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IRC log for #minetest, 2013-05-08

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:08 PilzAdam bye
00:18 ungali_mobile joined #minetest
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01:08 Kacey joined #minetest
01:17 Kacey some people should be thankful that i am afraid to go to prison..
01:17 VanessaE why?
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01:18 Kacey if i wasnt, i would be there right now
01:18 VanessaE where?
01:18 Kacey jail
01:19 VanessaE well duh :)
01:19 VanessaE but I meant why, as in what would you do that would send you there?
01:20 NakedFury kill
01:21 VanessaE *facepalm*
01:21 Kacey it would be easier to name things that i wouldnt do to everyone at school
01:21 VanessaE oh.  school.
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01:48 Kacey The next person to treat me like a doormat is going to get treated like a damn piñata!
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02:02 Nekofire524 sup
02:02 VanessaE hi
02:05 Nekofire524 how are you
02:06 VanessaE doing ok
02:06 ssieb joined #minetest
02:06 Nekofire524 thats good the mod irc is really quiet today lol
02:07 VanessaE this channel is where most chat takes place, but even here, this time of the day is always quiet
02:09 Nekofire524 when is it most active
02:09 VanessaE it varies
02:10 VanessaE but typically between about 7am and 8pm eastern time
02:10 Nekofire524 ah
02:21 ShadowNinja I need libz.so to compile on arch, does anyone know the package name?
02:24 ShadowNinja zlib, but that is installed...
02:24 VanessaE no clue really
02:25 VanessaE bbl
02:26 ShadowNinja Well if anyone knows: make[2]: *** No rule to make target `/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libz.so', needed by `bin/minetestserver'.  Stop.
02:26 hmmmm zlib is usually a standard part of your distribution...
02:26 ShadowNinja hmmmm: Yes, it was installed.
02:27 khonkhortisan is it in /usr/lib64?
02:28 ShadowNinja khonkhortisan: Yes.
02:28 BrandonReese joined #minetest
02:29 ShadowNinja How do I get it to look there?
02:29 khonkhortisan The wrong answer is ln
02:30 ShadowNinja Well I guessed that...
02:32 Jordach joined #minetest
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02:33 Jordach my plan for sleeping went out of the window :(
03:01 ShadowNinja Is the source code for irc.minetest.ru available?
03:14 khonkhortisan I can see over drop-ceiling tiles when using glass walls
03:16 ShadowNinja So ln it is then, unless someone has a better idea.
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03:25 ShadowNinja Does anyone here use Minetest on Arch Linux?
03:32 NakedFury on windows
03:34 ShadowNinja Menche, Jeija, jordan4ibanez, Zeg9...
03:37 ShadowNinja All but Jeija have been around within the last few days.
03:43 Jordach yeah
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04:02 Jordach huh
04:03 Jordach i'm seriously considering using MikuMikuDance on the Minetest model
04:05 Jordach actually
04:05 Jordach idea
04:05 Jordach hmm...
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04:28 Jordach muahahahaha
04:39 Jordach my boredom levels are epic http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88903#p88903
04:40 ShadowNinja Kray: Maybe you could help?
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05:02 ShadowNinja Oh, messed up the sasl auth :-(
05:06 ShadowNinja Well someone will need to op it after all. sfan5, VanessaE?
05:09 ungali_mobile joined #minetest
05:29 sfan5 !op ShadowBot
05:29 sfan5 ShadowNinja: done
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05:54 Jordach morning sfan5
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07:12 kahrl ShadowNinja: one reason why the setuid might not have worked is if the filesystem is mounted with nosuid
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07:31 celeron55_ that's a good catch
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08:19 kahrl how can I configure github to show precise dates instead of wishy washy stuff like "3 months ago"?
08:19 kahrl when looking at comments of pull requests for example
08:21 kahrl I don't think it's possible, yuck
08:21 ruskie talk to github about that
08:21 kahrl who the hell designed that
08:21 ruskie or you know do a clone of the repo and just look at the git log
08:22 ruskie github isn't really all that special
08:22 ruskie more or less just annoying
08:22 kahrl well pull request comments in particular don't show in the git log
08:22 ruskie as said annoying
08:23 ruskie they're trying to push their idea of a workflow in there
08:23 kahrl so a workflow means I can't follow past conversations? :|
08:24 VanessaE http://projects.skurfer.com/posts/2012/timestamps/
08:24 VanessaE is this of any use, kahrl ?
08:24 VanessaE eh, fuck.  that's for safari.
08:25 kahrl ooh, could be useful anyway
08:25 VanessaE (I find the fuzzy timestamps to be fucking annoying also)
08:25 kahrl I didn't know the precise timestamps were sent in the HTML, assumed they just sent the fuzzy ones
08:26 VanessaE this might be a job for greasemonkey then
08:27 VanessaE http://userscripts.org/scripts/show/76422
08:27 VanessaE bingo
08:27 VanessaE "Change time format from "n days ago" to weekday + HH:MM:SS ISO time by clicking them (github time in parenthesis)."
08:28 VanessaE (I note the last modified date is pretty old)
08:29 kahrl I just edited the chrome/userContent.css in my firefox profile
08:29 kahrl that worked too
08:29 VanessaE col
08:29 VanessaE cool
08:30 kahrl for reference: http://codepad.org/AJKywcjn
08:32 celeron55_ it's common practice these days to do date and other formatting on client side
08:33 celeron55_ saves resources on the server and automatically gets the correct time zone
08:35 VanessaE kahrl: oh that is SO much better.  ph33r my g00gl3-fu ;)
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09:21 VanessaE jeez, is everyone using centurylink or something? :)
09:38 ImQ009 joined #minetest
09:41 PilzAdam joined #minetest
09:44 PilzAdam Hello everyone!
09:44 VanessaE hey
09:48 Zeg9 Hi
09:56 PilzAdam thexyz, why does the minetest forum now include scripts from xyz.is ?
09:57 Infinity_69 joined #minetest
09:57 kaeza joined #minetest
09:57 Infinity_69 hi
09:57 kaeza hi all
09:57 VanessaE hi
09:57 Infinity_69 hi
09:57 kaeza hi
09:58 Zeg9 Hello kaeza
09:59 kaeza another post full of GNU zealotry on the forums -.-
10:00 thexyz PilzAdam: traffic stats
10:00 PilzAdam I block it then >:-)
10:06 Infinity_69 PilzAdam, im working on a mod and i need help...
10:06 Infinity_69 with the functions...
10:06 Infinity_69 can you help me?
10:06 Infinity_69 please
10:06 Infinity_69 =)
10:07 kahrl Infinity_69: just post the question here
10:07 Infinity_69 there are a lot of questions and i dont want to flood :/
10:07 Infinity_69 but ok...
10:07 VanessaE post them on the forum and give us a link then
10:08 PilzAdam if you have a lot of questions a tutorial about programming will most likely help you
10:08 Infinity_69 ...
10:09 Infinity_69 how do i make a flaming bottle of Molotov be throwable and if it touches grow
10:09 Infinity_69 ... ground it will explode
10:09 Infinity_69 sorry, i pressed enter too early...
10:09 blaze joined #minetest
10:09 kaeza look at throwing mod
10:09 Infinity_69 ok
10:10 kaeza actually, umm..
10:10 kaeza look at firearms
10:10 Infinity_69 !g minetest firearms
10:10 MinetestBot Infinity_69: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=4562
10:10 Infinity_69 lol
10:10 kaeza it has a somewhat easy framework
10:11 kaeza or just copy the relevant code
10:12 Infinity_69 ugh...can you just search the lines or give me the code?
10:12 Infinity_69 there are SO many files...
10:12 Infinity_69 o.o
10:14 VanessaE THAT is "so many files"?
10:14 * VanessaE mumbles something about a home decoration mod she wrote...
10:15 LunaVorax joined #minetest
10:16 PilzAdam that is a moderate amount of files: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/tree/master/src
10:16 VanessaE now THAT qualifies as "so many files". :)
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10:17 Infinity_69_ /nick Infinity_69
10:18 Infinity_69 i hate you PilzAdam!
10:21 PilzAdam :D
10:21 Infinity_69 -.-
10:21 Infinity_69 srsly, i crashed!
10:22 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
10:23 Infinity_69 yo PilzAdam what is the method of giving a player some privs?
10:23 kaeza too many files? http://sourceforge.net/p/fbc/code/ci/master/tree/
10:23 PilzAdam /grants <playername> <priv>
10:24 PilzAdam -s
10:24 Infinity_69 no, in the Lua API
10:24 Infinity_69 minetest.set_player_privs?
10:24 PilzAdam look in builting/chatcommands.lua
10:24 PilzAdam -g
10:25 Infinity_69 im making a mod
10:25 Infinity_69 [TOP SECRET]
10:25 Infinity_69 how do i register a priv?
10:26 Infinity_69 found it
10:26 PilzAdam look in builtin/privileges.lua
10:28 q66 joined #minetest
10:36 Infinity_69 PilzAdam can you help me a little bit?
10:36 Infinity_69 how do i make an if statement?
10:36 Infinity_69 =)
10:37 Infinity_69 just kidding...
10:38 Infinity_69 i know that...
10:38 kaeza lua.org/pil/ :)
10:38 Infinity_69 but how do i check if player who joins has a priv like Admin
10:38 kaeza if (minetest.check_player_privs("me", {Admin=true}) then
10:38 Infinity_69 "me"?
10:38 Infinity_69 what does that mean
10:39 kaeza the player name
10:39 Infinity_69 oh
10:39 kaeza if (minetest.check_player_privs("Ragnar", {Admin=true}) then
10:39 kaeza (obviously, you would gety the name from somewhere)
10:39 kaeza -y
10:40 Infinity_69 minetest.chat_send_all("Owner, PlayerName joined the game ")
10:40 Infinity_69 how do i get the PlayerName
10:40 kaeza ehm...
10:42 Infinity_69 got it
10:42 Infinity_69 player.get_player_name()
10:42 kaeza nope
10:42 Infinity_69 wut?
10:42 Infinity_69 o.o
10:42 kaeza player:get_player_name()
10:42 Infinity_69 then how
10:42 Infinity_69 oh
10:42 Infinity_69 :D
10:42 Infinity_69 was kicked by ShadowBot: message flood detected
10:42 Infinity_69 joined #minetest
10:42 kaeza lol
10:43 Infinity_69 somebody -o ShadowBot
10:43 VanessaE no way
10:43 VanessaE that bot is doing its job.
10:43 Infinity_69 whos bot is it anyways
10:43 Zeg9 Guess it...
10:43 Infinity_69 yours?
10:43 Infinity_69 o.o
10:43 Zeg9 ...
10:44 VanessaE note to self:  have the bot's owner lower the threshold for Infinity_69 so his messages trip it = kick sooner ;)
10:45 cisoun joined #minetest
10:47 VanessaE hey cisoun.
10:48 cisoun hey myself !
10:48 cisoun I mean, hey VanessaE
10:48 VanessaE heh
10:49 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
10:49 VanessaE cisoun: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/Screenshot%20-%2005052013%20-%2009:51:55%20PM.png
10:50 VanessaE inspired by one you posted on the screenshots thread a while back
10:50 cisoun Yeah I saw that yesterday. I like it. :)
10:51 VanessaE I'd produce a version displayed with standard textures, but like a moron, I deleted that world already :-/
10:51 arsdragonfly what's the stuff at the bottom left corner?
10:51 Infinity_69 kaeza, VanessaE, PilzAdam: i need somebody to find the error...
10:51 Infinity_69 http://ompldr.org/vaWNocQ/MT_Lua_Error_#1
10:51 VanessaE something like that ^^ or yours should be the default.
10:51 VanessaE arsdragonfly: those are the game filter buttons
10:52 PilzAdam Infinity_69, found it
10:52 Infinity_69 rlly?
10:52 Infinity_69 where, what :)
10:52 VanessaE you didn't say you wanted him to actually tell you what the error was
10:52 PilzAdam you have to find it yourself
10:52 VanessaE merely that he should find it
10:53 PilzAdam otherwise you will ask us everytime
10:53 kaeza so many errors...
10:53 cisoun But I'm thinking these backgrounds are not that good. The game should just show a PNG file at the middle of the window and at the front with a real world behind in the main menu.
10:53 cisoun I don't really like the stretching picture.
10:53 Infinity_69 >:'(
10:53 Taoki[laptop] joined #minetest
10:53 arsdragonfly Infinity_69 :mismatching parentheses @ ln25?
10:54 Infinity_69 what?
10:55 Infinity_69 minetest.chat_send_all("Owner, " player:get_player_name() " joined the game!") <!-- Whats wrong there?
10:55 VanessaE you forgot concat the strings
10:55 Infinity_69 ?
10:55 PilzAdam http://www.lua.org/pil/
10:55 VanessaE this ain't shell, this is Lua.
10:55 Infinity_69 NO!
10:56 Infinity_69 shell?
10:56 arsdragonfly the if statement has a (
10:56 Infinity_69 btw, VanessaE, NO >> PilzAdam
10:56 Infinity_69 ok...
10:56 kaeza minetest.register_privlage <-- wat
10:56 VanessaE if you don't understand the basics of concatenation, you'll never get anywhere
10:56 VanessaE this is programming 101 stuff here.
10:57 arsdragonfly use .. to concatenate the strings
10:57 VanessaE arsdragonfly: shhhhhhhh
10:57 kaeza also, arg #2 to register_privilege is a table
10:57 Infinity_69 ?
10:57 arsdragonfly VanessaE ,Er,what's the point of that anyway?
10:58 PilzAdam arsdragonfly, we dont help Infinity_69 so he doesnt ask again
10:58 PilzAdam because he is annyoing
10:58 VanessaE arsdragonfly: to make him actually LEARN instead of asking such simple questions
10:58 kaeza Infinity_69, if we were to post corrections o these lines, we may as well rewrite the whole thing
10:58 Infinity_69 PilzAdam, if i'm annoying then you are a DICK!
10:58 arsdragonfly all right
10:58 Infinity_69 PilzAdam = Dick
10:58 proller joined #minetest
10:59 Infinity_69 Dick is being a Richard to me!
10:59 Infinity_69 was kicked by VanessaE: shut up and go learn.
10:59 kaeza :D
10:59 PilzAdam finally
10:59 arsdragonfly gj
10:59 Infinity_69 joined #minetest
11:01 * VanessaE waits for the inevitable spew of insults, slurs, curses, etc.
11:02 john_minetest joined #minetest
11:03 Infinity_69 VanessaE = Fatty³ ; PilzAdam = .i.
11:04 Infinity_69 WOAH
11:04 Infinity_69 VanessaE is a freaking mind reader!
11:04 Infinity_69 was kicked by VanessaE: a pathetic attempt.
11:04 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
11:05 VanessaE can I ban him?  PLEASE???
11:06 PilzAdam sure
11:06 john_minetest Can you reaad this -> sqrt(-1) 2³ Σ Π
11:06 VanessaE john_minetest: sqrt(-1) 2-cubed Sigma Pi
11:07 VanessaE that's what I see (but with real symbols)
11:07 VanessaE testing unicode or somethign?
11:07 john_minetest It is "I ate some pie"
11:07 VanessaE hah!
11:08 john_minetest And the two is in the third thingie.
11:08 john_minetest i 8 sum pi
11:08 VanessaE and you didn't save any for the rest of us? :)
11:08 john_minetest :D
11:08 Issa joined #minetest
11:09 Issa hillo
11:09 VanessaE hi
11:09 Issa i used animals on my map
11:09 john_minetest No, actually I didn't eat any pie today. But I will eat pizza in a few minutes. And i will send you a few over the net ;).
11:09 Issa show i can teake animals to do my owxn ferm ?
11:09 Issa farm ?
11:09 kaeza Infinity was banned for 3 days on the forums a while ago IIRC
11:09 VanessaE john_minetest: all-meats, on thin crust please :)
11:12 thexyz http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=3003
11:12 thexyz ban?
11:12 VanessaE wtf>
11:13 VanessaE any idea what it was before?
11:13 VanessaE oh, dwarves
11:13 VanessaE ehm..
11:13 thexyz yes'
11:13 VanessaE restore from backups and ban his ass.
11:13 VanessaE this shit has to stop
11:14 PilzAdam he said he wants to continue dwarves
11:14 PilzAdam (some days ago)
11:14 VanessaE PilzAdam: how?  that *was* his dwarves thread
11:15 ImQ009 joined #minetest
11:16 VanessaE looks like he nuked his "D-Pack" thread also.
11:16 Issa F.. the spawn start is far away from where  dead
11:16 VanessaE http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=4402
11:17 VanessaE and several others too
11:17 Issa hwo i can play in 1920  * 16000 please ?
11:17 kaeza thexyz, you have backups right?
11:17 thexyz yes
11:17 kaeza revert the topic and re-troll th guy
11:18 kaeza the*
11:18 thexyz too lazy
11:18 kaeza hehe
11:18 VanessaE jesus, there's dozens here he blanked.
11:19 VanessaE thexyz: don't be lazy, revert 'em.  and jordan4ibanez also.
11:20 kaeza http://web.archive.org/web/20130205212441/http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=3003 :D
11:20 VanessaE muahahaha
11:20 VanessaE the download links still work, too
11:21 kaeza somebody mirror the copy and post the link in the first post
11:22 kaeza rule #1 of the internet: what you do in the internet, stays in the internet
11:23 VanessaE no way to see the forum post's bbcode source :(
11:24 troller joined #minetest
11:24 kaeza should be fairly easy to parse the HTML and output the BB source
11:24 kaeza <--- too lazy
11:25 john_minetest VanessaE: http://ompldr.org/vaWNpOQ
11:27 kaeza VanessaE, LOL the post is up again
11:27 VanessaE I'm restoring it.
11:28 VanessaE there, that
11:28 VanessaE that's got it.
11:29 john_minetest Srsly, why are people DELETING their posts when they leave? This is so stupid. If they want to quit, then they should go without annoying people who actually LIKED the post. People who don't care aren't annoyed by this.
11:32 ImQ009 kaeza, Rule #1 of the Internet: There are no rules
11:32 kaeza ImQ009, :D
11:32 kaeza you actually read the rules?
11:33 Calinou joined #minetest
11:33 ImQ009 http://internet.com/
11:33 ImQ009 That is the best fucking domain ever
11:34 kaeza ImQ009, actually, 1) Do not talk about rules 2-33
11:34 kaeza source: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/rules-of-the-internet
11:35 ImQ009 Nice try
11:35 ImQ009 NO RULES
11:36 ImQ009 Well, the only valid rule is 34, and the rule 1 should be "Do not talk about rules 1-33"
11:36 ImQ009 Oh wait, 2-33, it is correct, I am an idiot
11:37 kaeza derp
11:38 ImQ009 herp
11:38 kaeza hurr
11:38 TheLastProject joined #minetest
11:39 ImQ009 TheLastProject, GET OUT, FAAST
11:40 TheLastProject Errr, what?
11:40 VanessaE there, Dwarves is restored.
11:40 ImQ009 TheLastProject, There's no time to explain, RUN
11:40 VanessaE the game files are too large to mirror on ompldr though
11:41 VanessaE I'll mirror the last version on my web space.
11:47 Calinou you forgot rule 63, ImQ009
11:48 VanessaE http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=4402
11:48 VanessaE restored.
11:49 VanessaE fuck.
11:49 VanessaE bad link to that one.
11:50 VanessaE anyone got a mirror of it?
11:52 Calinou lol, mito
11:52 VanessaE got it.
11:53 VanessaE and..mirrored.
11:54 kaeza http://forum.minetest.net/profile.php?id=2566
11:54 kaeza see sig
11:54 Calinou no signature?
11:54 kaeza this is getting really stupid
11:54 VanessaE just fixed that.
11:54 Calinou also, no avatar :P
11:55 VanessaE you're getting slow, kaeza  :)
11:55 kaeza D:
11:55 Calinou http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88938#p88938
11:55 Calinou mmpph
11:56 Calinou I feel like I'm on a minecraft server
11:56 kaeza so... umm... what is the point in spamming "BAN ME"?
11:57 NakedFury joined #minetest
11:57 kaeza are they bound to some contract that doesn't let them leave the forums unless they are banned?
11:58 kaeza mauvebic just up and left, and didn't go around doing these stupid things AFAIK
12:08 Issa hello
12:09 Issa how install minetoon texture pack
12:09 VanessaE copy all png files from it into minetestfolder/textures/all
12:09 Issa on the zip u have 3 directory
12:09 Issa bucket
12:09 Issa deault
12:09 Issa an legacy ?
12:09 VanessaE er
12:09 Issa i have added the three directory on texture directoy on minetest bu is not loaded
12:10 Issa VanessaE, i knw but on the zip u have lua files
12:10 kaeza create a new dir, say, "Minetoon", move all the textures (*.png) to it, and set texture_path in minetest.conf to point to the dir
12:10 Maccer joined #minetest
12:10 Issa and for the lua files .??
12:10 kaeza Lua files?
12:11 kaeza a texture pack with code?
12:11 kaeza wut
12:11 VanessaE oh that's right, he redefines a few items
12:12 Maccer joined #minetest
12:12 kaeza then the best approach would be to create a new mod redefining all the items and distribute it separately
12:15 VanessaE there, I was able to restore four of Mito's posts from data on archive.org.
12:15 VanessaE the rest are dead.
12:16 VanessaE someone else can look up the necessary caches/archives to jordan4ibanez's deleted posts.
12:18 VanessaE thexyz: I suggest disabling editing of posts for now, lest someone else decide to pull the same routine
12:18 VanessaE (except for moderators of course ;) )
12:21 thexyz that suggestion is bad
12:22 thexyz .. i think
12:23 monkeycoder joined #minetest
12:25 NakedFury unless the forum is backedup monthly several times to fix this situation I cant find any punbb plugin to help us
12:26 VanessaE well in the meantime, I've gone through all his deleted posts and cleaned them up as best I can
12:30 NakedFury we would need a plugin that saves in a way all topics specially when they are edited. Saves them in the wikipedia style so administrators or users can go back and check past edits.
12:31 Pest joined #minetest
12:32 john_minetest VanessaE: Did you see this yet?  http://ompldr.org/vaWNpOQ
12:33 VanessaE yeah, saw it
12:34 bas080 joined #minetest
12:34 john_minetest :D
12:35 proller__ joined #minetest
12:38 kaeza small question: are dungeons generated only over already generated terrain?
12:38 kaeza i.e. are they not generated on air?
12:40 kaeza this is an interesting formation: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/100008207/screenshot_2138171518.jpg
12:41 salamanderrake joined #minetest
12:41 VanessaE only one of jordan4ibanez's topics was covered by archive.org.  restored it, but without download links.
12:41 VanessaE (the links were broken)
12:43 iqualfragile joined #minetest
12:47 kaeza thought I had a copy of his slimes here... seems like not
12:47 VanessaE if you can find it, upload it and let me know which of those topics I need to restore it to :)
12:51 NakedFury its such a dick move to delete your posts when you leave
12:54 kaeza lol just found my old copy of ternadim :D
12:55 Issa hello what i need to add on my minetest?conf for add admin server on my server minetetst please E?
12:58 Zeg9 http://ompldr.org/vaWNqMg <- waiting for content, now with progress bar
12:59 kaeza Zeg9, awesome!
12:59 Zeg9 I don't know if I should add menubg thingie
12:59 Zeg9 testing it with freetype right now
12:59 Zeg9 testing it without* freetype right now
13:00 Zeg9 This requires to recompile the whole game -.-
13:00 Issa Zeg9, it's cool screenshoot
13:01 kaeza Zeg9, "Menu principal"... spanish? :3
13:01 Zeg9 No, french
13:01 kaeza ah ok :)
13:01 Zeg9 I'll comment my code a bit and pull request
13:03 thexyz by the way, PilzAdam, piwik supports do-not-track header
13:04 PilzAdam hm?
13:04 Zeg9 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/705
13:05 thexyz http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest/2013-05-08#i_3074324
13:09 Kacey joined #minetest
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13:17 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
13:21 Calinou http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88958#p88958
13:21 Calinou mmmph
13:21 Calinou tells people not to put screamers
13:21 Calinou puts an "overly attached girlfriend" screamer
13:22 ImQ009 joined #minetest
13:22 Calinou Zeg9: "media" still isn't translated :P
13:22 Calinou also, (something) enabled/disabled (eg. press F3) isn't translated
13:22 Calinou :/
13:23 Zeg9 How do you want to translate media ? "données"?
13:26 Zeg9 Calinou: I could add wgettext to the code but I don't know how to update the .mo or whatever so weblate knows about
13:26 Zeg9 Calinou: I could add wgettext to the code but I don't know how to update the .mo or whatever so weblate knows about it*
13:27 Calinou "média" :>
13:29 arsdragonfly Seriously translating the keycodes are annoying
13:30 hmmmm joined #minetest
13:30 arsdragonfly 'Cause if you copy the text you'll get a failing check
13:37 troller joined #minetest
13:42 kaeza thexyz, http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=5904
13:46 thexyz > Still it's easier to deal with me than ban me. If it's so difficult to ban a person, then it's no wonder pull requests and ideas get ignored or denied.
13:46 thexyz http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88910#p88910
13:47 kaeza1 joined #minetest
13:51 thexyz okay, banned
13:54 Zeg9 What could /me do now...
13:59 Jousway joined #minetest
14:02 * VanessaE is back.  yay.
14:02 qznc__ Maybe minetest needs a clear process for feature requests? Could be Github issues, forum entries, wiki pages, ...
14:02 VanessaE thexyz: he wrote that to me in PM also, or words to substantially that effect
14:03 VanessaE qznc__: github issues are the most logical place, but those tend to be ignored
14:03 VanessaE on the forum, the probability of one of the core devs seeing the issue and figuring it's worth acting on are somewhat low, so all that's left is IRC.  it's much harder to ignore an issue being presented on a realtime chat.
14:04 kaeza I agree with them that saying "NOT IN THIS LIFE" right away without giving explanations does drive away contributors
14:04 kaeza but these guys kinda exaggerated the issue
14:05 qznc__ VanessaE: So posting links to github issues within the forum should be encouraged :)
14:06 VanessaE qznc__: actually I'd say that's a good idea
14:07 qznc__ VanessaE: A sticky post in "Feature Discussion" should explain that
14:07 PilzAdam iqualfragile, you almost have 100 posts
14:08 * ShadowBot wakes up
14:08 MinetestBot joined #minetest
14:08 * ShadowBot sleeps
14:09 VanessaE that does it.
14:09 VanessaE http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=5774  <-- closed
14:12 * ShadowBot wakes up
14:12 NakedFury perhaps you could add a last post explaining why it was closed so we stop the possibility of likwid making yet another post just to ask why it was closed.
14:12 MinetestBot joined #minetest
14:12 * ShadowBot sleeps
14:12 VanessaE I had a post there, but deleted it.  figured I didn't really need to take the last word there.
14:12 VanessaE someone else can chime in if they way
14:12 VanessaE want*
14:13 thexyz VanessaE: why did you close it?
14:13 NakedFury talking about religion always without fail messes things up
14:13 Issa joined #minetest
14:13 VanessaE thexyz: because of Jonathan getting "oh take Jesus into your bosom" bullshit
14:14 VanessaE the forums are NOT the place for religious messages, especially preachy-proselytizing crap
14:14 * kaeza mumbles about GNU GPL being also a religion
14:14 VanessaE heh
14:14 Issa hell
14:15 Issa hello
14:15 thexyz VanessaE: wait, this post was made in "Offtopic" section
14:15 Issa how configurer adminsitrateur for a dedicated serveur pleaseu
14:15 VanessaE thexyz: yep, and even then it's taking the concept way too far
14:15 Zeg9 Issa: mets name = <admin> dans minetest.conf
14:15 thexyz i still think there's nothing wrong with this topic
14:16 Zeg9 Ensuite dans le jeu /grant <name> <privilege>
14:16 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
14:16 Zeg9 And sorry for speaking french, thought he would understand better :)
14:16 rubenwardy joined #minetest
14:18 FreeFull joined #minetest
14:18 rubenwardy hi all
14:19 VanessaE hey rubemn
14:19 VanessaE ruben*
14:19 Zeg9 Hi
14:19 VanessaE thexyz: the topic as a whole is fine - but as I expected, it's devolved into religious nutjobbery.
14:19 VanessaE I closed it to put a silent, graceful stop to that.  maybe it can be re-opened later.
14:20 Zeg9 Nice to see this finally got closed...
14:20 rubenwardy thank God that has been closed.
14:21 rubenwardy Or rather do not thank God, it is him that started it
14:21 rubenwardy lol
14:21 VanessaE lol
14:21 VanessaE no, it's one of his nitwit disciples :)
14:21 VanessaE free will, etc.
14:21 thexyz VanessaE: the discussion looks fine to me
14:22 VanessaE http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88962#p88962
14:22 VanessaE this does not.
14:23 thexyz can you quote what is wrong here?
14:23 VanessaE " I will pray for you and others on here, and hope one day that you will accept Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and Savior."
14:23 rubenwardy nut job
14:23 VanessaE that shit.
14:23 rubenwardy I personally can not believe how narrowminded and sheepish people are
14:23 VanessaE don't go telling others you hope that, or that they should, convert to your religion
14:23 rubenwardy religion is good, as it provides faith and good morals
14:24 rubenwardy but it should not be used to:
14:24 rubenwardy A. Start wars
14:24 VanessaE rubenwardy: as long as the religion in question doesn't lead to hatred of some group, or reasons to get violent
14:24 rubenwardy B. Hinder scientific and non scientific knowledge
14:24 VanessaE hear hear!
14:24 rubenwardy C. Force people to do stupid things, or limit their freedom
14:25 rubenwardy start wars include terrorism and mudor
14:25 rubenwardy *murder
14:25 rubenwardy that is my 30 sec preach over
14:25 VanessaE lol
14:25 kaeza hehe
14:26 VanessaE I warned you guys that "offtopic" was a bad idea...but noooo, no one listened.  now we have religious topics, minecraft stuff creeping in, etc
14:26 rubenwardy Should be "offtopic but not so offtopic"
14:27 VanessaE http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88963#p88963
14:27 VanessaE now THIS on the other hand, is useful!
14:27 kaeza offtopic should be for things related to minetest that don't fit well in other categories
14:28 kaeza well... perhaps "General Discussion" would be for that
14:28 VanessaE (though I'd move the text to be displayed at the bottom, left of the hotbar)
14:28 kaeza VanessaE, :D
14:28 kaeza you like?
14:28 VanessaE yes
14:29 kaeza perhaps to the bottom-right, just under the "hand"
14:29 VanessaE yeah
14:29 VanessaE but with a shadow behind the text
14:29 VanessaE so it doesn't get lost in the noise
14:30 thexyz meh
14:30 thexyz i still don't see anything bad in such a discussion
14:31 VanessaE well you can always re-open it if you want to
14:31 VanessaE I won't compete.
14:32 thexyz wait, who deleted 4aiman's "leaving" post?
14:32 kaeza VanessaE, https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/100008207/minetest/mods/Kaeza-wielded_item_hud_2.jpg
14:33 VanessaE kaeza: yes, like that - but can you put a drop shadow under the text?
14:33 VanessaE (if not, I know a trick you can use to fake it)
14:33 kaeza that would need another hud item
14:33 VanessaE thexyz: not me, or at least I don't think I did anyway.
14:33 NakedFury make a no posting sub area where we can move all the Im leaving topics. they are all closed and can only be moved to that area. this way they are not deleted and kept for archiving
14:33 VanessaE thexyz: it might be in the trash?
14:34 VanessaE hm, no.. not there either.
14:35 thexyz NakedFury: such section already exists
14:36 rubenwardy THE TRASH!
14:37 thexyz still, some mods decide to delete topics instead of moving them
14:37 thexyz just wtf is wrong with those people
14:37 kaeza VanessaE, https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/100008207/minetest/mods/Kaeza-wielded_item_hud_3.jpg
14:37 VanessaE NICE
14:37 NakedFury have you guys found something to stop users completely editing out posts out of spite us minetest comunity?
14:37 thexyz kaeza: why no ttf?
14:37 VanessaE but keep the yellow text?
14:37 VanessaE thexyz: ttf has no drop shadows.
14:38 kaeza thexyz, it IS TTF
14:38 VanessaE and enabling ttf disables the ability to use bitmap fonts
14:38 kaeza actually... umm.. no it isn't
14:38 thexyz kaeza: it is not
14:38 NakedFury kaeza: could you add that to options? I would suggest another mode. when you switch the items the blocks name appears for a few seconds on top of the hotbar before fading out.
14:38 kaeza looks like I forgot to compile with -DENABLE_FREETYPE
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14:39 kaeza NakedFury, that could be arranged
14:39 NakedFury so users would have 2 modes. the fading out version and the always on
14:40 NakedFury but both ways its a great little thing you did there
14:40 VanessaE NakedFury: good idea!
14:41 kaeza lol http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88975#p88975
14:41 kaeza I wrote this in like 20 secs :3
14:42 proller joined #minetest
14:44 rubenwardy brb
14:46 Jordach joined #minetest
14:46 Jordach joined #minetest
14:51 rubenwardy I like it, vanessaE
14:51 rubenwardy http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/Screenshot%20-%2005052013%20-%2009:51:55%20PM.png
14:51 VanessaE thanks :)
14:51 Jordach hey all
14:51 VanessaE minecraft-esque, but clearly with a Minetest flavor :)
14:53 rubenwardy <Infinity_69> PilzAdam = Dick
14:54 rubenwardy such a noob, using the assignment instead of comparision
14:54 VanessaE heh
14:54 Jordach VanessaE, y u op
14:54 VanessaE Jordach:  because. :)
14:54 * rubenwardy is reading logs since he was last here
14:55 rubenwardy Mito551 is banned?
14:55 VanessaE yep.
14:55 VanessaE pulled the same routine others have been doing - deleting posts on the way out.
14:56 Calinou joined #minetest
14:57 VanessaE and then there's that Calinou guy, who keeps....oh, hi ;)
14:57 thefamilygrog66 joined #minetest
14:57 rubenwardy mauvebic has left?
14:57 VanessaE rubenwardy: apparently so
14:57 rubenwardy Minetest is going to shit
14:58 rubenwardy see my signature: http://forum.minetest.net/profile.php?id=2051
14:58 VanessaE I wish I knew what the correct answer is to that
14:58 thefamilygrog66 what are the "community problems"?
14:58 rubenwardy not sure
14:58 VanessaE thefamilygrog66: people leaving in a huff because they're not being listened to in the way they think is right
14:58 rubenwardy just blame PA for every thing :P
14:59 * PilzAdam too
14:59 Calinou http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88962#p88962
14:59 Calinou atheism won :>
14:59 VanessaE you know, "I'm taking my X and going home!" (for X = "mods", "code", etc)
14:59 rubenwardy lol
14:59 Calinou rubenwardy: blaming pulseaudio? no!
15:00 rubenwardy you know who I mean
15:00 rubenwardy and he know as well :P
15:00 Calinou yeah, mushroom adam
15:00 * Calinou knows haswell
15:00 Jordach anyways
15:00 thefamilygrog66 science for the win
15:00 rubenwardy I am just joking, I am not being serious
15:00 Jordach i might have found the problem to the people leaving issue
15:00 VanessaE whenever it is involved, blame is always properly laid if it points to pulseaudio :-)
15:00 VanessaE Jordach: which would be..?
15:00 Calinou "switch to arch."
15:00 Jordach its not just the devs
15:01 Jordach its some members essentially putting the lead devs down
15:01 Jordach this ISNT a PURE GAME engine
15:01 kaeza Calinou, https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/100008207/minetest/mods/Kaeza-wielded_item_hud_3.jpg
15:01 VanessaE Jordach: it aims to be, though
15:01 Jordach yes
15:01 VanessaE kaeza: the text needs to be bigger
15:01 Jordach but nowadays, voxel == mining game
15:01 Calinou shaded text :O
15:01 kaeza VanessaE, how?
15:01 VanessaE kaeza: no idea how, just that it's too small :)
15:01 Jordach yes, it can produce some awesome things
15:01 kaeza you can't use custom fonts in Lua HUD :P
15:02 VanessaE well shit
15:02 Jordach such as cornernote's skyblock
15:02 VanessaE use my "bigger, sharper font"?
15:02 Jordach that was the shit
15:02 VanessaE Jordach: too bad he never finished that
15:02 Jordach VanessaE, you know why?
15:02 Jordach -?
15:02 VanessaE dunno
15:02 VanessaE doesn't much matter anyway
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15:03 VanessaE he went full retard is why :)
15:03 Jordach VanessaE, you didnt allow him his say
15:03 thefamilygrog66 :O
15:03 VanessaE ?
15:03 Jordach or in fact, the ops
15:03 VanessaE what, you mean that BS about going veg?
15:03 Jordach yes
15:03 Jordach people are who they are
15:04 VanessaE of course we didn't - it was utterly off-topic and he was posting shock images to boot.
15:04 Jordach you didnt have to push him aside for that
15:04 rubenwardy 4aiman is quite right
15:04 Jordach hm?
15:04 rubenwardy "I still have a plenty of ideas, but no one seems to care about Minetest  having it's own face. Well, except really small group of unorganized  (that stands for "not united in their attempts") people."
15:04 kaeza well... if the guy was still around maybe he could ask to be unbanned
15:04 Calinou the text appears above hotbar, not at bottom right too, kaeza
15:04 * VanessaE wonders who that "small group" includes.
15:05 Calinou and it's server-side... sucks when you have 200ms+ latency :P
15:05 kaeza Calinou, that was VanessaE's idea
15:05 Jordach anyways
15:05 kaeza and I like it this way
15:05 Calinou +1, it looks fine
15:05 VanessaE I like it the way you've got it now
15:05 Jordach we should really stop the apprehension#
15:06 kaeza plus you gotta do some more processing so it doesn't overlap health bar
15:06 kaeza and think of hunger, thirst bars, etc
15:06 Jordach just because someone is different, doesnt mean you should exclude them
15:06 rubenwardy1 joined #minetest
15:06 * thefamilygrog66 is different
15:06 kaeza wb rubenwardy
15:07 rubenwardy1 stupid router :P
15:07 VanessaE Jordach: there's a big gap between being "different" and "shoving your differences down everyone else's throat".
15:07 kaeza ^
15:07 VanessaE different is good - G*d knows I'm not average
15:07 celeron55_ rubenwardy1: i'm constantly wondering why those people won't organize
15:07 VanessaE but I don't go cramming my beliefs in everyone's face and expecting positive responses.
15:07 celeron55_ it would be the benefit of everyone
15:08 thefamilygrog66 people should stop cutting their hair!
15:08 thefamilygrog66 sorry, that was me cramming my beliefs...
15:08 VanessaE lol
15:08 kaeza people should stop using Lua and switch to JavaScript
15:08 rubenwardy not quite sure who that group is
15:09 rubenwardy do you think he means, core devs, contributors, mod makers, or the community as a whole?
15:09 VanessaE kaeza: lamefun, is that you? ;)
15:09 * thefamilygrog66 kinda likes lua
15:09 kaeza the shiny new world won't allow compiled languages for the general public, etc, etc
15:09 celeron55_ rubenwardy: i'm not either, but they have referred to themselves more often than only this time
15:09 rubenwardy I like lua
15:09 rubenwardy but it encourages bad programming habbits
15:09 thexyz Jordach: "push him"?
15:09 thexyz [citation needed]
15:10 celeron55_ rubenwardy: i think that mostly means a small bunch of people in the community
15:10 * thefamilygrog66 was raised on BASIC
15:10 rubenwardy hmm
15:10 VanessaE thefamilygrog66: o/
15:11 rubenwardy I would hope I am an "influential" member of the community.
15:11 rubenwardy nah, no chance
15:11 thefamilygrog66 V knows what I'm talking about
15:11 VanessaE rubenwardy: you'd be surprised just how influential you are.
15:11 VanessaE thefamilygrog66: BASIC v2.0 ftw ;)
15:11 celeron55_ rubenwardy: you do are more than average, but i won't judge more than that
15:11 thefamilygrog66 haha
15:11 rubenwardy I wish I was better at c++ and Minetest's source
15:12 VanessaE for the longest time, that was the only language I could code in.
15:12 rubenwardy but I have no idea where to get started
15:12 celeron55_ the influence of people tend to somewhat correlate with the amount of stuff they make for others
15:12 Kray https://gist.github.com/spion/3049314
15:12 thefamilygrog66 likewise - learned on the Commodore PET, and graduated to the C64...
15:12 kaeza PRINT INK 7; PAPER 0; AT 1, 1; "thefamilygrog66 r00lz"
15:13 VanessaE thefamilygrog66: I'll do you one better - I learned on a Timex/Sinclair 1000 (e.g. ZX-81) and THEN got a c64 :)
15:13 thefamilygrog66 didn't learn Pascal till a few years later
15:13 VanessaE Kray: what is this?
15:13 thefamilygrog66 Actually, I also owned a TS1000 before my C64 - probably repressed that memory...
15:13 thefamilygrog66 :)
15:13 thefamilygrog66 that thing was a pain to program on!
15:13 Kray VanessaE: performance comparison
15:14 VanessaE thefamilygrog66: had a 16K RAM expander for mine :)
15:14 qznc__ celeron55_: that correlation is good, since it basically means it is a meritocracy
15:14 thefamilygrog66 I might've had one of those too, can't remember - all I recall is bizarre membranous key combinations to do anything
15:14 Jordach i probably have the (5th) highest forum ranking
15:14 VanessaE kaeza Ah, I see
15:15 kaeza ...
15:15 rubenwardy http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=4204
15:15 celeron55_ Kray: lol, luajit's hash table implementation appears to be quite intensely fast
15:15 celeron55_ (which doesn't surprise at all though)
15:15 VanessaE thefamilygrog66: yeah, that was a pain alright :)
15:15 rubenwardy close that now that I have posted it ^^
15:15 Kray celeron55_: yeah
15:15 rubenwardy Would be better to start a new topic than revive
15:15 VanessaE wtf?  I ended up at the top of that list? o.O
15:16 rubenwardy just
15:16 Jordach VanessaE, http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88903#p88903
15:16 Jordach half five in the morning
15:16 VanessaE Jordach: saw that
15:16 rubenwardy can you close it?
15:16 Jordach (i woke up about about 3:30am)
15:16 VanessaE rubenwardy: closed.
15:16 celeron55_ Kray: it's probably because hash tables would really be the bottleneck of well structured Lua code otherwise 8)
15:16 whirm -- LuaJIT library: LUA_LIBRARY-NOTFOUND
15:16 whirm -- LuaJIT headers: /usr/include/luajit-2.0
15:16 Jordach VanessaE, just god to add some bones
15:16 whirm -- LuaJIT not found, using bundled Lua.
15:16 rubenwardy thanks
15:16 Jordach got*
15:16 whirm its finding the luajit headers but then saying they aren't there?
15:17 Jordach VanessaE, i might have found a way to expand the player texture system
15:17 VanessaE Jordach: how?
15:17 Jordach VanessaE, not only can you have player textures, you can also have player models
15:17 VanessaE whirm: maybe all you have is the headers but not the actual library?
15:17 celeron55_ qznc__: yes, it is good; also it is quite inevitable
15:17 Jordach provided they use the same names as the default system
15:17 Jordach so mine_START
15:17 whirm VanessaE: I don't think that can happen on Debian, let me check
15:17 Jordach etcx
15:17 Jordach -x
15:18 whirm VanessaE: yup -> /usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libluajit-5.1.so.2
15:18 Jordach in other news: debian 7 came out
15:19 celeron55_ whirm: that path looks like something that the cmake scripts won't find
15:19 VanessaE whirm: delete CMakeCache.txt and use the command line switches to point to it manually
15:19 whirm oh
15:19 whirm just deleting CMakeCache.txt was enough :/
15:19 VanessaE oh ok
15:20 celeron55_ passing "-DLUA_LIBRARY=/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libluajit-5.1.so.2" to cmake may do it
15:20 rubenwardy Jordach: You were the 8th most respected person (not counting joint positions above you)
15:21 whirm celeron55_: not necessary, I only needed to remove CMakeCache.txt
15:21 celeron55_ (if one wants to leave the cache alone because of other changes to the configuration)
15:21 rubenwardy in december 2012
15:21 whirm celeron55_: shouldnt it be replaced when CMakefile gets updated?
15:21 celeron55_ it will only update the changed portions of the cache and leave all else as-is
15:23 celeron55_ it's probably because when doing stuff on windows, you can end up with a really hairy configuration that you don't even know how to recreate 8)
15:23 whirm :D
15:23 celeron55_ autotools does clear the configuration always; it's quite annoying actually
15:25 whirm btw, I'm trying to use Terminus as font in minetest, but it seems its ignoring the thing altogether? (IE, no file not found message and showing the default one)
15:25 VanessaE whirm: you lack freetype support
15:25 whirm celeron55_: well, I tend to create scripts for anything I build more than once, so I really don't care much :D
15:26 * whirm le checking...
15:26 VanessaE whirm: +1 for hand-rolled automated build scripts :)
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15:33 whirm VanessaE: ook, at least now it says it can't find the font :D
15:33 VanessaE heh
15:33 troller joined #minetest
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15:33 VanessaE well that's a start :)
15:35 whirm yeahh! looking good!
15:35 proller__ joined #minetest
15:36 whirm VanessaE: much better with Terminus 14
15:36 * ShadowBot wakes up
15:36 VanessaE whirm: try building without TTF, and use this font:  http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=63561#p63561
15:36 VanessaE imho, it looks better than the ttf ones :)
15:37 VanessaE (though there's some minor kerning issues, but that's in the engine, not the font)
15:37 john_minetest Minetest should really have a bigger font.
15:37 whirm VanessaE: Terminus has no antialias, I like it like this :)
15:37 whirm I use Terminus everywhere
15:38 * whirm thinking about setting it up on the phone
15:38 arsdragonfly VanessaE :What's the loading screen when connecting to a server like?
15:38 VanessaE arsdragonfly: with my font?  same as before, just bigger text.  Not sure how it would look with Zeg9's patch (see -dev)
15:38 arsdragonfly 'cause I have a TTF build ,and you said it'll break it
15:39 VanessaE oh that
15:39 VanessaE yeah, with TTF compiled in, most of the loading screen info is missing
15:39 Zeg9 Not with my patch... :P
15:39 VanessaE heh
15:40 VanessaE no offense to thexyz, but I have to wonder why that code was accepted in such a half-assed state
15:40 thefamilygrog66 I understand that the latest git allows mods to specify how fast a player can move, and how high a player can jump - is that correct?
15:42 VanessaE dunno
15:42 thefamilygrog66 PilzAdam?
15:42 Zeg9 Yes it does
15:43 Zeg9 thefamilygrog66, as well as gravity
15:43 PilzAdam thefamilygrog66?
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15:43 thefamilygrog66 Didn't you mention that it was now possible to control that sort of thing with the latest version?
15:44 thexyz sure, no offense
15:44 thexyz that code isn't written by me anyway
15:44 VanessaE oh ok heh
15:45 thexyz but it's good to know the only problem is the loading screen
15:45 VanessaE thexyz: that isn't the only problem.
15:46 rubenwardy the sheeps in YAMM eat grass
15:46 rubenwardy literally
15:47 rubenwardy ha!
15:47 rubenwardy I am standing on one
15:48 rubenwardy (Yet Another Mob Mod)
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15:52 thefamilygrog66 Zeg9: is there any documentation online that I can refer to regarding this?
15:53 Zeg9 thefamilygrog66: yes, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L1444
15:53 qznc__ is there a page on the wiki about the different games? (survival,build,etc)
15:53 thefamilygrog66 That's the one - thanks, Zeg9
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15:58 Zeg9 VanessaE, seems your font works fine with my patch
15:58 VanessaE screenshot? :)
15:59 Zeg9 http://ompldr.org/vaWNrcQ
16:00 VanessaE \o/
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16:04 celeron55_ VanessaE: TTF half-assed? i find it incredible that anyone even bothered to make it work as much as it does
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16:04 rubenwardy Can I use a keyword (ie: end) as a table hash in lua?
16:05 rubenwardy walk = {
16:05 rubenwardy start = 81
16:05 rubenwardy end = 100,
16:05 rubenwardy }
16:05 celeron55_ rubenwardy: of course
16:05 celeron55_ if you have some really odd stuff you may need to use ["9asfj09sfjdya0"] as the index though
16:05 VanessaE celeron55_: I wouldn't complain if the presence of TTF didn't break other stuff.
16:05 celeron55_ (well that wasn't a good example)
16:06 thexyz VanessaE: what stuff did it break?
16:06 celeron55_ VanessaE: nothing as big as that can be added without it having a single problem
16:06 Issa do u have a minetest.conf to play in HD
16:06 Issa ?
16:06 celeron55_ and if there is a problem, the right thing to do is fix it rather than complain
16:06 celeron55_ it's just a few numbers probably somewhere there anywya
16:07 VanessaE thexyz: aside from the loading screen, if TTF support is compiled in, bitmap fonts don't work anymore, which is mandatory if you need a drop shadow behind the text for readability sake.
16:08 kaeza NakedFury, https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/100008207/minetest/mods/Kaeza-wielded_item_hud-0.1.1.zip
16:08 celeron55_ VanessaE: you're lucky i forced someone (thexyz?) to even make having non-TTF fonts a compile-time option
16:09 celeron55_ they were going to be completely unsupported otherwise
16:10 VanessaE celeron55_: and had you not done so, frankly, it would have been a braindead decision :)
16:10 rubenwardy celeron55_, you Lyier, you can not use end as a hash
16:10 rubenwardy :P
16:10 kaeza rubenwardy, ["end"] = ...
16:10 celeron55_ rubenwardy: {["end"] = "yes you can"}
16:11 kaeza :D
16:11 rubenwardy (5:05:11 PM) rubenwardy: walk = {
16:11 rubenwardy (5:05:11 PM) rubenwardy:      start = 81
16:11 rubenwardy (5:05:11 PM) rubenwardy:      end = 100,
16:11 rubenwardy (5:05:11 PM) rubenwardy: }
16:11 rubenwardy forget the missing comma
16:14 thefamilygrog66 would the syntax be something like this?  set_physics_override(speed=2, jump=1, gravity=3)
16:15 NakedFury kaeza: error line 28 attempt to call method hud_add (a nil value)
16:15 kaeza NakedFury, your client is too old
16:15 NakedFury 046
16:15 NakedFury are we at 047 now?
16:15 kaeza 0.4.6 stable?
16:16 kaeza HUD support was added in dev version
16:16 VanessaE just get the latest git
16:16 VanessaE :)
16:16 thefamilygrog66 the latest git crashes on my linux machine :(
16:16 VanessaE what's it do?
16:17 VanessaE (I mean, does it segfault, etc)
16:17 NakedFury downloading pillzadams 28 hours ago dropbox version
16:17 thefamilygrog66 as soon as I attempt to log into a server, it just disappears - haven't bothered checking the log yet though
16:17 VanessaE thefamilygrog66: that happens with a LOT of people
16:17 thefamilygrog66 I just run an earlier standalone version (i.e. the installed version is a daily)
16:19 NakedFury dammit the game wont even list the mod with /mods command in game
16:19 arsdragonfly joined #minetest
16:19 arsdragonfly I forgot to construct a table
16:19 NakedFury mods here my ass
16:19 arsdragonfly Nvm it works
16:21 NakedFury ok now it works, I got to add the mods directly to games>gamemode>mods
16:21 NakedFury but works nice
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16:23 NakedFury what is TTF?
16:23 thexyz truetype fonts
16:23 NakedFury wait. true type font?
16:23 NakedFury ohh ok it clicked in my head after asking
16:23 thexyz + unicode support
16:23 thexyz some subset though
16:23 thexyz ucs-2 it seems
16:24 thefamilygrog66 does anyone have an example using set_physics_override(speed, jump, gravity) ?
16:24 PilzAdam player:set_physics_override(1, 10, 1)
16:24 Calinou potion API
16:25 PilzAdam increases jump height by a factor of 10
16:25 thefamilygrog66 cool, thanks PilzAdam
16:25 Zeg9 player:set_physics_override(nil,10,nil)
16:25 thefamilygrog66 oh yeah, nil is the default, right?
16:25 PilzAdam no
16:25 PilzAdam 1 is default
16:25 Zeg9 Using nil will allow using the already set physics. But 1 is default
16:25 PilzAdam nil simply doesnt override what is already set
16:26 thefamilygrog66 Okay, so if I've changed a value already, nil will keep it the same.
16:26 PilzAdam Zeg9, ", nil)" is quite useless
16:27 Zeg9 True
16:27 * PilzAdam wonders how many people will copy it if I add , nil) to all my function calls in my mods
16:27 * thefamilygrog66 probably will
16:28 thefamilygrog66 haha
16:28 * kaeza hates people writing tbl = { foo = nil }
16:28 * Zeg9 just understood what is the segfault in the main menu
16:29 VanessaE Zeg9: kahrl has a patch waiting that fixes that I guess
16:29 * PilzAdam needs to merge it
16:29 Zeg9 Yeah, I saw the patch before actually knowing the bug
16:30 Zeg9 PilzAdam, while you're at it, what about my progress bar ? o:-)
16:30 VanessaE https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/702  <-- is this what I think it is?
16:30 PilzAdam no, its not batman
16:30 kaeza Zeg9, not sure if an algel smiley, or a man with a pickaxe in the head
16:31 kaeza angel*
16:31 Zeg9 Let's say both, kaeza
16:32 PilzAdam Zeg9, your thing is untested by me
16:32 PilzAdam so I cant say that Ill merge it
16:32 PilzAdam the idea sounds good, though
16:36 NakedFury how long would zeg9s idea and the pull on vanessaes 702 link take to test and be added>
16:36 NakedFury ?
16:37 PilzAdam my lazyness included?
16:37 NakedFury and by others?
16:39 Zeg9 Why not you ? :P
16:45 NakedFury I will start practicing the compilers art starting saturday when my finals are over. I will need to purge all c++ compilers from my system and start clean
16:45 webdesigner97 joined #minetest
16:45 rubenwardy Let create a "Talk like Likwid" day
16:45 rubenwardy make 20 posts in a day, saying not much that is useful
16:45 Jordach_ rubenwardy, just be retarded
16:46 rubenwardy that is another parameter
16:46 NakedFury 20 a day must be when he feels sick
16:54 Jordach_ Taoki[laptop], you about
16:54 * Zeg9 is bored --'
16:54 pandaro joined #minetest
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16:58 Jordach yo Taoki[laptop]
17:03 Jordach anyways
17:03 rubenwardy added 3d model support and animation to YAMM (Yet another mob mod)
17:04 rubenwardy next: animal damage and running away from predators
17:04 rubenwardy and trying to get pathfinding to work
17:04 proller joined #minetest
17:06 * Jordach finally knows how to modify blender bones
17:06 rubenwardy blender is complicated
17:07 rubenwardy I have never managed to do uv or texture painting
17:07 rubenwardy all of the tutorials do not work
17:07 Jordach btw
17:07 Jordach i've worked out how to make movies with minetest
17:08 Jordach bandicam + custom model (and /command anims
17:08 Jordach and have a second window recording
17:08 Jordach thats a start
17:09 john_minetest rubenwardy: Blender is easy.
17:09 rubenwardy for killing people, yes
17:09 Zeg9 -is easy +is easy when you know it
17:09 john_minetest rubenwardy: This only took a few hours: http://ompldr.org/vaWNjMQ/rat_render.jpg
17:10 Zeg9 oh and I found how to attach bones to vertex groups, john_minetest
17:10 Zeg9 just call the bone the same name as the group
17:10 rubenwardy multa.bugs3.com/minetest/forum/
17:11 rubenwardy http://multa.bugs3.com/minetest/forum/
17:11 john_minetest This rat was the first time I made a model of a living being. I made it yesterday ^^
17:11 Jordach john_minetest, rubenwardy: challenge add armature and FIX THE UV WRAPS: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=88903#p88903
17:12 Jordach because 3ds sucks ass
17:12 rubenwardy Minetest Extensions has been decommissioned
17:12 rubenwardy brb
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17:18 VanessaE bbl
17:18 frogcrush joined #minetest
17:20 Jordach john_minetest, rigify FTW
17:23 Jordach esp. with this model
17:25 kaeza joined #minetest
17:29 Jordach john_minetest, partially done the arms
17:31 rubenwardy back
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17:32 [ungali] is there a way to turn off particles in minetest.conf ?
17:33 Jordach yes
17:33 rubenwardy see minetest.conf.example]
17:33 [ungali] thanks
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17:54 rubenwardy how can you get the height of the terrain at a specific X/Z
17:54 rubenwardy ?
17:56 Warr1024 I've been wondering the same thing, actually...
17:58 Zeg9 Is someone not lazy enough to test this? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/705
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18:02 celeron55_ Zeg9: you should add clouds only if the enable_clouds setting is true
18:03 celeron55_ gotta respect the people who want less bling
18:03 Zeg9 I was wondering what was the setting in fact
18:03 celeron55_ hmm actually no
18:03 celeron55_ not enable_clouds...
18:03 Zeg9 should it be a black background when there is no cloud, or a blue one?
18:03 celeron55_ menu_clouds
18:04 celeron55_ well, dunno
18:05 john_minetest Zeg9: Make it green.
18:05 celeron55_ i'd prefer black
18:06 Zeg9 Black is simpler since I kept it for other loading screens, so sorry, john... :P
18:06 john_minetest yeah ^^
18:07 Jordach also: star-made.org
18:07 Jordach thats a nice game
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18:09 sfan5 Zeg9: if you add it respecting the menu_clouds settings I can merge it
18:10 Zeg9 It's nearly done
18:10 Zeg9 should I squash the commits?
18:10 sfan5 yup
18:11 celeron55_ i think the way i made the menu theming to handle clouds is kind of not good either from the perspective of the user who doesn't want clouds
18:11 celeron55_ but... whatever i guess
18:11 Zeg9 I just saw the background, yeah...
18:11 sfan5 Zeg9: also "video::IVideoDriver*driver = device->getVideoDriver();" should be "video::IVideoDriver* driver = device->getVideoDriver();"
18:11 Zeg9 The space?
18:11 sfan5 yes
18:11 Zeg9 ok
18:11 Zeg9 I'll amend
18:13 rubenwardy how do you get a player by their name?
18:13 rubenwardy nevermind
18:13 Zeg9 sfan5, fixed
18:14 sfan5 will test now
18:14 sfan5 celeron55_: is it ok if I merge Zeg9's pull after testing?
18:16 celeron55_ sfan5: i think so
18:19 sfan5 Zeg9: works! awesome
18:20 Zeg9 Thanks :D
18:22 sfan5 Zeg9: i'll merge that now
18:22 sfan5 *waits for git clone to finish*
18:22 BrandonReese Zeg9, I like it a lot
18:23 rubenwardy this is my function to get a terrain's height: https://gist.github.com/rubenwardy/4d96a25f8cc1a37aa191
18:23 rubenwardy fairly complicated, but works and is fast
18:24 Zeg9 I remember there was some get surface height or whatever that got merged... I don't think it has a lua interface though
18:24 sfan5 how I'd do it:   start at 0, repeat until above == air && below ~= air { block ~= air -> go up else go down }
18:25 sfan5 *y 0
18:25 Zeg9 Going to eat, cya.
18:25 sfan5 Zeg9: "warning: 5 lines add whitespace errors." y u no code correctly?
18:25 rubenwardy similar to minet
18:25 celeron55_ Zeg9: i think it didn't get merged as of now
18:25 rubenwardy *mine
18:26 Warr1024 what about caves?
18:26 salamanderrake joined #minetest
18:27 sfan5 where did MinetestBot go?
18:28 MinetestBot joined #minetest
18:28 * ShadowBot sleeps
18:28 sfan5 !deop
18:28 sfan5 Zeg9: merged!
18:29 sfan5 time for a new win builds
18:29 sfan5 -s
18:30 Warr1024 If you want to find the true terrain height at a certain point, it seems like you'd have to look at sunlight incidence...
18:30 rubenwardy sfan5: with your one you make two get_nodes per loop, with my one it is one node per loop, and saving the last node in a boolean
18:30 rubenwardy not sure if that is faster
18:31 rubenwardy I need it to work out if the animal can run to there, w/o using path finding
18:32 rubenwardy I have positionA and central position
18:32 iqualfragile rubenwardy: but what happens when the position is in the air allready?
18:32 rubenwardy It goes down
18:32 rubenwardy and checks if the below node is a block
18:32 rubenwardy if it is, the air block is the result
18:33 rubenwardy https://gist.github.com/rubenwardy/4d96a25f8cc1a37aa191
18:35 rubenwardy updated
18:39 sfan5 new win build: http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=89023#p89023
18:40 Warr1024 I guess there's no definitive way in the lua API to find out whether a block can "see sky" or at least is affected by sunlight?
18:40 Warr1024 You could compare get_node_light(pos, 0) vs. get_node_light(pos, 0.5) and see if they differ, but if there's a light source immediately nearby, that would give you a false negative...
18:40 BrandonReese rubenwardy: Why do you redeclare your position table using values from the position table being passed to the function? Looks redundant to me.
18:41 rubenwardy because the position table would have been modified
18:41 rubenwardy tables are pased by referende
18:41 rubenwardy *reference
18:41 rubenwardy *passed
18:41 BrandonReese ok gotcha
18:42 BrandonReese I learned something today
18:42 rubenwardy would the best way to make a mob run in an opposite direction be to use trigonometry?
18:42 ShadowNinja Zeg9: How did you get Minetest to compile on Arch linux?
18:43 tripod he may have grabbed the git....or PKGBUILD
18:43 ShadowNinja Maybe, but I need to develop on my copy.
18:45 tjbarber joined #minetest
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18:55 rubenwardy how do I get the yaw of one object to another?
18:55 MinetestBot GIT: kahrl commited to minetest/minetest: Fix world selection a bit (also fixes a main menu segfault) f00cee75c1 2013-05-08T11:54:03-07:00 http://git.io/_uhZ1A
18:57 ssieb celeron55_: that guy with the sse3 error yesterday was probably running Fedora.  There's a forum thread on that.  There's an issue with the F18 irrlicht devel package where it has the wrong headers.
18:58 Zeg9 ShadowNinja: I used git, then cmake . && make -j4
19:00 Zeg9 Also you should install the dependencies for the PKGBUILD of minetest-git
19:01 rubenwardy bye all
19:01 Zeg9 I have to go now, bye all, too.
19:04 rubenwardy left #minetest
19:12 ShadowNinja Audio set up now, but I still can't compile minetest. Does anyone here compile minetest on Arch linux?
19:13 thexyz > Minetest Extensions experiences over 400 visitors a week, and because of this it has been suffering from Immense lag and failures.
19:15 ShadowNinja Um... lol
19:17 AshleyWaffle someone should make this for minetest: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&amp;v=8RN7PD2qiJE
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19:33 khonkhortisan if it can do anaglyph then it can do cross-eyed 3d too
19:34 sokomine i wish there where more models for animals for mobf
19:45 john_minetest i can do cross-eye 3d with these occulus rift videos.
19:47 john_minetest Add official oculus rift support to minetest so we can say "Minecraft copies us."
19:48 * ShadowBot wakes up
19:49 ShadowNinja sfan5: ^
19:50 john_minetest cross-eyed watching videos is exhausting...
19:50 Warr1024 is it safe?
19:51 sokomine never managed 3d view when those crazy images where around where you could presumably see 3d out of that chaos
19:52 john_minetest It is easy. Just don't give up :D
19:53 john_minetest But staring at stuff for hours IS exhausting. So I will better buy the oculus rift instead of playing with crossed eyeds ;)
19:55 jojoa1997 joined #minetest
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20:01 iqualfragile if you want 3d you can just use those red-cyan glasses
20:02 john_minetest oculus rift is much better. because it is all the field of view, not only a small screen
20:02 Calinou joined #minetest
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20:03 Calinou hi
20:03 ShadowNinja Any ops around?
20:05 Calinou ShadowNinja, why?
20:06 ShadowNinja I want to restart my bot, I thought they would want to re-op it.
20:06 iqualfragile1 joined #minetest
20:06 Calinou how do you restart it?
20:07 ShadowNinja I send it the quit command or Control-C it.
20:07 ShadowNinja Then re-run it.
20:07 ShadowNinja But I guess you will op it?
20:08 ShadowNinja Calinou: ^
20:08 Calinou yes?
20:08 Calinou do it :P
20:08 ShadowNinja Will you re-op it?
20:09 Calinou yes
20:09 ShadowNinja ShadowBot: quit
20:09 ShadowBot joined #minetest
20:16 * john_minetest always has got 2 hammes, one large screwdriver and a pair of tongs on his desk </random>
20:17 sfan5 ParseError: No opening tag found for "random"
20:17 * Calinou gives john_minetest an HR-02 Macho
20:18 Calinou now put it on your CPU, using your large screwdriver
20:18 Calinou :> <: :>
20:18 Calinou sfan5, you're slow to parse things
20:18 ShadowNinja Calinou: Still oped.
20:18 ttk2 joined #minetest
20:19 sfan5 Calinou: it uses brainfuck to parse XML, hence the slowness
20:19 john_minetest The screwdriver is about 25 centimeters long and it is one centimeter thick. A bit too thick to open a computer. But, wait... I have got a pocket knife on my desk :D
20:19 Calinou the HR-02 Macho is infamous for being very hard to install :P
20:19 Calinou you need a very long screwdriver or tiny fingers to fix it easily
20:20 * Calinou has a true spirit 140 anyway
20:20 ShadowNinja sfan5: ,,(bf "+++[<.]")
20:20 ShadowBot ShadowNinja: Error: Segmentation fault: Negative memory pointer.
20:20 Calinou same brand, but thinner heatsink, performance is slightly better at the cost of 17cm height and not 16cm
20:20 john_minetest I have got a laptop. This could make the installing even more difficult ;)
20:20 Calinou few cases can receive 17cm heatsink/fan
20:20 Calinou mine can
20:20 ShadowNinja :-(
20:20 ImQ009 joined #minetest
20:20 sfan5 ,,(bf "+[.+]")
20:21 Calinou ImQ009, "certianly", wasn't it "certainly" before? :P
20:21 ShadowBot sfan5: Error: Tried to output invalid character: 1114112
20:21 sfan5 test ,,(bf "+[.+]")
20:21 ShadowBot sfan5: Error: Tried to output invalid character: 1114112
20:21 ShadowNinja sfan5: It ignores everyone but me.
20:21 sfan5 ShadowNinja: you made a 32bit implementation? wat?
20:21 sfan5 +brainfuck
20:21 john_minetest What would one use such a heatsink for? For a CPU compiling minetest in 0.1 seconds? Hey, that would be cool...
20:21 ImQ009 Calinou is an op. Better run
20:21 ShadowNinja Maybe.
20:22 Calinou /kick ImQ009
20:22 MinetestBot joined #minetest
20:22 * ShadowBot sleeps
20:22 ShadowNinja sfan5: That is when MinetestBot isn't around
20:22 Calinou john_minetest, non-stock coolers are infinitely better than stock
20:22 Calinou mine is about 30°C better than stock while being twice as quiet, easily
20:23 Calinou also, no CPU can compile minetest in 0.1 seconds
20:23 Calinou even an octacore xeon would take 20 seconds or so when overclocked :P
20:23 Calinou and an octacore xeon costs €3500 :P
20:23 sfan5 ,,(bf "+[,.]")
20:23 john_minetest Why so long? For compiling?
20:23 john_minetest *Why so long for compiling?
20:23 ShadowNinja sfan5: MinetestBot is around, I could add you as a bot admin if you like.
20:24 sfan5 ShadowNinja: would be nice if you'd do that
20:24 * ImQ009 feels safe now
20:24 ShadowNinja Ok, you will need to register with it first.
20:25 thexyz Calinou: how about distcc?
20:25 shadowjay1 joined #minetest
20:25 Calinou not counting distributed stuff
20:25 sfan5 ShadowBot hate me: <ShadowBot> You've given me 5 commands within the last minute; I'm now ignoring you for 5 minutes.
20:26 Calinou http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=89018#p89018
20:26 Calinou nooo
20:26 Calinou I'm playing that game right now :<
20:26 thexyz Calinou: no fun
20:26 ShadowNinja Note that unless you give MinetestBot the specific addressal feature or use a PM things like op will happen twice(But not op specificaly, that is just an example)
20:26 Calinou thexyz, who said it was fun!
20:26 ShadowNinja ShadowBot: admin ignore remove sfan5
20:26 ShadowBot ShadowNinja: Error: sfan5!~sfan5@minetest.ru wasn't in the ignores database.
20:26 ShadowNinja ShadowBot: admin ignore list
20:26 ShadowBot ShadowNinja: 'Rollem!~cinch@c-71-197-240-152.hsd1.wa.comcast.net' and '*!*@minetest.ru'
20:27 ShadowNinja ShadowBot: admin ignore remove *!*@minetest.ru
20:27 ShadowBot ShadowNinja: The operation succeeded.
20:27 ShadowNinja sfan5: Try now.
20:27 sfan5 ,,(bf "+[,.]")
20:27 sfan5 ,,(bf "+++.")
20:27 sfan5 :/
20:27 ShadowNinja No, registering.
20:28 sfan5 how?
20:28 ShadowNinja /msg ShadowBot help register
20:28 sfan5 done
20:30 sapier joined #minetest
20:31 ShadowNinja sfan5: Now try running commands on it.
20:31 sfan5 ,,(bf "+++.")
20:31 sfan5 :/
20:31 ShadowNinja sfan5: How about now.
20:31 sfan5 ,,(bf "+++.")
20:32 ShadowNinja *sigh* It must require the owner capability, and I can't add that without shuting down the bot and setting it manualy.
20:33 ShadowNinja (security feature)
20:33 ShadowNinja Well I can ,,(channel capability add sfan5 op)
20:33 ShadowBot ShadowNinja: The operation succeeded.
20:34 ShadowNinja Now you can use ShadowBot's op command.
20:34 STHGOM bye
20:36 * ShadowBot wakes up
20:37 Calinou *kernel panic*
20:40 thexyz http://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=5906
20:41 Warr1024 ha, nice.
20:43 Calinou lol
20:44 Calinou PilzAdam, about bookshelves, try not to be another eihrul
20:46 Calinou (this is a game afterall)
20:53 MinetestBot joined #minetest
20:53 * ShadowBot sleeps
20:54 iqualfragile1 nice server
20:56 iqualfragile1 reminds me of facebook: it forced me to log in and change my password latlely, it told me that somebody would have accessed my account. it showed me the ip: 10.124.35.14 or something similar
20:57 sapier facebook lied to you  ... at least if not telling full truth is lieing :-) most likely they did know name of whom logged in
20:58 john_minetest "My server is the best. 127.0.0.1 port 30000 or somewhere i read 192.168.0.2 but I think the first one is the right because I can connect."
20:58 ShadowNinja sfan5: You should register MinetestBot with NickServ.
20:58 sapier lol
21:01 sfan5 MinetestBot: quit
21:01 * ShadowBot wakes up
21:01 MinetestBot joined #minetest
21:01 * ShadowBot sleeps
21:01 MinetestBot hi guys, i'm the new bot
21:03 * ShadowBot wakes up
21:03 ShadowNinja sfan5: Is it grouped?
21:04 sfan5 no
21:04 ShadowNinja OK, good.
21:05 sfan5 why are you asking?
21:05 ShadowNinja I was just wondering.
21:05 sfan5 did you group ShadowBot to ShadowNinja ?
21:06 MinetestBot joined #minetest
21:06 * ShadowBot sleeps
21:07 sfan5 * [MinetestBot] is logged in as MinetestBot
21:07 ShadowNinja No, if I had I would be auto-oped in half a dozed channels.
21:07 sfan5 ok, I also didn't like MinetestBot to use my personal password
21:07 sfan5 celeron55_: please auto-op MinetestBot
21:07 sfan5 (if you want to)
21:08 ShadowNinja And ShadowBot :-)
21:08 * sfan5 is now going to sleep
21:08 ShadowNinja Actually ShadowBot could replace MinetestBot and loggingbot_.
21:08 sfan5 "could"
21:09 ShadowNinja You would just have to get irc.minetest.ru to read it's log files.
21:09 ShadowNinja I don't know how loggingbot_ writes them so I don't know how hard that would be.
21:12 thexyz insanely
21:13 ShadowNinja thexyz: How does it write them?
21:13 PilzAdam ShadowNinja, http://irc.minetest.ru/text.pl?channel=minetest;date=2013-05-08
21:14 thexyz ShadowNinja: directly into MySQL database
21:15 kaeza joined #minetest
21:15 thexyz why do we need loggingbot_ replacement?
21:16 ShadowNinja Hmmm, ShadowBot has support for sqlite, and probably MySQL. I think it would be nice to have one bot instead of three.
21:16 PilzAdam I see no reason to replace it
21:16 ShadowNinja By default it writes to a text file.
21:20 sokomine as long as the bots do not start talking amongst themshelves...
21:22 kaeza ^ what would be fun actually
21:22 kaeza hi all
21:23 sokomine hi kaeza
21:23 khonkhortisan bot1: Tell everyone where the new server is. bot2: A new server showed up at...
21:24 sokomine it has to get recursive to get intresting :-)
21:25 Gambit joined #minetest
21:25 sokomine hi gambit
21:25 Gambit Hm?
21:25 Gambit Hi.
21:29 ShadowNinja sokomine: Imposible, at least with ShadowBot, it is smarter than that.
21:30 Gambit left #minetest
21:33 ShadowNinja Well switching to MySQL would be hard, harder that switching the website to files.
21:35 thexyz well, so what's the point?
21:37 john_minetest gtg, byer
21:37 john_minetest *bye
21:37 ShadowNinja Nothing, I won't write a front-end unless you want it, so loggingbot_ will remain, although MinetestBot could still be replaced.
21:41 leo_rockway joined #minetest
21:57 VanessaE hi
21:59 Menche joined #minetest
22:02 Menche joined #minetest
22:05 sokomine hi
22:11 Kacey joined #minetest
22:11 Kacey joined #minetest
22:17 EduardeCalibal Wow... My debug file have more tha 200MB.  :-o
22:18 EduardeCalibal How I disable this?
22:18 PilzAdam debug_log_level = 0
22:18 PilzAdam in minetest.conf
22:18 sapier 200mb? very small :-) mine ia >1gb most of time ;-)
22:18 EduardeCalibal Thanks.  :D
22:18 ShadowNinja EduardeCalibal: 1.1G before I cleared it.
22:18 EduardeCalibal :-o
22:18 EduardeCalibal AFK
22:30 VanessaE EduardeCalibal: you don't want to disable the debug log - just delete it when it gets too big.
22:32 EduardeCalibal I only see it now...  I will enable when have trouble and disable after solve my problems...  New police.  :D
22:32 EduardeCalibal AFK
22:39 khonkhortisan Deleting only says you can put other stuff over it, such as a new debug.txt
22:40 Menche lol, specialties mod put 1410 small files in my map dir
22:40 Menche there has got to be a better way to do that
22:41 VanessaE small files consisting of what?
22:41 iqualfragile1 mine is at 514mb right now
22:41 Menche information about specialties
22:41 sokomine for how many players?
22:42 Menche each player has a file for each of the 5 specialtis
22:42 VanessaE for 1410 of them I guess :)
22:42 Menche *specialties
22:42 VanessaE oh heh
22:42 NekoGloop joined #minetest
22:42 sokomine no, that would be too few :-) 5 files per user sounds worse :-)
22:42 NekoGloop Hi fools.
22:42 sokomine hi nekogloop
22:43 VanessaE eek, my debug logs are 1.2GB for my client and 3.1GB for the server.  Time to zero those out :)
22:43 sokomine still a lot of players
22:43 NekoGloop And I'm out.
22:43 NekoGloop left #minetest
22:43 Menche specialties files seems to be 4.0K each
22:44 sokomine sure? guessing from your complaint, i guess they might contain only one number each.....or do they just add to a file? 4 k might be minimal filesystem size
22:45 Menche lol, each file only contains 1 number
22:45 sokomine so i guessed right :-)
22:45 VanessaE seems like a better idea would be five files - each containing a list of players that have that particular specialty
22:45 sokomine the repair-picks-function is quite nice
22:45 ShadowNinja Menche: I can't get Minetest to compile on Arch linux, do you still use it?
22:45 Menche or a file that contains lua tables
22:46 Menche about minetest on arch, i have to delete minetest.conf frequently
22:46 Menche or it segfaults
22:46 sapier maybe we should add world specific settings
22:46 sokomine afaik everyone has every speciality he/she has ever done anything in, that is: mined once? got points there. cut down trees? points for tree-cutting. and so on
22:47 ShadowNinja Well my build fails, the AUR install seems to work, the error is No rule to make target `/usr/lib/x86_64-linux-gnu/libz.so', needed by `bin/minetestserver'.  Stop.
22:47 sokomine or a general way to save mod data in some form of database or whatever. no point in having a mod author to wonder how and where to store the data
22:47 Menche i use the AUR build
22:48 Menche it segfaults frequently
22:52 ShadowNinja Well AUR build is better than no build I guess.
22:52 thexyz Kray: update pkgbuild, please
22:53 thexyz it should download common, survival and build now
22:53 thexyz no need for minetest_game anymore
22:53 PilzAdam thexyz, we probably drop survial and build
22:53 PilzAdam and common
22:53 thexyz um
22:53 sokomine hm. why?
22:53 PilzAdam and move back to minetest_game only
22:53 sokomine the idea wasn't bad. it just needs to be extended
22:54 PilzAdam c55 called it a "failed experiemnt"
22:54 * Menche is for going to back just 1 game
22:54 thexyz Kray: okay, forget it
22:54 sokomine and the existance of other "games" needs to be made more clear
22:54 PilzAdam and thats basically what it is
22:54 VanessaE ditto
22:55 VanessaE one official game is enough imho.
22:55 sokomine will the game.conf where you can easily enable/disable mods from common remain?
22:55 ShadowNinja common was a great idea IMO, maybe not survival and build
22:55 Menche i say just remove common
22:55 sapier imho common is a very bad idea as most "normal" users don't have any idea how to get it
22:56 ShadowNinja Common allows for removing a lot of redundant folders and having everything update at once.
22:56 Menche and if you want a different "default" mod than provided by common...? you have to make your own, so it doesn't really make anything easier
22:56 sapier in theory ... in praxis users don't have any idea where to put what
22:57 sokomine maybe moving common into the main minetest folder so that it gets downloaded alongside?
22:57 VanessaE praxis?  practice*
22:57 ShadowNinja Menche: Most won't, those that do will make a copy and remove it from the list.
22:57 Menche there's a lot of stuff in common
22:57 ShadowNinja Although I can't think of a good reason to do that.
22:57 theTroy joined #minetest
22:57 Menche a lot of people will want a different default mod
22:58 sapier we need a simple way to add mods ... imho core should handle this
22:58 ShadowNinja Menche: Then write a mydefault mod that changes the nodes or whatever.
22:58 Menche common has a lot of stuff that isn't necessarily "common"
22:58 sapier maybe add a "add mod" menu which supports some common formats e.g zip/tar.gz containing a single mod / modpack / game folder
22:58 Menche ShadowNinja: which removes the purpose for common, if you write your own
22:58 iqualfragile1 when an database containing the mods is used that would be simplified as the user would not need to care about the exact folders anymore
22:59 sokomine menche: what do you mean specificly?
22:59 sapier yes but creating a database is an idea floating around for more than a year now not getting any closer to realization
22:59 ShadowNinja Menche: No, you can still include a lot of other mods, and I was saying that you should write a new mod, not modify the original.
23:00 Menche if you don't like [insert controversial change], you have to use your own default mod
23:00 Menche ShadowNinja: there's no way to modify the original common mods :P
23:00 Menche besides making your own copy, which misses the point of common
23:01 ShadowNinja Menche: I mean re-register the node for example.
23:01 Menche re-defining tons of nodes would get pretty messy, IMO
23:01 sokomine hmm. but that's only relevant for people who already know what they do. new users or those who just want to play most likely won't know how to (or have reason to) change their common mods
23:01 sapier what about a mintest core administrated mod storage storing mods added through gui?
23:02 Menche any gui stuff should also have a non-gui version
23:02 ShadowNinja Menche: If you are changing a lot just don't include default, but most games will leave default alone.
23:02 Menche ShadowNinja: cue tons of mods with next to no differences
23:02 Menche s/mods/games/
23:03 sapier true but non gui stuff is useless for the well known normal user
23:03 Menche and gui stuff is useless for server owners without guis :P
23:03 ShadowNinja Menche: Perhaps, but removing common won't stop that.
23:03 sapier now lets compare server owner numbers to normal player numbers
23:04 sapier and btw server owners don't have any problem with current way of doing it so they're not main target for a change like that
23:04 Menche not against gui options, i'm against gui options that don't have non-gui alternatives
23:05 sapier won't be  a problem to add .. just not something that is of any interest when trying to add a user friendly way of adding mods
23:06 * Menche doesn't think there's a reason for the minetest_game, build, and survival games to be separate
23:06 Menche there's not that much difference between them
23:07 Menche build and survival each have one mod of their own and survival has fewer mods included
23:07 Exio there was a pull request for making common mods "general", - that would be useful for "external moding"
23:08 sapier make games managed by core itself if there are mods added with colliding folder names make core compute md5 sum to store both
23:08 VanessaE I say just dump it all back into minetest_game.  Let the user decide if it's survival or creative or whatever by way of the extra mods they install
23:08 * Menche agrees with VanessaE
23:09 kaeza joined #minetest
23:09 Menche is there a way to install a mod for all games?
23:09 sapier what about changing "game" from separate folder to configuration file which mods should be loaded?
23:10 PilzAdam VanessaE, thats the plan
23:12 NekoGloop joined #minetest
23:13 NekoGloop Woah. Woah. Adam is admitting he did something wrong.
23:13 kaeza wb NekoGloop
23:13 NekoGloop I never left.
23:14 PilzAdam NekoGloop, I still want to see your list of suggestions
23:14 NekoGloop I still want you to come up with your own ideas.
23:15 Menche so when you download minetest and start the only available game, you're greeted with a message that basically says "this isn't the real thing. use [minetest_game]."
23:16 Menche that doesn't seem right.
23:16 Menche *especially* because minetest_game isn't included.
23:16 PilzAdam *if you downloda the minetest engine
23:16 NekoGloop Seems legit.
23:16 PilzAdam *download
23:16 NekoGloop After all, they aren't making a game, they're making an engine.
23:16 PilzAdam if you download the Linux kernel you dont have a complete OS
23:16 VanessaE Menche: well you mean the "minimal" game.  I'd actually agree with that
23:17 PilzAdam NekoGloop, actually we are doing both
23:17 VanessaE is there any *real* reason that we don't ship minetest_game with the engine?  I mean, seriously?
23:17 thexyz Menche: seriously?
23:17 PilzAdam seriously?
23:17 thexyz you learned to download things from github and compile them
23:17 PilzAdam (had to say this)
23:17 khonkhortisan seriously.
23:18 thexyz but still cannot manage to get minetest_game
23:18 Menche lol, i know how to get minetest game, i'm just saying it looks tacky
23:18 PilzAdam if you read the README to learn how to compile, the first thing you read is "get minetest_game and place it in games/"
23:18 iqualfragile1 ok, that are two different usecases
23:18 thexyz i agree, reading is a hard task
23:19 iqualfragile1 if someone has enought brain to compile minetest he is very likely to have enought to rtfm
23:19 NekoGloop (the real reason that they're seperate is so that they can put them under seperate adf.ly or similar links to get more money)
23:19 Menche "step 1: download another folder from over there"
23:19 iqualfragile1 NekoGloop: more money? they dont get any money at all
23:19 Menche "cuz we're too lazy to ship it"
23:19 iqualfragile1 in fact they are putting a shitload of work and evenen some bits of money (celeron55 and thexyz have rent servers) in it
23:20 NekoGloop precisely.
23:20 PilzAdam Menche, you might have noticed that we do distribute Minetest with minetest_game included?
23:20 thexyz typically you don't need to download anything but officialâ„¢ package
23:20 thexyz which already includes all stuff you need
23:20 PilzAdam Menche, the only way to get Minetest without minetest_game is, if you download the engine source code
23:21 iqualfragile1 yeah, thats the other usecase: players who just download the game and there its included, so i dont get whats the problem
23:21 PilzAdam and people who want to do that, can read the README
23:21 NekoGloop "And I'll be a prissy little bitch about it hehehehehe" <-- my impression of PilzAdam
23:22 PilzAdam there are also people that want only the engine, not the default game for it
23:22 PilzAdam you can save some bandwith when seperating it
23:22 VanessaE meh
23:22 VanessaE bandwidth and storage are cheap
23:22 * Menche splits his mod into 30 different files
23:22 thexyz NekoGloop: plz stop your stupid trolling, thx
23:22 PilzAdam VanessaE, actually no
23:23 sapier ppl don't read the README unless it's callt DO_NOT_README
23:23 sapier called
23:23 Menche when someone complains, I'll say "well the README told you where to download all 30 files, rtfm"
23:23 VanessaE PilzAdam: maybe where you are I guess, but for most people, it's true.
23:23 sapier and the one will answer "are you crazy?"
23:23 VanessaE besides, minetest_game is only 1.6MB
23:24 PilzAdam Menche, your example is bad; a proper one would splitting Simple Mobs into several mods like: coreAPI, animals, monsters, other_stuff
23:24 VanessaE the engine is 90! MB.
23:24 VanessaE does that extra 1.6MB really matter?
23:24 VanessaE (I realize a lot of that is git history, but the ratios should be similar for the current commits alone)
23:24 sapier btw mobf is already split up this way ;-)
23:24 iqualfragile1 hey, guys great idea: why dont we put all the mods existing into the minetest github repository
23:24 thexyz i lost it, what are you guys arguing about?
23:24 kaeza most linux games offer a separate -data package
23:24 PilzAdam VanessaE, with git history minetest_game is 23 MiB
23:25 iqualfragile1 no need to split different things into different repositories
23:25 VanessaE PilzAdam: my copy of minetest_game is a git clone, and is 1.6MB.
23:25 Menche "this mod now provides an api. therefore the actual content is available as 5 very similar, separate downloads"
23:25 thexyz including minetest_game into minetest? won't happen
23:25 PilzAdam VanessaE, how many remotes have you set up?
23:25 iqualfragile1 lets just put them all together and dont forget to add the code for the minetest website!
23:25 VanessaE PilzAdam: afaik it's just straight, or maybe with one extra remote in it
23:25 VanessaE which is how most people would receive it
23:25 sapier maybe we should first define what we want to have? an experimental game engine just usable for a few ppl or a working game to be played by unskilled ppl
23:25 PilzAdam ok, I have 16 remotes set up and fetched (due to merging)
23:26 VanessaE that would be why yours is 23MB :)
23:26 VanessaE thexyz: why not?  what stops that from happening?
23:26 PilzAdam first you want to make clear that engine and games are seperated, now you want to merge them all together
23:26 kaeza it makes it easier to work on the game "data" files
23:27 thexyz devs will
23:27 thexyz (i.e. me)
23:27 VanessaE *facepalm*
23:27 VanessaE I said "what", not "who".
23:27 sapier no things should not be merged but there should be a release version containing both
23:27 thexyz oh, sorry
23:27 kaeza no need to download the engine source/binaries if the data is updated
23:27 PilzAdam VanessaE, the git history will be completly messed up
23:28 PilzAdam if you keep track of your issue tracker, sure, go ahead
23:28 kaeza and viceversa
23:28 VanessaE PilzAdam: that's what I'd have preferred, but it's clearly impossible to separate them in the minds of the userbase.
23:28 thexyz treat me like "it" for a moment then
23:28 PilzAdam thexyz, I always do
23:28 VanessaE hah!
23:28 NekoGloop I am "cat"
23:29 PilzAdam NekoGloop, you are a programm to print files to the terminal?
23:29 VanessaE well whatever, it's no big deal for me to pull (or re-clone) when something is updated.  I'm just thinking of your average user who barely knows how to download to begin with.
23:29 Menche ShadowNinja: back to archlinux, i just built minetest manually without any problems
23:29 NekoGloop shits_to_give.txt : nothing to print
23:29 PilzAdam VanessaE, they most likely download the win build
23:29 thexyz VanessaE: average user will download http://minetest.ru/builds/minetest-0.4.6.zip
23:29 PilzAdam and that has minetest_game packaged
23:30 VanessaE well, probably.
23:30 VanessaE though I'd hope they'll at least download the latest builds, not some rusted-out "stable" release :)
23:30 PilzAdam if they are more advanced they will download my win build :-)
23:30 thexyz definitely, not probably
23:30 thexyz PilzAdam: do you have any download stats?
23:30 sapier VanessaE why release "stable" versions if they should download latest?
23:31 NekoGloop because stable is 400+ commits ago
23:31 VanessaE sapier: because with this project, "stable" equates to "old and outdated" in about a week's time :)
23:31 PilzAdam thexyz, http://ompldr.org/iaWEzag
23:31 sapier and where is the real argument?
23:31 thexyz sapier: they only will in VanessaE's mind
23:31 PilzAdam thats the last one that I uploaded to omploader
23:31 PilzAdam does dropbox has stats?
23:31 thexyz PilzAdam: how about dropbox one?
23:31 Warr10241 joined #minetest
23:31 sapier development will always be ahead of stable ... in features as well as in bugs
23:32 VanessaE thexyz: spoken like someone who has forgotten what it's like to be an average user.
23:32 sapier currently no one maintains stable to fix critical bugs ... imho this is main problem with currents minetest releas scheme
23:32 NekoGloop those aren't bugs, they're features.
23:32 VanessaE should they download the engine sources?  maybe not.  Should they get the latest *build*?  fuck yeah.
23:33 thexyz okay, let's see
23:33 sapier why don't you download latest git tree of linux vanessae?
23:33 PilzAdam thexyz, seems like dropbox doesnt have download stats :-/
23:33 VanessaE sapier: because I gave up on gentoo years ago? ;)
23:33 sapier so why do you expect ppl to do this for something that superfluss as minetest?
23:33 VanessaE eh?
23:34 thexyz the official©™ minetest 0.4.6 was downloaded 28699 times
23:34 sapier sorry but your "always" latest is silly for players as well as for modders
23:34 thexyz the PilzAdam's cutting edge one was downloaded 53 times
23:34 VanessaE I said twice, and I quote, "the latest build".
23:34 sapier how should someone ever release a stable mod if testing against a moving target? this will work for some mods replacing different nodes but won't work for any complex mod
23:35 sapier latest build should always be latest stable
23:35 PilzAdam sapier, well, there are two "complex mods": mobf and mesecons
23:35 PilzAdam (maybe technic too)
23:35 VanessaE a moving target?  um, if you've got issues with shit disappearing from one release to another, you've got a bigger problem on you hands.
23:35 sapier and?
23:35 VanessaE your*
23:35 kaeza sapier, have two downloads for mods: one "stable" that works in MT stable, and one for dev. end of story
23:35 PilzAdam all the others can keep easily track what new dev features they add
23:36 sapier It took about two weeks to test mobf against 0.4.6 and still some bugs are left
23:36 PilzAdam kaeza, tags or branches in the git repo for example
23:36 kaeza PilzAdam, exactly
23:36 thexyz so, in the end, it's safe to assume most users use stable builds
23:36 sapier it's just imposible to recheck every 2 weeks for compatibility
23:37 thexyz and those who don't are experienced enough to switch to stable one when needed
23:37 PilzAdam people are just too lazy to care about compatibility while coding a mod
23:37 kaeza sapier, read what I said
23:37 * VanessaE shrugs
23:37 thexyz yes, sure
23:37 Warr10241 it's not like you have to wait for any version to be "released" before you can start coding and testing a mod against it...
23:37 kaeza I plan to start doing thins once 0.4.7 (0.5.0 [1.0.0]???) is released
23:37 thexyz just maintain 2 versions
23:37 * iqualfragile1 compiles the latest git of linux
23:37 thexyz then 3
23:38 thexyz then 4 and so on
23:38 NekoGloop I'm playing minetest 4.6
23:38 NekoGloop fuck all y'all I'm a time traveller
23:38 thexyz it's not like you don't have enough free time to maintain all those versions
23:38 iqualfragile1 wasnt minetest 4.6 released some weeks ago?
23:38 PilzAdam iqualfragile1, no
23:38 Warr10241 thexyz: that's what "end of life" is for.
23:39 iqualfragile1 oh, ok
23:39 PilzAdam it will be released in some years
23:39 sapier currently stable is eol once next commit is added
23:39 kaeza sapier, "stable" is "stable"
23:39 VanessaE sapier: more like about 2-3 weeks after stable is out, on average I'd say
23:39 kaeza once a commit is made, "stable" keeps being "stable"
23:39 VanessaE stable is "rusted-out", git is "new hotness" :-)
23:40 PilzAdam kaeza, 0.4.6 "stable" is the most unstable thing I have ever seen
23:40 NekoGloop MiB ftw
23:40 sapier i believe critical bugs should be fixed in stable until next stable is released
23:40 iqualfragile1 oh, it occurs to me that i have forgotten a zero
23:40 thexyz woo! https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-devel/2013-May/037074.html
23:40 thexyz rip
23:40 PilzAdam iqualfragile1, and a dot :-p
23:40 sapier where no new festures should be added to stable
23:40 NekoGloop VanessaE, MiB ftw
23:40 VanessaE NekoGloop: of course :)
23:40 Warr10241 true in principle, but who shall be responsible for backporting fixes against stable?
23:41 kaeza PilzAdam, I'm not actually talking about stability, but about versions
23:41 NekoGloop Can I deneuralize Adam so he shuts the fuck up?
23:41 sapier have a look at current mod releases next to no one really tells you what version the mod is working for ... and finding a mod compatible to 0.4.6 is already complicated yet ...
23:41 * Menche is liking the new media progress bar
23:41 PilzAdam NekoGloop, yes, but its a bit more complicated
23:41 iqualfragile1 NekoGloop: what about you shutting the fuck up
23:41 VanessaE the problem with "stable" is that too many users are having problems running it because of shiny new mods that depend on some new feature that's almost never in a stable build.
23:41 PilzAdam NekoGloop, first step, install Linux
23:41 NekoGloop Hey I'm the quiet one here.
23:42 Warr10241 if minetest has a stable and a dev branch, then it only makes sense to me that each mod built against it should have a stable and a dev branch...?
23:42 iqualfragile1 VanessaE: that could be solved if minetest would care about installing mods
23:42 kaeza sapier, then make a rule that mods in mod releases must provide separate links
23:42 kaeza or some shit like that
23:42 PilzAdam VanessaE, the problem is that mod devs always almost immediatly throw the new features from the dev version in
23:42 VanessaE PilzAdam: and this is a problem.....why?
23:43 sapier vanessae so you prefere shiny new mobs that noone ever will get a working set without trying for hours to having at least a stable set
23:43 NekoGloop read: the mod developers expect people to actually know how to minetest
23:43 sapier -mobs +mods
23:43 PilzAdam VanessaE, so everyone is forced to use the dev version of the engine too, to run the mods
23:43 iqualfragile1 as long as there is an old version for the stable versions its no problem
23:43 Menche am I the only one who uses the latest git exclusively?
23:43 kaeza Menche, nope
23:43 iqualfragile1 no, we all do
23:43 VanessaE sapier: strange, I seem to have a pretty stable set of mods on my server - all 53 of them seem to behave together
23:43 sapier kaeza that would be an option yes but I don't have authority to demand
23:43 Menche making it sound like everyone uses only stable
23:43 iqualfragile1 but we are thinking aboutthe 20000 others who dont
23:43 VanessaE PilzAdam: and getting the latest dev build is trivial, is it not?
23:43 PilzAdam <iqualfragile1> as long as there is an old version for the stable versions its no problem <- there isnt, in most cases
23:44 VanessaE how many unofficial buidls are there now?  Four or five?
23:44 sapier vanessae you should think about how much time you spend in chat and forum
23:44 iqualfragile1 PilzAdam: that will be solved soon
23:44 sapier next to none of those "normal" users are willing to spend even thenth of that time
23:44 thexyz VanessaE: read my message regarding the number of downloads once again
23:44 VanessaE thexyz: number of downloads means exactly dick, and you know it.
23:44 thexyz how come
23:44 kaeza sapier, so if you are ok, we can request this from forum moderators/admins, to be implemented in the near future
23:44 PilzAdam VanessaE, the problem is that we ruin our own stable releases with this; and we have many people running with incompatible versions arround
23:44 VanessaE how do you expect people to *find* those unofficial builds if they arne't linked from the main website?
23:45 thexyz that!
23:45 thexyz i don't
23:45 sapier that would be at least an improovement kaeza
23:45 Menche so, 2 official builds, 3 unofficial builds, 2 unofficial build instructions
23:45 VanessaE then why do you expect your download stats to be even close to accurate if you're trying to compare a main-site-linked build against the unofficial ones?
23:45 iqualfragile1 well, there is a big asymetry between  28699 downloads on the one hand and 100 peple in irc and 1000 in the forums on the other side
23:45 Menche (that's just counting the stickied unofficial builds)
23:46 PilzAdam VanessaE, my builds are linked from the main page
23:46 sapier still moders would have to change behaviour from moving fast forward forgetting about stable version once a new feature is added telling users only "oh that bug take latest version its fixed there" to a little bit more maintenance
23:46 thexyz VanessaE: wait, wait
23:47 thexyz do you mean more people actually use unofficial builds?
23:47 PilzAdam I cant even remember where this discussion started
23:47 PilzAdam thus, it is useless
23:47 thexyz they actually are linked from the main website
23:47 thexyz http://minetest.net/download
23:47 sapier no it's not it's about aim of minetest
23:48 PilzAdam sapier, well, it gives a nice impression about what the irc part of the community thinks
23:48 PilzAdam but its useless if you expect real results from it
23:49 thexyz iqualfragile1: hmmm?
23:49 Menche so, you say discussion on irc is useless, discussion on the forums is useless, where is discussion useful?
23:49 VanessaE oh I give up already
23:49 sapier of course ;-) but some of latest development decistions have been at least not best ... and seam to be already on it's way to be corrected
23:49 PilzAdam Menche, no, this particular discussion is useless
23:49 sapier decisions
23:49 PilzAdam because we moved offtopic
23:49 iqualfragile1 thexyz: "hmmm?"?
23:49 PilzAdam IIRC we were talking about minetest_game being merged into the engine
23:50 kaeza oh hell, let's not start this crap again
23:50 thexyz iqualfragile1: > well, there is a big asymetry between  28699 downloads on the one hand and 100 peple in irc and 1000 in the forums on the other side
23:50 Menche now the discussion seems to be about the confusing number of different builds and versions
23:50 iqualfragile1 if it was about my latest statement: the big number are the players, the small numbers are the people who would put some work into getting everything to run
23:50 iqualfragile1 feedback?: http://imgur.com/n9Skr5G
23:51 * Menche was going to suggest something about mods, but would probably be eaten alive for going offtopic
23:51 sapier I try to get my brother to play minetest for some time his only answer is "its to complicated to set it up"
23:51 sapier and he is right
23:51 Warr10241 it is?
23:51 sapier if you're a normal user only capable of using a appstore (which most users are) you'll never succeed in setting up minetest
23:52 thexyz sapier: really?
23:52 sapier not even a documentation will change that
23:52 sapier yes
23:52 thexyz well
23:52 Menche why not have an official full game download for each of windoze, mac, and linux, i686 and x86_64
23:52 Warr10241 I didn't have much trouble setting it up myself, and I had to port it to my OS first...
23:52 PilzAdam sapier, well, my brother says: "Das ist doch wieder so ne Linux sch****"
23:52 thexyz i'm disappointed
23:52 kaeza sapier, agreed
23:52 sapier i don't suggest an appstore
23:52 VanessaE and I stand corrected, didn't realize sfan, PA, and xyz's builds were linked from the main page.
23:52 Warr10241 :-)
23:52 sapier no my brother uses linux
23:52 thexyz clicking a link and downloading a .zip archive
23:52 thexyz then unzipping it
23:52 sapier just he's not a hacker like us but a user only
23:52 thexyz must be really hard
23:53 Menche before you troll about having 100s of distros, it *is* possible to make a binary that runs on most if not all
23:53 kaeza my nephew started using minetest, and it was also his response
23:53 PilzAdam sapier, cant be, "users" dont use Linux .-)
23:53 PilzAdam *:-)
23:53 sapier unzipping minetest starting and running is quite dissapointing once you've seen al those screenshots in forum
23:53 Warr10241 Just make a bootable ISO download with a tested, pre-approved linux distro built in that launches directly into minetest.
23:53 thexyz won't work
23:53 sapier pilzadam just get into present time linux is most common used os for about 5 years now
23:54 kaeza Warr1024, that's a bit extreme
23:54 thexyz better sell usb drives
23:54 Warr10241 I'm running it on OpenBSD myself.
23:54 ShadowNinja Warr10241: Already done.
23:54 Warr10241 yeah, it's a pretty easy port.
23:54 Warr10241 someone needs to make it official :-)
23:55 iqualfragile1 Warr10241 you woulnd be able to port it to darwin, would you?
23:55 thexyz the very same users will complain about unobviousness of where to put in those usb drives and how to boot them up
23:55 sapier and most important problem is how to explain ppl not having any idea what a folder is how to install a mod to a specific folder (more complicated there are different possibilitys where to install)
23:55 iqualfragile1 then lets just add an appstore to minetest
23:55 Warr1024 iqualfragile1: I wouldn't know, don't have a Darwin machine handy...
23:56 ShadowNinja We should add a mod/game manager.
23:56 VanessaE when I was growing up, you were expected to understand computers in *detail*...wtf happened?
23:56 sapier and don't tell me "if they don't understand what a folder is..." this is a useless discussion folder concept is not obvious for current users
23:56 iqualfragile1 VanessaE: america!
23:57 Warr1024 A mod install tool might be nice
23:57 thexyz folder concept isn't obvious for me either
23:57 sapier vanessae knowledge about computers is not required anymore you just need to know how to use them
23:57 VanessaE sapier: if they don't understand what a folder is, they need to get the fuck off the computer and go learn.
23:57 thexyz directories are much easier to understand
23:57 iqualfragile1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxroiTRg7Tg
23:57 Menche VanessaE: YES.
23:57 sapier have you ever seen a directory on your android phone? ... not even windows has real directorys anymore
23:58 Warr1024 lol @ "not even windows" :-)
23:58 kaeza related: making the engine ignore the folder/directory name would help a lot with newbies
23:58 VanessaE kaeza: +100000
23:58 Warr1024 sapier: you might be right about the android phone issue, but I'm still waiting for that port to come out :-)
23:58 iqualfragile1 im sorry but what is the difference between folders and directories?
23:58 thexyz http://c2.com/cgi/wiki?IdiotProofProcess
23:58 thexyz sorry
23:59 kaeza too many complaints because the mod doesn't work because the directory is named "foouser-foomod-master"
23:59 Menche why does minetest not allow dashes in modnames?
23:59 thexyz iqualfragile1: forget it, only inodes are real
23:59 sapier there's no real difference iqualfragile

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