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IRC log for #minetest-hub, 2017-05-29

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:01 Jordach__ rubenwardy, hearthstone_well_played.png
00:01 Jordach__ dockerizing all the things is a silly idea
00:02 rubenwardy well, I need someone to manage all the stuff
00:02 rubenwardy *someway
00:02 rubenwardy docker works for web apps and NGINX
00:03 Jordach__ rubenwardy, just use github gists as your configs
00:03 Jordach__ :^)
00:04 Jordach__ i'm out for the night, leaving my laptop running fer chromecast
00:05 Fixer http://files.explosm.net/comics/Rob/reunion.png
00:22 benrob0329 diegom: its not my script 0:-)
00:27 benrob0329 id＀need＀to＀fork＀it
00:27 benrob0329 not that its broken on my client, i have proper unicode support :P
00:31 VanessaE "you can't drive a forklift!"  "I can drive any forkin' thing around."
00:34 benrob0329 lol
00:34 benrob0329 using vim keys to switch and manage windows is really nice
00:35 VanessaE oh for G*d sakes, talk about misreading that
00:35 VanessaE I read that as "id need a forklift"
00:36 VaultyTowers oh my
00:36 NathanS21 I read it as the same Vanessa
00:36 NathanS21 but I do drive forklifts 'professionally'
00:37 VanessaE I haven't driven one in... 25 years?
00:37 VanessaE pretty sure I still remember it though
00:37 NathanS21 just remember not to turn your blinkers on when you want to shift gears in the car....
00:37 VanessaE hm, well over 20 anyway
00:37 VanessaE heh
00:38 NathanS21 I can't count the number of times I've done that after getting out of work. LOL
00:39 benrob0329 reversed controls i take it?
00:40 NathanS21 on the forklift there is a lever on the left of the steering column
00:40 NathanS21 make that right
00:40 NathanS21 right of the column
00:40 NathanS21 right where the wiper controls are in most cars
00:41 NathanS21 Almost drove into a light pole once because of that
00:41 NathanS21 put the car into drive, with the shifter, but should have been going in reverse to pull out
00:41 NathanS21 I started moving forwards and flicked my wipers on
00:43 benrob0329 i feel like that is a safty hazard...
00:43 VanessaE the one I drove, if I remember right, had all of the controls/levers on a separate console to one side
00:43 VanessaE (save for the gas/brake)
00:43 NathanS21 the controls are completely different from a car, save for the pedals
00:44 NathanS21 you've got controls to move the forks, side to side, up and down, and tilt
00:44 NathanS21 if the truck has side to side
00:44 NathanS21 usually not an issue
00:44 VanessaE this one did, yeah
00:44 VanessaE tilt, shift, raise/lower, and the electric reach truck had a ..well.. reach feature also
00:45 VanessaE (there were two that I drove commonly there)
00:45 VanessaE (that one was a piece of crap though.  had a half a ton battery "pack" that could barely last half an hour of continuous light use)
00:46 NathanS21 sounds like a new battery would have been a good investment for the company
00:48 NathanS21 Everything I currently drive is propane, so no issues there. :)
01:12 VanessaE yeah, we all complained about it
01:12 VanessaE they were too cheap to replace it
01:18 Megaf joined #minetest-hub
01:19 Megaf Sneaking in
01:19 Megaf Testing SwiftKey keyboard too in the tumb mode layout
01:19 * Shara pounces on the tiger
01:19 Shara Hi Megaf
01:19 benrob0329 hi Megaf
01:20 Megaf Hi everybody. It is great seeing you
01:20 Megaf Specially now that I haven't been joining much lately
01:20 Megaf How are things?
01:21 Shara Sleepy
01:22 Megaf Hehe
01:22 Megaf I will not be sleeping tonight
01:22 Shara I'm trying to get a study project submitted so... who knows if I will either
01:23 Megaf I have been sleep late and waking up late too. So will stay awake to try to reset myself
01:26 Shara Good luck
01:30 lumidify_ joined #minetest-hub
01:39 Megaf I gotta find a cheap yet decent USB keyboard
01:39 benrob0329 Megaf: currently trying to teach a friend how to edit videos
01:39 benrob0329 also trying out AwesomeWM
01:39 Megaf You sir, do you feel pleasure in suffering?
01:40 Megaf I was pretty happy with gnome 3
01:41 Megaf At least in usability
01:41 Megaf Lots of room for improvement performance wise
01:43 Megaf Any news from the old gentleman that codes?
01:44 * Megaf awkwardly looks at Shara
01:44 Shara There are logs.
01:45 Megaf Will take that as a yes then
01:45 Shara Not sure what else to say :(
01:46 * Megaf is a computerless person now
01:51 Megaf Very sad, isn't it?
01:51 Shara How'd that happen?
01:53 Megaf Water on the keyboard happened
01:54 VaultyLappy anyone who wants to watch any tv show Download Kodi
01:54 VaultyLappy and install the exodus add-on
01:55 Megaf joined #minetest-hub
02:04 Miner_48er joined #minetest-hub
03:24 diegom benrob0329, http://www.fileformat.info/inf​o/unicode/char/ff00/index.htm
03:25 diegom "U+FF00 is not a valid unicode character."
03:25 diegom so your script is still broken :P
03:30 diegom well, your client, rather
04:26 octacian Night all :D
04:27 octacian Unless I decide to come back before morning :rotfl:
04:59 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
05:11 DI3HARD139 joined #minetest-hub
06:17 CWz joined #minetest-hub
06:44 sniper338 joined #minetest-hub
06:54 sniper338 joined #minetest-hub
07:43 Calinou hi
07:43 Calinou rubenwardy: I could use Docker now that I have a KVM-based VPS (instead of OpenVZ) but I don't, I don't see the need
07:43 Calinou I did set up systemd services for game servers and the like, at least, I used to just start them in screens but that was a hack
07:44 Calinou (this means I can't control them from their ncurses interfaces though, but it does not really matter)
07:55 Jordach joined #minetest-hub
08:25 IhrFussel joined #minetest-hub
08:27 red-002 could someone voice IhrFussel ?
08:27 red-002 !list
08:27 ShadowBot red-002: Admin, Aka, Anonymous, BanNotify, Brainfuck, Channel, ChannelLogger, ChannelStats, Conditional, Config, Ctcp, DDG, Debug, DerplangPlus, Dict, Filter, FloodProtector, Format, Games, GitHub, Karma, Later, Logger, Math, MessageParser, Minetest, Misc, MoobotFactoids, Network, Note, Owner, Plugin, Quote, Reply, Scheduler, Services, Status, String, Time, Topic, URL, Unix, User, Util, (1 more message)
08:27 red-002 !help aka
08:27 ShadowBot red-002: Error: There is no command "aka". However, "Aka" is the name of a loaded plugin, and you may be able to find its provided commands using 'list Aka'.
08:28 red-002 !help Aka
08:28 ShadowBot red-002: Error: There is no command "aka". However, "Aka" is the name of a loaded plugin, and you may be able to find its provided commands using 'list Aka'.
08:28 red-002 !help Anonymous
08:28 ShadowBot red-002: Error: There is no command "anonymous". However, "Anonymous" is the name of a loaded plugin, and you may be able to find its provided commands using 'list Anonymous'.
08:32 red-002 I guess no ops are online then
08:50 Calinou hmm, https://github.com/desktop/desktop
08:50 Calinou the official GitHub app rewrite is open source? :o
08:50 Calinou (it used to be a native app, now they're moving to something Electron-based)
08:51 Calinou although there doesn't seem to be Linux support, and official builds have a restrictive EULA
08:55 lumidify Has anyone here used https://www.scaleway.com/?
08:56 Calinou there's ongoing work, https://github.com/desktop/desktop/issues/1525
08:57 Calinou nope, not me
09:00 Shara Morning all
09:00 Calinou hi
09:01 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
09:08 Zeno` joined #minetest-hub
09:13 Shara Hi Zeno`
09:21 red-002 hey Zeno` can IhrFussel have voice?
09:22 red-002 hi all
09:22 nerzhul it's 50$
09:22 Shara red-002: I already gave him it  a while back?
09:22 red-002 Shara, he went offline
09:23 Shara Not according to what I see
09:23 red-002 oh nvm
09:23 red-002 I didn't notice
09:24 Shara Actually, just added him to list :)
09:25 red-002 ah so chanserv will be able to do it's thing now?
09:25 Shara Yup.
09:25 Shara I wish mransom would register his name :(
09:27 IhrFussel Hello and thanks again
09:27 Shara No problem :)
09:41 VaultyLappy i registered my name lol
09:42 Shara VaultyLappy: Added you to list
09:42 VaultyLappy thanks
09:42 VaultyLappy its as VaultBoy but i should be identified
09:43 Shara Yea, I added it as VaultBoy, so don't worry :)
09:50 VaultyLappy aight :P
09:54 * Jordach purrs
09:54 Jordach heading out shopping in london
09:55 Shara Jordach: Meow :)
09:55 Jordach removing my phones tether......now
09:55 Jordach meow, Shara
10:20 Fixer joined #minetest-hub
12:20 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
12:21 rubenwardy do you like GoT, nerzhul?
12:21 rubenwardy re: your host name
12:21 nerzhul heh
12:22 nerzhul it's my FreeBSD front server name
12:22 rubenwardy was just wondering if it was a GoT reference
12:24 nerzhul King's Landing it Iron Throne city
12:26 Fixer suddenly
12:38 WhoAreYou joined #minetest-hub
12:44 nore nerzhul: iron throne is the French name :p, it's game of thrones or a song of ice and fire in English :)
12:46 red-003 ahh the good old "world's most uncomfortable chair"
12:47 Fixer two chairs....
12:49 nerzhul nore, i talked about the throne itself not the book title :)
12:49 nore nerzhul: oh, okay :)
12:53 DS-minetest joined #minetest-hub
12:55 octacian joined #minetest-hub
12:58 DS-minetest we need something like this http://wiki.minetest.net/Help:Installing_Mods for clientmods
13:02 RobbieF joined #minetest-hub
13:03 jin_xi joined #minetest-hub
13:13 nerzhul DS-minetest,  without doubt, feel free to coontribute :)
13:17 red-003 DS-minetest, great idea
13:17 red-003 I was meaning to write something like that but I wasn't able to find the time
13:19 Shara left #minetest-hub
13:23 benrob0329 Calinou: I find it sad that a company that hosts the worlds code doesn't want to open source their desktop app
13:29 lisac joined #minetest-hub
13:33 octacian Well, I had a totally great morning. Launch YT to check how the video I uploaded last night is doing, and I discover it was removed for "Inappropriate content"
13:35 octacian heh
13:37 sniper570 joined #minetest-hub
13:39 DS-minetest hmm, instead of making a new topic called something like "installing clientmods", the installing mods site could include clientmods
13:40 DS-minetest (it also explains how to install modpacks)
13:41 Megaf joined #minetest-hub
13:41 Raven262 joined #minetest-hub
13:42 Megaf Greetings everyone
13:42 Megaf Did I spam the channel earlier on?
13:43 Raven262 Greetings Megaf
13:49 benrob0329 Hi Megaf
13:49 benrob0329 octacian: wait what
13:49 octacian benrob0329: Yeah, ridiculous. That video you commented on was removed for being inappropriate
13:50 benrob0329 just....what???
13:50 octacian Apparently it had "Inappropriate content"
13:51 octacian I'm like... WHAT!? If THAT is inappropriate, why do either pewdiepie OR LeafyIsHere still exist?
13:51 benrob0329 money
13:51 octacian They haven't always been that big though... And for most of them, they were no different when they were smaller
13:52 benrob0329 Although they seem to care less and less about creators
13:52 octacian Although the rules were also probably different then.
13:52 octacian Yeah
13:52 benrob0329 Youtube is becoming corporate, mind you
13:52 octacian Yeah
13:52 benrob0329 They now have "Youtube TV" n such
13:53 benrob0329 didn't mind YT red, giving creators sn extra boost for a show
13:53 benrob0329 But putting normal tv on youtube and pushing creators aside?
13:53 octacian Yeah, same
13:54 benrob0329 its sad because now the good channels that did receive money wont exactly leave
13:55 Fixer remember my words: DL good stuff of youtube, some day you will lose it all
13:56 octacian Well, there goes what was supposed to be a productive morning working on a subgame. Instead spent it reading all of YT's community guidlines....
13:58 octacian Speaking of which though, would anyone be willing to give me a hand with my modified item drop? It has extra additions supporting movement with water, however, having an issue where items go through walls. If anybody is willing, let me know and I can give you line numbers. https://gist.github.com/octacian/​8bd7f000dfb2748e6802ef6b151f33ea
14:00 behalebabo octacian: doesn't local new_pos = minetest.find_node_near(object:get_pos(), 1, "air") cause the item to teleport into any node, not just air?
14:01 behalebabo ok, thinking of other function
14:01 octacian No, just air. That's to move items out from inside nodes. However, before that is called, the item is moved inside the node by water flow
14:03 benrob0329 https://www.minds.com/
14:03 benrob0329 Oh shoot! !!
14:03 behalebabo octacian: do they always go through walls? or is it only part of the time?
14:03 Megaf We should have a totally P2P encrypted network
14:03 Megaf Using DHT
14:04 Megaf Routed via onion
14:04 octacian All the time. If you test it out by putting some flowing water and a node at the end, the dropped item will go into the node at the end
14:04 * Megaf hides
14:04 behalebabo Megaf: what about I2P?
14:04 octacian What seems to happen, is the item sits there for a few moments just bouncing around in physical mode, then, the item switched to not physical for less than a second, goes into the node, and back to physical
14:05 octacian However, there is only one place in the code where the item is changed to non-physical, and even with that line commented out, it still happens
14:05 Megaf I'm not familiar with that term benrob0329
14:05 Megaf benrob0329: oh yeah
14:06 Megaf That's one of the solutions
14:06 Megaf I've seen others
14:06 Megaf But I'm happy with none
14:06 benrob0329 Megaf: its called a nicer way of saying oh $h!+
14:06 benrob0329 Because I didn't feel like swearing
14:10 Stone-Talus joined #minetest-hub
14:10 red-003 huh I think this channel has more people then the old one used to
14:23 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/ZJBCbvK.png
14:23 Fixer what are those people, servers full of them... multicraft?
14:23 stormchaser3000 joined #minetest-hub
14:24 Raven262 Who knows, there are more of them than there are ants on the planet
14:24 DS-minetest perhaps some alternative guest names
14:24 Raven262 I mean, i couldn't join Xanadu yesterday two times cause it was full, guess of what.
14:26 stormchaser3000 joined #minetest-hub
14:26 VanessaE rebooting my servers (clearing out the xban list)
14:27 VanessaE oops, wrong channel
14:29 Jordach joined #minetest-hub
14:33 octacian benrob0329: heh, On the plus side, YT just removed the strike and brought the video back up :D
14:35 benrob0329 octacian: -_-
14:35 cx384 joined #minetest-hub
14:37 Megaf benrob0329: I'm connected to i2p
14:38 benrob0329 Megaf: i2p?
14:38 Megaf And joined thir channel at 127.0.0.1:6668
14:38 Megaf I mean
14:38 Megaf behalebabo:
14:38 Megaf :)
14:38 Megaf Sorry benrob0329
14:39 * Jordach just feels like shit
14:39 Jordach one MT client, potato laptop
14:39 Jordach what server
14:40 benrob0329 Subgames for all
14:40 Jordach uwotm8
14:41 red-backup wait what?
14:46 * Jordach looks at VanessaE's survival server
14:46 Jordach potato laptop vs that thing
14:54 Fixer i wonder if there are ways to ban android on server
14:55 Fixer not in VanessaE way
14:55 Fixer but more simple, elegant way
14:59 DS-minetest lol, VanessaE way is making the server so heavy to make it unplayable, right?
14:59 VanessaE er, no :P
14:59 Fixer yeah
14:59 VanessaE if android clients can't handle a heavy server, fix the clients :P
15:00 Fixer if only there was some neat bug or exploit that crashed just android clients while connecting to particular server :}
15:00 VanessaE (doesn't help much that android manufacturers skimp so badly on RAM)
15:02 benrob0329 Jordach: its a minigame server
15:02 benrob0329 Pretty good actually
15:03 IhrFussel Fixer, you're joking but there actually IS a way to make all 0.4.14 Android clients crash while connecting to a server: Display an error message while they try to connect
15:03 benrob0329 Lol
15:03 Fixer IhrFussel: just 0.4.14?
15:03 benrob0329 Wait, does that literally crash them?
15:04 Megaf_ joined #minetest-hub
15:04 IhrFussel Just 0.4.14 and yes the app will just close
15:04 Fixer nice
15:04 Fixer too bad it is 0.4.14 only
15:05 Jordach Fixer, most of the clones are .14
15:05 benrob0329 Feature check?
15:05 Jordach ;P
15:05 benrob0329 Kick older clients?
15:06 IhrFussel But we shouldn't treat the (few) people who actually use the official client as "bad"
15:06 Jordach this is why clients need to send an official header
15:07 Jordach like how tcp and HTTP sorts things
15:07 Jordach needs compat num: x
15:07 Jordach needs feature set: x
15:08 IhrFussel And you think the clone devs won't be able to fake it?
15:08 Jordach IhrFussel, making it more like a HTTP header solves things
15:08 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/iNXxPIF.png
15:08 Zeno` The clone devs should just update
15:09 Jordach unlikely
15:09 Jordach :^)
15:09 Jordach more interested in milking than updating
15:09 Zeno` Nothing to do with us then. They are free to update
15:10 Jordach Zeno`, just let the server run a -dev version and then use a texture modifier that doesn't exist on mobile clients
15:10 Jordach if they report that bug; ez ban
15:10 IhrFussel One of my players told me "I see all names as white" although I use namecolors...how old was that commit again? 2013/2014?
15:10 Zeno` Jordach, that's not in the spirit of open source
15:10 Fixer Jordach: lol, nice
15:10 Jordach Zeno`, then tell them to leave a shitty review on a "fork"
15:11 Zeno` and how can we do that anyway? The check would be open source so the clone could add it themselves
15:11 Jordach not my business to run servers for others
15:11 Fixer Zeno`: sometimes people want a server without android/moms/mams/dads/sisters/brothers/cryi​ng/yelling/woodenboxes/horrificboxes/etc/etc
15:11 Jordach but it's a solution to the problem
15:11 Jordach that Fixer has somewhat asked for
15:11 Zeno` But... there is no problem
15:11 Jordach protip Fixer: using [multiply:#00000 in a texture line will make those clients whine like dogs
15:11 Zeno` clones and forks are perfectly legit
15:12 Jordach doesn't even have to be a usable node
15:12 Jordach just one to exist will cause it
15:12 Zeno` Jordach, and how do we "hide" that?
15:12 Fixer Zeno`: it is not about clones, it was a about making server for #PCmasterrace people
15:12 Fixer Zeno`: that kicks out androiders :}
15:12 Zeno` Fixer, impossible
15:12 Jordach Zeno`, the node in registry will make the clients report it to that user
15:12 Jordach if they keep complaining
15:12 Jordach then tough shit
15:13 Jordach (an entity with that will also do it, spawn a cube underspawn with [multiply:#000000 also works
15:13 Zeno` Like it or not, minetest is FOSS
15:13 Jordach FOSS doesn't mean accomodating others
15:14 Zeno` Jordach, but we also can't do anything at all to block them
15:14 Fixer easy solution will be autokick of everything that has wordXXX %)
15:14 Fixer Zeno`: no need to block them
15:14 Jordach Fixer, maybe xban3 Kappa
15:14 Zeno` that's no a solution. The clone could implement the same @#&*@&#@* code
15:14 Fixer just make some android ghetto server for them %)
15:14 Jordach Zeno`, considering renaming the project is what they do
15:14 Jordach and not touching the shit we call networking
15:15 Jordach most pump and dump chinese clients don't bother with such
15:15 Zeno` Jordach, so they spoof the name when connecting
15:16 Jordach Zeno`, most of the clones can't be bothered to port it right
15:16 Jordach let alone change the mess of UDP networking
15:16 Zeno` There is NOTHING we can do about the clones. Clones are encouraged by the license in fact
15:16 Zeno` Jordach, so those ones won't work
15:17 Fixer Zeno`: i started discussion not about clones btw, it was about: is it possible to create server for PC users only, in some way not letting android/ios peasants :trollface:
15:17 Zeno` There is no issue here. If the clone complies with the license then *shrug*
15:17 Zeno` Fixer, as I said: Impossible
15:19 Fixer true englishman in sight! https://i.imgur.com/iie3uI4.png
15:20 Zeno` Fixer, or do you suggest that we abandon our open source roots and create a secret fork of the source code?
15:20 Zeno` (I don't even know if that's possible)
15:20 Fixer Zeno`: not that
15:21 Jordach Fixer, maybe registering a forum account then sending a pm to the server owner?
15:21 Fixer Jordach: my idea was hypothetical
15:22 stormchaser3000 joined #minetest-hub
15:22 Fixer or, on other hand, I'm android lover and want read that amazing mom/mum/dad/dud roleplay and want to create android ghetto server :}
15:24 Fixer and ban pc users from it $)
15:24 Fixer to save their minds
15:24 NathanS21 There are servers that require you to register on a website before they grant you any privs on the server
15:24 * benrob0329 slaps Fixer with his 4-5 year old Galaxy Tab 2, in the otterbox
15:24 * Fixer slaps benrob0329 with lenovo yoga
15:25 Zeno` NathanS21, and what does that achieve? The user registers using a PC and then uses an Android to play
15:25 Zeno` it's not as if using an Android to play offers any advantage
15:25 * benrob0329 slaps Fixer with his spare PC case
15:26 NathanS21 They could register with an Android device as well
15:26 * Fixer slaps benrob0329 with PC case from year 2001
15:26 NathanS21 it just cuts out on the name0000 users that join
15:26 NathanS21 as they can't do anything
15:26 NathanS21 and most of them won't bother creating an account
15:26 Fixer i have even more strange idea
15:26 * benrob0329 slaps Fixer with an old XP system
15:26 NathanS21 they'll just go to some other server where they can be annoying.
15:26 Fixer when somebody connect to server: scan him with nmap -> detect android -> ban :D
15:27 benrob0329 XD thats evil
15:27 benrob0329 I love it
15:27 Fixer show error: server is for adult PC users, with hidden automatic ban by IP
15:27 Sokomine Fixer: using android and strange roleplay are not the same. don't mix them up. there are capable android users out there
15:27 Fixer and by name
15:28 Fixer Sokomine: yeah, but what if you want to be elitist and have ProServer for ProPC ProUsers
15:29 Sokomine what for, fixer? if you don't want...problematic..users it's usually sufficient to have suitable server rules and perhaps some slight obstacles in gaining interact (like i.e. *reading* something)
15:30 Zeno` minetest is an open source engine
15:30 * Fixer thinking
15:30 Zeno` if someone wants to sell it for $60.00 a copy then they can do that
15:30 Sokomine players using anroid to connect = bad  is just far too simple
15:30 Fixer PERFECT SOLUTION
15:30 Fixer :
15:30 Sokomine ah. just wanting to keep those strange clients out?
15:31 Fixer on login: show formspec asking to TAP something, then ban
15:31 Zeno` is someone wants to use the engine and NOT open source the "game" they can do that as well
15:31 Sokomine just point players to the official client :-)
15:31 Fixer thats not about clients/clones or whatever
15:32 Zeno` this is all just silly talk
15:32 Fixer ofc it is, since i can't host anything behind NAT :(
15:32 Wayward_One And what of the Android x86/Phoenix OS/Remix OS users?
15:33 Zeno` Wayward_One, they are obviously breaking the law! </sarcasm>
15:33 Wayward_One :P
15:33 Fixer Wayward_One: three buttons on formspec: 1) Tap this to join game (bans user) 2) Press Scroll Lock 3) I'm glorious Linux user: answer how to exit vim
15:33 benrob0329 Fixer: last one is the easiest
15:34 Fixer actually
15:34 Wayward_One Lol nice
15:34 Fixer Press Scroll Lock and Print Screen to join the game...
15:34 Zeno` benrob0329, yeah. kill -9 it
15:34 Fixer b i n g o
15:34 Fixer i wonder if minetest detects scroll lock
15:34 Fixer yeah it does
15:34 Fixer perfect
15:35 benrob0329 Fixer: press Shift Alt Print O
15:35 Zeno` Fixer, how long do you think it would take me to make a patch to emulate scroll lock? 5 minutes?
15:35 Fixer glorious Emacs user
15:35 Sokomine just don't solve something with a technical solution that demands a social one
15:35 Sokomine it won't work
15:35 Fixer Zeno`: why would you? It is just someones modded server :)
15:36 Sokomine you need to have admins for that. real people who can think, read, understand. and even those will make errors in judgement
15:36 Fixer wait a second
15:36 benrob0329 I don't have a scroll lock -_-
15:36 Fixer Numpad can also be utilised :}
15:36 benrob0329 Stupid modern keyboards
15:37 Fixer but notebook users...
15:37 Zeno` Fixer, so official android releases are no good either?
15:37 Fixer Zeno`: this is not about official/nonofficial
15:37 benrob0329 Zeno`: not really, Minetesr on android is painful
15:37 Zeno` of course it's painful. So they're already at a disadvantage
15:38 Fixer Zeno`: say I decided to do server for PC users only :) thats what I mean
15:38 Zeno` Fixer, what's a PC?
15:38 benrob0329 Personal Computer
15:38 benrob0329 Desktop
15:38 Zeno` So my Amiga would be ok?
15:38 benrob0329 x86
15:39 Fixer Zeno`: if you port minetest to it - yes!
15:39 benrob0329 Zeno`: sure, if you can get Minetest to run on it
15:40 Zeno` err so what's an Android?
15:40 Fixer "Android is a mobile operating system developed by Google, based on the Linux kernel and designed primarily for touchscreen mobile devices such as smartphones and tablets."
15:41 Fixer acc to wikipedia
15:41 Zeno` So, it's about the OS?
15:41 benrob0329 Its about playability
15:41 Fixer Zeno`: it is about user discrimination by platform %)
15:42 Zeno` I tend to think that minetest on Android is probably better than my Amiga 500 port
15:42 Fixer you can do amiga port, vanessa will do c64 one
15:42 VanessaE no.
15:42 Fixer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfUWbgLdSgE
15:42 VanessaE though recently someone did a Wolfenstein 3D port to C64+SuperCPU (16 MHz accelerator with max 16MB RAM)... so I suppose it's technically possible
15:44 Fixer https://66.media.tumblr.com/09d68ec9329b93b1b979​e6e9e859f44b/tumblr_mj79as89bc1qh142io1_1280.png
15:44 Zeno` VanessaE, good luck porting irrlicht :D
15:44 VanessaE heh
15:44 VanessaE ain't gonna do it
15:46 Fixer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geq1nREkj2k
15:46 benrob0329 Good luck porting OpenGL
15:48 Sokomine benrob0329: it is painful. but it's also possible to connect a mouse and a keyboard to a phone. then it's pretty fine. better than extremly old notebooks with even poorer graphics
15:49 Sokomine :-) mt on a c64..hm...wasn't there a 2d version of this kind of voxel game somewhere? such a 2d version might to some degree run on a c64. but i never really used them
15:50 Zeno` VanessaE, you can use my vic-20 port as a basis if you want to
15:50 VanessaE I'll let the active c64 geeks do that :P
15:50 Sokomine :-)
15:51 Fixer ground breaking http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/05/16/​article-0-1DE9561C00000578-255_634x588.jpg
15:51 Fixer http://www.androidcentral.com/sites/androidcentr​al.com/files/styles/xlarge_wm_brw/public/article​_images/2015/09/lenovo-phab-1.jpg?itok=CNBfqq7c
15:56 Shara joined #minetest-hub
15:56 Fixer o.O https://github.com/LuaJIT/LuaJIT/issues/331
15:58 Krock joined #minetest-hub
15:58 Krock joined #minetest-hub
16:00 Fixer xfce will be quite soon on gtk3, it is about time
16:00 Calinou benrob0329: GitHub *has* open sourced their new desktop app
16:00 Calinou it does not compile out of the box, though, this is likely a bug
16:00 Calinou it's also not available for Linux yet but it might happen in a few months
16:01 Calinou https://github.com/desktop/​desktop/blob/master/LICENSE
16:01 Calinou it's a bit limited right now but looks fancy
16:01 VanessaE Fixer: awh HELL no
16:01 Fixer VanessaE: hell yes
16:01 VanessaE leave my xfce just the way it ius!
16:01 VanessaE no, no way, hell no, and FUCK NO in that order
16:02 benrob0329 VanessaE: AwesomeMasterace :
16:02 VanessaE I'd sooner go back to AFTERSTEP than deal with gtk3-anything
16:02 benrob0329 :P
16:02 Fixer VanessaE: unfortunately the speed they are going, both gimp and xfce will be on gtk3 by the time gtk2/3 is dead
16:02 Fixer VanessaE: OPENSTEP
16:03 VanessaE no, come to think of it, I think I'd go back to FVWM before I'll tolerate gtk3
16:03 Fixer VanessaE: just use openbox
16:04 VanessaE Fixer: where are you getting this from anyway?  (gtk3 in xfce I mean)
16:04 Fixer "The first Gtk+3 release of xfce4-panel is out!"
16:04 Fixer VanessaE: it was known long ago that xfce will have GTK3 support, not sure if they will support GTK2
16:04 Calinou #OccupyGTK3
16:04 VanessaE *checks phoronix*
16:05 Fixer https://blog.alteroot.org/articles​/2016-04-12/road-to-xfce-4.14.html
16:05 Fixer The bigger change for 4.14 is the port / upgrade to GTK+ 3.x.
16:05 LazyJ joined #minetest-hub
16:05 VanessaE G*d help us
16:07 red-003 that must look quite confusing to LazyJ lol
16:08 LazyJ I just fired-up the computer. Coming into the middle of IRC conversations.
16:08 Calinou hi LazyJ
16:08 LazyJ Howdy Calinou ;)
16:08 Calinou Fixer: [insert KDE welcoming users here]
16:09 Calinou (RAM upgrade not included)
16:09 red-003 {insert greeting here}, LazyJ
16:09 VanessaE guess I'll just have to wait and see but every gtk3 app I've run into so far has been just plain shit.
16:10 VanessaE with the biggest regression being no menubar because random
16:10 Calinou this is why most modern Electron apps use their own menubar now
16:10 Calinou like this, https://desktop.github.com/
16:10 Calinou they adhere to the Windows/macOS design guidelines the most they can, and it works well
16:11 Calinou however, adhering to GNOME/KDE guidelines is going to be a pain
16:11 VanessaE fuck your "guidelines"
16:11 VanessaE I want my desktop to stay exactly like it is
16:11 VanessaE (and no, no "spacebar heating" xkcd references here)
16:12 Calinou design guidelines are exactly what you want, I think
16:12 Calinou it's following the OS conventions
16:12 Calinou their blog mentions, for example, macOS having buttons named "Like This" and Windows "Like this"
16:12 Calinou (I never realized that before today, by the way)
16:12 VanessaE design guidelines is what gave us KDE4 when it wasn't ready for production use and 3.5 was nearly perfect.
16:12 VanessaE those same guidelines gave us gnome 3/unity
16:12 VanessaE i.e. tablet motif on the desktop
16:12 VanessaE == FAIL
16:13 * Jordach screeches autistically
16:13 VanessaE sorry but I'm just plain sick of change-for-the-sake-of-change.
16:13 Calinou anyway, I'm happy with Plasma 5 so far
16:13 Jordach mobile crap is a giant fucking meme
16:14 Calinou the defaults are not very sane, though
16:14 Jordach have you tried pro apps on a tablet>
16:14 Calinou but once you change many settings, it's quite good
16:15 Jordach >many settings
16:15 Jordach nice fucking meme
16:15 Jordach some people want it out of the box and not pages of nano to go through
16:15 Jordach i might just pick up a nice 128gb SSD for my laptop and some extra RAM
16:16 Jordach and then go install KDE
16:16 Jordach tl;dr the desktop isn't a fucking tablet, ever
16:16 VanessaE exactly.
16:16 Jordach "but muh convertibles"
16:16 Jordach go install windows 10 for that
16:17 VanessaE it.  just.  doesn't.  work.
16:17 Jordach (i use windows as a desktop gaming machine specifically, the laptop, not so much)
16:17 Jordach VanessaE, i'm finding modern devs so retarded
16:17 Jordach not realising that they're no longer adhering to the UNIX philosophy
16:18 VanessaE so many modern "devs" are just hipsters who got their hands on compilers before the learned the history of user experience and familiarity.
16:18 Calinou Jordach: well, the settings I talked about are all done in a GUI
16:18 Calinou so, no nano is involved
16:18 Jordach Calinou, might as well be knowing Linux
16:18 Calinou also, sadly, battery life on my laptop is far better on Windows 10 than on Manjaro :(
16:18 Calinou I used it for 3h30 this afternoon, still 50% battery (it had ~90% when starting)
16:19 Calinou this is not remotely possible on Manjaro
16:19 Fuchs if only there was a technology to create adaptive desktop UIs :(
16:19 Calinou the display also feels smoother (because Xorg was never made to handle 4K displays)
16:19 Fuchs oh, wait, qml and kirigami, nevermind.
16:19 Calinou Fuchs: Qt can do that, but nobody really does it
16:19 Jordach Calinou, hmmmm, FOSS devs generally have to "good" of a system spec, e.g. high end laptops like Razer or Asus
16:19 Fuchs Calinou: I was kidding  (I did some minor qml development, so I am aware of it)
16:19 Calinou I was about to post that here, http://dengine.net/blog/20​17/05/the-road-to-mobile/
16:19 Calinou but in general, that source port has a responsive UI and it's all made in Qt
16:19 Fuchs Calinou: I think we'll be having a sprint this year at Randa
16:19 Calinou Jordach: eh, not exactly true IMO
16:20 Calinou most FOSS devs are poor
16:20 Calinou it's a true meme
16:20 Calinou none of them are rolling in money, the ones who do that all work for proprietary software companies all day
16:20 Fixer VanessaE: no menubar because tiny widescreen crap with 1366*768
16:20 VanessaE no menu bar because fuck users. :P
16:20 * Jordach likes the old win9x style GUI
16:20 Fixer i remember 1024*768... that was like pre2000 resolution, seriously
16:21 * benrob0329 likes tiling window managers
16:21 Fixer VanessaE: it is taking up valuable vertical space!111
16:21 Fixer because 768px
16:21 VanessaE windows with close buttons, menu bars, a taskbar/panel at the bottom, and a "quick launcher" section (for me, that's a second panel at the top), auto-hiding enabled.
16:21 VanessaE hence, auto-hide
16:22 VanessaE two pixels at the bottom is not a significant amount of screen space, even to a C64.,
16:22 Fixer spacebar heating intensifies
16:22 Jordach my laptop is that resolution, Fixer; no complaints here
16:23 Fixer Jordach: my condolescens
16:23 Fixer es
16:23 Jordach Fixer, don;t worry, my 2560x1080 ultrawide waits for me tomorrow
16:23 VanessaE no no no and no..... if I wanted a tablet-style interface I'd use gnome3 or buy a tablet.  if I wanted an OS-X-style interface I'd buy a fucking Mac.
16:23 VanessaE leave my desktop style alone
16:24 Fixer VanessaE: not all gtk3 programs are crappified gnome way
16:24 Jordach >using GNOME as a guideline since the fuck up known as release GNOME3
16:24 Fuchs most are, because Gnome people working on GTK3 love to break the API in minor releases just so things work for Gnome
16:24 Fuchs which means, for third parties, usually either follow Gnome, or sooner or later be broken
16:25 Calinou global menu bar is nice, but it forces you to have a dock of some kind, like macOS or Unity
16:25 Calinou vertical real estate is precious today
16:25 Calinou (why do you think Firefox is losing users, especially on Linux?)
16:25 Calinou (it wastes so much vertical space)
16:25 Fixer eh, in 200X i was quite entusiastic about linux DEs... after GNOME3/KDE4/Win8/10 debacle I'm not sure anymore :}
16:25 Jordach Fixer, people want Win95 style simplicity
16:26 Calinou I'm not sure
16:26 Jordach modern shit is over-developed and far too complex for basic tasks
16:26 Calinou plenty of people *do* praise modern UIs, including me
16:26 Calinou I don't regret the 95/98/XP era
16:26 Calinou while KDE does have a lot of classic desktop elements, it also brings some new things to the table
16:27 Calinou (same for Windows 10, actually…)
16:27 Fixer on my desktop firefox has 175px for name, menu + weather + bookmarks + 3 rows of tabs... because 5:4 :}
16:27 Calinou I'm also not convinced that modern software is "over-developed"
16:27 Jordach Calinou, bullshit
16:27 Calinou you could argue that AAA games have useless, "over-developed" features
16:27 Fixer it is underdeveloped
16:27 Calinou "I could see 3D in Quake, so why do I need TressFX?"
16:27 benrob0329 Also, Jordach: nano is for normies
16:27 Jordach benrob0329, but at least its easily usable unlike vi
16:28 Fixer Jordach: +1000
16:28 benrob0329 Jordach: vi is for neckbeards
16:28 Fixer Jordach: when I seen 3.11 and W95, 95 was ground breaking
16:28 Fixer not just because newer
16:28 Jordach Fixer, because it made sense
16:28 benrob0329 Vim is where its at
16:28 Jordach now everythings like gotta be flatter than me mum's titsa
16:28 Jordach -a
16:28 Fixer Jordach: yep
16:28 benrob0329 I mean my gosh, vim is one of the easiest programs to learn
16:28 Jordach tablets and phones ruined UX design
16:29 PsychoVision joined #minetest-hub
16:29 benrob0329 It has a built in tutorial for gosh sake
16:29 Fixer Jordach: yep
16:29 Calinou https://micro-editor.github.io/ :P
16:29 Jordach depth is something humans use to judge distance
16:29 Calinou there's not much point in using nano once you start using micro
16:29 Jordach it also applies to UI
16:29 Calinou I finally got my muscle memory to type "micro" instead of "nano" now
16:30 Fixer Calinou: lol
16:30 Jordach Fixer, for the same reasons is why i use a 1989 era Walkman as my music player of choice
16:30 Fixer Calinou: wait a second ^^^^^ a modern and intuitive terminal-based text editor **** github.io ****
16:30 Jordach Calinou, and looks like every other fucking sublime clone ever made
16:30 Fixer Jordach: not really the same
16:30 Jordach gtfo
16:31 Jordach lemme open Atom, Brackets, VS2015, N++
16:31 Jordach oh wait, they look and function identically
16:31 Fixer Jordach: still, people were hyped for new windows interface back then, now people are horrified on what new SHIT microsoft (almost wrote minetest) puts in UI again
16:32 Jordach Fixer, what ain't broke; don't fix
16:32 Shara Hi PsychoVision
16:32 Jordach Fixer, my walkman plays a tape front to back without a single complaint
16:32 Jordach if my phone loses internet for a second it autistically screeches
16:32 benrob0329 Jordach: exactly, use vim.
16:32 Calinou Jordach: the default theme is Monokai indeed; in fact, I contributed that one last year
16:32 Jordach benrob0329, nano is straight forward
16:32 Calinou it looks good, approximates well to 256-color (for non-truecolor terminals)
16:32 benrob0329 Jordach: vim is powerful
16:32 Calinou and is familiar to users
16:33 Jordach powerful != useful
16:33 Calinou most users are fine with it, which is not the case of eg. solarized
16:33 Fixer Jordach: i don't even have internet on my Android 2.2... phone, now thats autistic
16:33 Calinou solarized is pretty opinionated
16:33 benrob0329 Calinou: does is support plugins?
16:33 benrob0329 Marcos?
16:33 Calinou plugins, yes
16:33 Calinou macros/snippets, not sure
16:33 Fixer i use wifi only very rarely
16:33 PsychoVision Hello Shara :D
16:33 Calinou anyway, this is a CLI editor for quick editing or editing over SSH
16:33 Calinou for actual development, use Visual Studio Code or an IDE
16:33 Fixer Calinou: just use nano
16:33 PsychoVision Lots o People here
16:33 benrob0329 Can it compile in under a minute?
16:33 Calinou likely; but official Windows/macOS/Linux/BSD binaries are available…
16:33 Calinou and they work on all distros
16:34 Jordach benrob0329, on what processor, benchmarks do not apply
16:34 Calinou https://github.com/zyedidia/micro/releases
16:34 Calinou even ARM Linux is available
16:34 Shara PsychoVision: Yup. It's getting busy.
16:34 Jordach >doing heavyweight programming on an ePI
16:34 Fixer Jordach: if you don't break UI every release - how you gonna sell it? :}
16:34 Calinou it's got a new release 2 days ago :)
16:34 Jordach Fixer, by creating security patches that work properly?
16:34 Shara Most of them don't bite though.
16:34 Fixer Jordach: fuck that.... nobody will pay for that :}
16:35 Fixer Jordach: apart from few corps
16:35 Shara though Fixer might, from some of the faces he pulls :)
16:35 Fixer Jordach: rememba that security fix that breaked printing for millions?
16:36 benrob0329 Calinou: one last question
16:36 benrob0329 Can I use vim keys?
16:36 Fixer XP/7 interface was managable, but 8 Metro thing was debucle, 8.1 was introduced to lessen anal pains, and 10 was bulled to the head
16:37 Calinou benrob0329: nope
16:37 Fixer r.i.p.
16:37 Fixer not just UI
16:37 Fixer MS went full Google
16:37 benrob0329 Calinou: then it's useless to me
16:37 Fixer now thats maximum evil
16:37 Jordach Fixer, it's why my tower at home runs literally nothing but games
16:38 Calinou do you call it the Gaben's Den?
16:38 Calinou ;)
16:39 Jordach Calinou, >plays BF1 and OW frequently
16:39 Jordach uh no
16:40 Jordach i don't even play Valve games at all
16:40 Zeno`` joined #minetest-hub
16:42 Fixer in earlier windows time you had some control over OS, but now things changed
16:42 Fixer you still have control
16:42 Fixer but MS gained so much more
16:42 Fixer you can't even shutdown telemetry to full extend
16:44 benrob0329 Windows is designed around the idea that the user should know as little about the systen as possible.
16:44 Fixer benrob0329: thats Ios
16:44 Fixer windows is not the worst case
16:45 benrob0329 its getting close.
16:45 Fixer it is more like one apple, one os, one furher
16:45 Fixer benrob0329: yeah it does
16:45 Fixer win 10 ui is mess, google for some ui analysis, for example menus
16:48 Fixer or that forced win7 to win10 upgrade that created worldwide crying
16:49 VaultyTowers anyone need help installing Kodi on Ubuntu just ask
16:49 VaultyTowers kodi + Exodus
16:53 Jordach that's called git gud, m8
17:06 Jordach sfan5, https://pbs.twimg.com/media​/DBAZtPCXgAAYKtz.jpg:large
17:07 Krock deserves a place in MTB
17:09 Jordach Fixer, i'm tempted to make a "Technic lite" mod
17:10 Jordach hyper simplicity
17:12 DS-minetest Jordach: the worst problem with technic is that it uses meta
17:12 sfan5 fluffy kitty
17:12 Jordach DS-minetest, i'm thinking of a mesecon style method
17:12 DS-minetest when that is changed, technic won't be that laggy anymore
17:13 sfan5 Krock: https://github.com/sfan5/minetestbot-modules/c​ommit/382e7cb15bd2064fc4aee47c3f85b3173fd2a507
17:13 Krock \o/
17:13 Jordach sfan5, https://twitter.com/HaddockStinker
17:14 DS-minetest Jordach: i think, HybridDog has started something already something
17:14 Jordach DS-minetest, i'd prefer doing it myself
17:14 DS-minetest yep, just that you know more
17:17 Jordach i want to do it in a way that looks good
17:18 * Jordach is thinking electrical victorian
17:18 nerzhul joined #minetest-hub
17:19 kaeza joined #minetest-hub
17:22 ssieb joined #minetest-hub
17:28 Fixer DS-minetest: there is PR that should easy the pain for technic users
17:28 * Fixer pokes Krock
17:29 Krock o.0
17:29 Fixer Send only changed node metadata to clients instead of whole mapblock @ Server / Client / Env. One approval / Performance / Protocol bump @ #5268 opened on 18 Feb by SmallJoker  / https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/5268
17:30 Krock *looks*
17:30 Krock hmm.. appears to have some conficts
17:30 Fixer nerzhul added to Feature PR in Minetest 0.5 6 days ago
17:31 Krock that's good :)  no?
17:31 Fixer *suspicious*
17:32 DS-minetest Fixer: yeah, but the server still has too much lag
17:33 DS-minetest using meta makes no sense
17:33 Krock Fixer, what's so suspicious about it?
17:34 Fixer Krock: just rebase it after 0.4.16 release and move it in :}
17:34 Fixer DS-minetest: why no sense?
17:35 DS-minetest Fixer: because meta shouldn't be used for such stuff
17:35 DS-minetest in technic it's called very very often
17:35 Fixer DS-minetest: but what is alternative?
17:36 DS-minetest make a new system, that doesn't use meta too much
17:36 DS-minetest i cant be too specific now
17:36 Krock Fixer, yes sure. We'll have to see what's going to happen first: protocol changes or this feature
17:36 Krock these two plans collide, that's why it may not be patched into Minetest right after the new version released
17:39 Jordach a y y  l m a o
17:41 DS-minetest Fixer: eg. it could look like this https://github.com/HybridDog/technic/blob/hversi​on/technic/machines/register/solar_array_new.lua
17:56 nerzhul this PR has bugs
17:57 nerzhul it's incomplete, i remember when RBA wrote it, we discussed together
18:09 Krock it has been improved over the time and there's not much original code (1:1 taken) left.
18:10 corvus_ joined #minetest-hub
18:10 lisac_ joined #minetest-hub
18:12 VaultyTowers sup lisac
18:12 VaultyTowers I started a war
18:12 Jordach :thinking:
18:12 VaultyTowers lisac_, ^^
18:13 VaultyTowers PM me what troop you want in your CC
18:13 lisac_ Hi VaultyTowers.
18:13 lisac_ lol okay
18:13 Raven262 War you say?
18:13 VaultyTowers Clash of clans
18:14 * lisac > Amorphis - Death of a King  - [ Under the Red Cloud #5 ] - [ 02:32 / 05:14 ]
18:14 Raven262 And thats how the war started, both sides found themselves fighting for whatever cause.
18:14 Raven262 And killing each other cause whatever.
18:14 VaultyTowers both benefit
18:15 VaultyTowers lisac, I gave you a valkery and 4 lvl 4 wizards
18:16 Raven262 Heh, i thought you were talking about OC's things.
18:16 lisac nice :)
18:16 lisac I just logged in after several days of inactivity
18:16 lisac got goons now
18:17 VaultyTowers need normal troops just ask
18:17 VaultyTowers I got several pekkas ready
18:17 lisac sure :)
18:17 lisac I need just 6 more stars on the Goblins
18:17 lisac to take all 150
18:17 VaultyTowers lol I got all 150
18:18 lisac Yeah, but I'm not such a hardcore player
18:18 * lisac > Amorphis - Under the Red Cloud  - [ Under the Red Cloud #1 ] - [ 00:05 / 05:33 ]
18:18 * lisac is playing on Clementine: [ 00:07 / 05:33 ] "Under the Red Cloud" by "Amorphis" (track #1 of album "Under the Red Cloud") | MP3 | 44100 Hz | 320 kbps
18:19 Raven262 Hello lisac, did we meet each other?
18:19 Raven262 Like ever?
18:19 Raven262 Cause i doubt it.
18:19 lisac hey look at this http://armory.twinstar.cz/character-s​heet.xml?r=Kronos&amp;cn=Wordsofpower
18:20 lisac Hi Raven262.
18:21 nore ehm you know that you both have the same IP, right?
18:21 Raven262 nore, we are joking.
18:21 nore Raven262: I was not sure :)
18:22 Raven262 xD
18:22 Raven262 I found this mod: https://forum.minetest.net/v​iewtopic.php?f=9&amp;t=17654
18:22 * nore is used to people in the same room using irc to talk anyway
18:23 Krock !title
18:23 ShadowBot BTW - BETTER THAN WOOL - MOD - Minetest Forums
18:23 Raven262 So i had to correct a few things in the last comment
18:23 Raven262 :D
18:23 Raven262 Really, nore?
18:23 nore Raven262: yes.
18:23 red-002 lol
18:24 Raven262 I thought lisac an I are the only two persons who are in the same room, yet talking over irc.
18:24 lisac Raven262, https://media.giphy.com/med​ia/G6NaboPT6q3za/giphy.gif
18:24 nore (well it's useful if you want to talk to other people at the same time, but then you get carried over and talk even though you're all in the same room)
18:24 lisac that's because I don't like talking to you, Raven.
18:24 Raven262 Yes, basically.
18:24 Raven262 That too.
18:24 nore also, especially useful during lectures
18:24 benrob0329 If we had a conference, we'd still talk over irc
18:25 nore you can talk and the teacher is not noticing, they think you are taking notes :)
18:25 benrob0329 The whole presentation would be in ascii art
18:25 Raven262 :O
18:25 lisac nore, Yeah, but don't forget to look the teacher in the eye a few times
18:25 lisac just to pretend you are listening
18:25 nore lisac: oh but I'm listening at the same time
18:25 Raven262 They have computers and stuff in their schools, lisac.
18:25 benrob0329 lisac: nono, then you get asked questions
18:25 nore doing both things at once :)
18:26 benrob0329 Jusr don't smile randomly
18:26 benrob0329 Then all bets are off
18:26 Raven262 xD
18:26 lisac benrob0329, There is a skill of answering questions you don't know answers to.
18:26 lumidify benrob0329: write the presentation in markdown and share that.
18:26 lumidify #MarkdownFTW
18:26 Raven262 Hello lumidify
18:26 lumidify Hi Raven262
18:27 * Raven262 sends lumidify a lumidified hello.
18:27 Raven262 What does lumidify mean actually?
18:27 Raven262 Is it a name?
18:27 benrob0329 lumidify: no, write it in latex :^)
18:27 benrob0329 Honestly though, latex looks really powerful
18:27 lumidify Nah, markdown is really nice and simple
18:28 lumidify Although I write all my papers in LaTex
18:28 * nore still needs to meet someone who writes their papers with markdown
18:28 benrob0329 markdown is nice for in chat text
18:29 benrob0329 Latex is nice for when you need to write a paper/presentation
18:29 benrob0329 Afaik anyways
18:29 lumidify I would write my papers in markdown if there was an easy way to do MLA :P
18:29 nore (LaTeX is very useful for papers and presentations (beamer ftw))
18:29 nore MLA?
18:29 lumidify Hmm, I could write the body in markdown and then use pandoc to convert it to LaTex
18:29 benrob0329 Asciidoc looks nice too
18:29 lumidify https://www.mla.org/
18:29 jin_xi joined #minetest-hub
18:30 nore hmmm
18:30 benrob0329 Perhaps we should make a standard for MT documentation
18:30 nore well when doing math or CS, having to write papers without a way to write nice formulas is quite impossible :)
18:30 lumidify pandoc is really nice because I can convert everyone's stupid formats to LaTex
18:31 lumidify http://pandoc.org/
18:31 benrob0329 Right now we have text in engine, markdown in mods, and mediawiki for the wiki
18:31 lumidify Yeah, markdown really could only be used for the most simple papers
18:32 * benrob0329 bookmarks pandoc
18:37 benrob0329 We should force everyone to use LaTeX, and then make the docs available to everyone via Html, pdf etc
18:37 benrob0329 Actually, that'd be an interesting way to run a wiki
18:38 lumidify Well, I think for docs markdown is good enough
18:38 benrob0329 Have a git repo that compiles to htmk
18:38 benrob0329 *html
18:38 lumidify LaTex has a fairly large overhead compared to markdown
18:38 benrob0329 Yes, but is far more powerful
18:39 lumidify "Use the right tool for the job."
18:39 lumidify It would probably be overkill
18:39 benrob0329 Id much rather learn the more flexible tool than get stuck 'cause I took a shortcut
18:39 lumidify Yes, but why the extra complexity when you don't need it?
18:40 benrob0329 Because its like a multitool
18:40 benrob0329 you'll necer need it, until you do
18:40 benrob0329 And then you'll NEED it
18:40 lumidify Yes, but will you ever need the full power of LaTex for fairly simple documentation?
18:41 benrob0329 Do you ever need the full power of anything?
18:41 red-002 but can you make a turning machine in LaTex?
18:41 lumidify It's not like you need to use Markdown for absolutely everything you ever do if you use it for one thing.
18:41 lumidify You could still use LaTex for papers/more complicated stuff but do documentation in something simple like Markdown.
18:41 benrob0329 yes, but then you need two setups
18:42 benrob0329 One for latex, and one for markdown, unless its on a wiki or something
18:42 benrob0329 But then your not really using markdown anyways
18:43 lumidify I just don't think using LaTex for something as simple as most documentation is warranted because it is less human readable than markdown.
18:43 lumidify Don't get me wrong, I love LaTex, but for simple applications I like to use simple tools.
18:44 benrob0329 I didn't say it was practical, just interesting :-)
18:44 benrob0329 I donr write wikis or websites
18:44 benrob0329 So neither are really a use case
18:44 lumidify Yeah, it would be interesting, just maybe overkill
18:46 benrob0329 Who knows, being able to easily embed a presentation into your website which inherits from some backend function overriding all css could be usefull for something
18:46 benrob0329 Idk what though
18:46 lumidify Meh, I use lynx anyways, it doesn't care about CSS.
18:47 benrob0329 elinks supports ecma
18:47 lumidify #LynxFTW
18:47 lumidify But I have to be able to tell people that I use the oldest browser currently still in development.
18:47 benrob0329 Links2 has a Framebuffer mode
18:48 benrob0329 And w3m has in terminal images
18:48 lumidify I don't think it's bad that lynx doesn't support CSS or images, it makes everything so much cleaner.
18:48 lumidify Images are opened in an external viewer when I go to them.
18:48 benrob0329 Also, I don't know that any of them are still being developed
18:49 lumidify Gopher is so much better than the web anyways.
18:49 lumidify Lynx is still being developed.
18:49 benrob0329 Needs proper layouts
18:49 lumidify gopher://lumidify.ig42.org/
18:49 lumidify Lynx also supports gopher natively :)
18:49 benrob0329 Many webpages are nearly unusable in lynx
18:50 lumidify You can download Lord of the Test over gopher!
18:50 lumidify gopher://lumidify.ig42.org/1/lott/
18:50 * Krock grabs gopher addon
18:53 * benrob0329 wonders what browser would support that on mobile
19:11 Jordach joined #minetest-hub
19:11 tenplus1 joined #minetest-hub
19:11 tenplus1 hi folks
19:12 Jordach ayy
19:12 tenplus1 hi Jordach :P
19:13 Jordach :thinking:
19:13 tenplus1 about ?
19:18 Jordach a better replacement for an already existing idea for SP
19:21 tenplus1 sp?
19:21 Jordach Solar Plains
19:21 Jordach thinking about a degree of automation
19:21 tenplus1 ahh... gotcha :P  acronyms confuse me :P
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19:28 tenplus1 hi gary
19:28 garywhite hi ten
19:29 Raven262 Greetings, tenplus1.
19:29 tenplus1 hi raven :D
19:29 Raven262 I was playing on Xanadu yesterday, made a mushroom house
19:30 Raven262 I like mushrooms
19:30 tenplus1 ncie one :)  we got an udpate ready to go for tonight
19:31 * Jordach is working on new cool stuff
19:36 * Calinou set up a ttrss instance
19:36 Calinou works well
19:36 tenplus1 it seems we have a hacked client out there able to dig up cloud nodes on server
19:37 Calinou if anticheat is on, that shouldn't be possible
19:37 Calinou but since disabling anticheat disables even the checks that should never have false positives… :(
19:38 tenplus1 https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-cus0​GoX95qA/WSx4DQWl-xI/AAAAAAAADyg/9FjYU57​whHUDNP5qCoqNkvEu4K3Gjmb5QCL0B/h900/689​5818338944823733%253Faccount_id%253D1
19:38 tenplus1 they dug up the LB arena, floor was all cloud block
19:39 garywhite Geez, how did that happen, & also, did you run a rollback check?
19:41 tenplus1 rollback disabled
20:03 Fixer Calinou: rss is power, rss is life
20:03 Calinou now I can read Phoronix with less trolls!
20:03 Calinou :D
20:04 Fixer Calinou: less trolls? Where do you see trolls on phoronix? o_O
20:04 tenplus1 +1 for phoronix :p
20:04 Calinou Fixer: in comments :P
20:04 Calinou the forums, that is
20:04 Fixer oh, it has comments
20:04 Fixer never looked into them
20:04 Fixer comments = cancer
20:04 Fixer everywhere
20:05 Fuchs I honestly can't recommend phoronix, the comments are full of trolls, and the "articleS" are poorly up to not at all recherched and auto-crawled by various mailing list and repo crawlers
20:05 Fuchs we had to correct them multiple times for spreading downright wrong information
20:05 Fuchs well, "them", it's basically a one man show
20:06 tenplus1 hi Fixer, hi Fuchs
20:06 Fuchs hi :)
20:12 Calinou Fuchs: however, Phoronix is the only site that does Linux hardware benchmarks
20:12 Calinou (real one, not "I got a new laptop from 2013, I'll benchmark it, lol")
20:13 Fuchs I'm not sure if that really warrants the rest, but that's personal preference :)
20:13 Calinou it gives Linux exposure to enthusiasts, so we need a site like that
20:14 Fixer Calinou: his benchmarks lack one thing - conclusions page
20:18 Calinou full-featured benchmarks do have a conclusion page
20:18 Calinou but it's not great
20:21 tenplus1 nite folks
20:21 tenplus1 left #minetest-hub
20:31 Fixer <invalid multibyte string>
20:32 shivajiva joined #minetest-hub
20:41 Fixer need to rework this insanity https://i.imgur.com/AyqXHxc.png
20:42 Fixer changed windows
20:42 Fixer need to rework that middle ugly horizontal thing
20:43 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/gG2lB8b.png
21:13 Jordach Fixer, https://gist.github.com/Jordach/​f66af33cc01f60da2e9fa790f7d85f22
21:14 red-002 <invalid multibyte string> ?
21:16 Fixer red-002: <invalid multibyte string> !
21:16 * red-002 is still confused
21:17 LazyJ joined #minetest-hub
21:17 red-002 <invalid multibyte string> ??!
21:17 Fixer red-002: happens in minetest chat sometimes
21:18 red-002 oh I only saw <invalid wstring>
21:18 red-002 but that was via the IRC mod
21:18 red-002 not in-game
21:24 NathanS21 Is there no way to change the size of the players inventory?
21:24 NathanS21 Everything I can find is just the formspecs
21:24 NathanS21 which makes fewer slots show, but does nothing to the actual inventory capacity
21:25 NathanS21 so even when all slots are filled I can still pick up items.
21:26 Jordach https://github.com/minetest/minetes​t/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L1522
21:27 Jordach list[current_player;main;0,3.5;8,4;]
21:27 Jordach change the 8,4;] part to whatever
21:27 Jordach 8x4 inv slots
21:27 NathanS21 I have it set as 8x3
21:27 Jordach it's in the goddamn manual ;)
21:27 Jordach NathanS21, it has to be on join
21:27 NathanS21 but I can still pick up eight extra items
21:28 NathanS21 unfortunately I can't see them in inventory, because there are no slots to display them in.
21:29 NathanS21 It's almost as if it's hardcoded someplace that the player can carry 32 stacks
21:29 NathanS21 but I can't even find that code in the engine.
21:30 red-002 constants.h?
21:30 NathanS21 hmm, didn't look at that at all
21:30 Jordach https://github.com/PilzAdam/nodetopia​/blob/f245dfdd9ebad63a4f0d3f2cf04739b​12747f0e6/mods/backpack/init.lua#L24
21:31 Jordach NathanS21, git gud
21:31 red-002 it's one of those werid hardcoded things iirc
21:31 Jordach red-002, *wrong*
21:31 red-002 like max health/breath
21:31 Jordach Pilzadam did it years ago
21:31 NathanS21 hmm, I'll try that out
21:32 Jordach NathanS21, https://github.com/PilzAdam/nodetopia​/blob/f245dfdd9ebad63a4f0d3f2cf04739b​12747f0e6/mods/backpack/init.lua#L42
21:32 NathanS21 not sure where I'll put the code in
21:32 Jordach you need that line to change how many slots the inv "main" has
21:32 NathanS21 ya, line 53 looks like what I need
21:32 Jordach remember, that's in total slots
21:33 NathanS21 yes
21:33 NathanS21 not unfamiliar with creating UIs and inventories, just couldn't figure out how to change the players.
21:33 NathanS21 I'm writing a subgame from scratch, and want to change the players inventory
21:34 NathanS21 more reasons for people to craft a backpack.
21:35 NathanS21 that worked, just put it in the on joinplayer code for the 3d player model
21:35 NathanS21 thanks!
21:35 Jordach NathanS21, i re-did the fecking main menu into a proper menu, not a tabbed ui
21:35 Jordach (alright, it's a prototype that works)
21:36 NathanS21 I don't think I've seen that
21:38 Jordach https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.p​hp?f=3&amp;t=156&amp;p=268254#p268254
21:38 NathanS21 not bad, though that green does seem a little bright
21:39 NathanS21 is that something texture packs could change?
21:39 Jordach base/pack
21:39 Jordach like every other MT component
21:39 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/9XQvQw6.png
21:39 Jordach Fixer, a y y  l m ao
21:40 Jordach +0x20
21:40 NathanS21 cool
21:41 kaeza oi limão
21:41 kaeza Fixer, outdated client?
21:41 Jordach tfw jordach.net cert is busted until tomorrow
21:41 Fixer no idea
21:41 kaeza I've seen that happen on SN's server
21:41 Jordach i can;t fix it since root is locked out
21:41 kaeza well, from IRC anyway
21:41 Jordach and that digitalocean's root panel is also locked out through ssh key usage
21:42 Jordach tfw rekt
21:42 Jordach adding a new key to root does not work either
21:42 kaeza Jordach, rm -fr
21:42 kaeza +/
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21:42 Jordach kaeza, cant do fuck all
21:42 kaeza Jordach, worked once IIRC
21:42 kaeza <_<
21:42 Jordach NathanS21, http://i.imgur.com/9xRosJr.png
21:43 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/AylBkEr.png
21:43 Jordach i've braved sapier tier Lua shit
21:43 kaeza LOL
21:43 kaeza "sapier tier" :D
21:43 Jordach all to produce a fucking proper mainmenu
21:43 Jordach but fun fact
21:44 Jordach fstk was not modified except one line: to remove that grey formspec bg
21:44 Fixer Jordach: now do PR to merge this in 0.5
21:44 Jordach Fixer, out of date, needs rebase like fuck
21:44 Jordach i'll see what git pull does to it on a copy
21:44 Fixer oh that LCD ghosting....
21:45 NathanS21 Jordach, not bad, not bad.
21:45 Jordach kaeza, if i figured out the black magic sapier used, then there's no stopping me tearing the engine apart for realtime lighting
21:49 Jordach judging by https://github.com/minetest/minetes​t/blob/master/doc/menu_lua_api.txt
21:49 Jordach it may even be possible to re-write the whole damn thing
21:50 Jordach yeeee[p
21:50 Jordach shits doable
21:50 Jordach probably may do a better job, Kappa
21:51 kaeza do it
21:51 kaeza nao
21:52 * Fixer thinks https://i.imgur.com/xO1whR4.png
21:52 Jordach dir_delim is useless to Lua specificallh
21:53 Jordach -h +y
21:53 Fixer kaeza: nice fonts
21:53 Jordach because it translates / to \ on windows and other systems
21:53 kaeza Fixer, wut
21:53 Fixer kaeza: do it
21:53 * Jordach can't read that
21:53 Jordach fucking useless laptop and hexchat
21:53 kaeza Jordach, hexchat?
21:53 kaeza lel
21:54 kaeza hexchat's rendering is shit
21:54 Jordach kaeza, doesn't render at all
21:54 Jordach top kek
21:55 kaeza Jordach, http://i.imgur.com/uIElQHt.png
21:55 Jordach i'll probably sketch out a new UI
21:55 Jordach and then retire FSTK for good
21:56 Jordach it's all metatable bollocks that can be re-written
21:56 Jordach plus the offical minetest android build gets a fix
21:56 kaeza Jordach, Fixer, https://gist.github.com/kaeza/c​906bd55a129223c5ae71ea0da79bbd5
21:56 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/GOX1ICK.png
21:57 Jordach holy shit wtf
21:57 Jordach >firefox on 5200rpm disk
21:57 Jordach >15 sec to start
21:57 Fixer Jordach: lololol
21:57 Jordach >chrome
21:57 Fixer Jordach: true
21:57 Jordach >instant
21:57 Jordach wat
21:57 Fixer Jordach: be fair, chrome was just installed?
21:57 Jordach Fixer, ancient install, like ff
21:57 Jordach on windows
21:57 Jordach chrome beating firefox round the head with a giant purple dildo
21:58 Fixer my firefox starts >10 sec for a good reason, 6000 bookmarks, about 10 addons...
21:58 Fixer first start is long
21:58 Fixer next one is fast
21:58 Jordach Fixer, my ssd makes loading chrome literally instant
21:58 Jordach i see no delay even at 75hz
21:59 red-002 <Fixer> kaeza: do it
22:03 red-002 https://pastebin.com/zZm4xXhW
22:04 red-002 someones ban might need to be reinstated
22:04 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/yQCj6IE.png
22:06 Fixer kids love coloured clay
22:07 Fixer now i understand why MC introduced many kinds of doors
22:08 Sokomine coloured clay is great! it's a very nice material for building
22:08 Fixer as well as minetest
22:08 Sokomine and doors are good as well
22:35 bigfoot547 joined #minetest-hub
22:38 bigfoot547 left #minetest-hub
22:43 bigfoot547 joined #minetest-hub
22:45 red-002 hey can bigfoot547 have voice?
22:46 Shara Hi bigfoot547
22:47 VaultyTowers anyone know how to get a free VPN for linux?
22:47 bigfoot547 Hey Shara. Thanks red-002 :)
22:47 red-002 VaultyTowers, VPN's don't tend to care what OS you use
22:48 VaultyTowers fine does anyone know any free ones period XD
22:52 bigfoot547 joined #minetest-hub
22:53 red-002 and thats why you register with chanserv
22:53 red-002 nickserv*
22:53 red-002 *serv*
22:53 rubenwardy bigfoot547, /msg NickServ register username email
22:57 red-002 s/username/password ?
22:58 benrob0329 red-002: yes
23:18 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/cPHKV2l.png
23:19 benrob0329 >4:3
23:19 benrob0329 kek
23:19 jin_xi joined #minetest-hub
23:20 stormchaser3000_ joined #minetest-hub
23:27 Fixer benrob0329: 5:4
23:28 Hijiri Jordach: it doesn't look like your system allows for machines with multiple outputs being output in different directions from a machine, is that intended? It doesn't actually describe what extractor pipes do, but it looks like it's implying one output inventory
23:29 Jordach Hijiri, the pipes allow non top and bottom faces irregardless
23:29 Jordach refresh it, there's a few new things that add some factorio like complexity
23:29 Hijiri I opened it a moment ago
23:29 Hijiri Jordach: I mean for example a recipe produces ice cream and water buckets, and those get output from different sides
23:30 Jordach Hijiri, it'll extract in sequence
23:30 Hijiri so it would all go out the same side?
23:30 Jordach yes
23:30 Hijiri ok, so it can't be output from different sides, then
23:30 Jordach Modded MC spoilt me with intelligent sides and routing
23:31 Jordach using a London Underground stop system is unique
23:31 Jordach plus they have to be pulsed by a power source
23:31 Hijiri I guess so, don't know if that means it's better though
23:31 Jordach Hijiri, IRL conveyors are like that
23:31 Hijiri IRL machines don't take one node
23:32 Jordach obviously ;)
23:32 Jordach i wanted a proper balance between the two
23:32 Jordach basic automation features
23:32 Hijiri If you had a centrifuge for example it wouldn't make sense to output them from the same outlet
23:32 Jordach and some difficulty rather than *cough* AE2
23:32 Jordach Hijiri, as MT doesn't do multiblocks juuuuuust yet (other than the Technic reactor)
23:33 Jordach i'm staving off of them for simplicity
23:33 Hijiri MT doesn't need to do it, I'm convinced you could make a multiblock structure library in pure modding currently
23:33 Jordach Hijiri, considering factories are multiblock structures ;)
23:33 Hijiri multiblock machines
23:33 Jordach same difference
23:34 Jordach most of them have a simple i/o
23:34 Jordach (eg, two chests)
23:34 Hijiri I can describe the entire thing if we want to be pedantic
23:34 Jordach you could
23:34 Jordach but notice most of the auto-sorting stupidity is missing
23:34 Jordach i may also do some sort of JABBA like for those who want to neatly display things
23:35 Hijiri What does auto-sorting being missing have to do with this?
23:35 Hijiri the multiblock stuff
23:35 Hijiri not the side output stuff
23:35 Jordach i'm not a fan of multiblocks
23:36 Jordach <obscure material block 1> <tedium crafting block 2>
23:36 Jordach immersive engineering looks nice
23:36 Jordach horrible to do
23:36 Hijiri by "do" you mean use as a player right
23:36 Jordach yes
23:36 Hijiri ok
23:36 Jordach i've played lots of modded MC on a few servers
23:36 Hijiri I guess if that's a personal preference
23:37 Hijiri I thought you were implying that you would do them if you could do it easily, since you blamed MT not supporting them well
23:37 Jordach it's because MT has a monster of a desync issue
23:37 Hijiri Is that a problem for multiblocks?
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23:37 Jordach my chest experiment showed that it struggles with communicating states to a single object, let alone 3^3
23:38 Hijiri by object you mean node?
23:38 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/GIaDSkv.png
23:38 Hijiri Or are you saying each node would be an entity?
23:38 Jordach either or
23:39 Jordach it's doable as both
23:39 benrob0329 what if every entity was a node :^)
23:39 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/sQ4B8eK.png
23:39 Hijiri I imagine you would have 3x3 invisible nodes and just an entity / node in the center that was big enough to display the whole thing
23:39 Hijiri 3x3x3
23:39 Hijiri or whatever size your thing is
23:40 Jordach https://youtu.be/JHfmoG4MUIQ
23:40 Hijiri multiblocks don't have to be animated
23:40 Hijiri animation and multiblock are orthogonal
23:40 Jordach Hijiri, remember, active and inactive states still need to be sent to clients
23:41 Jordach even locally that had inane levels of latency
23:41 Hijiri If you're updating one node / entity then what's the difference with single node machines?
23:41 Jordach CSM might help
23:41 benrob0329 nodes need animation
23:41 Jordach ^
23:41 Jordach wielditem custom models wen
23:41 benrob0329 thatd solve a lot of out problems
23:41 Hijiri Jordach: Okay, but it's still no different that working with a single node
23:41 benrob0329 *out
23:41 Hijiri than*
23:41 benrob0329 *our
23:41 Jordach Hijiri the problem is latency
23:42 Jordach you don;t know how bad it is for some servers
23:42 Hijiri Why is it a bigger problem with a multiblock
23:42 Hijiri You're still only updating one node / entity
23:42 benrob0329 if nodes had entity like animation, and states, you could set the animation based on the state
23:42 benrob0329 same with texture etc
23:42 Jordach benrob0329, i'd love nodes in the form of a state machine
23:42 Hijiri benrob0329: and you would still need to send states
23:42 Jordach Hijiri, sending the changing states is a problem
23:42 benrob0329 Hijiri: so? sending a 1 or a 2 isnt hard
23:43 Hijiri benrob0329: right, and neither is sending an animation index
23:43 Jordach Hijiri, i'd advise you to stand in a pipeworks factory ;)
23:43 benrob0329 1,30,5 state 3
23:43 Hijiri Jordach: I still don't see why the problem is worse with a multiblock than a single node machine
23:43 Hijiri (because you still haven't explained it)
23:43 benrob0329 Hijiri: think about it this way
23:43 benrob0329 you have a chest
23:43 benrob0329 and you have to have two states anyways
23:44 Jordach Hijiri, because a multiblock might be misloaded, a node missing (MT doesn't check for those automatically)
23:44 benrob0329 one for open, one for close
23:44 Hijiri Jordach: Only the "main" node has to be loaded
23:44 Fixer Jordach: could this help in any way? https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/5702
23:44 Hijiri The other nodes are just there so that if you dig them it undoes the whole structure
23:45 benrob0329 having to manage changing states (with callbacks, youll need to copy meta manually, without youll need to make the node do a thing on a timer) is a huge pain
23:45 benrob0329 trust me when i say its a huge pain
23:45 Jordach Fixer, *orgasm*
23:45 benrob0329 i made a mod that had 10+ states on a node
23:45 Hijiri Jordach: You only need one node to provide visuals, processing things, etc., the rest of the nodes can just display the "main" node's formspec and remove the structure on_destruxt
23:45 Jordach Hijiri, Tile Entities mostly make it straight forward
23:46 Hijiri Jordach: sure, but there aren't great problems with implementing such a library in MT
23:46 Hijiri including desync problems
23:46 Jordach Hijiri, https://github.com/Jordach/big_freaking_​dig/blob/master/mods/deco/init.lua#L917
23:46 benrob0329 each state could only overide certain aspects of the node
23:46 Jordach look at the shit i had to do to make a chest lid swing open and shut
23:46 Hijiri For one node
23:47 Hijiri the problem will be the same with a multiblock or one node
23:47 Jordach Hijiri, depending on things, that might have even more animations
23:47 Jordach eg, processing, smelting, grinding etc
23:47 Hijiri But not because it was a multiblock, only because it is a machine
23:47 Jordach which is a bitch to do
23:47 benrob0329 Hijiri: it would be far less caotic for one node + states
23:47 Hijiri Jordach: Why do multiblocks need to have multiple animations when a single node machine only needs one?
23:47 Hijiri or two
23:48 Jordach Hijiri, because a multiblock may do multiple things
23:48 Jordach (factorization and magneticcraft speak to me(
23:48 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/HzyguHR.png
23:48 Hijiri They don't need to though
23:48 Jordach ask anyone who's played a game in the last 30 years
23:48 benrob0329 multinode: redifine every spect of the node 20 times, make a nice meta-copying function that calls node callbacks, make sure that each node returns to base state or else everything will go horribly wrong
23:48 Jordach even the smallest shit has an animation
23:48 Hijiri The only game in the last 30 years with multiblocks is minecraft
23:49 Jordach Hijiri, tile entities make that a fucking breeze
23:49 Jordach they are not a block
23:49 Jordach nor an entity in the MT way
23:49 benrob0329 ok hold on for a minute
23:49 Hijiri They could be implemented with an entity + other stuff, ignoring the entity component stuff MC has going on
23:49 Jordach MT cannot do it properly since there's too many hoops to jump through
23:49 benrob0329 Hijiri: why would yo not want node states?
23:49 Hijiri You can jump through the hoops
23:49 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/Y60aFFx.png need to think more about this floor transition, it bothers me
23:50 Jordach at the cost of being a tech demo
23:50 Hijiri benrob0329: I'm saying it wouldn't solve the desync problem if you had to send each state
23:50 Hijiri benrob0329: It could be good for other reasons
23:50 Jordach i'm opinionated because i've seen it's trash
23:50 benrob0329 each state is a lot less intensive than a new friggen node
23:50 Jordach theres no point in doing it
23:50 Jordach Minetest isn't "dynamic" in the slightest
23:50 Hijiri Jordach: So I'm guessing all your single node machines are going to be animated?
23:51 Jordach Hijiri, fuck that
23:51 Jordach i'm not made of dev time
23:51 Hijiri Okay, then why does a multiblock have to be animated?
23:51 Jordach Hijiri, because users cannot tell if it works or not
23:51 Hijiri Jordach: do you mean if it's put together properly
23:51 Jordach yes and no
23:52 Jordach you need states to identify what it's doing
23:52 benrob0329 Hijiri: ignore the horid code style and look at this
23:52 benrob0329 https://github.com/benrob0329​/tardis/blob/master/demat.lua
23:52 Hijiri Jordach: Are you talking about multiple functions again?
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23:52 benrob0329 there are 12 node def in that file
23:52 Hijiri Why not just have single-function machines like IE?
23:52 benrob0329 12!
23:52 Hijiri benrob0329: I wouldn't consider implementing animations like that
23:52 Jordach Hijiri, entities cannot be semi-transparent
23:53 benrob0329 a node state that redefines the texture and timer would make that a breeze
23:53 Jordach protip
23:53 Hijiri Jordach: oh right
23:53 Jordach it's alpha or no alpha
23:53 benrob0329 reduce the amount of code by..90%?
23:53 Hijiri benrob0329: So what about supporting node animations though?
23:53 Jordach no middle ground, just the high ground...it's OVER ANAKIN
23:53 benrob0329 Hijiri: thatd be incredibly usefull
23:53 benrob0329 doors could have some life to them
23:53 Jordach how about wielditem custom meshes as well
23:54 Jordach benrob0329, see masalis doors please
23:54 Fixer malasis
23:54 Fixer or molasis
23:54 Fixer molasis had crash with optifine, but now it is fixed
23:54 Jordach Hijiri, MC modders won't touch MT because it's not fecking flexible enough to do some cool shit
23:55 Jordach that includes multiblocks
23:55 Fixer multiblocks? you mean cheasel & bits?
23:55 Hijiri I'm not saying it wouldn't be cool to support multiblocks, but I'm saying you could still get a lot of functionality through mod land
23:55 Hijiri If you wanted that functionality
23:56 benrob0329 node/entity/item states + animaiton + texture override + dynamic textures = win for all
23:56 Jordach Hijiri, multiblocks are used just to look cool half of the time
23:56 Jordach i'd rather be nice and cubic
23:57 Jordach everything in solar plains is 1/16
23:57 Hijiri Well if it's just about your preference, this conversation seems pointless since you wouldn't use multiblocks even if they were supported as an API
23:58 Jordach big massive machines that look nice but are an arse to work with vs a small block with plenty of i/o
23:58 benrob0329 I would use states and/or multiblocks
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23:59 benrob0329 tbh i stopped work atm on that tardis mod because i need to convert it to an api, and with the amount of ndoes defines...
23:59 benrob0329 yeah
23:59 Jordach i also dislike the tanks as seen in the core engine
23:59 Jordach framed glass looks like shit
23:59 Jordach Minecraft as a game on it;s own proves that MT needs work

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