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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2016-01-14

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Time Nick Message
00:00 RealBadAngel nodes cant have animations, entities can
00:01 RealBadAngel sofar, have you checked my concrete posts mod?
00:02 sofar you showed me a video
00:03 thePalindrome Would animated nodes be feasible at all, or at least some way to fudge it with an entity?
00:04 RealBadAngel sofar, please do try it, its a part of technic
00:04 Soni animated nodes?
00:04 Soni as in textures?
00:04 thePalindrome As in a dynamic mesh
00:04 RealBadAngel one thing that differs that kind of fences it comes with platforms, merged into them
00:05 Soni oh
00:05 thePalindrome Thinking about it, it would be rather difficult to do properly
00:05 RealBadAngel so youre able to make monorail tracks for example
00:05 sofar have anode spawn an entity
00:06 Soni add node entities, they aren't full-blown entities but they're not simple nodes either
00:06 thePalindrome Figured, just was hoping I wouldn't have to manually futz with the colission/rendering boxes
00:06 sofar RealBadAngel: monorail tracks should be possible already with this
00:06 RealBadAngel hold on a sec
00:06 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/4Y1BJbe.png
00:11 RealBadAngel or http://i.imgur.com/oXWm6q5.png
00:13 RealBadAngel thePalindrome, theres a mod that adds animated chests for example
00:14 RealBadAngel or item pedestals, with animated, rotating item
00:14 Hijiri RealBadAngel: Can entities have animated meshes in 0.4.13? My lua api file says that only static meshes are implemented
00:14 Hijiri oh
00:14 Hijiri that is for tiles
00:14 RealBadAngel animation for textures != animation of skeletal body for meshes
00:15 Hijiri sorry, I don't know where I got "tiles"
00:15 Hijiri It doesn't say anything about tiles in the section I was looking at
00:15 Hijiri But it was talking about node meshes
00:15 RealBadAngel tiles are texture definitions
00:16 RealBadAngel regular node has 6 of them, up down NESW
00:16 Hijiri actually I see where I got tiles
00:16 Hijiri the section mentioned "tiles", but I just glossed over and I didn't read what it was talking about
00:16 Hijiri it is just the materials texture for the mesh
00:16 sofar RealBadAngel: yeah, I think the current code can already make pillars like that
00:16 RealBadAngel mesh, usually have one "tile" that holds all the texture parts in one file
00:16 Hijiri I know about tiles in general
00:17 RealBadAngel uv mapped in blender for example
00:17 Hijiri I just misread something
00:17 RealBadAngel sofar, point there is adding a platform
00:17 sofar the platform can just be fixed
00:17 RealBadAngel kinda similiar thingy to junction
00:18 sofar platform and pillar, 2 fixed nodes
00:18 sofar boxes
00:18 RealBadAngel if param2 is set add extra thing
00:18 RealBadAngel like mentioned platform
00:18 RealBadAngel ive made similiar thing with glasslike framed
00:18 sofar never thought of using param2
00:19 RealBadAngel param2 controls there volume level of interior volume
00:19 sofar not for NODEBOX_CONNECTED
00:20 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/zRbg6rD.png
00:22 RealBadAngel just an idea, param2 usage and triggering extra addition to regular set of nodeboxes can make this drawtype even more flexible
00:22 RealBadAngel that could control junctions, platforms or whatever
00:24 RealBadAngel in fact, engine logic dont have to determine usage of that extra box, just check param2 instead
00:24 RealBadAngel mods could set/reset it
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00:38 RealBadAngel sofar, but nvm, i guess such thing could be added later on
00:38 RealBadAngel better polish it as it is now
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01:34 RealBadAngel shit, ive kicked the power button lmao
01:35 RealBadAngel half an hour of work went into code's heaven ;)
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02:05 sofar damn, how do I get a handle to map in mapnode.cpp?
02:11 RealBadAngel you want to read the map while creating the mesh?
02:13 RealBadAngel meshes are created in separate thread, != main, you cant have direct access to the map
02:13 sofar I'm just moving some code around into a function
02:14 RealBadAngel thats why mapblock mesh code copies blocks to vmanip in the first place
02:14 sofar there's no threading issues in there
02:14 sofar this is just to get the v3s16's of all the nodeboxes
02:14 sofar getNodeboxes() needs to look at adjacent map nodes
02:14 RealBadAngel so you need just the handle?
02:15 sofar I used to have it right outside the function call
02:15 sofar yes, just need a handle to Map
02:15 RealBadAngel hold on
02:15 sofar can I get it from nodemgr?
02:15 sofar static std::vector<aabb3f> transformNodeBox
02:15 sofar in there
02:15 RealBadAngel Map & getMap() { return m_env->getMap(); }
02:15 RealBadAngel thats in server
02:16 sofar m_env, hmmmm
02:16 sofar dinner time, afk
02:19 RealBadAngel http://i.imgur.com/OndtvCp.png
02:20 RealBadAngel yikes! almost complete, itemimagebuttons are also showing meshes
02:22 sofar uh so, how do I get a handle to server? lol
02:23 sofar ugh I should just pass in Map
02:23 RealBadAngel 80 (item image buttons) + 32 main inventory + 9 crafting + a few more, over 120 meshes in total
02:23 RealBadAngel switching to next page is just a blink, no preload needed
02:24 RealBadAngel good old preload_item_visuals can R.I.P
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02:26 RealBadAngel sofar, youre doing that only on client side, right?
02:26 sofar yes
02:26 sofar that's all client stuff
02:26 RealBadAngel client does have m_env
02:26 sofar it has a map
02:26 RealBadAngel void Client::addUpdateMeshTask(v3s16 p, bool ack_to_server, bool urgent)
02:26 RealBadAngel {
02:26 RealBadAngel MapBlock *b = m_env.getMap().getBlockNoCreateNoEx(p);
02:26 sofar both in collision.cpp and content_mapblock.cpp from where I call getNodeboxes()
02:26 RealBadAngel so you should be able to access it directly
02:27 sofar I just hate passing in 25 things
02:31 sofar crud, argh, grrrr
02:32 sofar this type of review comments turn something simple into hocus pocus
02:35 RealBadAngel ;)
02:36 RealBadAngel having methods aviable somwhere is sometimes pain in the ass
02:36 sofar yeah I'm thinking I need to method this not in mapnode, but in map
02:36 sofar of course none of this compiles or works anymore
02:36 sofar it's a fucking mess
02:37 RealBadAngel at such stage is just shut up and pass what i need ;)
02:38 sofar I can't seem to accomplish just that
02:38 sofar fuck it I'm reverting the lot and seeing if it at least works again
02:40 sofar alright, at least that works again
02:40 * sofar & headache now
02:40 sofar break time
02:42 RealBadAngel takin a short break is usually fastest way to solve the problem
02:43 RealBadAngel you usually get calm down and look at the problem again, easily finding a solution
02:44 RealBadAngel for example, i do have several hundreds of registered nodes now
02:45 RealBadAngel and ONLY mese lamp is not showing properly (as mesh) in inventories
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02:53 RealBadAngel why the duck, meselamp is glasslike drawtype??
02:56 kaadmy isn't it a non-ransparent nodebox?
03:01 RealBadAngel http://pastie.org/10688395
03:01 RealBadAngel its a damn solid node
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03:10 Skyduskguy is there anyway to draw a collision box based on the obj file?
03:18 RealBadAngel collision boxes are defined same way as nodeboxes
03:18 RealBadAngel if you need a collision box for your custom mesh, you shall define it
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04:10 paramat will merge 3558 after checks complete
04:42 paramat travis build is misbehaving but compiles for me so now merging
04:47 paramat merged
05:03 paramat now merging 3508
05:12 paramat merged, now we have 7 mapgens
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07:31 sofar hmm, I shouldn't have to rebase just yet, but I want to test the new mapgen :)
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11:02 Taoki So any news as to when the 3D plants and spinning inventory items will be in? Quite eager to be seeing these :)
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15:28 RealBadAngel damn, its cloneMesh that introduces those nans and other weird values for vertices
15:29 RealBadAngel i afraid we will have to redo alll mesh manipulation routines
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15:36 kaeza a
15:36 kaeza oops
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16:36 Megaf todo, remove all shaders and meshes from my fork :P
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16:50 RealBadAngel Megaf, you wanna go back to c64 times or what?
16:51 est31 well idk, if we had extruded plantlike it would perhaps been used more often than meshes
16:52 est31 and we could disable meshes
16:52 RealBadAngel we cant "disable" meshes, its native irrlicht format to display anything
16:52 est31 you know what I mean
16:53 est31 meshnodes with a provided model
16:53 est31 nodebox is cool
16:53 est31 probably it can be made more discrete
16:53 RealBadAngel yeah? texture it
16:53 est31 eg 1/16th of a node
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16:53 RealBadAngel i made that for plants
16:54 RealBadAngel it was rejected
16:54 est31 not by me :)
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16:54 RealBadAngel propably core minetest will become dumb and cut from any gfx
16:55 RealBadAngel definitely i will publish all my code within separate fork
16:55 Fixer !tell paramat tried git with valleys, started underwater, seed is 1504251439609839835
16:55 ShadowBot Fixer: O.K.
16:55 RealBadAngel i wanna play modern game after all
16:56 RealBadAngel atm we do have 7 mapgens and no modern lighting ;)
16:56 RealBadAngel maybe with 20 onboard mt will be mature enough to merge some modern stuff ;)
16:57 RealBadAngel i can just bet that mojang and m$ and sitting and laughing at what we do
16:57 RealBadAngel taking steps back
16:58 RealBadAngel but i cant discuss with "the spirit" lol
16:58 est31 the thing with "modern lighting" is that it doesn't work well with minetest's design of only partially loading the map
16:58 Fixer RealBadAngel, please fix texture tear problem (at least)
16:58 est31 e.g. if you build a house and its dark inside and the roof isn't loaded, you don't want to have light inside
16:59 RealBadAngel Fixer, fix irrlicht and drivers
16:59 * Fixer facedesks
16:59 RealBadAngel we are still allowing to use custom and faulty irr
17:00 RealBadAngel nrzkt merged 1.9 into codebase
17:00 RealBadAngel there are no such issues
17:00 est31 bc it has no users :)
17:00 RealBadAngel dont you get it? keeping to many years old soft will be causing such issues
17:01 RealBadAngel like 15 years old shaders specification
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17:01 nrzkt RealBadAngel, i didn't merged all 1.9, only commits from 1.8.4 to feb 2014
17:01 RealBadAngel well, pretty close to that
17:01 nrzkt there is a bug with current irrlicht master crashing client with some MT textures
17:03 RealBadAngel original mt can stay compatible with intels and 15 yrs old machines
17:03 RealBadAngel but i wont be developing code for that at all
17:04 RealBadAngel that has gone too far
17:04 RealBadAngel endless compability is causing way more harm than good
17:04 RealBadAngel if something is good for everthing, probably its worth shit
17:05 RealBadAngel and wont work as fast as designed to use the specified standards and enviroment
17:06 est31 RealBadAngel, feel free to go into a corner and write a fast and modern renderer for minetest, without irrlicht, using the shader lang version you like most
17:06 est31 perhaps you'll find users who like it
17:06 RealBadAngel est31, youre wrong to the bone
17:06 RealBadAngel get a copy of BuildAWorld
17:06 hmmmm lol BAW
17:06 RealBadAngel and see what irrlicht is capable for
17:06 hmmmm BAW is all eye candy and no substance
17:07 RealBadAngel im not talking bout content
17:07 est31 RealBadAngel, then implement it in irrlicht
17:07 RealBadAngel wut?
17:07 RealBadAngel it irrlicht
17:07 RealBadAngel *its
17:08 RealBadAngel they havent "implemented" anything
17:08 hmmmm Build-A-World is a very highly customized version of Irrlicht as I understand
17:08 RealBadAngel we dont know for sure, its closed source
17:08 hmmmm but anyway
17:08 hmmmm RBA you seem to value eye candy above all else
17:08 RealBadAngel not always
17:09 hmmmm but that approach is dragging minetest down for anybody who doesn't necessarily want all that
17:09 RealBadAngel the code im working on atm is kinda different
17:09 RealBadAngel using meshes makes game less resource demanding and in the long run faster
17:09 hmmmm endless FPS regressions for the sake of some neat effects with full shaders activated and texture bumpmapping and so on
17:10 est31 there was only one wasnt there
17:10 hmmmm i welcome your changes, or anybody's changes that improve graphics, as long as it doesn't cause a regression or introduce bugginess/unmaintainability
17:10 RealBadAngel hmmm, ive removed now preloading item visuals, and generating them
17:10 RealBadAngel and guess what, inventories are faster
17:11 RealBadAngel they come now with eyecandies just as side effects only
17:11 hmmmm in any case I've never seen anybody complain that an application is still compatible with an older version, but on the other hand I've seen lots of anger with cases of the opposite
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17:12 RealBadAngel hmmmm, we will check this measuring ram usage etc
17:12 RealBadAngel but i can just clearly see, theres no waiting for next inventory page
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17:13 RealBadAngel and if there are no textures made just for sake of inventory, it means saving lotsa ram
17:13 RealBadAngel especially in case of dreambuilder like games and hdx
17:16 RealBadAngel also, i dont quite understand why im blamed for effects are using CPU or GPU time
17:16 RealBadAngel you would like to get a coder that will develop GFX that doesnt take any computing power?
17:16 hmmmm the 25% FPS regression?
17:16 RealBadAngel look for one at Howghwarth
17:17 hmmmm and what does that 25% regression give to users?  the ability to use bumpmapping if they choose to enable that, or something?
17:17 RealBadAngel paramat effectively disabled it
17:17 RealBadAngel so youre free to trash it
17:17 RealBadAngel i wont be crying
17:17 RealBadAngel but you wont get lighting and other stuff without it
17:18 RealBadAngel and that 25% regression is highly questionable
17:18 RealBadAngel because i do get exactly opposite
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17:19 RealBadAngel hmmmm, btw how do you want to play with your modern gpu on freebsd when there are no proper drivers for it?
17:19 hmmmm "Works on My Machine" stamp of approval
17:20 hmmmm lol
17:20 RealBadAngel that was a mystery for me, your "im staring at the wall, seing 5 fps"
17:20 hmmmm the nvidia driver is plenty proper.  it's not my os that's the problem, it's the sucky code.
17:20 RealBadAngel youre using server distro for gaming
17:20 hmmmm many others have problems just as much
17:20 RealBadAngel no more comments
17:20 hmmmm absolutely irrelevant
17:21 Fixer I have texture tear problem on my gaming machine, horribly affect look of the game
17:21 RealBadAngel yeah? get radeon drivers for your freebsd
17:21 RealBadAngel and you want us to support freebsd?
17:21 RealBadAngel lol
17:21 hmmmm FreeBSD is supported
17:22 hmmmm we should be supporting more OSes to be honest
17:22 Calinou BSD support is important for server, but for client, probably not
17:22 Calinou BSD desktop is really stagnating
17:22 Fixer there was BSD server? oh come on
17:22 Calinou hmmmm, Android/iOS are the operating systems to support, probably not BSD
17:22 RealBadAngel freebsd is completely not supported
17:22 hmmmm uhm, yes it is supported.
17:22 RealBadAngel there are no proper GPU drivers for it
17:22 hmmmm end of discussion.
17:22 RealBadAngel for me too
17:22 est31 there are no proper GPU drivers for any OS, if its opengl
17:23 Calinou actually, the free drivers are ported to FreeBSD as well
17:23 Calinou but they lag behind
17:23 Calinou the NVIDIA blob is available for it as well
17:23 hmmmm I don't even understand this conversation
17:23 est31 me neither
17:23 hmmmm why are you arguing that FreeBSD shouldn't be supported all of a sudden
17:23 hmmmm this is completely, totally, 100% irrelevant
17:23 * est31 tries to do something more productive
17:23 est31 bye!
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17:23 hmmmm you're just trying to make minetest even more limited
17:24 hmmmm look, game development is hard.  I get that.  rise to the challenge instead of bringing everybody else down to your level.
17:24 RealBadAngel me too, off to coding
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17:24 hmmmm just because you are incompetent doesn't mean the rest of the MT community needs to be as well
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18:01 nrzkt Fixer, yes there was BSD servers
18:01 nrzkt Appletree on the serverlist and tuxsrv.fr are FreeBSD servers
18:01 nrzkt and i agree with hmmmm about supporting FreeBSD
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18:15 sofar nrzkt: ack on passing &boxes
18:15 Fixer new valley mapgen is amazing
18:15 sofar nrzkt: ack on using `switch`
18:16 sofar nrzkt: but ummmm, last time I did function pointers was 8 years ago and in C, not C++
18:18 sofar nrzkt: do you agree with me on the ordering issue though?
18:18 * sofar grabs some tea
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18:46 exio4 hmmmm: they probably want systemd support, don't they?
18:46 sofar ghegheghe
18:47 hmmmm lol
18:47 sofar systemd support in minetest?
18:47 sofar I can add that!
18:47 hmmmm honestly I think we should be supporting more OSes
18:47 sofar how about I make minetest socket activated?
18:47 hmmmm I've heard reports of people playing minetest on OpenBSD
18:47 sofar fancy bootchart graphs!
18:47 hmmmm NetBSD is a low hanging piece of fruit too
18:48 sofar (fyi no issues with making minetest working on the bsd's)
18:48 hmmmm Solaris shouldn't be too hard to add support for, either, and it is very playable since there's the nvidia driver for solaris
18:48 exio4 add systemd support, minetest randomly crashes when available for a complete user experience
18:48 hmmmm the only problem is when you get to the more exotic OSes like HP-UX/AIX/etc.
18:49 hmmmm I don't have total confidence in even a clean compile on those platforms, though I do strive to support them
18:50 sofar exio4: tbh for a daemon there's no reason to code anything up to support minetest
18:50 sofar exio4: sd_notify() would be the only thing, and that is maybe 20 lines of code that can be #ifdef'd out easily
18:51 exio4 sofar: #if 0 will do the trick
18:51 sofar oh come on, chill
18:52 sofar I've got too many PR's pending to even bother wasting my time on that
18:52 sofar but it's clear you're a systemd hater
18:54 sofar and like I said, I'm not going to submit code that would make minetest no longer work on *bsd's
18:54 sofar I'd rather get this connected nodeboxes patch accepted :)
18:54 sfan5 let's require systemd
18:55 sofar that's about as bad as requiring apt-get
18:55 sfan5 i'd rather require pacman
18:56 sofar I use archlinux (and others), but I'd still object to that
18:56 sofar that would just be poor packaging
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18:57 sofar the same way I shudder at release tarballs that have a .spec file inside of them, or a /debian/ folder
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19:23 Fixer !tell paramat Y=63 shadow bug is also present on valleys
19:23 ShadowBot Fixer: O.K.
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19:48 Nocx so this is where coders come for help with mod problems right?
19:49 Hijiri this channel is about the engine
19:49 Hijiri sometimes I ask mod questions though
19:49 Hijiri if it is a question I can justify to myself as somewhat relevant
19:50 Hijiri Nocx is more open to mod help
19:50 Hijiri sorry
19:50 Hijiri #minetest
19:50 Hijiri I meant
19:51 Nocx Did anyone else see: "Nocx is more open to mod help " because I just did
19:52 Hijiri yes, I wrote that
19:52 Hijiri then corrected myself
19:53 Nocx ok
19:56 Nocx well on the basic channel it says go to "#minetest-dev" for codding stuff
19:56 Nocx *coding
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20:51 Fixer when inside in cloud -> it turns transperent
20:56 kaadmy yeah backface culling
21:03 Fixer guh
21:04 Fixer why not just add stupid dirty hack -> when in cloud, add fog of that colour %)
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21:53 sofar Fixer: there are verious fog improvements that could be done...
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22:08 Fixer sofar, i'm playing valleys mapgen at the moment, caves are wonderful, but liquid over ignore bug ruins the fun with lava and water
22:08 sofar tough bugs to beat
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22:09 Fixer lots of hanging lava in air in caves
22:09 Fixer and water, by activating them things are going much nicer
22:11 Skyduskguy what was the reference for all the lua stuff hmm
22:11 Skyduskguy not the api, its liek the methods but better then the wiki
22:15 Skyduskguy it might have been the api but nicely formatted
22:16 Skyduskguy ok i found it http://rubenwardy.com/minete​st_modding_book/lua_api.html
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23:00 sofar how large is a mapblock again? it's 5x16 right?
23:03 kaadmy yep
23:03 kaadmy 80x80x80
23:03 sofar ok thanks
23:04 sofar I had to test something across mapblock boundaries
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23:17 RealBadAngel kahrl, here?
23:17 RealBadAngel hmmmm ?
23:18 RealBadAngel that code is wrong, https://github.com/minetest/minet​est/blob/master/src/mesh.cpp#L113
23:18 RealBadAngel it works correctly only for vertices video::EVT_STANDARD
23:19 RealBadAngel when you use that trick on other type of vertices we do get fucked up coords
23:20 RealBadAngel lotsa NANs or very small values
23:21 RealBadAngel affected are almost all our mesh manipulators
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23:49 Fixer interesting, singleplayer has lots of annoying stutters, so I've started dedicated server and connected client on the same PC and it still has lots of stutters

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