IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2017-05-29

Time	Nick	Message
00:00	VanessaE	which would effectively be the same thin g.
00:00	VanessaE	thing*
00:00	VanessaE	the server already writes changes to the map live anyway
00:00	VanessaE	every 3 seconds I think it is, by default
00:00	bigfoot547	well, like, autosave every number of minutes, to an hour.
00:00	VanessaE	right. can't be done
00:01	bigfoot547	Why not???????
00:01	VanessaE	the end result would be the same: a "backup" map file that's less than an hour old.
00:01	VanessaE	and again, the server would have to hang for a few minutes at a time each time it does thgat
00:02	VanessaE	that*
00:02	VanessaE	which will piss off users
00:02	bigfoot547	yeeesss, and the problem? You could disable auto saving, and save asynchronously which might lag the server but not hang it. Right?
00:02	VanessaE	the whole point of a backup is that it's something you copied when the server was offline, so that you have a safe thing to restore from if the live map takes a shit later
00:07	bigfoot547	Ok, maybe it was a bad idea...
00:08	VanessaE	not a bad idea, per se
00:09	VanessaE	you're just approaching it wrongly
00:10	VanessaE	it's no big deal to shut the server down for 5 minutes a day to take backups. then, after the server instance is back up, those same backups can be used to generate overview maps, and can be shuffled off to FTP storage, or downloaded by some partner admin to his or her machine.
00:10	bigfoot547	Hmmm. So do you think people would use it?
00:11	VanessaE	sure they would.
00:11	VanessaE	every good server admin has a backup process in place, or has plans to put one in place.
00:11	VanessaE	if something were supplied with Minetest that can mostly automate the task, it would be good.
00:12	bigfoot547	Yeah, I would use it, but again 100kb saves take maybe a second to save.
00:12	VanessaE	(so your idea probably won't "take" for many existing admins, but there are always more servers to be brought online)
00:12	VanessaE	these wouldn't be 100k saves.
00:13	bigfoot547	lol yeah
00:13	VanessaE	an hour's worth of changes to a map on a busy server with lots of active builders might be a 100+ MB
00:14	VanessaE	and bear in mind, that's data you would have to store in RAM between auto-saves
00:14	bigfoot547	Storytime: I wish I had backed up my server before I added the atnt mod. It adds bunkers that spawn via abm. Well my world got overrun. Not knowing this, I ignited the tnt in one. Map dead.
00:14	VanessaE	(on top of what the server already keeps loaded for normal operations)
00:15	VanessaE	ouch.
00:15	bigfoot547	Yes. That is when I found out Ctrl + \ sends SIGQUIT.
00:16	bigfoot547	I have this history of breaking servers w/ my sister after a month. Maybe 50 radius tnt, maybe messing with the technic mod, a lot of stuff.
00:16	bigfoot547	Anyways...
00:17	bigfoot547	I would certainly use an autosave feature. Thinking about it's complexity though, maybe I couldn't program it up. :/
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05:37	nerzhul	4 pr to merge and 4 issues to fix before release (or more if needed), nice job guys, we should fix all of them
05:52	VanessaE	looks at date
05:52	VanessaE	well, there's still 6 days...
05:54	nerzhul	5 or 6 days yes :)
05:55	nerzhul	two issues have pr linked
06:10	VanessaE	good luck
06:10	VanessaE	bbl
06:11	nerzhul	oh i have othre problems than MT today :
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09:08	nerzhul	hi Zeno`
09:08	Zeno`	hi
09:10	Zeno`	Removed ban on Grandolf
09:10	Zeno`	Will see what happens
09:14	red-002	what about #minetest?
09:14	red-002	they are still banned there
09:28	Zeno`	I am not an op there
09:29	Zeno`	and he's not banned there anyway
09:30	Zeno`	I have to say that I'm impressed with ShadowNinja's analysis of the unit test problem regarding the random numbers
09:30	Zeno`	nice work, ShadowNinja
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13:08	kilbith	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/content_nodemeta.cpp#L63-L126
13:08	kilbith	why it's still there
13:11	red-003	when was the code changed on the server?
13:11	nerzhul	wow seems very old, in 0.3 ages
13:11	nerzhul	content_nodemeta_deserialize_legacy_body
13:12	nerzhul	content_nodemeta_deserialize_legacy_meta
13:12	red-003	kill it with fire then
13:12	nerzhul	content_nodemeta_deserialize_legacy
13:12	nerzhul	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/071e114ffa945522a7a9acc3259427166992d5ee/src/mapblock.cpp#L705
13:12	nerzhul	called
13:12	red-003	well that might have to wait till after release
13:12	nerzhul	yes, i suggest to remove this very very old version on 0.5
13:13	red-003	since you know feature freeze
13:13	red-003	and the old code isn't harming anyone
13:15	nerzhul	no and it's a feature removal here, not a bugfix
13:17	red-003	but from what I can see the version of minetest that sent this is no longer supported?
13:18	nerzhul	i don't know, but we can wait for release
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16:11	kilbith_	I don't understand, the server needs to enable client-side modding to allow users to use their client-side mods?
16:13	kilbith_	no fucking idea how to use that
16:14	VanessaE	well, it's possible to develop a client-side mod that doesn't behave well when used while connecting to a server.
16:15	kilbith_	I've tried that oredetect mod on a server and it doesn't work
16:16	VanessaE	(what that would consist of, I don't know, but I think it's good practice for a server to be able to tell the client not to allow CSM for the duration)
16:16	kilbith_	I'll wait the confirmation from nerzhul
16:17	red-002	<kilbith_> I don't understand, the server needs to enable client-side modding to allow users to use their client-side mods?
16:17	red-002	???
16:17	red-002	that's what some people wanted to add
16:17	red-002	not something that has been added
16:17	kilbith_	do I need to enable something in order to use a client-side mod?
16:18	red-002	you need to enable client-sided modding and then enable the mod in question
16:18	red-002	/clientmods/mods.conf
16:18	kilbith_	aah, ok
16:18	kilbith_	thanks
16:19	kilbith_	I don't remember that thing was documented
16:19	red-002	yeah I forgot to document it
16:19	red-002	will make a PR later on today or tomorrow to fix that if someone else doesn't do it before me
16:22	kilbith_	well, this still doesn't work
16:22	kilbith_	load_mod_hack = true
16:22	kilbith_	enable_client_modding = true
16:22	kilbith_	I'm trying oredetect
16:26	kilbith_	no fucking idea
16:27	red-002	I assume you placed oredetect in <minetest_dir>/clientmods/hack ?
16:28	kilbith_	no I just moved the code from oredetect to a `hack` mod for testing purposes
16:29	red-002	could you try and set load_mod_preview to true and see if there is a bunch of new spam in the chat log when you do something?
16:29	kilbith_	alright
16:30	kilbith_	ok, `preview` doesn't work as well
16:31	kilbith_	wait, I actually see the spam in the console but I can't use any of the register commands
16:31	kilbith_	*registered
16:31	kilbith_	like `/dump`
16:31	red-002	what does .help output?
16:31	kilbith_	oh, it starts with .
16:31	red-002	kilbith_, the prefix was changed from / to . for csm commands
16:32	kilbith_	that was documented?
16:32	red-002	had a bunch of issues with commands clashing with server-sided commands
16:32	red-002	I think so?
16:32	kilbith_	ok that works
16:34	red-002	ah I see neither of the api docs mention the chatcommand prefix
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17:06	Krock	!tell nerzhul This here seems about to work. Instead of chopping the object pos, "upscale" blockpos https://pastebin.com/raw/JJJus5Bh
17:06	ShadowBot	Krock: O.K.
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20:40	bigfoot547	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/91a9382/src/environment.h#L65-L67 could be a u16 right?
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20:54	nerzhul	merging #5767 in ~10 mins
20:54	ShadowBot	https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/5767 -- Don't add damage flash while punch texture modifier is active by stujones11
20:55	bigfoot547	Yay!
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22:04	red-002	https://pastebin.com/zZm4xXhW
22:05	sfan5	can you not bring useless drama here, thanks
22:05	nerzhul	wrong chan i think, it's not dev
22:06	red-002	it's just that zeno unbanned him ealier saying lets see what will happen
22:06	bigfoot547	Hee seems like a colorful personality.
22:06	bigfoot547	He*
22:08	sfan5	can you not bring useless drama here, thanks
22:12	nerzhul	+1
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22:33	Fixer	is it possible to make mese post lamp rotetable?
22:33	Fixer	rotateable*
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