18 VanessaE of&*
08:18 * JamesTait prepares to file a bug against Ubuntu Update Manager.
08:19 JamesTait It does seem like a very strange dependency, if there is one.
08:20 JamesTait I see nothing in the depends for the PPA package.
08:20 JamesTait Yet Update Manager has the OpenLDAP libraries update grouped under Minetest.
08:20 VanessaE odd
08:20 * JamesTait files the bug.
08:22 JamesTait Ah, but this is interesting - ldd output *does* list libldap_r-2.4.so
08:23 JamesTait I still think the grouping is a bug, though.
08:23 VanessaE very odd, as it's not listed among the official dependencies
08:24 VanessaE maybe a dep of a dep of...  somewhere down the line
08:25 VanessaE my build shows that too (kerberos?)
08:25 VanessaE oops
08:25 VanessaE my build shows that too
08:26 VanessaE plus some stuff related to kerberos?
08:26 VanessaE http://pastebin.com/vPAkZ7xm
08:26 VanessaE (self-compiled, system install, from a couple of days ago)
08:26 JamesTait Yep, I see the krb stuff as well.
08:33 JamesTait https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+​source/update-manager/+bug/1237277
08:37 VanessaE why does MT even use that stuff?
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08:53 JamesTait I have no idea. :(  Unless it's something in the build recipe or something.
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09:27 john_minetest Hello everypony
09:27 VanessaE hi
09:29 john_minetest phew... university
09:36 VanessaE ?
09:37 Weedy joined #minetest
09:40 VanessaE bbl
09:41 reacktor Is there any tool for automating buildings' decay?
09:42 reacktor It takes too long to draw realistic destruction.
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09:57 reacktor john_minetest entered uni?
09:57 john_minetest yeah
09:57 john_minetest computer science, first semester
09:58 john_minetest We learn stuff like "The sky is always green implies that I am coding 24/7" is a true statement...
10:00 john_minetest Oh, I hope minetest gets shaders soon
10:00 reacktor It's already slow.
10:01 reacktor I hope it will have option to disable them.
10:01 reacktor It does, last time I checked.
10:01 reacktor s/does/did/
10:01 reacktor john_minetest: computer science eh. I have related speciality.
10:01 reacktor I mean, I'm studying for a degree in related area.
10:02 john_minetest There IS a disable option for shaders. Else minetest won't be cool.
10:02 john_minetest Lol, people say minecraft is better because of the forge modloader.
10:02 reacktor So I hope it will be retained :)
10:02 reacktor People are dumb.
10:02 john_minetest Yeah
10:03 reacktor <fine-print> 95% of them. We omitted the rest 5% </fine-print>
10:03 john_minetest oooh, seems ShadowNinja's server is down
10:03 reacktor By the way, john_minetest, what do you think of solid state physics?
10:05 john_minetest sounds like a mix of physics and geology
10:05 john_minetest at least that what I have found about it on wikipedia
10:05 john_minetest !up minetest.org 30000
10:06 ShadowBot john_minetest: minetest.org:30000 seems to be down
10:06 reacktor Well, while it does deal with geological matters, it's not much of geology
10:06 reacktor s/matters/matter/
10:07 john_minetest I have seen some geology stuff and it is a lot about crystal structures and stuff
10:07 john_minetest Anyways...
10:08 john_minetest Computer science is barely about computers (we call it informatik [information+mathematics]) here.
10:09 reacktor Oh, only computers.
10:09 reacktor I thought you're gonna be related to applied math.
10:11 john_minetest informatik is more maths than computers
10:12 reacktor How about theoretical physics?
10:12 john_minetest atm we do logics and logarythms and stuff.
10:13 john_minetest no physics
10:13 reacktor At all?
10:14 john_minetest nope. just looked at the list for all semesters. no physics there. BUT it is possible to take it as a secondary thing.
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10:20 john_minetest Lol, people told me that minetest will die because we have no forge modloader and every minecraft clone needs the forge modloader or it won't work properly... :D
10:20 reacktor Ha.
10:20 reacktor They're morons.
10:21 reacktor As mentioned above, most people are just unfit for thinking.
10:21 reacktor Don't try arguing with them, it sucks in.
10:22 john_minetest They don't realize that minecraft->minetest is a difference like battlefield 3 -> openspades
10:22 reacktor Yep.
10:23 reacktor Wait, they opensources Ace of Spades?
10:23 john_minetest They are also computer science students so they should have at least a basic intelligence but somehow intelligent people can sometimes be dumb...
10:23 reacktor s/es/ed/
10:23 john_minetest yeah, there is a OSS aos clone
10:23 reacktor mk
10:23 john_minetest it works with the aos servers
10:23 reacktor a fork of the old aos?
10:23 reacktor oh
10:23 reacktor I should try AoS sometime.
10:23 john_minetest It is a complete rewrite
10:23 john_minetest iirc
10:24 john_minetest Uses GL and epic shaders but the sounds and similar are strange when you are used to the normal client
10:24 john_minetest Also the sun is very bright
10:26 reacktor idk, my groupmates still can't accept the fact they need UNIX for scientific computations
10:27 reacktor Otherwise intelligent. Probably afraid of changes.
10:32 Exio4 wut
10:33 Exio4 hi reacktor :P
10:45 reacktor Exio4: o/
10:46 reacktor Exio4: have we met before?
10:46 Exio4 yes reactor
10:52 reacktor Oh.
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11:25 reacktor does worldedit have capability to set facedir?
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11:53 Hunterz is possible delete all entity, which are on map after deleting for example animals mod?
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11:57 dafull97 Hey
11:59 sfan5 Hunterz: /clearobjects
12:01 Hunterz thanks, this clear whole map or only active chunks?
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12:06 sfan5 whole map
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12:10 john_minetest why is animal mod so buggy? The animal entities are sometimes black
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12:21 dafull97 FAGS
12:22 dafull97 mad bro???
12:23 dafull97 assholes!
12:24 reacktor Do slabs turn into blocks when placed together?
12:24 john_minetest reacktor: yeag#
12:24 john_minetest *yeah
12:24 reacktor Or some "double slab", like in MC?
12:24 john_minetest iirc it makes blocks
12:25 reacktor Good! I always had to worry about consistency.
12:25 john_minetest or... wait
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12:27 john_minetest yeah, it forms blocks
12:27 john_minetest this doesn't work in creative mode but in normal mode it works
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12:29 dafull97 fucking retards\
12:29 dafull97 HAHAHA
12:30 sfan5 john_minetest:
12:30 sfan5 thats not the mod, its the engine
12:30 john_minetest How exactly does it work?
12:30 john_minetest Why doesn't it work properly in creative mode?
12:30 dafull97 by being a asshole
12:31 john_minetest sfan5: ^
12:31 dafull97 john_minetest: asshole
12:31 dafull97 LOL
12:32 sfan5 all entities have the same lightning
12:32 dafull97 liar
12:32 john_minetest oh, you mean about the animals
12:32 john_minetest I thought you meant the slabs
12:32 john_minetest :D
12:32 john_minetest *talk about
12:33 dafull97 liar!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!\
12:33 reacktor Black holes?
12:33 john_minetest sfan5: any idea why 2 slabs -> block doesn't work in creative?
12:34 reacktor They're the ultimate ass holes. Geometrically.
12:34 sfan5 no
12:34 dafull97 suck it!
12:34 john_minetest anyways, gtg now.
12:34 john_minetest cya later
12:35 dafull97 better retard!
12:35 dafull97 sfan5 you a ass fucked retard
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12:37 dafull97 was kicked by sfan5: dafull97
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12:43 reacktor Yes. Black holes do kind of suck in.
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12:59 VanessaE hi all
13:00 VanessaE wtf was the above all about?
13:03 Hunterz is possible make breaking nodes in the creative mode slower?
13:03 VanessaE no clue how
13:03 Hunterz very often I destroy more block than need
13:03 VanessaE but I know it's possible - Unified Inventory does this.
13:04 Hunterz ah
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13:06 Hunterz anyone have isse with sea mod - not working noair around water plants
13:06 Hunterz ?
13:06 VanessaE never used it
13:07 ibloat VanessaE, don't mind me running around your server btw, trying minetest for the first time, am apparently missing a few textures (or my checkout is broken :))
13:07 VanessaE it's fine
13:08 VanessaE not you can build.  read the rules, no griefing, etc. etc. etc.
13:08 VanessaE now*
13:09 Hunterz when enable announce server, is automatically on servers.minetest.net ? or must someone approve?
13:09 VanessaE yes
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13:12 ibloat VanessaE, awesome, thank you! will read the signs now that the textures have loaded
13:13 ibloat also no griefing of course
13:13 VanessaE the forum post has the rules, the signs are there for people who don't know the forum exists :)
13:13 VanessaE https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=7017
13:13 ibloat ah yeah i read the forum post first :)
13:14 VanessaE ok
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13:30 ibloat hm my notebook doesn't cut it, will try again later from a bigger machine
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14:27 VanessaE !seen zeg9
14:27 VanessaE bah.
14:27 VanessaE why can I never remember the syntax for that command
14:28 VanessaE oh, it ain't here.
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14:32 kahrl oh, that's why I couldn't open any sites! Adfeno turned off the internet. https://forum.minetest.net/vie​wtopic.php?pid=113697#p113697
14:32 VanessaE haha
14:32 VanessaE I saw that :D
14:33 reacktor is it possible to make the fog less tight?
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14:33 VanessaE tight?
14:34 VanessaE O.o
14:34 VanessaE I never knew fog could get loose......
14:35 VanessaE one thing I would, however, like to see, is that it be tuned a bit so as to hide distant mapblock edges.
14:35 VanessaE (at present, this fails somewhat)
14:36 reacktor yep
14:37 reacktor I mean, less thick.
14:37 VanessaE less dense, right
14:37 reacktor without it the map edge is seen, with it I can see too little
14:37 VanessaE sounds like you more or less want the same thing I just said :D
14:41 reacktor yep
14:41 reacktor it could probably get its density from the current draw distance
14:42 VanessaE kahrl: I'd like to make a change to minetest_game such that this sort of code:  https://github.com/minetest/minetest_gam​e/blob/master/mods/farming/init.lua#L180  gets replaced by code of this form:  https://github.com/DanDuncombe/​mushroom/blob/master/compat.lua
14:42 VanessaE since pilz isn't around (and it somewhat resistant to changes to minetest_game) I figured I'd just kinda toss it out there.
14:43 VanessaE basically, the latter code only redefines the parts of the nodes that actually need changed.  Novatux did this in pipeworks to very good effect, and I've echoed it to mushrooms ^^^ and to one of dan's other mods.
14:44 reacktor oh wait
14:45 reacktor it already did reduce density
14:45 reacktor somehow
14:45 reacktor that's weird.
14:46 VanessaE reacktor: it adjusts back and forth to try to keep your fps near 60 or whatever you configured it to
14:49 PilzAdam joined #minetest
14:49 VanessaE ha!
14:49 VanessaE thou hast been summoned!
14:49 PilzAdam Hello everyone!
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14:59 reacktor VanessaE: I know, I'm talking about the fog.
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15:10 JamesTait What is the significance of the ':' prefix to the node name in minetest.register_node?  e.g. minetest.register_node(':default:grass', foo)
15:10 JamesTait Does that redefine default:grass, or do the two coexist?
15:10 PilzAdam redefine
15:11 VanessaE one should never redefine a whole node.
15:11 PilzAdam its not possible that 2 nodes have the same name
15:11 VanessaE always use Novatux's method.
15:11 PilzAdam VanessaE, what is Novatux's method?
15:12 VanessaE PilzAdam: https://github.com/DanDuncombe/​mushroom/blob/master/compat.lua
15:12 JamesTait PilzAdam, but the two strings are different: ':default:grass' vs 'default:grass'.  Note the prefix on the former.
15:12 VanessaE see what I did there in the mushrooms mod
15:12 VanessaE basically, you copy the node, edit the one entry or field you need to edit, then redefine the node with the edit in place.
15:12 JamesTait Note also that I'm not a Lua programmer, let alone a minetest modder. :)
15:12 PilzAdam how is that "Novatux's method"?
15:12 VanessaE PilzAdam: because he's the first person I saw to use it, and did so in Pipeworks
15:12 VanessaE (for chests and furnaces)\
15:13 PilzAdam in which mod was that?
15:14 VanessaE the one I just linked to?  dan duncombe's mushrooms mod
15:14 PilzAdam ehm, that mod is 4 days old; very unlikely that this method wasnt used before that
15:15 VanessaE eh?
15:15 VanessaE I said it was in pipeworks beore
15:15 VanessaE before*
15:15 PilzAdam where did Novatux use it first?
15:15 VanessaE in pipeworks, unless he did it before that, even
15:16 cisoun joined #minetest
15:17 PilzAdam https://github.com/VanessaE/pipeworks/commi​t/863b82b242c8b434dcfa1ba97178a002a944e3c4 here?
15:17 Jordach joined #minetest
15:18 VanessaE yup that's it
15:18 VanessaE unless he's used that method previously, that's the one I speak of
15:18 PilzAdam hmm... IIRC I used that before
15:18 VanessaE I've taken to using it anywhere that a node gets redefined if it makes sense.
15:18 VanessaE well then use it :)
15:21 PilzAdam there: https://github.com/PilzAdam/item_drop/blame/b5d48​c50c2da27fdeeab03db50cc94c158022c37/init.lua#L143
15:21 PilzAdam 2013-02-01 vs. 2012-08-31
15:21 VanessaE looks similar enough
15:21 * PilzAdam wins
15:22 VanessaE still I call it novatux's because it's his code I use rather than yours :)
15:24 VanessaE either way you should use that code in farming, rather than redefining the whole nodes like you do now
15:24 PilzAdam why?
15:24 PilzAdam it doesnt matter if its in the same game
15:24 PilzAdam game gets loaded first
15:24 PilzAdam *game mods
15:24 VanessaE in case someone resets things to force another mod to load farming first?
15:24 VanessaE or default gets changed?
15:24 PilzAdam so you, as a modder, shouldnt care at all
15:24 VanessaE e.g. duplicated code is bad, mmkay?
15:25 VanessaE remember the issue moreblocks had?
15:25 VanessaE it redefined some nodes but had outdated defs
15:25 PilzAdam dont mess up external and game internal mods
15:26 VanessaE so the nodes looked wrong
15:26 VanessaE just trying to prevent a recurrence of that
15:26 zat joined #minetest
15:26 VanessaE well still
15:26 VanessaE you're duplicating code
15:26 VanessaE you should not do this.
15:29 PilzAdam well, that can always happen, even if farming wouldnt redefine the ndoes
15:29 PilzAdam *nodes
15:29 PilzAdam oh god, I lag :-/
15:30 VanessaE true
15:30 VanessaE and wherever it happens, needs to be worked on
15:30 VanessaE I did this in mushrooms and animated_furnaces so as not to break pipeworks and whatever might redefine dirt
15:31 PilzAdam as I said: we are in a game here, so you can be sure that all mods get loaded before the external mods
15:31 VanessaE (I took it one step further in the furnace and redefined the one texture entry that needed it)
15:31 VanessaE well I guess.
15:31 PilzAdam and: I prefer speed over avoiding code duplication
15:31 PilzAdam making a copy of tables takes longer than just typing them out
15:32 VanessaE I doubt the speed of startup is significantly affected :)
15:40 PilzAdam bbl
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16:19 thefamilygrog66 joined #minetest
16:19 thefamilygrog66 bonjour mes amis
16:21 ShadowNinja Calinou: Fix moreblocks to load it's config from minetest.conf or a file in the world directory using Settings().
16:21 GNADev|zRokh joined #minetest
16:23 GNADev|zRokh hi JesseH
16:25 Calinou ShadowNinja: maybe, but doesn't doing that have downsides?
16:26 GNADev|zRokh Calinou: do you like 2D RPG games
16:26 GNADev|zRokh (SingleP and MultiP)
16:27 JesseH sup GNADev|zRokh
16:27 GNADev|zRokh PM!!!
16:28 ShadowNinja Calinou: Not that I know of, but _config.txt certainly has it's downsides, and it should be named config.lua.
16:28 Calinou .txt allows it to be opened by windows easier
16:28 Calinou GNADev|zRokh: no
16:28 Calinou .cfg and .lua both can't be opened on windows by default
16:29 JesseH ?
16:29 ShadowNinja Calinou: .cfg? .conf>.cfg But don't expect anyone to modify files in the moddir.
16:30 ShadowNinja Calinou: And you can always have defaults for people that us windows(And don't run a server)
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16:32 JesseH You're not supposed to do anything in windows...
16:33 Calinou same thing about .conf
16:36 ShadowNinja Calinou: ^ You don't need to worry about windows users modifying config settings.
16:37 Calinou why not?
16:38 Calinou anyway I'm probably going to migrate settings to minetest.conf, yeah
16:38 Calinou it's not like most Minetest power users use windows anyway :P
16:38 thefamilygrog66 wtf is a minetest power user?
16:39 Calinou active players that make mods or tweak them
16:39 Calinou or someone that plays Minetest without setting a FPS limit :>
16:39 * thefamilygrog66 uses windows, and also linux
16:40 thefamilygrog66 I also enjoy making/tweaking modsl
16:40 thefamilygrog66 *mods
16:41 Calinou the problem is, how do I set a default value?
16:41 Calinou since I'm going to read from minetest.conf
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16:43 ShadowNinja Calinou: Check if setting_get returns nil and set it to the default value if it does.
16:44 Calinou at the beginning?
16:44 Calinou minetest.setting_set(setting_name,value): is that right?
16:44 thefamilygrog66 nice windows user generalizations, though. @@
16:46 thexyz why do you need to set it?
16:46 ShadowNinja local moreblocks.wood_facedir = minetest.setting_getbool("wood_facedir")
16:46 Calinou yep, lua_api.txt
16:46 ShadowNinja if moreblocks.wood_facedir == nil then moreblocks.wood_facedir = true end
16:46 thexyz local my_awesome_variable = minetest.setting_get("asd") or "my_default_setting"
16:46 Calinou oh
16:46 ShadowNinja thexyz: That doesn't work with bools.
16:47 rubenwardy Hi all
16:47 ShadowNinja local a = minetest.is_yes(minetest.setting_get("a") or "true") would work.
16:47 ShadowNinja Hello rubenwardy.
16:48 rubenwardy See https://github.com/rubenwardy/capturetheflag/​blob/master/mods/capturetheflag/init.lua#L47 calinou
16:48 Calinou hi rubenwardy :)
16:48 rubenwardy what you guys up to?
16:48 troller joined #minetest
16:49 Calinou modding
16:49 Calinou <ShadowNinja> Calinou: Fix moreblocks to load it's config from minetest.conf or a file in the world directory using Settings().
16:49 thexyz ShadowNinja: setting_get returns string or nil so I don't see the point in that
16:53 ShadowNinja thexyz: That provides a one-line default value for boolean settings.
16:53 thexyz and with setting_getbool you can use `setting_getbool() or false` (default value is false) or `setting_getbool() ~= false` (default value is true)
16:53 rubenwardy I am making a mod
16:54 rubenwardy A little clue: its folder name is "osmapgen"
16:54 thexyz so I dunno why would you want to make extra call to is_yes
16:54 ShadowNinja Hmmm, that works too...
16:55 thexyz or use `not not setting_getbool()`
16:55 thexyz it's 1 char shorter
16:57 zat http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8acmD2jyQo
16:57 thexyz probably should add it to dev wiki
17:02 IceCraft joined #minetest
17:02 rubenwardy http://www.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/
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17:36 rubenwardy brb
17:38 john_minetest zat: lol
17:39 zat john_minetest: lol
17:40 Peacock in other lols: Greece demands war reparations from Germany, South African gov't bans floss <resume scanning news>
17:42 Peacock though the first article seems to be based on information a year old, must be a slow day at National Post lol
17:42 zat floss... sounds famiiar to me
17:43 Peacock http://news.slashdot.org/story/13/10/09​/1648218/south-african-education-depart​ment-bans-free-and-open-source-software
17:43 Peacock people imply bribes, i think they just got tired of opening documents made in OO, saved in MS format, and improperly rendered in MS office lol
17:44 Peacock (which was a problem for my sister's schoolwork and job applications)
17:45 Peacock in local news: quebec cop investigating bikers arrested for selling information to.... the bikers (epic lol)
17:48 zat the FLOSS news game me cancer
17:48 IceCraft joined #minetest
17:49 zat wtf I just compiled the last Minetest commit and it looks more like Minecraft.
17:49 zat Different textures and lightning looks better
17:49 Calinou finished doing the setting stuff
17:49 Calinou 19:49:11: ERROR[main]: /home/calinou/.minetest/mods/moreores/init.lua:13: unexpected symbol near '.'
17:49 Calinou :<
17:50 Peacock http://news.nationalpost.com/2013/10/09/s​tray-calgary-kitten-boards-transit-rides-​rails-to-new-home-with-ctrain-employee/
17:51 Peacock canadian cats are becoming self aware and rising up
17:51 ruskie all hail the cats
17:52 Peacock soon they'll be taking our jobs, how are we supposed to compete with a species that will work for cookies and petting?
17:52 Peacock especially as employers would love the opportunity to pet without the subsequent sexual harassment lawsuit
17:53 sfan5 lolwat
17:53 Peacock <still on my second coffee> :P
17:56 Peacock "Congress is scraping rock bottom, with a ghastly approval rating of 5%."...http://i2.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/00​0/007/666/_57c8a1a431a592af806925e57258202f.png
18:02 thexyz Calinou: where's the code? it looks like you're talking about an error you get but at the same time there's no code; it seems like you forgot to attach it perhaps?
18:03 Calinou http://paste.ubuntu.com/6214785/
18:03 Calinou trying to move moreores settings to minetest.conf as requested by ShadowNinja
18:03 Calinou line 13 is first line
18:03 thexyz uhh
18:03 Peacock yeah that is confusing lol
18:04 thexyz why don't you do as I suggested
18:04 thexyz local moreores.mithril_chunk_size = minetest.setting_getbool("mo​reores_mithril_chunk_size") or 8
18:04 thexyz instead of those two lines
18:04 Peacock use pastebin and lua highlighting next time :P
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18:05 thexyz anyway, I'd suggest to make a table which holds default values for keys and loop over it
18:05 thexyz {["mithril_chunk_size"] = 8, ["tin_chunk_size"] = 7}
18:05 thexyz your code won't look like a mess
18:06 PilzAdam joined #minetest
18:07 Peacock momma's always naggin' me about cleaning up my code, but i like it this way
18:07 thexyz mom knows better
18:07 Peacock hehe
18:08 thexyz I wonder what the error is
18:08 Peacock beats me, everything looked fine
18:08 Dan_D joined #minetest
18:08 thexyz well, to me everything looks unfine
18:09 Zeitgeist_ joined #minetest
18:09 thexyz because you can replace this with just one simple pretty for loop
18:09 Calinou don't know how to do that loop
18:09 thexyz okay, I can show you
18:10 Calinou I still get the same error btw :P
18:10 Peacock code itself yeah but the actual error with it, beats me lol
18:10 Calinou http://paste.ubuntu.com/6214807/
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18:10 Peacock whats the error say?
18:11 thexyz also meh
18:11 thexyz you use settings_getbool
18:11 Peacock isn't bool true or false?
18:11 Calinou oh, that's the issue
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18:11 Peacock also, you renamed all your variables to mithril :P
18:12 Calinou still get the same error
18:12 Calinou oh that too
18:12 thexyz Calinou: http://bpaste.net/show/139126/
18:12 * Peacock starts calinou's coffeemaker
18:12 Dan_D left #minetest
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18:13 thexyz now you should go deeper and create a NESTED LOOP! over "mithril", "tin", "silver", etc
18:14 thexyz that will be your homework assignment
18:14 zat inception!
18:14 thexyz but there's not much point in that anyway
18:15 thexyz I'd rather have a table for every mineral which defines all its properties as well as default settings
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18:21 jojoa1997 VanessaE, you there
18:22 Peacock hm, unless something changed between yesterday's git and today's git, my mouse lag from yesterday may actually be related to minetest_game
18:24 zat That actor guessing feature seems to be a serious issue of the rollback efficiency.
18:25 Peacock still on about rollback? :P
18:25 Peacock did you try your sql thing?
18:25 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
18:25 zat I am on that Peacock
18:26 zat understanding the code to make it write to a sqlite table instead
18:26 Peacock does lua do databases? or do you need a system package for that?
18:26 zat lua should... however, that part of the code is cpp
18:26 jojoa1997 is anyone here on VanessaE's server irc
18:27 Peacock well in any event you can always do os.execute and write the db stuff in any faster language
18:28 Sokomine a better rollback would be great
18:28 Peacock well i still dont know how it would be better than the builtin rollback, but its always worth a shot
18:28 zat I am going to write it in server.cpp
18:28 Sokomine i don't know why the mt-code is so slow there. doing a grep on the plain text file the engine writes for rollback is faster by factor 10
18:29 zat but.... are guessed actions included in actual rollbacks?
18:29 zat someone knows?
18:29 Peacock well i dunno if its reading the rollback log that takes a while or cycling through the map db
18:29 Calinou 20:29:04: ERROR[main]: /home/calinou/.minetest/mo​ds/moreores/init.lua:254: bad argument #1 to 'setting_get' (string expected, got nil)
18:29 Sokomine at least they're listed in the file
18:29 Calinou :/
18:29 Peacock calinou missing an or <value>
18:30 Sokomine so if water starts flowing because someone placed a source somewhere, that gets listed with the water-source-placer as culprit
18:30 Peacock i guess that error means the settings' not there
18:30 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
18:30 Sokomine hi jojoa
18:30 Peacock he's been popping on and off for a while now :P
18:30 Calinou http://paste.ubuntu.com/6214891/
18:31 Peacock ahh
18:31 Peacock tonumber
18:31 zat Peacock: I am going to find now what makes it slow
18:31 Peacock its gonna give you an error if the settings' missing i think
18:31 ShadowNinja Calinou: Move the closing for tonumber to just after setting_get
18:32 Calinou I don't get it
18:32 Peacock calinou kinda messy but try this: http://pastebin.com/zLu08a9w
18:33 Peacock oups line 21 should read moreores[key] = newval
18:33 Calinou still get same error
18:33 Calinou ah
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18:33 Calinou nope
18:33 Peacock still error?
18:34 Peacock what does the error say? (and disregard the code i sent then lol)
18:34 Calinou oh, wait
18:34 Calinou it's on line 256
18:34 Peacock for which code? lol
18:35 Calinou http://paste.ubuntu.com/6214903/
18:35 Calinou such as ^
18:35 Peacock which is line 256?
18:36 Peacock judging from the error message
18:36 Peacock moreores_tin_chunk_size is nil
18:36 Peacock :254: bad argument #1 to 'setting_get' (string expected, got nil)
18:36 Calinou oredef = {clust_scarcity = minetest.setting_get(moreores_silver_chunk_size) * minetest.setting_get(moreores_silver_chunk_size) * minetest.setting_get(moreores_silver_chunk_size),
18:36 Calinou that's 256
18:37 PilzAdam its nil apparently
18:37 Peacock moreores_silver_chunk_size is nil yeah
18:37 PilzAdam how about adding some ""
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18:37 Calinou oh
18:37 Peacock lol
18:37 Peacock ok i thought that was *supposed* to be a variable
18:39 Calinou 20:38:50: ERROR[main]: /home/calinou/.minetest/mo​ds/moreores/init.lua:256: attempt to perform arithmetic on a nil value
18:39 twoelk joined #minetest
18:39 Peacock well if the settings' not set, it will be nil
18:40 Calinou silver_chunk_size = 11,
18:40 Calinou in your loop thingy
18:40 PilzAdam use (tonumber(minetest.setting_get(...)) or 1)
18:40 cisoun joined #minetest
18:40 Calinou why 1?
18:40 Sokomine hm. why is my mt version now 0.4.6-541-<id>-dirty?  the dirty may be understandable...after all i was testing current git with my modification
18:40 PilzAdam "moreores_silver_chunk_size" != "silver_chunk_size"
18:40 PilzAdam whatever default value you want instead of 1
18:40 Calinou loop: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6214925/
18:41 Peacock yeah but in this: http://paste.ubuntu.com/6214903/ he performs arithmetic on minetest.setting_get(moreores_tin_chunk_size), not the variable
18:41 Calinou http://paste.ubuntu.com/6214927/
18:41 Calinou how the ore def looks now ^
18:41 Peacock try replacing minetest.setting_get("moreores_silver_chunk_size") with the variable you set earlier
18:42 Calinou which variable?
18:42 Calinou just removing the quotes won't work
18:42 Peacock moreores.silver_chunk_size
18:43 Peacock because you set the variables with default values, you didn't actually set the settings, and youre doing arithmetic on settings which may or may not be there
18:43 thexyz just use http://bpaste.net/show/139126/
18:43 Calinou still happens
18:44 thexyz meh
18:44 thexyz I don't like to say things similar to "how about you go read docs" but it seems I should do that now
18:45 Peacock try http://pastebin.com/gdgw49N5
18:46 Calinou works
18:46 Calinou thanks
18:47 Peacock np
18:50 Calinou problem with moreblocks, this doesn't work: local moreblocks.wood_facedir = minetest.setting_getbool("​moreblocks_wood_facedir") or true
18:50 Calinou unexpected .
18:50 Peacock is facedir supposed to be bool?
18:50 Calinou yes, it's a setting
18:50 Calinou if false then wood will not use facedir
18:51 Peacock wait, its the unexpected . error
18:51 zat local moreblocks.wood_facedir ??????
18:51 zat maybe for the local
18:51 thexyz that's not how you should use it with getbool
18:51 Peacock oh yeah, try dropping the local
18:51 Calinou doesn't work with local
18:51 Calinou 20:51:25: ERROR[main]: /home/calinou/.minetest/mo​ds/moreblocks/init.lua:23: attempt to index global 'moreblocks' (a nil value)
18:51 thexyz if you want it to be true when not defined you should totally use `moreblocks.wood_facedir = minetest.setting_getbool("​moreblocks_wood_facedir") ~= false`
18:52 Calinou that's weird
18:52 thexyz because otherwise it'll always be true
18:53 Taoki Noticed something interesting: Even if I enable full view range, certain nodes which appear to me as solid nodes of their correct type are detected as "ignore" by Lua scripts
18:53 Taoki I wonder why that is
18:54 thexyz because view range has nothing to do with what blocks are actually loaded
18:54 Taoki Ah. So the server can drop a chunk while you might still be seeing it?
18:55 thexyz sure why not? it has no idea about what blocks are you seeing
18:56 Taoki I'm noticing it with my Structure I/O system, for importing and exporting buildings via schematics. It's a node which detects 3 markers parallel to it, in order to know which area to edit. I'm trying a distance of 68 blocks. But even if I see the 3 markers from a given angle, the node still doesn't detect them, and sees ignore
18:57 Peacock active block range?
18:58 Calinou still get unexpected symbol with that ~= thingy
18:58 thexyz yeah you need active_block_range
18:59 thexyz Calinou: post actual error and your code
18:59 Calinou 20:58:36: ERROR[main]: /home/calinou/.minetest/mo​ds/moreblocks/init.lua:23: unexpected symbol near '.'
18:59 Calinou local moreblocks.wood_facedir = minetest.setting_getbool("​moreblocks_wood_facedir") ~= false
19:00 thexyz you can't have `local` here
19:00 Calinou not having local causes this:
19:00 Calinou 21:00:33: ERROR[main]: /home/calinou/.minetest/mo​ds/moreblocks/init.lua:23: attempt to index global 'moreblocks' (a nil value)
19:00 thexyz and this is because it's not defined yet
19:00 thexyz where is it defined?
19:01 thexyz it should be defined before you use it
19:01 ShadowNinja Calinou: Add moreblocks = {} to the top if init.lua.
19:01 Calinou oh moreblocks = {} works
19:01 Calinou did it
19:01 Calinou now wood doesn't orient :(
19:02 Peacock taoki simple solution, when a user sets down a marker, store the pos in table indexed by playername, then the block doesn't need to remain loaded
19:03 Taoki Peacock: Hmm... that might be a good idea. Will think about something similar
19:03 Peacock just be sure to clear the entries once they've done something with it, otherwise the table will get fat and buy a mobility scooter
19:04 ShadowNinja Calinou: cHANGE "if wood_facedir then" to "if moreblocks.wood_facedir then"
19:04 ShadowNinja Change*
19:04 Calinou now I don't think ores generate too
19:04 Calinou if minetest.setting_getbool("​moreblocks_wood_facedir") == true then
19:04 Calinou I'm using this
19:04 Calinou why wouldn't it work?
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19:05 ShadowNinja Calinou: Now it disablef facedir by default.
19:05 ShadowNinja Use ~= false if you want it to be true by default.
19:06 Calinou nope
19:06 fairiestoy Hey guys, fast question related to ABMs. If i registered an ABM for a node, which is not in the current loaded mapchunk(s), is the ABM still running ( means iterating through the nodes )?
19:06 Calinou no
19:06 Calinou obviously...
19:07 PilzAdam fairiestoy, it doesnt execute any Lua code
19:07 fairiestoy Thats not my direct question
19:07 PilzAdam so there shouldnt be a noticeable slowdown
19:07 fairiestoy So it is anyway running?
19:07 PilzAdam no, "running" means executing Lua code
19:09 Peacock abms play catchup when you enter an area :p
19:09 fairiestoy Alright, i got what you want me to tell anyway. Thanks for the info :3
19:09 PilzAdam iterating through a block to find nodes takes like no time in core
19:10 Calinou <_< I wasted ~3 hours just for a "code correctness" thingy that doesn't work
19:10 Calinou ubuntu all the way
19:10 fairiestoy PilzAdam: But why using it, if you could use another system of the API?
19:10 thexyz next time read the docs
19:11 PilzAdam fairiestoy, hm?
19:11 thexyz instead of wasting ~3 hours
19:11 Calinou won't work
19:11 Calinou I did read the docs
19:11 fairiestoy For example furnaces or more likely the toolworkshops from technic. Why not using NodeTimers on demand instead of shooting blind on nodes where it is not needed?
19:12 Calinou I reverted the changes (kept them in another folder) and rotating wood still doesn't work
19:13 PilzAdam fairiestoy, there isnt really a difference
19:13 Peacock nodetimers = minetest.after = on global step i think
19:13 PilzAdam Peacock, no, not at all
19:13 Peacock no?
19:14 PilzAdam nodetimers are defined in core
19:14 Peacock so what is the difference with abms then?
19:15 Peacock i guess nodetimers have their own age and abm's operate on all the nodes of a given group/name
19:15 PilzAdam nodetimers are useful for e.g. the bones mod, where the bones get "public" after 10 minutes
19:16 Peacock hmm pretty much what i figured, so... plants technically should use nodetimers rather than abms
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19:20 john_minetest but is it efficient?
19:20 john_minetest a timer for every plant...
19:20 fairiestoy You mean having 200 single Timers running or an ABM controlling behaviour?
19:20 john_minetest yeah
19:20 Peacock dunno, never tried nodetimers, did try git minetest_game yesterday, the only game to lag my mt (minimal and my game still fine) so maybe
19:20 fairiestoy Same question came up in my mind
19:21 john_minetest for maximal 100 bones on a server it might be okay. But what's about thousands of plants
19:21 john_minetest ?
19:21 Peacock by the same token, you can always set os.time in a node meta and the abm could check that
19:22 Peacock meta int should be easier on the engine than meta string
19:24 fairiestoy But thats what i (for example) want to avoid. Making lua checks on each node within the abm. Its not much performance, but maybe performance one could save
19:24 Peacock well nodetimers must be storing the time somewhere
19:25 Peacock how is the question
19:25 Peacock last time i wondered into the engine source, i had to leave a trail of breadcrumbs to find my way back, so i dont know lol
19:27 Peacock quick gander through githubs' search of source, seems like the time is stored in the map itself
19:28 ShadowNinja Yep, it's stored in tth MapBlocks.
19:29 ShadowNinja As in meta.
19:29 Peacock so yeah, more efficient that the abm/meta route
19:29 Peacock oh, in meta?
19:29 ShadowNinja is*
19:29 Peacock oh ok
19:29 Peacock though im guessing meta goes through some sort of serialization ?
19:29 ShadowNinja At least I think so...
19:29 ShadowNinja Yep.
19:30 Peacock v3s16 ... nodetimers can be negative?
19:31 ShadowNinja v3s16 = position.
19:33 Peacock ah yes: NodeTimer getNodeTimer(v3s16 p){     <-- overlooked the p lol
19:34 Peacock more coffee XD
19:36 fairiestoy Peacock, shouldn't line 84 be relavant for you?
19:37 PilzAdam bye
19:39 Peacock line 84 of what? lol
19:40 fairiestoy Oh my bad ._. Of nodetimer.h  If you go back the routing which is called on each step, you will know how the nodetimers work
19:41 Peacock dont have the whole file loaded, i just did a GH search
19:41 Peacock brb, must steal cat poop
19:46 roboman2444 joined #minetest
19:52 dhbiker joined #minetest
19:52 Peacock bach
19:55 Peacock hm, why are femen protesters always the last people  you'd want to see topless? (Spain's parliament this time lol)
20:17 zat ERROR[main]: ERROR: An unhandled exception occurred: ServerError: LuaError: error: ...t/bin/../mods/technic/unifi​ed_inventory/internal.lua:131: bad argument #1 to 'next' (table expected, got nil)
20:17 zat &%#&%&$#
20:35 ShadowNinja zat: Update, recent versions don't even have next.
20:37 zat pulling, thx
20:39 Peacock "Gulf states to start ‘medical tests’ to ‘detect’ and stop gays trying to enter country" ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aq-G4HATiC8
20:42 TheLastProject joined #minetest
20:44 Peacock theres an even funnier piece about how Charles Manson deduced from a Beatles album that a race war was coming lol
20:49 chlue joined #minetest
20:53 TheLastProject joined #minetest
21:05 bas080 joined #minetest
21:17 bas080 joined #minetest
21:29 zat well... I can insert actions in a sqlite file.
21:33 Menche joined #minetest
21:34 Menche minetest-classic
21:34 Peacock zat howcome?
21:34 Peacock menche, what about?
21:34 * Menche meant /join
21:34 Peacock lol
21:34 Menche gah
21:34 Menche my irc client switched windows and cleared the text box as i was typing the command :P
21:35 Peacock you've been outed as a traitor, you can expect the obsidian order to be paying you a visit XD
21:35 zat Peacock: My game inserts values in a sqlite file at the same time it uses the rollback.txt file
21:35 Peacock thats okay, i often type minetest commands here not realizing i didn't shift focus lol
21:35 zat now I have to adapt the rollback functions to gather the data to rollback from the table
21:35 Menche yep, the other irc window has "/join #" still in the box :P
21:35 Peacock zat you can disable rollback though
21:35 Menche lol
21:36 zat Peacock: yes I can but the code does not seem to be much friendly to change a rollbacking backend
21:36 Menche ...anyone know how to get xchat to not switch focus on me? :P
21:36 Peacock i recently downloaded minetest classic myself, wanted to play around with it's sourcecode, figured it would be easier than the current maze lol
21:37 Menche classic just got 3d torches, signs, and doors
21:38 Peacock and slabs
21:38 Peacock if they decide to put in some sort of binary/cpp api, i might seriously consider porting my shit to that
21:41 Peacock not that i dont like the current mt, but development seems abit random
21:41 Peacock and mt classic actually boasts about bugfixes lol
21:42 Menche ?
21:42 Peacock mt classic focuses abit more on bugfixes
21:43 Peacock here's its kinda: can't-reproduce/dont-know-the-cause/wontfix
21:46 Peacock and non-core people dont bother trying to come up with a fix because they doubt their pulls would be taken seriously lol
21:46 Peacock (imo)
21:48 ShadowNinja Menche: Use a different client like quassel. :-)
21:48 Taoki Do we have anything like the bone meal? Something to make saplings grow faster
21:48 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
21:48 Menche don't think so
21:49 ShadowNinja Nope, maybe in a mod.
21:51 Taoki ok
21:51 Peacock bone meal? sounds like KFC without the chicken lol
21:52 Menche They sell it boneless now. Seen their annoying "I ate the bones!" ads?
21:53 Peacock how motherfuckin' dumb do you have to be to eat the bones?
21:53 Peacock though considering in the US a woman successfully sued for being served hot coffee (the horror), i guess i shouldn't be surprised lol
21:54 Peacock though KFC is thoroughly inedible now compared to when i was kid lol
21:59 john_minetest lol, what large fastfood chain sells stuff with bones?
22:01 Peacock well any chicken place i would presume lol
22:01 Menche McNuggets?
22:01 Menche "chicken"
22:02 Menche some of that McStuff may contain bits of ground, chemically dissolved bones, idk
22:04 Peacock have you seen the video about how mcnuggets are made?
22:04 Peacock (from a pink paste type of crap)
22:05 Menche mechanically separated, chemically sanitized, then colored and flavored so it's half edible?
22:05 Menche i think they stopped using that stuff after people started finding out
22:06 Peacock i somehow doubt that lol
22:06 Peacock you know how it turns pink right? exposure to ammonia gas
22:07 Menche yeah
22:07 Menche they need to sanitize it or something due to how they separate it, i think
22:07 OWNSyouAll_DESKT joined #minetest
22:07 Peacock and thats why i avoid mcd's chicken lol
22:08 * Menche likes to avoid mcd's *
22:08 zat mcd's chicken is not such, does not exist.
22:08 zat undefined symbol, got it?
22:08 Ritchie joined #minetest
22:08 zat such idea wont link......
22:09 zat ...eh
22:09 zat http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8acmD2jyQo
22:09 Peacock though having worked in the cheapest and most expensive restaurants, i try to avoid eating out whenever i can lol
22:09 Menche !title
22:09 ShadowBot Menche: title [--no-filter] <url>
22:09 Menche !title http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8acmD2jyQ
22:09 ShadowBot Menche: HTTP Error 404: Not Found
22:09 zat It is a video about response codes
22:09 Menche how did that work?
22:10 Menche or was that MinetestBot that could do that?
22:26 * Peacock serves mcnuggets
22:33 Pelayo joined #minetest
22:35 * Sokomine inspects them critically
22:36 Sokomine do you have other food to offer? a pizza perhaps?
22:37 Menche this is minetest. we cook rats alive and eat them. (at least back in 0.3)
22:49 Sokomine how does horizontal tee work now?
22:49 Sokomine no, rat cooking is forbidden
22:50 * Sokomine handles menche a piece of paper from the mod protection organization
22:50 Sokomine also it's forbidden to kill non-hostile mobs :)
22:56 NekoGloop joined #minetest
23:05 Menche joined #minetest
23:19 Peacock yay, just freed up 120 gigs lol
23:20 Peacock (remind me to turn off full allocation in deluge lol)
23:29 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
23:30 Pelayo joined #minetest
23:31 jojoa1997 hi
23:31 VanessaE hi all
23:31 VanessaE did I miss anything good? :)
23:33 Peacock well Calinou stripped and danced to Right Said Fred - I`m Too Sexy
23:33 Peacock apart from that, nothing much
23:34 VanessaE lo
23:34 VanessaE lol
23:35 Peacock (let's hope he doesn't read the logs lol)
23:37 Miner_48er joined #minetest
23:38 jojoa1997|PC joined #minetest
23:38 jojoa1997|PC Hello
23:39 us_0gb joined #minetest
23:39 jojoa1997|PC hi us_0gb
23:40 us_0gb Hollo, jojoa1997!
23:40 Wuzzy2 joined #minetest
23:40 us_0gb *Hello
23:40 Peacock jojoa, you have dishonoured yourself and your house, you must perform the Mauk-to'Vor
23:41 jojoa1997|PC ?
23:41 us_0gb Peacock, what is "the Mauk-to'Vor"?
23:41 Peacock just kidding, no need for ritual suicide
23:41 jojoa1997|PC probably japanese for an honorable suicide
23:41 Peacock lol
23:41 Peacock good guess
23:41 Peacock klingon for honorable suicide
23:41 jojoa1997|PC samuris would kill themselves witha  blunt blade(through the stomach) if their masters told them too
23:41 Peacock though you get someone else to do it for you
23:42 us_0gb Hmm. Dishonor is never a reason to die.
23:42 Peacock of course, otherwise bankers would off themselves in record numbers lol
23:42 us_0gb Of course, "everybody does it" might be a valid reason to die. It's the only reason to die I've found so far.
23:42 jojoa1997|PC though what did i do to dishonor myself
23:43 Peacock i was just kidding jojoa lol
23:43 Peacock apart for a few mod issues this morning (EST), #minetest's been pretty slow today
23:44 us_0gb I'm having too much fun with the ore-placing function, even though I still have no idea what the noise parameters do.
23:44 Peacock i never figured out noise either lol
23:44 Peacock just one of those random things that work
23:44 us_0gb I'm going to place a few stratospheric and cosmic entities with it. Then I'll move on to actual ores.
23:45 jojoa1997|PC what do you mean ore placement
23:45 us_0gb Peacock, the problem with not understanding it is that it's hard to find a combination of numbers that work.
23:45 us_0gb minetest,register_ore(). I'm using it on things that aren't ores.
23:45 us_0gb *.
23:45 Peacock well paramat has a pretty good handle on noise, and all his mods use it, so i'd study those
23:46 us_0gb Unless I know what each number means individually, studying other peoples' code won't help.
23:47 Peacock i had the same problem with noise :P thats why i suggest studying how people use them, rather than what they might mean
23:48 us_0gb How people use them gives me more combinations of numbers. It doesn't help me figure out how to create my own combinations of numbers. So basically, I'd just be copying paramat's code.
23:49 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
23:49 Peacock so you want to make your own noise generator?
23:50 Peacock that's even more complicated than understanding where the current numbers come from XD
23:50 us_0gb No, I want my own noise parameters.
23:50 Peacock ah shit i can't help you there, people on mt-dev might be more help
23:50 us_0gb I want to use the built-in noise generator, but use my own input numbers, not copy someone else's numbers.
23:50 jojoa1997 i leave for 5 seconds and i come in on a confusing conversation
23:50 jojoa1997 oive
23:50 us_0gb jojoa1997, we literally said nothing while you were away.
23:51 jojoa1997 oh
23:51 Peacock jesus cries whenever you touch it, jojoa
23:51 jojoa1997 then i was still busy elsewhere
23:51 jojoa1997 Peacock touch what
23:51 Peacock LOL nevermind
23:51 jojoa1997 :(
23:51 us_0gb Don't listen to Peacock. Jesus dies ages ago and can no longer generate tears.
23:51 Peacock i ain't said nothing - Al Capone
23:51 us_0gb *died
23:52 jojoa1997 also to you linux users i admit i kinda like windows more than ubuntu right now but..
23:52 jojoa1997 not that much and i still love windows
23:52 us_0gb Ubuntu is kind of bad. You need a better GNU/Linux distribution.
23:53 Menche i'd probably recommend Mint to a newcomer
23:53 Menche has a more traditional desktop environment
23:53 us_0gb Such as, if you are after one with proprietary applications, Xubuntu.
23:53 jojoa1997 bleh i have had enough trouble fixing my pc after installing ubuntu on my external hdd
23:53 jojoa1997 i think i am fine with what i have
23:53 Peacock Mint is the easiest one to get used to
23:53 Peacock but if you dont like fucking around in the guts too much, stick to windows :P
23:54 jojoa1997 im a fast leraner
23:54 jojoa1997 learner
23:54 Peacock were all fast learners, but there is such a thing as learning useful skills :P
23:54 jojoa1997 yeah
23:54 Peacock and there are a shitton a linux admins/devs available for hire already
23:54 jojoa1997 and i dont need to be one of those
23:55 Peacock no, because then you'd have to give up bathing or any chance of getting the sex
23:56 Peacock heck even proprietary programmers have a hard time with that, and they have soo much more money lol
23:58 us_0gb joined #minetest
23:59 us_0gb Sorry, router failure.]

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