Minetest logo

IRC log for #minetest-hub, 2018-01-05

| Channels | #minetest-hub index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:31 EvergreenTree joined #minetest-hub
00:38 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
00:47 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
00:53 Fixer more healthy offtopic
00:54 Fixer disabled antivirus, delayed start to worst offenders, boot time improved from 160 to 50 sec
01:00 red-001 #minetest-hub on-topic is [off] and offtopic is ontopic
01:00 roben1430 Disabled Windows, removed worst offenders. Boot time improved from 3 minutes to 10 seconds
01:09 Fixer .net is a bitch to start
01:10 Fixer infamous ATI CCC, slow as fuck since 2003 (iirc)
01:10 Fixer greenshot - advanced screenshoter, boot time like it is photoshop
01:25 IhrFussel max_lag can max decrease by 50% per 5 minutes right? I think someone said that
01:26 twoelk joined #minetest-hub
01:33 red-001 oooh the bugs got catchy names
01:52 EvergreenTree joined #minetest-hub
01:53 roben1430 joined #minetest-hub
02:02 sniper570 joined #minetest-hub
02:08 twoelk left #minetest-hub
02:11 roben1430 joined #minetest-hub
02:14 paramat joined #minetest-hub
02:27 EvergreenTree joined #minetest-hub
02:28 roben1430 joined #minetest-hub
02:59 roben1430 joined #minetest-hub
03:05 * benrob0329 crashes hexchat with lua script
03:05 benrob0329 And all of Xorg apparently
03:26 Shara joined #minetest-hub
03:26 shivajiva wb Shara
03:30 red-001 hi Shara
03:31 Shara Hi :)
03:36 benrob0329 Hello Shara
03:37 Shara I am so tired. But server was so broken.
03:37 Shara And apparently I can't sleep when server is broken.
04:02 EvergreenTree joined #minetest-hub
04:08 shivajiva no excuse now :P
04:09 shivajiva oops wrong window :)
04:09 red-001 that explains the confusion
04:10 shivajiva nothing can explain the confusion red lol
04:53 paramat joined #minetest-hub
05:54 * sofar goes to fix more shivajiva code
05:58 * sofar rebases
05:58 * sofar fixes conflicts
06:02 * sofar luachecks
06:03 roben1430 joined #minetest-hub
07:07 CWz joined #minetest-hub
07:07 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
09:29 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
10:58 Megaf Good morning
11:06 IhrFussel joined #minetest-hub
11:06 IhrFussel Hi guys
11:14 Megaf morning Fussel
11:22 Megaf Man, for days I've been trying to figure out how to make Linux dont use one VGA and use another instead
11:23 Megaf My integrated GPU had it's outputs burnt, now I wanted to use a PCI VGA
11:23 Megaf But I can't even make it send any output at all to the PCI VGA
11:23 Megaf and by PCI I meant it, the old PCI standard
11:25 IhrFussel So far I only see one entry where my avg_lag mod reports an average lag above 0.150 sec within hours ... very happy with this root server so far
11:31 Megaf IhrFussel: what do you mean by root server?
11:32 IhrFussel Root server can mean different things...in my case it's a VPS with dedicated CPU, so not really shared between all customers
11:33 IhrFussel Or let's say I "own" certain cores of that CPU when I need them
11:34 Megaf which one is your host?
11:35 IhrFussel https://www.netcup.eu/vserver/ << I have the RS 2000
11:37 IhrFussel It can't get much cheaper than that considering it mentions dedicated cores
11:39 Megaf That's great price
11:41 IhrFussel In the support forum I saw people running CS:GO servers on it and they say the performance is outstanding
11:43 IhrFussel So I thought if the product can handle CS:GO it sure as heck should be able to handle MT
11:44 Megaf FPS shooters dont require much power
11:44 IhrFussel But CS:GO runs with a MUCH higher tick rate (64 by default)
11:46 IhrFussel Or was it 66? Something between 60-70 ... also the hoster *promises* 99.9% availability per year which is 364.876957 days
11:47 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
11:49 Megaf Morning Fixer
11:51 IhrFussel Megaf, a FPS server has to calculate shots all the time plus collision... are you sure that's not demanding?
11:51 Megaf Well, you need a high clock yes, but not a lot of memory
11:51 Megaf nor disk space
11:51 Megaf and you are not running ABMs
11:53 IhrFussel True that...well the Xeon E5 "only" has 2.4 Ghz but I heard it can use turbo (not sure if my hoster supports that though)
11:53 Megaf I hosteI some WOLFET servers back in the day
11:54 Megaf and ArmyOps servers too
11:54 Megaf hosted*
11:54 Megaf Minetest is the most demaning game server I have ever hosted, seconded by OpenSim
11:55 Megaf And Minetest is only demanding because of it's experimental design (inefficient, but improving)
11:55 Megaf OpenSim runs 100s of scripts at the same time while managing 100s of players
11:55 Megaf still using less resourses than my MT server with 2 or 3 people and a couple of ABMs...
11:56 Megaf OpenSim is Mono/C#
11:56 Megaf there's no excuse really...
11:56 Megaf MT was very good in it's 0.3 version
11:57 Megaf man, I miss my OSGrid region. Now that I don't have MT server running in my VPS anymore I might put my OSGrid region back online
12:01 IhrFussel joined #minetest-hub
12:02 IhrFussel Sorry in case I spammed the chat with my relogs ... IRC is a bit weird when it comes to reconnecting after the ISP decided to switch your IP
12:03 Megaf did you read anything I wrote?
12:03 IhrFussel I just called my hoster and they said the turbo mode of the CPU will be used "Minetest is the most demaning game server I have ever hosted, seconded by OpenSim" << last message I received
12:08 Megaf IhrFussel: http://paste.debian.net/plain/1003588
12:09 Megaf you can just curl that
12:12 IhrFussel Yes like I already said recently: MT can run great on very fast hardware ... but it's definitely not good enough for older CPUs/specs anymore which is a shame
12:14 IhrFussel I mean you CAN play MT on a Celeron from 2003 ... with 20 FPS *after* you optimized everything in advanced settings
12:17 IhrFussel Even an AMD Opteron from 2010 struggles if you run a MT server on it ... the Intel Xeon E5 my current root server uses is from 2016 AFAIK and even THAT cannot stay on consistent 150ms ticks
12:19 IhrFussel We all know the main issue: Server thread only uses one single core of any machine
12:24 sfan5 IhrFussel: have they ever hosted minecraft? :P
12:25 sfan5 it's far more demanding
12:28 IhrFussel Yes in the support forum customers also report performance when running MC ... they say mostly the TPS stay at 20
12:31 IhrFussel With 10 players max_lag now is 0.3 ... okay I admit my server/mods aren't that lightweight but there is still a lot of room for improvement
12:31 IhrFussel engine-side*
12:33 IhrFussel I think MT would perform best on a CPU that is clocked at 3+ Ghz per core
12:39 Megaf MT is great for high clock CPUs yes
12:39 Megaf all MT needs is 2 threads running at very high clock rates
12:40 Megaf an AMD FX woul be great for MT
12:41 Megaf https://www.newegg.com/Product/P​roduct.aspx?Item=N82E16819113347
12:42 Megaf !title
12:42 MinetestBot Megaf: AMD FX-9590 Vishera 8-Core 4.7 GHz Socket AM3+ 220W FD9590FHHKWOF Desktop Processor - Black Edition - Newegg.com
12:42 Megaf Perfect CPU for Minetest ^
12:42 Megaf IhrFussel: ^
12:43 Megaf I think that's the highest clock x86 CPU we can buy
12:43 sfan5 AMD's FX series has terrible single core perf so that's not actually a good cpu for mt
12:43 IhrFussel 4.7 Ghz?? I thought CPUs would potentially burn after 4 Ghz
12:43 Megaf "8-core processor with 5.0 GHZ Max Turbo speed, and 4.7 GHz CPU base. Fully unlocked."
12:43 Megaf this one can go to 5 GHz
12:44 Megaf sfan5: at 5 GHz performance will be good for MT
12:45 sfan5 no
12:45 Megaf learned a new word today, dodeca. Means 12
12:45 Megaf dodeca core, 12 cores
12:46 IhrFussel Do you guys also have that problem with carts? Sometimes when you turn you are "stuck" for a few secs before you can drive further...I mean it's like the cart resets you a lot before it allows you to proceed
12:46 IhrFussel Maybe I can make a GIF one sec
12:47 Megaf ok, now talking truthly
12:47 Megaf https://www.newegg.com/Product/P​roduct.aspx?Item=N82E16819117792
12:47 Megaf !title
12:47 MinetestBot Megaf: Intel Core i7-7740X Kaby Lake-X Quad-Core 4.3 GHz LGA 2066 112W BX80677I77740X Desktop Processor - Newegg.com
12:47 Megaf that would run MT great
12:47 Megaf great single core performance, not many threads, just enough to run MT at full speed
12:48 Megaf sfan5: ^
12:48 Megaf IhrFussel: another 4+ GHz CPU
12:48 sfan5 yes such a cpu would be better
12:49 Megaf that CPU with two cores and HT disabled, running at 5 GHz with a real time kernel, so sweet
12:49 sfan5 Megaf: an i3 with roughly the same price can deliver better single core perf than the FX https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare.php?cmp[]=2014&cmp[]=2317
12:49 Megaf sfan5: I know, FX were terrible
12:49 Megaf I always disliked their architecture. reason I still have a Phenom II X4
12:50 Megaf any modern high clock Intel CPU will be good for MT
12:51 Megaf I'm quite found of i3s, they deliver good performance and are very cheap
12:51 Megaf https://www.newegg.com/Product/P​roduct.aspx?Item=N82E16819117772
12:51 Megaf !titel
12:51 Megaf !title
12:51 MinetestBot Megaf: Intel Core i3-7350K Kaby Lake Dual-Core 4.2 GHz LGA 1151 60W BX80677I37350K Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 630 - Newegg.com
12:53 IhrFussel 10 MB GIF warning > http://94.16.121.151/mt2.gif
12:54 IhrFussel It's hard to capture it cause it only happens for a moment
12:54 Megaf 11 MB
12:54 IhrFussel And it's not lag max_lag was 0.2 there
12:55 IhrFussel It only happens at turns or when an obstacle appears ... it seems to fix itself faster when you turn the camera around
12:59 IhrFussel Here I was able to capture it better and in MP4 http://94.16.121.151/mt3.mp4
13:00 IhrFussel Again max_lag is 0.2
13:03 IhrFussel Plus it doesn't happen with the boost_cart mod last I checked
13:12 Fixer ah, """bestest""" european winter
13:15 aerozoic joined #minetest-hub
13:20 nerzhul IhrFussel, i have a 8350 at 4.2 Ghz it rocks :D
13:20 nerzhul 8 cores, MT compiled in 25sec
13:25 Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub
13:33 Megaf nerzhul: 25 seconds :O
13:33 Megaf for minetestserver or minetest client?
13:33 Megaf Hello Mr_Pardison
13:33 Mr_Pardison o/ Megaf
13:33 Megaf !server Megaf
13:33 MinetestBot Megaf: Megaf Server V4.17 | mt.megaf.info:30003 | Clients: 0/10, 0/1 | Version: 0.4.17-Megaf / MegafXploreNext | Ping: 13ms
13:34 Megaf sfan5: what do you think about including uptime in that output? ^
13:35 sfan5 sounds useful
13:35 Megaf Could you do that for us? Please?
13:39 EvergreenTree joined #minetest-hub
13:39 nerzhul Megaf, both
13:40 Megaf Wow, I can't beat that
13:40 Megaf Maybe I can build minetestserver in 25 seconds
13:40 Megaf both, no way
13:40 Megaf only using ccache
13:41 Mr_Pardison Communism: you have 2 cows. You take care of them, but that government takes all the milk.
13:41 Mr_Pardison Capitalism: You have two cows. You sell one and buy a bull. You herd multiplies, and the economy grows. You sell them and retire on the income.
13:41 Mr_Pardison Enron Capitalism: You have two cows. You sell three of them to your brother-in-law , who then sells you all four cows back, which gives you five cows in the annual report which gives you a tax exemption for eight cows. But you're not aware of it at the time.
13:42 Megaf Brazil ^
13:42 Megaf People and politians do that all the time
13:43 Megaf very efficient
13:43 Mr_Pardison they use mark-to-market accounting?
13:43 Megaf Sometimes it gets you in jail though, then you have to sell give away around 4 cows to buy freedom
13:44 Megaf s/sell give away/give away
13:50 Megaf *unplugs ethernet cable from switch
13:50 Megaf *gets angry when ssh doesnt connect
13:50 Megaf Me right now ^
13:59 Raven262 joined #minetest-hub
14:03 Megaf Welcome back Raven262
14:04 Raven262 thx Megaf
14:06 IhrFussel nerzhul, 8 cores are useless in MT
14:07 nerzhul IhrFussel, for compiling it's useful, i don't run server on my PC
14:07 IhrFussel It really only counts what *one* core can do
14:08 IhrFussel Yes for compiling every core can be used, but those minutes don't matter much as server owner
14:09 IhrFussel I wish we could at least split some tasks from the server thread into a new one
14:09 benrob0329 Lua threads!
14:09 Mr_Pardison sew! a needle pulling thread!
14:12 IhrFussel How about splitting ABMs into another thread? Would that make sense?
14:13 IhrFussel ABMs run pretty much independently right?
14:13 Megaf we just have to bundle this with our Lua http://lualanes.github.io/lanes/
14:16 nerzhul no sense as the map is common and this will trigger many locks, it's not easy to split that
14:18 IhrFussel nerzhul, isn't there a way to just trigger the ABM thread whenever the usual server thread would trigger the ABMs?
14:20 IhrFussel And then the Server thread could do something non-critical until the ABM thread finished ... just a thought
14:33 rubenwardy ABMs need to be on the server thread as Lua
14:34 rubenwardy would be good to make Lua on a different thread, and communicate with a queue. Lots of things would need to be blocking however, namely the callbacks that affect inbuilt behaviour
14:34 rubenwardy heh
14:35 rubenwardy could maybe make our map storage multithreaded, achieve massive I/O
14:48 rubenwardy left #minetest-hub
14:50 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
14:53 lumberJ joined #minetest-hub
14:56 Megaf you can make Lua and SQLite very fast in MT
14:56 Megaf problem is, if the server crashes you are screwed
14:57 rubenwardy joined #minetest-hub
14:57 Mr_Pardison *helically wrapped around an inclined plane
14:57 Megaf there's some nice building options for Lua and SQLite that makes them totally async
14:57 Megaf [12:56:34] <Megaf> you can make Lua and SQLite very fast in MT
14:57 Megaf [12:56:45] <Megaf> problem is, if the server crashes you are screwed
14:57 rubenwardy sqlite is still limited by disk I/O
14:57 rubenwardy and you can't perform operations async
14:58 rubenwardy with a highly distributed map backend, you could read/write millions of nodes in seconds
14:58 rubenwardy source: I have a friend that did this for Minecraft
14:58 Megaf rubenwardy: https://sqlite.org/asyncvfs.html
14:59 rubenwardy ?
14:59 Megaf async module for sqlite?
14:59 rubenwardy how would you use that to set all water to lava?
14:59 rubenwardy that's what I meant by read/write
15:01 rubenwardy I mean, asking for this is too much given that entities aren't even stored in a simple constantly bounded spatial partition
15:01 rubenwardy they're stored in a list
15:01 rubenwardy what is optimisation again?
15:01 jas_ no clue
15:01 jas_ what's wrong with lists?
15:01 rubenwardy O(N^2) for collisions on entire set of loaded entities
15:02 jas_ a lot of whooshing going on around here
15:02 jas_ (seriously, heavy gusts!)
15:02 rubenwardy basically every entity needs to compare itself against all other entities for collisions
15:02 rubenwardy because they're all stored in one list
15:03 jas_ ouch
15:03 rubenwardy rather than a spartial partition, where they'd check all the entities in the same chunk, and then entities in neighbouring chunks if close enough to the border
15:03 jas_ i think spatial, i think AreaStore, which i like
15:03 jas_ that was very fast, iirc, so much so that areas was converted to use it
15:03 jas_ is it related somehow?
15:03 rubenwardy yeah, AreaStore is an API for spatial partitioning
15:04 jas_ too bad about the entities, i suspect the server gets slower the longer it's played, and the more entities are spawned -- if one is in a peculiar position, it could cause errors
15:06 jas_ oh i see your comment about AreaStore now, on this gh issue
15:09 Fixer quassel on start reads all my fonts, 2 second wasted, why?
15:10 jas_ because
15:11 benrob0329 Because Hexchat is better :P
15:11 jas_ weeeeeeeeeeeeeeechat
15:11 benrob0329 Actually I'm pondering an IRC client, you could do p2p VoIP using DCC :P
15:12 benrob0329 That is, if DCC worked in any modern clients anyways
15:12 jas_ https://www.reddit.com/r/Maine/com​ments/7o3vku/hannafids_last_night/
15:13 sniper570 joined #minetest-hub
15:14 benrob0329 jas_: weechat is good, but I got tired of having to constantly retype all autojoin channels just to change one
15:14 jas_ ?
15:14 jas_ i dunno about that, there's a script
15:14 jas_ plus u can use iset too, and alt-k it
15:14 jas_ but there's a script
15:14 jas_ just type /script, i gotta rescue my pizza
15:15 jas_ and search join or autojoin, i think the script is called autojoin
15:15 jas_ and don't forget go, that's great
15:15 * benrob0329 should write some lua for Hexchat
15:15 benrob0329 I tried last night for an [off] script but ended up crashing everything lol
15:15 jas_ there's a lua plugin for weechat
15:16 benrob0329 Ik
15:16 jas_ but the best plugin, for me, is the relay plugin
15:16 jas_ allowing me to access the box from an irc relay, or a weechat relay
15:18 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
15:19 jas_ well i guess the irc plugin is the most important
15:23 Krock joined #minetest-hub
15:25 jas_ i burnt it a little bit
15:26 jas_ https://weechat.org/script​s/source/autojoin.py.html/
15:27 jas_ but using /iset and alt+k works too, so u dont have to type a lot
15:34 sniper570 joined #minetest-hub
15:48 benrob0329 o/ Krock, Wb sniper570
15:48 Krock o/ benrob0329
16:14 sniper570 \o benrob0329
16:19 Fixer /o\
16:19 Mr_Pardison \o/
16:30 IhrFussel joined #minetest-hub
16:42 IhrFussel My cars still suddenly stop at a certain speed... could it be caused by the send optimize distance?? I set that to 3 ... it is definitely not the HDD or RAM or CPU
16:42 Krock do they also stop when running into unloaded areas?
16:43 IhrFussel That never happens, the map loads too fast
16:43 IhrFussel One sec will make a MP4
16:46 IhrFussel Krock, http://94.16.121.151/mt4.mp4
16:47 IhrFussel Window may be a bit small
16:49 Krock that's indeed strange. Either it's the collision code that does weird stuff or the velocity is reset in the mod somehow due wrong calculations
16:51 IhrFussel It worked in 0.4.16 fine ... now the server is 0.4.17 and it broke I guess
16:52 IhrFussel But maybe it really is the block optimize send distance...I removed it and will see if it's fixed after restart
16:56 rubenwardy how does one get the kernel update to protect against meltdown?
16:56 rubenwardy can't see anything special looking in   apt upgrade
16:57 sofar once I know, I'll let everyone know too
16:57 sofar lol
16:57 IhrFussel You just have to enable PTI (Page Table Isolation) AFAIK
16:58 IhrFussel If anyone got time, please check if the movement code here maybe has a bug https://pastebin.com/s4ETkJdS
17:01 IhrFussel rubenwardy, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki​/Kernel_page-table_isolation ... as for OS update it will just be a regular security update by Debian/Ubuntu etc
17:02 IhrFussel The bad part is that they are not done with the patch yet (at least Ubuntu isn't)
17:04 IhrFussel Regarding Ubuntu they will update this page as soon as a patch has been released https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTea​m/KnowledgeBase/SpectreAndMeltdown
17:06 IhrFussel "The original coordinated disclosure date was planned for January 9 and we have been driving toward that date to release fixes. Due to the early disclosure, we are trying to accelerate the release, but we don't yet have an earlier ETA when the updates will be released."
17:07 IhrFussel 2017 Nov 09: the Ubuntu Security team is notified by Intel under NDA << They had almost 2 MONTHS to fix this and aren't done yet
17:07 Darcidride_ joined #minetest-hub
17:08 Mr_Pardison this affects all OS's.
17:09 IhrFussel Ubuntu specifies Spectre as "High" while they specify Meltdown as "Critical" ... IMO both are critical
17:09 * Mr_Pardison agrees
17:09 benrob0329 Ubuntu, the OS to rule no one but everyone seems to think they do.
17:17 IhrFussel benrob0329, that date apparently was the CRD for everyone if this article is right "there was a coordinated release date of January 9, 2018, agreed upon by essentially every operating system, hardware, and cloud vendor in the world."
17:17 Mr-Pardison makes sense.
17:18 Mr-Pardison release the patch at the same time so that it couldn't be exploited on a system that didn't have the patch.
17:19 IhrFussel I wonder if they would have kept it secret if the public wouldn't know about it until Jan 9
17:20 benrob0329 Probably
17:21 Mr-Pardison Fedora alerted me just now that important OS updates are available.
17:23 sofar are you kidding me?
17:23 sofar "<benrob0329> Probably"
17:23 sofar seriously?
17:24 sofar "there was a coordinated release date of January 9, 2018, agreed upon by essentially every operating system, hardware, and cloud vendor in the world."
17:24 sofar I mean, wat?
17:24 sofar how do you?
17:24 sofar even?
17:25 sofar http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/f7/f71beaed2b2a0d18a08​1fe28448c68ec43cc052c8c1539addfdaeede78e59800.jpg
17:25 benrob0329 Lol, I didn't say that keeping is secret until it was fixed was a bad thing
17:27 benrob0329 IhrFussel: [...] until Jan 9
17:27 IhrFussel I think there is  a very good chance that no vendor/manufacturer etc would've said ANYTHING about the vulnerabilities if it wouldn't have been gone public
17:27 Megaf off, I shoud attach some wings to my two servers
17:27 Megaf they sound like they are about to take off
17:27 rubenwardy lol, offtopic by talking about minetest
17:27 rubenwardy gtfu
17:29 IhrFussel I mean we get security patches all the time and never really know what it was about (well you can read about many things that get patched but you don't see always all details)
17:34 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
18:21 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
18:47 IhrFussel I tried to compile 0.4.17 client and when I run it I get "2018-01-05 19:45:36: ERROR[AsyncWorker-0]: Execution of async base environment failed: Failed to load and run script from /usr/local/share/minetest/builtin/init.lua:"
18:48 IhrFussel Wait maybe I know what the problem is
19:07 IhrFussel Ok it's fixed ... but now I can confirm that the cars also stop in 0.4.17 client ... It could be something server side
19:07 Fixer *,,,,,,,*
19:09 IhrFussel Maybe a PR that was backported
19:09 Fixer sofar: btw not everyone will receive new update on Windows, since some AV shitware goes into BSOD, so it checks if you have outdated one and disables update, had to manually install it
19:09 Fixer security quality update one for Win7
19:09 sofar I don't windows
19:10 Fixer about that meltdown/spectre vulnderability
19:10 Fixer i decided to disable that Avast for now, to just feel if there is improvement in responsiveness
19:10 Fixer win7 is slow as hell on HDD
19:11 Fixer running ATI Control Centre and Greenshot apps written in .NET 2 and 4 literally rape my HDD
19:11 Fixer during boot
19:12 Fixer used delayed start on a lot of stuff, like Shype and torrents, boots in 50 sec now, year ago it was 300 sec
19:12 Fixer AV alone adds entire 1 minute to boot time, it is ridiculous
19:13 Fixer quassel went to delayed mode too, it is painfully slow to start, amazingly
19:14 Krock > literally rape
19:14 Fixer 4 sec to read a quassel database... it is not like 100gb in size, and it is not 386 cpu, WTF
19:15 Krock there can't be too much physical damage to a HDD by read/write cycles
19:15 Fixer it is just 256mb, lol
19:15 Fixer god damned
19:15 Krock symlink it to a ramdisk :P
19:16 Fixer it also wastes TWO seconds on reading all my /FONTS, WHY?
19:16 Fixer i only use 3 fonts at most
19:16 Fixer in quassel
19:17 Mr-Pardison g2g cya in a bit.
19:17 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/dx2stIu.png DANGEROUS
19:18 Krock use it. it's there for a reason
19:22 Mr_Pardison joined #minetest-hub
19:36 compunerd joined #minetest-hub
19:37 Fixer Krock: you like to live dangerously
19:39 Mr_Pardison Fixer: life is more fun that way :D
19:39 Krock not really. I just find it quite amusing that they documented such a parameter if people should better not use it
19:40 Fixer "16 dec 2014 - If you're using HDMI output with an Nvidia graphics card, you likely aren't getting full and accurate color range, specifically at the black and white ends of the spectrum."
19:40 Fixer o__________O
19:40 Fixer patch available
19:40 IhrFussel Stupid German media "Browsers are receiving patches against Meltdown & Spectre" That will fix NOTHING
19:41 Fixer it is like back to 90s
19:41 Krock but without gifs or 56k modems
19:41 Fixer https://pcmonitors.info/articles/correct​ing-hdmi-colour-on-nvidia-and-amd-gpus/ o.O
19:44 sofar IhrFussel: fixing browsers is critical
19:44 sofar since that is where you run untrusted code
19:45 red-001 huh I wonder how this affects luaJIT
19:45 IhrFussel sofar, the average joe is dumber than just visiting stranger websites
19:45 sofar oh sure don't patch your browser, you'll be better of for sure (said nobody ever)
19:46 sofar the dumber they are the more serious you should be about them updating their browser
19:46 IhrFussel There are many ways for those exploits to work... outside of browsers
19:48 sofar I guess you don't understand security defense strategies
19:48 sofar "Defense in depth"
19:50 IhrFussel I never said that patching browsers is wrong ... but if the German media reports it like THAT, some people might think that they are safe then
19:51 sofar most consumers will get OS patches automatically through Microsoft/Apple
19:51 IhrFussel Nobody can fix Spectre 100% right now
19:51 Fixer Keep your OS and programs up to date (except those that degrade over time), use adblocker, noscript, remove flash/java, done
19:51 sofar reminding them to patch their browser where they run random code from the internet as they surf german porn sites seems like a good idea
19:51 IhrFussel The fixes are mainly just for Meltdown
19:52 sofar "oh sure just postpone patching then"
19:53 sofar if anything it's amazing the press is trying to make sense of it all and tell users what they can do, right?
19:53 sofar I mean, it's almost like... they're doing what they should do
19:54 Mr_Pardison it's like one of those "FINALLY!" moments.
19:54 Fixer sofar: lol, yes
19:56 sofar here's an image of germans after they get instructions on how to patch their computer: https://i.imgur.com/nb0AsTE.jpg
19:56 Krock that's how native germans look like
19:57 sofar :)
19:57 sofar wait
19:57 Mr-Pardison >.<
19:57 sofar are you implying that there's "positive" germans?
19:57 sofar as a dutch person, I was not aware
19:58 red-001 can't get viruses if you burn your computer can you?
19:58 sofar just cancer
19:58 Krock no, that's bacteria that gets killed by heat
20:01 Fixer colorized
20:02 Fixer sofar: updating helps, it is just long legacy of WinCLF__K ecosystem with painful OS updating and absense of good update mechanism for programs itself
20:02 Fixer Nix systems are very good in this aspect
20:02 Fixer win ecosystem is minefield too
20:03 Fixer while they push store for now, i dislike the way they do it
20:03 Megaf That chat... ˆ^ˆ^ˆ^ˆ^ˆ^
20:20 EvergreenTree joined #minetest-hub
20:39 Calinou https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=3&amp;t=19208
20:39 Calinou nice
20:39 red-001 yeah
20:39 Calinou I just reminded myself that Minetest's birthdate is October 10th 2010
20:40 Calinou …which is the same day on which My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic first aired, by the way
20:40 Calinou (:D)
20:40 Calinou or Ubuntu 10.10's release
20:41 red-001 wait those are 3 diffirent things?
20:49 benrob0329 Calinou: noice
20:50 rubenwardy ew
20:50 benrob0329 Ew?
20:52 red-001 ew
20:55 Calinou yes, Ubuntu 10.10 was a meh release
20:55 Krock Calinou, also minetest had a nyan cat with rainbow nodes. There's a pony with a rainbow tail. Illuminati confirmed
20:57 Calinou illumineighti!
21:01 Mr-Pardison g2g cya tomorrow peeps.
21:02 Mr-Pardison left #minetest-hub
21:52 IhrFussel Is MT safe from a sudden shutdown? My hoster says they will now shutdown all systems for the CPU bugfixes but in waves, so I cannot know when my machine will be shutdown
21:53 Calinou [    0.000000] Kernel/User page tables isolation: enabled
21:53 IhrFussel I mean is the map.sqlite safe then?
21:53 Calinou I booted the patched kernel from Fedora today
21:54 Calinou IhrFussel: SQLite doesn't like very much brutal shutdowns
21:54 red-001 ^
21:54 Calinou so it's best to gracefully shut down your server before
21:54 Calinou (/shutdown or Ctrl+C once)
21:54 Calinou (or stopping the systemd service if you used that)
21:54 IhrFussel Not brutal, my hoster says they will send a regular shutdown signal which waits 300 secs for all processes to finish
21:55 IhrFussel Or to clean up
21:57 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
22:16 IhrFussel Calinou, I read that SQLite is *designed* to recover from any unexpected situations (OS crash, power failure etc)
22:18 Calinou IhrFussel: the best it can, yes
22:19 Calinou but it's not perfect at doing this, like any program
22:19 rubenwardy it'll probably be fine as long as you haven't changed sqlite_synchronous
22:20 IhrFussel I have no such setting in my conf
22:20 Calinou it's set to 2 by default (safest, but slowest)
22:20 Calinou 0 is the least safe, but can be much faster (sometimes 50 times faster)
22:20 Calinou you should use that one only if you have regular backups
22:21 Calinou (but you should use PostgreSQL anyway…)
22:30 paramat joined #minetest-hub
22:34 benrob0329 joined #minetest-hub
23:09 red-001 it's just a frontend to lua loadstring/pcall combo
23:32 Megaf IhrFussel: I think no server has crashed more than mine in its 5 or 6 years of life
23:32 Megaf to this day, no map corruption
23:33 Megaf And I did change sqlite syncronous options to less safe options
23:34 Megaf well, everything else got currupted and I had to rebuild several times...
23:34 Megaf auth, players, homes, landmarks, world.mt, and so on...
23:35 Megaf but map.sqlite was always rock solid
23:36 Megaf The most often crash I had lately was OOM, seconded by indexing nil values, then maybe seg faults and no more disk space
23:36 Megaf all of them rather frustrating
23:55 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
23:57 Fixer reading about that meltdown/spectre thing, pretty neat stuff
23:57 Fixer the more you read - more creepy it gets
23:58 Fixer IhrFussel: you should check minetest db performance before/after that KPTI patch
23:58 Fixer https://github.com/HarsaroopDhillon/Meltdown who wants to try this? :D

| Channels | #minetest-hub index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext