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IRC log for #minetest, 2013-06-28

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:00 PilzAdam we need a ban hammer, and we need it NOW! http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=96988#p96988
00:00 * Kacey is having beef ramen noodles
00:00 PilzAdam this guy is a serious troll
00:00 PilzAdam ^ VanessaE
00:01 Kacey ooh god
00:04 Menche so I'm not the only one annoyed by Duncombe's persistent top-posting http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=96894#p96894
00:22 Mallot1 Don't forget to subscribe: www.youtube.com/user/Djcyberslash
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00:33 VanessaE PilzAdam: I don't see anything there that suggests being banned, not if his post of March 22 ( http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=78000#p78000 ) is allowed to stand, anyway.
00:36 VanessaE he's just irritating as usual is all.
00:36 arsdragonfly|pho Menche are you there?
00:36 VanessaE lamefun:  yeah, if you see this in the logs.  You're irritating :P
00:39 PilzAdam VanessaE, oh, and this really belongs into a minetest forum?
00:40 VanessaE moved to the offtopic section.  and imho it doesn't belong, but I'm not the forum admin and my opinion on that matter seems to be of little value.
00:42 * khonkhortisan walked by Kacey's beef ramen noodles at the store and got chicken instead
00:43 Kacey we need more ramen!
00:43 VanessaE mmmmmm ramen ahh
00:54 Mallot1 guys...
00:54 Mallot1 DONT
00:54 Mallot1 FORGET
00:54 Mallot1 TO
00:54 Mallot1 SUBSCRIBE :D
00:55 Mallot1 www.youtube.com/user/Djcyberslash
00:56 Mallot1 was kicked by VanessaE: don't.  forget.  to.  STOP. ADVERTISING.
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00:56 Mallot1 okok i get it no more squirrel jokes :3
00:58 harrison a squirrel walks up to the door of a nightclub and the bouncer asks the squirrel "....
00:58 hmmmmmm joined #minetest
00:59 Mallot1 how many squirrels does it talk to screw in a light bulb? :3
00:59 Mallot1 *take
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01:03 hdastwb http://xkcd.com/776/
01:10 Kacey heh
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01:15 Kacey bb
01:15 Kacey bbl
01:16 PilzAdam bye
01:32 Kacey joined #minetest
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01:36 Kacey iiiiiiiiiiiiiim back
01:36 * Kacey gives the kitten generator some more bones
01:37 Kacey but sadly, it has been dormant for so long that it will be a while before it makes anymore kittens
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01:58 ShadowNinja -_- Greifers.
01:58 ShadowNinja Hmmm, Mallot1 you say...
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02:05 Mallot1 what ShadowNinja?
02:06 ShadowNinja Mallot1: Someone with your nick greifed my server.
02:06 ShadowNinja ... It was you...
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02:08 Mallot1 w h no!!
02:08 Mallot1 I wasnt on today
02:08 Mallot1 are they still on?
02:09 ShadowNinja No, rollback fixed most of it. But they had the same IP as you...
02:09 Mallot1 oh
02:09 Mallot1 was it today? cause i wasnt on today
02:10 Mallot1 can i put that out
02:10 Mallot1 *and
02:10 Mallot1 and i put that out
02:10 ShadowNinja Nope, all fixed.
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02:21 ShadowNinja LazyJ: Fix your connection.
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02:34 LazyJ ShadowNinja, I wish I could.
02:35 hmmmmm alright
02:35 hmmmmm pushing my lua mmvm shit + other stuff
02:36 hmmmmm this is actually pretty huge
02:38 hmmmmm a total of 413 + 26 + 188 + 56 + 151 + 15 = 849 additions and 8 + 15 + 9 + 1 + 13 + 6 = 52 deletions
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03:00 ShadowNinja Does Lua have a shorter way to do x = x - 1? Like x-- or x -= 1.
03:01 VanessaE nope.
03:02 hdastwb post/pre increment/decrement are too fancy for a minimalist language like Lua
03:03 * Kacey is leaving for a couple days. will come back when things are straightened out.
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03:23 Mallot1 what is a good and free screen recorder i can use for my programming tutorials?
03:23 khonkhortisan +1 this question
03:24 khonkhortisan ShadowNinja, you also can't redefine lua keywords like for
03:33 ShadowNinja Mallot1: gtkrecordmydesktop. Or go all out with ffmpeg. ;-)
03:33 khonkhortisan Left and right always go left and right. Up-and-down and forward-and-back can go each other. Looking up or down can either do that or exactly nothing. Looking left or right can roll either direction. What matters in all these things is whether you're looking up or down.
03:33 ShadowNinja khonkhortisan: Yes, but I don't see how that relates.
03:34 ShadowNinja (previous statement)
03:34 khonkhortisan afaik you can't define operators
03:34 ShadowNinja You lost me with that. ;-)
03:35 * ShadowNinja gets back to documenting...
03:35 Mallot1 thanks shadow :D
03:38 khonkhortisan the qt frontend isn't an official package in my distro
03:42 * ShadowNinja has a package for all the things. :-)
03:42 ShadowNinja khonkhortisan: What distro?
03:42 khonkhortisan opensuse
03:43 ShadowNinja Ah, I tried that... Auto-mount-and-run was nice...
03:44 * ShadowNinja prefers Arch.
03:46 khonkhortisan oh yeah, I can run that in a vm...
03:46 * khonkhortisan goes off into the internet
04:06 khonkhortisan it's not like backtrack, I can't just type startx and click a desktop icon to install
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04:28 ShadowNinja khonkhortisan: Heh, no. Check the ,,(g Arch linux beginners guide)
04:28 ShadowBot ShadowNinja: https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Beginners'_Guide
04:29 ShadowNinja I don't always need X so I like that.
04:29 khonkhortisan I only get out of X to kill a runaway program
04:30 ShadowNinja (eg: My rasberry pi)
04:30 ShadowNinja Love the terminal. :-)
04:31 khonkhortisan I like the terminal, but I like staying away from the operating system itself
04:34 ShadowNinja Hmmm? Once I learned enough commands I didn't really need X. But if you want it it only takes a minute.
04:35 khonkhortisan Do you only run one graphical program at a time?
04:36 khonkhortisan I do not understand this way of thinking
04:39 ShadowNinja khonkhortisan: No...
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05:21 hmmmmmm http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=97021#p97021
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05:46 hmmmmmm http://www.fee.org/the_freeman/detail/are-there-too-many-lawyers#axzz2XUDwWm1K
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09:05 Calinou happy international caps lock day :D
09:05 VanessaE caps...lock?
09:05 JAMESTAIT Calinou, AND YOU! :-P
09:06 * VanessaE looks at her keyboard....  oh you mean the key that goes with this hole right here? :)
09:06 JAMESTAIT VanessaE, I think it's the key a lot of people seem to map to Ctrl. ;)
09:06 VanessaE heh
09:07 VanessaE I just rip the fuckin' thing off when I buy a new keyboard :)
09:09 JAMESTAIT I appreciate the caps lock key most of the time, except on days when I have fat fingers and hit it by accident and thus end up typing haLF a word in capitals before my eyes have registered what's happened and my fingers have stopped hitting the keys.
09:10 VanessaE which is precisely why I remove that evil key from my keyboards :)
09:10 VanessaE my fingers are fat more often than not :)
09:10 Calinou I don't :P
09:11 JAMESTAIT Thankfully it's the exception rather than the rule for me currently.  Maybe it'll change as I get older.
09:11 JAMESTAIT Or if I let my finger nails grow again.
09:12 VanessaE well I finally graduated...  from Ubuntu to debian (7).
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09:14 Calinou lol, you switched to debian?
09:14 VanessaE yup.
09:14 Calinou enjoy the lack of firmware by default
09:14 VanessaE got tired of the nanny-state that is Ubuntu.
09:15 Calinou and your outdated software, and your annoying community
09:15 VanessaE fortunately none of my hardware requires any extra firmware
09:15 VanessaE (video aside, which is using fglrx as usual)
09:15 VanessaE the community, well..  heh
09:24 whirm VanessaE: welcome :)
09:25 VanessaE thanks :)
09:25 VanessaE the only thing I had to fight with (and I still lost) is getting Google Earth > 5.x to run
09:25 VanessaE (anything higher either crashes or exhibits one or another sort of unsolvable dependency issue)
09:26 whirm VanessaE: did you enable multiarch?
09:26 VanessaE yup.
09:27 Zeg9 joined #minetest
09:27 diemartin http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest-delta/2012-07-17#i_2377146 <-- fun stuff
09:27 * whirm is waiting for a recent version of systemd for debian
09:28 VanessaE f.ex the current "latest" (allegedly 7.1) needs glibc 2.14 (wheezy uses 2.13).  The current "previous" (allegedly 7.0, but is really 5.x) runs, but is slow to start and of course is dead old.
09:28 VanessaE and good luck finding a legit download of 6.x :)
09:29 Exio VanessaE: ehm
09:29 Exio i have an idea for that
09:29 whirm VanessaE: use the deb from testing/unstable (I have 2.17 here)
09:30 VanessaE whirm: the glibc deb?  hrm, didn't think about that.
09:30 Exio whirm: i wouldn't do that
09:31 Exio http://aspensmonster.com/2013/01/19/updated-procedures-for-installing-steam-for-linux-beta-on-debian-gnulinux-testingwheezy/
09:31 Exio LD_LIBRARY_PATH
09:32 whirm Exio: steam is already packaged on the debian repos
09:32 Exio whirm: i know
09:32 Exio but i posted the link because it contains info about the "LD_LIBRARY_PATH hack" :P
09:33 whirm VanessaE, Exio, if a too-new version of glibc breaks your system you can always unpack it and use LD_PRELOAD or LD_LIBRARY_PATH
09:33 VanessaE true
09:33 VanessaE or do the lazy thing and re-install :P)
09:33 VanessaE :P
09:33 Exio that is what i'm saying
09:33 Exio unpack + ld_library_path
09:33 VanessaE (plus I have a script I run that brings my system to within 99% of my normal setup)
09:33 whirm VanessaE: I use debian sid, with some stuff from experimental
09:33 Exio ^ me too
09:33 whirm and it is pretty stable
09:34 VanessaE maybe I'll just update the whole thing to testing then.
09:34 VanessaE I dunno why I went with rust...er...stable :)
09:34 whirm except for btrfs on the 3.9 kernel (it has some issues and I can't move forward because of the fgrlx drivers)
09:35 whirm *fglrx
09:35 Exio i really want a proper ati driver for linux :(
09:36 VanessaE oh that reminds me.  I decided to try out MT with my 256px HDX...  I was able to sustain about 10 fps under the open source driver :)
09:37 VanessaE not exactly hot shit but playable if I'm ever in a jam.
09:37 diemartin lol ati
09:38 Exio diemartin: ?
09:38 diemartin dunno
09:38 whirm VanessaE: which card do you have?
09:39 VanessaE whirm:  AMD HD6870.  But I didn't do any extensive testing, I just played a bit in that mode while some other stuff was installing :)
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09:43 whirm VanessaE: do the trees grow after they are spawned with your moretrees mod?
09:43 Calinou Exio: no point in using the very latest kernel most of the time
09:43 VanessaE no
09:43 VanessaE though in theory they could
09:43 Calinou if I was AMD I'd rather work on a less buggy OpenGL implementation
09:44 VanessaE ah, here come the packages for testing now.  is there's one thing debian distros were always good at, it's switching branches.
09:44 whirm If I was AMD i'd would work on having the driver merged with the upstream kernel so everybody can fix it :D
09:45 VanessaE s/is/if/
09:45 Calinou whirm: radeon sucks on the HD7000s. the end.
09:45 Calinou aka. today's cards
09:45 whirm Calinou: yes, I know I have a 7850
09:45 VanessaE Calinou: and yesterday's.  and the day before's also.
09:45 VanessaE sadly.
09:45 Calinou AMD is always fearing legal issues so they never open source good 3D accel code
09:46 Calinou VanessaE: the HD6000 support is ok
09:46 Calinou if you use the various optimizations, the performance should be at least 80% of catalyst on most games
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09:47 john_minetest hi Zeg9
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09:56 Nore hi
09:56 VanessaE hey Nore.
09:56 Nore I have a bug: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=97047#p97047
09:57 Nore the most strange thing is that is worked before
09:58 VanessaE no clue there, except that shaders are somewhat less pleasing on recent ATI drivers compared to old ones.
09:59 VanessaE at least, the lighting changes MT uses them for
09:59 Nore I should perhaps ask Calinou, he knows more about that
10:00 Nore about pipeworks, I have an idea
10:00 VanessaE oh?
10:00 Taoki Nice to see the VoxelManip is upstream now! Hoever, I can't see any info on how to export a list of nodes to it in the documentation. Any info on that?
10:01 Nore special tubes that you can place at intersections
10:01 VanessaE which do what?
10:01 Nore that will automatically route items to where they are requested
10:01 Nore with tubes that request items
10:01 VanessaE hmmm..
10:01 Nore when a mesecons signal is applied to them
10:02 Taoki There's write_to_map but it takes no parameters x_x
10:02 VanessaE ok, upgrade to testing is done.  time to reboot and see what broke :D
10:02 VanessaE Nore: we'll talk more shortly.
10:03 Taoki Guess I'll ask hmmm when he's back
10:03 Nore Taoki: even his test code for mapgen does not work
10:04 Nore I have not been able to fix it
10:04 Taoki ok :P
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10:04 Nore http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=6396
10:04 VanessaE hey whaddya no, it didn't break :D
10:04 kaeza ._.
10:05 VanessaE no?
10:05 VanessaE KNOW.
10:05 VanessaE jeez, I must be more tired than I thought.
10:06 kaeza http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=97048#p97048
10:06 VanessaE *facepalm*
10:07 kaeza indeed
10:08 Nore technically, that's minecraft running inside of minetest folder
10:08 kaeza effective troll is effective
10:08 Nore but if you really want to run minecraft inside minetest
10:08 Nore you need mesecons and you need to create a huge computer
10:08 Nore and it will perhaps run at 0.0000000000001 fps
10:09 kaeza a JVM in mesecons?
10:09 kaeza sounds fun :D
10:09 VanessaE knowing Nore, he could do it.
10:09 VanessaE :)
10:09 Nore sounds impossible
10:10 Nore I'm actually trying to implement Forth on a virtual machine I created
10:10 Nore it could be possible to build it, except for the multiplier/divider and the memory which would need to be replaced by luacontrollers
10:12 Nore VanessaE: With the tubes I spoke you of, one could create some complex crafting networks
10:13 VanessaE right
10:13 Nore perhaps they should be added in the more_tubes mod
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10:13 Nore and keep pipeworks light
10:14 VanessaE brb
10:16 Calinou Nore: *AMD shrug*
10:16 Calinou also, radeon does provide 3D accel
10:16 Calinou remember that the 7670M is actually a rebranded HD6000
10:16 Calinou so it's not GCN and has decent accel with the open source driver
10:16 Calinou but it heats like hell :P
10:17 Nore since when does it work well with the radeon driver?
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10:18 Nore because it reduced cpu consumption to 50% of the previous value
10:19 Nore and my screen resolution was not correctly detected
10:19 Nore and I could not connect external screens
10:19 Nore but the radeon driver I had was perhaps old
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10:24 Calinou oh
10:24 Calinou well, that's debian
10:24 Calinou shipping outdated drivers since 2002
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10:40 john_minetest I think debian is only cool if you want to run a server.
10:40 john_minetest It is really stable.
10:41 Calinou no?
10:41 john_minetest Rolling release distros are sometimes way unstable and have some incompatibilities but I never experienced serious problems with archlinux.
10:41 Calinou ubuntu server :P
10:42 john_minetest "You are now entering an ubuntu server. Don't enter if you are epileptic. It is using unity."
10:44 Calinou ubuntu server has no DE installed by default
10:44 Calinou you can also use ubuntu without unity
10:45 proller debian is only cool if you want use 3-5 years old sodt
10:45 Exio Calinou: ubuntu server is a joke
10:45 proller soft
10:47 Calinou Exio: or not
10:47 Calinou ubuntu server is ubuntu without a DE
10:47 Calinou you get 41000 packages, a big community, recent software and all that.
10:47 Exio the community of ubuntu is 95% newfags and the other 5% is cool people
10:47 proller ubuntu resent  = 2 yersa old
10:48 Calinou lol Exio
10:48 Exio ubuntu comes from debian sid
10:48 Calinou not at all
10:48 Calinou testing for the LTSes
10:48 Calinou and a stabilized sid
10:48 Calinou not just sid
10:48 kaeza best commit message evar https://github.com/MovingBlocks/Terasology/commit/7f571c5583b853c9d6ce0a8dfc7116b19b27c56a
10:49 Calinou Exio: what do you mean by "newfag"?
10:49 kaeza </random>
10:49 Calinou if you're talking about people who behave like apple evangelists, they are fine, and even good
10:49 Exio Calinou: random users that think KDE and XFCE are the same
10:51 Exio Calinou: did you even try debian sid
10:51 Calinou in virtualbox, yeah
10:52 Calinou software was less uptodate than in ubuntu most of the time
10:52 Calinou stability was ok, but i didn't update often
10:52 Calinou non-LTS ubuntus are rock stable for me
10:55 Exio Calinou: vms don't count
10:55 Exio and less up-to-date?
10:55 Calinou yes
10:55 Calinou kernel 3.2 only in sid
10:55 Calinou (august 2012)
10:56 Calinou while I expected to get 3.5 or so :P
10:56 Calinou what's LuaVoxelManip useful for?
10:56 Calinou to make worldedit faster?
10:56 Exio Calinou: that time debian was "preparing the stable release"
10:57 Exio ...
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11:46 PilzAdam Hello everyone!
11:47 sfan5 hi
11:47 sfan5 sweet! my raspi came
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11:51 Calinou twss
11:51 Calinou very high twss factor
11:52 PilzAdam sfan5, move this http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=6396 to "news" and add "[0.4.8]" at the front of the topic
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12:07 sfan5 PilzAdam: done
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12:09 sfan5 ShadowBot: op MinetestBot
12:09 sfan5 ...
12:10 sfan5 foobar ,,(op MinetestBot)
12:10 sfan5 :/
12:10 whirm what is this nolight mapgen attribute?
12:13 Calinou whirm: don't use lighting?
12:13 Calinou so, caves are bright
12:14 whirm thats what I guessed, but just in case... :)
12:16 whirm http://paste.debian.net/13119/ <- I'm getting this when loading my world in single player with a current master's build
12:16 Exio Calinou: it is meant to don't calculate the lighting in the "mapgen-time" but instead with the "calc_lighting" function
12:17 whirm Exio: does it make it to have less lighing errors then?
12:18 Exio whirm: hm?
12:18 Exio ask hmmm about details, but afaic it is for just don't recalculate it
12:18 kahrl whirm: did you terminate minetest abnormally recently? do you have a backup of the world?
12:18 Exio the result should be the same
12:19 whirm Exio: I get some dark areas where there should be plenty of light
12:19 whirm and when i interact with the area the lights get right
12:19 whirm it is not happening all the time, but it happens every now and then
12:20 whirm kahrl: yes, I have backups, and I don't think it crashed recently
12:21 kahrl check if env_meta.txt from any of the backups is nonempty, and copy it to the current world if so
12:21 kahrl or just put this in env_meta.txt: http://paste.dy.fi/WNy
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12:24 whirm kahrl: my env_meta is full of crap D
12:24 whirm :D
12:26 whirm kahrl: now I'm getting: 14:25:52: ERROR[main]: Player::deSerialize(): PlayerArgsEnd of player "singleplayer" not found
12:26 whirm (I copied the env_meta from another world)
12:28 sfan5 whirm: is your player file also full of crap?
12:28 kahrl then players/singleplayer is also corrupted... you could try deleting it if you can afford to lose the inventory and settings
12:29 Calinou ^
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12:32 whirm kahrl: yes it was
12:34 whirm kahrl: it is working now, thanks a lot. Ill recover both files from my daily backup.
12:38 PilzAdam sfan5, try /msg ShadowBot op #minetest MinetestBot
12:42 john_minetest How can there be dislikes on youtube? When people don't like a video, they should simply stop watching it. They act as if they are forced to watch these videos...
12:42 sfan5 yeah
12:42 PilzAdam john_minetest, haters
12:43 Nore joined #minetest
12:45 Nore hi
12:45 Exio hi nore
12:45 john_minetest How can people hate a song of a band that noone knows? 193.799 views, 190 likes, 12 dislikes. Why? I can understand that people dislike Justin Bieber videos because everyone does and it is natural to have at least one "This-dislikes-are-justin-bieber's-fake-accounts" comments under a video. But why would someone dislike small bands that are not doing much profit and don't act stupid?
12:46 Nore what do you think about minetest removing objects when there are too much in a block?
12:47 Nore Do you think the limit should be configurable?
12:47 PilzAdam john_minetest, you know, some people just browse youtube the whole day and dislike random videos
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12:51 Nore hi Zeg9
12:51 Zeg9 Hello !
12:52 Nore what do you think about large amount of objects?
12:53 Exio isn't there a 49 entities / mapblock limit
12:53 Nore there is, but I made a pull request that allows to configure it in minetest.conf
12:53 Zeg9 The limit should be a bit bigger or configurable
12:53 Zeg9 configurable would be the best
12:53 Nore do you think it will be merged?
12:54 Zeg9 I'm not sure it will be merged, but I hope so
12:54 Nore https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/655
12:55 Nore it was a 4-line change
12:56 Nore is it possible to use mapgen v7?
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12:58 VanessaE ok, the next time I challenge my computer to break/not break like that, someone please smack me upside the head.
12:58 Zeg9 Nore: IIRC it needs a few fixes before being really usable.
12:58 Zeg9 and nobody has configured biomes yet, and there is no documentation afaik
13:00 Exio VanessaE: what happened?
13:00 VanessaE (had to resort to a clean install and a bit of rewrite of my system install script to get everything exactly where I wanted it)
13:00 Calinou PilzAdam: like you :P
13:00 Exio Zeg9: hmmmm posted the "biome examples" :P
13:00 Calinou :trollface:
13:01 Zeg9 Exio: but they don't work really fine with the current version :p
13:01 Calinou VanessaE: that's debian :shrug:
13:01 VanessaE whirm: on testing now, and everything finally works right.
13:01 PilzAdam Calinou, wut?
13:01 Calinou funny, because *buntus are usually the kind of distro you have to reinstall to fix :P
13:01 Calinou PilzAdam: about disliking youtube videos all day
13:01 PilzAdam I dont even have a google account
13:02 * Zeg9 needs an email provider and he won't use google account anymore
13:02 PilzAdam Zeg9, https://www.startmail.com/
13:02 PilzAdam ^ Calinou
13:02 VanessaE Calinou: well in theory this would have been fixable without a re-install, but I'm lazy :P
13:02 VanessaE (plus I like to know I'm starting from a known good state)
13:03 Zeg9 interesting, thanks Adam
13:05 whirm VanessaE: yes... stable is already too old when it gets released
13:06 VanessaE yeah, I remembered that from last time I ran pure debian.  figured by now they'd have "caught up", but I guess not :P
13:06 Nore VanessaE: https://github.com/VanessaE/pipeworks/pull/43
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13:08 VanessaE Nore: merged.  Can you do me a favor?  Add an option somewhere that will cause items to not "randomly" turn corners but rather to always follow some predictable path.  I was testing something a couple days ago and noticed how slowly that makes things run in certain cases.
13:09 VanessaE if you want to try:  Set up a 5x3 wall of node breakers, a 5x3 wall of dirt on their breaking/input side, and a 5x3 matrix of conductive tubes to their backsides, then run a single tube from that assembly to a chest.  Activate the tubes with a mesecon switch and watch the flow
13:10 VanessaE you'll notice that a lot of the time, the items flow right past the final output pipe, no matter where you put it, even if it seems like they should turn that way
13:11 VanessaE it might be enough to just do something like "items always turn left or upwards" or something simple like that.
13:11 Tom-s joined #minetest
13:11 VanessaE seems to work well for minecarts anyway :)
13:11 Calinou PilzAdam: TIL startpage now offers email service :P
13:12 Calinou the problem is, how do they make money
13:12 Nore they do not turn corners randomly, but they chose among the directions they can go by selecting those cyclicly
13:12 VanessaE ah, ok.  well can you add something to turn off that cyclic behavior?
13:12 VanessaE (you know your code better than me :) )
13:15 paramat joined #minetest
13:17 Nore done
13:17 Nore paramat: have you finished moonrealm 0.3.0?
13:17 VanessaE oh hell that was simple
13:18 Nore I'd love to try it
13:19 Nore VanessaE: try it, but it will perhaps prevent all your items from going where you want
13:19 Nore or it will make them always go there
13:19 VanessaE what's the normal behavior without cyclic?
13:20 Nore they go to first tube they find that is not the one they come from
13:20 VanessaE ok
13:20 VanessaE so, straight line or turn a corner essentially.
13:21 Nore node, must be something like x- first, then x+, then y-, then y+, then z-, then z+ or something like that
13:21 VanessaE ok
13:21 VanessaE that's the sort of behavior I was wanting actually
13:21 Nore we need to use 6d facedir
13:21 VanessaE oh ho ho ho
13:21 VanessaE I've been dreading THAT rewrite.
13:22 Nore it will change from 64 nodes to 10 (I calculated that)
13:22 VanessaE it'll require completely rewriting the tube flowing logic and autorouting code :-/
13:22 Nore not that much it we add functions to convert between 6d and tubes
13:22 VanessaE hm
13:22 VanessaE well yeah I suppose
13:23 VanessaE could get slow with large networks though
13:23 Nore but we will need to set an ABM for old tubes to be converted because alias will not work
13:23 paramat Nore, almost, testing right now :P
13:23 Nore so we must alias them to a new node, that will have an ABM to convert to the correct tube
13:24 VanessaE before we do that, I need to rewrite autoplace.lua anyways a bit, the rules are hard-coded and need to be condensed into a generic interpreter + tables
13:24 VanessaE oh sure I know about that part.  I wrote something like that for moreblocks
13:24 Nore paramat, you should really put your mods on github as you write them
13:25 Nore so one can test them before they are released and find bugs/make suggestions before the release
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13:27 VanessaE nore:  minor typo in tubes.lua:485 (fixed and pushed already)
13:28 Nore paramat: what do you think about a mod that generates many realms, which have random characteristics (sea level, sea material (water, lava), trees, etc.)
13:28 Nore one could then go to a realm using some item
13:29 Nore VanessaE: oops, didn't see that one (I don't test such little changes usually)
13:29 VanessaE s'ok
13:29 paramat Nore, with this mod ive been so immersed i still haven't pushed it to github ...
13:30 NakedFury joined #minetest
13:31 paramat Nore, sounds fun to me, something for someone else to do but i would certainly like to see screenshots.
13:31 Nore paramat: I can rewrite the code to use the VoxelManipulator if you want (I finally understood how it worked, since there is a bug in hmmmm's code)
13:33 Exio Nore: how did you fix "that bug"?
13:33 paramat Nore, sure go ahead ... as i am waiting for 0.4.8 stable before doing the same.
13:33 VanessaE Nore: oh that's perfect
13:33 VanessaE now the network empties in a few seconds instead of a couple minutes :)
13:40 VanessaE Nore: uberi and I were discussing using a variation of the item transport code to move liquid sources around via the pipes.  Number of entities in a given pipe at any one time = pressure.  Pumps won't add more entities unless the pressure is below a certain threshold.  Liquid entities route around in cyclic mode and are converted back into liquid sources if they reach a spigot.
13:40 VanessaE your thoughts?
13:41 VanessaE (all of that ^^^ as opposed to the current method via an ABM, which is inaccurate and inflexible)
13:42 Nore good idea
13:42 Nore paramat: nore.mesecons.net/realms1.png nore.mesecons.net/realms2.png nore.mesecons.net/realms3.ong
13:42 Nore oops
13:43 Nore nore.mesecons.net/realms3.png
13:43 VanessaE I Was about to ask what an 'ong' was ;)
13:43 Nore instead of a:index use:
13:44 Nore x+y*(emax.x-emin.x+1)+z*(emax.y-emin.y+1)*(emax.x-emin.x+1)
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13:44 Nore hi realbadangel
13:44 realbadangel hi
13:45 VanessaE hey rba
13:45 Exio rba! :D
13:45 Nore Exio: is it what you wanted?
13:46 paramat Nore, interesting ...
13:46 realbadangel whats up folks?
13:46 Nore nore.mesecons.net/realms1.png nore.mesecons.net/realms2.png nore.mesecons.net/realms3.png
13:46 Nore indev mod
13:47 Nore each chunk at y=20000 gets a separate mapgen
13:47 Nore and there are barriers to separate them
13:47 Nore it uses voxelmanipulator to be fast
13:48 realbadangel interesting
13:49 Nore however, I lack ideas about what to create
13:49 Nore for now, only the sea level, the sea material (water or lava) and the trees are random
13:49 realbadangel crystal world, with crystal formations all around
13:50 Nore paramat: I will need your help for caves, fissures, etc.
13:50 Nore crystal world? what do you mean?
13:50 realbadangel decaying world, full of resources but with disappearing content, holes that destroy it
13:50 Nore I thought of that, but it will be harder
13:50 realbadangel i mean crystals instead of trees
13:51 Nore perhaps add a value content to worlds, if it is above some value, there is danger in the world
13:52 Nore what do you think of mese trees? Too cheaty?
13:52 VanessaE Nore: put 'em up at +30000 and add some flying nyan cats ;)
13:52 realbadangel since mese has already many uses it can be to cheaty
13:52 NakedFury a world that has a corruption. This corruption slowly spreads through the land destroying trees and other things, staying to long on it poisons you
13:53 paramat Nore, for caves and fissures study my mods :)
13:53 realbadangel but new resource, crystal wont be
13:53 Zeg9 [offtopic]what's the circular saw recipe in moreblocks[/offtopic]
13:53 realbadangel search for minecraft mod that add worlds that players can describe and create
13:53 Nore but if mese trees world risk to kill you, with something that devours the world...
13:54 realbadangel lemme recall its name
13:54 Nore is it not part of technic?
13:54 VanessaE zeg:
13:54 VanessaE _ X _
13:54 VanessaE T T T
13:54 VanessaE T _ T
13:55 VanessaE X= steel, T = tree.
13:55 Zeg9 thanks
13:55 khonkhortisan_ VanessaE has been kicked for flood (MinetestBot)
13:55 VanessaE hehe
13:55 Zeg9 Nore: nop; but moreblocks is only used with technic now :D
13:55 realbadangel got it
13:55 realbadangel http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y8BLonCAeV8
13:56 realbadangel its Mystcraft
13:56 realbadangel ages == realms
13:57 mrtux joined #minetest
13:57 Nore actually, it gave me the global idea
13:57 TheLastProject joined #minetest
13:57 Nore but I did not intend to let the user create his own relams
13:58 realbadangel thats actually pretty nice idea
14:02 realbadangel Nore, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9bZeGi2ndM
14:02 realbadangel please watch this
14:03 realbadangel this explains this mod better, basics, not the later additions
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14:03 realbadangel hi hmmmm
14:03 hmmmm hey
14:04 Exio hmmmm: here, where is the VoxelArea? :P
14:04 realbadangel hmmmm, i was reading about tinting
14:04 realbadangel imho you shall use separate byte for it
14:04 hmmmm exio, i am thinking of including it with builtin
14:05 hmmmm byte for tinting? ???
14:05 realbadangel because i have plans for leftover bits of facedir
14:06 hmmmm i have a good enough idea of what i need to do for tinting
14:06 khonkhortisan_ I can already see someone taking a single node from every biome and placing them all next to each other
14:06 realbadangel i planned to use them for scaling nodes
14:06 hmmmm ah nope
14:06 hmmmm see, you're conflating this with colordef
14:07 hmmmm colorlike rather
14:07 realbadangel ah yes
14:07 realbadangel i was thinkin about color maps, so yes
14:07 hmmmm this is different
14:08 hmmmm the details are a bit fuzzy but... this is a tint applied to all nodes of the type no matter what position they're at, based on where the player is
14:08 realbadangel i know the idea
14:08 Nore realbadangel: I guess that mod is not open-source, is it?
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14:08 hmmmm i'm thinking, maybe i transfer biome maps from the server to the client (ehh...) or maybe noiseparams for the biomes and have the client compute it
14:09 hmmmm and every time the user enters a different biome, the tint will change for grass, water, sky, and other blocks with this thing defined
14:09 realbadangel Nore: mystcraft? propably not, but who said you cannot watch it and write from scratch?
14:10 khonkhortisan_ it looks like that mod creates a new world, that you go inside a book to get to
14:10 realbadangel same with me and RedPower 2 mod, i havent see its code even once
14:10 Nore yes, but I am not paramat... he is much better than me  for mapgen
14:10 hmmmm so it requires transferring biome definitions to each client, and the client would now have to deal with some noise generation and biome handling
14:10 khonkhortisan_ I stole the null cell from redpower2
14:11 Nore and I stole the idea to make a computer that can be programmed in forth
14:11 Nore it is however not finished yet
14:11 hmmmm although honestly what i originally wanted was to send a packet when the user crosses a biome, and the server handles all of the rest
14:12 hmmmm might be laggy though
14:12 realbadangel Nore, do you want to have push rights to technic_game?
14:12 hmmmm i'm not sure at this point.  i'd rather try easier things first
14:12 Mati^1 <realbadangel> priv
14:12 Nore yes please!
14:12 realbadangel ok, hold on a sec
14:13 realbadangel Nore, whats your github login?
14:13 Nore but I told you, it is not finished at all yet: I have made a virtual machine in Python, that I will need to recode in Lua, and I almost finished an ANS-compliant core
14:14 Nore realbadangel: it is Novatux
14:14 realbadangel ok
14:14 Nore because Nore was already taken ;)
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14:17 MinetestBot GIT: PilzAdam commited to minetest/minetest: Dont write player files all the time 280946ba83 2013-06-28T07:15:48-07:00 http://git.io/eS1qaw
14:17 realbadangel Nore, welcome aboard then
14:17 Nore thanks
14:18 realbadangel i gave push rights to you, VanessaE and Jordach by now
14:18 realbadangel will also add all the folks that had rights in technic mod
14:18 PilzAdam realbadangel, your fake, the real RBA is called RealBadAngel :-p
14:18 PilzAdam *you are
14:19 realbadangel ofc im a fake
14:19 realbadangel :)
14:19 realbadangel stupid xchat takes my login as a nick
14:19 VanessaE heh
14:19 Mati^1 wow
14:19 VanessaE realbadangel: right click, Network List
14:19 VanessaE er
14:19 VanessaE realbadangel: right click, Xchat -> Network List
14:19 VanessaE set your default nick there.
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14:21 PilzAdam hmmmm, btw, your LuaVoxelManip topic in the forum is moved to "News", things like that should be posted there
14:22 hmmmm it was discussion about a feature
14:23 PilzAdam it was an announcement of a recently added feature
14:23 RealBadAngel Nore, you could work some more on tubes
14:23 hmmmm btw pilzadam, you're the lua master here, so i figured i ought to ask you what you think about adding voxelarea to builtin
14:24 RealBadAngel and use at least the facedir to get just one motor for frames
14:24 RealBadAngel the motor was one of the reasons i wrote 6d facedir code
14:24 PilzAdam hmmmm, Id say add a bunch of wrappers to make it easier to handle the voxel manipulator (optional, of course)
14:25 Nore yes, I will do it
14:25 RealBadAngel i also was thinkin about moving nodes
14:25 Nore but I reckon t needs energy, and I don't know how to make energy work
14:26 Nore moving nodes? what do you mean?
14:26 RealBadAngel by frames
14:26 VanessaE bbl
14:26 PilzAdam hmmmm, what exactly is the "VoxelArea" thing?
14:26 hmmmm a helper class
14:26 RealBadAngel i would like to do engine built in mechanism to turn them into entities
14:26 RealBadAngel and move them
14:26 Nore that is above my skills...
14:27 RealBadAngel i know how to do it
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14:27 RealBadAngel so its my part
14:27 Nore my biggest pull request changes at most 10 lines ;)
14:27 RealBadAngel dont say so
14:27 RealBadAngel i know what are you capable of
14:27 Nore realbadangel, what do you think of that https://github.com/Novatux/turtle ?
14:28 Nore maybe merge it in technic when it will be a bit more stable?
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14:29 RealBadAngel 10 lines? wanna be kicked in ass ;)
14:29 RealBadAngel im reading it atm
14:29 Nore 10 lines of c++ are as hard to code as 10000 lines of Lua or Python
14:30 RealBadAngel not really, rules are the same
14:30 RealBadAngel and the idea behind the lines
14:30 RealBadAngel that is whats important
14:31 RealBadAngel you have the gift to solve the things
14:31 RealBadAngel and make ideas true
14:31 hmmmm PilzAdam, https://github.com/kwolekr/minetest/commit/3680e60ecbd78c3ccd9106eef1c8a2a3c1c7b458
14:31 Nore I don't like having to declare types... well, I don't like to write the code, just to make an algorithm to solve the problem efficiently
14:32 hmmmm hah
14:32 hmmmm wow
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14:32 PilzAdam hmmmm, nice, document that in lua-api.txt and its fine
14:32 RealBadAngel thats the whole point of modding/coding
14:32 RealBadAngel make the ideas reality
14:32 hmmmm other way around... lua or python is way worse because you need to know exactly what interactions take place, and account for all sorts of stupid things like round off error when you're trying to work with something that should've been an integer for example
14:33 RealBadAngel agree with hmmmm
14:33 hmmmm having to choose between "int" and "float" or whatever isn't vexing
14:33 RealBadAngel c++ is lotsa easier
14:33 hmmmm like see the code i just wrote?  i really have to write math.floor(i)?  yeah, that's the reality of the language :/
14:34 Nore well, one can say machine code is easier (see https://github.com/Novatux/pforth ), the basic primitives are made in machine code
14:34 hmmmm and if i didn't?  i'd have a subtle bug in accessing an array where some indicies work and others don't
14:34 RealBadAngel for me yes
14:34 RealBadAngel i have self learned assembler
14:34 RealBadAngel Z80 then x86
14:35 Nore in Python, types are better than lua (there are ints, long, etc)
14:35 RealBadAngel and theres real power
14:35 Nore I only know assembler of MIX (yes, the one of TAOCP), and the one of the virtual machine I created less than 1 week ago
14:36 RealBadAngel i would really love to join there at some point Z80 emulation lib
14:37 RealBadAngel for our own computer with OS and applications
14:37 Nore very hard to do
14:37 RealBadAngel not really
14:37 RealBadAngel just include the sources
14:37 RealBadAngel http://libz80.sourceforge.net/
14:38 RealBadAngel and off we go
14:38 Nore writing your own compiler is hard, and emulation will be far slower than on a normal machine
14:38 RealBadAngel ofc it will be slow
14:38 RealBadAngel but thats not the point
14:38 RealBadAngel point is to write a simple control programs
14:39 RealBadAngel play tetris
14:39 RealBadAngel and the like
14:39 RealBadAngel and primo, open another door in sandbox world
14:40 salamanderrake joined #minetest
14:40 Nore I understand that
14:40 Nore bye
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14:43 hmmmm i sorta wonder why more helper classes weren't ever put into builtin, like operator overloading for vectors
14:44 hmmmm i'm sure a lot of people would appreciate being able to do pos = pos + v3:{x=1, y=1, z=1} * size or something
14:44 PilzAdam is that even possible in Lua?
14:44 hmmmm yes, like i did with voxelarea, except set __add and so on
14:47 hmmmm check this out http://lua-users.org/wiki/MetamethodsTutorial
14:48 hmmmm good way to pretty print a position instead of minetest.pos_to_string(), print("player blah at pos " .. pos)
14:48 hmmmm can be done by setting __concat
14:52 Exio hmmmm: merge it?
14:52 Exio (after the documentation, ofc)
14:52 hmmmm yeah, why not.
14:52 Exio :P
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14:56 BrandonReese RealBadAngel: Notch beat you to the ingame computer. His latest work has a fully function emulated 16 bit cpu that you can write programs for. http://0x10c.com/story/
14:56 PilzAdam I have a new development system: the 1st of a month is the "throw anything in" day, and the rest of the month we fix everything ;-)
14:57 john_minetest joined #minetest
14:59 Jordach btw, i found something that's pissed me off
14:59 PilzAdam minetest_game?
14:59 Exio i guess he meant you
14:59 Exio PilzAdam: ^
14:59 john_minetest Zombies in your garden?
15:00 john_minetest (I _really_ watched too many zombie films yesterday...)
15:00 RealBadAngel BrandonReese, i know about it. But in fact he was following 6502 from RedPower2
15:01 * BrandonReese nods
15:01 PilzAdam john_minetest, /me watched resident evil: apocalypse yesterday
15:01 RealBadAngel http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pyrTM_aZQI
15:02 Jordach john_minetest, you know that model i fixed by hand
15:02 Jordach the original UV had the mesh data there.
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15:02 Jordach i found it when i zoomed out.
15:04 john_minetest Yeah, I remember this one.
15:04 john_minetest PilzAdam: I watched "Shawn of the dead" on dvd yesterday and a Let's Play of "The last of us" with Sarazar.
15:04 PilzAdam john_minetest, well, lets put it this way: the games are better ;-)
15:05 Jordach john_minetest, you've got red on you
15:05 IceCraft joined #minetest
15:05 john_minetest Jordach: Let's go to the Winchester.
15:05 Jordach :D
15:05 john_minetest :D
15:05 Jordach cornetto?
15:06 john_minetest Hey, are you here? *bling* I owe you 15 cents.
15:06 Jordach anyways, MK2 Model coming son
15:06 Jordach soon*
15:07 john_minetest The end of sotd is cool. With his zombie friend in the shed xD
15:08 Jordach Did you know: the game they're playing is Timesplitters 2 on the Arcade map Streets
15:08 hmmmm https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/3f13dc790caeda7ca8f5e429f6f94458bda5826c
15:08 Jordach i spent an hour finding that
15:09 Calinou BrandonReese: TIL 0x10c is YAQS
15:09 MinetestBot GIT: kwolekr commited to minetest/minetest: Add voxelarea.lua helper to builtin 3f13dc790c 2013-06-28T08:07:45-07:00 http://git.io/IGlIIw
15:09 Calinou also, 0x10c is dead :P
15:10 BrandonReese Oh is it?
15:10 Calinou see date of latest post
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15:13 BrandonReese that's kind of sad, I was interested in where it was going.
15:14 john_minetest lol. the story. first paragraph, okay. But then there is something with big and small endian...
15:18 hmmmm meh.
15:18 hmmmm someone should add VoxelArea:contains(x, y, z), VoxelArea:containsp(pos), and VoxelArea:containsi(index) to builtin/voxelmanip.lua
15:19 john_minetest hmmm: You should add VoxelArea:contains(x, y, z), VoxelArea:containsp(pos), and VoxelArea:containsi(index) to builtin/voxelmanip.lua
15:19 john_minetest ;)
15:22 Exio /home/exio4/sources/minetest/src/nodedef.cpp:434: virtual const ContentFeatures& CNodeDefManager::get(content_t) const: Assertion 'c <= 0xfff' failed.
15:22 Exio aw
15:28 john_minetest going to abiball now
15:29 john_minetest bye
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15:40 Jordach Taoki, you here
15:40 Calinou why not ask him directly :P
15:40 Jordach Calinou, throw ponies at Taoki please
15:50 * Calinou throws a pony at Taoki
15:50 Calinou [vote which pony now]
15:51 Calinou too lazy to make a poll, and I have to go :P
15:51 khonkhortisan_ throw PilzAdam at Taoki
15:51 khonkhortisan_ idk why minetest has so much trouble figuring out what key I'm sending it
15:56 Jordach oh well
15:58 IceCraft joined #minetest
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16:40 * khonkhortisan_ randomly typed /*-+-*/
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16:46 Jordach omg
16:46 Jordach CLOWN!
16:47 STHGOM be
16:47 STHGOM bye
16:49 khonkhortisan_ http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=97098#p97098 the table at the bottom shows how difficult minetest is to use
16:53 sfan5 wut
16:56 khonkhortisan_ I have trouble typing numbers
16:57 khonkhortisan_ I must use both the numpad and the number row - a 3 sends my message prematurely
16:57 OldCoder joined #minetest
16:58 khonkhortisan_ codre of ye olde
17:04 Taoki Jordach: I'm back now
17:04 Taoki Working on some Minetest code now though
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17:11 dysoco Hello
17:11 khonkhortisan_ hi
17:11 salamanderrake joined #minetest
17:11 khonkhortisan_ Your cloak precedes you
17:12 dysoco You mean me?
17:13 khonkhortisan_ yes.
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17:13 dysoco I am not very familiar with the IRC, you mean that the cloak comes before my nick right?
17:13 khonkhortisan_ you didn't double-join while your cloak was applied
17:13 dysoco I don't understand what you mean, sorry.
17:14 Exio dysoco: que entraste con el cloak ya puesto, que no salio el tipico changing host
17:14 Exio :P
17:14 khonkhortisan_ You joined with the cloak already applied, instead of joining, quit (changing host), then joining with the cloak applied.
17:14 khonkhortisan_ But it's a pun on the phrase "Your reputation precedes you"
17:14 dysoco Oh I see... so what should I do? Apply a delay? how does that work?
17:15 khonkhortisan_ No, you're doing it the right way
17:15 khonkhortisan_ it's the people who join before their cloak works that need to add a delay
17:15 dysoco Ah I see
17:16 dysoco I think it was Exio who first told me to get a cloak
17:17 Exio maybe, i don't recall :P
17:17 dysoco I'm trying to build Minetest in Funtoo, let's see how it works
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17:26 dysoco wow, works perfectly
17:29 Calinou joined #minetest
17:34 dysoco Well, this main function is massive
17:35 whirm joined #minetest
17:37 Calinou some main functions _aren't_ massive?
17:39 dysoco Some are
17:39 dysoco Redis for example, is nicely structured
17:41 dysoco But heck, for being a hobby project, this is awesome
17:47 Exio dysoco: what main function? the_game?
17:48 dysoco Exio: the main one
17:48 dysoco not checked the_game yet
17:49 dysoco Well, the_game looks really big too
17:49 dysoco and takes a lot of parameters
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17:57 dysoco Wonder what can I start working in? Any suggestions? Any areas that need polish or bugs that need fixing?
17:59 Exio http://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues
18:01 dysoco Yes, I'm reading those
18:01 thexyz dysoco: I suggest you to ask in #minetest-dev
18:32 * Jordach pokes VanessaE
18:35 STHGOM joined #minetest
18:48 STHGOM !up minetest.org 30015
18:48 MinetestBot minetest.org:30015 seems to be down
18:51 Calinou joined #minetest
18:53 STHGOM hi
18:53 Calinou hi
19:15 STHGOM joined #minetest
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19:24 Calinou TIL Taoki plays minecraft
19:25 Taoki Calinou: I play MC for years
19:26 Calinou Taoki, same, since november 2010
19:26 Calinou dat skin, Taoki
19:26 * Calinou would have guessed
19:27 Taoki :)
19:27 * Calinou is just a fully black guy because it makes you less visible :P
19:27 MinetestBot Yay! PilzAdam is back!
19:28 * Calinou throws a pony at PilzAdam
19:29 khonkhortisan "play" - there's no tense there. I play MC for years, then take a breaks for a few months, then back to playing again.
19:30 Calinou I play it quite often
19:32 Calinou rarkenin's making this: https://github.com/mosstest/mosstest
19:32 Calinou first one to get the point of this gets a free copy of minceraft
19:32 Calinou :3
19:32 Calinou (note: minceraft != minecraft)
19:35 PilzAdam Calinou, the wiki says that there are two reasons for this: 1) in Minecraft the mods need to be installed client side too 2) in Minetest the mods are server side only
19:35 PilzAdam both is called "wrong" there
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19:36 Calinou "Honestly, not everyone needs shaders and extreme render distances." minecraft does not use shaders or extreme render distances without mods
19:37 Calinou the "far" render distance is reasonable but not extreme
19:37 Calinou "In addition, after developing the most important components for gameplay, we plan to continue into performance enhancement--peer-to-peer enhanced gameplay lessening the server’s role in interactions between players, and leaving the server to only operate on more important gameplay functions. " => have fun telling players to forward their ports
19:38 Calinou or, have fun implementing UPnP
19:38 thexyz http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAiVsbXVP6k&amp;feature=player_embedded
19:44 proller joined #minetest
20:13 Exio Calinou: since when MC supports shaders by default
20:15 Calinou Exio, never
20:16 PilzAdam Exio, rarkenin has to imagine things to justify his fork
20:17 whirm joined #minetest
20:17 PilzAdam \o/ finally, yellow fog! http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=97100#p97100
20:19 Calinou Taoki is just chuck norris, he beat the sun at a staring contest
20:19 Taoki Working on the formula right now. But it's very hard to get how close the crosshair is aiming at the sun
20:19 Taoki Mostly because you need to account pitch past the 180 barrier
20:19 Jordach EDIT: It's piss yellow.
20:20 proller joined #minetest
20:20 Jordach ffs, my beard wont stop growing
20:21 Jordach its also big and bushy
20:21 Jordach <Calinou> that's what she said
20:21 Calinou how about "twss" instead
20:21 Calinou same thing, but shorter
20:21 Jordach lol
20:22 thexyz about how many more wonderful discoveries will Jordach make
20:22 jordan4ibanez joined #minetest
20:22 Jordach PilzAdam is the Minetest dickhead
20:24 Calinou blockhead, you mean
20:25 PilzAdam nodehead
20:26 Exio nonrenewablelavahead :3
20:26 Calinou <Calinou> ~family PilzAdam
20:26 Calinou <redroid> Calinou: PilzAdam is the nodehead in our screwed up family
20:29 Mati1 joined #minetest
20:30 thexyz http://max.mmlc.northwestern.edu/~mdenner/Demo/texts/elephant_pug.htm
20:33 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
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20:43 Mallot1 hey guys :D
20:47 Mallot1 im ready to release my first mod :) Im soo pyched :D
20:47 Mallot1 *psyched!
20:48 Mallot1 But you wanna know whats funny?
20:49 Mallot1 i went into the minetest forums to submitt my mod into the mod releases section simply to find out...
20:49 marktraceur Missing apostrophes?
20:49 Mallot1 "Sorry! no permission to post new topics"
20:50 Mallot1 is what i found where my new post button was/should be O.o
20:50 Mallot1 how can i get the premisson?
20:50 Mallot1 permission
20:51 marktraceur Mallot1: You need to post in a different forum first and have an admin move your post. Read the sticky.
20:51 Mallot1 ok, which one?
20:52 Mallot1 is this for everyone?
20:52 marktraceur Yeah.
20:52 PilzAdam Mallot1, its not _that_ hard to read the sticky topics first...
20:53 Mallot1 lol PilzAdam
20:53 Mallot1 thanks marktraceur
20:54 Mallot1 i was reading them when i got ur PM PilzAdam
20:54 Mallot1 ping
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21:29 Uberi oh snap we have LuaVoxelManipulators as of 2 days ago
21:30 * ShadowNinja waits for ultra-fast WorldEdits...
21:31 Uberi I should get started on that soon
21:32 Uberi but I don't get what the data format looks like without any examples
21:33 Uberi "raw node data is in the form of a table mapping indicies to node content ids" <= where does param1 + param2 enter the mix?
21:33 BlockMen joined #minetest
21:34 BlockMen hi
21:34 Uberi o/ BlockMen
21:37 ShadowNinja Uberi: I don't know. Either that isn't implemented or it is in the ID. hmmmm: ^
21:37 hmmmm uberi, you can't access param1 or param2 directly
21:38 Uberi darn
21:38 hmmmm for param1, you use set_lighting or calc_lighting, for param2, you have to just use set_node... you don't use param1 too often for bulk node data
21:39 Uberi doesn't set_lighting only work during mapgen time?
21:39 hmmmm oh, yeah, that's true
21:40 Uberi well, I'll stick with schematics where params are needed
21:40 hmmmm can't really help that because the map updatelighting functions would wipe out any changes anyway
21:40 Uberi this will still speed up the worldedit primitives API
21:40 hmmmm hmm
21:41 hmmmm i suppose i can make things more flexible
21:41 hmmmm like, i can allow you to forcibly set lighting outside of the mapgen (but there's no guarantee it'll stay like that for a very long length of time)
21:42 Uberi until lighting next gets updated, anyways
21:42 hmmmm right, which can happen from an ABM even if you're careful to not place any nodes around it
21:43 Uberi oh, and I was wondering
21:43 Uberi does this work on unloaded areas?
21:43 hmmmm yes
21:43 Uberi \o/
21:43 Uberi that's wonderful news
21:44 hmmmm i'm going to add in a mode to read node tables as the data, but i'll put a disclaimer that it severly degrades the speed
21:45 Uberi does it load those blocks such that other functions can access them? (i.e., use voxmanip to load area, then set_node on them)
21:45 hmmmm huh?  you can't run set_node on unloaded areas?
21:45 Uberi doesn't seem to work, unfortunately
21:45 hmmmm hold on
21:46 Uberi when filling a huge area in WE, you get jagged edges at the edge of the block load distance
21:46 Uberi it's a rough sphere centered around the player
21:46 sokomine with the new schematics system or with the old set_node method?
21:47 Uberi set_node
21:47 sokomine ah, ok. so perhaps due to area not loaded
21:47 Uberi I haven't gotten my speedups branch to run very well yet :/
21:47 sokomine i tested it with a small area. even that was not loaded entirely and thus imported only partly
21:47 sokomine we need a place to exchange such schematics
21:48 Uberi like a special forum or something
21:48 hmmmm ah yeah i see it
21:48 hmmmm if it's not loaded it'll throw an exception
21:48 sokomine what i'm waiting for now (and hmmm will hopefully do) is rotation. and an option to replace one node type with another (i.e. all default:tree with default:brick) in one schematic without having to modify the stored file
21:49 hmmmm yeah, not with this.  the nodes will get placed, guaranteed
21:49 sokomine that's - apart from the speed - one of the great benefits of this new function :-)
21:49 Uberi place_schematic guaranteed node placement?
21:49 Uberi or voxelmanip
21:49 hmmmm both actually
21:49 Uberi awesome
21:49 Uberi but not set_node, intentionally
21:50 hmmmm i guess not
21:50 sokomine voxelmanip is only for mapgen time?
21:51 hmmmm it's for anything
21:52 sokomine the documentation mentions it only in on_mapgen context?
21:52 hmmmm if not during mapgen, you get it with local vm = minetest.get_voxel_manip(); local eminp, emaxp = vm.read_from_map(p1, p2); local data = vm.get_data(); ---do stuff here--- vm.set_data(data); vm.write_to_map(); vm.update_map();
21:52 Uberi can we have this example in lua_api.txt?
21:53 hmmmm lua_api.txt isn't for samples
21:53 Uberi true
21:53 hmmmm believe me, if i could, i would put examples there
21:53 PilzAdam hmmmm, you should write the article for it in the dev wiki
21:53 Uberi so wiki materiel then
21:53 PilzAdam with examples and stuff
21:53 sokomine maybe an examples.lua would be helpful then
21:53 PilzAdam sokomine, -> dev wiki
21:53 hmmmm also, the environment needs to be active when creating a voxelmanip, if it's not, the get_voxel_manip will fail
21:54 PilzAdam hmmmm, will unloaded blocks get loaded when the area of VoxelManip goes into them?
21:55 sokomine so this needs loaded areas?
21:55 hmmmm ...
21:55 hmmmm yes, unloaded blocks GET LOADED
21:55 hmmmm i said this before
21:55 Uberi so I can use voxelmanip to load an area, then use set_node on them?
21:56 Uberi that's perfect
21:56 hmmmm you could
21:56 Uberi and they stay loaded for max_block_something_something_timeout?
21:56 PilzAdam hmmmm, until its written down somewhere (= dev wiki) people will keep asking
21:57 hmmmm I think a modder should be the one to write it.. they know what kind of questions people are asking better than i would
21:57 hmmmm (read: i'm not going to be the one editing wiki pages and whatever)
21:58 hmmmm here's some bad code i wrote to test it:  http://pastebin.com/mf06wWpV
21:59 hmmmm i don't recommend calling index like that of course
21:59 hmmmm it's slower than it should be
22:01 Uberi is using that index() thing different from using table.insert() in your example?
22:01 Uberi (assuming we go x, y, z in the loop from low to high)
22:01 hmmmm yes, it's different, it gets the index inside of the voxelarea at that specific point
22:02 hmmmm should read up on what it does
22:02 hmmmm it's in builtin/voxelarea.lua
22:03 Uberi yeah the math seems about equivalent
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22:05 hmmmm you should put local vi = a:index(minp.x, y, z) outside of the for x .. loop and then increment x each loop
22:05 hmmmm this way you remove most of the excess computations
22:06 hmmmm you can do even better, though, by extending the same idea by calculating the index only once, for the initial position, and only add on the stride amounts (how many indexes you'd have to skip to get to the next scanline at that position)
22:07 hmmmm they're calculated in advance on voxelarea construction, and you could use them raw like that
22:08 hmmmm doesn't matter though, probably, because you're probably not going to be as careful with the rest of the loop body when deciding what node to place where
22:08 hmmmm being fast is especially important here, since you hold up the entire server until your mod is done with its task
22:09 Uberi that's why everyone should leave the most common node manipulation tasks to the WE API!
22:29 PilzAdam Uberi, you know that nobody ever uses the API of a mod?
22:30 Uberi I like to pretend they do :P
22:30 ShadowNinja PilzAdam: I did.
22:31 ShadowNinja (irc_commands. I may depend on WorldEdit for position setting in my areas mod.)
22:32 Uberi position setting? that's like 15 lines of code in worldedit_commands
22:33 ShadowNinja No, the boxes and everything. Maybe 100 lines+textures.
22:33 Uberi ah
22:33 ShadowNinja 235 Lines.
22:34 ShadowNinja (I copied it for now)
22:38 Mallot1 go to the minetest-dev chat if you want to talk about the development X3
22:45 ShadowNinja Mallot1: That wasn't on-topic for -dev. That channel is for engine development, not mods.
22:51 Mallot1 i put the that here
22:52 Mallot1 what button is screenshot for minetest?
22:52 PilzAdam you can use the screenshot button of your OS
22:53 ShadowNinja Mallot1: F12.
22:53 Mallot1 thanks guys
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23:08 kaeza greetings
23:08 Uberi o/
23:08 kaeza I'm suddenly getting this error: 20:06:40: ERROR[main]: ServerError: LuaError: error: ...rc/minetest/bin/../games/testing/mods/default/player.lua:126: attempt to index local 'anim' (a nil value)
23:08 kaeza hey Uberi
23:09 kaeza from what I see, the on_globalstep callback is being called before on_joinplayer
23:09 ShadowNinja kaeza: Remove other mods until it stops?
23:10 kaeza ShadowNinja, it's running vanilla minetest_game
23:10 kaeza only mod in there is xban (for testing)
23:11 kaeza (which does not touch anything related to player models/animation/whatever)
23:11 ShadowNinja Hrm, disabling xban doesn't fix it?
23:11 ShadowNinja It doesn't have to. I had that bug before but forgot the fix.
23:13 kaeza hmm... seems like that fixed it
23:13 Uberi kaeza: got a link to xbans?
23:13 kaeza now I'm wondering what kind of interaction is between those that makes it bug out
23:13 Uberi it probably registers a on_joinplayer callback
23:13 kaeza https://github.com/kaeza/minetest-xban
23:14 kaeza yes it does
23:15 Uberi I'm guessing it takes too long and globalstep kicks in
23:16 kaeza hmm
23:17 PilzAdam that cant be AFAIK
23:18 PilzAdam the server is fully locked while Lua runs
23:18 Uberi well it is a reproducible crash upon loading a mod that affects basically just the player joining part
23:20 kaeza using minetest.after(1, load_ips) seemed to fix that
23:20 PilzAdam wich line?
23:21 kaeza but as PilzAdam said, that shouldn't happen
23:21 Uberi but now they get an extra second to play!
23:21 kaeza PilzAdam, https://github.com/kaeza/minetest-xban/blob/master/init.lua#L183
23:21 kaeza instead of that ^
23:22 PilzAdam Uberi, no, thats only 1 second after the server start
23:24 harrison eep! minetest is in the debian repo! good work!
23:24 PilzAdam its even not outdated in sid!
23:24 harrison outdated? or updated?
23:25 harrison i used to compile it from the git repo
23:25 PilzAdam sid has the latest stable version in the repos
23:25 Exio Package: minetest
23:25 Exio Version: 0.4.7+repack-2
23:25 Exio :D
23:25 harrison naturally i run the most bleedingest edge box possible
23:26 harrison siduction.org
23:27 harrison recommend a server please
23:27 PilzAdam what gameplay do you want? creative, survival?
23:28 harrison creative let us say
23:28 rsiska joined #minetest
23:28 PilzAdam then VanessaE's server (see public server list)
23:28 harrison k
23:28 harrison thx
23:29 PilzAdam but turn "preload item visuals" in the settings tab off
23:29 PilzAdam she has so many nodes that your vram just flows over if you pregenerate them
23:30 harrison nobody nodes ... the trouble i - i - i've seen ...
23:30 PilzAdam oh, and media downloading at the first connect may take a while
23:30 Uberi bwahahaha
23:30 harrison fine
23:30 harrison ever try spasim?
23:30 harrison that can take a long time to generate a complex world too
23:31 PilzAdam yea, I tried spasim once
23:31 harrison what, jam i in such a hurry?
23:31 PilzAdam didnt really got the point of it
23:31 harrison excellent ... everything proceeds according to plan ...
23:31 PilzAdam is the plan evil?
23:32 harrison oh, NO! That would be wrong.
23:32 Uberi it's just mildly malicious
23:32 harrison free weev!
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23:44 PilzAdam VanessaE, have you updated the carts mod?
23:46 hmmmm heh http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_vault/2013/06/28/voting_rights_and_the_supreme_court_the_impossible_literacy_test_louisiana.html
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