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IRC log for #minetest-hub, 2017-12-31

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:02 Fixer paramat: it is worse-st NY ever, we should embrace it :]
00:04 Fixer when you expect that NY mood with snow and stuff and you got shitty moisty +10*C shitty cloudy weather, climate change is a myth
00:07 Shara It's warmer than you expect... and climate change is a myth? Not seeing your logic.
00:14 sofar extreme weather changes are excepected as a result of global warming as demonstrated by weather models, including NOAA's weather model, the one Trump is in charge of.
00:17 IhrFussel The majority of US people refuses to accept that global warming is a thing last I heard
00:18 IhrFussel Or...not sure if it was majority or just a large part
00:21 rubenwardy http://climatecommunication.yale.edu/v​isualizations-data/ycom-us-2016/?est=h​appening&type=value&geo=county
00:25 IhrFussel That's what I meant actually...most Americans think the global warming is NOT mainly caused by humans which is total bollocks to think
00:26 rubenwardy that's not true
00:26 rubenwardy look at the scale
00:26 rubenwardy 52% think it's caused by humans
00:26 rubenwardy 34% think it's natural
00:26 rubenwardy 18% are unsure
00:26 rubenwardy 34% is rather a large percentage, but not "most"
00:27 rubenwardy according to that source, at least
00:27 rubenwardy people that do surveys based on climate change are more likely to care about it
00:30 IhrFussel True, in Germany it's 60% believe it's (mainly) human-made an 16% don't
00:31 IhrFussel Wait, 16% don't believe in it at all*
00:35 Fixer Shara: it was sarcastic
00:36 Shara When every other word is "shitty" it just sounds grouchy :)
00:36 Fixer rubenwardy: it can be both, natural and man-made
00:37 rubenwardy yes
00:37 Fixer Shara: when you have rain with +10*C, seriously, send Santa to ISIS
00:37 rubenwardy the question is about which one it is mostly
00:37 Fixer yeah
00:37 Fixer but it is happening
00:37 Shara Fixer: snow is practically a myth here :)
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00:38 Fixer now it seems like not a big problem, but in far future exsessive heat may melt some arctic ice may cause unwanted ocean level rise
00:39 Shara Well, some news would have you believe an ice age will magically come and buy us some more time... but that idea seems to do the rounds every so often
00:40 Shara And of course, we're already in one
00:41 shivajiva Trump could always nuke North Korea and cause a nuclear winter if he goes overboard, that would help :)
00:45 shivajiva the petrodollar would rise to an all time high and the energy companies could rip us off with impunity
00:46 shivajiva oh wait...that bit already happened
00:48 Fixer ocean level rise is particularly nasty
00:48 Fixer since so much population lives on low areas and in coastal areas
00:49 Fixer shivajiva: useful oil will raise in price, very probably, due to scarcity, and its consumption will be hugely decreased
00:49 Fixer problem is chemistry needs oil for a lot of stuff
00:50 Fixer now  you just stupiditly burning it
00:50 Fixer there will be change in the future, and not everyone will like it, and not everyone will buy new iphone every year, it is not sustainable in current way
00:52 Fixer it is pretty much: most of population does not care, business as usual, problems will be solved/mitigated when it is already fucked up too much, standard of living may decline (it is already declining in US)
00:53 Fixer maybe fusion reactor will solve energy problems, and our big roads will be electrified with those electrobuses everywhere
00:53 Fixer it is not ready yet, but they are getting closer
00:54 Fixer wonder if world moves back to coal ;)
00:54 Fixer when natural gas and oil is too expensive, business as usual goes horrible way instead of investing into fusion, cinical a bit
00:55 Fixer but again, probably 80% of population thinks: i will be fine, future generations - good luck, you are on your own
00:56 Fixer remember, GDP must flow, i mean grow
01:02 sofar goddamn ukrainian VPNs
01:02 sofar thousands of SASL logins on my dovecot
01:03 sofar grep 91.200.12 /var/log/mail.log|wc -l
01:03 sofar 28563
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04:53 Sokomine redblade7 asked me something related to server operations. i pointed to this channel as this is the right place for such things. hope that's ok?
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11:32 tenplus1 hi folks
11:32 tenplus1 Bonmeal mod updated to 0.7 - coral recipe for bonemeal added, api addition, can also grow papyrus and cactus now
11:33 Raven262 Hi ten
11:34 tenplus1 hi raven :)
11:34 Raven262 I had an idea, for improving toolranks trough a new mod.
11:34 tenplus1 ooh, do tell ?
11:35 Raven262 What if the tool would count how many of one node type the user has dug?
11:35 Raven262 For example, I can make my pickaxe count how many mese I've dug.
11:35 tenplus1 would be a rather large list considering how many nodes exist in default and using mods
11:36 Raven262 And thats why there is an other part of my idea.
11:36 Raven262 This counting of nodes can only be achieved if the user attaches a special gem to the tool.
11:36 Raven262 Which is already set to count a node type.
11:37 Raven262 SO not all nodes can be counted, but the important ones such as ores can.
11:37 Raven262 *So
11:37 Raven262 And this also adds space for some fancy crafting recipes.
11:37 Raven262 The gem info is stored in the metadata, changes no texture, just the description.
11:37 Raven262 I might try to make this^
11:38 tenplus1 you could make it as an addition to existing toolranks mod
11:38 Raven262 Nah, I'm more into making a gems mod with many fancy features such as this.
11:38 tenplus1 once you craft a new tool it uses a different function to dig/count
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11:39 tenplus1 also remember that on use doesnt supply node name, so to do this you could have to use get_node each time you dig, and with 20+ players on server it'll lag somewhat
11:39 tenplus1 just to check node names for special ores
11:40 Raven262 Hmm, right.
11:50 tenplus1 would be handy if the on_use function could supply node information as well, would save mods having to get it
11:50 tenplus1 and speed things up :D
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11:55 tenplus1 hi xerox
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12:20 tenplus1 hi fussel
12:21 IhrFussel Ok I'm crazy..I bought the Intel Xeon dedi even though it's pretty expensive ... compiling took 45 secs which is very nice but single core performance is the important part
12:21 IhrFussel Hello tenplus1
12:22 aerozoic hi tenplus1
12:22 tenplus1 o/ aerozoic
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12:35 Shara Hi all
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12:40 IhrFussel Will cancel the dedi again, up to 1.3 sec lag when I fly around on the map ... that's not much better than my old dedi
12:41 Shara Fussel, have you tested both all your mods on a new map, and without the mods you are using right now?
12:41 tenplus1 o/ shara
12:42 IhrFussel Shara, I'm testing an empty world now with just MTG and lag already spikes to 1+ sec at times ... that is a very bad sign
12:43 Shara Initial mapgen can spike lag, though I'm not sure if it should go that high
12:43 tenplus1 wait, did you say you have a single core ?
12:44 Shara I ran RC on a single core for a long time without problems.
12:44 Shara Two cores currently.
12:44 IhrFussel tenplus1, the dedi has 4 cores but htop displays 8 (hyperthreading?)
12:44 tenplus1 ah ok, have you set  num_emerge_cores = 4    in minetest.conf to assist mapgen
12:45 tenplus1 sorry,   num_emerge_threads = 4
12:45 IhrFussel All those cores don't help much when MT still only uses mainly 1 core of any machine... I checked a snglecore benchmark for the Intel Xeon and compared it to my AMD Opteron and the benchmark said it would be twice as fast...I don't see it
12:45 tenplus1 and:   server_dedicated = true
12:45 IhrFussel I set that to 3, doesn't help
12:46 VanessaE IhrFussel: especially if you have *any* mods that hook into the mapgen
12:46 tenplus1 true, voxelmanip will slow things down... also hi Vanessa
12:46 VanessaE hi
12:46 IhrFussel I have zero mods running outsie of MTG right now...let me check max_lag after just standing on the map for a few minutes
12:46 VanessaE well I meant Lua will force it down to 1 thread
12:47 IhrFussel 0.7 ... garbage
12:47 Shara If you have only MTG running on a new map and still don't like the performance, there is not much to say.
12:47 IhrFussel I will NOT pay $35/month for that crap
12:47 tenplus1 what OS on server ?
12:48 IhrFussel Ubuntu 16.04
12:49 IhrFussel Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E3-1230 V2 @ 3.30GHz << NOT recommended for MT
12:49 tenplus1 ah okie... have you tried adding 'noatime' to partitions in /etc/fstab   to reduce writes to drive, that helps somewhat
12:49 tenplus1 also setting    vm.swappiness = 10   at end of etc/sysctl.conf   helps too
12:50 IhrFussel It's the CPU that spikes when I fly around...it spikes to 50-90%
12:51 tenplus1 what gpu you using ?
12:51 IhrFussel I cannot tolerate this when several players move on the map the lag will be just as bad as on my old dedi ... cancelling before they charge me
12:51 IhrFussel Don't dedis always have integrated GPUs?
12:51 Shara Once map is generated, it's rare to get many players generating new map all at once
12:51 tenplus1 true
12:52 Shara And your map is already well developed, so your concern should be if normal map loading, not new map generation, causes lag
12:52 IhrFussel Shara, even after standing on the same spot for 5 minutes only reduces max_lag to 0.7
12:52 Shara With only MTG?
12:52 IhrFussel Yes
12:52 tenplus1 how many players connected ?
12:52 IhrFussel Only me
12:52 tenplus1 ssd ?
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12:53 IhrFussel No, the dedi got a 1 TB HDD but it's not the HDD ... there is nothing to load/save from/to HDD when only 1 player stands somewhere
12:53 tenplus1 you;d be surprised what gets accessed in the background at times
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12:54 tenplus1 have you tried using leveldb map instead of sql ?
12:54 tenplus1 hi evergreen
12:55 Shara I never saw any gain in performance from leveldb
12:55 tenplus1 wait, are you using Ubuntu with unity gui ?
12:56 IhrFussel When I compare this dedi#s lag times to my old dedi's lag times I see only a minor difference...a difference that's not worth paying $35 for ... I will just cancel this machine and stay on the VPS for now (the VPS can manage 0.15 max_lag with up to 5 players at once)
12:56 tenplus1 prolly easier for now
12:56 IhrFussel A dedi is a machine without DE it's all command line
12:56 tenplus1 just checking :PPP
12:57 Shara I'm just trying to work out how my VPS with 160+ mods even manages now
12:57 VanessaE remember that with a VPS you have to fight with other users for resources.
12:58 Shara Yet I get basically no problems ever
12:58 VanessaE same with my dedicated server.  it performs as I would expect it to
12:59 Shara 24 players currently. I don't get how this runs so well with so many mods when Fussel has such issues with just MTG
12:59 tenplus1 who are you getting dedi from fussel ??
13:01 IhrFussel VanessaE, I already have a dedi but its performance is pretty bad ... now someone here recommended me a VPS which worked fine the FIRST day (absolutely no lags) ... but then the nightmare started and I had hourly 30-60 secs lags (last night it was even 222 secs) and I decided to go for a more modern dedi but now I realized this new dedi isn't a lot better than my old one so I cancel it again
13:01 * VanessaE shrugs
13:02 tenplus1 do you guys do anything to optimize .conf for dedicated servers ?
13:02 VanessaE mine (from SoYouStart, a division of OVH) works fine for me
13:02 IhrFussel I'm not rich...very good dedis are too expensive for my budget ($100+)
13:02 VanessaE tenplus1:  not really, no.
13:02 VanessaE mine costs $42/mo
13:02 tenplus1 that's why we run a desktop :) ehehehe
13:03 IhrFussel I already cancelled my contract, hope they won't charge me before
13:03 VanessaE and yes, dedis usually have low-end onboard graphics/video, but minetestserver does not use the gpu.
13:04 * tenplus1 gives fussel's server some lucozade
13:05 Shara I thought I'd need a dedi given the way RC was growing, but tried upgrading to a slightly better VPS instead, and it turned out to be more than enough.
13:06 VanessaE I guess in my case a dedi is needed since I run several MT instances
13:06 tenplus1 how many you got now Vanessa ?
13:06 Shara Yea, I'd need to switch if I wanted to start more servers.
13:07 Shara sniper is hosting DarkLands as it is though, and TPS hosts my third servers that may or may not ever open publically.
13:07 VanessaE tenplus1: my 5 plus like 4 or 5 that I host for others.
13:07 IhrFussel Shara, you most likely just have very good luck that the other customers in the same cluster don't exceed the usage
13:08 Shara Fussel, hard to say. I have a history of crazy luck when it comes to this kind of thing, but other people have done fine with VPS as well.
13:08 IhrFussel I'm not sure what kind of script makes all customers lag for 200+ secs...it must be some stupid backup script or so
13:08 VanessaE looks like there are only 7 total right now, at least that are announcing to the master list
13:09 tenplus1 fussel: sounds silly but have you tried disabling rollback and anticheat ?
13:09 IhrFussel That's not it...when the VPS lags a long time I see the load going up up to 3-5
13:10 Shara I seem to get the full resources I should on my VPS.
13:10 VanessaE 9 total running on the server.  guess a couple of them just don't announce.
13:10 IhrFussel The lags mainly happen every full hour ... it must be some expensive cron or whatever
13:11 tenplus1 fussel: I know that may not be the initial problem, but the tips I'm giving you were used to bring Xanadu's lag right down and it definitely helped
13:12 IhrFussel Rollback is enabled and to disable anticheat allows Android users to dig nodes from far away (300 nodes or so)
13:13 IhrFussel 0.4.16 or an earlier Android version introduced that interact bug...it only happens when in 3rd person view
13:13 tenplus1 *shakes fist at android bugs*
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13:14 tenplus1 hi Jordach
13:15 Shara Well, I literally can't run anticheat on my servers without a load of other things being spoiled for players... not a fun dilema
13:15 IhrFussel tenplus1, fixed in 0.5.0 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/6187
13:16 tenplus1 w00t...  cant wait for 0.5 release...
13:16 IhrFussel Wait it's part of 0.4.17
13:17 tenplus1 even better
13:17 VanessaE is 0.4.17 coming out soon?
13:18 IhrFussel Is game.cpp client side?
13:18 VanessaE server
13:19 IhrFussel Ok then it should be fixed in 0.4.17 servers no matter which version the client has
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13:21 IhrFussel VanessaE, I was asking last night whether or not 0.4.17 would be an "official" release in the play store and someone only said likely just 0.5.0
13:22 tenplus1 in which case I want 0.5.0 more...
13:22 IhrFussel Not sure about other places like websites ... but seems like "0.4.17" is really just meant for server bugfixes
13:23 VanessaE well, idc about play stores or whatever
13:24 sfan5 IhrFussel: that's the plan yes
13:24 VanessaE since I run a real PC.
13:24 sfan5 i mean 0.4.17 is a good idea for clients too, but it won't be released on the play store as 0.5.x is the real successor
13:24 tenplus1 :P
13:24 Shara You can't enforce people to use an updated client unless compatibility breaks anyway
13:25 Shara 0.4.17 is important for servers far more than clients
13:25 tenplus1 yeah, will be using that when it's out to fix many issues
13:26 lisac hey tenplus1
13:26 lisac when is .5 coming out?
13:26 IhrFussel tenplus1, you can already use it when you compile backport-0.4 branch
13:26 IhrFussel You mean 0.5.0?
13:26 lisac yeah, that's .5.
13:27 IhrFussel 0.5.0 has no release date yet ... last I heard was Feb/Mar 2018
13:27 Shara Better to get it right than rush release
13:28 IhrFussel "You mean 0.5.0" was directed at tenplus1 though sorry xP
13:28 tenplus1 I d ont compile my builds, I get 'em from launchpad on the ubuntu/mint unstable build
13:29 IhrFussel Well let's hope that the PPAs will get updated with 0.4.17 then
13:29 tenplus1 bloody hope so
13:35 * tenplus1 is off to nom chili... laters all
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13:47 IhrFussel There are IRC channels where you can get a VPS/dedi? Doesn't sound very reliable
13:50 Jordach ^#
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13:58 VanessaE sfan5: maybe you remember: there was a PR, since merged into the 0.5.0 codebase, to fix dig drops not inheriting the param2 color of the node that was dug...but for the life of me, I can't find it.
13:59 sfan5 hm
14:00 VanessaE I just want to request that it be backported to 0.4.x
14:01 VanessaE it's the last piece of the puzzle needed so that unified dyes can support colored itemstacks
14:01 sfan5 this one? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/71b02d626f4a9629e0f282adef908eedc8ed252a
14:02 VanessaE no, not that.. all I can remember, and I'm not sure of this much now, was that the issue number was some assortment of 6's, 4's 0's and maybe 2's :)
14:03 sfan5 but that's the exact commit implementing saving of the color to item meta
14:04 VanessaE nono, there was another, regarding auto-inheritance
14:04 sfan5 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/6604 ?
14:05 sfan5 that used to have auto-inheritance but was changed to use a callback for flexibility reasons
14:05 VanessaE no, it was by juhdanad I'm pretty sure
14:07 sfan5 how about this https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/0fcaf9fb1b61caaf8ed78a5d3005b1d9d1c43b57
14:07 sfan5 if that's not it then i don't know what you mean
14:07 IhrFussel I just found a root server with 8 dedicated cores and 120 GB SSD for $25/month ... the CPU seems to be not much better than my Opteron though > Intel® Xeon® E5-2680V4
14:08 sfan5 a xeon will definitely be better than some opteron from 2009
14:08 * VanessaE keeps searching
14:08 IhrFussel I just had a Xeon and the max_lag was almost as high as on my Opteron
14:09 IhrFussel You need to check singlecore performance and it's not a lot better
14:12 sfan5 lol what
14:12 sfan5 IhrFussel: https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare.php?cmp[]=2779&cmp[]=1406
14:13 VanessaE sfan5: actually, I think 71b02d62 *is* the one I had in mind
14:13 IhrFussel sfan5, how did max_lag stay at ~ 0.6 then?
14:14 sfan5 no idea, there's many more factors to that than just the CPU
14:14 IhrFussel Your benchmark doesn't compare singlecore performance.... look at this http://cpuboss.com/cpus/Intel-​E5-2680V4-vs-AMD-Opteron-1381
14:14 VanessaE hah!  https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/6042
14:15 sfan5 IhrFussel: it does actually, look above the red numbers: 1782 (xeon) vs 915 (opteron)
14:15 sfan5 not sure what site cpuboss.com is but it doesn't seem to be any good
14:17 VanessaE sfan5: ^^ that was the issue number.  I'd like to request that it be backported (not necessarily by you, just whoever).  being all Lua, I Imagine it's not too hard?
14:18 sfan5 added it to the TODO
14:18 sfan5 lua or not it's only "hard" when merge conficts occurr
14:18 VanessaE thanks :)
14:18 VanessaE at least I was right about the selection of digits in the issue number ;)
14:19 VanessaE wow, that's some list.
14:21 IhrFussel sfan5, I had nothing else running, the RAM is DDR3 and the HDD doesn't matter since I didn't move during the time frame and max_lag *still* was at ~ 0.7 ... that screams weak single core power at me
14:21 sfan5 was that on a vps?
14:21 IhrFussel No, dedi
14:21 sfan5 no idea then
14:21 sfan5 on paper the Xeon is definitely better
14:22 IhrFussel htop showed minetestserver @ 50-90% CPU usage whenever I was flying around...sounds a bit much
14:25 Shara Hmmm... 28/30 players causes my server to drop right down the list
14:25 Shara Yes my survival at 18/22 is quite high
14:26 * Shara continues to find the server list ranking weird
14:26 sfan5 the algorithm penalizes highly loaded servers
14:26 IhrFussel sfan5, E3-1230v2 was the CPU I had on the test dedi
14:26 IhrFussel E5 seems to be a bit higher in single core power
14:27 Shara sfan5: You are really making it so servers that don't allow high numbers of players can never be at the top anymore then?
14:27 sfan5 i don't understand your question
14:27 sfan5 also it wasn't me who designed this algo
14:28 Shara I don't object to not being at the top, but I do find the situation really silly
14:28 Shara Hometown certainly never scores as high as it seems it should, to give another example
14:29 sfan5 improvements welcome https://github.com/minetest/master-s​erver/blob/master/server.py#L303L344
14:30 Shara Hmm, might think about it.
14:30 Shara It's no criticism of you either way.
14:42 Krock rubenwardy, you could add one or multiple "safety" slots to the player's inventories which require a certain score in the running game in order to be used
14:43 Shara So a person respawns, who can't be killed for some seconds, with a good weapon ready to use? :P
14:55 Krock not saying that they can use it for the first seconds. i.e. not in the "main" inventory
15:14 rubenwardy IhrFussel, that Xeon should be more than enough
15:15 rubenwardy how are you reading the CPU percentage?
15:15 IhrFussel rubenwardy, E5 will be likely enough, E3 definitely wasn't
15:15 rubenwardy usually % is terms of cores, so 400% is complete usage
15:15 IhrFussel You know that MT runs on one core
15:15 rubenwardy emerge threads
15:15 rubenwardy and networking
15:15 rubenwardy but you have some very heavy mods
15:15 IhrFussel I don't care about mapgen, I want much power for my mods
15:16 rubenwardy well, the CPU is enough for Minetest, just not for you
15:16 IhrFussel No, I had it run just a test world with MTG and max_lag never went below 0.5
15:17 rubenwardy also "it's not the hdd" -> try dummy backend to verify this
15:17 rubenwardy I mean you can't now you've cancelled
15:17 IhrFussel It doesn't matter now, I just realized how greedy the my current hoster is and chose a product from another smaller one now...I pay $15 per month for 4 cores+ 12 GB RAM + 120 GB SSD
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15:18 rubenwardy nice
15:18 IhrFussel I wonder how they can make it that cheap but I'll trust them
15:19 IhrFussel It's a root server though not "real" dedi... so it's virtual but dedicated
15:23 IhrFussel The only problem I got is that they sent me a contract which I need to print and send back to them...and I got no printer :/
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15:31 * Jordach dies laughing at rubenwardy's email
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15:55 red-001 looks like minetesthosting went down
15:57 rubenwardy yup
15:58 rubenwardy and the average quality of servers has thus increased
15:58 rubenwardy just need CTF to go down now, for the quality to raise further!
16:00 red-001 lol
16:01 rubenwardy <CTF_Bot> *** minecraft joined the game
16:01 rubenwardy shieeeettt
16:02 red-001 the minetest.com page sure is old
16:03 rubenwardy yup
16:03 rubenwardy and the owner is AWOL
16:03 Sokomine VanessaE: i'm on 0.4.16x and digged blocks inherit their color. what is keeping me from getting further with circular saw support for the colored blocks is that i have to set up color matching (translation from 256 colors for full block to 8 colors for stair shape) manually. it would help a lot if i'd be able to read the palette directly and be able to find out which colors are the same
16:04 Sokomine and not just in one mod but in a more general lib
16:07 VanessaE Sokomine: digged blocks with a custom drop (e.g. stone -> cobble) don't inherit.
16:12 CWz VanessaE,  are you able to compile the backport branch on your server?
16:14 Shara Now RC is #1 on the list with only 12 players? And DL at 21/22 is second? While other servers have 30+ players and come much lower... I don't understand
16:15 VanessaE CWz: I'm waiting for a few things to go in first
16:15 CWz might need to update your version of gcc
16:15 rubenwardy Shara, CTF just restarted ;)
16:16 Shara rubenwardy: It's just about how senseless it is
16:16 Krock Shara, not only the user count matters. much depends on the player names (no 3/4 digit endings) or the age
16:17 rubenwardy DL has a lot of users with 3 numbers
16:17 Shara When RC was at 28/30 earlier, it fell way outside the top ten, but at 12/35 it can hit #1. Yet DL just 1 below cap with a lower maximum can hit 2nd?
16:17 rubenwardy RC doesn't
16:17 Shara Which should bring it down.
16:17 Shara It at close to cap DL ranks high while RC at close to cap just drops right down
16:18 Shara Yet at*
16:21 Fixer rubenwardy: high quality players (c)
16:23 red-001 (TM) (R)
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16:25 red-001 wtf?
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16:27 Sokomine VanessaE: aah. yes, i remember. you mentionned that. however...cobble...is bad in most ways. just returning the colored stone would be best...
16:28 red-001 bigfoot547, what was that about?
16:29 red-001 ah I see linode got k-lined
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17:16 Fixer COBOL
17:18 IhrFussel How can I imagine a root server with dedicated cores? A root server is also a form of VPS no?
17:20 Calinou don't let your root servers be dreams
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17:23 IhrFussel Calinou, the description says "Our root servers combine the advantages of virtual and dedicated servers. Despite virtualization the root servers provide guaranteed Intel® XEON® Broadwell® CPU cores and fast DDR4 main memory (RAM)."
17:23 Calinou doesn't that mean you get a full machine, but intended for virtualization?
17:24 IhrFussel I chose the 2nd https://www.netcup.eu/vserver/#features
17:28 IhrFussel Maybe their virtualization software allows to split full cores between customers?? IDK
17:31 red-001 IhrFussel, that sounds like marketing mumbo jumbo
17:31 IhrFussel red-001, the VPS description mentions "Only the dedicated CPU cores, the satisfaction guarantee and the very high guaranteed average annual minimum availability of at least 99.9% are not included in the VPS system."
17:33 IhrFussel I don't think companies in Germany are allowed to mention "dedicated" where it#s not
17:34 IhrFussel The root server's CPU is the same across all plans "Intel® Xeon® E5-2680V4" ... the VPS CPU is the same across all plans "Intel® vCore"
17:35 red-001 so I guess they pin one cpu core to the vm and call it dedicated?
17:41 IhrFussel I'll see what I get... in case they really lied to me and I have inconsistent performance I can just cancel it again I guess
17:44 IhrFussel I found another hoster with root servers mentioning "guaranteed" performance: Full virtualization of the root server provides you guaranteed resources in terms of CPU and RAM.
17:45 red-001 if you think it's false advertisement you could report them to a consumer protection watchdog
18:02 Fixer c o m p i l e  t i m e
18:08 Jordach IhrFussel: scaleway does hand out dedis like candy
18:08 Jordach jordach.net runs it
18:09 IhrFussel I feel more comfortable with a German hoster, sorry :/ But is what netcup advertizes possible? To map full cores to certain customers?
18:09 Jordach core affinity
18:10 Jordach cores can be locked to KVM processes
18:10 Jordach but if one needs more load, the affinity generally stops working until the load dies down
18:10 IhrFussel So will I have guaranteed CPU power at any time?
18:11 Jordach yes
18:11 Jordach you will have close to 100% power at any given moment
18:11 Jordach per "core"
18:11 IhrFussel So other customers cannot make me lag for 30+ secs?
18:11 Jordach only in certain circumstances
18:12 Fixer lol, cheap hosting sucks these days
18:12 Jordach by certain, i mean the 1 or 2 other users of that machine
18:12 Calinou Fixer: not necessarily
18:12 IhrFussel But they say I get more than "vCores"
18:13 Fixer the worst was LazyJ server hoster, constant max_lag 6-8 with just one player and even his ssh lagged, what a pos, he switched it to better one
18:13 Krock virtual cores?
18:13 Jordach with the jetpack and my server generating *new* mapblocks i can't get max_lag over 0.5
18:14 IhrFussel vCores are only mentioned in the vServer (VPS) section not in the root server section
18:17 Jordach root server may be actually a true dedi
18:17 Jordach but not in the sense of a real dedi
18:18 Jordach aka it's a dedi that gets reformatted constantly
18:18 Jordach why waste old hardware when you can make cheap re-usable dedis from it
18:19 Jordach my current dedi is SSDs top to bottom
18:19 IhrFussel I really don't know...I just see "4 dedicated cores" and therefore expect full 4 cores to be mine and only mine
18:20 Jordach it's just a VM with less users at any given time essentially
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18:29 IhrFussel Jordach, they offer a site that shows the differences between vps and root https://www.netcup.eu/vserver/​vergleich-root-server-vps.php
18:30 Jordach IhrFussel: they're VPS
18:30 Jordach Despite virtualization the root servers
18:30 Jordach just with more affinity over other processes
18:33 IhrFussel It says "these cores will not be shared with other systems" isn't that a lie then?
18:33 Jordach cores can be locked with affinity
18:33 Jordach except in certain cases your spare power will compensate for a while
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18:55 benrob0329 Idea for end-portal type effect: use an ignore type block that shows the skybox, and change the skybox
18:58 benrob0329 Or we could ask for a skybox drawtype
18:59 Jordach pls gib borderless item_image_buttons
19:19 benrob0329 Can you change player buoyancy?
19:19 Calinou yes, but it doesn't work very well in practice, I tried
19:19 Calinou there's one or two minetest.conf settings for that
19:19 Calinou also, liquid viscosity (per-node)
19:20 benrob0329 Hmm
19:20 benrob0329 Boats need to be redone
19:20 benrob0329 Boat elevators might actually be viable if boats themselves didn't suck (no offence, they just do)
19:25 benrob0329 Calinou: per player buoyancy?
19:57 Fixer btw, boats and carts in mc beta suck a lot
20:13 Sokomine Jordach: power consumption of old hardware may be much higher than new hw
20:14 Jordach you still have to *sell* it
20:15 Krock Sokomine, also consider production and recycling energy
20:16 Sokomine Krock: i don't think hosters count that way. disposal may be an issue. but old hw needs more energy -> more cooling -> expensive!. ok, german hosters move to france where energy is cheper, so...probably it's worth keeping old hw there
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20:55 Jordach https://i.imgur.com/73r3Eep.jpg
20:56 sofar that 90s button shading
20:56 Jordach but i like win 9x
20:56 Krock that Alt+Printscreen instead of F12
20:56 Jordach two step operation to upload
20:57 Krock save your screenies to a synced cloud directory?
20:57 Jordach bitch, does it look like i have a server with sharex support....wait a second
20:58 Krock bro, the second is over
20:59 Jordach https://jordach.net/images/dtlzqvelvslapygsvl.png
20:59 Krock sofar, irrlicht's buttons aren't that much better regarding the shading :P
21:00 Krock topkek
21:00 * sofar has 'printscreen' bound to script that uses `import` and automatically uploads to imgur, while making a log entry for posterity in ~/.imgur.log with the URL
21:00 sofar $ wc -l ~/.imgur.log
21:00 sofar 394 /home/sofar/.imgur.log
21:01 sofar https://i.imgur.com/oCJMpCi.png
21:01 Sokomine Jordach: looks nice, yet...it doesn't have those nice practical buttons unified_inventory has. that copy-to-craft-grid, the serach button for receipes and the general setup are very useful
21:02 Krock sofar, nice one :)
21:02 sofar at one point I even had a local web script to pull all of the screenshots into a viewable page, lol
21:03 sofar but the fact I can screenshot a region, a window or the desktop with one button and be done, saves a bunch of time
21:03 sofar it even opens a browser window with the uploaded screenshot
21:04 sofar https://gist.github.com/sofar/1​13c9be7256a37ef1d3e2c328ea5b322
21:18 octacian I just have a simple python script rubenwardy gave me to allow right-clicking on pictures and directly uploading them to a VPS.
21:34 * Jordach sits back
21:38 Calinou ShareX does this easily
21:38 Calinou I should look into setting `incron` up for doing something like that
21:38 Calinou optimizing using oxipng, then uploading via SFTP to my server
21:39 Calinou (incron is like cron, but does things when files are added/modified/removed)
21:39 Calinou or is there a better alternative to incron?
21:39 Calinou (it's to be used on a client PC, so it should stay simple enough)
21:46 Jordach Calinou: >2018
21:46 Jordach >PNG optimisation
21:52 Calinou Jordach: it can bring 30%+ gains on screenshots
21:52 Calinou usually above 10%
21:52 Calinou so it's worth it, and takes a few seconds at most with oxipng (which is multi-threaded)
21:53 Jordach >460 bytes per PNG in some cases
21:53 red-001 maybe emacs has something, it's a pretty good OS, just missing a decent text editor
21:59 benrob0329 Calinou: >sftp in 2017
21:59 benrob0329 Rsync master race :^)
22:05 Krock me: https://i.imgur.com/CMfpZ5x.gif
22:38 Jordach sofar: mind announcing you're streaming sometime
22:40 xerox123 do people still need to be whitelisted for the server list?
22:42 Calinou benrob0329: it doesn't need to be incremental, scp/sftp works fine for this
22:43 Calinou it's fast and secure
22:43 Calinou Jordach: nah, over 1 MB on many PNGs I've tried
22:44 red-001_ sofar, nice mapgen
22:52 benrob0329 Calinou: s/ftp is not fast
22:53 benrob0329 Nor is it stable
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23:04 Sokomine qbruell :welcomes the year 2018 and wishes all a happy new year
23:04 * Sokomine welcomes the year 2018 and wishes all a happy new year
23:05 ThomasMonroe happy new year to you too Sokomine
23:05 * red-001_ guess $current_year is going to be the year of the Linux desktop
23:06 EvergreenTree joined #minetest-hub
23:06 red-001_ happy new year to you too ThomasMonroe and Sokomine
23:06 ThomasMonroe thanks red-001_
23:08 Calinou happy new year!
23:09 benrob0329 Its still 2017 here
23:09 benrob0329 Hello people of the future, how is it?
23:10 ThomasMonroe same here for me
23:11 IhrFussel Happy New Year!
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23:13 lisac Happy new year
23:13 lisac aaand good night
23:14 ThomasMonroe night lisac
23:16 Sokomine benrob0329: so far quite good. bit too bright outside to enjoy any firework; also too warm for this time of year
23:16 Sokomine benrob0329: you can come over to 2018 once your time zone catches up. mt still runs in 2018 :-)
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