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IRC log for #minetest-hub, 2019-03-06

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:03 Fixer o.O
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01:09 GreenDimond So someone is trying to use my waffle mod on Windows and it cant find the modpath with \mods\waffles/nodes.lua
01:09 GreenDimond I dont remember mods being fundamentally broken on Windows
01:14 GreenDimond Actually the user didnt copy something right
01:14 GreenDimond sheesh
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01:56 kaeza !next
01:56 MinetestBot Another satisfied customer. Next!
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03:56 sofar kewl flathub gave me write access to net.minetest.Minetest flatpak
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05:05 ANAND 5.0.0 is finally out! :D
05:05 ANAND Yay!
05:09 paramat and broken! :D
05:28 ANAND lol
05:31 ANAND At least it was released :)
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08:46 nerzhul ANAND we have a big problem with detached inventories
08:47 nerzhul we will need a urgent fix with another network breakage to fix it. Large entities are not working anymore due to a behaviour change
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09:18 jas_ !mod
09:18 MinetestBot jas_: Prevent new accounts from joining [nonew] by taikedz - https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?t=19720
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11:56 ANAND nerzhul: That's bad. Hope these are fixed soon. Good luck! :)
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12:51 IhrFussel Critical inventory bug in 5.0.0 nice...exactly why I think it's too risky to update just yet
12:52 sfan5 too risky? will your server catch fire?
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13:17 IhrFussel You have no clue how CRITICAL it is for a production server to be full of bugs
13:17 IhrFussel At least I would feel ASHAMED for offering such a service
13:18 rubenwardy you must feel ashamed then
13:19 IhrFussel No, my server still runs with 0.4.17.1 and I can pretty much assure there that my server runs for at least 24 hours without any major bugs or crashes
13:20 IhrFussel Since my server relies heavily on entity eggs this would cost me many users now IF I upgraded
13:20 IhrFussel I want to offer a stable experience to my users... no matter what view you have
13:21 rubenwardy my server has been running since the release with no crashes
13:21 IhrFussel I already know the mentality of many in here so no surprise to me that you don't care about the people who play on your servers
13:21 sfan5 IhrFussel: maybe if the community actually fucking tested release candidates this would not have happened
13:21 sfan5 there was two weeks to test shit
13:21 sfan5 but nobody did
13:22 sfan5 on release day: oh look here is a trivial bug
13:22 sfan5 NO FUCKING SHIT
13:22 rubenwardy ^
13:22 rubenwardy IhrFussel: https://i.rubenwardy.com/nlmSy.png
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13:22 IhrFussel Production servers are not made for testing RC ... I am working pretty much fulltime on my server
13:22 rubenwardy no crashes
13:22 rubenwardy consistently half the users
13:22 rubenwardy yellow=5.0,  green=0.4.17
13:23 IhrFussel Our community is simply too small to extensively test RCs I'd say
13:23 sfan5 of course it takes time
13:23 sfan5 but you don't need to move your server over or anything
13:23 sfan5 you make a copy, update all your mods and check if it works
13:24 IhrFussel Most users on servers don't even know what 'Minetest' is cause their app makes them believe they play 'Multicraft' or 'Exploration: Lite' or 'WorldCraft 3D'
13:25 IhrFussel I myself found out about Minetest via an app called 'Worldcraft 2' ... when I researched how to create a server I suddenly found 'Minetest engine' and looked it up
13:27 IhrFussel Such tasks are probably better for servers that have less intensive mods and code running
13:27 IhrFussel Or servers that have everything packed as game/modpack
13:27 rubenwardy you *should* have everything packed a game
13:27 rubenwardy it's a good way to manage it
13:27 IhrFussel On my machine mods interact with shell scripts which interact with PHP which interacts with DBs which interact with MT
13:28 rubenwardy even if you never distribute it
13:28 rubenwardy that's disgusting
13:28 rubenwardy but... there's docker for that
13:28 rubenwardy do you develop live on the server?
13:28 IhrFussel Yes
13:28 rubenwardy ew
13:29 sfan5 putting a mess into a container does not make it better
13:29 rubenwardy <IhrFussel> You have no clue how CRITICAL it is for a production server to be full of bugs
13:29 rubenwardy sfan5: that is true
13:29 IhrFussel Sometimes the server will be down for a bit cause of a critical bug...but I find it fast and fix it
13:29 rubenwardy but it at least makes it easier to have the same environment
13:29 rubenwardy but ideally you wouldn't have this insecure mess
13:30 IhrFussel I don't think it's insecure...I simply have a chat bot running in the background that listens to certain commands from the MT chat log and executes stuff based on those ... you cannot run $(rm -rf /) or something like that
13:31 rubenwardy you literally had a remote execution vulnerability a year ago
13:31 IhrFussel That was a missing check on my website
13:31 IhrFussel Can happen to anybody
13:32 IhrFussel I developed my site from scratch...others use CSMs or wordpress etc
13:32 rubenwardy It can't happen to anybody, because sane people don't use user input as a parameter to a shell command
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13:32 rubenwardy having a shell vulnerability like that is like having an SQL vulnerability
13:33 rubenwardy *SQL injection
13:33 rubenwardy it only happens when you misuse technology
13:33 IhrFussel I replaced those calls too... Basically I used shell_exec("cat ...") before and now I use file_get_contents()
13:34 IhrFussel For some reason I though file_get_contents() would not work for my specific case but later I realized I was wrong
13:34 IhrFussel SQL injection happen lots of times every day
13:34 IhrFussel Mostly cause of websites with outdated CSMs
13:35 IhrFussel CMS*
13:35 rubenwardy ContentDB doesn't have any sql injections, and never will
13:36 IhrFussel I'm talking about people who have no clue about coding and just install any CMS they like onto their webspace and never update it
13:36 rubenwardy how did we even get here, lol
13:38 IhrFussel Many people also don't advise to upgrade for example Ubuntu to the newest LTS at launch cause of possible critical bugs that could potentially harm your services
13:39 rubenwardy -------
13:39 rubenwardy anyone good with nginx?
13:39 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> Hi! I'm using nginx as a reverse proxy, and I'm using a proxy cache. Urls with no query strings are cached fine, but as soon as I add a query param it misses the cache every time
13:39 rubenwardy <rubenwardy> https://paste.ngx.cc/14
13:40 rubenwardy (this is why ContentDB loads slowly)
13:45 rubenwardy (#nginx doesn't help)
13:46 IhrFussel Wait YT runs on lighttpd I read?
13:46 rubenwardy I imagine YT runs on a lot of things
13:46 rubenwardy cloud computing is dark magic
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14:41 Calinou its backend is said to run on Python 2 too
14:42 Calinou rubenwardy: I believe URLs with query strings are never cached for robustness reasons, not sure if you can change that behavior
14:42 Calinou (or at least, not by default)
14:42 rubenwardy sadness
14:43 rubenwardy application-level caching then :'(
14:43 Calinou https://stackoverflow.com/questions/850187/caching-from-urls-with-a-query-string
14:43 Calinou maybe you can find a setting to change that, but I'm not sure
14:43 Calinou where are you using query strings (and what for)?
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14:44 rubenwardy https://content.minetest.net/api/packages/?type=game&amp;type=mod&amp;type=txp&amp;hide=nonfree&amp;hide=desktop_default&amp;protocol_version=37
14:45 Calinou I see… implementing things like Redis is quite common in this case
14:45 IhrFussel luk3yx, can you tell us what the vulnerability is about WITHOUT giving away any code/tutorials on how to do it? I (and many other server owners likely) would like to know which parts of MT the vulnerebility affects exactly
14:45 Calinou or can nginx's built-in caching handle this? (is it proxy caching or something else?)
14:45 rubenwardy IhrFussel: something to do with log integrity
14:46 Calinou https://www.nginx.com/blog/nginx-high-performance-caching/#MechanicsofHTTPCaching
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14:48 IhrFussel So modified clients that abuse it are able to supress log entries server side?
14:48 Calinou maybe you could tweak proxy_cache_key?
14:51 Calinou rubenwardy: also this is why I'm skeptical of microframeworks, but that's just me :) Anyway, what's done is done
14:51 Calinou (for any sizeable project, that is)
14:52 rubenwardy probably
14:53 rubenwardy maybe I should try actually returning cache headers from the API directly
14:54 rubenwardy proxy_cache_key should already include the query as args
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15:45 Fixer nah, cdb is fine for me
15:51 rubenwardy uncached --> 1.94s,   cached --> 0.364s
15:52 rubenwardy wait, maybe it is caching
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16:19 IhrFussel Core devs: Are you serious about adding a HACK to fix the inventory problem instead of fixinf it correctly (nerzhul's way) JUST because 5.0.0 released yesterday and you want to assure backwards compatibility with something that's not even 48 hours old?
16:19 IhrFussel Fix it PROPERLY
16:19 IhrFussel I'm seriously losing faith in some of you
16:19 IhrFussel was kicked by rubenwardy: kick
16:20 rubenwardy oh, did I do that outloud
16:20 jas_ :)
16:21 jas_ reminder, do not lose faitrh
16:28 rubenwardy lol, I think I've angered him
16:29 * Fixer breathes heavily
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16:30 rubenwardy IhrFussel: sorry, that kick was impulse and not really warranted
16:30 IhrFussel If anyone ever ask me about 5.0.0 I will tell them that devs didn't care much abouzt releasing it in a good state...that's a fact
16:30 jas_ that's your impression
16:30 jas_ your perception
16:30 jas_ your opinion
16:30 rubenwardy the problem is that no one really tests it
16:31 rubenwardy like, I had CTF running on it for months
16:31 rubenwardy some people did join to test =
16:31 sfan5 >community doesn't help testing
16:31 sfan5 >it's the devs fault
16:31 sfan5 🤔
16:31 rubenwardy but this bug doesn't happen on CTF, because I don't have very many ndoes
16:31 rubenwardy also, VanessaE's servers have had 5.0.0 since rc1
16:31 rubenwardy and some of them are creative
16:31 IhrFussel I'm talking about adding hacky solutions instead of fixing code properly... adding hacks is never a proper way to do things
16:31 rubenwardy I guess UI does creative differently?
16:31 rubenwardy IhrFussel: the hacky solution works the exact same way as 0.4.17.1
16:32 rubenwardy in 0.4.17.1, this string was a raw string which had no length encoding
16:32 jas_ and breaking network compat twice in two days is not an easy decision.  nor has the decision been made yet.
16:32 jas_ (well)
16:32 rubenwardy this solution adds a length encoding to still support 5.0.0, but ignores it to have the same affect as 0.4.17
16:32 jas_ 6.0.0 ftw!!!
16:32 IhrFussel That's like realizing a mistake and acting like it never happened
16:32 Fixer daily reminder: fuck dropbox
16:33 sfan5 IhrFussel: if you had downloaded 5.0.0 yesterday and found no problems with your setup, what would you say if there was 6.0.0 today which is (again!) incompatible with your version?
16:33 Fixer whatever dick desided to ruin millions of dropbox links should burn in ISIS camp
16:33 jas_ rough
16:33 jas_ i think they just call it IS now
16:33 Fixer and his family sent to North Korea labor camp
16:33 IhrFussel Who says that a network brakage after less than 48 hours HAS TO bump the first digit? Where does it state that? This is essentially still 5.0.0 release
16:34 sfan5 the versioning scheme says that
16:34 rubenwardy ^
16:35 sfan5 besides, you want to tell users that the 5.0.0 they downloaded yesterday is not "real" and that they need to download a new one today?
16:35 Fixer yeah, it had critical bug
16:35 IhrFussel That sounds just silly to me... if there is a critical network bug in my 1.0.0 software I can of course fix it without bumping to 2.0.0 within a few days
16:35 Fixer do 5.0.1 or smth
16:35 sfan5 you can do so if your versioning scheme allows you to
16:35 rubenwardy 5.0.0 still works perfectly fine on server like CTF which don't have large inventories
16:36 jas_ i think there's some features planned for 6.0.0 that break compat anyway?  so a hack now and a proper fix later makes sense in that regard, i think.
16:36 rubenwardy my patch makes it act like 0.4.17.1 on 5.0.1+ client/server pairs
16:36 rubenwardy and it acts no worse than 5.0.0 on 5.x mismatches
16:36 rubenwardy and it acts no worse than 5.0.0 when one of the client or server is 5.0.0
16:36 jas_ and "hack" is a poor choice of word here, it's a fix really, just a temp fix.
16:37 IhrFussel But suddenly hacks are FINE in the engine...a few months ago you said hacks don't belong into PRs
16:37 jas_ yeah poor choice of wording sorry
16:37 jas_ but it's a temporary fix, heh
16:37 jas_ i don't think it's worth getting too upset about tho
16:37 rubenwardy It's not really a hack
16:37 jas_ 5.0.0 is a fine release
16:38 jas_ it's too bad you couldn't have tested it on the dev version, or release candidates
16:39 IhrFussel Not every server uses items with lots of meta... I think it requires quite a few books/mob eggs/other items with meta to actually happen
16:39 rubenwardy we should probably require devs to test using dreambuilder
16:39 rubenwardy as much as I'd hate that
16:39 rubenwardy although actually, this bug doesn't happen using dreambuilder as dreambuilder includes UI
16:39 rubenwardy which is presumably exempt from this
16:40 jas_ in the future i'm sure testing for loads and loads of nodes will be a requisite
16:40 IhrFussel I think 1 mob egg from Mobs Redo stores several hundred bytes of 'self' values
16:41 jas_ anyway, "shit happens"
16:43 IhrFussel I'm guessing more and more bugs will surface the more servers upgrade
16:43 sofar you can't just load dreambuilder - it won't exercise much of the actual code paths
16:43 sofar that's the problem I have with minetest-mods
16:43 sofar almost all mods load fine on 5.0.0
16:43 IhrFussel Cause the RC wasn't tested in actual production environments at all AFAIK
16:43 sofar but I didn't actually place any nodes or use any recipes of the mods
16:44 sofar I tested the RCs against ITB
16:44 jas_ vannesa's servers, too
16:44 jas_ vanessa*
16:44 IhrFussel Not sure how many users your server got but actual 'stress tests' would be on popular servers with 10+ players online mostly
16:44 jas_ yeah, vanessa's, plus that thailand one had loads of users
16:44 jas_ where were you?
16:44 sofar ITB has no stress
16:45 sofar either box loading and editing works or it doesn't
16:45 IhrFussel There are many things that could break only when many users are online... or some memory leak that is only visible with many players connected
16:46 IhrFussel Maybe race conditions that only happen the more players do something at the same time and will basically never happen with just 1 or 2
16:47 sofar so you're volunteering to test that, then
16:48 jas_ also, when vanessa tested (thank you!) they found a big network slow-down problem that was fixed during a release candidate
16:48 rubenwardy the 5.0-rcX server for CTF had 5+ players on at time
16:48 IhrFussel My suggestion for the next major breaking release would be to make an official testing server running with the RC
16:48 IhrFussel Let it run for 1 week at least
16:48 sofar great! Looking forward to you doing that, that would be fantastic
16:49 IhrFussel I thought rather of someone who doesn't already run/pay for servers
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16:50 sofar listen, you, IhrFussel, are an engaged and committed community member
16:50 sofar if YOU can't help out, who can?
16:50 IhrFussel Renting a VPS for 1 month for $5 or so should be doable
16:50 rubenwardy problem is you need a wide range of testing
16:50 rubenwardy this bug does not happen in MTG
16:50 rubenwardy or in CTF
16:50 sofar everyone should step up, and we did
16:50 rubenwardy only when you have mods instqalled
16:51 rubenwardy so an official server would not help with this
16:51 sofar and it's server owners that are exposed to that scenario
16:51 IhrFussel Then that RC server should maybe have multiple instances... one running with vanilla MTG another running another popular but heavy game
16:52 jas_ "in a perfect world"
16:53 IhrFussel The actual problem is that barely anyone can/wants to test the RC ... many users in the forum for example are actually young kids that don't necessarily know how to download/install the RC
16:53 sofar no
16:53 sofar the actual problem is that capable people don't step up
16:53 sofar like you
16:54 sofar I ran a random 5.0.0 test server for 2 weeks or so
16:55 sofar tested ITB with 5.0 thoroughly
16:55 Calinou I was busy updating my mods so I couldn't test 5.0.0, sorry :(
16:55 rubenwardy CTF 5.0.0 was running for more than a month
16:55 Calinou (now I need to make sure they work well with 5.0.0 :P)
16:55 sofar tried to help out with minetest-mods and getting most 5.0.0 ready
16:55 rubenwardy VanessaE's updated as soon as rc1 came up
16:55 sofar send several PRs in the last month
16:55 sofar rebased urgent mtg fixes even last night for paramat
16:56 sofar please stop complaining and start helping
16:56 * sofar goes to get coffee
16:56 VanessaE I haven't had but one or two instances of 5.0.0 incompatibility on my servers, which I've mostly corrected
16:56 VanessaE still need to make a new DB release though.
17:02 IhrFussel I already mentioned earlier that I am working fulltime on my own server to optimize and improve it... I'm too busy to test the RC...and my playerbase might not be enough to actually test it... servers with many players should test the RC cause they have a much bigger audience
17:03 jas_ let us move forward, somehow
17:03 IhrFussel Servers that disallow the people with random names should be more important to test it cause those definitely have users who know about 'Minetest'
17:04 IhrFussel I don't think I'm much of help... I admit that the vast majority of my active players actually uses a 3rd-party app to play
17:05 IhrFussel Without those my server would be pretty dead
17:06 IhrFussel That probably applies to all servers who don't restrict these app users
17:06 IhrFussel that don't*
17:06 VanessaE so, I guess I should update my server build to 5.0.0-release, right?  or should I wait?
17:06 rubenwardy I'd wait for 5.0.1
17:06 VanessaE ok.
17:07 rubenwardy should be today or tomorrow
17:07 rubenwardy depends on when we resolve this argument :D
17:07 VanessaE I missed most of the current argument :P
17:07 jas_ i never restrict users, but it doesn't apply to me.  my servers have been dead since the network compat breakage, and it's been so peaceful
17:07 VanessaE rubenwardy: has a fix for the VM lighting segfault been pushed yet?
17:07 sfan5 VanessaE: depends, do your mods plan to put 2000+ items in a single inventory?
17:08 rubenwardy VanessaE: oh, have you reproduced it?
17:08 sfan5 rubenwardy: while the opportunity is here, it'd be nice to fix a few other bugs
17:08 sfan5 like the one just mentioned
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17:08 VanessaE rubenwardy: I should hope I did -- I *filed* it. :)
17:08 sfan5 so 5.0.1 might not necessarily come today/tomorrow
17:08 rubenwardy that is true
17:08 rubenwardy if we decide against nerzhul's approach, there's no reason that it has to be today or tomorrow
17:08 VanessaE there's still one mod somewhere in DB that is triggering, but I can't find it without a proper lua crash report/backtrace.
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17:09 rubenwardy VanessaE: https://i.rubenwardy.com/RzMev.png
17:09 rubenwardy is this the same bug?
17:10 VanessaE sfan5: as for 2000+ items in an inv I assume you do not simply mean 32 slots with enough full stacks to exceed 2000 total?
17:10 VanessaE rubenwardy: no.
17:10 jas_ like 2,000+ registered items
17:10 jas_ in a single list
17:10 jas_ (unique items)
17:11 VanessaE rubenwardy: I mean this, https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/8220
17:11 VanessaE (and since it's still open, obviously the answer to my question is "no" :P )
17:12 VanessaE jas_: I suppose not.  I don't have many mods that even create detached inventories as far as I know.
17:12 rubenwardy here's the player count on my servers: https://i.rubenwardy.com/T40js.png
17:12 VanessaE (most inventories are part of some node, ala chests)
17:13 jas_ creative server creates a detached inventory
17:13 rubenwardy the 5.0.0 server has been pretty ok
17:13 jas_ setting*
17:13 VanessaE rubenwardy: https://daconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/stats-daily.html
17:13 rubenwardy because most of the regulars moved over
17:15 sofar VanessaE: when did you switch to 5.0? wed 10:00?
17:16 VanessaE sofar: Feb 4 I think.  that break on wednesday was migrating to a new box.
17:16 sofar yeah, looks like a reboot of some sorts
17:16 VanessaE er, on thursday
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17:17 sofar flatpak now has net.minetest.Minetest - 5.0.0 on flathub
17:18 VanessaE the new box has fewer cores and only has spinning rust, so the morning reboot and the mapper each take about 3x as long.. but live use is not appreciably slower because single-core speed is faster.
17:19 VanessaE (leaftest rendering of a map is slllllooooooooowwwwww presumably because it reads the entire map database instead of just the parts it needs to render)
17:19 rubenwardy it's because it renders multiple zoom levels
17:20 rubenwardy and it probably doesn't down size, idk
17:20 VanessaE rubenwardy: you sure?  it's clearly disk-IO-bound.
17:21 VanessaE though I do need to see if I can render the overviews to ramdisk and dump them out when finished.
17:22 VanessaE hm..  1.1 GB for all of the overview maps.  yeah, should be no prob.
17:30 jas_ does a minimum protocol version bump break network compat?
17:30 jas_ or only if `enable_strict_protocol_version_check' is true?
17:30 jas_ (or whatever that setting is... `strict_protocol_version_checking'
17:31 rubenwardy yes
17:31 jas_ i see, thank you
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18:59 IhrFussel Android: Trying to start a world with 'Minetest Life' game crashes the whole app ... inventory bug too?
19:02 IhrFussel Missing files in game it seems...but why does the app crash there?
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19:20 IhrFussel Auto JUmp only works when walking forward...is this intended?
19:21 sfan5 I think it is
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19:36 IhrFussel Can I check anywhere which MT versions corresponds to what protocol version?
19:37 IhrFussel In particular 0.4.11 - 0.4.15 is interesting
19:37 rubenwardy 32 = 0.4.16 - 17
19:37 rubenwardy 37 = 5.0.0
19:37 rubenwardy (from memory)
19:37 rubenwardy oh
19:37 IhrFussel I know that much... but below is more complex
19:38 rubenwardy and you can check using github by viewing the file and selecting tags
19:39 rubenwardy https://i.rubenwardy.com/Apr83.png
19:39 rubenwardy https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/network/networkprotocol.h#L199
19:40 rubenwardy as in, you'd want to change the drop down in the screenshot
19:40 rubenwardy then view the line in the link
19:40 rubenwardy #define LATEST_PROTOCOL_VERSION 37
19:42 IhrFussel 0.4.11 didn't have that file?
19:43 IhrFussel Leads me to 404 page
19:43 sfan5 it was moved at some point
19:43 sfan5 try changing src/network/ -> src/
19:45 IhrFussel 0.4.11 src has no 'networkprotocol.h'
19:47 sfan5 well no idea where it is then
19:48 IhrFussel But 0.4.11 must be version 24 since that's the minimum 0.4.X servers support
19:48 IhrFussel Default minimum*
19:55 IhrFussel 0.4.13 added the file...it was not there before it seems
19:55 IhrFussel 0.4.13 is 26
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20:02 IhrFussel 0.4.14 is 27, 0.4.15 is 28 ... 29/30/31 are dev-only prot versions as are 33/34/35/36
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20:04 IhrFussel With this info and my logging of protocol version when players join I was able to get a list of recent unique users for my server
20:04 IhrFussel MT Version Stats (users from recent days): 523 used 0.4.16/0.4.17(.1), 42 used 0.4.15, 2731 used 0.4.14 and 4 used <= 0.4.13
20:05 IhrFussel 0.4.14 is by FAR the most used version by 3rd-party apps
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20:07 IhrFussel Judging by this it might take a long time until they upgrade to 5.0.X
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20:36 lumberJ sneak peak: http://i.imgur.com/0Q4AQK1.png
20:37 lumberJ just want to take this opportunity to say to the core devs, 1st congrats on the 5.0.0 release and 2nd thanks for what you do. Having a blast working on this and it wouldn't be possible without all the work you all do
20:38 Fixer nice
20:39 lumberJ i see you all taking a disproportionate amount of static for this and that missing feature or bug, but even in the few years i've been enjoying minetest, i've seen it improve by leaps and bounds. just want to let you all know a silent majority really enjoys your work
20:57 rubenwardy IhrFussel: CTF4 only allows 0.4.16 and above to connect
20:57 rubenwardy I thin
20:57 rubenwardy it's probably worth compairing the average hours of those users
20:57 rubenwardy like, do they just disconnect because their phones are too slow
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21:24 sofar ITB only allows 0.4.16+ as well
21:24 sofar several key features are missing for older clients
21:28 rubenwardy CTF also has players, though
21:28 rubenwardy :)
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21:32 VanessaE *gasp*
21:32 VanessaE ok I may have it..
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21:33 VanessaE #1234
21:33 * VanessaE pokes ShadowBot
21:34 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1234 -- Client side caching of mapblocks
21:36 luk3yx #1024
21:36 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1024 -- Shaders rework. by RealBadAngel
21:39 Emerald2 Ooooh shots fired, ruben.
21:40 * VanessaE looks around for the shooter :P
21:41 sofar I don't mind, CTF is a great server, and I spend hours awake at night trying to come up with ideas to attract the same order of players (not to ITB, but something else)
21:42 rubenwardy my point was that CTF limits the MT version already and still has players
21:42 rubenwardy ITB is pretty good imo
21:43 sofar well, my point was that even for low population servers like ITB, limiting clients doesn't seem to hurt much
21:46 rubenwardy oh fair
21:46 rubenwardy I guess that's a good point
21:46 rubenwardy but, an interesting thing is that most of the regulars have already updated to 5.0.0
21:46 rubenwardy the problem is not the regulars, but those on 3rd party apps - especially those on iOS
21:46 sofar yeah, I saw the serverlist
21:48 sofar 6234820 seconds played to complete 16839 boxes = average time to complete a box = 6mins10secs
21:48 sofar I think that's up from before
21:51 sfan5 does the areas mod have self-protection enabled by default?
21:55 sfan5 it doesn't
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