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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2016-01-08

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Time Nick Message
00:07 rubenwardy joined #minetest-dev
00:18 paramat joined #minetest-dev
00:21 paramat now merging game 774 trivial fix
00:26 paramat merged
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02:39 paramat https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3545 'Mapgen: Use 'mapgen_air' alias instead of CONTENT_AIR WIP'
03:07 sofar paramat: so you gave up on the grass texture?
03:07 sofar I can understand...
03:07 sofar there's plenty other battles to be had
03:08 paramat too soon for a PR, need to consider the options
03:08 sofar I have a much better, structural approach to the problem
03:08 paramat not given up though
03:08 paramat ?
03:09 sofar I totally think we should do a kickstarter and hire an actual artist
03:09 sofar and do *all* the textures at once
03:10 sofar similarly, we can do sounds, models in the same way
03:10 sofar or all at the same time, even
03:14 paramat nooo. that's just not minetest to do that, everyone here is an artist already
03:14 sofar hahaha
03:14 sofar shuuuure
03:15 sofar ;)
03:15 kaadmy ^
03:15 paramat i think the textures are consistent enough, it all evolves organically (chaos development)
03:15 kaadmy Mojang did that, imho their textures look kinda ametuerish
03:16 sofar actually
03:16 sofar a lot of our textures (minetest_game) are done by people, not artists
03:16 sofar there's no style
03:16 sofar it's just drawn up something
03:16 sofar that's not bad per se
03:16 paramat what i mean is there's no need for an 'external' 'artist' because we have enough artistic talent in our contributors
03:17 sofar but an artist makes it into something coherent
03:17 sofar well nothing says we can't hire someone who's already done stuff for minetest
03:17 sofar but the core idea is
03:17 sofar have ONE person make everything
03:17 sofar so that it's all ONE style, one feeling
03:17 sofar coherent
03:17 paramat external people are external, that's the problem. better to have more amateur internal artists
03:18 paramat everything in minetest is done this way
03:18 sofar I'm not seeing many people come in and redo the rose texture, or the cotton plant
03:18 sofar and we can have said artist make an entirely new texture pack as well
03:19 paramat only allowing one person to do textures is against the approach that anyone can contribute
03:19 sofar not my intent
03:19 sofar so what would be against having an artist making a non-default resource pack?
03:20 paramat nothing i guess, this artist is best one of us though
03:20 sofar not really. 10 different artists have 10 different styles
03:21 sofar they probably do not match
03:23 sofar I had to spend a lot of time studying the existing leaf textures before I was happy with my drawing of the aspen leaf
03:23 sofar I doubt that others have done that as well before for other aspects
03:23 sofar of course, there are exceptions
03:24 sofar your log top texture is really well done
03:25 kaadmy the leaf textures are especially hard
03:25 paramat the textures are consistent enough, everything else about minetest is an organic mess of various contributions, and it seems to work
03:25 sofar https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/775 fyi
03:25 paramat i know you see a problem with texture consistency though :)
03:26 paramat cool
03:27 paramat so i look forward to your optional consistent texture pack
03:27 sofar it's been on the backburner a bit
03:27 sofar 70 textures so far
03:27 sofar but this week I had to go back to work again ;)
03:28 paramat you know we already have this: texture packs
03:28 sofar it is a texture pack
03:29 kaadmy already suggested before, but maybe minetest should come with some texture packs/subgamws
03:29 paramat i mean what you're suggesting is already being done, various consistent packs by single artists
03:29 sofar yes, almost every optional texture pack is done by 1 person
03:32 paramat have to go bbl
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04:43 paramat now merging game 775
04:46 paramat merged
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14:04 dfelinto does anyone know if the developer “Sapier” comes in irc?
14:04 zat joined #minetest-dev
14:06 * dfelinto assumes he is the current maintainer of the stereo 3d code
14:09 RealBadAngel dfelinto, yeah you can meet him here
14:09 dfelinto RealBadAngel: thanks, I will set up an alarm then. his nick here is sapier I assume
14:10 RealBadAngel whats your problem anyway?
14:11 dfelinto RealBadAngel: minetest stereo implementation is based on the Toe-In method
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14:11 dfelinto RealBadAngel: as I was saying, minetest stereo implementation is based on the Toe-In method
14:12 dfelinto this is considered a poor method, where we simply rotate the cameras towards the convergence point
14:13 dfelinto I have a patch that replaces this by the (off-axis) zero-parallax method
14:13 dfelinto wip - https://github.com/dfelinto​/minetest/tree/offset-axis
14:14 RealBadAngel so make a PR with this patch
14:14 dfelinto and I wanted to bounce it by someone before sending it for review
14:14 dfelinto in fact there are some design decisions that I would like to discuss regardless of the code itself
14:14 RealBadAngel you can mark the PR as WIP and discuss it then there
14:14 dfelinto okay, I will try that
14:15 RealBadAngel as far as i remember those 3d modes were coded by sapier and mirceakitsune
14:15 dfelinto I’m just waiting for the pageflip patch to be merged, because the off-axis patch was built on top of it
14:15 dfelinto RealBadAngel: and hte original patch is from “xyz” from what I read in the log
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14:27 Taoki dfelinto: I noticed that red-cyan anaglyph in Minetest is not by far as high quality as that in Minecraft (excuse the comparison). As in it doesn't look so detailed, real, immersive, etc. In MC I can focus my eyes on the geometry more correctly.
14:27 Taoki So I agree that a better formula for stereoscopy angles would be welcome. Especially with Oculus Rift support as a hope of something that will eventually happen.
14:27 dfelinto oculus is another story, since the projection matrix is provided by the SDK itself
14:28 dfelinto but yes, the current method (toe-in) is (looking for a nice word) barely usable
14:28 dfelinto there are a few cases where you may want it, but it’s mostly for legacy reasons
14:30 dfelinto it would be interesting to import a minetest world in Blender (or the other way around), and compare the 3d in both viewports
14:34 est31 joined #minetest-dev
14:34 est31 can it be that our redis error reporting has been broken all the time?
14:35 est31 we directly used reply->str as c-type string
14:35 est31 so NULL terminated
14:35 est31 but now an user turned up who had a crash that smells of missing NULL termination
14:36 est31 https://github.com/minetest/minetest​/issues/2610#issuecomment-169936057
14:36 est31 can sb test that
14:36 est31 anyway will create a PR that changes the reply str reading
14:36 est31 I wont merge it, my time is limited
14:37 nrzkt2 no est31 don't die !
14:37 est31 I've said Im doing minetest pause
14:38 est31 I want to lower my contributions not highen them
14:43 nrzkt i know :p
14:44 est31 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3546
14:44 est31 if it makes sense, merge it
14:44 est31 if not comment
14:48 est31 either way, its no super urgent issue, otherwise it would have been discovered earlier
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14:53 nrzkt est31 seems good
14:56 est31 I'll push it then
14:57 est31 fine
14:57 est31 and I'm gone again
14:58 est31 bye all
15:01 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/3547
15:02 RealBadAngel ^^ enables infotext for item entities
15:06 sofar nice
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15:15 red-001 ~webtitle https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/602
15:15 red-001 ~web title https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/602
15:15 ShadowBot red-001: Allowed players with access priv to access any locked chest, steel door or trapdoor and breck bones they don't own. by red-001 · Pull Request #602 · minetest/minetest_game · GitHub
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15:17 nrzkt red-001, it's not necessary to do that here. Thanks
15:19 nrzkt RealBadAngel, seems good except the point i sent to you on the PR
15:20 nrzkt two comments*
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17:08 RealBadAngel quick question, why function fgettext(text, ...) is allowed only for mainmenu?
17:10 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/m​aster/builtin/common/misc_helpers.lua#L599
17:10 RealBadAngel i would like to use fgettext in item entities code, to display "Count" on infotext, translated
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18:22 sofar RealBadAngel: I could see someone wanting to prevent using it for localization of in-game messages
18:23 sofar but, your use case seems legit
18:24 kaeza it still has the same problems as e.g. intllib (server-side translation)
18:24 kaeza intllib sucks anyway so...
18:25 RealBadAngel i know, but how to make item entity use it and at the same time not allow using it for everybody out there/
18:25 RealBadAngel ?
18:26 kaeza RealBadAngel, see misc_register.lua; it hides core.register_item_raw, but please don't do that in builtin :)
18:26 RealBadAngel i think atm i will just use non-translated "Count" string until its resolved
18:27 RealBadAngel or anybody have an idea on how to format items infotext without any text to translate
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18:29 RealBadAngel or just dont display count at all?
18:35 kaeza something like "Dirt (5)" would be good for now
18:35 sofar RealBadAngel: why not add `or INIT == "GAME"` ?
18:36 RealBadAngel sofar if i add there init=="GAME" too i could remove that init at all
18:37 sofar right
18:38 RealBadAngel but that propably wont be enough
18:38 RealBadAngel gettext itself is defined within mainmenu api only
18:39 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/ma​ster/src/script/lua_api/l_mainmenu.cpp#L1060
18:43 sofar seems trivial enough to make that available to game
18:43 sofar a lot easier than the work I'll have to do for ItemStackMetaRef :^)
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19:00 RealBadAngel sofar, but complicated enough to not be a part of infotext PR imho
19:01 sofar yeah, I'd split that out into different commits
19:02 sofar just submit your infotext one as is, and a second one that adds the needed bits to display count
19:02 RealBadAngel so imho infotext pr is now complete
19:02 sofar my experience is that once you show a good concept, additional related patches are easier to merge
19:02 sofar I agree. I was going to test it this morning but ran out of time
19:03 RealBadAngel nrzkt commented it out with some mess about "virtual" stuff but thats rather about overall mess there, not this PR only
19:03 RealBadAngel in entities code theres lotsa dead stuff
19:05 RealBadAngel https://github.com/minetest/minetest/​blob/master/src/content_cao.cpp#L280
19:05 RealBadAngel like above, item entities are genericCAOs, that one is not used at all
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19:07 sofar I saw that
19:07 sofar I wonder if I can make that show up in gcov
19:08 sofar http://foo-projects.org/~sofar/minetest_coverage/
19:09 sofar of course, that was a quick run without much in-game interaction
19:09 sofar I can likely make that work again and push upstream
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20:09 Skyduskguy did i join ok?
20:11 kaadmy ?
20:26 Skyduskguy seems like i did
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22:06 Skyduskguy ohh poop anyone know a free b3d mesh maker?
22:07 kaadmy blender..
22:08 Skyduskguy to my knowledge that doesnt export b3d?
22:09 kaadmy there's an addon for it
22:09 Skyduskguy I was looking for one and that was one of ppls complaints
22:10 Skyduskguy what plugin do you use?
22:10 kaadmy does this work? http://supertuxkart.sourceforge.net/​persistent/images/e/e1/B3d_export.py
22:10 kaadmy i THINK that's the one i use
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22:10 Skyduskguy I dont know what im looking at, its a txtwith .py
22:11 kaadmy right-click, save as
22:12 kaadmy on linux, save it in (USER)/.config/blender/<version>/sc​ripts/addons/io_scene_export_b3d.py
22:19 Skyduskguy do i have to make that directory
22:20 Skyduskguy I tried installing an addon from file but that doesnt seem to make anything new appear
22:21 Skyduskguy well i dled a zip form somewhere else and install from file worked, i hope it works
22:22 kaadmy are you on linux?
22:22 Skyduskguy of course not
22:23 kaadmy i dunno where to put it then, it belongs in your addon folder, whereever that is
22:27 Skyduskguy well exporting a box and replacing the mesh from a mob didnt work, I need a way to test this
22:30 Skyduskguy there is no such thing as a b3d importer....
22:32 kaadmy yeah :(
22:32 Skyduskguy maybe i needed to add a texture?
22:32 kaadmy does the model just not show up?
22:32 Skyduskguy th4e mob showed up in game invisible
22:32 kaadmy what's the dimensions of the model? in MT, 10 units is 1m
22:32 Skyduskguy ehh its a box
22:33 kaadmy hmm, i remember having problems with being invisible
22:33 Skyduskguy im looking for dimension info....
22:33 kaadmy in blender, press N. near the top of the panel, scroll up
22:34 Skyduskguy 1 1 1
22:34 kaadmy scale it 10x in edit mode
22:34 kaadmy should work then
22:34 kaadmy and try adding a texture, might need it
22:35 Skyduskguy yeah im still looking for that part
22:35 kaadmy just unwrap it, press U>Reset
22:35 kaadmy and export and test again
22:35 Skyduskguy this comes up when i press u http://i.imgur.com/O1ImWeu.png
22:36 kaadmy in edit mode :p
22:36 kaadmy shoulda mentioned that
22:36 Skyduskguy ehh you did
22:36 Skyduskguy I dont know what that s
22:36 sofar blender is impossible to learn without a tutorial
22:36 Skyduskguy i just installed blender...
22:36 kaadmy ^
22:36 kaadmy ahh
22:36 kaadmy i assumed you'd used blender before ;)
22:37 kaadmy press Tab
22:37 kaadmy that puts you in edit mode
22:37 sofar I'm amazed I managed to make this: http://i.imgur.com/pYv3xhN.png myself in it
22:38 Skyduskguy how do i add a texture to this thing?
22:38 Skyduskguy it just needs to be a color
22:38 sofar Skyduskguy: UV mapping
22:38 kaadmy Skyduskguy: just unwrap it, doesn't matter how
22:38 Skyduskguy doesnt seem to do anything?
22:38 sofar you need to add a texture, can't just give a model a color
22:38 Skyduskguy I assumed so
22:38 sofar unwrapping is sufficient
22:39 sofar but then in MT you'll need to add a texture
22:39 Skyduskguy im just pasting it over some mob
22:39 Skyduskguy replacing the model
22:39 Skyduskguy for now to learning
22:40 kaadmy check the mob's texture, if the top-left pixel is transparent, it'll show up invisible if you haven't unwrapped the model
22:40 Skyduskguy yeah
22:40 Skyduskguy \it was
22:40 Skyduskguy ima load it in now
22:41 Skyduskguy damn still invis
22:41 kaadmy :|
22:43 Skyduskguy does clickign unwrap, unwrap it?
22:43 Skyduskguy \im seeing a unwrap tool to the left
22:43 Skyduskguy http://i.imgur.com/TLyY9OZ.png
22:43 kaadmy that shows up if you selected an unwrap type when you press U in edit mode
22:43 kaadmy just press U again, and select Reset
22:44 Skyduskguy so u gets this? http://i.imgur.com/LWzY0Wu.png
22:44 Skyduskguy what do i want
22:44 kaadmy just click that
22:44 kaadmy wait
22:44 Skyduskguy I have..
22:44 Skyduskguy what now
22:45 kaadmy press A in edit mode until the whole mesh is orange
22:45 kaadmy then unwrap
22:45 Skyduskguy how do i unwrap it
22:45 sofar yeah, you have to select all faces
22:45 kaadmy <sofar>blender is impossible to learn without a tutorial
22:45 kaadmy wisdon ^
22:45 sofar add a material
22:45 kaadmy don't need materials iirc
22:45 Skyduskguy http://i.imgur.com/z4LVJoZ.png
22:45 sofar hmm
22:46 Skyduskguy im just trying to get abox to show up
22:46 Skyduskguy ill start the tuts after proving it
22:46 sofar this needs to be a minetest-specific tutorial video
22:46 Skyduskguy yeah
22:46 Skyduskguy nothing on howto make mobs
22:46 Skyduskguy i looked
22:46 sofar so that it can omit all the random parts you don't care about
22:46 sofar just a mesh node
22:46 sofar for starters
22:46 sofar that's even simpler
22:47 Skyduskguy ive made node meshes in lua
22:47 Skyduskguy how
22:47 Skyduskguy do i unwrap
22:47 RealBadAngel Skyduskguy, meshes in lua? you mean nodeboxes rather
22:47 Skyduskguy man i idc
22:47 Skyduskguy we talkin bout blender n b3ds
22:48 Skyduskguy beh
22:48 Skyduskguy how is box formed
22:48 Skyduskguy so click unwrap
22:48 sofar nodeboxes != meshes
22:48 Skyduskguy then just export it?
22:48 kaadmy yep
22:48 kaadmy *should* work
22:49 sofar http://i.imgur.com/pYv3xhN.png <- blender-made mesh model
22:51 Skyduskguy beautiful
22:51 Skyduskguy http://i.imgur.com/F5gyq67.png
22:51 Skyduskguy :)
22:51 sofar is it just a box?
22:51 Skyduskguy yeah
22:51 sofar oh, you're making a mob?
22:51 Skyduskguy starting the process of learning howto
22:52 Skyduskguy I know i needed ot be able to make a model
22:52 Skyduskguy now i can make a box ty to you guys
22:52 Skyduskguy <3
22:52 kaadmy ty ;)
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