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IRC log for #minetest, 2013-06-18

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Time Nick Message
00:03 khonkhortisan it also catches rats somehow
00:15 Guest63453 joined #minetest
00:57 PilzAdam bye
01:10 Roukoswarf-M joined #minetest
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01:13 Asad_ Hey, what is teh skylimit, and what is bedrock?
01:14 Asad_ as in
01:14 khonkhortisan We don't have bedrock without a mod
01:14 Asad_ how high on teh z axis is this world?
01:14 khonkhortisan the world is a cube
01:14 Asad_ so 31980x31980x31980?
01:14 Exio 31980*2
01:14 kaeza_ 62000³
01:14 Exio ^
01:14 khonkhortisan You'll also have graphics glitches when you get near there
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01:15 Asad_ yah see i play minecraft, bu this game has some awesome features I want tot ry
01:15 Asad_ whats sea level?
01:15 Uberi 0
01:15 Exio the water_level option
01:15 Exio by default it is 1
01:15 Exio (iirc)
01:15 khonkhortisan flatland is at 4
01:16 Asad_ hmm
01:16 Asad_ can you walk off the edge? if your reach the end?
01:16 Asad_ or dig deep enough
01:16 khonkhortisan you can't travel through the edge of the world
01:16 khonkhortisan you can teleport there, but then you're stuck
01:16 khonkhortisan I think you can fly through it though?
01:16 khonkhortisan idk
01:16 kaeza yep
01:16 Exio if you teleport to places far-away that don't exist
01:16 Exio you will probably end with a fucked up client
01:17 kaeza ^ map
01:17 Uberi Asad_: near the end you hit an invisible wall if not flying
01:17 Asad_ awesome
01:17 khonkhortisan the same invisible wall that you get before loading a map block (which it never will in that case)
01:18 Asad_ this is not so important, i know that mobs and our player are all sprites
01:18 Asad_ are these customizable?
01:18 Asad_ for others to see
01:18 kaeza uhh..
01:18 Asad_ or texture pack only
01:18 kaeza what version are you using?
01:19 Asad_ i built the latest one on debian
01:19 kaeza inb4 ubuntu repos
01:19 Kacey joined #minetest
01:19 khonkhortisan There's a skin mod where you select one of the player skins that's on the server
01:19 khonkhortisan *that're
01:19 Asad_ hmmm cool
01:20 Asad_ i take it the modders are moving faster then the devs ?
01:20 kaeza yes and no
01:20 Uberi they are not mutually exclusive groups :P
01:20 Asad_ :)
01:20 khonkhortisan There's still some things missing from both mods and engine
01:21 Asad_ may you build on your statement good sir?
01:21 khonkhortisan me?
01:21 Asad_ yes
01:21 Asad_ see im more interested int he modding myself
01:21 Exio Asad_: nope, minetest has a good mod api for something, no?
01:21 Uberi for example, a way to control fov from the mod API
01:21 Exio ew
01:21 Uberi for ironsights/potions/etc.
01:21 Exio don't look at me :(
01:22 Exio :P
01:22 kaeza Exio is the FOV expert
01:22 kaeza go code it
01:22 kaeza :)
01:22 Asad_ lol
01:22 Exio no u
01:22 Uberi I remember it was rejected though due to network latency?
01:22 Exio wut?
01:22 Uberi anyways, there's gotta be some way of making ironsights functionality
01:23 Asad_ yah see im taking some java classes now so i was starting up modding in minecraft. But i know some c++ and open source free projects have a warm place in my heart and I actually want to give back to the free software community
01:23 Uberi otherwise gun mods and such just don't feel complete
01:23 khonkhortisan The facedir of a node used to be along the vertical axis. We can now rotate any node in 90° increments in 3d. The helper functions still have to be written into commonlib. You should be able to change the keys without disconnecting from a server. Minecraft has carts that go diagonally on rail, minetest could have diagonal rail, but the carts haven't been made to go diagonally yet. Redpower2 has a null cell, and I'm working on a
01:23 khonkhortisan crossover for mesecons.
01:23 kaeza :O
01:23 khonkhortisan To name a few.
01:23 Asad_ Awesome
01:23 kaeza you evaded (Minetest|Shadow)Bot for the second time :D
01:23 khonkhortisan yep
01:24 Uberi khonkhortisan: pretty sure I saw carts go diagonally before
01:24 Uberi I think there's just no diagonal rail but diagonal motion works fine
01:24 Asad_ there are no diagonal rails on minecraft either
01:24 khonkhortisan I haven't seen it - I made diagonal rail, minecraft has diagonal carts, but I've never seen a minetest diagonal cart.
01:24 Asad_ hmm
01:25 Uberi would look good with the interpolated rotation patch too, imagine it
01:25 Asad_ well I will leave you good sirs for now
01:25 Asad_ expect to see me around though more often
01:25 Uberi see ya
01:25 khonkhortisan The cart can turn on a curve?
01:25 Asad_ I will probably be under the name Asad3ainJalout though. thats my registerd nick. Im at a public pc soooo
01:25 khonkhortisan bye
01:25 kaeza see ya around
01:25 Asad_ See you all
01:25 Uberi khonkhortisan: yeah, that would look great no?
01:26 khonkhortisan much better than left-right-left-right-left-right as you go NE
01:26 Uberi totally
01:27 kaeza ↑↑↓↓←→←→BA is better
01:28 khonkhortisan Also, I'd like the cart to stop at a turn until the server gives me an update, instead of continuing through walls.
01:28 khonkhortisan The same for the uphill-downhill looped animation
01:29 Uberi khonkhortisan: that'd need some sort of client-side stuff though
01:30 Uberi maybe a better moveto could work
01:30 khonkhortisan another variable to say when it's expected to stop
01:30 Uberi a time value, perfect
01:31 Exio why not make it just "attach" to a node type?
01:33 khonkhortisan the player attaches to the cart, what node would the cart attach to?
01:33 Exio some node_group
01:33 Uberi plus it has to handle acceleration
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01:55 khonkhortisan Did the stack traceback work in the past, giving me the previous lua functions that led to the crash?
01:55 Uberi never really worked for me
02:01 MinetestBot GIT: kwolekr commited to minetest/minetest: Decoration: Place decorations in mgv6, check if air or cignore before placement f18b4872ea 2013-06-17T18:59:57-07:00 http://git.io/nJcf8g
02:02 VanessaE hi all
02:05 Kacey hi v
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02:33 Kacey !up 209.141.129.87
02:33 MinetestBot 209.141.129.87:30000 seems to be down
02:33 ShadowBot Kacey: 209.141.129.87:30000 seems to be down
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02:37 arsdragonfly how to set up a remote media server?
02:38 khonkhortisan set it to VanessaE's HDX pack on github :P
02:39 VanessaE heh
02:39 Menche i have a webserver with all the textures
02:41 ShadowNinja Grrr, somehow ShadowBot still gets confused. ,,(stfu)
02:41 ShadowBot ShadowNinja: The operation succeeded.
02:41 VanessaE ha!
02:46 khonkhortisan What if each player could independently toggle item_drop?
02:48 VanessaE that would certainly satisfy most of the contingent that hates item drop
02:49 khonkhortisan On some of the layers of the menger sponge, it's easier to build a solid sheet then punch holes through it. But then I have items dropping through the whole thing, either getting caught in the sponge, or causing a mess at the bottom.
02:54 sokomine ah. hi menche. i've asked pilzadam some hours ago to join your server in order to find out why framerate dropped so dramaticly after a short while. he suspects that there are far too much items
02:55 VanessaE sokomine: -dev
02:55 Menche yeah, vines dumped a ton of items all over
02:55 VanessaE exio and I are investigating the same thing on my server.
02:56 Menche of course /clearobjects definitely won't work at this point
02:56 VanessaE Menche: clearobjects has been fixced.
02:56 VanessaE fixed*
02:56 sokomine oh? it's already fixed?
02:56 VanessaE yeah
02:56 sokomine pilzadam mentioned up to 4000 objects that...er...attacked framerate
02:56 sokomine that's great! guess it's server-side? so a lot of servers ought to update?
02:57 VanessaE fixed enough not to eat up a metric assload of RAM anyway (I understand it's still not ideal, but it's 1000000x better)
02:57 VanessaE yeah, anyone not running 0.4.7 needs to update.
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03:01 sokomine ok. glad it could be fixed! that strange behaviour puzzled me for a while. it went away if you left the area for a short while and returned. pilzadam was pretty fast at discovering the source once the bug showed up. in the case of menches server, it might be the saplings. 12 of them stacked on top of each other...at least those where the visible ones
03:03 Exio i can't get any sign locally duplicated
03:03 Exio placed like 400
03:03 Exio and only 400 :(
03:04 sokomine maybe you have to write something on them and use the right type of sign. the normal ones (those without the floating letters) won't cause a problem i guess. if all fails, chop donwn a few trees. the saplings ought to cause enough items
03:04 VanessaE sokomine: I meant that the clearobjects command has been fixed.
03:04 VanessaE entity duplication is still a problem (and quite so)
03:05 VanessaE Exio: you  have to wait like 5 minutes, out of range of the signs (say 5 mapblocks away)
03:05 VanessaE then walk up to them and wait for them to reload
03:05 Exio like, far enough to don't see them?
03:05 Exio my view-distance is 100
03:05 VanessaE yeah
03:05 VanessaE set your view distance to 50
03:05 VanessaE that's what I was using
03:06 VanessaE my machine, despite having a kick-ass video card, just can't handle >50 or 60 near the spawn on my map.
03:06 VanessaE (elsewhere, I can do 150+)
03:07 Menche trying clearobjects
03:07 Exio i will take a shower in the meantime
03:07 Exio brb
03:08 Menche my server *still* doesn't appear on the serverlist
03:10 sokomine at least the duplication can be cleaned up a bit now and then if the clearallobjects command is fixed
03:10 Menche settings seem to be right, and it says that it is announcing on startup
03:10 VanessaE Menche: build against cURL, then do:  http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/5775944/
03:11 sokomine vanessa: yes, for some strange reason, spawn seems to be usually more problematic than other regions of a server
03:11 Menche VanessaE, i have all of those settings already
03:11 VanessaE Menche: what's the server address?
03:12 Menche menche.servegame.com:30000
03:12 Menche don't try to connect now, clearobjects has it locked up
03:13 sokomine ah yes, come to menches server :-) i've built a second small house there recently. however, don't stick to one playce too long because that'll ruin your framerate
03:13 Menche sokomine, your house at spawn got kinda messed up
03:13 Menche a stairsplus update caused the facedir on a lot of stuff to be reset somehow
03:13 arsdragonfly how to set a cooldown for unifiedinventory's sethome?
03:14 Menche when stairsplus was merged with moreblocks it broke a bunch of stuff
03:15 Menche if i can get the entities cleaned up now, there shouldn't be too many more
03:15 Menche most of them were from the vines mod, which i removed
03:15 Menche i still think entities are awful
03:17 ShadowNinja Did MinetestBot join with an alternate nick and /nick MinetestBot?
03:18 sokomine menche: yes, i saw :-( unfortionately, the screwdriver does not seem to work
03:20 sokomine even with the newest version, stairsplus/screwdriver is not yet ideal. i like the way 6d facedir as such works - it's just not convenient enough for everyday usage. we need to find a better way there
03:20 sokomine i'm thinking of offering a tool which shows all possible rotations and allows to select one. problem: lots of images would be needed for all possible rotations of each node
03:21 khonkhortisan facedir <=> xyz rotation, rotating v3 by xyzrot.
03:21 Uberi sokomine: show generic icons
03:21 Uberi like a grey cube with arrows on it
03:21 sokomine hmm
03:24 Exio i can't make them duplicate VanessaE :/
03:24 VanessaE Exio: maybe it only happens in a client-server setup rather than singleplayer?
03:25 sokomine really imagining how an object will be rotated in 3d may be difficult for some people. getting that illustrated well is not easy. the images used to show how that new version works where not that easy to comprehend
03:25 sokomine perhaps
03:25 Exio i guess VanessaE
03:25 Exio but it is getting late, sorry
03:25 Exio good night
03:26 VanessaE no worries
03:26 sokomine sleep well
03:26 Menche singleplayer really is a client-server setup
03:27 Menche it's just on a different port and only allows 1 client
03:29 sokomine is your server back up again?
03:29 Menche it's up but it's at 100% cpu
03:29 Menche probably won't be able to connect, i can't
03:30 khonkhortisan Grr the crossover will turn on X, or turn on Y, but not both...
03:30 khonkhortisan *Z
03:32 Uberi left #minetest
03:33 sokomine guess the duplication problem (especially considering signs with the floating letters) can be replicated on the wazuclan server as well
03:33 sokomine standing close to spawn for some time there might be equally sufficient
03:35 VanessaE sokomine: that's all one need do on my server to trigger entities to start duplicating - just stand there for 10-15 mins, maybe walk up and down the north road once in a while.
03:35 VanessaE there = the spawn
03:39 ShadowNinja ShadowBot should take nick  changes into account when sleeping now.
03:41 Menche clearobjects has been running for quite a while, but at least it's not gobbling up all my memory this time
03:42 sokomine is it still running?
03:42 Kacey why dont deployers plant seeds?
03:43 VanessaE Menche: it'll still take a while, maybe 30 minutes on a large map, but it'll finish clean now.
03:43 Menche the cpu usage seems to be calming down now
03:43 Menche ok it's donw
03:43 Menche *done
03:43 VanessaE now restart your server
03:43 VanessaE to force it to release that last bit of RAM it needed for the clearobjects
03:45 Menche are the monsters from simple mobs supposed to be hostile all the time?
03:45 Menche they aren't
03:45 VanessaE some are.
03:45 VanessaE for me they tend to zerg rush you
03:45 VanessaE especially if you have lots of sheep and some wheat in-hand :)
03:45 Menche sand monsters seem the most aggressive
03:46 Menche oh, and while they're chasing you, they won't climb hills
03:46 Menche makes it kinda easy to get away
03:46 VanessaE I notice that too
03:46 VanessaE +d
03:46 sokomine hard to tell. on one server, a dirt-monster "knocked" on the door (it jumped up and down in front of it) - and when let inside, it tried to kill everyone :-(
03:47 * Menche is standing in the middle of a swarm of sand monsters
03:47 Menche they don't seem to notice me
03:47 khonkhortisan land shark!
03:48 sokomine the sand- and dirtmonsters and sheep and rat seem to duplicate as well...there where huge hordes in the desert close to my new house
03:48 Menche sand monsters don't die during the day
03:48 Menche like dirt ones
03:49 Kacey why dont deployers plant seeds?
03:50 * Kacey needs a way to automatically plant things
03:50 ShadowNinja Kacey: They don't know about seeds?
03:50 Menche woo, i'm on the server list again
03:51 Menche well it's bedtime for me
03:56 kaeza Kacey, because seeds are craftitems?
03:56 kaeza (i.e. not nodes)
03:57 kaeza also, this: https://github.com/RealBadAngel/technic/issues/11
03:58 Kacey how would i get water buckets automatically?
03:58 VanessaE Exio: there, finally got the latest map uploaded
03:58 VanessaE (also trimmed down the size of the game files by excluding all the git stuff)
03:59 Kacey night
03:59 VanessaE night
04:00 VanessaE (not that Exio is still here though)
04:01 kaeza I'm feeling a bit of inspiration today
04:02 kaeza I'll give a try at fixing the issue I linked and the one Kacey told about
04:04 * kaeza wished technic was not so bloated
04:05 kaeza 14MB IIRC
04:06 khonkhortisan Status update: The mesecon #crossover can turn all the way on, but must be persuaded to turn off.
04:07 VanessaE yay
04:07 VanessaE kaeza: not quite so
04:08 VanessaE kaeza: it's only 4.3MB after you strip out all the .git stuff
04:08 khonkhortisan and it's not a small change, either: https://github.com/khonkhortisan/minetest-mod-mesecons/compare/multi_rules
04:08 kaeza oh
04:08 VanessaE kaeza: you're not using the ambiance add-on are you?
04:08 VanessaE that's about 10MB if memory serves
04:08 khonkhortisan I used ambiance until the bird annoyed me
04:08 khonkhortisan it's good for swimming, though
04:09 kaeza git clone https://github.com/RealBadAngel/technic.git
04:09 kaeza that's what I use
04:09 kaeza Receiving objects: 100% (2125/2125), 14.08 MiB | 63 KiB/s, done.
04:09 VanessaE wow, the actual git repo is about 26MB on mine
04:10 VanessaE good thing I trimmed out all the git crap from my final game :)
04:10 kaeza hah
04:10 ShadowNinja khonkhortisan: ~50% of that is debug statements.
04:10 kaeza and even tehn, it seems all the stuff is already compressed
04:10 kaeza then*
04:10 khonkhortisan and I need them greatly
04:11 khonkhortisan I'm going backwards from the node definition through the functions, stumbling through the crashes, and checking the functionality when it stays running.
04:12 kaeza mesecons: Receiving objects: 100% (3217/3217), 1.58 MiB | 114 KiB/s, done.
04:12 arsdragonfly :-\ minetest crashed just now
04:12 khonkhortisan gdb it
04:13 sokomine it doesn't crash that often anymore. it gained a lot of stability
04:13 arsdragonfly then glxinfo | grep rendering -> no
04:13 khonkhortisan I have two distinct crashes I have copied down
04:13 arsdragonfly that's terrible
04:13 arsdragonfly Direct rendering : no
04:14 kaeza ^ $ reboot
04:15 kaeza :P
04:15 kaeza VanessaE, Receiving objects: 100% (1013/1013), 8.32 MiB | 113 KiB/s, done.
04:15 kaeza pipeworks :|
04:16 VanessaE vanessa@rainbird:~$ du -h -c /home/minetest/.minetest/games/vanessae_game/mods/pipeworks/
04:16 VanessaE 6.8Mtotal
04:16 sokomine mobf with its models is worse
04:16 kaeza 16M with git history
04:23 * sokomine crafts a bed and goes sleeping
04:24 * khonkhortisan sleepwalks, looking for bed parts
04:26 VanessaE night sokomine
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04:38 kahrl ^ Hmm. Self join. Reminds me of database class
04:42 VanessaE jeez, even with default textures I have to set my view range to 60 to get ~30 fps near the spawn
04:42 VanessaE wtf is going on with the rendering engine that it's this fucking slow!?
04:44 kahrl how many entities now?
04:44 VanessaE when I last looked, about 600
04:45 kahrl yeah, well entity drawing is not optimized at all
04:45 VanessaE I haven't run /clearobjects yet, and figured I should wait until you tell me to :P
04:45 kahrl for example there is no sorting by material as far as i know (unlike for mapblock meshes)
04:45 VanessaE right after sign-on, 555 of them.
04:46 VanessaE kahrl: the part that bugs me isn't the entities - it's the mapblock occlusion culling, which is presently reading zero.
04:47 kahrl that is strange indeed
04:47 VanessaE I have to wonder if sunlight_propagates being set to 'true' has any effect on that?
04:48 VanessaE most nodebox items have that set - but bear in mind that my performance didn't change appreciably when I forced everything to "normal" drawtype.
04:48 VanessaE hell even without *any* mods installed (so the map was entirely made of unknown nodes), I couldn't even sustain 55 fps at the spawn.
04:49 VanessaE (and by any, I mean any - not even default)
04:49 VanessaE #objects is 604 now and I haven't done anything but briefly look underground)
04:49 kahrl sunlight_propagates shouldn't have any effect on occlusion culling
04:50 kahrl drawtype does
04:50 VanessaE right.
04:51 kahrl was the occlusion culling still zero when you set everything to drawtype=normal?
04:51 VanessaE but for me, drawtype has little effect on frame rates - I gain *maybe* 5 fps at the spawn using the all-nodeboxes-are-cubes game.
04:51 VanessaE I didn't check then
04:51 kahrl so it might have fixed the occlusion culling but the framerate was still bad because of the entities
04:52 kahrl hard to say if that's true
04:52 VanessaE lemme check it.
04:52 ch98 did anyone try concrete 1.5?
04:53 VanessaE kahrl: #objects is 650, occlusion culled is 0, even with the modified game
04:53 kahrl hrm
04:54 VanessaE view range 50, loaded the game and had to walk about 30m to my usual low-fps observation point at the spawn's north junction.
04:55 VanessaE at present, I'm getting about 32 fps.  Under these conditions, I'd get about 27 fps or so on the live map/normal game.
04:55 VanessaE *turns to look a bit more north*  make that 26-27 fps
04:56 VanessaE running /clearobjects now (this is a backup copy of the live map, so it won't affect the server)
04:58 VanessaE oops, had another copy of MT running, make that 36 fps.  still terrible.
04:59 VanessaE *turns a bit more to find the 'bad' spot*  make that 29.
05:00 VanessaE hell even the act of panning the camera is enough to lower my fps somewhat
05:01 kahrl have you tried starting a completely new world with the same game and mods?
05:01 kahrl how does that occlusion culling for example?
05:01 kahrl s/that/that affect/
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05:01 VanessaE good question.  I create new worlds now and then.  I'll check after /clearobjects is done.
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05:15 Guest03187 is khonkhortisan here? xd
05:17 kahrl i have to sleep a bit, good night
05:18 VanessaE night kahrl
05:18 Guest03187 good night
05:18 VanessaE Guest03187: khonkhortisan was here earlier.
05:18 Guest03187 VanessaE : ah okay
05:42 VanessaE I'm off to bed now too.  Night all.
05:46 khonkhortisan I'm here
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05:46 khonkhortisan aw
05:48 khonkhortisan oh I know who that was
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06:57 lrh9 Hello.
06:57 khonkhortisan hi.
06:58 khonkhortisan Welcome to #minetest. If you can imagine it, you can build it.
07:10 Calinou if we can tell khonkhortisan to stop making stupid mottos, we can do it
07:10 Calinou :-)
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07:14 khonkhortisan blame VanessaE for that one
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07:16 lrh9 I'm studying the internals of voxel games and I was wondering if I could ask some questions to make sure I'm grasping the concepts.
07:16 VanessaE :P
07:16 VanessaE I had to think of something :)
07:17 * VanessaE <-- can't sleep.  as usual.
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07:32 reactor Morning.
07:32 reactor So eh. It works. Part from sound. If I haven't told ye.
07:33 Calinou achivement get! sound on BSD works
07:33 VanessaE morning
07:33 reactor Calinou: not yet, mate.
07:33 reactor I think I'm gonna... test Minecrap, too?
07:33 VanessaE Calinou: can you re-sync your various moreblocks defs against current minetest_game/default soon?
07:34 Calinou VanessaE: which defs?
07:34 reactor But graphics with Java... It will surely lag like hell.
07:34 Calinou or not
07:34 Calinou graphics are done with the GPU
07:34 reactor Slideshow.
07:34 Calinou get a decent driver and graphics card
07:34 VanessaE Calinou: the redefined stuff e.g. jungle grass, saplings, etc.
07:34 reactor Man, there are no drivers for NetBSD.
07:34 Calinou even on a 3970X minecraft is unplayable in software
07:34 reactor Aha.
07:34 Calinou use a OS with drivers then
07:34 Calinou i.e. linux
07:34 reactor Minecraft totally gets pwned then.
07:35 Calinou too bad, it's a decent game too
07:35 reactor I mean, from the runnability-on-software point of view.
07:35 reactor It is, yet I'm frustrated by their choice of programming language.
07:36 reactor And licensing policy.
07:36 reactor By former, rather ffuuustrated.
07:36 Calinou software rendering is old and obsolete, the end
07:36 Calinou we have graphics cards which are much more efficient at rendering
07:36 reactor NVIDIA are assholes. I rest my case.
07:37 Calinou sure, they make the best OpenGL and OpenCL implementation and a good driver
07:37 Calinou their only downsides are 1) fan control isn't OOTB 2) no overclocking 3) high prices
07:37 reactor They're leaving out support for an OS that is used, and is better than other OSes.
07:38 reactor And they are not contributing to open source drivers.
07:38 reactor That makes them double ass holes.
07:38 Calinou not contributing to OSS is fine
07:38 Calinou I'd rather have a good closed driver and no OSS driver than an average closed driver and average OSS
07:39 Calinou they make money with HW already. nothing to fear
07:39 reactor Meh.
07:39 reactor What, say, if your company ceases to exist?
07:39 reactor What are the users left with?
07:40 reactor Or if you recall the proprietary driver? Or terminate support for some device that is still used?
07:40 Calinou they won't
07:40 Calinou they're making tons of money, so why would they disappear
07:40 reactor Oh yeah, it's important they _buy_ their crap. What happens after that is no more of interest.
07:40 Calinou terminate support? who cares?
07:40 reactor Capitalism.
07:40 Calinou the fuss about the radeon HD4000s being not supported is wrong
07:41 Calinou there is no HD4000 that still offers decent performance, except the insanely-expensive bi-GPU epeen-FPS HD4890
07:42 Calinou and nvidia supports their hardware for a longer time anyway
07:42 Calinou (even the 8xxxs, which are more than 5 years old)
07:42 reactor Why not release a driver for NetBSD then?
07:43 reactor It _is_ used as a desktop platform.
07:43 reactor Not many users... WellIt's just about the majority of ~users being not experienced enough
07:44 Calinou too few users, not profitable
07:44 Calinou linux is similar to BSDs
07:44 Calinou so why not use it
07:44 reactor it is not.
07:44 reactor Look at its godawful ways.
07:44 reactor It's a mess no one wants to straighten up.
07:44 reactor Even Linus Torvalds said the kernel is bloated and huge.
07:45 Calinou yeah and?
07:45 reactor And.
07:45 Calinou most distros are still very fast and simple to use
07:45 reactor Try compiling anything without failing.
07:45 Calinou what?
07:45 reactor Oh yeah. They totally are. Like ubuntu.
07:45 Calinou how about this: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=3837
07:45 reactor "fast"
07:45 Calinou xubuntu > ubuntu ;)
07:45 reactor It's still a mess.
07:46 reactor No one wants pulseaudio.
07:46 reactor Or HAl.
07:46 reactor HAL*
07:46 reactor Or all this dbus crap.
07:46 reactor We don't need all this bloody automounting to work. People just need to learn to type!
07:47 Calinou there is no HAL since a few years
07:47 Calinou what?
07:47 Calinou sounds like an ugly troll
07:47 Calinou auto mounting is nice
07:47 Calinou oh and you're allowed to uninstall PA with just a command and a reboot
07:47 reactor Reboot.
07:48 reactor ha.
07:48 reactor That link.
07:48 reactor Well.
07:48 reactor It's good. Why not... but I see integrating packages with package managers as a more efficient way.
07:49 Calinou .deb is pretty much a standard
07:49 reactor You can tell what to build and leave for a tea break.
07:49 reactor I'm talking about source packages.
07:50 reactor Binaries pull tons of unnecessary deps, like the aforementioned ugly pulseaudio crap.
07:50 reactor Or HAL and dbus, that no one will ever use beside the newcomers who are used to Windows-like GUI's.
07:51 Calinou windows-like GUIs are a tried and proven method
07:51 Calinou (before windows 8)
07:51 reactor Even these won't... As for me, after all this time I still haven't gotten to know what to do with these.
07:51 reactor Oh, good luck with tunnel syndrome and not being able to type fast.
07:52 Calinou what? I can type 113 WPm
07:52 arsdragonfly|pho joined #minetest
07:52 Calinou WPM*
07:52 reactor You know, keyboard is the most efficient method of human interaction.
07:52 Calinou mouse can be in some cases
07:52 reactor Mouse is for games and painting. Come on!
07:52 reactor Maybe for CADs!
07:52 Calinou gtg
07:53 reactor But NOT for everyday tasks like opening some disk.
07:53 arsdragonfly|pho how to make animated models?
07:53 reactor Good.
07:53 reactor If I had known, I would tell ye, arsdragonfly|pho.
07:54 reactor First, you're gonna need some CAD... I think.
07:54 reactor To draw them.
07:54 reactor If you find an open source one, let me know.
07:55 VanessaE blender is fine for making models
07:55 VanessaE but that's all I know about it :)
07:55 reactor Hmm.
07:56 reactor Oh yeah. That.
07:56 reactor But can... it be used for engineering?
07:56 VanessaE dunno, but who cares?  this is minetest he's talking about. :)
07:56 reactor I'm looking for something appropriate for drawing eh.
07:57 reactor Yeah, try blender, arsdragonfly|pho.
07:57 arsdragonfly|pho oh yeah
07:58 arsdragonfly|pho I used to make meshes with google sketchup
07:58 arsdragonfly|pho but that doesn't provide animation:-(
07:58 reactor I didn't like Google's ketchup. It tastes like they've been adding too much starch or some other crap.
07:58 reactor s/tes/ted/
07:59 reactor "tested".
07:59 VanessaE reactor: too much high fructose corn syrup :)
07:59 reactor Guess I might want to talk to GLaDOS.
07:59 reactor Oooh yeah yeah. Corn.
07:59 reactor Uhhhuhuhuh.
08:03 khonkhortisan bad argument #3 to 'add_node' (string expected, got boolean)
08:03 khonkhortisan I'm only giving it two arguments
08:03 VanessaE since when does add_node take more than t2?
08:03 VanessaE -t
08:03 khonkhortisan minetest.env:add_node(pos, {name = mesecon:get_conductor_on(node.name, rulename), param2 = node.param2})
08:03 reactor More, I can say they're number one company at making tomatoes inedible.
08:03 reactor khonkhortisan: you're bad at arguing then
08:04 khonkhortisan Tomatoes and onions, I may or may not like depending on how they're prepared.
08:04 reactor I'm talking about Google's brand new ketchup sauce.
08:04 reactor It's awful.
08:05 reactor s/Go/the Go/
08:05 khonkhortisan sour cream and onion chips are good, but not onions in hamburgers. Pizza and spaghetti are good but not tomato soup
08:06 reactor Onions... You've reminded me of a good record by Booker T. and the MG's. Green onions.
08:06 reactor s/oni/Oni/
08:07 reactor Meh, whoever invented fast food was an evil genius. Getting paid for making the nation sick. Uhhuhuhuhuh.
08:07 khonkhortisan it takes three arguments since I pulled a new copy of minetest
08:07 tango_ joined #minetest
08:07 reactor Try ''
08:08 reactor Or any sequence of chars.
08:08 reactor Since it expects a string.
08:08 khonkhortisan it might be the env: it's actually complaining about
08:08 reactor Man, I've never understood the idea behind the string theory.
08:09 khonkhortisan aah! I changed minetest.env:add_node to minetest.add_node, and now it's complaining about argument #4!
08:09 reactor What language?
08:10 khonkhortisan lua, minetest mod, mesecons
08:10 reactor Yipe. Interpreted languages, here we go again.
08:11 khonkhortisan compiled, then interpreted.
08:11 khonkhortisan I think.
08:25 Calinou joined #minetest
08:31 JamesTait Good morning all, happy Autistic Pride Day! :-D
08:31 ImQ009 joined #minetest
08:37 TheLastProject joined #minetest
08:44 reactor Nuclear meltdown?
08:44 Calinou BSD meltdown
08:44 reactor Calinou: oh... it's you.
08:47 TheLastProject reactor: Good to know I'm not the only one who feels that way about Calinou
08:47 reactor TheLastProject: no, no. Don't get me wrong. It's a quote.
08:48 TheLastProject reactor: You're quoting GLaDOS without even meaning the sarcasm? :(
08:48 reactor JamesTait: I like the new name given to the lack of social and mechanical skills. Yeah.
08:49 reactor TheLastProject: oh yeah. I think I've list some logic boards today.
08:49 reactor s/list/lost.
08:49 reactor See that?
08:49 * JamesTait smirks
08:49 Calinou smirking is illegal in the USA
08:50 LunaVorax joined #minetest
08:50 TheLastProject We're not in the USA, Calinou, we're on the Internet
08:50 JamesTait Calinou, smirking is illegal on my server as well.
08:50 john_minetest joined #minetest
08:50 reactor Smirking is illegal in labs here.
08:51 JamesTait Alas, it's about the only place in the word I have any authority.
08:51 JamesTait And the world, as well.
08:51 reactor Because hell knows what someone who smirks wants. Or would you like to be poured with liquid nitrogen all over?
08:52 JamesTait Let me think about that.
08:52 Calinou says the guy who runs their CPU @ stock
08:55 reactor Calinou: so what?
09:01 reactor Calinou: what do you mean stock?
09:04 Calinou stock frequencies
09:04 Calinou and you're talking about LN2 :P
09:06 reactor ?
09:06 reactor Well, personally, i'm skeptical towards overclocking.
09:07 reactor If I wanted more computing power, I would buy/find one more machine.
09:11 reactor s/ i/ I/
09:13 Calinou >uses BSD
09:13 Calinou >says overclocking is bad
09:13 Calinou mmmmph
09:13 Calinou and you say people shouldn't use nvidia driver because of bankrupting?
09:26 reactor I say people shouldn't be buying stuff produced by assholes, Calinou.
09:28 ImQ009 joined #minetest
09:29 Calinou reactor: what CPU do you have? i forgot
09:29 Calinou if intel: then you are buying stuff produced by assholes :P
09:30 reactor Well, I didn't choose to buy it.
09:30 reactor I'm not paying a cent to the Chinese.
09:30 reactor But.
09:31 reactor Intel, AMD, what's the difference? It's still the crappy PC architecture.
09:31 reactor x86 assembly is crap.
09:33 Calinou why aren't you using ARM then?
09:34 reactor If there was an option.
09:39 Jordach joined #minetest
09:39 Jordach joined #minetest
09:44 * VanessaE pokes john_minetest
09:44 VanessaE d'oh
09:44 VanessaE left #minetest
09:44 VanessaE joined #minetest
09:44 VanessaE damn it!
09:44 VanessaE way to ruin a joke.
09:44 * VanessaE pokes Jordach
09:44 Jordach hello
09:44 Jordach early / late for you
09:45 john_minetest Hi VanessaE
09:46 VanessaE late in my case.  couldn't sleep
09:46 VanessaE hi john; that poke was meant for Jordach :)
09:46 john_minetest 11:46:35 here
09:46 Jordach VanessaE, cant sleep in my own bed, but i can on the sofa
09:48 Jordach VanessaE, mgv7 is getting fixed quick
09:48 VanessaE I saw
09:48 Jordach it's either going to make 0.5.x
09:48 Jordach (as in, next minetest-stable = 0.5.x)
09:48 VanessaE at the rate it and the version numbers are going, I'd expect around 0.4.9 or .10
09:49 Jordach yeah
09:49 Jordach my chest feels really compressed
09:50 whirm joined #minetest
09:50 VanessaE sorry to hear :(
09:50 Jordach i'd love to see mgv7 in action one day
09:50 Jordach MoreBiomes anyone?
09:50 Taoki joined #minetest
09:50 Jordach Taoki, mgv7 + MoreBiomes mod
09:51 Taoki Jordach: What about it?
09:52 Jordach in theory, we could have HUGE amounts of biomes
09:52 Jordach fairy, badlands, etc
09:53 Taoki Jordach: Sure, v7 will allow custom biomes :)
09:53 Jordach i also forgot pony
09:53 Jordach where simple mobs spawn ponies
09:54 Taoki Eh, don't bother with ponies for minetest_game
09:54 Taoki Let me make a whole my_little_pony_game when I have the time :D
09:55 Taoki (that's actually a real plan, but for later)
09:55 Taoki For now, BBL
09:55 Jordach Taoki, suggestion: go look at the mine little pony mod for MC
09:55 Jordach they use a modified player skin
09:55 Taoki yeah
09:55 reactor Taoki: UNIX v7?
09:55 Jordach which we could do and keep compat
09:58 reactor Eh.
09:58 reactor v7 was pretty good
09:58 Calinou Jordach: model*
09:58 VanessaE reactor: Minetest mapgen v7.
09:59 reactor Oh.
09:59 * Jordach didnt see Calinou
09:59 LunaVorax joined #minetest
09:59 * Jordach runs and hides
09:59 reactor Coulda mention that.
09:59 Jordach reactor, OpenVMS#
09:59 Jordach -#
09:59 reactor VMS. Meh.
09:59 reactor I's never be able to comprehend it.
10:00 VanessaE reactor: "mgv7" is a standard abbreviation in these parts for that.
10:00 reactor I mean, eh.
10:00 whirm minetest has just been packaged for Void linux (voidlinux.eu)
10:00 reactor Confused.
10:00 reactor There are too many linux distros out there.
10:01 whirm reactor: yes, that's an universal truth :)
10:01 reactor Uhhuhhuhuh. I wouldn't know.
10:04 xtraeme joined #minetest
10:05 qznc joined #minetest
10:06 Calinou whirm: cool story bro
10:06 Calinou :>
10:10 Jordach oh god
10:10 Jordach the swiss have build a robot cat: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2013/06/17/swiss_robot_cat/
10:10 Jordach built*
10:10 VanessaE that's a cat?
10:11 Jordach VanessaE, next thing we'll be getting cats from ikea
10:11 reactor Does it come with a Swiss watch built in?
10:11 Jordach except it comes in bits
10:11 reactor Good.
10:12 reactor Schroedinger's?
10:12 Calinou "shroedinger's cat" is a linux distro
10:12 Calinou so no
10:12 Calinou linux distro version*
10:14 reactor Eh.
10:14 reactor I meant the cat!
10:14 reactor I meant the bloody cat!
10:23 PilzAdam joined #minetest
10:23 proller joined #minetest
10:23 VanessaE shit, everyone hide!
10:24 Jordach dun dun durr
10:24 xtraeme left #minetest
10:27 VanessaE actually I think I'll go hide...in bed.  Time to try this sleep thing again.
10:28 VanessaE night
10:30 PilzAdam Hello everyone!
10:31 reactor I am countable. So, hello.
10:37 TheLastProject joined #minetest
10:38 pandaro joined #minetest
10:38 pandaro hi all
10:39 pandaro i'm not sure but...
10:39 pandaro Gaithersburg dentistA is spam i think
10:40 pandaro see the last post of this discussion :     http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=6256
10:40 kaeza joined #minetest
10:43 Jordach hey kaeza
10:43 kaeza mornings
10:43 Jordach for once theres a nice smell in this room
10:43 kaeza sup Jordach
10:43 Jordach (rather sweet like sugar, but not sugar in smell.)
10:44 kaeza I can sell you some incense sticks
10:44 kaeza Come to my store
10:44 kaeza the best one in 3 Ombúes
10:44 kaeza (also perhaps the only "decent" one)
10:45 Jordach ha
10:45 Issa joined #minetest
10:45 kaeza most of them sell other... kind of tuff
10:46 kaeza *cough*cannabis*cough*
10:46 * Jordach takes a iron man suit over to argentina
10:46 Issa yeaa
10:47 Calinou joined #minetest
10:47 kaeza heh
10:47 kaeza like Calinou
10:47 kaeza oops
10:48 * kaeza runs
10:48 * Calinou checks logs
10:49 Calinou no, I am not a drug :>
10:49 Zeg9 joined #minetest
10:50 Jordach kaeza, i'd be there in a heartbeat if i could :P
10:50 kaeza whoa dude
10:50 kaeza don't come here
10:50 kaeza the unicorns are in bad mood
10:50 Jordach Calinou, MAPS: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=95384#p95384
10:51 Jordach (!rev MAPS)
10:51 Calinou buut unicorns are never in a bad moon
10:51 Calinou mood*
10:51 PilzAdam Calinou, http://forum.minetest.net/search.php?action=show_user_posts&amp;user_id=6167
10:51 Calinou "dentist games" lol'd
10:51 Calinou done
10:51 Calinou thanks for reporting :p
10:53 Jordach i found an interesting piece of propietary software the other day: it contained py2exe
10:58 reactor pandaro: you mean Heisenberg?
10:59 pandaro please explain better reactor
10:59 Jordach this website loves to 502
11:00 reactor Because you must have really really bad... gateway... computer... thing.
11:00 reactor Passive-aggressive.
11:00 Jordach > nginx/1.2.1
11:00 Jordach oh
11:00 reactor That's it.
11:00 reactor It's passive-aggressive.
11:02 pandaro reactor: are you talking to me?
11:02 reactor I'm not talking to you anymore.
11:03 pandaro ok
11:03 reactor You're not being consistent.
11:03 pandaro lol
11:04 Jordach * lamefun has quit (Quit: Worship JavaScript!)
11:05 reactor Oh yeah yeah.
11:08 PilzAdam joined #minetest
11:09 reactor pandaro: but seriously, I didn't mean anything meaningful.
11:10 reactor Jordach: yeah, I've seen some 502's from nginx's. From other daemons... not so much.
11:10 kaeza 10:11<Jordach> next thing we'll be getting cats from ikea
11:10 kaeza https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/100008207/descarga%20%289%29.jpg
11:10 reactor kaeza: wow.
11:10 reactor Both alive and dead in the box?
11:10 reactor Cool. I need to buy one. To surprise my quantum mechanics reader.
11:10 pandaro reactor:no problem
11:11 Jordach i just went full fucktard
11:11 kaeza reactor, :D
11:12 Jordach oh cmon
11:12 Jordach free daily spin: wins spin
11:12 reactor np: youtube - Jordach melts down
11:12 Jordach spins again: wins another spin
11:12 Jordach wtf
11:12 Jordach another spin
11:12 kaeza Jordach, ~roulette?
11:13 Jordach nope
11:13 reactor A meat spin?
11:13 Jordach dem fb games
11:13 kaeza ._.
11:13 kaeza lol fb
11:13 Jordach i hate loops
11:13 Calinou kaeza: looks like Jordach building a PC
11:13 Calinou :3
11:14 reactor Ooh yeah yeah, Jordach. "goto" in C.
11:14 * Jordach slaps Calinou with a 486
11:14 reactor x86... oh come on!
11:14 kaeza I'll seriously want to kill every game that ends in -Ville
11:14 Jordach kaeza, i play pool
11:14 reactor kaezaville
11:14 kaeza -'ll
11:14 reactor now, kill yourself
11:14 kaeza I'm lready dead
11:14 * reactor slaps Calinou with a PDP-10. Now that'll fix it.
11:14 kaeza I'm a zimbie
11:14 kaeza ...viell
11:15 reactor s/it/him/
11:15 kaeza fuck kb
11:15 kaeza ville*
11:15 reactor villain!
11:15 Calinou how 'bout itanium
11:15 reactor I've got an idea. Villainville.
11:15 reactor Too small. Wouldn't reach through the bone structure of your head.
11:15 kaeza vile != ville
11:16 kaeza lrn2englisch
11:16 reactor Mkay...
11:16 reactor I do know mine is not perfect.
11:16 paramat joined #minetest
11:16 kaeza whose is?
11:16 reactor Error.
11:17 kaeza certainly not that of americans
11:17 reactor Oh. Didn't see that coming. I meant to say, I don't know.
11:17 kaeza bleh
11:17 reactor Pff.
11:17 kaeza I just insulted myself ._.
11:18 reactor Man, that's nothing compared to Engrish.
11:18 kaeza IKR
11:18 Calinou reactor: so villains are ponies
11:18 Calinou TIL
11:18 kaeza no
11:18 reactor Calinou: Sorry, I'm not a zoo. Define "TIL".
11:18 kaeza there's only one villain here
11:18 Jordach today i learned
11:18 Calinou today I learned
11:19 Jordach and thats PilzAdam
11:19 reactor kaeza: no, I am not.
11:19 kaeza ^
11:20 reactor That was preemptive.
11:20 reactor I've got a quote for the case.
11:20 reactor "That 'shh' was a preemptive one, just so you know I've got a whole bag of 'shh's for you..."
11:21 reactor If... my memory.
11:21 kaeza hahaha...no
11:21 reactor Seriously, what if Matrix?
11:21 reactor I mean, what if Marx*
11:21 reactor and Engels...
11:22 reactor were...                actually... thE VILL\\\\\ AIN_s
11:22 Calinou the BSD users*
11:22 kaeza ¿?
11:23 reactor No.
11:23 reactor Man, this is old.
11:23 Jordach Calinou, BSD runs faster than Linux
11:23 reactor It's a matter of choice which OS to run.
11:23 reactor Jordach: depends.
11:24 Calinou Jordach: or not, see phoronix
11:24 reactor Too many variables.
11:24 Jordach considering 36fps Linux, 45 Windows and 51 BSD
11:24 reactor Any OS can outrun any OS.
11:24 Jordach that's minetest
11:24 reactor Jordach: not on software render.
11:24 Jordach trolololol
11:24 reactor Jordach: FreeBSD?
11:24 reactor Okay, I might wanna test it this summer.
11:24 Jordach pcBSD
11:24 reactor But eh.
11:24 Jordach comes with KDE
11:25 reactor I do like NetBSD's ways. Especially its documentation.
11:25 Jordach which BSD was made for
11:25 reactor Meh, KDE.
11:25 reactor It's been long since I've taken a dump on GUI.
11:25 Calinou lol
11:25 Jordach if XFCE4.10 was on Windows, i'd be using it right now
11:26 reactor Meh.
11:26 reactor People, keyboards are designed for _two_ bloody hands!
11:26 reactor How do you manage to type and move that little rodent?!
11:26 Jordach reactor, not me :O
11:26 Jordach because pron
11:27 reactor Naughty naughty naughty naughty!
11:27 reactor "You filthy old soomka!"
11:28 * kaeza highfives Jordach
11:28 kaeza :D
11:28 reactor Anyway... ahem. I di really think mouse-driven interfaces slow everything down.
11:28 PilzAdam sfan5, wheres MinetestBot?
11:28 reactor Because you can't type fast while your right (or left) hand is elsewhere.
11:29 Jordach i have a chrome extension that hides all my tabs and puts them into bookmarks for later, guess what they were
11:29 reactor Jordach: may I extrapolate?
11:29 paramat Hi :] Is proller or anyone else interested in fixing the flat edges in MGV6indev floatlands? An easy fix, see http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=90954#p90954
11:30 PilzAdam reactor, I control 90% of my GUI with the keyboard
11:30 PilzAdam the other 10% are Minetest
11:30 Calinou the other 10% are pron
11:30 reactor PilzAdam: How?
11:30 reactor For ex., firefox?
11:30 reactor How, without vimperator?!
11:30 Calinou reactor: tab, alt+f4, alt+f2, shift+tab, down/up/left/right arrow, home, end...
11:30 reactor Calinou: not enough.
11:30 kaeza lol
11:31 reactor Tab is too slow to get to the right button every time.
11:31 reactor Seriously, people. That's molasses slow and turd disgusting.
11:31 proller paramat, very interested, but can you make pull?
11:31 kaeza reactor, go back to vim
11:31 reactor vim is a decent editor
11:31 PilzAdam reactor, there are even functions in Firefox that I dont even know how to call them with a mouse
11:31 reactor Control-Shift-P.
11:31 Jordach http://i.imgur.com/h3v3HUC.png
11:32 reactor yeah...
11:32 reactor Jordach: I won't.
11:32 kaeza Ctrl+Shift+N
11:32 kaeza if you know what I mean
11:32 reactor Because that is obvious.
11:32 Jordach kaeza, its actually quite stupid
11:32 reactor kaeza: Control-Alt-Backspace
11:32 Jordach ctrl + shift + sys req
11:32 reactor and K
11:32 reactor yeah
11:32 Jordach a/shift/
11:33 Jordach s/shift/alt
11:33 reactor "a" is not an ex command
11:33 reactor thou faileth
11:33 kaeza lol
11:33 Jordach i want one: http://i.imgur.com/A8kOjj7.jpg
11:33 reactor I want minus one.
11:34 reactor Oh wait, no. Nononononon65535
11:34 reactor Thanks for testing.
11:34 kaeza Jordach, X on ubuntu ignores Ctrl+AtlBackspace
11:34 kaeza Alt+*
11:34 PilzAdam Jordach, s/Minetest-c55/Minetest/ in your bookmarks
11:34 reactor Ubuntu is lame.
11:34 kaeza no u
11:34 Jordach PilzAdam, i was here before you
11:34 reactor Can't update anything without breaking everything.
11:35 reactor Debilian.
11:35 PilzAdam Jordach, ... and?
11:35 reactor Jordach: what kernel does PCBSD use?
11:35 proller paramat, or describe what to change. if onle noice params - test it via config, now all 3 noices is configurable
11:35 reactor Jordach: FreeBSD, OpenBSD or NetBSD/
11:35 reactor s/\//?/
11:36 proller pc = free
11:36 Jordach reactor, freeBSD iirc
11:36 Jordach http://i.imgur.com/1dlFJ0w.jpg
11:36 reactor MKay.
11:36 reactor s/K/k/
11:36 reactor Back then... they... Wait a second.
11:36 reactor How do you select text in terminals without the rodent?
11:36 reactor I'm kind of tired of having to pull the cursor around with mouse emulation keys.
11:37 kaeza is there a way to simulate calculating the item drops? sans implementing that myself?
11:37 kaeza node drops*
11:37 reactor drone ops*
11:37 Jordach http://i.imgur.com/9jILRdI.jpg
11:38 kaeza ^
11:38 proller btw - waiting freebsd port update .. http://www.freebsd.org/cgi/query-pr.cgi?pr=ports/178244
11:38 reactor Meh. Ports.
11:38 reactor Why do they call them ports, when everyone else calls them source packages?
11:38 reactor What a stupid word - ports.
11:38 whirm reactor: I use urxvt with a small vi like selection extension
11:39 reactor Oh.
11:39 reactor I've never had this idea.
11:40 whirm reactor: http://www.github.com/muennich/urxvt-perls
11:40 paramat proller: pull request? Ha i am useless on github.
11:43 paramat proller: ... i cant yet program in C++ so i need someone else to fix the flat edges.
11:43 proller learn it, not very hard, but useful
11:43 reactor whirm: trying...
11:44 proller paramat, ok, describe what i must change
11:44 proller reactor, because ports - its ports, they using source packages,
11:45 paramat proller: Yes learning C++ is a good idea :)
11:46 proller look at code, its not harder than lua
11:47 proller https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/mapgen_indev.cpp#L347
11:47 Jordach kaeza, http://i.imgur.com/GHrfZFe.jpg
11:48 kaeza LOL
11:51 paramat proller: Okay cool, see this post http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=77490#p77490 and the following post ...
11:51 kaeza what does 'rarity' in 'drop' means? 1/rarity chance?
11:51 Exio i guess
11:52 Exio hi btw
11:52 kaeza hai Exio
11:52 Exio :D
11:54 Jordach i'm going to troll the NSA
11:54 Jordach im making a document in GDocs called terrorist plans
11:54 Jordach and just have an image of the troll face in it
11:55 paramat proller: The 3 SEEDDIFF values should only depend on minp.y , they should be of this form: local perlin1 = env:get_perlin(SEEDDIFF1 + minp.y * 100, OCTAVES1, PERSISTENCE1, SCALE1)
11:57 LunaVorax joined #minetest
11:57 reactor brb
11:59 Jordach i like trolling: http://i.imgur.com/cPqDeGM.png
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12:04 kaeza Jordach, lol
12:09 Jordach kaeza, the look on the agents faces
12:11 paramat proller: Secondly, to avoid the 64 node repeating configuration you disliked, perlin noise 1 needs a larger scale such as 256, so the new default parameters should be: mgindev_np_float_islands1 = 0,    1,   (256,  256,  256 ), 3683,  6, 0.5,  1,   1.5
12:17 paramat proller: So the number of octaves has increased to 6 to retain fine detail.
12:22 Jordach paramat, you should make a mapgen to replace the existing one
12:23 sfan5 hello
12:23 Jordach all in lua w/ configurable nodes
12:23 PilzAdam sfan5, get MinetestBot here. Now.
12:23 JamesTait joined #minetest
12:23 sfan5 my vps is still down :(
12:24 MinetestBot joined #minetest
12:24 Jordach sentry down!
12:24 sfan5 MinetestBot!
12:24 MinetestBot sfan5!
12:24 Jordach !up redcrab.suret.ner 30401
12:24 MinetestBot redcrab.suret.ner:30401 seems to be down
12:24 Jordach !up redcrab.suret.net 30401
12:24 MinetestBot redcrab.suret.net:30401 is up (369ms)
12:24 Jordach mmm
12:24 paramat proller: Hopefully that's a quick and easy improvement, for any big changes i agree i will study the code and try to code it myself ;]
12:27 paramat Jordach: Ha ... 'all in lua' i like the sound of that.
12:27 proller ok, will try today later
12:28 Jordach paramat, PilzAdam ported the minetest trees to lua
12:29 PilzAdam https://github.com/PilzAdam/farming_plus/blob/master/init.lua#L39
12:30 PilzAdam it isnt optimized or anything
12:31 kaeza ha! fixed the digging in technic constructor mk3
12:31 kaeza now I can make automated farms :P
12:32 kaeza way too much code duplication here ;_;
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12:47 rubenwardy Hi all
12:48 PilzAdam hi
12:49 rubenwardy How are you?
12:50 Mir__ joined #minetest
12:52 Mir__ Hello to all, can I ask for some help?
12:52 Kacey how can i get automatic water buckets?
12:52 kaeza YAY
12:52 kaeza http://youtu.be/eotIs5D1bWk
12:52 kaeza Kacey, ^
12:53 PilzAdam Mir__, dont ask to ask, just ask
12:54 Kacey i need to get the water bucket and then send it through a pipe...
12:54 Mir__ I'm running Minetest 0.4.6 and I have some problems with minetestmapper.py: It doesn't draw the whole world.
12:55 JamesTait joined #minetest
12:57 rubenwardy Look at the parameters, Mir__
12:58 rubenwardy there may be one like on the C++ version that specifies how far to draw
12:59 Mir__ rubenwardy: running minetestmapper.py --help I can't see anything about size or geometry
13:00 rubenwardy bounds?
13:00 Mir__ nope
13:02 rubenwardy I personally use the c++ version, it is 50 times faster
13:02 Mir__ yes, but with that version I have some strange "holes" everywhere
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13:03 Mir__ the python version I'm using is the same present on github now
13:04 kahrl Mir__: the boundaries are hardcoded at minetestmapper.py:163
13:05 Mir__ kahrl: thanks
13:05 PilzAdam kahrl, related: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/296
13:06 PilzAdam Mir__, can you test that one ^ ?
13:06 Mir__ PilzAdam: sure
13:07 proller joined #minetest
13:09 * Kacey needs to get automatic water buckets and automatically plant seeds
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13:16 arsdragonfly !server ping:most
13:16 MinetestBot arsdragonfly: Arsdragonfly's server | arsenalmp.no-ip.org | Clients: 1/100, 4 | Version: 0.4.7 | ping: 0.523
13:17 arsdragonfly can anyone join this server?
13:17 arsdragonfly seems every is timing out upon joining :-(
13:18 PilzAdam joined #minetest
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13:31 * paramat is very tired, his sleep cycle is out of phase and he was up all night programming an alien planet realm generator mod.
13:32 * Jordach hands paramat energy drinks
13:35 paramat The lua trees in my slabrealm mod have simple roots, i'm thinking of letting soil depth decide where they can grow: 1 node depth = grasses only.
13:37 * paramat is in the UK but is still up :P
13:37 * Jordach scratches head
13:38 Jordach Ukraine or England
13:38 Final joined #minetest
13:40 Mir__ PilzAdam: I've tested the patched minetestmappers and it works well. The only thing I noticed is that the ETA count is less precise
13:40 PilzAdam yea, I noticed that ETA thing too, it goes up on a big map
13:41 rubenwerdy I am just updating my irc client...
13:41 PilzAdam rubenwerdy, hello fake rubenwardy
13:41 rubenwerdy joined #minetest
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13:41 rubenwardy fool!
13:42 rubenwardy joined #minetest
13:43 paramat Jordach, England.
13:43 Jordach sweet
13:43 Jordach <- from norfolk
13:44 rubenwardy joined #minetest
13:44 rubenwardy Hmmm
13:45 rubenwardy joined #minetest
13:46 rubenwardy joined #minetest
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13:46 paramat Yes me Norfolk too, nice dark grey sky and heavy atmosphere, hoping for thunder.
13:46 Jordach rubenwardy, solve your join issues
13:47 rubenwardy not join issues
13:47 rubenwardy restarting to test themes
13:47 rubenwardy done now
13:47 Jordach paramat, most likely
13:48 whirm is anybody working on having weather stuff in minetest?
13:50 PilzAdam whirm, there is a weather mod
13:50 kaeza Jordach, https://github.com/RealBadAngel/technic/pull/32
13:50 Jordach i know i can pull in the repo
13:51 whirm PilzAdam: oh, cool, Ill google for it, thanks
13:51 Jordach kaeza, switched design to github next as its going to be used in future
13:52 kaeza Jordach, new design looks simpler somewhat
13:52 kaeza at least places more important information more prominently
13:52 Jordach donesies.
13:53 kaeza woo
13:53 kaeza didn't know you had access to the repo
13:54 paramat Despite a slight increase in mapgen time, i like the idea of Minetest trees having 2 or 3 nodes of trunk below ground.
13:54 Jordach i got given it a fucking while back
13:54 Jordach paramat, thats actually pretty good
13:56 msandoy joined #minetest
13:58 rubenwardy on single player, I keep on placing a node and it disappears
13:59 rubenwardy I choose enougher block and it works
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14:14 kaeza "enougher"?
14:14 kaeza ._.
14:16 rubenwardy another
14:18 kaeza rubenwardy, how's the NodeBox Generator coming along?
14:18 rubenwardy not much has changed
14:19 kaeza oh :(
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14:40 Jordach kaeza, http://seemikedraw.com.au/
14:44 kaeza bookmarked :D
14:44 kaeza http://seemikedraw.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/seemikedraw-see-you-in-hell.gif
14:46 BrandonReese joined #minetest
14:50 kahrl VanessaE, do you run any mod that modifies textures or other media while the server is running?
14:51 bas080 joined #minetest
14:57 Calinou joined #minetest
14:59 kahrl mapplus, for example
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15:07 rubenwardy !up rubenwardy.no-ip.net
15:07 MinetestBot rubenwardy.no-ip.net:30000 seems to be down
15:07 rubenwardy !up rubenwardy.no-ip.biz
15:08 rubenwardy !up rubenwardy.no-ip.biz
15:08 MinetestBot rubenwardy.no-ip.biz:30000 is up (2923ms)
15:08 Jordach rubenwardy, if you have a no-ip DNS account
15:08 sfan5 2923 ms...
15:08 Jordach your homehub can sync for you
15:08 rubenwardy I know
15:08 rubenwardy that is what I am doing
15:08 rubenwardy :P
15:08 Jordach like me
15:08 rubenwardy /done
15:08 Jordach thats the first time BT did anything right
15:08 Jordach </troll>
15:09 rubenwardy I just //save and //load a house
15:09 rubenwardy transplanting
15:09 Jordach sfan5, worldedit needs a //scale function
15:09 Jordach so: //scale 2 doubles the structure
15:10 sfan5 Jordach: -> http://github.com/Uberi/<idon'tremeber>-worldedit/issues/new
15:10 Jordach going going gone
15:12 Jordach #23 worldedit
15:17 hmmmm joined #minetest
15:19 rubenwardy maybe something like //load map_name 2
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15:29 VanessaE kahrl: as far as I am aware, no.  player_textures is the only one that I know of that does anything close to that
15:29 VanessaE hi all.
15:30 VanessaE (and it only loads images at player sign-on)
15:32 kaeza well, depending on what he means by "modify", the signs from homedecor may create tons of textures
15:32 VanessaE yes, those do but only at the moment you hit enter to edit a sign
15:33 VanessaE I assume he meant textures on nodes though
15:33 kaeza speaking of which... what happens with the textures when you change them on the fly?
15:34 kaeza for example, my firearms mod creates tons of textures for the ammo counters
15:34 VanessaE there are a few mods here and there that use animated textures on nodeboxes (3d forniture/homedecor torches, pipeworks spigots, surely others)
15:34 VanessaE kaeza: I wasn't aware that textures could be modified in realtime anyway
15:35 VanessaE (not without that one patch c55/RBA were mulling over a while back)
15:35 kaeza VanessaE, I assumed foo.png^bar.png" created a new texture?
15:35 VanessaE kaeza: it does, but those things are done at startup, not actively.
15:35 VanessaE afaik you can't do that to a node any time other than inside a register_node() call
15:35 kaeza what about HUD?
15:35 VanessaE (which can, when last I checked, only be run once)
15:35 VanessaE nothing I use operates on the HUD
15:36 kaeza (or entities for that matter)
15:36 kaeza s/for that matter/too/
15:36 VanessaE Jordach: you have push access to technic?  cool.
15:40 rubenwardy VanessaE: more trees look awesome in a map
15:40 rubenwardy ie: map.png
15:40 VanessaE thanks
15:40 Jordach VanessaE, seen my trolling with GDocs?
15:40 VanessaE Jordach: no
15:41 Jordach VanessaE, http://i.imgur.com/cPqDeGM.png
15:41 VanessaE oh
15:53 rubenwardy wtf?
15:54 rubenwardy Server -!- Invalid node name: moreblocks:stonesquare
15:54 Calinou moreblocks:stone_square
15:54 Calinou erm
15:54 Calinou moreblocks:stone_tile
15:54 Calinou Jordach: "I watch it for the terrorist plot"
15:54 rubenwardy wierd
15:54 rubenwardy :P http://wiki.minetest.com/wiki/Item_Codes/moreblocks
15:55 Calinou it is old
15:55 Calinou there, updated
16:11 rubenwardy Would any one like to help me build a town hall on rubenwardy.no-ip.biz:30000?
16:11 Calinou maybe
16:11 Jordach maybe
16:11 sfan5 !c 2^5/2
16:11 MinetestBot 16
16:12 rubenwardy I was thinking roman style or tradional style
16:12 rubenwardy Inspiration: https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=town%20hall%20minecraft&amp;oe=utf-8&amp;aq=t&amp;rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&amp;client=firefox-a&amp;um=1&amp;ie=UTF-8&amp;hl=en&amp;tbm=isch&amp;source=og&amp;sa=N&amp;tab=wi&amp;ei=o4bAUcSDLcOg0QXbzoDICQ&amp;biw=1366&amp;bih=614&amp;sei=pYbAUeK_Iuar0gX-xIGQCw
16:13 sfan5 !c 2^6/2
16:13 MinetestBot 32
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16:16 Jordach sfan5, is this the calculations for //scale
16:16 sfan5 Jordach: no
16:16 Jordach :(
16:17 sfan5 calculations for //scale would be like *2
16:18 Jordach wrong
16:19 Jordach cubic volumes are not treated as x*y*z
16:19 Jordach -*z
16:22 rubenwardy Where can I get half walls
16:22 rubenwardy ie this: "01/01" which is one node
16:23 rubenwardy 0 = air
16:23 rubenwardy 1 = block
16:23 VanessaE wall slabs?
16:23 rubenwardy yeah
16:23 VanessaE moreblocks circular saw
16:23 rubenwardy ah
16:23 rubenwardy wow
16:24 VanessaE it uses 6dfacedir now.  Calinou, can you please adjust the facedir rotation for when slabs are placed in wall orientation?  I got it wrong, the axis-relative rotation is off by 90 degrees
16:25 MarkTwain joined #minetest
16:25 MarkTwain Hello
16:26 VanessaE hi
16:26 VanessaE Calinou: also use the same rotation for the abm that converts the old slabs
16:27 rubenwardy How do you get a panel to go vertically?
16:27 VanessaE rubenwardy: hold shift while you place it
16:28 rubenwardy nope
16:28 VanessaE you can also directly place it against a wall and it'll flip upward to match.
16:28 VanessaE well
16:28 VanessaE hold your 'sneak' key
16:28 VanessaE (for me, that's shift)
16:28 rubenwardy it is still horisontal
16:28 VanessaE update your copy of moreblocks :-)
16:29 rubenwardy Downloaded today
16:29 VanessaE from git?
16:29 rubenwardy no
16:29 VanessaE that's why
16:29 VanessaE get it from his "calinou_mods" git repo
16:29 rubenwardy meh
16:30 VanessaE https://github.com/Calinou/calinou_mods
16:30 rubenwardy how do you download a single folder?
16:30 rubenwardy I hate how he does that
16:30 VanessaE you can't.  you have to download the whole thing and copy over the one you need
16:31 MarkTwain redsand wont work with the latest
16:31 MarkTwain minetest.chat_send_player(name, string.format("\nCurrent players online: %d\nNames: \[%s\]", count, namelist))
16:31 VanessaE redsand?
16:31 MarkTwain that one line
16:31 MarkTwain the server tools
16:32 rubenwardy Lol
16:33 rubenwardy If you drag the minetest window half ofscreen to the right when it is loading, when it loads the camera spins infinitely
16:33 rubenwardy rubenwardy.no-ip.biz:30000 !
16:34 rubenwardy still not working
16:38 iqualfragile joined #minetest
16:38 VanessaE rubenwardy: odd, it works fine on my server
16:38 rubenwardy Using the screw driver to do it :P
16:40 khonkhortisan I also get that spin
16:40 FreeFull joined #minetest
16:45 rubenwardy brb
16:54 Maccer joined #minetest
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17:00 rubenwardy back
17:01 rubenwardy Redsand is outdated
17:02 rubenwardy MarkTwain: I assume count or namelist is undefined
17:07 Jordach Calinou, i've been playing a little Trackmania
17:08 Jordach rubenwardy, joining
17:08 bas080 joined #minetest
17:08 Jordach y u no server
17:09 salamanderrake joined #minetest
17:10 Jordach my chest feels like theyre's hundreds of fat people on my chest
17:10 Jordach -on my chest
17:10 Jordach actually scrap that last line :P
17:12 Calinou mmmph, Traxie21 connected to the xonotic server I play on
17:12 Calinou on the server with pawny mode :P
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17:39 Jordach joined #minetest
17:40 Jordach did i change host again?
17:40 kaeza nope
17:40 kaeza already joined as unaffiliated
17:50 MinetestBot GIT: davidzgumberg@gmail.com commited to minetest/minetest: Compress textures 26165453d2 2013-06-18T12:48:04-07:00 http://git.io/HfGXpQ
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18:13 khonkhortisan I made mesecon:is_conductor_off return not mesecon:is_conducor_on, instead of being an equivalent function. What I didn't notice is the default boolean return value if it fails to find whether it's on or off. It's not exactly equivalent.
18:14 khonkhortisan is_on and is_off are both false if it's not a conductor, and those functions aren't interchangable.
18:15 neko259 joined #minetest
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19:03 hmmmm I'm at the pizza hut
19:03 hmmmm I'm at the taco bell
19:03 hmmmm I'm at the commmmmmbination pizza hut and taco bell
19:03 * Calinou is actually eating a pizza
19:03 VanessaE pizza..... *whimper*
19:03 Calinou hmmmm, wallhack
19:03 Calinou :<
19:03 hmmmm huh?
19:03 Calinou wallhack is seeing through walls :P
19:04 hmmmm ah
19:05 _2cool4me4_ hmmm says hun
19:05 _2cool4me4_ huh
19:06 sokomine those pizza hut pizzas don't taste well compared to those by local delivery services
19:06 PilzAdam ^
19:07 _2cool4me4_ Who's wallhacking a picca hut and taco bell?
19:07 _2cool4me4_ grr, pizza
19:07 MinetestBot GIT: Uberi commited to Uberi/MineTest-WorldEdit: Add `//scale <factor>` command (suggested by Jordach), fix transposition description in docs. d4187866db 2013-06-18T12:05:49-07:00 http://git.io/guY1Qw
19:08 hmmmm http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQ8ViYIeH04 <- for those of you who didn't get the reference
19:08 _2cool4me4_ Hey, you guys got a well trained bot now!
19:09 hmmmm pizza hut and taco bell are both owned by Yum! brands, along with KFC.  in new york city especially, you often see combination stores with both pizza hut and taco bell
19:09 MinetestBot _2cool4me4_, oh, thank you!
19:09 _2cool4me4_ wat.
19:10 _2cool4me4_ That's no bot!
19:10 MinetestBot GIT: Uberi commited to Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons: Merge pull request #110 from Novatux/wireless e7f6ca24e8 2013-06-18T12:09:28-07:00 http://git.io/2GfCBw
19:10 MinetestBot GIT: Novatux commited to Jeija/minetest-mod-mesecons: Add wireless emitters/recievers. Still needs textures and crafting recipe. 1d11a204f8 2013-06-17T23:51:29-07:00 http://git.io/XiPdhA
19:10 Jordach_ VanessaE, Calinou: i got french fries
19:10 Jordach_ plus bacon bagel
19:10 PilzAdam _2cool4me4_, it is
19:10 PilzAdam !help
19:10 MinetestBot https://github.com/sfan5/minetestbot-modules/blob/master/COMMANDS.md
19:11 * VanessaE steals Jordach's bacon bagel
19:11 Jordach_ already eaten it
19:11 ShadowNinja _2cool4me4_: Someone is sending it commands to make it say that.
19:11 sfan5 ShadowNinja: you ruined everything :/
19:12 * PilzAdam hides
19:12 _2cool4me4_ Yes, I know that
19:12 * sokomine heads for some warm bockwuerstchen (saussages)
19:12 ShadowNinja I figured it was you.
19:12 * _2cool4me4_ steals all of it
19:13 sfan5 s/saussages/sausages/
19:13 thexyz sfan5: so, can we have it quote dev wiki?
19:14 ShadowNinja thexyz: What do you mean? !syntax minetest.after?
19:14 thexyz like this, yeah
19:14 thexyz or !dev
19:15 _2cool4me4_ Mmm, Arnold Palmer
19:16 Calinou "Add wireless emitters/recievers."
19:16 sfan5 thexyz: I'll add it
19:16 Calinou weren't there wireless emiceivers (:D) since december 2011?
19:16 sfan5 Calinou: they were removed when mesecons split into a modpack
19:16 Calinou oh
19:17 Calinou I saw markveidemanis using some on his server... recently
19:17 Calinou (to toggle lights)
19:17 * sfan5 added yellow lightstone
19:17 Calinou or was that something else, but that does the same thing?
19:18 PilzAdam sfan5, add !dev like !wik but for the dev wiki
19:20 * sfan5 was going to do that
19:24 Jordach_ Calinou, worldedit has //scale <factor>
19:24 Jordach_ so one block becomes 2^3
19:25 Jordach_ more: https://github.com/Uberi/MineTest-WorldEdit/issues/23#issuecomment-19634631
19:25 Calinou "I've been ignoring everything with "Con" in it" --Opeth
19:25 Calinou (my reaction to JonathanD's notice :P)
19:25 Jordach_ haha
19:27 Jordach_ sfan5, was your server on a galaxy ace
19:27 sfan5 Jordach_: which one
19:27 Jordach_ the droid server
19:27 khonkhortisan mese"Con"s
19:28 Jordach_ sfan5, you ran ./minetestserver on your phone right
19:28 sfan5 Jordach_: yes
19:28 Jordach_ was it a samsung galaxy ace
19:28 sfan5 yes
19:28 Jordach_ good
19:28 Jordach_ now i dont need to edit my post
19:28 sfan5 I rebuilt minetestserver with ublibc and it now runs without any unicode errors
19:28 sfan5 *uclibc
19:28 sfan5 Jordach_: which post?
19:29 khonkhortisan markv was using wireless digilines
19:29 Jordach_ http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=95450#p95450
19:29 * VanessaE wonders if anyone's using digilines on her server for anything useful yet.
19:30 khonkhortisan not me
19:30 Jordach_ VanessaE, http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=95449#p95449
19:30 VanessaE I saw.
19:30 khonkhortisan woah
19:30 Exio sfan5: what is your toolchain file?
19:30 sfan5 none
19:30 Exio how do you make it link properly, then?
19:31 john_minetest What are digilines?
19:31 sfan5 I used cmake-gui and entered compilers and sysroot manually
19:31 sfan5 john_minetest: !g digilines mesecons
19:32 * sokomine has decimated the sausages successfully
19:32 khonkhortisan digilines are wires that send messages on channels - messages and channels both can be any lua type.
19:32 Jordach_ sokomine, bacon is better]
19:32 khonkhortisan you need a luacontroller to use them
19:32 PilzAdam Jordach_, have you ever eaten german sausages?
19:32 Jordach_ yus
19:32 john_minetest PilzAdam: Now I am hungry.
19:33 PilzAdam fun fact: VW produces more sausages than cars
19:33 * VanessaE offers john_minetest a protein bar
19:33 Jordach_ heh, well, VanessaE's already nicked my other bacon bagel
19:33 Jordach_ <PilzAdam> fun fact: VW produces more sausages than cars
19:33 Jordach_ wait what
19:33 * john_minetest takes the protein bar. thx
19:33 sokomine vanessa: preparation for travel into space? :-)
19:33 khonkhortisan I should build a house, then scale the neighborhood into a room in my house
19:33 Jordach_ khonkhortisan, lol
19:33 Jordach_ khonkhortisan, it doesnt go negative
19:33 VanessaE sokomine: trying to break this G*d damned weight loss plateau
19:34 khonkhortisan I was wondering
19:34 john_minetest fun fact: We produce more spaceship than wormholes.
19:34 sokomine regarding the discussion on the dev-channel about mapgen: sometimes servers with their maps become less used and visited while still holding houses that are of good quality and might be worth visiting. it would be great if maps could be merged
19:35 VanessaE Jordach_: if you guys really wanna be fancy, make it use stairsplus to scale things *down* (a stack of 1x2x2 nodes becomes a wall slab, etc)
19:35 Calinou not always possible, VanessaE
19:35 khonkhortisan it doesn't scale full nodes yet
19:35 VanessaE Calinou: I know, but it would be interesting to try
19:35 sokomine this ought to be relatively easy on the database level. the real problem i see there is how to identify chunks that are worth preserving. those where only mapgen took place or a mine was digged are not particulary intresting. yet they may take up most of the space
19:35 VanessaE and scale stairsplus nodes UP to whole blocks
19:36 sokomine vanessa: oh yes, that's difficult :-( let's just decide to turn gravity down :-)
19:36 VanessaE (an "inside" stairs becomes seven whole cubes)
19:36 khonkhortisan scale single stair 100x
19:36 khonkhortisan it would floodfill stairs
19:37 * sokomine runs away in panic from a growing stair
19:37 sokomine is there a useful way to find out if players built something inside a chunk?
19:38 Calinou rollback?
19:38 khonkhortisan if we saved only the changed part, it would be
19:40 sokomine it doesn't have to go that far
19:40 sokomine for rollback issues, it might be intresting to save inside the chunk which player did what :-)
19:41 VanessaE if a server's rollback log went back far enough one could theoretically use such a thing to re-generate all the built structures but place them onto a freshly-generated map
19:41 sokomine ok, wouldn't work with actual rollback (that has to load unloaded chunks as well) - it just would speed up checking considerably and allow to find out very fast who built what
19:41 * sokomine nods to vanessa
19:42 VanessaE (for situations where your seed got inexplicably changed, for example, or if your map file generally got trashed by unruly players, mapgen bugs, etc)
19:42 sokomine i did something like that in a limited way once when my map was not saved for reasons unknown. 2 hours of building in singleplayer had been lost. thanks to the recording in the debug file, i was able to recreate the missing buildings
19:42 VanessaE neat
19:43 sokomine oh yes. protection against the feared mapgen bug on redcrabs server would be great!
19:43 PilzAdam sokomine, I found some of those duplication bug sapling stacks in my singleplayer world too
19:44 VanessaE PilzAdam: the "stacking up" effect happens in pipeworks too if lots of items get ejected from a pneumatic tube too close together.
19:44 _2cool4me4_ I clicked on an ad to this: http://www.ultrasabers.com/default.asp
19:44 sokomine pilzadam: is there any indication of what may cause it? vanessa talked about duplicating signs (those with floating letters i guess) as well. it may be the very same bug
19:44 VanessaE even without the duplication bug
19:44 _2cool4me4_ Why
19:44 PilzAdam for now, there is only the /clearobjects workaround
19:45 sokomine the "stacking up" as such would not be a problem (it just looks strange if there are 12 saplings stacked on each other) - the real trouble is when performance drops to the button due to those duplications
19:45 VanessaE sokomine: indeed, after I did a /clearobjects on my server last night, performance near the spawn improved a bit.
19:45 VanessaE (+5fps at most)
19:45 VanessaE went from 500-1200 down to about 80.
19:45 khonkhortisan Would it be possible to make a machine where you have a sheep stand on a pipe, and items come out, causing the sheep to rise to another section of the machine?
19:46 Exio teleportation machine
19:46 PilzAdam VanessaE, on menches server were over 4000 objects wich causes FPS to drop to 2
19:46 * Exio teleports khonkhortisan to 44003425345, inf, nan
19:46 sokomine hm, yes, your server is still hard to handle for my machine as well. on redcrabs server, it is less of a problem. on menches and the wazuclan server, it's the same - don't stay in on place too long or say good-bye to framerate
19:46 VanessaE PilzAdam: OUCH
19:46 _2cool4me4_ Exio: Would that work?
19:46 Exio _2cool4me4_: crashing the client, of course! :D
19:47 VanessaE I thought I'd seen you or someone mention 4000+ entities, but didn't really draw the connection
19:47 VanessaE khonkhortisan: that should be possible as long as the sheep keep trying to jump
19:48 VanessaE otherwise the entities would just stack up on top of the sheep - because they always seem to want to 'pop up' above anything that's already there.
19:48 MinetestBot GIT: kaeza commited to minetest/minetest: Restore old output format of dump() e65ac4d626 2013-06-18T12:55:53-07:00 http://git.io/zEhaiw
19:49 sokomine pilzadam counted 4000 objects on menches server after staying in one location. the framerate dropped to the bottom
19:49 kaeza that's a better commit message :P
19:49 khonkhortisan ^ that commit is odd
19:49 sokomine ah, he said it already
19:49 PilzAdam khonkhortisan, hm?
19:49 khonkhortisan oh I get it
19:49 PilzAdam kaeza, yes, the format wasnt "wrong"?
19:49 PilzAdam -?
19:50 khonkhortisan it makes it so you can use a dump to set keys again
19:50 PilzAdam VanessaE was relying on the fact that its Lua compatible, wich isnt documented or anything
19:50 VanessaE PilzAdam: if the format changes and a mod depends on a format that everyone knew already, and this in turn broke the mod, the format became "wrong".
19:50 sokomine regarding stacking...the sheep stack already pretty high. i've seen them get up to 4 layers of sheep. they're also pretty jumpy. they might do a good imitation of a goat (wish someone would do a model for them)
19:51 khonkhortisan and it was already "wrong" because you could crash the server by printing a key which is a table
19:51 PilzAdam VanessaE, nope, a mod could depend on sane things like "dirt is the 10th element in that is registered"
19:51 khonkhortisan so now it's "right"
19:51 PilzAdam *insane
19:51 VanessaE PilzAdam: non sequitur.  We're talking about the output of a function that's been there for...how long now?
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19:52 khonkhortisan dump is made for terminal output
19:53 Jordach_ i might make a periodic table of minetest for the blocks
19:53 Jordach_ (basic blocks, stone, cobble, dirt, grass - both kinds.)
19:54 Calinou that's what she said
19:54 VanessaE Jordach_: +100
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19:59 Jordach_ Calinou, page needs updating: http://wiki.minetest.com/wiki/Player
19:59 Jordach_ we need the sam skin in place
20:00 VanessaE so "sam" is official now? :)
20:00 Calinou ideally I should make a 3D isometric sam render
20:00 Calinou yeah, somehow
20:00 Calinou semi-official
20:00 VanessaE mg, the "green thing"
20:00 VanessaE omg*
20:00 Jordach_ VanessaE, it sounds better than the shit i've head so far
20:00 VanessaE I thought we'd phased that out finally :)
20:00 Calinou yeah
20:01 Calinou "blockien", "blockhead"... really, can't kids have better imagination today
20:01 Calinou even xonotic player model names are more imaginative
20:01 Jordach_ yup
20:01 Jordach_ even red eclipse is]
20:01 Jordach_ -]
20:01 * Calinou calls the RE model "red eclipse dude", and nothing else
20:01 Jordach_ there is a female model too
20:03 Jordach_ were missing, diamond ore, copper ore, and mese ore from the wiki
20:03 Calinou no? these were added recently, no?
20:03 Jordach_ http://wiki.minetest.com/wiki/Blocks
20:03 Calinou anyway the wiki is very outdated, and I don't even feel it is useful, except for recipes
20:03 Calinou most blocks are decorative
20:03 Calinou and you can learn most facts about them yourself
20:04 Calinou not to mention the whole .com thing
20:04 Calinou (never liked that)
20:14 kaeza would it be possible to add a section directed to "users" in the minetest.net wiki?
20:14 VanessaE Calinou, Jordach_:  fixed the wiki page, using this as the source:  http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=76027#p76027
20:15 Calinou kaeza, "Game/" namespace?
20:15 kaeza is there one already?
20:16 Calinou <engineer voice> nope
20:16 Jordach_ VanessaE, you could have used the crafting mod by blockmen
20:16 VanessaE thexyz: please fix your broken captcha on the edit-images page (new URL = triggers the captcha even if I'm signed in)
20:17 Jordach_ didnt notice before
20:17 * VanessaE gives up trying to give a proper source URL after three tries.
20:18 Calinou life without ImQ009 is a waste of danger
20:19 thexyz VanessaE: wtf is "edit-images page"?
20:19 VanessaE thexyz: when you click "edit" while looking at an image, i.e. to add to/change the image's description.
20:19 kaeza LOL: "Added new sounds (someone who can't decide if he wants to be called mitori or mito551)"
20:20 Calinou heh
20:20 Calinou let's call him mitori551
20:21 PilzAdam I vote for mito551ri
20:21 sfan5 can someone try this? http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=95459#p95459
20:21 thexyz VanessaE: well, there's $wgGroupPermissions['user']['skipcaptcha'] = true;
20:21 VanessaE thexyz: it's happening because I need to add a URL to the description.
20:23 VanessaE also, you're asking me to solve "the simple sum below" but showing me pictures of cats :)
20:23 thexyz hm.. that's odd
20:23 thexyz can you post your URL?
20:23 VanessaE http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=76027#p76027
20:24 VanessaE oh the page edit url?
20:24 VanessaE http://wiki.minetest.com/index.php?title=File:Player_large.png&amp;action=submit
20:24 VanessaE (the first is the one I was trying to add.  proper attribution after all)
20:25 thexyz well, that'
20:25 thexyz meh
20:25 thexyz that's not my wiki
20:25 thexyz i only host dev.minetest.net
20:25 VanessaE ah, thought you did.  wonder who hosts the other one then.
20:25 PilzAdam Calinou is admin there
20:26 VanessaE Calinou: fix your busted-ass captcha ;)
20:26 Calinou can't
20:26 Calinou I'm half-admin, can't change MW settings, iirc
20:26 Calinou and yes the captcha sucks
20:26 VanessaE bah
20:26 Calinou Saxony ("Admin" in the wiki) is occasionally online
20:27 sfan5 can someone test this? http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=95459#p95459
20:27 VanessaE fuck it, I'll just leave out the "http://" part and that gets around the filter.
20:27 Calinou put a space between http and ://
20:27 Calinou and I'll remove it later :P (not now, have to go)
20:30 PilzAdam VanessaE, http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=95462#p95462
20:30 PilzAdam close it
20:31 VanessaE closed.
20:31 sfan5 good night
20:31 VanessaE night sfan5.
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21:14 kaeza what the... http://forum.minetest.net/search.php?action=show_user_posts&amp;user_id=6177
21:15 PilzAdam kaeza, you just cant understand what he wants to tell us
21:16 VanessaE PilzAdam: issue #773 - is that code good to use?
21:16 PilzAdam sure
21:16 VanessaE Merge it please.  Pipeworks needs it pretty badly since the introduction of general item collisions.
21:16 kaeza PilzAdam, actual post text: [url][/url]
21:17 Roukoghost joined #minetest
21:17 VanessaE kaeza: I say delete both posts.
21:17 kaeza now THAT is more annoying than saying hi
21:17 kaeza VanessaE, +1
21:17 VanessaE I suspect they were failed spam attempts.
21:17 sudobash1 joined #minetest
21:17 VanessaE PilzAdam: opinions on that?
21:18 PilzAdam "that"?
21:18 kaeza I suspect more of a BB n00b
21:18 VanessaE PilzAdam: the two failed posts.
21:18 PilzAdam I think its funny
21:18 PilzAdam lets see where we get
21:20 sudobash1 Does `use_texture_alpha' work with drawtype = "glasslike"?
21:20 Gambit joined #minetest
21:20 VanessaE sudobash1: it works with all drawtypes as far as I can tell
21:20 VanessaE I've used it with nodeboxes, for example.
21:21 sudobash1 The dev wiki says it requires backface culling. Isn't that dependant of the drawtype?
21:21 VanessaE it doesn't seem to work reliably with animated textures over nodeboxes, or didn't when I tried last.
21:21 john_minetest <img>/home/john/Pictures/embeddingfail.png</img>
21:21 VanessaE sudobash1: partially, but mostly it depends if your video card handles shaders properly.  with those, it works mostly right anyway
21:21 sudobash1 Water works fine, so I suppose it does.
21:23 VanessaE water is a special case.
21:23 VanessaE it doesn't use the use_texture_alpha path but something else entirely.
21:26 john_minetest <random_fact>And water has its hugest density at 4 degrees celsius </random_fact>
21:27 TheLastProject joined #minetest
21:28 VanessaE but drop a few degrees further and it's no longer water anyway :)
21:31 Uberi joined #minetest
21:32 john_minetest It is still water. But it is in a solid state. Like iron is always iron, no matter if it is solid or liquid.
21:32 john_minetest Of course in most games it turnes into ice nodes/textures/particles/voxels/whatever and is no water node anymore.
21:34 john_minetest </smart-arse>
21:34 kaeza drop it ~ -270ºC further and air won't be air anymore
21:35 kaeza (in gaseous state)
21:36 kaeza anyone seen 'The Dau After Tomorrow' ?
21:36 kaeza Day*
21:36 VanessaE kaeza: seen it.
21:36 VanessaE I think
21:36 PilzAdam yep
21:36 VanessaE that was the made-for-tv version of category 6, or vice versa wasn't it?
21:37 kaeza that movie creeped me when it was released
21:38 VanessaE yes, it was DAT.  Good movie
21:38 PilzAdam fun fact: we watched it in English at school
21:38 kaeza (well, when I saw it, it was creepy; it was around that 6/6/6 hoax)
21:39 kaeza (2006-06-06)
21:39 john_minetest kaeza: "Dau" is acronym for "Dümmster Anzunehmender User" (Maximum Stupid User) in germany.
21:39 Exio in the 2006-06-06 i was using internet explorer
21:40 Exio for playing flash games
21:40 PilzAdam screw you!
21:40 john_minetest 'The Dau After Tomorrow'
21:40 kaeza In 2006-06-06 I still had my old Pentium MMX @ 200MHz :(
21:40 Exio now you overclocked it to 201MHz? :D
21:40 PilzAdam john_minetest, "Der Idiot von Ãœbermorgen" :D
21:41 john_minetest In 2006-06-06 I was in school and I think I didn't even have internet back then.
21:41 Exio i was 9 :P
21:41 john_minetest PilzAdam: :D
21:41 kaeza I was 18 :D
21:41 john_minetest I was 10 :b
21:41 PilzAdam I was 11
21:42 Exio kaeza is the oldest guy here
21:42 kaeza ha! now I know PilzAdam's age :P
21:42 Exio he is probably 67 now :3
21:42 john_minetest No, he's 1337.
21:42 john_minetest ;)
21:42 Exio 42
21:42 PilzAdam john_minetest, /me too!
21:42 PilzAdam :-p
21:42 Uberi I was 11 and thought MS Word was the pinnacle of software achievement
21:42 john_minetest I only had 7 points in my maths Abitur, so...
21:43 VanessaE Uberi: pipeworks crafting guide needs your attention again ;-)
21:43 Uberi what changed?
21:44 VanessaE I added proper textures and crafting recipes for the mesecons conductive tubes, and changed the recipe for the detector to account for it.
21:44 VanessaE there are suitable images in the img/ folder.
21:44 Uberi oh nice
21:45 Uberi I'll take a look when I'm done over here
21:45 VanessaE k
21:46 Exio i'm tempted to overclock my cpu with k2ctl
21:46 Exio http://dpaste.com/1251640/
21:46 VanessaE Uberi: you have push access to the repo now :)
21:47 Uberi thanks :)
21:47 VanessaE no prob
21:47 john_minetest PilzAdam: What is your Abitur average?
21:48 PilzAdam 1.2
21:48 PilzAdam yours?
21:48 john_minetest Lol, mine, too.
21:48 PilzAdam with 7 in maths?
21:48 john_minetest 1,2. 633 points.
21:48 john_minetest 7 in maths, 10 in english, 7 in physics and 5 in german.
21:49 john_minetest P5 (oral exam) was 13.
21:49 PilzAdam my exams: 14 maths, 15 physics, 6 politics/economy, 14 informatics, 14 german
21:49 PilzAdam german was oral
21:49 john_minetest Wow.
21:50 john_minetest I was quite good in all the other exams so I got a "Durchschnittsnote laut Staatsvertrag" of 2.1
21:51 PilzAdam hm?
21:51 PilzAdam havent you said that you have 1.2?
21:52 john_minetest Oops. I read it wrong.
21:52 john_minetest Like I said, maths 7...
21:52 john_minetest So 2.1.
21:53 Uberi VanessaE: so uh, does the airtight pipe entry work now? :P
21:53 john_minetest I just wondered how you can get a 2,1 with such good marks xD
21:53 VanessaE yep
21:53 Exio what is abitur? :D
21:54 PilzAdam john_minetest, I would have gottne 2.1 if I had written 5 points everywhere
21:54 Uberi some sort of exam thingy it seems
21:54 PilzAdam Exio, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abitur
21:54 VanessaE there's a bug in the water routing code where valves, entry panels, etc can pass water across to a neighboring pipe circuit that isn't physically connected, but I'm just too lazy to fix that :)
21:54 VanessaE s/physically/physically or visibly/
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21:55 Uberi it's now a feature known as "leaking pipes and duct tape"
21:55 Exio ah
21:55 john_minetest PilzAdam: If I had written the Abitur exams a bit better I could have reached a 1.8. But I failed :(
21:55 Uberi all you need to do is code up a duct tape item and it's fully fixed
21:55 PilzAdam john_minetest, what do you want to study?
21:56 john_minetest PilzAdam: Informatik.
21:56 * PilzAdam too
21:56 PilzAdam "Wirtschaftsinformatik" to be more precise
21:57 john_minetest Informatik, Bachelor of Science here :)
21:57 PilzAdam it has an NC of 4.0 everywhere AFAIK
21:58 john_minetest I'm not quite sure yet where to study.
21:58 VanessaE Uberi: heh
21:58 VanessaE well I'm gonna fix that sooner or later.  Also I noticed that at some point, I seemed to have caused a bug where a spigot can keep a set of pipes flowing if there are too many in a circuit.
21:59 Uberi hmm? there's a flow limit?
22:00 VanessaE there's not supposed to be
22:00 VanessaE it's probably just a source detection glitch
22:01 VanessaE or it might have been a server glitch and not in pipeworks - I noticed it while doing some work on jojoa1997's farm out to the east
22:01 VanessaE (I'd turn off a valve but the waterflow didn't stop)
22:02 VanessaE oh yes, valves work now too :)
22:02 VanessaE (don't remember if you covered that already)
22:02 Uberi oh awesome
22:03 Uberi works with mesecons too?
22:05 VanessaE yep
22:05 VanessaE pumps, valves, flow sensors, conductive tubes, and of course item detector tubes are all fully compatible with current mesecons git
22:05 bas080 joined #minetest
22:05 VanessaE (not sure if they work with the latest stable or not, don't care either :P )
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22:18 kaeza VanessaE, seen latest commit in technic?
22:20 VanessaE which ones?
22:20 VanessaE *looks*
22:20 VanessaE the changes to the constructor?
22:20 VanessaE (s)
22:20 Uberi VanessaE: can I place an airtight entry from below?
22:20 VanessaE Uberi: yes
22:21 VanessaE as long as it has something legit to connect to.
22:21 Uberi as well as above, right?
22:21 VanessaE yep
22:21 kaeza VanessaE, yep
22:21 Uberi cool
22:21 VanessaE so you have to place a pipe, storage tank, pump, etc. first, then place the entry panel on it
22:21 kaeza need more thorough testing
22:21 kaeza hope I didn't break anything :P
22:21 kaeza +this time
22:22 VanessaE kaeza: I'll deploy it and restart the server shortly
22:22 VanessaE looks like there are a few players online right now, so best not to disturb anyone :)
22:22 kaeza cool
22:23 kaeza ah np, there's no rush
22:24 Uberi VanessaE: that spigot anim is awesome
22:24 VanessaE thanks :)
22:26 Uberi I guess the pipeworks deployer/node_breaker's been superceded by the technic stuff huh
22:26 VanessaE Uberi: you might have noticed I found a rather weird workaround for the nodebox lighting issues:  All of the pipe textures are greyscale PNG and have alpha (even where it's not needed)
22:26 Uberi is there any way to get those two without the rest of the stuff?
22:26 PilzAdam anyone cares to create a seperate article for each of the old "minetest.env:" calls and add an redirect from "$functionName" to "minetest.$functionName" in the dev wiki?
22:26 Uberi lighting issues?
22:26 VanessaE they're in the "attic" folder I think
22:26 Uberi I never noticed any lighting issues
22:26 VanessaE yeah, there were problems with pipes' texture colors changing in weird ways particularly when they went from empty to full, even though the actual files were good
22:27 VanessaE PilzAdam: why not just s/minetest.env:/minetest./g
22:27 VanessaE since the old syntax is now deprecated anyway
22:27 PilzAdam VanessaE, can you do that in a wiki?
22:28 PilzAdam currently all the functions are in one article
22:28 VanessaE PilzAdam: well surely not from a web interface, but I suppose the server admin could do it from a terminal
22:28 kaeza PilzAdam, I added a notice at the top a bit ago
22:28 kaeza was planning on splitting those articles
22:28 Uberi I think the notice should be good enough
22:28 kaeza s/those/that/
22:28 PilzAdam kaeza, yes, that reminded me
22:29 PilzAdam kaeza, good, just make sure you add those redirects, so you get to "minetest.set_node()" when searching for "set_node()"
22:29 kaeza k
22:30 PilzAdam ... and dont mess it up, it will be a PITA to fix all those articles ;-)
22:31 kaeza thannks for the encouragement :D
22:31 kaeza -n
22:31 Uberi so it turns out the only documentation change really needed is to the airtight pipe entry part
22:32 Uberi how do you make those craft images VanessaE?
22:32 VanessaE Uberi: screenshots while running Unified Inventory
22:32 VanessaE cropped with GIMP
22:32 Uberi to the exact same dimensions and offset each time?
22:33 VanessaE I do that the hard way, by telling GIMP to crop to exactly the same settings each time
22:33 Uberi ah
22:33 Uberi any idea how I can make them the same resolution? I play at 800x600
22:34 VanessaE Maximize to 1280x1024, then crop to width: 410, height: 235
22:34 Uberi right now I use GIMP to skew and translate the images to manually make inventorycubes
22:34 Uberi right
22:34 VanessaE I think the X/Y are...232/240-something?  I forget now :-)
22:36 kaeza we need another doc sprint
22:36 kaeza marktraceur, where art thou?
22:36 VanessaE ghandi.
22:39 VanessaE Uberi: I've been giving some thought to how to make those storage tanks work, also
22:39 Uberi oh?
22:40 VanessaE I figured they could just store up water if there's a loaded pipe attached, and start acting like a pump, losing one 'unit' per ABM tick.
22:40 Uberi so like a holding tank, sort of
22:40 VanessaE take water in from the top, drin from the bottom
22:40 VanessaE drain*
22:40 VanessaE yeah basically
22:41 VanessaE sort of like a capacitor in series in a circuit.
22:41 VanessaE (well, not exactly)
22:42 Uberi that sounds good, now how is this going to be implemented?
22:42 VanessaE I'm still mulling it over.
22:43 VanessaE but I figure, a pipe into the top dumps unobstructed flow into the tank.  On the outlet side, a pipe connected to a valve.  The tank would have its own ABM that runs once every 2s, which checks the pipe circuit downline the same way pumps do
22:43 VanessaE (every 2s since a tank should drain slower than it fills)
22:44 VanessaE if the circuit downline from the tank doesn't allow flow to the nearest spigot, don't draw the tank down.
22:44 Uberi and they should definitely store a whole ton of liquids to make it worthwhile over just digging a big ol' pit
22:45 VanessaE really though, the whole flow logic needs some rework, as it doesn't take into account total water flow through a pipe (so in finite-water mode it can be used to get infinite water)
22:45 Uberi yeah, needs some heavier simulation stuff
22:45 VanessaE maybe one tank = 50 water nodes?
22:45 Uberi I'm thinking backtracking with depth-first
22:46 VanessaE RBA has a water circuit analysis routine somewhere which was pretty quick.  re-evaluated the circuit each time a pipe was laid, I think
22:46 VanessaE that would get pretty heavy though given the size of the pipelines in my server
22:47 Uberi hmm, that seems unavoidable for certain circumstances
22:47 VanessaE *looks up depth-first search*
22:47 Uberi it's just search
22:47 Uberi except depth first
22:47 * Uberi is amazing at explaining things
22:47 VanessaE starting at the spigot and working backward?
22:48 VanessaE s/the/a/
22:48 Uberi well really the entire circuit needs updating
22:48 Uberi everything
22:48 VanessaE yeah
22:49 Uberi how about the tube-style transport?
22:49 Uberi pump turns water into little thingies
22:49 VanessaE I thought about that
22:49 Uberi send them along pipes
22:50 VanessaE that might actually be far easier
22:50 Uberi finite water guaranteed
22:50 VanessaE and of course we have the code to do it
22:50 Uberi then the pipes get some special graphics stuff to make it work
22:50 Uberi like animated textures turned on via abm that checks objects in a radius 1
22:50 VanessaE naw, leave the pipes the way they look now, have a segment "light up" if it has a water entity "in" it.  make the entities invisible.
22:50 Uberi or something like that
22:51 Uberi yeah, sounds great
22:51 VanessaE use the pneumatic tubes algorithm
22:51 Uberi plus you can't possibly have any water dupe glitches
22:51 VanessaE right
22:51 VanessaE and if they do dupe, it's the engine doing it :)
22:51 Uberi not much of an issue with anything but nonrenewable liquids though
22:51 VanessaE right
22:52 VanessaE this would make the tank thing easier too
22:52 VanessaE have it output one entity for every two that come in.
22:52 VanessaE simple as that.
22:52 VanessaE that way it can be connected in parallel to a pipe instead of having to be in-line
22:53 Uberi each entity is a water unit, representing 1m^3 of water
22:53 Uberi pumps and spigots convert between entities and liquid
22:53 VanessaE there's one caveat:  how do we keep the entities from traveling backward along a previously-navigated circuit?
22:53 Uberi why not have them travel backwards?
22:53 VanessaE well
22:54 Uberi water pressure and all that
22:54 VanessaE hm..
22:54 Uberi take this circuit: PIPE PIPE PIPE PUMP WATER
22:54 VanessaE in that case, the pumps/tanks will have to have an output limit
22:54 Uberi the water flows down the pipe (leftwards)
22:54 Uberi and then bounces back at the end
22:54 VanessaE *nod*
22:54 Uberi since no spigot there
22:54 Uberi then it shoots back out at the pump
22:54 Uberi and you get a "pipe rupture"
22:54 VanessaE hm...
22:55 VanessaE heh
22:55 VanessaE I dunno about *that* :D
22:55 Uberi this is a case study in the effectiveness of the "it's a feature!" mentality
22:55 Uberi fixes bugs faster than anything else
22:55 VanessaE maybe just have the pump check the one node attached to it for number of entities.  If it's over a certain amount, just don't add more.
22:56 Uberi that works actually
22:56 VanessaE that way a pump can maintain X amount of pressure in a line after the line "fills up" past a certain point
22:56 Uberi oh awesome
22:56 Uberi the pressure is the density of entities
22:56 VanessaE and when someone adds a spigot or whatever, the pipeline will naturally start to "drain out" and the pump stars adding more
22:56 VanessaE yes exactly!
22:56 VanessaE I wonder if this is a case where the pump should operate on a node timer instead of an ABM?
22:57 VanessaE or is 1 m^3/sec adequate?
22:57 Uberi that is one fast pump
22:57 VanessaE true
22:57 VanessaE heh
22:57 Uberi should be fine for now, it's not exact in any case
22:58 VanessaE well if we're using entities to carry the water flow instead of the nodes' metadata, we can slow the ABM down considerably.
22:58 VanessaE true
22:58 Uberi OK, now time to dig through the code
22:58 Uberi all this code is making me hungry for some reason
23:01 * VanessaE offers Uberi a protein bar
23:01 VanessaE ("chewy chocolate chip" on hand at the moment)
23:06 Uberi I go to put the pasta on the stove, and Java takes this opportunity to install another blasted update
23:06 VanessaE heh
23:07 VanessaE Wait a minute here...
23:08 VanessaE didn't I see some work recently to add the A* search algorithm to the engine?
23:09 PilzAdam https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L1092
23:09 VanessaE I *thought* so
23:09 VanessaE Uberi:  ^^^^^
23:10 PilzAdam didnt you know? we are all in your head
23:10 VanessaE not sure that'll work for our use case though
23:10 PilzAdam what you think will happen
23:12 Uberi quick, don't think of the pink elephant!
23:13 * VanessaE thinks of a blue elephant with orange polka-dots
23:13 Uberi I think the pathfinder only works for entity movement pathfinding
23:13 VanessaE that's what I thought
23:13 Uberi doesn't have any callbacks for the heuristic of the g-value
23:13 Uberi * or the
23:13 VanessaE won't work for us then
23:22 Uberi I'd better go study for my exams
23:23 bdjnk Is there a way to use the plantlike drawtype (or any aside from nodebox) under water without it forming a pocket of air (and looking stupid)?
23:23 VanessaE afaik you have to use entities for that.
23:23 kaeza testing the page layout... what do you think of this? http://dev.minetest.net/User:Kaeza/Test
23:24 PilzAdam should be more like this: http://dev.minetest.net/get_ban_description
23:25 VanessaE bdjnk: by the way, flowers_plus already has seaweed.
23:26 VanessaE I might suggest a different creature/plant, maybe some kind of coral or anemone
23:27 VanessaE er
23:27 VanessaE yeah, that's spelled right :P
23:27 bdjnk Thanks VanessaE. I'll check out flowers_plus and play with entities.
23:28 kaeza is it just me or the wiki is being slow today?
23:31 bas080 joined #minetest
23:43 bdjnk discussion about what I was asking from a while back: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=48527#p48527

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