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IRC log for #minetest-hub, 2018-02-11

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:29 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
00:29 MinetestBot benrob0329: Feb-10 13:55 UTC <Jordach> https://i.imgur.com/3jQ58MG.png
00:31 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
00:32 Jordach F
00:32 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
00:36 sofar Fixer: try downloading https://github.com/minetest-tools/mtmapprune/​releases/download/v3/mtmapprune-v3-win64.zip again and see if that version works now
00:54 Fixer sofar: now it started prunning, hope it will be fast (relatively)
00:55 sofar it can't be much faster than this
00:55 sofar the sqlite vacuum is what takes so long
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01:12 Fixer sofar: how fast is it for you? i'm testing on North America
01:15 Fixer sofar: i don't get it, why can't you just copy selected range to a new db, and not doing work on other stuff in db?
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04:09 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
04:11 benrob0329 Oh my <word>, why don't we just add a command line flag for the ASCII logo and be done with it?
04:11 benrob0329 The amount of discussion over something so small is ridiculous
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06:30 * ssieb doesn't understand why there's a problem with the ascii logo...
06:40 * roben1430 doesn't understand why there is a problem with a command line flag for it if people really dislike it that much
06:40 sofar benrob0329: let me guess, nobody made a PR?
06:41 benrob0329 sofar: oh no someone made a PR
06:42 sofar I don't see it
06:42 sofar link?
06:42 sofar nvm
06:42 benrob0329 Got a -1 from paramat and the author closed it
06:42 benrob0329 A bad move from the author imho
06:46 sofar well, kind of have to blame the author on it
06:47 sofar I mean, sfan couldn't have given a much more useful hint
06:47 sofar benrob0329: why not brush it up if you care, and resubmit?
06:49 benrob0329 sofar: because I don't care about the ASCII logo, it just seems silly to argue so much about something so small
06:50 benrob0329 Tbh its never bothered me, though I can see the annoyance for some
06:52 benrob0329 AFAIK its a bunch of  printf statements though, wouldn't be too hard to put behind an if statement
06:52 benrob0329 I could probably do it and get it over with
06:53 sofar just take his patch and fix the global C variable to use settings like sfan hinted
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11:10 Darcidride joined #minetest-hub
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11:48 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
12:52 Fixer sofar: btw, if you interrupt prune, you will get error: "malformed original db" on the next run of prune
13:26 FourFire left #minetest-hub
13:48 Megaf Greetings folks
13:56 IhrFussel joined #minetest-hub
13:56 IhrFussel Hello people
13:57 lumberJ joined #minetest-hub
14:03 Megaf well, since we are talking on topic about Minetest on -chat I will offtopic here
14:03 Megaf It's beautiful day today, blue sky, sunny
14:03 Megaf not too cold
14:03 Megaf and it was weird actually, because I saw some snow flakes snowing, very weird
14:03 red-001 * user Megaf was kicked by paramat *
14:03 Megaf it's not even that cold. It is indeed very very very windy
14:04 red-001 Megaf, ok lets swap the channels around
14:04 Megaf I would be riding my bike now, but meh, too windy really
14:04 Megaf Actually there's two yellow warnings for wind in place
14:07 Shara Megaf: stop really
14:08 Shara If you make a channel where people can talk about anything, then invite a bunch of MT people to it... is it surprising MT is something that gets mentioned a lot?
14:08 Shara Go and make a channel with no MT people in it if you don't want any talk about MT
14:13 Fixer kkkkk
14:13 Fixer mtmapprune is insanely slow
14:15 Fixer gave up on it after 1 hour
14:16 Shara Fixer: size of map?
14:16 Fixer 5.5gb
14:16 CWz joined #minetest-hub
14:16 Shara It's not something I'd expect to be quick
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17:46 ircSparky why can you use setvelocity() or setacceleration() on players?
17:46 ircSparky cant*
17:47 rubenwardy because players are client-controlled
17:47 rubenwardy the client determines their physics
17:47 rubenwardy the server just accepts what the client tells them
17:47 rubenwardy unless they travel too fast
17:47 rubenwardy this is why you can noclip or fly
17:48 rubenwardy It would be good to have some form of add_velocity
17:48 rubenwardy or impulse
17:48 rubenwardy there's also the WIP impulse PR
17:48 rubenwardy errr
17:48 rubenwardy *knockback
17:49 rubenwardy LuaEntities are server controlled, so the server determines their velocity etc
17:49 ircSparky ok, yea that's basically why im asking. legends of survival has a mod that attached player to an entity, then knocks them back
17:49 ircSparky attaches*
17:49 rubenwardy sounds like lag
17:49 ircSparky yea
17:49 rubenwardy I was planning on doing something similar in CTF
17:49 rubenwardy I want to add catapults
17:50 ircSparky and when players detach from something they appear to fly from spawn
17:50 Jordach TREBUCHET > CATAPULT
17:50 rubenwardy which can catapult players into enemy territory and over walls
17:50 rubenwardy fuck off
17:50 Jordach >:D
17:51 ircSparky I have a trebuchet model laying around my files somewhere i think
17:51 rubenwardy oh nice
17:51 rubenwardy that would make things easier
17:51 rubenwardy long way off though, CTF is in feature freeze ish for now
17:52 rubenwardy as in, I cba to write any more features
17:52 rubenwardy I'm drained
17:52 read-001 mangonel > TREBUCHET || CATAPULT
17:53 ircSparky howitzer > mangonel
17:53 read-001 Ballistas are also pretty cool
17:53 ircSparky ruben do you have a link or name of the knockback PR?
17:54 ircSparky cant find it
17:54 rubenwardy it's called [WIP] Knockback
17:54 read-001 WMD > howitzer
17:54 rubenwardy it may be closed
17:54 ircSparky thanks
17:58 ircSparky oh well
17:59 Fixer bestest rule board i've seen in a town https://i.imgur.com/PTNISPp.png
18:00 Fixer SOMEONE SAID KNOCKBACK? STILL NOT MERGED
18:00 rubenwardy the PR sucked
18:00 * Fixer walks away double dissapointed
18:00 ircSparky yea i agree
18:00 rubenwardy not mod controllable, ridiculously large knockback
18:00 Fixer he can still fix
18:01 Fixer it
18:01 Shara The one server I played on that had knockback... just annoyed me
18:01 rubenwardy maybe, he's not active anymore though
18:01 ircSparky I want it mostly so my players can force people into jail cells
18:02 Shara I don't know if they added that PR or made something up themselves, but it seemed to spin me about as well.
18:02 rubenwardy you could set player speed to 0
18:02 rubenwardy or do you mean knock them into jails
18:02 rubenwardy urgh
18:02 ircSparky yea
18:02 rubenwardy I hate that feature, especially in protector
18:02 Shara I hate anything at all that changes where my camera points
18:03 ircSparky should make a mod that makes players spin uncontrollably
18:03 * Shara makes note to avoid any server ircSparky runs :D
18:04 ircSparky :P
18:04 Jordach Shara: upto no good again, area is work in progress
18:04 Jordach https://i.imgur.com/GmPDrGZ.png
18:04 Shara Hmmm
18:04 Shara It needs leaves, Jordach
18:04 Jordach what do you think i'm doing then :^)
18:04 Shara Give me leaves!!
18:05 Shara Even my game is able to add trees without leaves!
18:05 Jordach i wanted the model to look right before adding leaves :D
18:05 ircSparky I'll probably end up trying again to make an "unconscious" mod, and then if a criminal is noncompliant they'll just beat him till he drops and drag him to the cell
18:06 * Jordach is tempted to add an admin T.A.S.E.R
18:06 Fixer If "Server side movement" PR gets stall due to usual minetest reasons, I will be extremaly sad and offensive
18:07 rubenwardy I'm quite excited about that PR
18:07 rubenwardy but it'll be a bitch to revie
18:07 rubenwardy might be worth just doing the best we can to review, making sure you can disable it, then merge!
18:07 rubenwardy then fix things later[tm]
18:07 Shara I really hope that PR gets in, but also that it is tested at least somewhat first :P
18:07 rubenwardy :D
18:07 Fixer yeah, or I will declare engine DEAD to new outside contributions, and 4W guy will be right in the end
18:08 Shara Ewww
18:08 rubenwardy We should definitely release Fixer on that PR
18:08 rubenwardy he's good at testing player movement stuff
18:08 Shara Fixer: please fix this :(
18:08 rubenwardy heh
18:08 Fixer rubenwardy: it needs server with players hosted ideally
18:08 rubenwardy yeah
18:08 Fixer totally fine to play with it
18:08 rubenwardy well, I'm happy to host
18:08 Fixer there are tons of empty servers like Megafs that can be used
18:09 rubenwardy it's something I'd like for CTF
18:09 rubenwardy as well as glitch testing it needs performance testing really
18:09 rubenwardy heh
18:09 rubenwardy it should at least work as fast with it disabled
18:09 Fixer that will solve a lot of BS with noclip, flying, etc, it is uuuuge, just don't blow it up this time with mt beaurocracy
18:10 Fixer or i will start loosing faith again in mt
18:10 rubenwardy the main reason PRs take so freaking long to merge is due to difficulty in reviewing
18:10 rubenwardy and the fact it's so deathly boring to review
18:10 rubenwardy you help much more than most, Fixer
18:10 Fixer just keep it reasonable, we can always find and fix bugs later
18:11 Fixer I always expect bugs, if you don't want bugs, delete this repo and move with your life
18:12 Fixer reasonable review and then players/me/wuzzy whatever will have time to see bugs introduced
18:13 ircSparky then dies the PR just need to be opened again? or what would need to happen?
18:13 Fixer easy, it gets reopened if somebody continues work on it
18:13 rubenwardy ^
18:14 rubenwardy there's also a HybridDog PR, iirc
18:15 rubenwardy for add_velocity
18:15 Fixer this? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3208
18:15 ircSparky ok
18:16 Fixer it is like 2,5 years old PR going nowhere :)
18:19 Krock déjà vu
18:20 Jordach i've been to space before
18:21 Krock igher on the street
18:39 sofar Fixer: well duh, don't interrupt it
18:40 sofar it's sqlite, not oracle
18:48 Jordach *sad airhorn*
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19:02 Jordach Shara: https://i.imgur.com/c7KzTpp.png
19:03 Krock Is toast related to tree?
19:03 Jordach i needed food
19:03 Jordach i don't often test somethig *this* long
19:03 Krock to grow it?
19:03 Jordach actual gameplay mechanics beat my testing
19:04 Fixer sofar: but why can you just copy db entries you need to a new database fast without vacuuming anything and just rename back to map.sqlite
19:09 Shara Jordach: now I approve
19:09 Jordach there's two other models
19:09 Jordach read: i'm lazy
19:09 Shara So am I
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19:41 Jordach https://i.imgur.com/P4DR0Jz.jpg Shara
19:41 Shara The one on the right looks odd.
19:41 Shara Too much trunk without branches.
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19:53 sofar Fixer: no
19:54 sofar Fixer: I didn't write mtmapprune for making copies of sections
19:54 sofar Fixer: I wrote it to cut off regions of the same map regularly
19:54 sofar it just serves another purpose, and you're using it for a different purpose than it was intended
19:55 Fixer sofar: what is the difference? you can cut off it by copying into new db, is not that hugely faster?
19:55 sofar it likely won't be
19:55 sofar huge map in, huge map out, it still needs to do a ton of copying
19:55 sofar now you have 2 huge maps?
19:59 Fixer yes, but faster
19:59 Fixer depends on amount of prune
20:00 sofar but more code, and more complex, and oh
20:00 sofar imagine this
20:00 sofar I'm not going to write it
20:00 * sofar shrugs
20:00 Fixer okay
20:00 sofar whether it's faster is almost irrelevant
20:00 Fixer not a problem
20:00 sofar the cutting of A out of B is a one-time problem
20:01 sofar how long it takes is mostly irrelevant if it's within a reasonable amount of time anyway
20:01 sofar I wrote mtmapprune so it could run 10x a day on the same map
20:01 sofar so it needed to be the fastest approach and really quick
20:01 sofar obviously copying 90% of a map out to a new file is _not_ faster than pruning 10%
20:02 sofar so from a technical perspective, I think it does the right thing for the purpose that I wrote it for
20:02 sofar btw, my system takes like 4 days to convert earth by lentebriesje
20:02 sofar so if the prune takes 20+ hours... *shrug* :)
20:03 Fixer if you prune a little bit, it is probably fast, but for Earth it is megaslow unfortunately
20:04 sofar it will be slow even when copying out massive amounts
20:04 sofar either way it's a one-time operation
20:04 sofar it's a huge map, expectations should be that it takes a long time :)
20:08 Fixer i gave up on one hour mark :)
20:09 sofar try 24h
20:09 sofar lol
20:09 sofar honestly I should try it, let me do the prune as well here on Linux
20:10 Jordach Minetest BigData TM
20:12 Fixer sofar: how much it takes to prune North America with coords you posted?
20:12 sofar I will time it right now
20:16 sofar $ time ~/git/mtmapprune/mtmapprune ebl.sqlite -4890 200 7700 -15383 -100 1200
20:18 sofar come back in 5 hours and ask me :)
20:23 Jordach Shara: been fine tuning the mapgen for a bit
20:23 Jordach https://jordach.net/images/jmsrskkvsyrporfyms.png
20:23 Jordach acacia are rare as hell
20:23 Jordach as are cherries now
20:25 Jordach here's another example https://jordach.net/images/exqzfnmifzhsphjz.png
20:25 Jordach even cacti got nerfed to imply the deserts are dead areas
20:29 sofar Fixer: btw, mtmapprune is sitting barely at 10% cpu (single core) as it goes about its business... this is just sqlite not being very good at what it does on really large data sets
20:36 sofar hmmm, I'm making it a bit more verbose so I can see how long each step takes
20:40 Fixer sofar: if you add some simple progress bar or time left - that will help a lot
20:40 sofar so, it takes 46 seconds just to query all the block pos data
20:41 sofar there's almost no way to predict how long it will take I think
20:41 sofar still not vacuuming
20:51 sofar 25 minutes of just deleting sqlite blocks
21:01 Jordach Shara: https://jordach.net/images/ejyqjdnfzehofxmkf.png
21:01 Jordach grass will get redone
21:01 Jordach aka don't panic
21:28 Fixer wth every ---k wants to check me for 5 sec for antiddos protection, get off my internet bitches
21:29 Fixer Jordach: have you seen my message?
21:29 Jordach which
21:31 red-001 Fixer, welcome to cloudflare
21:32 Fixer Jordach: on mountain
21:32 Jordach what
21:32 Jordach Fixer: if you mean SP, then yes, the Reeeeee was amusing
21:32 Fixer yes :)
21:35 sofar 1hr still deleting blocks, not even vacuuming yet
21:37 Jordach Fixer: reminder that the server world will be reset once i finish these mapgen changes
21:37 Jordach also, new biome: Wildlands https://jordach.net/images/mbhxzcevqxxltdlg.png
21:37 red-001 !title
21:37 MinetestBot No title found.
21:44 Jordach extra (thicc) https://jordach.net/images/nvnjorwwleptktdpbz.png
21:45 Fixer too narrow
21:50 Jordach Fixer: i've noticed my colour choices resemble minecraft alpha
21:53 sofar Fixer: oh, it's done on my system
21:53 Fixer sofar: time?
21:53 sofar Fixer: https://gist.github.com/sofar/2​81ba09a8c09b723e491d849f2365e7b
21:53 sofar 74 minutes, not bad
21:54 sofar vacuuming took way less than I expected
21:54 sofar barely a minute to vacuum
21:54 IhrFussel sofar, did you try with a 20 GB DB?
21:55 sofar 5.7gb down to 726mb final size after prune
21:55 IhrFussel Because that's where the speed is needed...for large DBs
21:56 IhrFussel So I'm guessing 20 GB would take ~ 5 hours on a relatively modern machine
21:56 sofar no
21:56 rubenwardy how do I add newlines to a tool tip?
21:56 rubenwardy I've seen it been done
21:56 sofar you're not pruning 90% of your map every time
21:56 rubenwardy nvm
21:56 sofar IhrFussel: let me demonstrate by running a second trim and showing you how fast it is when there is nothing to prune
21:56 Jordach rubenwardy: https://github.com/Jordach/Solar_Plain​s/blob/master/mods/core/tools.lua#L185
21:57 Jordach https://github.com/Jordach/Solar_Plain​s/blob/master/mods/core/tools.lua#L233
21:57 sofar IhrFussel: second prune run took 0m52.269s
21:58 rubenwardy thanks Jordach
21:58 sofar IhrFussel: so, the time it needs is proportional to the amount of blocks removed
21:58 sofar if you prune often, it's fast
21:58 sofar (that's what it is designed for)
21:58 IhrFussel Ok so ~ 5 hours likely for the first time
21:59 sofar depends on your cpu
21:59 sofar the CPU I used is from 2010
21:59 IhrFussel Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2680 v4 @ 2.40GHz
21:59 sofar well, q1'11
21:59 sofar it should be way faster than mine
22:00 sofar https://ark.intel.com/compare/52585,91754
22:00 Fixer lol, 8 cores
22:00 IhrFussel By the way is v4 worse than v3? It looks like the next version is always clocked lower compared to the prevous one
22:00 Fixer sofar: 726 mb is North America?
22:01 sofar yes, the coords that I posted in the thread
22:01 Fixer then on my hardware it will take few hours at least
22:01 sofar probably :)
22:02 sofar v4 should be better than v3, I hope :)
22:03 Calinou hi :)
22:04 Calinou rubenwardy: I had an idea for Minetest CTF, what about playing a subtle sound on item pickup, and another sound if trying to pick an item up while having a full inventory?
22:04 Calinou this would help mid-fight :P
22:06 IhrFussel sofar, looks like it is...but why lower cock then if it's newer hm
22:06 rubenwardy sounds good
22:06 IhrFussel clock*
22:06 rubenwardy need sounds though
22:06 IhrFussel Funny typo lol
22:06 sofar IhrFussel: clocks aren't lowered per se
22:07 sofar I'm fairly sure that people just buy a lower binned CPU
22:07 IhrFussel v3 has 2.5 ghz and v4 2.4 ... or am I missing something?
22:07 sofar however, more cores means more thermal pressure
22:07 sofar so they may drop the frequency to prevent it from overheating
22:07 sofar e.g. 24 cores instead of 16 is 50% more heat
22:08 sofar so core count matters
22:08 sofar so if you compare cpu X and Y, you have to look at a *lot* of parameters
22:09 IhrFussel Looks like v4 is 6% faster compared to v3 ... not much but better than nothing
22:09 Calinou rubenwardy: I can create an issue, is that OK?
22:09 rubenwardy sure
22:09 Calinou I can try finding sounds too
22:09 IhrFussel singlecore* ... using all cores it's 24% faster
22:09 sofar https://ark.intel.com/compare/92987,82764
22:10 sofar those are the highest frequency xeon e5 v3 and v4 parts
22:10 sofar notice... no clock change?
22:10 sofar no tdp change, either
22:10 sofar but turbo frequency of the v4 is higher
22:10 sofar so effectively, the new cpu went up in frequency
22:11 sofar also memory bw went up
22:11 sofar this is really an apples-to-apples comparison
22:15 Calinou lol, there's a player walking on lava on Minetest CTF
22:15 Calinou literally cave Jesus
22:16 rubenwardy /ban time
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22:22 Jordach Fixer: dev server has a new world, and new biome and mapgen changes
22:24 Jordach it's no longer a 36C desert!
22:24 Jordach (i measured with my V5/7 mapgen to celcius conversion)
22:24 Jordach it's more like a -20 siberian place
22:29 paramat joined #minetest-hub
22:29 MinetestBot paramat: Feb-10 21:21 UTC <Jordach> you've got 603 commits to Minetest Engine :D
22:29 Shara Hi paramat
22:30 paramat hi. well not 603, about 350
22:39 lumberJ joined #minetest-hub
23:29 RoaryTiger Hi paramat
23:30 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
23:30 RoaryTiger I will be using this nick for the forerable future
23:30 RoaryTiger Hi behalebabo
23:30 RoaryTiger benrob0329:
23:32 benrob0329 hi RoaryTiger
23:51 Fixer Calinou: devil Jesus
23:51 Fixer or antiJesus
23:51 Fixer or Jesus on drugs
23:51 Fixer Japanese Jesus
23:56 red-001 huh Japanese Jesus on anti-devil drugs

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