IRC log for #minetest, 2012-07-25

Time	Nick	Message
00:27	khonkhortisan	the gameboom one should be up
00:27	MiJyn	is gameboom update?
01:13	MiJyn	I feel good!
01:13	MiJyn	I've got much work on code
01:13	VanessaE	I need help//
01:13	MiJyn	*a lot of codework done
01:13	VanessaE	..
01:14	MiJyn	c55 would be happy!
01:14	VanessaE	I need to come up with a unique way to make a glass bottle, preferably in one step.
01:14	MiJyn	*should be rather happy, but will be annoyed that someone is contributing
01:14	MiJyn	VanessaE, like the potions mod?
01:14	VanessaE	crafting glass blocks either has to generate dozens of units, or it's wastetul
01:14	VanessaE	wasteful*
01:15	VanessaE	smelting glass is already done by one of sdzen's mods
01:15	VanessaE	so what do I do here?
01:15	MiJyn	you want to integrate his mod?
01:15	VanessaE	no
01:15	VanessaE	I just don't know what's left
01:16	VanessaE	we're running out of sensible crafts
01:16	VanessaE	and there's no multiple-input oven/furnace
01:16	MiJyn	you could make one
01:17	VanessaE	I suppose, but that feels wrong too - this is for Unified Dyes
01:17	MiJyn	oh
01:17	MiJyn	you can't use X - X \| X - X \| - X -
01:17	MiJyn	can you?
01:17	MiJyn	X being glass
01:17	MiJyn	- being nothing
01:17	MiJyn	\| being a newline :P
01:17	VanessaE	--> crafting glass blocks either has to generate dozens of units, or it's wasteful
01:18	VanessaE	I mean, do I just settle for "generates dozens of units"?
01:18	VanessaE	(at present, I've programmed it to give 9 pieces from one glass block via the furnace)
01:19	MiJyn	I know!
01:19	MiJyn	make a craft so that you can split the glass
01:19	MiJyn	and then use the splitted glass :P
01:20	VanessaE	hm..
01:20	MiJyn	so you can use 3 glass blocks instead of 5
01:20	MiJyn	or whatever
01:27	VanessaE	I think I'll go with your first idea, craft a U-shape -> a bunch of bottles and just make it waste some glass (or it'll be too easy)
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01:39	NakedFury	what you need: http://or.ucsf.edu/ehs/11567-DSY/version/default/part/ImageData/data/Lab%20Glassware.jpg
01:40	NakedFury	some table or thingy that would hold the vials
01:41	NakedFury	like the bookcase idea but for vials
01:41	VanessaE	I'll consider that
01:41	VanessaE	that's a good idea
01:41	VanessaE	though I think I'd make it look more like the spice rack in my kitchen
01:41	VanessaE	(holds 16, in four columns on a lazy susan)
01:42	VanessaE	(or was it 20?)
01:42	VanessaE	such a rack/holder would have to basically be a stripped-down locked chest I think
01:43	NakedFury	yeah until its easier to make it better and able to change depending on content
01:51	NakedFury	a small chest type that holds 20, when its empty it looks empty, when it has 1 item of the only type it can hold the model changes
02:00	VanessaE	there, how's this look?
02:00	VanessaE	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=28399
02:05	* VanessaE	pokes at NakedFury for signs of life
02:05	* VanessaE	pokes at MiJyn for signs of life
02:18	* VanessaE	pokes other random people, just because.
02:19	cornernote	whos that poking everyone ?
02:19	cornernote	i was just reading the new crafts
02:19	cornernote	nice work!
02:19	VanessaE	cool, let's see c55 complain about THAT ;-)
02:20	cornernote	many mod developers dont put enough thought into the crafts
02:20	VanessaE	which is a huge problem :-/
02:20	cornernote	and thoughtful crafts are really a lot more fun than /giveme
02:20	VanessaE	yes, exactly
02:21	VanessaE	so this doesn't require too much work out of the player to get from flowers -> some kind of colored block?
02:22	cornernote	its a little, but i prefer this way
02:22	VanessaE	hrm
02:22	cornernote	personally, i dont like how you can break trees with your hand
02:22	VanessaE	heh
02:22	VanessaE	well c55 and I talked about that
02:22	cornernote	i think you should need a tool to chop them
02:23	VanessaE	he settled on the idea of finding loose stones around, combining them with branches gained from tearing down leaves (which you can do by hand)
02:23	VanessaE	and using that to chop down the rest of the tree
02:23	VanessaE	but I guess he decided not to implement it
02:23	cornernote	wow, i was thinking loose stones too
02:25	NakedFury	loose stones, thats nice
02:25	NakedFury	create a small pick or smaller fragile version of normal tools
02:29	NakedFury	you would need to generate the stones all over the world or add them to rivers
02:30	VanessaE	"primitive axe" I think he was going to call it
02:30	VanessaE	(or at least, that's what I would)
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02:33	cornernote	there is a droprate setting too
02:33	cornernote	so you can allow dig leaves/dirt by hand
02:33	cornernote	and give a chance at finding stick/rock
02:34	NakedFury	have a chance when dropping dirt and leaves?
02:35	cornernote	when you smash a leaves, usually leaves goes into your inventory
02:35	cornernote	but have a 1/10 or 1/20 that you get a stick
02:37	NakedFury	there is a droprate setting?
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02:40	cornernote	yeah, i saw in the forums.. sec
02:41	NakedFury	having dirt drop loose stone as a chance is a great idea
02:41	NakedFury	same with leaves
02:41	NakedFury	can be added to other blocks too
02:43	cornernote	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=838
02:43	cornernote	node.drop = {}
02:45	cornernote	if default:leaves is already defined, and i define it again... which one does it use ?
02:45	cornernote	i assume the later one
02:46	NakedFury	rarity=20
02:47	cornernote	yeah, looks simple enough
02:48	NakedFury	thats great
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02:49	NakedFury	the api doc needs a serious update man
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02:49	NakedFury	this has been in since january and now I find about it?
02:49	NakedFury	and the pick stuff! tools= pick
02:49	cornernote	i know, funny how you learn from forums/chat what should be in docs
02:49	NakedFury	yeah
02:50	NakedFury	you need to add the tools line to every block so you cant break with hands
02:50	cornernote	but get no drop
02:50	cornernote	hrmmm
02:50	cornernote	i wouldnt like that
02:51	cornernote	dirt and leaves and flowers/plants etc... things you expect hands can do
02:51	cornernote	trees should need sticks
02:51	cornernote	then its a little challenge when someone first plays
02:51	cornernote	they have to dig dirt and trees to get tools
02:51	cornernote	right now tools are too easy to get, i can have mese axe in 5 mins
02:54	NakedFury	and for the love of good a pick cant be used as a shovel or axe
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03:05	cornernote	lol, yes!
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03:07	NakedFury	if I used a pick on a tree I would get smashed and damaged pieces of food. splinters
03:10	mauvebic	you know youve been playing too long when you go to open the file manager by typing /giveme thunar in your run dialog lol
03:11	NakedFury	first time I see you online
03:12	mauvebic	yeah its break time after making enough nodes lol
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03:18	cornernote	i think im going to use available mods to make a cornernote_game
03:19	mauvebic	you gonna edit the default mods?
03:19	cornernote	depends if i can overwrite definitions without altering default
03:20	cornernote	prefer not to change the defaults
03:20	NakedFury	you can
03:20	cornernote	ok, cool
03:20	cornernote	so no default mod changes
03:20	mauvebic	well then youre talking about a modpack :p
03:21	NakedFury	Enforcement can be overridden by prefixing the name with ":". This can
03:21	NakedFury	be used for overriding the registrations of some other mod.
03:21	mauvebic	if your defaults and the games defaults are the same, you dont need 2 game folders
03:21	cornernote	i guess, but a modpack that is intended to be used as a complete game
03:22	mauvebic	from experience, people will pick and chose the mods anyhoo lol
03:22	cornernote	and the mods wont be what i download.. i will tweak them to work better with each other
03:22	mauvebic	are you madchicken?
03:22	cornernote	no, i am cornernote
03:22	cornernote	mauvebic, i see that as a problem
03:23	mauvebic	a problem?
03:23	cornernote	eg, people needing to install mods to make a complete game
03:23	cornernote	i would like to see more game variations, with their own modpacks
03:23	mauvebic	i dunno, i see alot of people making modpacks with other people's mods, i dont really see the point, making new mods gives something new to people
03:24	NakedFury	its hard to make a new game
03:24	cornernote	a lot of people just copy/paste the other ppls mods
03:24	cornernote	NF, yep
03:24	mauvebic	theres alot of copy/pasting going on too lol sometimes within days
03:24	NakedFury	right now minetest can just make a minecraft game unless you know a lot of coding
03:25	cornernote	how about this....
03:25	cornernote	quest mod
03:25	cornernote	like a sign, but it asks you to bring it an item
03:25	NakedFury	the game needs more stuff
03:25	cornernote	bring it, and get a drop% reward
03:25	mauvebic	im trying to come up with puzzles (like myst)
03:26	cornernote	thats a really good idea
03:26	NakedFury	I keep saying it, we need a way to modify the user interface
03:26	cornernote	puzzles are fun
03:26	mauvebic	as for quests... most mobs mods arent up to the task yet
03:26	cornernote	dont need mobs for quests
03:26	cornernote	quest: find 1 mese
03:26	mauvebic	well the first puzzle i thought was, 3 hidden books, when combined give you a linking book to somewhere interesting
03:26	NakedFury	ugh as of now thats gonna need lots of /commands
03:26	mauvebic	apart from that i have no other ideas lol
03:26	mauvebic	naw puzzles can be easy
03:27	mauvebic	use the inventory window
03:27	NakedFury	yes
03:27	cornernote	inventory window is pretty good now
03:27	NakedFury	BUT you need a way to check progress and read clues or quest info
03:27	cornernote	text/fields/buttons/images/etc
03:27	mauvebic	most myst puzzles was able placing the marbles/switches whatever in the right spots, and they were usually grids there too
03:27	cornernote	NF, store it in txt/ini files
03:27	mauvebic	more efficient to break up and transmit long texts over chat
03:28	NakedFury	ok but the engine still needs to allow modders control of ui
03:28	cornernote	or perhaps the quests can be included lua files ?
03:28	mauvebic	how about...
03:28	mauvebic	this node that you punch, and everytime you punch you get the next bit of text in the chat console
03:28	NakedFury	the current minecraft way
03:29	mauvebic	never played MC but im glad we think alike then lol
03:29	NakedFury	god no
03:29	mauvebic	store the strings as lua variables
03:29	cornernote	why not punch it, and it loads an inventory with the quest text ?
03:29	NakedFury	in the end all mods need commands
03:29	NakedFury	thats like playing an rpg from stone age
03:29	NakedFury	them MUDS
03:29	mauvebic	because you cant store enough text in nodes' infotext meta
03:30	cornernote	do you craft the questgiver ?
03:30	mauvebic	i dont craft shit i use gimmes lol
03:30	cornernote	maybe makes a computer
03:30	mauvebic	look in the nodebox thread
03:30	mauvebic	theres a model for computers
03:31	cornernote	yeah, an lcd
03:31	cornernote	i saw that, looks awesome
03:31	cornernote	then you can have levels
03:31	cornernote	eg, gain XP from quests
03:31	cornernote	that lets you use better items/tools .. so mese tools arent until level 10 or something
03:32	NakedFury	http://dev.bukkit.org/server-mods/mcmmo/pages/items-commands/
03:32	NakedFury	that is what you want
03:32	NakedFury	what I keep saying
03:32	mauvebic	you know whats funny
03:32	mauvebic	we have toilets, food, and beds
03:32	NakedFury	until you can add a gui its all about commands
03:32	mauvebic	the player never needs to shit,eat or sleep lol
03:33	mauvebic	ive thought of making a "hungry" mod that just eats away at your HP the longer you go w/o eating
03:33	cornernote	NF, formspec (inventory) is a gui
03:33	NakedFury	yeah a crap gui
03:33	NakedFury	an engine NEEDS to allow modders to change it
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03:33	vortexlabs	hello
03:33	NakedFury	completely
03:33	cornernote	this guy made something nice with it: http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2263
03:33	mauvebic	celeron would be the first to tell you, theres nothing stopping you from coding a new gui
03:33	vortexlabs	could someone review my mod?
03:34	vortexlabs	i'm so inpatient sorry
03:34	NakedFury	yes it is my lack of c++ knowledge
03:34	vortexlabs	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2535
03:34	cornernote	wheres your mod vortexlabs?
03:34	vortexlabs	It's called Infinity Tools
03:34	cornernote	yeah, i downloaded that just before
03:34	vortexlabs	ah
03:35	cornernote	i was going to comment...
03:35	vortexlabs	Oh yea I like your minetest wiki thing
03:35	vortexlabs	I might try that on my server
03:35	cornernote	i think the tools should be more expensive to craft
03:35	vortexlabs	Ok
03:35	cornernote	eg, 15x mese
03:35	vortexlabs	Thanks for the suggestion :)
03:35	cornernote	so that you have to make a tough choice... build a normal mese axe and waste 3, or save for infinite tool
03:36	vortexlabs	lol
03:36	vortexlabs	saving would be better :P
03:36	cornernote	maybe, but when you have a mese axe, you can replace those 3 fast
03:36	vortexlabs	yea i guess so
03:37	vortexlabs	I plan on making more mods soon, as I enjoy making them
03:37	vortexlabs	I might make a programmable computer for mesecons
03:37	cornernote	im going to start using github
03:37	vortexlabs	same
03:37	vortexlabs	I have a github
03:37	cornernote	makes it easier to share versions and download links/readme/etc
03:37	vortexlabs	yep
03:37	vortexlabs	I have one, github.com/vortexlabs
03:38	cornernote	i used mine, but not for a release yet
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03:38	cornernote	i have one too, but just been copying other peoples stuff and playing with git .. nothing released there yet
03:38	cornernote	https://github.com/cornernote
03:38	vortexlabs	I might add in an all-in-one tool that takes a lot of infinity blocks to make
03:39	cornernote	you can have an all in 1 tool ?
03:39	vortexlabs	yea, in a later version
03:40	vortexlabs	It will require 9 infinity blocks
03:40	cornernote	i want to make a mining bomb, but instead of removing blocks, it leavs them on the floor for you to collect
03:40	vortexlabs	ah
03:42	vortexlabs	hello
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03:52	vortexlabs	hello
04:03	* khonkhortisan	is the last person on the planet
04:04	khonkhortisan	mt1.gameboom.net
04:40	* MiJyn	was hiding behind the bushes where khonkhortisan couldn't see him
04:40	khonkhortisan	I like my house
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04:41	MiJyn	in mt1.gameboom.net?
04:41	khonkhortisan	yes
04:42	MiJyn	it's too old :(
04:42	khonkhortisan	I'm running the windows version in wine
04:42	MiJyn	I can't connect :(
04:42	MiJyn	my version is 11
04:42	MiJyn	his version is 10
04:42	khonkhortisan	I have 11 source and 10 compiled
04:45	khonkhortisan	huh. leaves block light.
05:11	cornernote	<khonkhortisan> I'm running the windows version in wine <--- why ?
05:13	khonkhortisan	I have irrlicht source and it crashes when I press enter when trying to talk
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05:28	VanessaE	there. That's done finally.
05:28	VanessaE	unifieddyes, coloredwood, homedecor all updated
05:29	khonkhortisan	now maybe you can let the client install them and add info to tiles in the server so the server doesn't need the mod
05:29	* VanessaE	shrugs
05:30	VanessaE	c55 decoded to implement his own, which is basically a stripped down version of the dyes system used in jordach's old 16-color wool mod with some extensions
05:30	VanessaE	but no one's gonna use it because mine's better :-)
05:36	VanessaE	decoded? decided.
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05:42	jin_xi	hi vanessa
05:42	VanessaE	hey
05:43	jin_xi	just commented on the crash in cactus mod on the forums
05:43	VanessaE	odd
05:43	jin_xi	has a cactus spawned on some weird node?
05:44	VanessaE	it's possible - did you make sure to check for unknown nodes and map blocks that aren't loaded?
05:44	VanessaE	(node ID = "ignore" or nil)
05:44	jin_xi	yeah, will have to add more checks like that.
05:45	VanessaE	other than that, they worked fine. Might I suggest they be moved in smaller increments?
05:45	jin_xi	i mean i don't expect my experiments to run smoothly 100% if the time
05:45	VanessaE	hey, the fact that they worked is a major plus!
05:45	jin_xi	but i'll try to fix that
05:47	jin_xi	its my first mob or moving thing, so i have to work a bit on better movement
05:47	VanessaE	did you notice the unifieddyes update?
05:48	jin_xi	yes and i'll make use of it once i update my painting mods
05:48	VanessaE	(short version: you give back one empty glass bottle for each bottle of dye you use)
05:48	VanessaE	(you should that is)
05:48	khonkhortisan	how does one make Trap Grass?
05:49	VanessaE	that's bobblocks isn't it?
05:49	khonkhortisan	maybe?
05:50	VanessaE	well there's "trap stone" and "trap gLass" in moreblocks
05:50	khonkhortisan	you made the L bold
05:51	khonkhortisan	I have "Trap Grass"
05:51	VanessaE	in bobblocks, there's a grass texture that's used for that purpose
05:51	VanessaE	recipe for that is:
05:51	VanessaE	- - -
05:51	VanessaE	- D -
05:51	VanessaE	- S -
05:51	VanessaE	d = dirt, s=stick
05:52	khonkhortisan	thanks
05:52	VanessaE	I thinl
05:52	VanessaE	think
05:52	khonkhortisan	yep
05:52	khonkhortisan	now I can put some back where I found it
06:05	cornernote	anyone here that can help me a little with Irrlicht/C ? im trying to generate 3d images for the wiki, but im a c noob
06:05	cornernote	i can see where i need to change
06:06	cornernote	and i know what i need to do
06:06	VanessaE	calinou did something for his mods that might be useful
06:06	VanessaE	blender I think
06:06	cornernote	basically i need to get a filename string into a variable with a type of irr::c8
06:06	VanessaE	though I doubt he automated the texture placement
06:06	cornernote	i dont know what a irr::c8 is :S
06:06	VanessaE	I could guess 8-bit char
06:07	VanessaE	besides that, good luck :-)
06:07	cornernote	http://www.irrlicht3d.org/wiki/index.php?n=Main.TakingAScreenShot
06:07	cornernote	it defines a filename, like this:
06:07	cornernote	irr::c8 filename[64];
06:07	cornernote	then populates it with the snprintf
06:07	cornernote	then writes it like this: driver->writeImageToFile(image, filename)
06:08	cornernote	i have a string i want to put in filename
06:08	VanessaE	over my head
06:09	VanessaE	I know very little C++, and pretty much no irrlicht :-)
06:09	cornernote	im soooooo close
06:09	cornernote	i can feel it
06:09	darkrose	huh?
06:09	cornernote	hi darkrose
06:10	cornernote	can you read up 10-15 lines ?
06:10	cornernote	basically, how do i convert a string to a irr:c8 ?
06:11	* darkrose	shrugs
06:11	darkrose	looks like just string.c_str()
06:11	cornernote	what is an irr::c8 ?
06:12	darkrose	other than random obfuscation for no benefit? no idea
06:12	cornernote	they seem to populate it with snprintf() .. but i cant even get that to accept my string
06:12	cornernote	i see why php was invented... this type stuff is tricky
06:13	* darkrose	just hugs ansi C
06:14	VanessaE	C++ was invented by a drug-crazed psychopath bent on being forward-compatible with brainfuck (nevermind which came first ;-) )
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06:16	* jin_xi	prefers () to {}
06:17	VanessaE	speaking of psychopaths... hey Calinou. :-)
06:18	Calinou	lol, hi
06:18	* Calinou	is downloading tremulous
06:18	Calinou	the FPS where you deserve a cookie when you figure out how to play
06:19	VanessaE	hah
06:19	GTRsdk	Has anyone had luck passing gcc optimization flags to increase FPS?
06:20	VanessaE	GTRsdk: that's almost entirely a function of your video card and its driver
06:20	VanessaE	not the game
06:20	GTRsdk	oh okay
06:20	VanessaE	(save for how much stuff you have loaded into the game of course)
06:24	GTRsdk	is it normal for there to be 100% CPU usage then while playing the game (using an integrated card)
06:25	VanessaE	probably
06:25	VanessaE	integrated graphics usually is pretty low-capability compared to a dedicated card
06:25	Calinou	http://dinnerbone.com/media/uploads/2012-07/screenshots/2012-07-24_14-26-43.I81819362.png < one of the minecraft devs is adding horizontal wood blocks
06:25	Calinou	BEAT YOU TO IT
06:25	Calinou	long time ago
06:26	VanessaE	and even with my Phenom II X6, HD6870 video card, and default textures, it takes an average of 1/6 of my total CPU power to maintain ~60 fps.
06:27	VanessaE	(that is, if it were 1 core instead of 6, that one core would be nearly pegged)
06:31	GTRsdk	so if I were to just upgrade to a dedicated GPU (most likely a 5450), would be FPS rate be much higher? (currently goes to like around 30)
06:31	VanessaE	likely
06:31	VanessaE	it depends on a number of factors
06:32	VanessaE	like the size of your textures, how much stuff is on-screen, how good your OS and drivers are, and how good that particular video card actually is
06:33	VanessaE	how much stuff is on-screen depends on things like your current view_distance, whether fog affects your performance, and whether you're looking at stuff mostly nearby or mostly in the distance
06:34	cornernote	yeah baby, i got it to start compiling without complaining
06:34	cornernote	lets see if it makes me some images! =)
06:34	GTRsdk	I usually have the screen maximized with no fog
06:34	GTRsdk	which is probably why the FPS is lower than when the screen is smaller and with fog
06:34	VanessaE	with my particular setup, even with the high-end hardware, minetest drops as low as ~6 FPS when I'm up really high and looking out over a hundreds-of-nodes distance (i.e. with a large part of the map loaded and "full viewing distance" turned on)
06:35	VanessaE	in practice, it varies between 25 and 55 or so
06:35	VanessaE	(i.e. on the ground, view distance set for 150, fog on, view limited to the view distance setting)
06:36	VanessaE	cornernote: excellent!
06:36	VanessaE	cornernote: will this handle nodebox objects also?
06:36	GTRsdk	is 60 the max FPS possible, or is it possible to go to 100 if one has the right hardware?
06:36	VanessaE	GTRsdk: in practice, 60 is the max
06:37	VanessaE	if you have a monitor that can drive higher (say 75 or 120) then perhaps
06:37	VanessaE	but your eyes aren't going to notice more than 60 anyway as long as the timing between frames is even
06:37	VanessaE	(which would be the case with a normal 60 Hz monitor)
06:37	cornernote	lol, no just cashed the game on load
06:37	VanessaE	(some people claim to see up to 75 FPS, but those are fairly rare)
06:38	VanessaE	cornernote: OOPS :-)
06:38	cornernote	VanessaE, yes it should handle every image that is shown in your inventory
06:38	cornernote	should
06:38	VanessaE	...provided the game doesn't crash ;-)
06:38	cornernote	in all honesty im way over my head
06:38	cornernote	just pushing random things to see what happens
06:38	VanessaE	you'll figure it out
06:38	cornernote	=)
06:39	VanessaE	"Ooo! What does THIS button do?"\
06:39	cornernote	guess what
06:39	cornernote	it works !!!
06:39	VanessaE	w00t!
06:39	VanessaE	see? I told you!
06:39	cornernote	it was the bug red button all along
06:39	cornernote	big
06:40	VanessaE	haha
06:40	cornernote	ok, now to try with more than the default mods
06:40	cornernote	at the moment i only get the cube images, not nodeboxes
06:41	VanessaE	remember to use the latest git as your basis, to get over the number-of-nodes limit
06:42	cornernote	yes, i have EVERY mod
06:42	cornernote	i went right back through the forums
06:42	cornernote	and my game still loads
06:42	VanessaE	how many nodes are defined now?
06:42	cornernote	well, sometimes
06:42	cornernote	:)
06:43	cornernote	it generated 33 before crashing this time
06:43	Calinou	GTRsdk, protip: nvidia > AMD
06:43	VanessaE	heh
06:43	cy1	protip nvidia = AMD = teh suck
06:43	VanessaE	haha
06:44	Calinou	cy1, still better than AMD
06:45	Calinou	too bad no company opensources their drivers, though, other than intel
06:45	Calinou	but intel is slow :p
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06:50	mauvebic	finally did it, keycode doors :-)
06:53	Calinou	http://minetest.net/forum/search.php?search_id=1720668941
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06:53	Calinou	WTF
06:55	mauvebic	link to nowhere?
06:55	Calinou	thought search links were sharable in some way; nevermind then
06:56	mauvebic	yeah said something about forum messages unavailable lol
06:57	mauvebic	must be pretty early there cuz its really late here lol
06:57	VanessaE	hey mauvebic.
06:57	mauvebic	wassup
06:57	mauvebic	whys your text in red and not everyone elses?
06:58	VanessaE	because I said your name
06:58	mauvebic	ooohh
06:58	VanessaE	(for me, the highlight is yellow)
06:58	mauvebic	havent been used to IRC in some years now lol
06:59	VanessaE	been using IRC for about 16 years myself.
06:59	mauvebic	i used it in the 90s, but by now most of my friends consider it mesopotamian
06:59	mauvebic	or sumerian
06:59	VanessaE	heh
07:00	VanessaE	so, a relative of Zuul or Gozer then. :-)
07:00	mauvebic	yeah lol
07:00	mauvebic	though i try to sprinkle as many cryptic error messages as i can lol
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07:01	mauvebic	i managed to come up with password protected gates, im gonna "functionalize" the whole thing and release it tomorrow
07:01	mauvebic	hopefully add more doors like that
07:01	mauvebic	do the nodebox doors work just as well?
07:01	aaronbargman	are there any admins here that can grant build privs for boomworld
07:02	VanessaE	they seem to, though I can't say I like the textures they use
07:02	VanessaE	(plain wood is ugly, there's no variation, no "style")
07:02	mauvebic	i got my own texs thats not a problem :-) so long as the model doesnt flicker and the parts align right
07:02	aaronbargman	wait what server do yoyu playon
07:02	VanessaE	boomworld? you mean gameboom?
07:03	aaronbargman	yes
07:03	VanessaE	That's Bad_Command's territory, but I guess he's idle right now.
07:04	darkrose	I could, but I'd have to compile a client for whatever version gameboom's running, and I cbf
07:04	VanessaE	darkrose: roughly 0.4-dev just prior to nodeboxes. :-)
07:04	VanessaE	unless he's gotten out of the dark ages since then
07:04	aaronbargman	wil yu be willingto do it ik the server rule
07:05	darkrose	would you be willing to use something approximating a sentence?
07:05	VanessaE	I wonder if redcrab's updated 30401 to work with the 16-bit node ID's commit et.al
07:07	aaronbargman	so how often is bad_command o?
07:07	VanessaE	randomly.
07:07	aaronbargman	on)
07:07	aaronbargman	oh i see
07:08	VanessaE	you have a gameboom account?
07:08	aaronbargman	yes
07:10	VanessaE	I see you've already asked on the gameboom server forum, so give the admin time to answer
07:11	aaronbargman	ok
07:13	VanessaE	ok, time for me to head off to bed.
07:13	VanessaE	night all
07:14	mauvebic	me too lol night
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07:37	cornernote	im stuck on a c++ thing... i want to base64_encode a string like this "[inventorycube{default_glass.png{default_glass.png{default_glass.png" .. so i can save it as a file on disk
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07:37	cornernote	heres what i am trying: it compiles, but crashes when the code hits that part (i can see from debug.txt)
07:37	cornernote	const std::string s = part_of_name;
07:37	cornernote	std::string se = base64_encode(reinterpret_cast<const unsigned char*>(s.c_str()), s.length());
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07:53	VanessaE	sigh insomnia sucks
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08:01	* darkrose	pets VanessaE
08:01	VanessaE	purr
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08:07	VanessaE	hey sfan
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08:31	VanessaE	didjya break ityet? :-)
08:31	cornernote	ok, i can extract inventorycube images from the game as png, but not node_box .. where are they rendered ?
08:32	VanessaE	dunno
08:33	cornernote	:(
08:33	cornernote	i really want the furniture... more than the cubes lol
08:38	VanessaE	and my pipes, of course ;-)\
08:45	jin_xi	yeah, back from the dentist =(
08:45	VanessaE	didn't go well?
08:45	jin_xi	ok. but always glad it's over!!
08:45	VanessaE	my rule with a dentist: knock me the fuck out!
08:50	jin_xi	i think i'm gonna make a nodebox model for a train track stop thingy
08:51	VanessaE	a bumper track?
08:51	jin_xi	yes, thanks, thats the word
08:52	VanessaE	nice
08:52	VanessaE	of course, that means we need nodebox rails too :-)
08:52	VanessaE	and those will be difficult because of the curves.
08:52	VanessaE	(if it's not high-resolution enough, HD texture packs won't work)
08:52	jin_xi	would be nice. i wonder if that could be done using the texture extrusion thing,
08:53	jin_xi	the one that gives wielded toold its 3d appearance
08:53	VanessaE	right. I asked about that months ago :-)
08:54	jin_xi	i can't wait until someone starts exploring the full scope of mods
08:55	jin_xi	gonna look at mauvebics custom game soonish, looks interesting
08:55	VanessaE	maybe use separate images - one for the ties, one for the rails, perhaps a third for the spikes. extrude each separately, stack them up
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09:19	VanessaE	bbl
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10:28	chinabootlegmake	hi all
10:28	chinabootlegmake	i want to play minetest on ubuntu 12.04
10:28	chinabootlegmake	but the font of this game is so small and I don't know how to change to full screen
10:29	chinabootlegmake	there must something wrong with these tiny font
10:44	chinabootlegmake	hi
10:44	chinabootlegmake	anyone here
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13:55	* VanessaE	wanders in
13:55	VanessaE	good morning all
13:57	thexyz	morning
13:57	VanessaE	hey xyz, ltns
13:58	thexyz	yes.
14:03	VanessaE	were've you been hiding? :-)
14:04	VanessaE	where've
14:04	thexyz	is that so important?
14:06	VanessaE	er, I suppose not
14:07	thexyz	nice then
14:08	VanessaE	jeez, who pissed in your Cheerios this morning? :-)
14:10	thexyz	nice
14:11	thexyz	http://pastebin.com/FcyCKVr2 that's how stress server died
14:12	thexyz	oh, and nobody now plays on it
14:15	VanessaE	Not sure I understand the final error but it sorta looks like that emerge player issue from a while back
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14:29	alpha_one_x86	Hello, somebody know if minetest have lag like the old very of minecraft when a player go far of start?
14:30	VanessaE	not sure what you mean
14:31	alpha_one_x86	if I go at x: 500000 y: 500000, z: 500 000 that's not product a lag? cf: http://www.minecraftwiki.net/wiki/Far_Lands
14:32	VanessaE	well minetest goes to +/- 31000 (all three axes),
14:32	VanessaE	but last I saw, no that sort of thing doesn't happen
14:33	alpha_one_x86	then 16bits entry, why not 32Bits coord?
14:33	VanessaE	ask celeron55 :-)
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14:41	VanessaE	reason: performance and bandwidth.
14:42	VanessaE	16 bit coords perform better and require less bandwidth
14:46	thexyz	oh, who cares about bandwidth now
14:47	thexyz	2 or 4 byte, is that such a big difference
14:47	thexyz	cornernote: can you make your craftwiki script to produce .html pages?
14:47	thexyz	static ones
14:52	VanessaE	w00t - blox mod is going to unified dyes :-)
14:53	MiJyn	hi
14:53	VanessaE	hey MiJyn
14:54	MiJyn	how is everyone today?
14:54	VanessaE	pretty good, save for not having slept well
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14:55	MiJyn	ah
14:56	Nemo08	hi all!
14:56	MiJyn	dang, eclipse doesn't know that apt.apt_pkg DOES contain things like init() amd Cache() lol
14:56	MiJyn	hi Nemo
14:56	VanessaE	hey nemo
14:57	alpha_one_x86	I have the same problem on my mmorpg, it can be simplie solved by reference point into 32Bits + offset of player into 8 or 16Bits
14:58	VanessaE	c55 doesn't want to go over 16-bit coords - they're not needed anyway
14:58	thexyz	that "not needed" thingâ€¦
14:59	thexyz	who the fuck needs Â±31000 in vertical direction?
14:59	VanessaE	well it does create a world with a max of 238328 cubic kilometers
15:00	alpha_one_x86	But with lot of player on the server, +-31000 in horizontal can be few
15:01	thexyz	maybe
15:01	alpha_one_x86	and all the cpu manage 32Bits (now 64Bits), then drop 16Bits...
15:01	thexyz	the problem is that most >100 is air
15:01	thexyz	except that floating islands
15:01	VanessaE	with the default mapgen yes
15:02	alpha_one_x86	under minecraft I use +2000 for floating islands like you say, and -2000 to have hidden home (work only if the server limit the distance to display the other player)
15:02	VanessaE	but shrug it's c55's project and he refuses. he even said he'd go with 16-bit coords again if he were to re-start minetest from scratch
15:02	thexyz	alpha_one_x86: i mean that floating islands that mapgen generates, not ones built by players
15:03	Nemo08	you see many flying islands?
15:03	NakedFury	make a fork with 32 bits just to show him
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15:04	alpha_one_x86	And before speak about performance or bandwith on 32Bits vs 16bits, lot of work is to do
15:05	VanessaE	raise an issue on github
15:05	VanessaE	give good reasonings
15:05	VanessaE	show examples where it's too small of a limit
15:06	VanessaE	maybe even see if you can provide a patch to change the behavior
15:06	VanessaE	show bandwidth and performance benchmarks if you can
15:07	thexyz	you know, this is still not main thing to do
15:07	VanessaE	of course there are more important things to do
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15:08	alpha_one_x86	I have do that's with my MMO, but if I don't wan't...
15:09	alpha_one_x86	with correct protocol, 32Bits coordo + 8Bits for offset, you can win 50% of the bandwith for lot of player (100+)
15:11	VanessaE	study the code, fork, patch, -> github.
15:11	VanessaE	:-)
15:15	VanessaE	on second thought, don't.
15:16	VanessaE	c55 requests that you not file a github issue at all
15:16	VanessaE	(though fork and patch is of course up to you)
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16:17	jordach	sup
16:17	* jordach	is not at home with xchat :(
16:17	VanessaE	jordach: new unifieddyes. :-)
16:17	jordach	FUCK#
16:17	* jordach	slams face on desk
16:17	VanessaE	relax
16:18	VanessaE	it only matters if you don't mind wasting glass :-)
16:18	jordach	no. fuck cotton.
16:18	jordach	ill go let c55 do wool
16:18	jordach	and the dyes
16:18	VanessaE	requires roughly a 5-line patch to add "replacements=" lines
16:18	* jordach	does not want a patch
16:18	* jordach	prefers something else
16:19	VanessaE	he already pushed wool to git master.
16:19	VanessaE	and this:
16:19	VanessaE	http://c55.me/random/2012-07/tscrot-2012-07-25_18-29-37.png
16:19	VanessaE	new creative inventory, will also be used for the regular inventory.
16:21	jordach	wait what
16:21	jordach	WTF
16:21	VanessaE	npd
16:21	jordach	my bad
16:21	VanessaE	npd
16:21	VanessaE	DAMN IT
16:21	VanessaE	N
16:21	VanessaE	O
16:21	VanessaE	D
16:21	jordach	npd ?
16:21	VanessaE	supposed to be a nod :-)
16:21	VanessaE	but my fingers kept going to the wrong keys :)
16:22	jordach	aaaaannnd something else by chance???? D:
16:22	VanessaE	that's about it for now
16:22	* VanessaE	patches cotton.
16:23	VanessaE	gimme 5 or 10 mins and I'll upload the changes.
16:23	jordach	thanks
16:23	jordach	since i aint at home, user submitted forks are accepted with me
16:26	jordach	http://c55.me/random/2012-07/tscrot-2012-07-25_18-29-37.png against http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg13/scaled.php?server=13&filename=tmi100.png&res=landing TOO MANY ITEMS Calinou?
16:27	jordach	thexyz: youve returned?
16:27	thexyz	yes
16:27	Calinou	wow awesome
16:27	jordach	oh good
16:27	jordach	celeron cloned too many items
16:27	jordach	LAWSUIT
16:28	* jordach	wants to compile this bad boy
16:29	Calinou	http://minetest.net/packages/nightly/?C=M;O=A
16:29	* Calinou	wants a new nightly
16:29	thexyz	i can build nightly for you
16:32	thexyz	latest master, right?
16:33	VanessaE	jordach: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/cotton-20120725.zip
16:33	VanessaE	also fixed the wield/inventory images so they render as proper cubes.
16:33	jordach	thexyz, VanessaE, later
16:33	jordach	VanessaE: it would be easier to email me
16:33	Calinou	thexyz, no, thanks anyway
16:33	VanessaE	all items give back either an empty bottle or bucket
16:33	Calinou	^^
16:33	VanessaE	email addy?
16:36	VanessaE	jordach ...
16:36	jordach	yeas
16:38	VanessaE	what is your email address?
16:38	jordach	jordach.snellinggmail.com
16:40	VanessaE	sent.
16:41	* darkrose	sets up spambot
16:42	* jordach	kicks darkrose
16:42	jordach	gmail has an awesome spam filter, try breaking it
16:42	darkrose	:p
16:42	jordach	thank you VanessaE
16:42	VanessaE	yw
16:42	jordach	thexyz: please do cross build a client
16:42	* darkrose	doesn't really want to be banned from google again
16:43	thexyz	jordach: ok
16:43	jordach	30001 MOTHER FU
16:43	NakedFury	banned from google?
16:43	jordach	yes
16:43	jordach	you can get banned from googlem
16:43	VanessaE	darkrose: hell, all you gotta do is click on enough images in sequence and you'll trigger their anti-bot auto-lockout :-)
16:44	* Calinou	is adding wool/dye mod support to misa pack
16:45	* jordach	thanks Calinou
16:45	VanessaE	don't forget cotton and unifieddyes ;-)
16:45	jordach	Calinou: we prefer instagib metl3
16:45	jordach	???
16:45	Calinou	default dye textures need better textures
16:45	Calinou	^ some noise
16:45	Calinou	jordach, a reference to the name of a sauerbraten server
16:45	Calinou	instagib being a game mode and metl3 a map
16:45	VanessaE	(the gentextures.sh script makes it dead easy to add unifieddyes-based mod support to a tex pack)
16:46	jordach	but they look crap
16:46	VanessaE	only if the textures you start with are crap :-)
16:47	jordach	my own textures http://imgur.com/a/ZNjgl
16:47	VanessaE	mine: http://i.imgur.com/0U8YA.png
16:47	VanessaE	(for unified bricks)
16:47	VanessaE	definitely not crap.
16:47	jordach	TEXTURE FILTERING THANK YOU
16:48	VanessaE	I wish.
16:48	jordach	i know
16:48	VanessaE	all textures look at least a little like crap because of lack of that, even 16px ones.
16:48	jordach	thats why i aint ever going to use your pack
16:48	jordach	NOISY NOISY NOISY
16:48	VanessaE	64px in that screenshot ^^
16:49	jordach	cant we have 16px here
16:49	VanessaE	just pointing it out.
16:49	jordach	yes
16:49	jordach	my texture was a 2x1 repeating pattern
16:49	jordach	then added some noise
16:49	jordach	(made sure they tile)
16:50	VanessaE	hey, if it works?
16:50	jordach	those images look really nice, don they, even from me
16:50	VanessaE	many of my textures have added noise, usually to simulate less-than-smooth surfaces, rust, etc.
16:50	VanessaE	yes actually, yours look good
16:51	jordach	and i was being quick and cheap
16:51	jordach	if the noise is too light / dark in places a small amount of blur can fix it
16:52	VanessaE	exactly - it's surprising what you can do with a little noise and blur.
16:53	jordach	ikr
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16:58	VanessaE	jordach: what was the name of the mod and link to the one you were doing?
16:58	jordach	metals
16:58	VanessaE	the one with the pipes and other metal objects
16:58	VanessaE	ah
16:58	jordach	metals
16:58	jordach	in general mod
16:58	VanessaE	got it
16:59	VanessaE	(girders and warning marker need updated to give empty bottles btw)
16:59	jordach	?
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17:00	jordach	btw
17:00	vortexlabs	hello
17:00	jordach	the pipe cap fits the pipe ends exactly
17:00	jordach	sup vortexlabs
17:00	vortexlabs	Could I have some help with minetest?
17:00	VanessaE	you use a couple of dyes to make those two objects - the dyes should give back empty bottles when used.
17:00	Calinou	support for wool/dye mod added!
17:00	Calinou	vortexlabs, yes, don't ask to ask
17:00	jordach	VanessaE: fix it then
17:01	vortexlabs	I downloaded the stable version (4.1) and it says I don't have msvcr100.dll
17:01	Calinou	stable is 0.4.1 not 4.1 ;)
17:01	jordach	go grab http://download.microsoft.com/download/5/B/C/5BC5DBB3-652D-4DCE-B14A-475AB85EEF6E/vcredist_x86.exe and run it
17:01	Calinou	vortexlabs, protip... search on the forums:
17:01	Calinou	^ what jordach said
17:01	jordach	or http://download.microsoft.com/download/5/B/C/5BC5DBB3-652D-4DCE-B14A-475AB85EEF6E/vcredist_x64.exe
17:02	vortexlabs	I have the .net framework stuff installed
17:02	Calinou	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=33714#p33714
17:02	Calinou	5x-post...
17:02	Calinou	._.
17:02	jordach	vortexlabs: .net is pointless http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=14632
17:03	vortexlabs	ah
17:03	vortexlabs	i'm downloading that
17:04	* jordach	burps
17:05	vortexlabs	wait that download didn'y work
17:05	jordach	http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=14632 64 bit
17:05	vortexlabs	i have a 32 bit system my bad
17:05	jordach	alright
17:05	jordach	x64 = 64 bit, x86 = 32 bit
17:05	vortexlabs	i know
17:05	jordach	i use linux too much
17:05	jordach	too used to the errorless bleep
17:05	vortexlabs	I am switching to linux soon actually
17:06	jordach	good
17:06	jordach	xubuntu is a good start#
17:06	vortexlabs	Actually I was going for arch
17:06	jordach	hey Calinou ARCH USER
17:07	vortexlabs	It's fairly straightforward to install,I did it in qemu before
17:07	thexyz	qemu?
17:07	vortexlabs	Ok the vC++ stuff is installed
17:07	vortexlabs	yea it's an emulator
17:07	thexyz	i know
17:07	vortexlabs	oh
17:07	thexyz	but it's a low-level emulator
17:07	vortexlabs	Minetest is working
17:07	thexyz	why not install it in virtualbox?
17:07	vortexlabs	My pc is old
17:08	vortexlabs	My pc is old years to the exact
17:08	vortexlabs	*8
17:08	jordach	mines 6
17:08	jordach	woot
17:08	vortexlabs	ah
17:08	vortexlabs	I'm getting a new one around christmastime so
17:09	vortexlabs	well mt is working
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17:10	vortexlabs	is there a mod that can remove all dropped items?
17:10	jordach	do /clearobjects
17:10	vortexlabs	thanks
17:10	vortexlabs	sorry i ask too many questions
17:11	jordach	its no problem here
17:11	vortexlabs	ok
17:11	Calinou	<jordach> hey Calinou ARCH USER
17:11	Calinou	OKAY
17:11	Calinou	vortexlabs, arch sucks
17:11	VanessaE	hah
17:11	thexyz	NICE TRY!
17:11	thexyz	Calinou: why does arch suck?
17:12	thexyz	wrong question, why does it suck more than other distros?
17:12	Calinou	because, it's for people who like anime and want to show off their ski1lZ
17:12	Calinou	it sucks more than other distros because of its setup time
17:12	VanessaE	Calinou: that link you posted earlier ending in 33714 is wrong
17:12	Calinou	and it's unconvenient for no benefit
17:12	Calinou	VanessaE, ikr, I merged his posts and warned him
17:12	vortexlabs	my friend bacos uses arch and he watches too much anime
17:12	thexyz	Calinou: you should think about new reasons
17:13	VanessaE	oh ok
17:13	vortexlabs	he says he has a 'waifu'
17:13	VanessaE	didn't see that part
17:13	thexyz	and, remember, it is unconvenient for YOU
17:13	Calinou	<thexyz> and, remember, it is unconvenient for YOU
17:13	Calinou	this explains why the wiki recommends arch as a first distro?
17:13	thexyz	what wiki?
17:13	Calinou	the arch wiki
17:13	thexyz	lol
17:13	thexyz	what distro should distro wiki recommend?
17:14	VanessaE	Xubuntu. :-)
17:14	vortexlabs	i'm new to linux but i know a fair amount of commands and learn easily
17:14	thexyz	it seems that i hate everything .+buntu =(
17:14	Calinou	I use linux since 2.5 years ago; I find arch extremely hard to use (or at least, the wiki makes it sound like it's very hard, which is bad too)
17:14	Calinou	I'm fine with *buntu but I prefer debian
17:15	vortexlabs	what about gentoo
17:15	thexyz	debian is fine for slowpokes
17:15	VanessaE	MAKE_OPS="-funroll_loops -O3 [...] -no_gentoo"
17:15	thexyz	gentoo is fine too
17:16	VanessaE	or was it _OPTS rather ;)
17:16	thexyz	if you have enough time
17:17	thexyz	oh, btw
17:17	VanessaE	no.
17:17	thexyz	arch dropped its pseudo-graphics installer
17:17	VanessaE	;-)
17:18	thexyz	but (see the difference), you may still use it
17:18	SmugLeaf	lol VanessaE
17:18	SmugLeaf	MAKEOPTS is for shit like -j
17:18	VanessaE	it's been too long since I last used gentoo :-)
17:19	SmugLeaf	CFLAGS would have -march=r33th4xz -unroll-every-loop
17:19	SmugLeaf	i use gentoo every day
17:19	VanessaE	USE="[four million different packages because I like my system to actually support stuff ;-) ]"
17:20	VanessaE	actually it wasn't bad, I just got tired of shit breaking all the time
17:20	vortexlabs	I wonder how well a raspberry pi would run minetest
17:20	SmugLeaf	even my desktop systems only have like 30 flags
17:20	SmugLeaf	lol
17:20	SmugLeaf	i run ~
17:20	VanessaE	every other time I emerge'd something, some random package would fail to compile
17:20	SmugLeaf	shit still doesn't break
17:20	SmugLeaf	i've had more shit from *buntu and arch then gentoo
17:20	SmugLeaf	but gentoo was my first distro
17:21	SmugLeaf	so maybe i'm wired for gentoo now
17:21	VanessaE	well this was at least a few years ago. it's probably improved by now
17:22	VanessaE	it was at about the time that they stopped recommending starting from "stage 2" if I remember right
17:26	thexyz	jordach: http://rghost.net/39411771
17:27	jordach	kay
17:27	jordach	im gunna head to the beach now, bye!
17:27	Calinou	<vortexlabs> I wonder how well a raspberry pi would run minetest
17:27	Calinou	~1FPS
17:27	Calinou	<thexyz> debian is fine for slowpokes
17:27	Calinou	slowpokes?
17:27	Calinou	heard of testing/unstable?
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18:18	khonkhortisan	how do I tell who is on the server without rejoining?
18:18	VanessaE	/status
18:18	vortexlabs	status doesn't show whose online in irssi
18:19	VanessaE	I assume he means on a minetest server
18:19	khonkhortisan	in minetest
18:19	VanessaE	otherwise, try /users
18:19	VanessaE	or /who
18:19	vortexlabs	oh
18:19	vortexlabs	I'm maing a mine in minetest
18:20	khonkhortisan	if someone puts a bunch of crap in a public area, thereby defacing it, does that mean the stuff is mine if I clean it up?
18:20	VanessaE	prettymuch
18:21	VanessaE	as long as you're 100% certain it was placed there as vandalism
18:21	VanessaE	(and you can gather it all up of course)
18:22	VanessaE	when someone does that on a server I'm on, I clean up the mess if I can, and keep the materials for later. usually I end up re-using some of those materials to rebuild something that's been griefed or I give them away as needed
18:22	khonkhortisan	oh I just realized where the ladders came from
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18:51	khonkhortisan	what's the process for picking road names?
18:52	VanessaE	road names?
18:52	khonkhortisan	yeah I want an address for my house
18:52	VanessaE	oh, well it depends on the server
18:52	khonkhortisan	there's gravel paths
18:52	VanessaE	afaik, there's no standard
18:53	VanessaE	but if you want to pick one, of course I'd have to suggest the common thing in the US,
18:53	VanessaE	"central" and "main" would be the cross streets in the center of town, for example
18:53	VanessaE	names of US states to one side parallel to "main", names of US presidents to the other side
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18:54	VanessaE	numbered streets parallel to "central" to the south, lettered streets to the north
18:54	VanessaE	usually there's a major street every 1.6km, usually where 10th st, 20th st, etc would go
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18:55	VanessaE	once you get about halfway through the alphabet on the north-side streets, then anything goes
18:55	VanessaE	while south-side numbered streets commonly keep incrementing as far as you want them to
18:56	VanessaE	once you run out of states and presidents for the streets paralleling main, again anything goes.
18:56	khonkhortisan	sounds compicated
18:56	VanessaE	not really
18:57	VanessaE	many cities will replace one of the near-main or near-central streets with "favorite" names, like "broadway" or "wall" or a street named for the town
18:58	VanessaE	http://maps.google.com/maps?q=joplin,+missouri&ll=37.088357,-94.513879&spn=0.013231,0.01929&oe=utf-8&client=ubuntu&channel=fs&hnear=Joplin,+Jasper,+Missouri&gl=us&t=m&z=16
18:59	VanessaE	take a look at this layout, which is the central part of the last town I lived in
18:59	VanessaE	(Joplin Missouri, US)
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19:01	VanessaE	this layout, with minor changes, is pretty common
19:04	vortexlabs	bacj
19:04	vortexlabs	*back
19:04	VanessaE	whenever I look at a server's map, what I notice is they tend to have roads that, at best, resemble the major/yellow roads in that map
19:05	VanessaE	(that google map that is)
19:06	VanessaE	Wichita, KS makes a mess of it though :-)
19:06	VanessaE	numbered streets to the north AND south (I think even numbers on one side, odd on the other)
19:06	VanessaE	and anything goes on the east and west sides :-)
19:07	VanessaE	broadway is the "main" street I seem to remember, while Kellogg is the cross street
19:07	VanessaE	with a number of major freeways crossing at odd directions
19:09	VanessaE	chew on that one for a while ;-)
19:09	VanessaE	maybe some standard will emerge for roads in the game
19:09	VanessaE	bbl
19:12	khonkhortisan	with enough road signs I can direct someone to my house without having to go and get them
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19:19	khonkhortisan	I can build a house out of desert sand but I can't pick up desert stone, put the desert cobblestone in the furnace, and build with desert stone
19:33	khonkhortisan	wow, tree grows through cobblestone
19:41	vortexlabs	for some reason i cannot remove rails
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19:48	Allaun	\o
19:55	VanessaE	vortexlabs: that was fixed in a recent git
19:56	vortexlabs	oh
19:56	vortexlabs	i have v0.4.1
19:56	VanessaE	also, hi :-)
19:57	vortexlabs	hi
19:57	vortexlabs	i'll just wait till a newer version i guess
19:57	VanessaE	there's an easy fix
19:57	vortexlabs	o
19:58	vortexlabs	*oh
19:58	vortexlabs	i was thinking of writing an abm
19:58	VanessaE	trying to find it
19:58	vortexlabs	ok
19:59	vortexlabs	apparently you can ban yourself in minetest
20:00	VanessaE	hm, maybe it wasn't fixed in git, I coulda sworn it was
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20:00	vortexlabs	ah
20:00	vortexlabs	hello
20:01	Allaun	How is everyone
20:01	vortexlabs	fine
20:01		darkrose joined #minetest
20:03	VanessaE	well it's in the default/init.lua wherever rails are defined - there's no proper selection box
20:04	VanessaE	edit /usr/local/share/minetest/games/minetest_game/mods/default/init.lua
20:04	vortexlabs	ah
20:04	VanessaE	search for description = "Rail",
20:04	VanessaE	find the selection_box part
20:04	vortexlabs	I'm using windows but i know where it is
20:04	VanessaE	I think it says type="fixed" and then --fixed below that
20:05	vortexlabs	I'll go fix it and etc
20:05	VanessaE	remove the --fixed line, and change it to:
20:05	VanessaE	fixed = {-1/2, -1/2, -1/2, 1/2, -1/2+1/16, 1/2},
20:05	vortexlabs	ok
20:05	VanessaE	that's how it's defined now anyway
20:05	vortexlabs	ok
20:06	vortexlabs	oh yea have you checked out my mod infinitytools?
20:06	VanessaE	I saw the post about it
20:06	vortexlabs	ah
20:06	VanessaE	infinity blocks should require a lot of work to construct
20:06	vortexlabs	i see
20:06	VanessaE	like several pieces of mese and steel ingots
20:07	vortexlabs	calinou suggested nyan cats
20:07	VanessaE	yeah but nyancats are too rare
20:07	vortexlabs	yea
20:07	NakedFury	and crap
20:07	vortexlabs	where are they usually at anyways
20:07	VanessaE	somewhere below -2000 is all I know
20:07	vortexlabs	ah
20:08	vortexlabs	i should go down farther than -2000 then
20:08	vortexlabs	i've done that before
20:08	vortexlabs	tons of lava is there
20:08	VanessaE	over on minetest.ru:30001 I have a mine down at -4000
20:08	vortexlabs	nice
20:09	vortexlabs	i usually play on menche's server and my own server
20:09	VanessaE	but I don't play there really anymore
20:09	vortexlabs	ah
20:09	VanessaE	got one at -200 on redcrab:30401, but it's just getting started
20:11	vortexlabs	ok i did what you said to do to the default/init.lua file
20:11	VanessaE	now just run the game
20:11	vortexlabs	i did
20:11	vortexlabs	i can remove rails now
20:11	vortexlabs	thanks
20:11	VanessaE	cool
20:19	VanessaE	yw
20:20	Allaun	is there a active community server?
20:20	VanessaE	there are a few
20:20	VanessaE	http://servers.minetest.ru/
20:21	vortexlabs	my computer is so loud
20:22	FreeFull	I think nyancats have an equal opportunity of appearing anywhere below -64
20:22	thexyz	http://minetest.ru/nyansearch/
20:22	thexyz	don't know whether it works or no for current version
20:24	VanessaE	vortexlabs: mine, I swear, has a turbine in it.
20:24	vortexlabs	my pc is eight years old and most likely never had it's fans repleced
20:26	Allaun	bookmarked the server list
20:26	Allaun	\o/
20:28	Allaun	i never play minecraft because I can't afford it
20:28	Allaun	but it's nice to have something that i don't have to pirate
20:28	Allaun	:3
20:28	FreeFull	thexyz: Teleported to where it told me to
20:28	FreeFull	Nothing
20:28	thexyz	then it doesn't work for current version
20:29	FreeFull	Probably because new map generator
20:29	thexyz	yes
20:50	vortexlabs	I'm going to work on my mod
20:50	vortexlabs	and possibly add some stuff to mesecons
20:55	vortexlabs	now to learn git
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21:29	jin_xi	oh well, rewrite time again. sigh
21:30	VanessaE	hey, at least it means not having to rely on entities anymore
21:30	VanessaE	(and it would allow for higher-resolution drawings too)
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21:39	VanessaE	oh, don't forget the empty bottles issue (might be a good idea for your mod to just drop them all into a "discard bin" or something else that can be gathered later and passed through UD's recycle craft.
21:39	VanessaE	)
21:45	vortexlabs	i need to quit slacking off
21:45	vortexlabs	i was going to work on my mod, but ended up browing a forum
21:45	VanessaE	heh
21:45	VanessaE	I browse the forums several times a day (out of boredom :-) )
21:50	vortexlabs	Does anyone have a good crafting recipie for the infinity block of my mod?
21:50	vortexlabs	It needs to be harder to make, by using rare materials or something
21:50	vortexlabs	no nyan cats, they are not easy to find
21:52	khonkhortisan	ladder, stone, glass, mese pickaxe
21:52	sfan5	vortexlabs: crafting compressed mese out of 9 mese
21:52	khonkhortisan	compressed mese +1
21:52	sfan5	then 2 comp. mese + 1 iron ingot = 1 inf. block
21:52	vortexlabs	good idea
21:53	vortexlabs	I like that idea
21:53	VanessaE	no, better
21:53	vortexlabs	Could someone make me graphics for compressed mese and the infinity block?
21:53	vortexlabs	The tools graphics are ok
21:54	sfan5	compressed mese tile mese texture 4x4 and make it darker
21:54	VanessaE	9 mese = 1 compressed mese, 9 compressed mese = 1 infinite block, then craft tools like normal - infinite blocks for the heads instead of cobble/wood/etc and steel ingots for the handle
21:54	vortexlabs	I like that idea
21:54	VanessaE	so an infinite pick would take 243 mese and two steel ingots.
21:55	vortexlabs	lol
21:55	vortexlabs	kind of a lot but you can always just do /giveme infinitytools:pick
21:55	VanessaE	given how easy it is to get mese, you gotta make the player really work for it
21:55	vortexlabs	yea
21:55	khonkhortisan	vortexlabs: http://f.imgtmp.com/PWZer.png hehe
21:58	sfan5	khonkhortisan: i meant tiling 4x4 with the OLD texture
21:59	VanessaE	bah, use my mese texture, it's tons better :-)
21:59	vortexlabs	I'm still going to use sticks for the handle, let's just say the mese makes the handle stronger :P
22:00	khonkhortisan	bad_command was wrong, glass doesn't block light
22:01	vortexlabs	I bet some mods might depend on my mod with the compressed mese :P
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22:02	vortexlabs	hello
22:03	VanessaE	really though, compressed mese should look like it's actually been compressed somehow
22:03	vortexlabs	oh yea
22:03	vortexlabs	maybe flatten the mese texture?
22:03	VanessaE	mm..
22:03	VanessaE	maybe not like that but close
22:03	vortexlabs	hence 'compressed;
22:03	vortexlabs	ah
22:04	VanessaE	imagine stacking several vertically and then crunching them down
22:04	vortexlabs	oh yea
22:04	VanessaE	but you'll definitely need to go beyond 16px for that to work
22:04	vortexlabs	that's ok
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22:05	mauvebic	can someone plz move this http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2399 so i can release an update :-)
22:06	vortexlabs	Ok, I updated the init.lua file to add compressed mese
22:06	VanessaE	what is riven anyway?
22:07	vortexlabs	supper
22:07	NakedFury	rivensomething, all I know is that it needs a better summary
22:07	NakedFury	I have no idea what it is
22:07	VanessaE	"sequel to myst"
22:08	mauvebic	sorry bathroom
22:08	mauvebic	riven is the sequel to myst :-)
22:09	mauvebic	its basicaly a bunch of deco nodes, teleporting linking books and locking doors
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22:10	mauvebic	though i dont wanna release the new door from general lol
22:11	NakedFury	so its a map too
22:12	vortexlabs	wait nvm
22:12	VanessaE	How'd you get the textures in your mod?
22:12	vortexlabs	no supper yet
22:12	vortexlabs	i thought my parents called it lol
22:12	mauvebic	screenshots and rivencraft
22:13	vortexlabs	now to test my mod
22:14	VanessaE	I dunno mauvebic.. that constitutes a unauthorized derivative work, I'll have to see if it's okay
22:14	VanessaE	an*
22:15	mauvebic	i know, but no one complains when shit like my linking books get copied two or three times, id call that pretty derivative, while my mod is still being held down
22:16	VanessaE	they've been copied? I wasn't aware
22:16	VanessaE	(I don't read every post ;-) )
22:16	mauvebic	teleport pads came out a week later, another knockoff a week after, and another one yesterday i think
22:17	mauvebic	all of em based on the concept of using signs to store coordinates
22:17	mauvebic	but my mod is still being held down because of textures
22:17	mauvebic	at least my code is original
22:17	mauvebic	that should weight in my favour
22:17	VanessaE	yeah but the others don't use your textures do they?
22:18	VanessaE	your code's WTFPL, so that's okay any way
22:18	mauvebic	okay, so if i put a restrictive license on my locked doors, do you think anyone will seriously respect it?
22:18	khonkhortisan	locked doors are needed
22:18	mauvebic	its like "okay, we'll copy your code and concepts, but your mods' no good because you borrowed textures from another pack for another game"
22:18	VanessaE	probably not too much so, but at least you can then bitch legitimately :-)
22:19	VanessaE	actually your mod is good
22:19	VanessaE	from what I've read
22:19	mauvebic	im not talking about you but you know what i mean :p
22:20	VanessaE	you just need textures that you're allowed to copy/use/distribute
22:20	mauvebic	well i tried contacting the guy from rivencraft when it was first brought up, i never got an answer
22:20	VanessaE	I'm more concerned with what's derived from Riven rather than rivencraft.
22:21	mauvebic	Ok, where was this concern when people were copying tron? a top grossing film many orders of magnitude more valuable than riven
22:21	VanessaE	you can't be rightfully held to a license you didn't know was invalid if e.g. rivencraft turns out to be illegal, but Riven itself is commercial.
22:21	mauvebic	the studio that did Riven tanked i think
22:22	VanessaE	The Tron stuff was all hand-drawn from what I saw, so it doesn't count as a derivative work - those were fine.
22:22	VanessaE	at least under US law, I have no idea what Finnish law says about that stuff.
22:22	mauvebic	well the textures from riven aren't entire screenshots, theyre a 64x64 selection of larger images
22:22	VanessaE	right, so I assumed
22:23	mauvebic	the linking books i changed the images in the book
22:23	mauvebic	but the whole resolution is so blocky how would anyone recognize any specific image
22:24	mauvebic	Anyways, its up to you guys, im always willing to share my code, but i wont share from the shadows. im ready to release locked and passworded doors whenever you guys are :-)
22:25	mauvebic	tbh why we still bother with 2 mod forums
22:25	mauvebic	half the stuff in general could just as well go into Discusion
22:25	mauvebic	i gotta run to the store, bbl :-)
22:26	VanessaE	hm. Br0derbund (now defunct) originally published Riven, Cyan Worlds (still around) made it though.
22:26	VanessaE	so you'd need Cyan World's blessing.
22:27	NakedFury	do whatever you want and ignore the opposition
22:28	mauvebic	anyone know a good lua obfuscator?
22:28	VanessaE	as for two forums, simple: Any idiot could write whatever into a mod release. That's why they go into Modding General
22:28	VanessaE	that way we can weed out the idiots ;-)
22:29	mauvebic	the idiots, are the ones copying code and concepts and slapping on quick hand drawn textures
22:29	mauvebic	and they make it to releases just fine
22:29	mauvebic	things are upside down
22:29	NakedFury	they need to remove the mod tags, they are redundant
22:29	VanessaE	that's because the code is open source and declared as such
22:30	mauvebic	doesnt make it right.
22:30	VanessaE	now don't get me wrong
22:30	VanessaE	what they're doing isn't right either.
22:30	mauvebic	feels like im being bashed over the head with licenses
22:30	vortexlabs	i updated my mod to add compressed mese now, so I'm going to upload it
22:30	mauvebic	my mods get a no because of shitty licensing rules, and with those same rules, other people copy shit and call it original
22:31	mauvebic	fine, ill change my licenses
22:31	VanessaE	but seeing as how there's only like three of us actively moderating the forums, we relaly don't have time to audit every release for copied-but-not-attributed code
22:31	vortexlabs	I only copy source code for refence
22:31	vortexlabs	*referance
22:31	VanessaE	your mods get a 'no' because you're using illegal textures.
22:31	mauvebic	i dont want credit from other modders, i want my mods, the originals, to stand next to theirs on releases, thats all.
22:32	VanessaE	re-render your textures from your own photos and they'll be fine
22:32	VanessaE	even if they look nearly identical to those you were using
22:32	mauvebic	riddle me this, if i dont have a camera, where am i going to find realistic textures that arent "illegal"
22:32	VanessaE	I'll bet you can find enough stuff on wikipedia and wikimedia commons to fill in for the illegitimate images
22:32	VanessaE	that's where most of my photorealistic stuff came from
22:32	VanessaE	the rest, I rendered in Inkscape and GIMP
22:33	mauvebic	i dont do textures, i dont do texture packs, i do code. I bet this is why alot of the original modders left
22:34	VanessaE	well the point is, even the simplest mods usually need at least one texture of some kind.
22:34	NakedFury	should be no problem as long as you dont get money from it
22:34	mauvebic	thats the thing
22:34	mauvebic	no one is making money here
22:34	VanessaE	You have to make it yourself from imagery you either have the legal right to use or which you've rendered or photographed yourself.
22:34	mauvebic	there are no damages to sue for
22:34	VanessaE	wanna bet?
22:34	mauvebic	sue me.
22:34	mauvebic	try.
22:35	mauvebic	i just lost a huge case over a shitty property if you think i take this texture litigation shit seriously at all
22:35	VanessaE	if they wanted to be assholes about it, the Cyan Worlds guys could sue you (and would probably lose) for millions, claiming such things as unfair competition, copyright infringement, etc. and ask for millions in damaged
22:35	VanessaE	damages*
22:35	VanessaE	good luck winning of course, but do you really want to risk that?
22:35	mauvebic	yeah
22:35	NakedFury	I would
22:35	mauvebic	its my risk to take
22:35	VanessaE	(s/winning/them winning/)
22:36	mauvebic	im not new on the internet, or to modding, or webmastering, ive copied plenty of images of the years and ive never even received a takedown email, much less a letter from the court
22:36	mauvebic	and the day i do get a takedown notice, then i'll take it down, until then i wont deprive anyone
22:37	VanessaE	the problem here is you won't be the one to receive such a notice - c55 would.
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22:37	mauvebic	how? its open source
22:37	VanessaE	the code isn't the problem
22:37	mauvebic	he cant be held responsible for what people do with the code once its released
22:37	VanessaE	it's the textures.
22:38	mauvebic	well he's not the one releasing them either
22:38	mauvebic	and a forum isnt considered advertsiing
22:38	mauvebic	i mean we use it as such, but legally, its a public forum
22:39	mauvebic	i wouldn't expect europeans to understand but i'd think in north america we'd have a greater appreciation for deregulation and freedom
22:39	vortexlabs	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=33565#p33565
22:40	vortexlabs	I forgot to add the crafting recipie hang on
22:40	VanessaE	the forum is hosted on finnish soil, and a US-regulated domain name, and they're getting REAL hard-assed about it lately here.
22:40	VanessaE	c55 could very easily lose his domain - under US law - because it ends in .net
22:41	vortexlabs	Actually, flagfox says it's hosted in germany (minetest.net)
22:42	VanessaE	it is? Odd, it's under Finnish law according to the Rules post.
22:42	VanessaE	shrug
22:42	vortexlabs	ah
22:42	vortexlabs	c55.me is hosted in finland though
22:42	mauvebic	in every case, who'd be dumb enough to sue over mods or 64x64 pixels
22:42	vortexlabs	http://geoip.flagfox.net/?ip=212.53.165.52&host=minetest.net
22:43	mauvebic	rivencraft has been up for over a year, no problems there
22:43		vicscandl joined #minetest
22:43		vicscandl joined #minetest
22:43	mauvebic	notch is getting sued, but not for anything he did, just patent trolls
22:43	VanessaE	mauvebic: someone who thought they could have taken your idea and made it into a new commercial product
22:43	VanessaE	yeah so I heard
22:43	VanessaE	over DRM bullshit
22:43	mauvebic	yeah
22:44	mauvebic	so if c55 gets sued, he gets sued, and its not likely to be because of anything you or I released
22:44	VanessaE	I don't like minecraft or notch that much, but that lawsuit is just stupid and baseless
22:44	mauvebic	and if i thought my mods could make a commercial product, id charge for them lol
22:44	VanessaE	haha
22:44	VanessaE	well can you at least try to come up with textures where there's no ambiguity?
22:45	VanessaE	(site:wikipedia.org OR site:wikimedia.org OR site:clker.com) phrase
22:45	mauvebic	the problem is i like playing with them
22:45	mauvebic	my buildings look nice w/ those nodes
22:45	VanessaE	replace "phrase" with your search terms and you're almost guaranteed to find only free textures
22:45	mauvebic	and i couldnt come up with anything as nice
22:45	VanessaE	s/textures/imagery/
22:46	mauvebic	what about fair use?
22:46	mauvebic	how would that fit in, im not familiar
22:47	mauvebic	i cant create new textures from scratch that look as nice, but i could modify them (the ones that arent already)
22:47	VanessaE	fair use is a US-specific thing unfortunately.
22:47	VanessaE	trust me mauvebic, you can make them look as nice. They all came from photos anyway from what I just read
22:47	mauvebic	yeah but photos of riven
22:47	mauvebic	any other picture wont look quite the same :P :(
22:48	vortexlabs	supper
22:48	vortexlabs	i'll idle on here for now
22:48		Fixer left #minetest
22:48	VanessaE	yeah I know
22:49	VanessaE	but they have to be photos or hand-drawn images that weren't derived from the original game or anything derived from that.
22:49	VanessaE	here's the thing:
22:49	mauvebic	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Act_of_Canada
22:49	mauvebic	oups that was sposed to link to fair dealing
22:49	VanessaE	if you went to the same spot the Rivin guys did, on the same day and time, and snapped your own photos of the same object they did, your photos would still be legal because it was your work and not theirs.
22:50	VanessaE	Yeah I know about the Canadian Fair Dealing rule
22:51	VanessaE	under Finnish law though, there's no fair use/fair dealing law :(
22:51	mauvebic	im not finnish
22:51	mauvebic	as the originator, id be held liable under cdn law
22:51	VanessaE	the forum is, and that's the law that applies here.
22:51	mauvebic	hell even the germans wont deport their own
22:51	VanessaE	but the domain is a US domain
22:51	mauvebic	*extradite
22:51	VanessaE	and the server is on German soil I guess,
22:52	VanessaE	so you'd have to comply with all four sets of laws :D
22:52	mauvebic	youd think they have enough problems to deal with over there in between asking us for bailouts
22:52	VanessaE	yup I know
22:52	VanessaE	but this is all private industry stuff - civil laws
22:53	VanessaE	so the governments could be perfect in all countries and this would still exist in some manner :-)
22:53	VanessaE	so how many texture files came from a source you don't know for sure you have the rights to?
22:54	mauvebic	in riven? half are screens the other half were ported
22:54	mauvebic	though C55's big deal wasnt the ones from riven but the ones from rivencraft
22:54	mauvebic	so basically, the management wants me to get rid of all my textures to satisfy
22:54	mauvebic	brb
22:54	VanessaE	no, just replace them with something you definitely have the rights to
22:55	mauvebic	at this point im simply thinking of setting up a mod site, quicker and easier than the alt.
22:56	mauvebic	ok ill be back in a bit, need groceries
22:56	VanessaE	ok
22:59	SmugLeaf	dicks
23:01	VanessaE	blame the out-of-control copyright industry :(
23:01	VanessaE	afaic, a work should not retain exclusive copyright (as in illegal to copy) beyond 10 or 15 years.
23:05	mauvebic	i cant wait for the next big crash to knock out potential litigants out of business lol
23:05	VanessaE	heh
23:05	VanessaE	http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a4/Rust_on_iron.jpg/310px-Rust_on_iron.jpg
23:05	VanessaE	desaturate that and there's your door texture
23:06	mauvebic	humanity's become more concerned with collecting rent on everything than actually creating anything of value
23:06	VanessaE	(the one with the pentacle on it)
23:06	mauvebic	well the door came from rivencraft, not riven, so? okay, not okay?
23:06	VanessaE	wait, wrong link
23:06	VanessaE	http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a4/Rust_on_iron.jpg
23:06	VanessaE	THAT one.
23:07	VanessaE	the door came from rivencraft, but rivencraft got it from Riven, and the rivencraft guys haven't made their license clear, so even fi they didn't get it from Riven, you probably can't use it
23:08	mauvebic	i dont get how a paid game can get away with this shit but here we got our hands tied behind our backs
23:08	mauvebic	youd think if they sued someone theyd sue rivencraft first, they got more players
23:09	VanessaE	because rivencraft isn't a paid game :-)
23:09	mauvebic	no, minecraft is a paid game
23:09	mauvebic	theres a better argument for damages there
23:09	mauvebic	than there is here
23:09	VanessaE	yeah but that's not minecraft, it's just a mod/texpack or whatever they call them
23:10	mauvebic	rivencraft arguably brings paying players to MC
23:10	mauvebic	you cant even say that about minetest or riventest
23:10		q66 joined #minetest
23:10	VanessaE	yeah but it's still a mod (etc) and thus someone else's code
23:11	VanessaE	but that's neither here nor there
23:11	VanessaE	let's work on your copyright, see if we can weed out the non-free imagery
23:11	mauvebic	ok, but then you say C55 could be held responsible because of me... which one is it, someone else code or not?
23:12	VanessaE	he could, in theory, because it would be on pages he manages. He'd have to comply with any takedown notices sent to him, and any court orders issued to attempt to determine your identity
23:12	VanessaE	remote chance, to be sure
23:13	VanessaE	and if he doesn't comply fast enough, then he would be on the hook
23:13	mauvebic	id give them my adress myself, they cant gain anything by sueing me lol
23:13	VanessaE	haha
23:13	mauvebic	naw seriously
23:13	mauvebic	bankruptcy protection
23:13	VanessaE	well I'm pretty much sue-proof also (being disabled) but I still try to be extra careful
23:14	mauvebic	well when you dont have any money to take, they wont waste theirs on lawyers for nothing
23:14	mauvebic	spock would agree
23:14	VanessaE	wanna bet?
23:14		Joschasa left #minetest
23:14	mauvebic	why would they bother sueing someone they know cant pay up?
23:14	VanessaE	they've sued children before
23:14	VanessaE	as in single-digit ages
23:14	VanessaE	I think once they sued a newborn
23:15	mauvebic	hows that legally possible? crimes arent inherited
23:15	VanessaE	of course the suit was later dropped, but not before it cost both sides at least some money
23:15	VanessaE	nonono
23:15	mauvebic	civil stuff can be inherited?
23:15	VanessaE	sued claiming those children, including the newborn, are directly at fault
23:15	VanessaE	as in somehow a newborn logged into a computer, downloaded Kazaa or whatever, and started downloading :-()
23:15	VanessaE	:-0
23:15	VanessaE	:-)
23:16	mauvebic	i have 2 TB of stuff i wouldnt want those people seeing lol
23:16	VanessaE	haha
23:16	mauvebic	including every episode of startrek ever made lol
23:17	VanessaE	sendmail copyrightparamount.net -subject "Copyright violation". .... ..
23:17	VanessaE	;-)
23:17	mauvebic	please, they know most cant get the box sets in most other countries
23:17	VanessaE	ok lets get back to this for a sec
23:18	mauvebic	in the states they take it more seriously because theres no excuse, you have these huge shopping centers and youre the first to get everything
23:18	VanessaE	that rust texture is so big you could crop it apart into multiple, unique rust textures, desaturate and color-shift as needed, and that will handle everything that's rusty
23:19	VanessaE	http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/97/Taospueblo003.jpg
23:19	VanessaE	sandstone texture, apparently the very source or one exactly like it that went into Riven
23:20	VanessaE	next? :-)
23:21	VanessaE	you don't have to change your node shapes by the way - they can't claim copyright on a silhouette.\
23:21	mauvebic	id basically have to retexture the whole thing but tbh id rather just list it elsewhere
23:21	VanessaE	aw come on
23:21	VanessaE	you'll feel better inside ;-)
23:21	VanessaE	and you can claim it to be 100% your own work
23:22	mauvebic	people know what im about, the code
23:22	VanessaE	sure but a mod is more than just the code
23:22	mauvebic	if i have to post it elsewhere in protest over unfair rules and being subject to the laws of four different nations, thats what i should do
23:23	mauvebic	until people calm down and realize its just a game,
23:23	VanessaE	actually five - c55 says the registrar is in Russia or something ;-)
23:23	mauvebic	well look, i cant move around from country to country when i need go paying work, so i wont consider myself subject to their laws
23:23	VanessaE	so you have to create and upload it under Canad...hm..wait a sec
23:23	VanessaE	there is a loophole here.
23:24	mauvebic	the loophole is our own fair use law
23:24	VanessaE	US law declared recently that merely linking to a file does not constitute re-publishing
23:24	mauvebic	and ompldr has no registration details
23:24	VanessaE	so if you can host your mod and all files related to it on a Canadian site with a Canadian domain, you're safe
23:24	VanessaE	and I can publish it.
23:24	VanessaE	s/publish/move/
23:24	mauvebic	so what i need is a canadian file sharer?
23:24	VanessaE	yes
23:25	mauvebic	is that all? daaaaamn we coulda saved alot of trouble
23:25	mauvebic	:-)
23:25	VanessaE	they must be on Canadian soil, with a Canadian registrar, and a Canadian domain
23:25	VanessaE	then you and c55 are both safe.
23:25	mauvebic	sweet
23:26	mauvebic	i dont wanna cause trouble for him but i wanna keep my nodes, i mostly only build with those lol
23:26	VanessaE	IANAL of course, but this is your best net.
23:27	mauvebic	found a nice list :-) http://theheatweb.com/great-list-free-file-hosting-sites/
23:27	VanessaE	wait a sec...where's github located?
23:27	VanessaE	aren't they cabnucks?
23:27	VanessaE	Canucks
23:28	mauvebic	github or gittorius i think
23:28	mauvebic	either would do
23:28	VanessaE	checking
23:28	mauvebic	how do you "lookup" a site/service for that kind of info?
23:29	VanessaE	not sure - normally a whois will get you part way
23:30	VanessaE	but then you're left doing your own research, calling people, sending emails, etc.
23:31	VanessaE	damn, github is in San Fran
23:32	VanessaE	gitorious is hosted at Rackspace, which has data centers in the US, UK, and China
23:32	VanessaE	so that's out
23:33	mauvebic	damn
23:33	mauvebic	was asking them on irc
23:34	mauvebic	i suppose making a 5mb torrent is equally ridiculous lol
23:34	mauvebic	id have to be online all the time lol
23:34	VanessaE	hah yeah
23:35	mauvebic	well i think ill just sit on the doors for now, i got a two or three post-its of things to do w/ my other mods lol
23:35	mauvebic	ill keep my eyes open for a cdn host
23:35	mauvebic	but with "the cloud" its hard to tell where people host their actual servers these dayslol
23:36	VanessaE	looks like ompldr is safe enough
23:36	VanessaE	not canadian, but strongly disclaims any care regarding content etc.
23:36	mauvebic	well thats where it is now
23:36	VanessaE	it is?
23:37	mauvebic	any site that doesnt ask for registration info will disavow responsibility for any content found on it (and ive found some funky things on ompldr) lol
23:37	mauvebic	yeah
23:37	VanessaE	ok, link to your post
23:37	mauvebic	only one of my mods was hosted from filedropped the one day ompldr was down
23:37	mauvebic	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=2399
23:38	VanessaE	ok. Get your new release together that you mentioned and update your first post and subject and then I'll move it
23:38	mauvebic	i just need to bronzify the 3rd gate and im done :-)
23:38	VanessaE	and texture license will have to be WTFPL, so change that to "WTFPL (applies to all parts)
23:39	mauvebic	i thought i already fixed that lol
23:39	mauvebic	too many mod/modthreads lol
23:39	mauvebic	seen my sig lately? lol
23:39	VanessaE	haha
23:39	mauvebic	aiight gimme 15mins to fixup the textures for the pword gate and im done :-)
23:40	VanessaE	seen mine btw? I'm starting to have too much as well ;-)
23:40	VanessaE	only reason I don't list more mods is I'm too close to the 400 char limit :-)
23:40	mauvebic	tip: use goggle url shortening, can fit more links in your sigg :P
23:41	VanessaE	I use bitly actually
23:41	VanessaE	close enough though
23:41	mauvebic	works too lol
23:42	mauvebic	we should have a texture request forum/thread thingie
23:42	mauvebic	where people who like making them can submit them for people like me who are too lazy to make them lol
23:43	VanessaE	we do have one I thinkj
23:43	mauvebic	theres one for the nodeboxes, thats pretty cool
23:44	VanessaE	there is a texture requests thread here somwehere
23:44	mauvebic	ah shit i even have a staircase mod i forgot to release
23:44	mauvebic	yeah i think on page 5-6 now :s and i think it was deathdealers' so i avoided it lol haha
23:44	VanessaE	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?id=1585
23:44	VanessaE	there it is
23:44	VanessaE	yeah I saw those stairs - nice work!
23:44	mauvebic	aaaah in texture packs
23:45	mauvebic	thx, you can use the nodebox model afterwards to make those stairs with ur textures
23:45	mauvebic	i like the empty-underneath look to them lol
23:45	mauvebic	like basement stairs (unifinished basements)
23:51	mauvebic	http://www.zimg.eu/i/2585862407 bronze to differentiate from the userlock gates :-)
23:52	VanessaE	not bad.. what's it look like in daylight?
23:53	mauvebic	hmm yeah hard to tell with that light
23:53	mauvebic	its a sortof orangy/bronze/copper finish
23:53	VanessaE	well /time 7000 and take a new screenshot :-)
23:54	mauvebic	that pic was in daylight, but were in a sphere within a sphere :P
23:54	VanessaE	oh heh
23:54	VanessaE	ok, place a shitload of torches across from it ;-)
23:56	vortexlabs	back
23:56	VanessaE	wb
23:56	vortexlabs	thanks
23:57	vortexlabs	http://minetest.net/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=33565
23:58		SpeedProg1 joined #minetest
23:58	vortexlabs	I'm going to make a new mod, it's a secret for now
23:58	mauvebic	updated thread :-) you could try the door by commenting out everything else

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