Time Nick Message 00:44 * Natechip read writes his website 00:56 paramat hm now there's #AngelX007GR' doing it too 00:57 paramat 2 posts reported 00:59 Natechip paramat: doing? 01:01 paramat just the usual server thread whining 'y u ban me!?' 01:04 Natechip hehe 01:05 paramat i suspect i won't be made a forum moderator because i would be too good at it ;] 01:06 rubenwardy is swearing allowed on the forums? 01:09 Shara It has seemed tolerated. 01:10 benrob0329 I would assume an excess of it might get you a warning 01:11 rubenwardy I'm not really sure what to do with those replies 01:12 Shara I'm scared to ask which... 01:12 rubenwardy the complaints are mostly becoming circular 01:12 rubenwardy Xanadu 01:13 Shara ugh 01:14 Natechip i thought the server doesnt take players 01:14 Shara To be honest, I think if a server admin asks for their thread to be cleared of such junk, it should be. 01:14 Natechip i thought it has border on 01:15 Shara Natechip: servers that use borders generally have good reason to 01:16 Shara I've done the same thing on several occasions 01:16 Natechip Shara: so have I, i dont see why Xanadu has it on 01:17 rubenwardy I'm generally against censoring criticism, and I don't know much about the context. I'm inclined to believe that they were banned with a reason and told this reason, and they're just kicking up a fuss for the sake of it 01:17 Shara rubenwardy: criticism is one thing, but pages of derailed topic where it's just the same thing over and over? 01:18 Shara And it's not like this seems unique to the Xanadu topic either 01:18 Natechip that is true Shara 01:18 Natechip ive had a few cases where ppl are asking to be unbanned 01:20 Sokomine fixer: looks very nice. is that plant in mtg now? 01:20 Shara I don't have forum topics precisely because I don't want this kidn of nonsense to deal with. 01:20 Shara kind* 01:21 Natechip id rather use a GitHub Pages website 01:21 Natechip lol 01:21 Sokomine perhaps you ought to ask tenplus1 regarding the xanandu thread. he ought to at least be able to figure out what's going on 01:21 Shara I have a site where I post news for the servers. 01:21 Natechip Shara: link 01:22 Shara rc.minetest.tv 01:22 Shara It's nothing too fancy, but does the job 01:23 rubenwardy here's mine: https://ctf.rubenwardy.com/ 01:23 Shara Ugh, rubenwardy's site wins :( 01:23 Natechip lol 01:24 Natechip :) 01:24 rubenwardy :) 01:24 rubenwardy I need to get my CTF stats to HTML script up again 01:24 Natechip rubenwardy I love the pure CSS and HTML5 there 01:24 Shara So clean. 01:24 Natechip just beautiful 01:25 jas_ wow there's a pr for bindable dig/place... after all this time i might be able to use mouse2 to +moveup again. :') 01:29 rubenwardy it would make me feel lot better to hand out temp bans if they had actually said their ban reasons, and they kept arguing 01:30 Flairieve hi 01:30 Shara Hello and welcome. 01:32 Flairieve So I was wondering can minetest.after because used only to wait for five seconds without calling any functions? 01:32 Natechip Shara how is sban 01:32 Shara Working well, as is sauth 01:38 Natechip ool 01:38 Natechip cool 01:38 Shara Flairieve: what are you hoping to do? 01:41 Flairieve I was going to try and make a little query machine that mine a 16x16 grid and it mines a block every five seconds 01:42 Shara So it runs continuously? 01:49 Flairieve Yea it runs continuously until it can find no more nodes 01:49 Flairieve I was also going to plan it so you could upgrade the amount of time it takes to mine a node 01:54 Shara If it wasn't so late here, I would be tempted to play around to try and solve it. 01:55 paramat unfortunately i can't see a rule about swearing in the forum 01:56 paramat but it shouldn't be allowed, because if it was, the forum would become unbearable 01:56 rubenwardy I don't think it should be fully disallowed, but dissuaded 01:57 rubenwardy so the occasional s-word is fine, but not every post :/ 01:57 Shara Difficulty is deciding where to draw the line. 01:58 rubenwardy it's not that bad currently outside of that thread 01:58 Flairieve Why not censor the cuss words in black boxes were someone has to hover over them to reveal them? 01:59 Flairieve Though cussing is no issue to me 01:59 rubenwardy Scunthorpe 01:59 rubenwardy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scunthorpe_problem 01:59 Flairieve ah ok nvm 01:59 VanessaE ..not to mention people will always find a way around such filters. 01:59 VanessaE ass -> a$$ and so on. 02:00 Shara I also don't think it really helps people who are bothered by the words. 02:00 Shara Might even encourage people to swear more. 02:00 Flairieve I'm not bothered by any word or cuss word I'm fine with it I was just suggesting ways if you wanted to censor some words :P 02:01 Shara Flairieve: Personally I couldn't care, but it's about what sort of impression if makes... Given MT is played by children, and can be used in educational settings. 02:02 Shara it* 02:02 paramat yeah 02:02 Shara (and yes,I'm fully aware children can be the worst offenders and certainly say it elsewhere - but that's not the point) 02:03 paramat a teacher has told me they can lose their job over language in the code, so we removed all WTFPL licenses 02:04 Shara I've had parents play with their children on my servers. Main thing they have cared about is whether the chat their children are exposed to is appropriate 02:04 paramat there's still some fruity language in the C++ code 02:06 VanessaE "fruity"... 02:06 VanessaE now that's a new way to describe it. :) 02:06 Shara :D 02:07 Shara I was trying to resist :P 02:07 paramat hehe 02:09 paramat anyway yes 'dissuaded', and of course it depends on the words used 02:10 paramat and the frequency 02:12 Shara And whether they are specifically directed at someone or just general. 02:16 paramat crumbs that leave message =/ =) 02:17 Shara paramat: they don't really bother me 02:17 rubenwardy doesn't bother me :P 02:21 paramat ok i'll disable them for myself then :] 02:23 Shara :) 02:23 Shara But getting late. Good night. 04:04 * benrob0329 sets #1235 down, and walks away 04:21 * Natechip picks up #1235 and runs from benrob0329 04:27 Flairieve Shouldn't z be up and down 04:27 benrob0329 Flairieve: different standards for axis 04:27 benrob0329 Left vs right hand I believe 04:28 Flairieve https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cartesian_coordinate_system#Three_dimensions 04:28 Flairieve It shows on wikipedia that Z axis goes up and down 04:28 benrob0329 There are two standards 04:28 benrob0329 Some things use Z up and others use Z depth 04:29 Flairieve So I guess Y acts like Z? 04:29 Flairieve and Z acts like Y? 04:30 benrob0329 Yes, I suppose 04:31 Flairieve Wikipedia only just shows the default I don't see why Minetest is using Y as Z? That is really confusing. 04:31 benrob0329 Z is the extra axis when going from 2D to 3D, X and Y are historically 2D screen space. So it would make sense that computers would use z as depth 04:31 Flairieve well I suppose that makes little bit of sense? 04:35 benrob0329 Flairieve: https://www.blender.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11337 04:35 Flairieve I also guess that make 90deg up right pixel art is more easier since you just have to focus on x and y lol 08:36 red-001 whats with the forum and an obsession with god? There was that forum thread and half the signitures are about it 09:01 Raven262 red-001, That was kids debating stuff that they know nothing about. 10:40 DI3HARD139 Quick question. I'm still relatively new to registering nodes so this confused the ____ out of me. Not sure if this is a compatibility issue with technic or 'slopes' of the moreblocks mod. https://pastebin.com/sBe4N1Pq 10:42 red-001 wb neinwhal2 10:43 neinwhal woops 12:40 atorian37 what is it about when a player tells me that since the update from 0.4.15 to 0.4.16 he cannot run anymore? I made an update to 0.4.16 and forced the strict protocol so he had to update the client too 13:30 Fixer his hacks no longer work? %) 13:34 atorian37 no idea what he means...^O^ 13:37 red-001 atorian37, do they have fast? 13:52 CWz is there a way to combat this: https://github.com/red-001/colour_chat.git 13:53 Shara CWz: Bans work well :) 13:54 * Shara can't wait for the ability to disable CSM 13:54 red-001 CWz, filter colours 13:54 red-001 I think it got into 0.4.16 13:54 CWz how 13:54 red-001 it's a server setting 13:54 Shara I didn't think that was in stable for some reason 13:55 red-001 oh you are right 13:55 Shara I mostly hate how it messes up my logs. 13:55 Shara So players currently get a warning, and if they refuse to disable it, they can leave. 13:56 Shara I've never yet actually needed to bans omeone though. 13:56 Shara Most are pretty understanding if you explain to them. 13:56 red-001 what data was 0.4.16 released on again? 13:56 red-001 date* 13:56 Shara June 3rd? 13:56 Shara I think 13:57 DI3HARD139 That'd be correct 13:57 red-001 ahh it was merged on jun 10 13:57 CWz is there any way to port the setting to 0.4.16 13:58 Shara I think quite a few server owners voiced frustration around then 13:58 red-001 should be possible 13:58 red-001 I will open a pr for backporting it 13:58 CWz thanks 13:58 Shara :) 14:04 DI3HARD139 @CWz "strip_color_codes = true" 14:05 DI3HARD139 in the minetest.conf 14:08 IhrFussel Hello there 14:08 DI3HARD139 Hello IhrFussel 14:12 IhrFussel I modified the mobs redo API a lot... owned mobs receive EXP when they kill other mobs and can level up ... owned mobs will heal every 2 secs a bit if they are not in a battle ... aggressive mobs have a permanent nametag color 14:13 IhrFussel And the nametag doesn't switch between name/HP modes ... the name + HP can be seen at all times now 14:27 red-001 CWz, Shara https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/6541 14:33 Fixer ｅｖｅｒｙｂｏｄｙ　ｍｏｖｅ　ｙｏｕｒ　ｂｏｄｙ 14:44 Natechip Fixer: okay!! 14:45 CalebDavis hi Nate 14:56 ThomasMonroe hey Natechip 14:56 red-001 ｅｖｅｒｙｂｏｄｙ　ｄｏ　ｔｈｅ　ｆｌｏｐ 14:56 red-001 ａｎｄ　Ｖａｐｏｕｒｗａｖｅ 14:56 benrob0329 *splat* 14:57 benrob0329 \/music plays 15:06 * ThomasMonroe gets a kink in the back from dancing terribly 15:14 * jas_ does the salmon dance 15:24 * CalebDavis does the CD flop 15:24 CalebDavis thats when i trip and slide across the floor 15:39 ThomasMonroe XD 15:39 ThomasMonroe as usual 15:39 CalebDavis XD 16:11 tenplus1 hi folks 16:17 tenplus1 o/ paramat 16:18 Shara Hi Ten 16:18 tenplus1 hi Shara 16:18 CalebDavis hi ten 16:18 tenplus1 hey caleb 16:20 * twoelk waves a late o/ 16:20 tenplus1 ehe, hi twoelk 16:24 * tenplus1 has noms 16:26 benrob0329 Hi tenplus1 16:26 tenplus1 h ben 16:26 tenplus1 *hi :P 16:33 rubenwardy hi all o/ 16:34 paramat Shara i made this high priority https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5334 "Auth.txt causing large lag spikes" if helpful maybe you could add comments from your experience? 16:34 tenplus1 hi ruben, thanks for that post on forum :P 16:37 Krock hi tenplus1 16:37 tenplus1 hi Krock :) 16:41 * sofar wonders if Twoelk ever will redo his box 16:42 twoelk ? 16:42 tenplus1 hi Darcidride 16:42 tenplus1 Box Redo... ehehehe 16:42 sofar wasn't it you who submitted a box on Inside the Box? 16:42 sofar maybe someone else with a similar name 16:43 tenplus1 how many boxes you got now sofar ? 16:43 sofar http://minetest.foo-projects.org/boxes.html 16:43 sofar about 50, there's some that are in 2 series 16:43 * twoelk tries to disengage his brain from work and rushes to the mt department in the attics of his brain, looks around - is puzzled 16:44 tenplus1 heh 16:44 twoelk don't think I made any boxes lately 16:44 sofar must have been someone else then :) 16:44 twoelk seems so 16:45 sofar tenplus1: seems we're doing 2-3 decent boxes a week, so, if we keep this up for a year or so we'll have 200+ boxes 16:45 twoelk no, I'm pretty sure now I never made any boxes on your server :-( 16:45 tenplus1 not bad... the list grows ;P 16:45 sofar twoelk: tssss, what a shame :) 16:45 twoelk indeed 16:45 twoelk lots of rl work lately 16:46 sofar yeah, that was the goal - get a content creation flow that sustains itself 16:46 sofar it's not even so bad that players play for a few weeks, build a box or two, and then only come back once in a while 16:46 sofar with new boxes coming out once in a while, they'll keep hopping back on 16:47 sofar I might have to do some newsletter or mailing, at some point 16:48 Shara paramat: replied there before I even saw your message :) 16:48 twoelk actually I do have a handfull of projects on different servers that I do still keep thinking about - but - alas so little time - the dark season is approaching so hopefully I'll get more time for minetest 16:49 tenplus1 I hear ya twoelk... so little time indeed 16:51 Darcidride Hi everyone 16:52 tenplus1 o/ 16:52 twoelk for example xanadu - big plans I still have there - did some measuring lately, redid some basic plans - not much to be seen though 16:52 tenplus1 I redid lucky blocks to have a more random selection, players were getting fancy armor too easily :D 16:53 paramat thanks 16:53 twoelk sometimes I just forget the time in them tunnels and caves or simply wandering through the beauty of the landscape 16:53 tenplus1 mapgens can be very interesting, even the new carth one 16:54 tenplus1 hi nrz 16:58 nerzhul hi tenplus1 17:14 Raven262 Hi tenplus1 17:14 tenplus1 hi raven 17:15 nerzhul please vote: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/6542 17:16 tenplus1 wait, I thought we were going straight to 0.5.0 ??? 17:16 VanessaE nerzhul: I think we need a list of 0.4.17 milestones first. 17:16 tenplus1 o/ Vanessa 17:16 VanessaE hi 17:16 sofar 0.4.17 is a bugfix release, it shouldn't have milestones 17:17 VanessaE sofar: s/milestones/changes/ 17:17 Krock ^ only a list of bugs to backport 17:17 nerzhul 0.4.17 is a milestone iself 17:17 Krock s/bugs/bugfixes/ 17:17 VanessaE not only bugs, but one or two feature-ish things 17:17 sofar Krock: lol, bugs to backport :P 17:17 VanessaE (like colored itemstack drop inheritance) 17:17 Krock sofar, yeah. the mistake was not intended :3 17:19 nerzhul tenplus1, we are going to 0.5.0 but it's accepted that we will have a bugfix 0.4.17 release (without mtg which goes to 0.5) to fix core engine issue during the devel time 17:20 nerzhul red-001, i'm anoying to see you don't reproduced the problem, did you use windows threads or linux on mingw ? 17:20 nerzhul red-001, because i'm building with VS 17:20 nerzhul wow GH implemented now the create label on addition, gitlab has it since ages :p 17:21 jas_ let's go five oh 17:22 tenplus1 +1... would rather have a new base for mods to build from rather than 0.4.17 17:23 red-001 nerzhul, I honestly don't know I just went with whatever default the cross compiler used 17:23 VanessaE tenplus1: there will be both; my servers will stay on the 0.4.x branch for the time being 17:23 VanessaE (which is also why I keep harassing people to make sure 0.4.17 gets what we need) 17:23 paramat everyone will have their own little feature they want in 0.4.17 so it's risky to allow that as there will be so many, and how to decide? 17:23 tenplus1 will 0.4.17 have the player model changes ? cauyse that's a big thigns we need to address 17:24 nerzhul red-001, how many times did you played ? did you have crash on returning back to main menu 17:24 VanessaE paramat: as already said, bugfixes only, and imho feature-ish things where it isn't a bug, per se, but oversights that if left uncorrected make some other existing feature not work right 17:24 paramat player y offset? 17:25 red-001 nerzhul, I spent around 20-30 minutes testing it, tried a lot of stuff and it didn't crash 17:25 tenplus1 yeah paramat, the new player y offset.... cause mods NEED to start building with that change in mind 17:25 nerzhul tenplus1, 0.4.17 = 0.4.16 in terms of mod api 17:25 paramat the offset is very much a 0.5 breaking change so i doubt it 17:25 nerzhul red-001, it's nice then 17:26 red-001 maybe VS hasn't implemented some part of the standard? They have bad history with that 17:26 nerzhul red-001, i think it's issue with windows thread, i should investigate, the whole thing works as intended, just windows crash randomly 17:26 nerzhul red-001, they implemented it toally, but some resources are concurently freed, it's the crash, and i don't know why it'so nly on windows 17:30 benrob0329 (Offtopic) https://www.scmagazine.com/campaign-leverages-two-malicious-docs-and-rce-vulnerability-to-spread-orcus-rat/article/700353/ 17:31 red-001 benrob0329, let me guess another remoute code execution exploit in ms word? 17:32 benrob0329 red-001: yup 17:32 benrob0329 Someone remind me why Word is so popular... 17:32 benrob0329 Because I don't see why anymore 17:32 red-001 something something vendor lock-in 17:34 benrob0329 Something something software not worth its keep 17:39 tenplus1 hi Flairieve 17:39 Krock tenplus1, dead end. No voice 17:39 tenplus1 ehehehe 17:40 Flairieve Is there an update.exe or any sort of program that updates Minetest if you ran it? 17:40 tenplus1 sadly not Flairieve 17:40 tenplus1 gotta goto the download page and click unstable for any recent builds... 17:41 tenplus1 but it's better to run stable release 17:42 benrob0329 Do we push minetest binaries to Github Releases? 17:43 tenplus1 I always get latest versions from launchpad link 17:44 sofar we don't post binaries on github releases, at all 17:44 Flairieve I wish I can run .sh files on windows because they are more cooler than .bat files :P 17:44 sofar wait, lol 17:45 sofar I take that back 17:45 sofar there's apk's and sfan5's builds 17:45 benrob0329 Do we have any standard repo for binaries? 17:45 Calinou we could have Minetest on https://scoop.sh 17:45 Calinou I can add it if you want 17:45 Calinou it's pretty easy 17:45 Calinou that's for Windows only, though 17:46 tenplus1 hi behalebabo 17:46 Calinou benrob0329: there's no official Linux binaries, currently 17:46 Calinou only Windows 17:46 behalebabo hello 17:46 Calinou macOS is provided via Homebrew, which works well 17:46 sofar distros release binaries for linux 17:46 Calinou (non-developers rarely have Homebrew installed, though) 17:46 Calinou sofar: yeah, and these are rarely up-to-date :( 17:46 benrob0329 Calinou: SSL cert is invaled 17:46 sofar use a better distro 17:46 Calinou benrob0329: oh, right: http://scoop.sh/ 17:47 Calinou sofar: unfortunately, lots of people still use LTS distros on desktops, and that's not going to change soon 17:47 Calinou and even on Arch Linux, you can have a delay of a few days :P 17:47 benrob0329 sofar: thats not a good answer 17:47 Calinou which is more than you'd like, when the protocol breaks 17:47 sofar it's not a good answer for some people 17:47 sofar server operators shouldn't break protocol for clients in the first 2 days after a release 17:48 tenplus1 would be nice to have a .tar.gz dev build so I can run in place without affecting the isntalled stable release 17:48 benrob0329 sofar: Sure, me and you like up to date distros, but some like stable 17:48 sofar flatpak could solve that problem better 17:49 sofar it also can update, so 17:49 benrob0329 Flatpak...no, just no 17:49 sofar weh weh weh 17:49 nerzhul Calinou, there is official FreeBSD ports and Debian backport 17:49 nerzhul (official from the maintainers, not mt coredevs) 17:49 sofar :) 17:49 Calinou nerzhul: yes, and these are still rarely up-to-date 17:49 Calinou you know, I'll just PR AppImage builds on GitLab CI 17:49 nerzhul https://packages.debian.org/stretch-backports/minetest 17:50 Calinou this way, we can point users to them and we can shut up about this :P 17:50 Calinou we've struggled with this long enough 17:50 nerzhul Calinou, i didn't see the PR 17:50 benrob0329 sofar: we dont need another package manager for something as simple as unpacking a zip 17:50 tenplus1 hi Cal 17:50 benrob0329 Calinou: thanks 17:50 Calinou hi 17:50 sofar I don't have issues with someone making a generic linux binary build 17:50 sofar just go and do it 17:50 sofar however 17:50 Calinou yeah, but the point is making it at least semi-official 17:50 Calinou else, users won't use it 17:51 sofar you better make sure you use slackware 10 to build it and you have to include ALL the dependencies if you want to make it work everywhere 17:51 sofar e.g. a static build 17:51 Calinou Ubuntu 14.04 works well enough for this 17:51 Calinou no need to support ridiculously old distros, it's pretty old already 17:51 sofar just go and do it 17:51 Calinou it's hard enough to build Minetest on Ubuntu 14.04, you know :P 17:51 Calinou (i.e. it doesn't work out of the box) 17:51 benrob0329 Appimages are basically static binaries, but arent static binaries 17:51 Calinou benrob0329: they still contain .so files inside 17:51 sofar could probably do it in a VM, scriptable 17:51 Calinou (unless the original binary has everything statically linked) 17:52 Calinou sofar: GitLab CI :) 17:52 nerzhul Calinou, do appimages and push PR it becomes semi official 17:52 Calinou nerzhul: we'd need to upload the binaries somewhere too, GitLab CI's UI isn't made for end users to download binaries 17:52 Calinou it works, but it's very imperfect 17:52 Calinou this is like exposing Jenkins (I'm looking at you, Minecraft mods) 17:52 Krock LEEEROY JEEEENKINS 17:53 tenplus1 lol 17:53 sofar gitlab does some stuff good, and sucks on some other stuff 17:53 tenplus1 gitlab is annoying 17:55 Calinou it's probably intentional 17:55 Calinou CI platforms don't want masses of users taking their bandwidth :) 17:58 sfan5 did someone mention flatpack, snaps and appimage? 17:58 sfan5 cos we don't really need any of those 17:58 sfan5 you can build "semi-static" linux builds just fine and package them into a tar.gz 17:58 Calinou sure, but that's not standard at all 17:58 tenplus1 hi sfan 17:58 Calinou there's no standard directory structure for this 17:58 Calinou and no guarantee it works in the long run 17:58 Calinou you also don't get the AppImage benefits 17:59 Calinou (desktop integration, GPG signing without an extra file, built-in compression, automatic updates) 17:59 Calinou my Godot builds use AppImage and nobody complains :) 17:59 tenplus1 am only wondering about .tar.gz so I can test latest builds with mod changes without having to uninstall stable 18:00 Krock not a problem when compiling them as RUN_IN_PLACE 18:01 Krock well, only as long builtin doesn't change. 18:01 sfan5 what do you mean by "no guarantee"? it's not like statically linking libraries might just become impossible at some point 18:02 sfan5 the number of libraries not statically linked would be minimal (glibc, libGL, some x11 stuff, openal) 18:02 Calinou sure 18:02 Calinou either way, static linking by hand is tiresome 18:02 Calinou I've never got it to work myself 18:02 Calinou whereas dynamically linking libraries, and embedding them into an AppImage, is much easier and doesn't require recompiling 18:02 Calinou (so it works with proprietary software you don't have the source to!) 18:07 Flairieve So is there anyway to run .sh files on windows? 18:07 sofar linking libGL would be yucky 18:07 tenplus1 yes, run virtualbox with linux in it :PPPP 18:07 sofar openal fine 18:07 Calinou sofar: yes, it shouldn't be done, AppImage blacklists some libraries and will never bundle them 18:07 Calinou Flairieve: on Windows 10, you can install "Bash on Ubuntu on Windows", however it's not meant to be used by end users 18:07 sofar curl/vorbis sure 18:08 Calinou Flairieve: that said, what do you want to run a .sh script for? 18:08 sofar rm -rf * 18:10 benrob0329 Flairieve: probably Bash in the Windows Store 18:10 benrob0329 (Yes, that abomination) 18:10 Calinou that's what I meant, yeah 18:10 Calinou you won't see it in the Windows Store, by the way 18:11 Calinou also, HYPE https://media.hugo.pro/ApplicationFrameHost_2017-10-17_20-03-24.png 18:11 Calinou (for the first element, not the second one) 18:11 Calinou brace yourselves, the Windows 10 Fall Creators update is coming :) 18:11 sfan5 >using windows 10 18:11 benrob0329 Calinou: did they pull it down? 18:11 Calinou it's being deployed starting from today 18:11 Calinou sfan5: I've been considering switching back to Linux, but I don't think I'll try anytime soon 18:12 Calinou (I don't need Office/Adobe for uni anymore) 18:12 sofar ugh, win10. my windows box refuses all windows update 18:12 benrob0329 #LomuxMasterRace 18:12 sofar some darn update file is stuck somewhere and it can't update 18:12 sofar failsauce 18:12 Calinou that sucks 18:12 Calinou on my laptop, Steam screwed up the download of… Wolfenstein 3D 18:12 sofar (and this is why I don't boot windows more than once a year) 18:12 Calinou with file access errors 18:12 Calinou so it's permanently in my download list 18:12 Calinou and I can't remove it :D 18:13 Calinou (I needed to get the game data, I copied the game data to my NAS anyway, so I don't need Steam anymore) 18:18 nerzhul you can run sh files with cygwin 18:19 tenplus1 Cal, try Xubuntu 17.10... it's pretty stable and fast 18:19 sfan5 is 17.10 out yet? 18:20 tenplus1 19th is final release day... but it's stable as can be and has a ton of new driver support and GFX driver updates 18:20 tenplus1 and repo has newer 0.1.46 build :D 18:21 Flairieve "Cygwin is not: 18:21 Flairieve a way to run native Linux apps on Windows. You must rebuild your application from source if you want it to run on Windows." 18:21 Calinou tenplus1: I'd use either Manjaro or Fedora 18:22 Calinou *buntus are nice, but the packages are quite out of date, even on non-LTS releases 18:22 Flairieve It says its not a native way to run linux files on Windows? 18:22 Calinou Flairieve: Cygwin is not a way to run any Linux application on Windows 18:22 Calinou (the WSL, a.k.a. "Bash on Ubuntu on Windows", is much closer to that) 18:22 Calinou also, Cygwin is slow and fairly clunky to install/use 18:22 tenplus1 e4nable the dev repo's... gives you newer stuffs 18:22 Calinou also, I prefer having the AUR at hand :) 18:23 Calinou which Manjaro provides out of the box 18:23 tenplus1 what's aur ??? 18:24 tenplus1 ohh, arch user repo 18:24 tenplus1 whats wrong with debian repo ? 18:24 tenplus1 lolol 18:25 Calinou the AUR is very different from official distro repositories 18:25 Calinou and it's also different to Ubuntu PPAs or Fedora Copr 18:26 tenplus1 depends on the software you wanna run I suppose... most big companies have ppa's or deb repos handy alongside rpm etc 18:29 Flairieve But can Cygwin run any type of .sh file? 18:30 tenplus1 https://stackoverflow.com/questions/22722604/how-to-run-sh-file-on-windows-7-through-cygwin 18:31 CWz this seems to fail compile: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/6541 18:31 tenplus1 Krock: does your new boost cart changes for default carts work ok now ?? 18:32 Calinou Flairieve: most of them, yes. However, if they call native programs, it won't work 18:32 benrob0329 What I find is that anymore I either build from source (if not in the official repo) or dont use the app 18:34 Flairieve https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=14283 18:34 Flairieve Would this work with Cygwin? 18:35 tenplus1 try it and see :) might do 18:35 benrob0329 sofar: ^^ 18:38 sofar what about it? 18:38 sofar oh, cygwin? 18:39 sofar well so if you manually run the conversion script (and not use the zenity gui) it should work but you have to have imagemagick 18:39 sofar and, I didn't test nor am I going to test it 18:40 Flairieve Hmm so someone or me just needs to remake another mc resource or texture pack to minetest texturepack? 18:41 sofar redistributing MC's resource packs is prohibited and a copyright violation 18:41 sofar but, nothing prevents you from converting it yourself, legally 18:42 sofar so, fire up a linux VM? 18:42 tenplus1 yeah, you could easily make a bootable linux flash drive to run script on 18:42 Calinou the WSL would work for this, but just like a Linux VM, it's quite involved 18:42 Flairieve I was meaning to say to create a program for Windows to convert any mc resource/texture pack to minetest textures 18:43 sofar I've hinted in the forum thread that a go version would be good and easy to use on windows 18:43 sofar I'd never build a python version just because it's cruel to ask people to install python on windows 18:44 sofar that's like installing an anvil on the hood of a '76 corvette 18:44 sofar it looks cool, but it sucks when you brake hard 18:45 tenplus1 :P# 18:46 Flairieve Is the go language this? https://golang.org/# 18:47 tenplus1 *shudder* 18:47 tenplus1 hi ssieb 18:47 benrob0329 sofar: write it in....brainf*ck 18:48 tenplus1 hrm, would it be possible to run it in LUA... 18:48 tenplus1 since minetest already uses that 18:48 benrob0329 tenplus1: you'd still need a lua interpreter 18:49 benrob0329 I feel like a single C script would be nice and simple 18:49 Flairieve Wait just a second can minetest mods access os commands? 18:49 tenplus1 that's just a tiny package I add via linux that already uses lua libs installed for minetest 18:49 Krock tenplus1, there's still a pending pull. The missing pathfinder changes are still in testing but might be added soon too 18:49 tenplus1 wonder how hard it would be to add those for windows 18:49 tenplus1 kewl Krock, looking forward to testing it out... I seen your 62 cart flyby on youtiube :P 18:50 sofar benrob0329: well the thing about C is that it's hard to make a nice and simple gui 18:50 sofar which is why something that should be as simple as it can be should have a little menu/file selector etc. 18:50 sofar so `go` would give you this and have the best cross compile ability 18:51 sofar this is how I make windows binaries from my linux box for e.g. mtmapprune and mtmediasrv 18:51 tenplus1 it's 2017... GUI should never be that hard to add... hell, I made a full GUI front-end in basic and pascal at one point that worked like AmigaGUI... 18:51 nerzhul benrob0329, C is not a script it's a programming langauge 18:51 benrob0329 https://github.com/nothings/stb/blob/master/stb_image.h 18:51 sofar tenplus1: gui's are not hard, *portable* gui libraries do not exist 18:51 benrob0329 nerzhul: ok a single c file 18:51 sofar (easily portable, that is) 18:52 benrob0329 sofar: Nuklear? 18:52 tenplus1 woudl be nice if the c comp-ile libs included a basic gui lib as standard on ALL platforms 18:52 benrob0329 https://github.com/vurtun/nuklear 18:52 tenplus1 ooh, that looks pretty good 18:53 benrob0329 tenplus1: C11 isnt even fully implimented, let alone something like a GUI 18:53 sofar well there seem to be Nuklear bindings for golang, so that's positive 18:53 tenplus1 and works on lua :) even better 18:53 sofar https://github.com/golang-ui/nuklear 18:53 benrob0329 sofar: *sigh* 18:53 sofar I might play with that, then 18:54 benrob0329 You are really set on Go, even though you still need to install it to run the program 18:54 sofar no, go programs don't need installation 18:54 benrob0329 If you precompile 18:54 sofar a user doesn't need to install any go stuff either 18:55 tenplus1 +1million for nuklear :) 18:55 benrob0329 You'd need to precompile for every platform 18:55 sofar of course you precompile apps for users 18:55 sofar but go makes cross compilation trivial 18:55 benrob0329 A single c file is easy :-) 18:55 sofar it's like 2 seconds of work to make a windows build 18:55 sofar building C for windows... ouch 18:55 sofar are you seriously? 18:56 sofar mingw, compiler flags, dependencies, library versions, cmake or autotools 18:56 sofar golang obsoletes ALL of that 18:56 sofar I wouldn't write minetest in golang 18:56 sofar but for just run-of-the-mill tools and simple applications, hell yes 18:56 benrob0329 I have mixed feelings about Cmake 18:57 sofar cmake is a solution for the wrong problem 18:57 tenplus1 nite all... o/ 18:57 benrob0329 Plain old make seems to work fine 18:57 benrob0329 tenplus1: gnight 18:57 benrob0329 Darn 18:57 sofar well, I wouldn't say that either 18:57 sofar lol 18:57 sofar but that's another soapbox I'm keeping clean today 18:58 benrob0329 Tbh I have nothing against Go, but also nothing for it 18:59 nerzhul nice: https://thehackernews.com/2017/10/microsoft-bug-tracking-breach.html 19:00 benrob0329 Sure, it solves problems by being a new thing, which doesn't solve them for everything else 19:00 sofar benrob0329: that's a misconception I think, I don't think you understand what go/golang actually solves 19:00 sofar you'd have to extensively use many languages including go to figure it out 19:00 sofar golang isn't just 'a new language' by itself 19:01 sofar it solves a whole ton of problems around software delivery as well 19:01 sofar it doesn't solve anything "by being a new thing" at all 19:02 benrob0329 sofar: its a modern, simple, compiled language which uses garbage collection and was built with the web in mind, and has an official package manager 19:02 sofar now you're just copying a wikipedia summary 19:02 benrob0329 I didn't look at Wikipedia 19:03 benrob0329 I've just looked at Go 19:03 benrob0329 And Rust, D, etc 19:04 benrob0329 They all try to solve many of the same issues 19:04 benrob0329 And I can respect that 19:07 sofar hmm, so nuklear isn't so bad except that it doesn't present a modal window system - everything goes on a single canvas 19:07 sofar this is fine for MT and simple apps, of course 19:07 nerzhul benrob0329, go is to replace java in web applications in industry yes 19:07 nerzhul and has a good network support, but it's not as high performing as C++ 19:07 sofar but poses some issues for more complex applications 19:08 benrob0329 sofar: a modal window system? You mean multiple windows? 19:08 sofar yes, multiple independent windows 19:08 benrob0329 I believe every nk_start() creates a new window 19:08 benrob0329 There is an issue about it 19:08 sofar right, essentially that would be the only way around that 19:12 Flairieve Is there any image editing libaries for C++? 19:12 sofar ImageMagick, libgd 19:12 sofar they're C but that'll do 19:13 benrob0329 sofar: I kinda prefer single window applications that have internal popups, its easier than constantly moving new windows around 19:13 benrob0329 I always set GIMP to single window mode 19:14 benrob0329 Blender is a good mix of the two, ot defaults to single window but can spawn multiple windows if need be 19:14 sofar sure, but a file chooser in the OS style is not a bad concept 19:14 sofar blender's file chooser is a good example of an extreme that takes it too far for most normal people 19:14 benrob0329 No, but for something this small I think a custom one is fine 19:15 sofar also, a small application writer shouldn't have to design a file chooser UI 19:15 benrob0329 Blender is not for normal people :-) 19:15 sofar that's just defeat, right there 19:16 benrob0329 I don't mind Blender's file chooser, it uses Blender keys so I don't gave to switch workflows 19:16 benrob0329 *have 19:16 Flairieve https://github.com/leafo/magick 19:16 red-001 os file choosers ftw 19:16 Flairieve Lua bindings to ImageMagik? 19:16 benrob0329 red-001: what's a native file chooser anyways, I dont have one :P 19:17 sofar writing a windows application in lua seems... well, not optimal 19:17 benrob0329 In order for applications to use my preferred file manager, they would have to open a temrinal with ranger :P 19:17 sofar but, interesting for in-MT server use perhaps 19:17 red-001 anyway what did I miss? What started this conversation? 19:17 sofar benrob0329 did 19:17 sofar blame him 19:18 benrob0329 Lol 19:18 * sofar lolz 19:18 red-001 git blame benrob0329 19:18 Fixer LOL 19:18 sofar fatal: Not a git repository (or any of the parent directories): .git 19:18 red-001 fatal: cannot stat path 'benrob0329': No such file or directory 19:19 benrob0329 First it was asking about running the MC to MT pack converter, then writing it cross platform, then what language, then C headers for PNG and GUI, then Go, then Native dialogs and multiple windows, then this 19:22 benrob0329 git checkout newtopic 19:24 sofar I believe we're still on topic here 19:24 red-001 error: pathspec 'newtopic' did not match any file(s) known to git. 19:25 sofar afk lunch 19:37 benrob0329 I still have the tail end of a cold, and I feel like I should dab every time I cough... 19:38 benrob0329 But then again this isn't Oregon, wouldn't want anyone to get the wrong idea :PP 19:38 nerzhul https://twitter.com/Vlastimil_Hovan/status/919971533451382786 20:02 Calinou hmm, adding AppImage builds to GitLab CI will be harder than I thought 20:03 Calinou I'll need to write new macros and everything :/ 20:03 Calinou especially since the server shouldn't be built for AppImages 20:03 Calinou (only the client is needed) 20:30 Fixer =*,,,,,,,*= 20:31 Fixer testing time https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/6540 20:34 IhrFussel Question: If a client mod digs a node on the map (in case that's possible) will it be logged? 20:34 red-001 if it will be then yes 20:34 red-001 but it wouldn't be 20:35 IhrFussel You mean it's not possible right now? 20:35 benrob0329 I would assume that if a clientod digs a node, it'd be the same as if the user dug one 20:35 red-001 IhrFussel, yes that what I'm saying 20:35 benrob0329 So, the node the user is looking at could be dug 20:35 Calinou the client mod will send the same packet as a human client action 20:35 red-001 that's& 20:35 Calinou so, yes, it will be logged on the server 20:35 benrob0329 If it were my design,.anyways 20:35 Calinou (and rollback will be available) 20:36 red-001 IhrFussel, are you asking for a particular reason or just in-general? 20:36 IhrFussel I have a suspicious player on my server who talked about client side modding and then later asked me what the most valuable material is...so I kinda want to watch how frequently he finds those ores 20:37 benrob0329 IhrFussel: tell him dirt is 20:37 benrob0329 No, coal 20:38 red-001 IhrFussel, tell them it's nyancats 20:38 red-001 with how rare they are oredetect wouldn't help much 20:40 IhrFussel What radius does oredetect scan in? 20:41 benrob0329 Way too much 20:41 red-001 custom but according to dev and common sense not enough for nyancats 20:41 red-001 maybe max 40 or 60 20:42 IhrFussel My server has several rare ores though... diamond, silver, mithril, rainbow, mese 20:43 IhrFussel So I should watch the log very closely and compare the times between ore findings of players 20:43 nerzhul Fixer, IhrFussel i cannot reproduce the crash either on VS with current network version areyou able ? 20:43 nerzhul i think code is enough stable for integration now :) 20:44 Fixer i will check it out sometime 20:44 IhrFussel nerzhul, can I still use git fetch nerzhul -p && git checkout nerzhul/network_asio ? 20:45 nerzhul yeah no change 20:51 IhrFussel When is the crash supposed to happen? 20:57 red-001 nerzhul, how did you store the privledge list in the db? 21:03 nerzhul it's a separated table 21:03 nerzhul user,priv 21:03 nerzhul IhrFussel, if i knew it i can reproduce it and fix it heh :p 21:03 nerzhul but we can tell ~ 15-20 mins of gameplay are sufficient 21:17 Fixer IhrFussel: during play 21:17 Fixer i have in a few minutes usually 21:18 Fixer fuuuu, forgot to turn on my PARTICLE reader 21:18 Fixer also, wth F6 does not have particle count? 21:23 IhrFussel Joined almost 2,000 secs ago and no crash (yet) 21:23 Fixer play as usual 21:23 Fixer it may need more time 21:25 IhrFussel Fixer, any particular actions you do right before it crashes? 21:26 Fixer nope 21:26 Fixer walking 21:28 IhrFussel Any chance the crash is Windows-specific? 21:29 Fixer yes 21:29 Fixer are you on win? 21:33 Fixer uuuck 21:33 Fixer error: 'm_particles' was not declared in this scope 21:34 IhrFussel No I have Xubuntu lol...so maybe I can't even help? 21:35 Fixer IhrFussel: you can still help, by testing it in general during gameplay 21:36 Fixer IhrFussel: i will join later, i'm planning to have fun with some faucets 21:37 IhrFussel I am...currently driving on my boat 21:37 Fixer someone said mobile apps are not new, that means NEW pervert way to nuke them out can be usedc 21:38 Fixer 0.4.14 or maybe 0.4.15 21:38 Fixer by placing fau-cluster (say 20 faucets) and enabling them will cause armageddon for everything on entire server below 0.4.15 21:38 Fixer iirc 21:46 Fixer srp func warning 22:16 IhrFussel Can't reproduce any kind of crash, gameplay was 100% smooth 22:17 nerzhul IhrFussel, nice ! 22:17 nerzhul i hope Fixer will have same thing 22:17 Fixer nerzhul: have you actually looked into my crashes or just hoping? 22:18 nerzhul i looked at them, and added some cleanups which will help 22:18 nerzhul i should go to bed, brb 22:21 Fixer particle test fail, they did not render for homedecor for some reason 22:21 Fixer jas_: can confirm image overlay problem or how it is called 22:24 Fixer lets push faucets to their limits 22:24 Fixer when 10 faucets is not enough (lower fps from 217 to 45) 22:25 Fixer 22 fps... 22:25 Fixer when 20 faucets - 3700 particles 22:26 Fixer intensifying 22:26 Fixer 5600 particles - 14 fps 22:28 Fixer 8500 particles - 6 fps 22:29 Fixer 60 faucets 22:29 Fixer no wait 22:29 Fixer 11 000 particles 22:31 Fixer mOORE 22:32 Fixer 90 faucets 22:33 sofar csm particles, I hope :P 22:33 Fixer 17500 particles 22:33 Fixer 3 FPS 22:33 Fixer along with ridiculously good hard house track and this faucet fps bomb 22:33 Fixer screenshot 22:34 rubenwardy # 22:35 rubenwardy csm particles aren't going to be much more efficient. It doesn't sync individual particles, just systems 22:35 rubenwardy it's mostly limited by rendering particles individually 22:35 benrob0329 Particles_Redo 22:36 benrob0329 #MakeParticlesGreatAgain 22:36 sofar csm particles will make the server do nothing while the client can move the detail slider 22:36 Fixer #howIgonnaShutdownThoseFaucets? 22:36 sofar and it will elminate hundreds (if not more) network packets 22:36 Fixer link https://i.imgur.com/heFJbO7.png 22:37 rubenwardy nah 22:37 sofar csm sounds and particles are right up there on my wish list, together with metasetnodedef -> tiles 22:37 Fixer from 220 fps to 4 fps 22:38 Fixer rubenwardy: you can destroy entire servers with outdated clients 22:38 sofar particle spawners are not flexible enough, I keep end up using individual particles to get better effects 22:38 sofar plus garbage collection of spawners is nonexistent 22:38 sofar (I think, not sure if that got fixed) 22:38 Fixer 3 fps is ridiculously hard to play 22:40 Fixer 60 faucets..... 6 fps 22:41 Fixer 45 faucets - 9 fps 22:42 Fixer 30 faucets - 14 fps 22:42 Fixer good enough to destroy gameplay on server 22:43 sofar just bad design 22:43 Fixer thats for desktop Core i3 + ATI X800GTO, mobile are probably all dead after just few faucets 22:43 Fixer new update for new particles, will try 22:44 Fixer 15 faucets - 29 fps :p 22:48 Fixer he posted a simple mod for testing particles, nice 22:48 Fixer noice 22:49 red-001 Fixer, what pr? 22:50 Fixer In function 'SRP_Result H_ns(__mpz_struct*, SRP_HashAlgorithm, const unsigned char*, size_t, const unsigned char*, size_t)', 22:50 Fixer inlined from 'int calculate_x(__mpz_struct*, SRP_HashAlgorithm, const unsigned char*, size_t, const char*, const unsigned char*, size_t)' at \src\util\srp.cpp:451:13: 22:50 Fixer \src\util\srp.cpp:428:8: warning: 'void* memcpy(void*, const void*, size_t)': specified size 18446744073709551615 exceeds maximum object size 9223372036854775807 [-Wstringop-overflow=] 22:50 Fixer memcpy(bin + len_n, bytes, len_bytes); 22:50 Fixer ohh 22:50 Fixer red-001: 6540 23:07 Fixer new particles: 23:07 Fixer 15 fau - 65 fps 23:07 Fixer 30 fau - 34 fps 23:08 Fixer 60 fau - 24 fps 23:09 Fixer 90 fau - 19 fps 23:09 Fixer not bad 23:11 VanessaE that's a damned sight better than old particles. 23:11 VanessaE those are homedecor faucets? 23:16 Fixer yeah 23:17 Fixer so even 1000 particles is not a problem anymore 23:17 Fixer you can use f-ing proper rain 23:17 Fixer with at least 300 damn particles 23:17 VanessaE it used tobe even a few dozen was out of the question, on slower machines 23:17 VanessaE btw, 23:17 VanessaE try it again with non-translucent particles 23:18 VanessaE like dirt or something we know has no alpha, see what effect it has 23:20 VanessaE (well something with no alpha and is the same resolution as the water particles) 23:20 Fixer like this? https://pastebin.com/CMkpQA3q 23:21 VanessaE you're gonna make it rain keys? :)( 23:21 VanessaE :) 23:24 VanessaE keys have transparent parts, so that's still alpha. try dirt or cobble or something instead, but crop the image to something exactly the same rez as the original water particles, otherwise your results won't be entirely valid. 23:39 Fixer ok, but later 23:39 Fixer gn