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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2017-06-05

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Time Nick Message
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02:47 paramat celeron55 please could you consider this critical issue? #5915 this could potentially make a mess of multiplayer MT
02:47 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5915 -- CSM: Allowing a server to protect itself against clients running client-provided clientmods
02:49 bigfoot547 Wait. You want the server to be able to not allow a client to use CSM?
02:50 bigfoot547 paramat?
02:51 * bigfoot547 didn't see the quit message...
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07:35 nerzhul hi, pushing a trivial fix, we have a SharedPtr class which is unused, removing it this will never be used (std::shared_ptr<> is there is C++11 if needed later)
07:43 nerzhul merging #5909 docfix
07:43 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5909 -- Fixed #5907 Documentation for screen_h and screen_w by Dumbeldor
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09:38 red-001 #5852
09:38 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5852 -- Improve the path select GUI by red-001
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10:24 SG9kb3I https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/m​aster/builtin/mainmenu/tab_credits.lua#L60
10:25 nerzhul joined #minetest-dev
10:25 SG9kb3I What's the go there? Others (e.g. Zeno) did as much if not more optimization than gcu (you can check in the logs)
10:27 Thomas-S nerzhul, could you please check if the HybridPtr thing in #5895 is ok for you? (I'm asking because you removed SharedPtr today.) Thanks for your efforts!
10:27 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5895 -- Meta-set nodedef: Part 1 by Thomas--S
10:29 kilbith joined #minetest-dev
10:30 kilbith SG9kb3I, go troll elsewhere, Zeno
10:30 red-001 if you are going to make it so obvious you are zeno you might as well change your nick
10:36 SG9kb3I *sigh*
10:38 Zeno` joined #minetest-dev
10:39 Zeno` Last failed attempt from: |o|!red@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-tafhsqvroqtxbhac on Jun 03 19:10:28 2017.
10:39 Zeno` I wonder who that could have been
10:39 kilbith what's that
10:39 Zeno` it's someone who attempted to login as me
10:40 kilbith looks like red-001
10:40 Zeno` * [red-001] (red@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-tafhsqvroqtxbhac): red-001@EliteBnc
10:40 Zeno` yes, it does
10:40 red-001 huh
10:40 Zeno` -NickServ- Last failed attempt from: |o|!red@gateway/shell/elitebnc/x-tafhsqvroqtxbhac on Jun 03 19:10:28 2017.
10:40 kilbith the same one who threat servers to shut them down, right?
10:40 Zeno` *shrug* that's what nickserv says
10:40 red-001 werid
10:41 red-001 I didn't do that
10:41 red-001 it was your main account right?
10:41 red-001 wait maybe my bnc was compromised
10:42 Zeno` I could ask Fuchs I guess
10:42 kilbith you won't admit you did that, naturally
10:42 red-001 oh come on, you are trolling right>
10:42 red-001 8?
10:42 red-001 *?
10:43 Zeno` I'm not. That is what nickserv sent me upon logging in
10:43 red-001 huh
10:43 red-001 maybe I did and I forgot
10:43 kilbith sure, you forgot now
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10:47 Zeno` please don't try and login as me :/
10:47 Zeno` I dunno how you'd "accidentally" do it
10:47 red-001 wait so this really happened??!
10:48 red-001 wtf
10:48 red-001 how the hell do I not remeber....
10:48 red-001 this is 2 days ago...
10:49 red-001 brb reviewing my logs
10:50 Zeno` red-001, it's ok
10:51 Zeno` red-001, after discussion you may have tried to login (accidentally) with one of my linked nicks
10:51 Zeno` one of them is kinda desirable so I can see how it may have been an accident
10:52 Zeno` maybe you tried \o` or something as a nick... who knows
10:52 red-001 I think I tried \o/ a while back
10:54 red-001 Jun 03 20:10:28 *You are now known as |o|
10:55 Zeno` yeah, it's probably owned by me (in a way) which may have caused the nickserv message. We'll forget it
10:56 red-001 yeah ns confirms it's your nick
10:56 Zeno` ok, mystery solved
10:57 DS-minetest i don't want to annoy you but i think it would better to continue this conversation in #-hub
10:58 kilbith you annoy us, insect
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10:59 Zeno` huh? The conversation is over.
11:00 DS-minetest yep, i took too long to write >_<
11:02 Zeno` I have some moral/ethical objections to some things in place on -hub but the best place to discuss them is in -hub
11:03 Zeno` so I'm stuck in an infinite loop
11:03 Zeno` (well infinite recursion really)
11:04 Raven262 http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/ima​ges/newsfeed/001/246/322/9b2.gif
11:04 Raven262 That?
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11:17 nerzhul Thomas-S, why do you use a reference to a hybridPtr, it's crazy
11:17 nerzhul oh an now we use C++11, #ifdef MYHEADER #define #endif can be removed for new files
11:18 nerzhul just use #pragma once after the license header
11:18 Thomas-S Actually, I only use it because Ekdohibs and celeron55 used it too in their meta-set nodedef versions. I mainly only rebased that part.
11:19 Thomas-S What do you suggest me to use instead of HybridPtr?
11:19 nerzhul what is the purpose of this hybrid ptr ?
11:20 Thomas-S Actually I don't really know why this is used. It seems to be the same as the old SharedPtr, but with an additional never_delete field.
11:21 nerzhul i don't understand really why the nodewithdef has a pointer to contentfeatures
11:21 nerzhul we have a repository to check that if needed
11:22 Thomas-S I think in the pointer to contentfeatures the meta-set properties are stored. Maybe nore knows more?
11:23 nerzhul contentfeatures is a structure defining node static properties, meta should be in another structure
11:24 nerzhul interesting CSM mods, who_plus is nice :)
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13:39 Thomas-S nerzhul: nore explained the purpose of HybridPtr:
13:39 Thomas-S <nore> Okay so IIRC the idea is that when the ContentFeatures are in the nodedef, you want to free them
13:39 Thomas-S However, when they are global, you absolutely do not want that
13:41 nerzhul i see the concept but not hybridptr itself
13:43 Thomas-S So, you wanna know where HybridPtr is used? For this, please take a look at part 3: #5903
13:43 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5903 -- [WIP] Meta-set nodedef: Part 3 by Thomas--S
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14:12 Thomas-S So, nerzhul, is HybridPtr okay for you under these circumstances?
14:13 nerzhul i didn't get time to review it
14:13 nerzhul i'm working on continuous daily builds for Windows ATM
14:14 Thomas-S Ok. Could you please notify me when you have reviewed it then?
14:15 nerzhul i don't know when because it's a huge PR and i'm working on another parts, but i try to look at this, the main problem i want to solve is the hybrid ptr usage, if we can use STL or not
14:16 Thomas-S Ok. Thanks! I'll try to fix some problems in part 3 then (and maybe start with part 4)
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15:11 glut32 joined #minetest-dev
15:12 glut32 hi all
15:12 cx384 hi glut32
15:14 glut32 i would like to compile the latest minetest with mingw32 but I have compiling errors about new c++11 stuffs like "std::thread"... I add -std=c++11 on CMAKE_CXX_FLAGS but I have always the same errors
15:14 glut32 I added
15:16 glut32 I have gcc 5.3 (released in 2015)
15:17 DS-minetest is it difficult to decide what will happen to #5604? :P
15:17 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5604 -- lua_api: Correct craft recipe param `type` to `method` by DS-Minetest
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15:39 kilbith there's a lot of lag with sfinv when switching tab
15:40 kilbith up to 1s or more
15:41 kilbith my creative inventory got a cancer
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15:57 glut32 I would like to know who has compiled the mingw32 version of minetest?
15:57 glut32 (of minetest 4.16)
15:58 Fixer i did mingw64 one under linux vm and msys2
15:58 Fixer glut32: check your compilers if they are up to date, buildbot.sh script should be newest, libraries too
15:59 glut32 ok
16:01 red-NaN oh and disable leveldb
16:01 red-NaN it breaks
16:02 red-NaN you need to copy a few extra dll's too
16:02 Fixer red-NaN: if you have newest libleveldb from kitsunemimi, you don't need to
16:02 Fixer compiles just fine
16:02 red-NaN is that diffrent from the one used by the buildbot?
16:03 red-NaN well I don't really need it
16:03 kilbith he does not enable leveldb
16:03 kilbith (hint: he's my job mate)
16:04 red-NaN and the he is the buildbot?
16:04 kilbith what?
16:04 red-NaN I'm really confused right now tbg
16:04 red-NaN tbh*
16:05 kilbith I was talking about glut32
16:05 red-NaN oh that makes sense
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16:27 glut32 This the output errors : https://pastebin.com/LKGVuyvD I relanch a CMake from zero (from an empty folder) and I added CMAKE_CXX_FLAGS=-std=c++11
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16:27 glut32 this is
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16:46 nerzhul Krock, can you review #5917 permitting to merge ?
16:46 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5917 -- CSM: Fix documentation error for register_on_*_chat_messages by DS-Minetest
16:46 nerzhul hi Krock :)
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16:53 Krock yes but first I'll try to find a nice Git client for Linux and after that - cloning
16:54 nerzhul git
16:54 nerzhul git clone git@github.com:minetest/minetest.git
16:54 nerzhul :)
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18:07 Wuzzy What does dtime_jitter in the debug screen mean? I have 29% atm. is this good or bad?
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18:17 Krock jitter is generally bad. No idea why it is measured in percent
18:18 Krock perhaps the peak over/undershoot of the average dtime?
18:19 DS-minetest Thomas-S: how does is_ground_content make sense in the list of #5919 ? i mean meta can only be set after generating, right? or is that only for consistence? or for mods? ¿
18:19 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5919 -- [WIP] Meta-set nodedef: Part 4 by Thomas--S
18:20 Thomas-S Actually, I asked the same question to myself when I wrote down the list. I decided to write it down for now (for consistency, as I listed everything from `read_content_features`). But I think this will never be really implemented.
18:22 DS-minetest ok
18:24 Wuzzy Krock: fun fact: This number can get >100%
18:24 Wuzzy i have no idea what that's supposed to mean
18:48 red-NaN csm_player_q
18:48 red-NaN ??
18:48 red-NaN #5921
18:48 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5921 -- Remove old network code by red-001
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18:58 kilbith https://lut.im/aQt5ubrNKY/cvt551m8aYS7byx5.png
18:58 kilbith subtle bloom
19:00 kilbith https://lut.im/6qrW5JOh5f/hXksGZY6QM5xzKxY.png
19:00 kilbith you can see better on the clouds
19:07 celeron55 Wuzzy: it's % of dtime or something like that
19:08 Wuzzy thats a pretty vague description ;)
19:08 celeron55 i often say something like 50% is acceptable
19:08 Wuzzy so 50% dtime_jitter means … what?
19:08 celeron55 it means something has caused a frame to be 50% longer than the average frame length
19:09 Wuzzy ah. so MT averages the dtimes out over the past and the jitter is just how “far away” it is now
19:09 celeron55 no
19:09 Wuzzy hm
19:10 Wuzzy Do I want a low jitter?
19:10 celeron55 jitter means what the highest peak is compared to average
19:10 kilbith https://github.com/minetest/minetest
19:10 kilbith wth
19:10 celeron55 if one frame is 40ms and others are 20ms, the number should show 100%
19:10 Wuzzy okay
19:11 celeron55 i don't think the average is any particular time, it's just an avg = avg * 0.99 + current * 0.01 type thing, i.e. just a lowpassed value (probably a few seconds or something)
19:12 Wuzzy celeron55: the "highest peak"... i guess you mean a peak value over the last few second?
19:12 celeron55 hmm... i think the collected peak value is just decremented each frame
19:13 celeron55 it's just a quick way to see how choppy the framerate is
19:13 Wuzzy so roughly spoken: high jitter = framerate bounces up and down like crazy
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19:14 celeron55 not really; more like high jitter = frametime has high peaks
19:14 paramat github status "We are currently experiencing major service outages."
19:14 celeron55 high peaks in frametime are the most annoying thing you can get
19:14 celeron55 that's why it's trying to show them
19:15 Wuzzy ahhh. o 50% jitter means the peak drawtime in last few second was 50% higher than average (or fake average?) drawtime
19:15 celeron55 yes
19:15 Wuzzy okay, i see now why this is useful
19:15 celeron55 i like this fake peak and fake average terminology
19:15 celeron55 :D
19:15 Wuzzy i was almost saying that this value is useless
19:19 celeron55 and actually not drawtime but frametime or dtime (same thing); it's fine if drawtime has jitter as long as it's masked by sleep or other processing than drawing
19:19 celeron55 altough usually the minetest client's bottleneck is drawing so usually there's no practical difference
19:20 celeron55 but you can get frametime jitter from deserialization of large amounts of data in packet processing or whatnot
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19:21 Wuzzy celeron55: can you please take a quick look on <http://wiki.minetest.net/Debug> and tell me if this is correct?
19:22 celeron55 dtime isn't a shorthand for drawtime
19:23 celeron55 as far as i can remember
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19:23 celeron55 the name "dtime" comes from delta time, i.e. time from last frame
19:23 celeron55 which includes other things than drawing
19:24 celeron55 i wonder if drawtime in the debug view is actually drawtime...
19:24 Wuzzy o_O
19:24 Wuzzy lol
19:25 celeron55 i need to check
19:25 celeron55 looks like it's a lowpass filtered drawtime that doesn't include other things in a frame
19:26 celeron55 this is just totally random
19:26 celeron55 well that's what it is, better document it 8)
19:27 celeron55 i did choose them at some point, probably that particular value was the most useful value for some purpose
19:28 celeron55 if it wasn't lowpass filtered, it would probably jump around so much you couldn't read it so there's that
19:28 Wuzzy do you mean drawtime or dtime_jtter?
19:28 Wuzzy i mean with the filtering?
19:28 celeron55 drawtime
19:28 Wuzzy ah
19:29 celeron55 drawtime: an average time it's taking to render each frame, not including other processing than rendering
19:30 celeron55 dtime_jitter: jitter in the time difference between frames, including all processing
19:32 Wuzzy ok thanks
19:32 celeron55 drawtime is kind of useless i think
19:33 celeron55 could be just removed
19:35 Wuzzy because we already have FPS displayed?
19:35 Wuzzy yeah, makes sense
19:36 Wuzzy Relevant: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5920
19:36 celeron55 well it's not even related to FPS, because FPS is measuring the time difference between frames
19:36 celeron55 not the time it takes to render them
19:36 Fixer celeron55: i did tests yesterday and can confirm stuttering was seriously reduced, stand deviation 3.5 against 5-6 before, I can play without that mesh gen delay now, reduced it to just 5 ms for ideal, there is still some stuttering, including rare large ones of unknown origin (up to 100ms)
19:36 celeron55 nobody cares about the drawtime because the client can't run without doing other things in addition to drawing
19:38 celeron55 Wuzzy: i think your description of what jitter means was useful
19:52 VanessaE celeron55: fake peak, fake average?  fake news! :P
19:53 VanessaE (or would those be "alternative facts"? ;) )
19:53 celeron55 alternative average
19:53 VanessaE haha
19:55 Fixer safe space average
19:55 red-NaN you may laugh now, but soon even averages wouldn't be safe
19:56 Fixer i would like to see also median and stand deviation for frame times
19:56 Fixer on other hand median needs all data :/
19:56 Fixer bad idea
19:59 VanessaE Fixer: have you tried evaluating stutter/jitter/etc by using VE-Survival yet?
19:59 Fixer VanessaE: yes, it felt better
19:59 VanessaE ok.
20:00 Fixer number i got were from automated fly over tests
20:00 Fixer singleplayer is playable more or less, still stutter here and there but much less than before (before it was disaster)
20:03 Fixer while subjectively I had impression that msys2/mingw build was much smoother, numbers did not support me, both build got same distribution of frame more or less, msys2 got slightly higher fps by little
20:03 Fixer one annoying stutter is loading lots of signs
20:03 paramat VanessaE shivajiva as server admin i would be interested to see your comments in #5915
20:03 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5915 -- CSM: Allowing a server to protect itself against clients running client-provided clientmods
20:04 VanessaE Fixer: ...which boils down to either loading entities being slow to load in general, or time spent executing all the compositing operations that go into making the sign text.
20:04 VanessaE paramat: in a word?  absofuckinglutely.
20:04 VanessaE 'nuff said?
20:05 paramat ok thanks please comment
20:05 VanessaE done.
20:05 Fixer VanessaE: that huge freeze of signs loading was confirmed with other server and mod: display_modpack or smth like that (with neat and fancy signs), same large freezes when loading those
20:06 VanessaE Fixer: but is it because of the *entities* or is it because of the compositing operations used for the text?
20:06 Fixer no idea
20:06 Fixer i hope someone will be interested enough into looking at it
20:09 paramat #5908 is ready for review
20:09 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5908 -- (Re)spawn players within mapgen edges by paramat
20:09 VanessaE paramat: maybe MT needs to use punkbuster ;)
20:10 VanessaE hm, GH is starting to lag again.
20:10 VanessaE probably some little baby DDoSing it
20:16 nerzhul sfan5, when you get some time can you check/approve #5923 please ?
20:16 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5923 -- Implement GItlab CI daily builds for windows platform (32 & 64) by nerzhul
20:16 sfan5 sure
20:18 nerzhul we have #5921 (trivial) which requires a second approval too
20:18 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5921 -- Remove old network code by red-001
20:19 red-NaN #5924
20:19 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5924 -- Have the server send the player list to the client by red-001
20:19 red-NaN a less trival PR
20:19 nerzhul red-NaN, i prever UpdatePlayerList
20:19 nerzhul prefer*
20:20 Fixer nerzhul: no gettext support?
20:20 red-NaN alright I will change that then
20:21 Fixer nerzhul: dled 64bit artifact or how it is called, it runs, but there are no translations to other languages
20:21 Fixer nerzhul: says use_gettext=0
20:21 nerzhul Fixer, i don't know how does that work, i just ran buildbot
20:21 nerzhul maybe sfan5 can help me to know if something is missing to compilation to improve the build
20:22 nerzhul now i have the right process to generate artifacts (and you confirm it works :p) we can modulate
20:24 sfan5 pretty sure you're doing the exact same thing i do for my windows builds
20:25 nerzhul sfan5, then you don't use gettext ? i don't think there is a detection ?
20:25 Fixer lol
20:25 sfan5 the buildbot will automatically use gettext
20:25 nerzhul okay maybe it's because i don't installed gettext
20:25 Fixer nerzhul: maybe it needs to rerun cmake
20:26 nerzhul i will re-verify
20:26 sfan5 dunno what happens if windres isn't installed
20:26 Fixer nerzhul: funny how you solved that 3 dll problem, i will use the same method :D
20:26 sfan5 uh i mean msgfmt
20:26 sfan5 nerzhul: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob​/master/util/buildbot/buildwin32.sh#L133
20:26 nerzhul Fixer, i don't see better automated method heh
20:27 nerzhul okay i add gettext to ensure it fix it
20:27 nerzhul because we have explicit ENABLE_GETTEXT=1
20:27 Fixer 32 bit version also works fine, but has no gettext
20:27 sfan5 nerzhul: #5922 is pretty pointless as it will use c++11 mutextes if available
20:27 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5922 -- Use C++11 mutexes by nerzhul
20:28 nerzhul sfan5, it just drop the compat mode here
20:28 sfan5 well then the pr description is misleading
20:28 nerzhul yeah
20:28 nerzhul seems windows build doesn't like it
20:28 sfan5 you should also be able to drop the other threading compat code
20:28 nerzhul sfan5, i will do it in anotehr pr
20:28 nerzhul i split my PR
20:28 nerzhul #5906 is mergeable
20:28 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5906 -- C++11 patchset 3: remove Atomic/GenericAtomic and use std::atomic by nerzhul
20:30 nerzhul for windows pipeline: "-- Could NOT find GetText (missing:  GETTEXT_MSGFMT) "
20:30 nerzhul it's exactly the problem, msgfmt is in which package, hmmm
20:30 Fixer nerzhul: _build\_CPack_Packages\win64\ZIP\ has exactly same files before compression, you don't need to decompress that zip, just copy dlls to there and make new ZIP overwriting old one
20:30 Fixer nerzhul: imo
20:31 nerzhul Fixer, i just did it to remove the double zip
20:31 nerzhul (gitlab zip & buildbot zip)
20:33 nerzhul sfan5, i prefered to do a PR for each C++11 component to use to reduce the diff size to review, else it will be very very huge and less clear to read
20:36 nerzhul Fixer, https://gitlab.com/nerzhul​/minetest/builds/17939579
20:36 nerzhul gettext is now enabled :)
20:37 nerzhul wait for packaging step to finish and can re-test it
20:37 nerzhul sfan5, if you get time for #5906 could be nice heh, the description is better and build is already okay :p
20:37 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5906 -- C++11 patchset 3: remove Atomic/GenericAtomic and use std::atomic by nerzhul
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20:44 Fixer nerzhul: and someone should put a good visible link on minetest.net so people can DL
20:45 nerzhul when it will be available and accepted by everybody in our dev council yes :)
20:45 nerzhul s/everybody/majority/
20:46 nerzhul but gitlab-CI is a great meaning permitting to generate automaticly official builds, it's synced from github every day, that trigger a build pipeline which generate artifacts and we can have as many linux distro as we want, i did for debian/ubuntu but you can also build on fedora, arch if needed and generate packages
20:47 Fixer nerzhul: add appimage into it and that will be amazing
20:48 nerzhul appimage or a docker build can be done in some specific steps yes, but i don't know how to do it and i don't get time for this now, if somebody wants after we have this mode (if accepted) as official daily builds we can review/integrate it easily
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20:56 nerzhul Fixer, can you test https://gitlab.com/nerzhul/​minetest/pipelines/8786331 win32 & win64 packages to confirm translations are okay ?
20:56 Fixer nerzhul: sure
20:57 Fixer googled the way on how to add those libs into existing zip :}
20:57 red-NaN nerzhul, run_in_place?
20:57 nerzhul Fixer, oh in existing zip, jut call zip <zipfile> <pathstoadd>
20:58 Wuzzy I saw 0.4.16 brought texturable progress bar. But how do I change it for my subgame?
20:58 nerzhul red-NaN, seems not enabled by buildbot
20:58 nerzhul Wuzzy, you cannot
20:58 Wuzzy whyyyy
20:58 nerzhul progress bar is in texture packs
20:58 Wuzzy :-(
20:58 nerzhul just be logical
20:59 nerzhul when you connect to a server progress bar is shown and you don't know and didn't loaded any media
20:59 Wuzzy okay, make sense. XD
21:00 Wuzzy but what about singleplayer?
21:00 DS-minetest but the logo of the subgame is already loaden
21:00 Wuzzy exactly
21:00 nerzhul Wuzzy, all games are using the same way
21:00 nerzhul all modes
21:00 nerzhul singleplayer is just a name and a config on server but you load a local server and conenct to it
21:01 Fixer Using Irrlicht 1.8.4
21:01 Fixer Build info: VER=0.4.16-dfd79c0-dfd79c0-dirty BUILD_TYPE=Release RUN_IN_PLACE=1 USE_GETTEXT=1 USE_SOUND=1 USE_CURL=1 USE_FREETYPE=1 USE_LUAJIT=1 STATIC_SHAREDIR="."
21:01 nerzhul the logo is shown to main menu but game loader doesn't know anything about game, currently it just connect to any random server, local or not
21:01 red-NaN would it be possible to make it also build non RUN_IN_PLAVE builds for windows?
21:01 nerzhul Fixer, oh it seems implicit
21:01 Wuzzy in other words, loading screen is very hardcoded atm?
21:01 nerzhul red-NaN, what is the use case ?
21:01 Wuzzy anyway, no big deal
21:01 Wuzzy the default loading bar is fine.
21:01 nerzhul Wuzzy, yes, it cannot predict what he didn't load :p
21:01 Wuzzy i wish the rest of the GUI would match this style as well :)
21:01 red-NaN I'm currectly using non-run-in-place builds for itch.io builds
21:02 Wuzzy currently it just looks plain random
21:02 Fixer nerzhul: can confirm, both are working, have translations working
21:02 Fixer minetest_game is present
21:02 Fixer game runs
21:02 nerzhul Fixer, nice, it works as intended then
21:02 Fixer thumbs up
21:03 Wuzzy yes, i have German runnng here. runs perfectly
21:03 nerzhul red-NaN, i see the use case, maybe waiting for this PR to be merged and we can branch a specific pipeline for itch.io
21:03 nerzhul then sfan5 please help us to merge that and win some daily time to not build by hand :D
21:04 nerzhul itch.io uses win32 or 64 ? or multiple OS ?
21:05 red-NaN multiple OS's and archs
21:06 red-NaN currectly I have 64bit linux appimages and 64 and 32 bit windows builds
21:06 red-NaN currently*
21:07 nerzhul okay
21:08 nerzhul do you think we can create a Linux appimage easily in the Gitlab CI ?
21:08 nerzhul i don't know if it's easy or not
21:08 red-NaN not sure I'm using Calinou's builds
21:08 nerzhul okay, and on which Linux OS is this based ? Ubuntu ?
21:09 Calinou nerzhul: Ubuntu 14.04 preferably, Ubuntu 16.04 if you are lazy
21:09 Calinou you should build on an old distro
21:09 nerzhul maybe pipeline can use artifacts from Zesty and appimage consume it too to create it, in parallel of deb package
21:09 Calinou build script is smething like that: https://gist.github.com/Calinou/​a326b153ab4f21853e8741f11b0aa9db
21:09 nerzhul Calinou, why ? if you embed stdc++ lib you don't care no ?
21:09 Calinou if you use a recent distro, it won't work on old distros; please don't
21:09 Calinou no, you can't embed glibc in AppImage
21:09 Calinou that would make it much larger, too
21:09 Calinou join #appimage for details
21:09 nerzhul then AppImage is just.. :(
21:09 Calinou (or I can invite probono there)
21:10 nerzhul it's the major portability problem in C++ the libc++
21:10 Calinou well, musl did not overtake the world yet :)
21:10 nerzhul GNU stdlib has poor quality compared to BSD stdlib
21:11 nerzhul if appimage is just a script like this, it's easy to embed to our util/ directory and then call it in CI
21:11 nerzhul we can use trusty artifacts then and have 2 pipeline branch, one for deb one for appimage
21:11 Calinou yeah, you can also use yml-based scripts
21:11 Calinou and derive your AppImage from a .deb
21:11 Calinou perhaps use the xenial .deb...
21:12 nerzhul hey but you copy some system libs, don't you try stdc++ ? :p
21:12 Calinou here is the list of libraries AppImage will exclude by default: https://github.com/AppImage/App​Images/blob/master/excludelist
21:12 nerzhul ouch the wget for appimage helper
21:12 Calinou yeah, it requires a working connection
21:12 nerzhul i can't remember appimage is redhat or canonical ?
21:12 Calinou you could compile it from source, but that's not exactly easy
21:12 Calinou none
21:12 Calinou it's an independent project
21:13 Calinou Flatpak would be Red Hat(-ish), Snap would be Canonical
21:13 nerzhul oh yeah :)
21:14 Fixer my way of dealing with pesky dlls https://pastebin.com/raw/8eJ3yhyB
21:15 nerzhul Fixer, yeah, i just extract for removing zip into zip :p
21:15 nerzhul proper user experience :p
21:21 Fixer Feels Good Man
21:22 nerzhul less and less coredevs present on this channel these days, 0.4.16 has tired many devs :p
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21:23 Calinou it's impressive how AppImage is an one-man project existing since ~2004 (in other forms), yet has so much success, many commercial ISVs like JetBrains use it already
21:23 Calinou I really admire it, fixing a big issue in the Linux world
21:23 Calinou (but it does get a *lot* of opposition)
21:23 nerzhul it's good for portable crap :p
21:23 Calinou Debian might package appimagetool in their repositories, which will be extremely ironic to see if that happens
21:23 nerzhul package manager vs windows outdated dlls
21:24 nerzhul chocolatey on windows is nice (but slow as a hell)
21:24 MoNTE48_1 joined #minetest-dev
21:25 Fixer Calinou: +1
21:31 Calinou Chocolatey is meh, I've found
21:32 nerzhul if that continue we will have mor than 170 PR tomorrow :(
21:32 nerzhul ShadowBot, sfan5 nore help :p
21:33 paramat joined #minetest-dev
21:36 Fixer It is all in your head (c)
22:05 Fixer joined #minetest-dev
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22:30 Player_2 joined #minetest-dev
22:37 VanessaE interesting point of note:  1000m view range on VE-S when way out on the west end of West St, looking east (so all of it is loaded).  not a wide swath of it, just the region around the road I ran down.  still, managed 16 fps just then
22:38 VanessaE celeron55: any chance of revisiting farmap?  might be nice to see the "sides" of that range filled in :)
22:39 VanessaE http://i.imgur.com/AZzGxR7.png
22:40 VanessaE (and as you can see, that's with HDX-256, no less)
23:08 paramat wow
23:11 paramat #5926
23:11 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5926 -- Autorun: Change to 'automove' to be suitable and consistent by paramat
23:11 VanessaE paramat: you like? :)
23:11 VanessaE that image is what happens when the GPU gets to do its job unimpeded ;)
23:14 Fixer VanessaE: m?
23:14 VanessaE Fixer: 1000m
23:14 Fixer VanessaE: it is just small patch of land
23:16 VanessaE narrow, yes
23:16 VanessaE small?  no
23:16 VanessaE that's a full 1000m into the distance
23:16 VanessaE (actually it goes a bit past 1200 but I like a nice round number)
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23:58 paramat nice road

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