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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2016-11-16

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All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
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05:05 Zeno` Wayward_One, someone else was getting a 500 error for the public server list
05:29 Wayward_One Huh... Well, fwiw, i can access the server list just fine. Additionally, this issue has been going on since the 8th
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05:49 Zeno` no I mean somebody's server when registering to the PSL
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12:04 Zeno` what's blocking #4757?
12:04 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4757 -- Fix unexplained shader issue (glsl compiler bug??) by Rogier-5
12:05 Zeno` Rogier-5's change (using a constant) is the correct way
12:06 Zeno` and I disagree with paramat. Premature optimisation is the root of all evil
12:07 Zeno` Look, I'm the first person to push optimisations, I think you all know that
12:07 Zeno` but this is silly
12:07 Zeno` the bugfix is the more important of the two issues!
12:07 Zeno` by far
12:08 Zeno` there is no evidence that it even needs optimisation. I suggest it be merged
12:09 nore +1
12:13 Zeno` I'll merge in 15 minutes then if there are no objections
12:14 Zeno` every modern compiler will optimize that automagically anyway
12:15 Zeno` in this instance readability is the more important thing
12:16 Zeno` actually there is nothing to optimise. Because it's const float the compiler probably does it even with -O0
12:17 Zeno` and it certainly does it with -O1, O2 and O3
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12:43 sfan5 Zeno`: you can't make any assumptions about glsl compilers
12:43 sfan5 if they weren't this stupid we wouldn't have this issue in the first place
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12:44 sfan5 with glsl these changes can change "wtf i have 1fps" to "it run at 60 fps even on older devices"
12:45 Zeno` *sigh*
12:45 Zeno` I don't agree with optimising something when there is not evidence that there needs to be optimisation
12:46 Zeno` It's not considered good practice
12:47 sfan5 it isn't good practice for all other kinds of code
12:47 sfan5 but this does not necessarily apply to GLSL
12:47 Zeno` and yet, there is still no solid data that says that the current code is bad
12:48 Zeno` so until there is, then it should be merged
12:48 Zeno` and if evidence shows up that it's better to use magic values *then* they should be used
12:49 Zeno` this "oh it's gonna effect performance" is just conjecture
12:49 Zeno` and not a reason to :-1: something
12:50 Zeno` a few releases ago, how much time did I spend profiling stuff?
12:50 Zeno` maybe 100 hours
12:50 Zeno` maybe more
12:51 Zeno` I care about performance, a lot, but in this case there is nothing to care about
12:52 Zeno` sfan5, just to be clear... you're objecting to it being merged as-is?
12:52 Zeno` if so, then I won't merge. But I think it's silly
12:52 red-001 could someone review #4472 ?
12:52 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4472 -- Make serverlist searchable. by red-001
12:52 sfan5 dunno
12:53 sfan5 i'm just saying that doing what paramat suggested could be useful
12:53 Zeno` sfan5, "premature optimisation is the root of all evil"
12:53 Zeno` code can change and comments can be forgotten to be updated
12:54 sfan5 <sfan5> but this does not necessarily apply to GLSL
12:54 Zeno` but nobody has shown that it *does* apply
12:55 Zeno` and doing something just because it /might/ affect something is well within the definition of "premature optimisation"
12:56 Zeno` clear code wins every time unless there are solid reasons to do otherwise
12:56 Zeno` the const float is clear, readable, and maintainable
12:57 Zeno` And I'm kinda shocked we're debating this, heheh
12:57 Zeno` I won't merge because it seems there is still objection. But I think it should be
13:05 Zeno` <sfan5> Zeno`: you can't make any assumptions about glsl compilers
13:06 Zeno` and yet, you and paramat are making an assumption that it's slower?
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14:37 red-001 why is https://github.com/minetest/minete​st/blob/master/src/game.cpp#L1142 needed?
14:40 est31 red-001: its just some unification to have the same size for builtin formspecs
14:42 red-001 why does android not use diffrent settings?
14:42 red-001 why does android use diffrent settings?
14:43 est31 because android devices usually have smaller screens
14:44 sfan5 red-001: in that specific case, on pc it's no problem to fix the size of the menu to something
14:44 sfan5 but on android the screen sizes vary so much that it makes zero sense to set a fixed size
14:44 sfan5 also a fixed size would make the menu unusable on small screens
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15:18 Zeno` ok that'sit
15:18 Zeno` as much as I like the guy, paramat's latest comment goes way too far
15:18 Zeno` https://github.com/minetest/minetes​t/pull/4757#issuecomment-260945387
15:19 Zeno` that attack upon me is not only misrepresentation of what happened, it's WRONG
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15:19 Zeno` he should not modify his original messages
15:20 Zeno` because doing so seems to be a deliberate attempt to obfuscate things
15:20 Zeno` for the record it has TWO approvals
15:20 Zeno` my approval and nore's
15:22 Zeno` here is his comment, because he'll probably change it: "Zeno this is not trivial and has only one approval, you almost impulsively merged against the rules again :)"
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16:55 Zeno` merging #4757
16:55 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4757 -- Fix unexplained shader issue (glsl compiler bug??) by Rogier-5
17:04 Zeno` merging simple stuff like this should not be so difficult
17:26 Zeno` video of paramat: https://youtu.be/Q93SysOr8WU?t=1273
17:28 Zeno` with all due respect of course
17:28 Zeno` but it's funny!
17:39 Zeno` paramat approving a merge: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q93SysOr8WU
17:40 Zeno` ooops: https://youtu.be/Q93SysOr8WU?t=1946
17:44 est31 I want to merge #4780
17:44 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/4780 -- Introduce builtin_shared and use it to fix #4778 by est31
17:44 est31 I've improved the commit message like paramat requested
17:45 est31 will do the merge in 10 minutes if nobody objects
17:45 Zeno` I object!
17:45 est31 :/
17:45 Zeno` ok, I don't
17:45 est31 yeey
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17:46 Zeno` is it necessary?
17:47 Zeno` also, can builtin_shared be a constant?
17:47 est31 its a bugfix
17:47 est31 constant?
17:47 Zeno` yes, for performance
17:48 Zeno` lol, I'm sorry
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17:48 Zeno` the PR is fine :P
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18:06 kaeza you are comitting global genocide
18:07 kaeza good
18:07 Krock heh, git commit "genocide"
18:15 sofar zenocide
18:19 sfan5 Krock: you forgot the -m
18:20 est31 git commit -m "MY HANDS ARE TYPING WORDS"
18:20 est31 git commit -m "HAAAAAANDS"
18:25 Zeno` zenocide? roflol
18:25 Wayward_One xD
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18:30 Krock sfan5, sorry. I don't use the command line :3
18:30 sfan5 you should
18:31 Krock est31, xkcd knows how you should do it properly ;)
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18:38 Zeno` command line is evil
18:39 Zeno` 'tis black magic voodoo
18:41 Zeno` you can set the consoles
18:41 Zeno` you can set the console's background colour to something other than black, but it's still black magic
18:43 Zeno` I think I've gone insane
18:43 Zeno` every comment I make I imagine as a chess move and update the view of the board in my mind
18:44 Zeno` I'm not really sure if that's normal
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19:01 sofar sounds like sleep deprevation to me... I'd have nightmares as a child like that
19:01 * twoelk wonders who won Zeno´'s game of chess
19:01 sofar semi-lucid
19:03 SpawnBugs i've seen this "HAAAAAANDS" commit somewhere for real
19:05 twoelk I remember when playing early low pixel games with more jitter than fps my dreams where sort of - pixilated with low fps :-D
19:13 Krock SpawnBugs, it's a quite common nonsense commit message ^^
19:13 SpawnBugs Krock: i think I've seen it in some minetest mod
19:14 Krock I've used it once too. No idea in what project :3
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20:02 SpawnBugs Krock: could be you
20:03 kaeza would anybody find it useful to have a string.split_iter() or such function?
20:04 kaeza split() creates a table which is unneeded in 99% of cases
20:04 Krock really? I sometimes run through the array with the for-like loop
20:04 kaeza Krock, yes, that's the table I'm referring to
20:05 kaeza for i, part in ipairs(x:split(...) do ... end
20:05 Krock an iterrator is not really required IMO
20:05 kaeza vs: for part in x:split_iter(...) do ... end
20:05 Krock going to check out the logs tomorrow
20:07 kaeza it should be a trivial change in builtin
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20:15 sfan5 kaeza: sounds useful
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20:53 kaeza sfan5, http://codepad.org/gFUY08lF
20:53 kaeza also simplified it a bit in the process
20:53 sfan5 looks complicated
20:53 sfan5 post a pr if you want it reviewed also
20:55 kaeza it's just a simmplified form of the string.split currently in the codebase, modified to return an iterator function instead of a table
20:56 kaeza string.split now uses split_iter to build a table
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21:05 SpawnBugs found it! /media/sf_Exchange/minetest/mods/bitchange : 20fcf0a - SmallJoker, 2 years ago : HAAAANDS
21:09 SpawnBugs /media/sf_Exchange/minetest/mods/names_per_ip: 61fd749 - SmallJoker, 2 years, 3 months ago : More haaaaaands
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23:25 red-001 !seen troller
23:25 ShadowBot red-001: I haven't seen troller in #minetest-dev.
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23:28 proller__ ?

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