Minetest logo

IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2015-08-26

| Channels | #minetest-dev index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:10 paramat joined #minetest-dev
00:10 paramat yeah saveschems mod
00:11 VanessaE ok.
00:11 VanessaE do you, like, have some kind of script/bot/whatever that scrapes the logs and pings you? ;)
00:12 paramat my head
00:12 VanessaE heh
00:14 paramat worldedit is not great for saving schematics because you can't punch air to set it's probability to 0, and currently you can't set the per-node force-place
00:15 paramat that feature needs updating, or perhaps a dedicated node editor
00:15 VanessaE I'm finally preparing an update to Dreambuilder, wanted to make sure I included the "source" code for those
00:16 Sokomine paramat: i've decided to release the current version of my handle_schematics mod and posted it in the forum. with that, schematics are far easier to handle. hopefully, minetest.get_dir_list will soon be less restrictive
00:16 VanessaE btw, the acacia and pine schematics you have in saveschems are not identical to what's in upstream minetest_game
00:16 paramat for some structures the table form is actually easier to work with
00:16 Sokomine ah, ok, i don't do the per-node-probability
00:17 paramat yes some of the trees in saveschems may be older versions
00:17 VanessaE ok, I'll swap in the current ones then -- I used the ones in saveschems.
00:18 paramat Sokomine, you have tree problems you want to discuss?
00:19 paramat in all that rush i didn't bother updating my saveschems repo to the improved designs
00:19 VanessaE no worries.
00:20 Sokomine yes. can we do that here or do we have to move to the general channel?
00:20 Sokomine paramat: first: thanks for including the pines and acacias. more trees are great for the game in many aspects
00:21 paramat i'll join the other channel
00:21 Sokomine now, the problem i have is that i want to spawn trees inside mg_villages. the old minetest_game/mods/default/trees.lua code had code to generate the trees and spawn them inside a voxelmanip area it created for that purpose - which was fine; i just needed some changes and some functions where private
00:22 Sokomine hm, now i started here
00:23 Sokomine generating more or less simple trees and placing them into the world is a common problem for all mapgens and quite a lot of mods. it's...impractical...that there are so many ways out there
00:24 Sokomine i do not want to keep a modified copy of the code from minetest_game forever. copying is bad for maintenance
00:24 paramat okay lets continue here
00:24 paramat it's sortof dev stuff
00:26 Sokomine i'm wondering if it might be a good idea to offer a general tree-mod and a tree-registration function - a function that gets the nodes (trunk, leaves, fruit, planks) plus a way to actually put that tree-thing into the world (be it direct code, a schematic or l-system)
00:26 paramat yeah i have been thinking we need more ways to spawn trees
00:26 paramat ways that do not update lighting every tree
00:27 paramat for example a way to place a schem in a voxelmanip without updating, for multipple trees
00:27 paramat (multiple)
00:28 Sokomine modders like adding trees, and they make the game richer. but even with the schematics, the abm wants to be created. and it would also be helpful in some situations to know that a particular node is something treeish (without having to resort to the group) or to change tree-like things for all mods installed in one go (i.e. changing the way the leaves are - walkable, climbable, solid, ...)
00:29 Sokomine yes. right now i'm doing the place-a-schem-into-voxelmanip inside lua. so doing the new schematic-trees would work to a degree (i have no support for the probabilities yet)
00:29 paramat the lua code that grows the mgv6 design trees from saplings could perhaps be split into 2 bits, the 'update map' bit could then be optional
00:29 Sokomine it might also be helpful to be able to use a specific tree-shape (in particular the old way trees where generated) with diffrent nodes
00:31 paramat ugh problem is i'm a bit exhausted after the release and am not inspired to work on this currently, but will keep it in miind
00:31 paramat (mind)
00:32 paramat devs feel like this -> :P~
00:32 Sokomine ah, ok :-) the release is of course a lot of stress
00:32 Sokomine take a look at a real tree to get some relaxing ,-)
00:32 paramat you might make a good dev
00:33 paramat c++ is similar to lua and the code is not much more complex
00:33 Sokomine my knowledge of c/c++ is currently too limited i'm afraid
00:33 paramat so is mine =)
00:34 Sokomine yes, that's right. in the end, it's just another language. it's not that i like lua particulary much
00:35 paramat i was surprised how easy doing c++ stuff was, essentially if you're good at lua you're most of the way there already
00:35 paramat Vanessa too, we need more devs
00:36 paramat i stared at the mapgen soce for months until suddenly it made sense
00:36 paramat (code)
00:36 Sokomine in the end, most languages are the same. some do things a bit more complicated than others in some ways. but they all have their specialities, and it takes time to get used to it
00:37 Sokomine the mapgen is way over my head :-) i read a bit about it but have no feeling for how all these perlin noises cooperate
00:38 paramat the other mtgame devs are considering adding houses / simple villages to mapgen, you would be the obvious choice
00:38 paramat anyway no pressure
00:40 Sokomine oh. yes, of course. that would be fine for the game. my mod (based on nores) does that quite fine by now :-)
00:41 Sokomine it all happens inside lua voxelmanip and is pretty fast. it'd be even faster if it where in the engine itshelf. that'd safe the time to pass the 3d array to lua and back
00:45 Sokomine a good way to integrate villages might be to let lua do the planning of the village layout (=more flexibility for modders) and the c++ part do the actual placing. in theory, that'd already be possible with place_schematic, but in practice it isn't working so well as other mods may interfere and cavegen hits
00:52 paramat structures added to mapgen by default would have to be very simple, lightweight and fast, with minimal terrain shaping. anything more complex is best left to mods. we could start with just the occasional single hut or ruin
00:53 Sokomine that'd be a huge improvement already. players are glad if they encounter something in the world so that it doesn't seem so lonely and lifeless. but even small huts do require some terrain shaping
00:54 paramat yes, some core code for flattening and clearing trees
00:54 Sokomine in the end, a small hut just requires a smaller area to be changed in height
00:55 Sokomine that'd be very helpful already
00:55 Sokomine plus some core code for placing several schematics in one go at the right time
00:57 VanessaE paramat: I've been asked before but I must decline again. besides, for now I'm content to just whine, piss, and moan when something needs fixed ;)
00:58 Sokomine :-)
00:58 paramat cool
00:58 VanessaE speaking of fixing, did you sort out that shadowing issue with mgv7 + moretrees?
01:00 Player_2 joined #minetest-dev
01:01 paramat do you spawn many l-system trees in a short amount of time?
01:03 paramat the lighting update tends to make shadows if used too frequently
01:03 VanessaE yes
01:03 VanessaE a few dozen at a time in the densest areas, I guess
01:03 paramat ah. growing too many saplings at once does it too
01:03 VanessaE default saplings?
01:03 paramat yes
01:04 VanessaE good to knopw
01:04 VanessaE -p
01:04 VanessaE means moretrees is even less-to-blame than it already was ;)
01:04 Sokomine hm, yes, i've encountered it in the villages multiple times as well. there wasn't always an obvious sapling present in the shadowed area; but often nearby
01:04 VanessaE btw as for adding structures to the mapgen, I would advise making them fairly rare, at least as much so as dungeons are
01:05 paramat so yes we need a new l-system api that does not include a lighting update
01:05 paramat yes agreed
01:05 paramat the need for fast mapgen will force this anyway
01:07 paramat for a start just the occasional abandoned hut or ruin
01:08 VanessaE yeah
01:08 VanessaE now about the lighting update...... how do you mean?
01:08 VanessaE or, let me rephrase that
01:08 VanessaE if lighting updates are suspended with some proposed new call, how would you trigger a "final" update?  or would it even be needed?
01:11 paramat just a single final update for the mapchunk i guess
01:12 Sokomine the occasional hut or ruin might even be placed safely with place_schematic. as long as the ground where it will stand is sufficiently flat. any remaining cavegen griefing or mudflow might even add to a ruin
01:13 paramat so moretrees would work 'on generated'
01:14 VanessaE paramat: hm.  ok.  Better to fix the lighting code as well
01:14 paramat yes that first
01:14 VanessaE in plantlife, doing a final block-level update is easy enough, so I could indeed use that newer api call.
01:14 VanessaE s/plantlife/biome_lib/
01:15 paramat left #minetest-dev
01:24 Fritigern joined #minetest-dev
01:35 domtron joined #minetest-dev
01:56 Fritigern joined #minetest-dev
02:06 VargaD joined #minetest-dev
02:07 Fritigern joined #minetest-dev
02:11 VargaD joined #minetest-dev
02:29 domtron joined #minetest-dev
02:29 sloantothebone joined #minetest-dev
03:25 est31 joined #minetest-dev
04:20 Fritigern joined #minetest-dev
04:43 Hunterz joined #minetest-dev
05:08 nrzkt joined #minetest-dev
05:13 Fritigern joined #minetest-dev
06:24 nrzkt joined #minetest-dev
06:56 chchjesus joined #minetest-dev
06:57 emptty joined #minetest-dev
07:13 domtron joined #minetest-dev
07:42 julienrat joined #minetest-dev
07:48 julienrat joined #minetest-dev
07:50 julienrat left #minetest-dev
08:00 Yepoleb_ joined #minetest-dev
08:09 nore joined #minetest-dev
08:16 Gael-de-Sailly joined #minetest-dev
08:26 kilbith joined #minetest-dev
08:28 tomreyn joined #minetest-dev
08:47 Darcidride joined #minetest-dev
09:00 T4im joined #minetest-dev
09:26 Fritigern joined #minetest-dev
10:16 domtron joined #minetest-dev
10:43 Wayward_One joined #minetest-dev
10:45 kilbith joined #minetest-dev
10:47 proller joined #minetest-dev
11:04 Calinou joined #minetest-dev
11:18 Zeitgeist_ joined #minetest-dev
11:33 Wayward_One joined #minetest-dev
11:33 Wayward_One joined #minetest-dev
11:55 nore joined #minetest-dev
12:35 domtron joined #minetest-dev
12:42 tuy joined #minetest-dev
12:58 zupoman joined #minetest-dev
12:58 zupoman joined #minetest-dev
13:01 proller joined #minetest-dev
13:03 Megaf joined #minetest-dev
13:07 proller joined #minetest-dev
13:50 proller joined #minetest-dev
13:54 emptty joined #minetest-dev
14:24 nore joined #minetest-dev
14:43 rubenwardy joined #minetest-dev
14:50 hmmmm joined #minetest-dev
15:01 Gael-de-Sailly joined #minetest-dev
15:16 Zeitgeist_ i am still working on the minetest bump for gentoo and got another issue, the example conf file doesnt get installed in the right location and overriding it with -DCUSTOM_CUSTOM_EXAMPLE_CONF_DIR doesnt seem to work
16:14 nrzkt joined #minetest-dev
16:19 celeron55 Zeitgeist_: maybe because it's -DCUSTOM_EXAMPLE_CONF_DIR, not -DCUSTOM_CUSTOM_EXAMPLE_CONF_DIR
16:27 anton__ joined #minetest-dev
16:46 emptty joined #minetest-dev
16:57 domtron joined #minetest-dev
17:11 Krock joined #minetest-dev
17:18 damiel joined #minetest-dev
17:19 Robert_Zenz joined #minetest-dev
17:48 TenPlus1 joined #minetest-dev
17:48 TenPlus1 Hi folks...
17:48 TenPlus1 Does anyone know of any issues with 0.4.13 that causes crashing ???
17:53 Krock Hi there, can you provide a link to the error message?
17:53 TenPlus1 segfaults and std::bad_alloc errors
17:54 TenPlus1 plus clients connecting to server are glitching out when using wireless
17:54 TenPlus1 no errors apart from those
17:54 TenPlus1 server was crashing every few minutes earlier with those errors, nothing specific
17:57 TenPlus1 all mods have been tried and tested and work perfectly fine standalone and local server (no internet)... but things crash as soon as internet is involved ?!?!
18:03 TenPlus1 would client version affect game server connections ??
18:06 rubenwardy My server has never had a stf::bad_alloc crash, what mods do you have?
18:06 rubenwardy Xandu?
18:11 TenPlus1 yes Xanadu...  it's weird that some days it hardly crashes at all, and others it's every few minutes...
18:12 rubenwardy Before today, my server's had an up time of > 10 days (except for me restarting to install updates 6 days ago)
18:12 TenPlus1 3d_armor, ambience, bags, bakedclay, beds, boats, boost_cart, bucket, builtin_item, framedglass, castle, doors, dropondie, dye, ethereal, farming, fire, flowers, inventory_plus, itemframes, lapis, lucky_blocks, mobs, money, more_chests, no_guests, paintings, teleport_potion, tnt, vessels, wieldview, wool, worldedit, xpanes, zcg
18:13 rubenwardy so we need to find out why it's happening to you
18:13 rubenwardy OS?
18:13 rubenwardy You should make a GH issue with all these details
18:13 TenPlus1 server is running on lubuntu 14.04 64-bit with 4gb ram (minetest never goes over 600mb) and 120gb ssd drive
18:14 TenPlus1 I've made many forum and gh issues and so far nothing has come of it...  mods have been tested and never have errors, it's always those 2...
18:14 kilbith joined #minetest-dev
18:15 TenPlus1 I've even added a command to remove any entities in the area incase one turned out to be glitched... wasnt that
18:18 rubenwardy If you create a new, blank world does the error still happen?
18:18 Siva joined #minetest-dev
18:18 TenPlus1 we tried running a limited xanadu world which still crashed...  this was only for 1 day...
18:19 rubenwardy what db backend?
18:19 TenPlus1 we thought it was originally map errors that freaked out engine and crashed everything
18:19 TenPlus1 sqlite...  leveldb is too glitchy
18:19 rubenwardy are you using sqlite_asynonous or whatever?
18:19 TenPlus1 sqlite_synchronous = 1 is in minetest.conf
18:20 TenPlus1 so it error checks
18:20 TenPlus1 *should*
18:22 TenPlus1 we tried converting map to leveldb but players kept reporting that blocks they removed or added disappeared when they returned to area
18:24 rubenwardy I'm reading an article saying that 32bit can make problems, although I don't see how as you only have 4GB of memory
18:24 TenPlus1 we're using 64-bit os and minetest...
18:24 rubenwardy hmmm
18:24 rubenwardy you're sure?
18:24 kilbith you do use heavy mapgen stuff and entities on your server IIRC
18:25 TenPlus1 and server has been monitored and minetest memory usage never goes beyond 600mb...  the whole server has been streamlined to run a terminal with minetestserver
18:25 TenPlus1 heavy mapgen and entities ??
18:25 kilbith depends if it has been coded with feets or not
18:25 TenPlus1 as soon as player walks away and mobs are out of shot they are removed
18:25 TenPlus1 as for mapgen, only ethereal...  using minetest's own biomes and decoration
18:27 Siva_AndroIRC joined #minetest-dev
18:27 Hunterz joined #minetest-dev
18:27 TenPlus1 coded with feets ?
18:31 nanepiwo i have a weird problem: i need to turn off my server to be able to start my gui minetest client, and then start the server
18:31 rubenwardy How to rebase a PR to latest MT?
18:32 TenPlus1 nanepiwo, what version of minetest are you using ? you should be able to keep server running and run a GUI minetest at same time
18:35 T4im rubenwardy: go into your local branch then "git rebase upstream/master" (provided you call the official remote upstream, if not yet, I recommend so) after that you'll have to fix any conflicts coming up and rebase --continue until you're through
18:35 T4im that also assumes you already fetched upstream/maser of course
18:35 rubenwardy ah
18:36 rubenwardy that's why it wasn't working, it didn't git fetch
18:36 T4im push back onto the branch your PR is from, and github will automaticly update the rest
18:36 T4im ah, ok :D
18:40 RealBadAngel joined #minetest-dev
18:40 RealBadAngel hi guys
18:40 RealBadAngel i would like to get an answer for the very specific question
18:41 TenPlus1 ?
18:41 RealBadAngel why sings are using nodebox drawtype and the only one one using signlike drawtype is ladder?
18:42 RealBadAngel sorry for double "one" :P
18:42 Calinou joined #minetest-dev
18:43 * TenPlus1 use to use nodebox ladders but the rotation of the signlike one's was all over the place so reverted back
18:43 kilbith you would have to make 7 nodeboxes for the ladder
18:43 kilbith bad for performance
18:44 kilbith or 6
18:44 T4im and the signs look better as nodebox than a hovering texture
18:45 T4im organic api disgrowth x)
18:48 TenPlus1 being in an area with many half slabs is enough to drop my framerate, nodebox ladders would kill my pc ;p
18:49 kilbith just watch your FPS in a snowy forrest
18:49 TenPlus1 indeed... lol, but they do look pretty :P  the new biomes are great
18:49 kilbith dramatically fell with single nodeboxes on trees
18:49 TenPlus1 that's why I use plantlike leaves on ethereal... speeds things back up a taf
18:49 TenPlus1 *tad
18:50 kilbith so now imagine thousands of nodeboxes ladders around
18:52 TenPlus1 paramat's new changes to fire mod helps things a bit too...  modified it for server
18:53 TenPlus1 but doing minetest.setting_get many times when checking fire seems to slow things down...
18:53 nore joined #minetest-dev
18:54 RealBadAngel kilbith, there are no nodeboxes...
18:54 TenPlus1 is their a way to cache minetest.conf settings in memory to keep things speeds
18:54 TenPlus1 *speedy
18:54 RealBadAngel see, theres no spoon :P
18:54 kilbith sure, but there are many vertices ;)
18:54 T4im TenPlus1: you can settings give you a table representation
18:55 rubenwardy TenPlus1, I'm pretty sure they're help in memoryu
18:55 TenPlus1 that would be handy, mods reading the same setting a lot definitely lags things...  changed most of my mods to read it once (or less often)
18:55 TenPlus1 what command to read from table representation in memory ?
18:56 T4im probably :to_table() or so
18:56 RealBadAngel im askin why sign is nodebox and ladder is sign
18:56 RealBadAngel thats a mess
18:56 T4im TenPlus1: Settings(filename):to_table()
18:57 rubenwardy Rebase of #1869: https://github.com/rubenwar​dy/minetest/tree/http_fetch
18:57 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1869 -- Add scriptapi interface to HTTPFetchRequest by Jeija
18:57 TenPlus1 T4im, so minetest doesnt do this automatially on 1st run, it's up to mod to copy it into tabkle ?
18:57 RealBadAngel kilbith, you can ask your unix masters bout that :P
18:57 rubenwardy TenPlus1, oh right, yeah they're not cached in Lua
18:57 kilbith and you can ask on new fork
18:58 kilbith on your*
18:58 RealBadAngel kilbith, im still codin for mt
18:58 RealBadAngel in case you havent noticed ;P
18:58 kilbith oh ? last time you said "i don't care anymore, you morons and middle finger" ...
18:59 TenPlus1 lol
19:00 TenPlus1 T4im, for now it's prolly easier to load settings into variable at start of mod... until tables are global to access
19:00 T4im they are certainly cached in the engine; the table reprensentation can be useful if you need lots of settings in one place, or need to search through them
19:00 rubenwardy TenPlus1, indexing tables are slow as well, if you want speed at the cost of not being able to do /set enable_fire false, use local fire_enabled = ...  in the init.lua
19:01 rubenwardy ie: outside of the function, so it only loads at load time
19:01 TenPlus1 that's what I've done rubenwardy...  was just wondering (hoping) they were globally loaded when minetest started
19:01 TenPlus1 most of my mods do that to save on lagg
19:01 rubenwardy at a guess I'd say they're stored on the CPP side
19:02 T4im just test changing a value in the config at runtime.. it will probably not be reflected in the engine -> read at startup
19:02 T4im as a heuristic
19:02 T4im but I think I also saw it early read when doctoring around with the apparmor profile
19:03 T4im which btw, *thumps up* is pretty clean in the case of minetest... relativly to other software minetest keeps its fingers mostly where they belong, it seems
19:04 Gael-de-Sailly joined #minetest-dev
19:05 TenPlus1 Q. would different clients connecting to a server affect performance or stability... e.g. freeminer, minetest clones, older versions etc?
19:05 kilbith freeminer can connect ?
19:05 kilbith since it's enet
19:06 TenPlus1 it was mentioned that 0.4.12+ uses a new way of networking, just curious if this breaks at all when using older clients
19:07 rubenwardy TenPlus1, whilst it shouldn't be possible for clients to crash servers or make them unresponsive, you've got to remember that there will be bugs with Minetest
19:08 TenPlus1 I know, am wondering what if anything can cause a crash... known issues... that kinda thing
19:08 RealBadAngel kilbith,  last time i was coding hotfixes in hurry for 13
19:09 RealBadAngel what i felt offended with was paramats opinion that parallax and premade maps look awful and should be disabled
19:10 RealBadAngel that was kinda criticall mass reaction
19:10 kilbith and your previous self-inflated melodrama was for the PR on music
19:10 kilbith there was several
19:10 RealBadAngel see, im doing AV
19:10 RealBadAngel nothing more
19:11 RealBadAngel being on that position, and have no real vote to make anythin?
19:11 RealBadAngel a joke
19:12 rubenwardy You're not actually the AV sub-system maintainer though
19:12 RealBadAngel now im not
19:12 rubenwardy so, other than being a core developer, you have no elevated rights
19:13 rubenwardy *had
19:13 RealBadAngel im coding now what i want
19:13 rubenwardy good
19:14 RealBadAngel for a break i took mese crystals
19:14 RealBadAngel now im on sings
19:14 TenPlus1 the growing crystals next to lava thing?
19:16 Sketch2 joined #minetest-dev
19:19 Sketch2 joined #minetest-dev
19:22 twoelk joined #minetest-dev
19:29 MinetestForFun joined #minetest-dev
19:31 paramat joined #minetest-dev
19:32 TenPlus1 hi paramar
19:32 TenPlus1 *t
19:32 paramat hi
19:32 paramat i have changes to fire mod here game#651
19:32 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetes​t/minetest_game/issues/651 -- Fire: Move flame extinguishing to separate faster ABM (WIP) by paramat
19:32 paramat no more frequent use of 'setting get'
19:33 TenPlus1 ahh, did u add my changed paramat ?
19:33 paramat no did this independantly
19:33 TenPlus1 ehehe, kewl :)  added your changes to my own with a few tweaks
19:34 paramat also has fast extinguishing. fire mod is a bit of a mess for 0.4.13
19:34 paramat so working on it
19:37 TenPlus1 I sent u msg in forums with a few changes paramat, so it still reads disable_fire setting every 7 seconds
19:43 paramat ah i see, haven't got your message yet. my PR only needs to read it once
19:44 TenPlus1 this was so you could enable.disable fire live on server
19:44 paramat ah i see
19:45 paramat that could be useful..
19:45 TenPlus1 I removed the sounds on my own github version to use ambiance instead, less resources used
19:46 paramat is live setting of 'disable fire' essential?
19:46 paramat i may have to rethink my PR
19:47 TenPlus1 not really... just for servers where fire can be enabled.disabled on the fly...  your version works great when 1 setting is in use
19:53 paramat sorry RealBadAngel i only asked for removal of parallax occlusion because i misunderstood you here http://irc.minetest.ru/minet​est-dev/2015-08-19#i_4371511 and was essentially 'agreeing with you'
19:55 Player_2 joined #minetest-dev
19:55 Player-2 joined #minetest-dev
19:56 Player_2 joined #minetest-dev
20:01 TenPlus1 cya folks
20:07 * paramat looks at tenplus1's fire mod
20:07 paramat left #minetest-dev
20:11 nore joined #minetest-dev
20:14 leat joined #minetest-dev
20:14 Siva joined #minetest-dev
20:32 Siva_AndroIRC joined #minetest-dev
21:56 proller joined #minetest-dev
22:10 younishd joined #minetest-dev
22:23 proller joined #minetest-dev
22:25 Siva joined #minetest-dev
22:26 Siva joined #minetest-dev
22:53 Player_2 joined #minetest-dev
22:55 domtron joined #minetest-dev
23:00 segfault22 joined #minetest-dev
23:01 segfault22 hey y'all, I'm having some issues with configuring sheet ore generation parameters,... it seems that regardless of what the "noise_threshold" and "persist" values are set to, I always get massive swathes of ore that are often interconnected
23:05 segfault22 I prefer generating somewhat smaller clusters, so that they are difficult to find but still providing plenty of ore for those who can find them,... so basically, I need to be able to control how often the noise value reaches above the noise_threshold
23:06 segfault22 all of my attempts at modifying the parameters have failed, resulting in the same giant clusters,... but oddly I have been using identical parameters to what was actually working in the past, to no avail.
23:07 Siva joined #minetest-dev
23:11 segfault22 welcome
23:12 segfault22 its so lonely here,... as if none of the people connected to the IRC are looking at it. Should I start naming them so that they get a notification of activity?
23:12 segfault22 or would that be spammy
23:12 T4im you probably need to divide those values by a factor to get a better resolution
23:13 T4im and yes highlighting random people is generally considered rude ;)
23:14 T4im sorry, swapping myself to death here right now, give me a moment
23:14 segfault22 thank you for the reply, any support is helpful
23:15 segfault22 I have changed all of the parameters in both directions,... but I haven't tried tiny fractional values yet. Was the code making use of noise_threshold changed to interpret a higher value as a lower threshold?
23:18 kahrl if it makes you feel any better, I did read what you wrote
23:19 kahrl but I know nothing about noise parameters so I did not respond
23:20 segfault22 it's okay,...
23:22 segfault22 It seems very unusual that even when I use the parameters that generated only about 12 iridium ore nodes per 1000x1000x1000 area, it still generates massive swathes.
23:22 T4im if the perlin noise behaves similar as simpex noise with this, you don't want to map minetest coordinates to noise map coordinates 1:1, that would result (at least with simplex) in very rough differences
23:23 Siva joined #minetest-dev
23:23 T4im dividing these by a factor should increase frequency, thereby giving you more different values on a shorter area
23:24 T4im but I'm a bit winging this x)
23:24 segfault22 Did they change it to simplex noise? I thought it was always perlin noise,... I understand what you are saying, and I have tried to change the values independent of node coordinates for size.
23:24 T4im no, not in minetest
23:24 T4im not yet anyway
23:24 segfault22 good
23:25 segfault22 I would rather use perlin noise because it was what was working a while ago
23:25 T4im but I wouldn't be surprised if perlin behaves similar in that regard
23:25 T4im its worth a try at least ;)
23:25 T4im and since frequency doesn't seem to be one of those plenty parameters, I guess you still have to do that yourself
23:28 segfault22 A while ago I could work with it and make it generate sheets of the relative size I wanted, but it now appears that even when using parameters identical to those, it stays the same. I am somewhat convinced that there has been a change in how the values are interpreted, but it hasn't broken other mods like technic marble/granite generation
23:30 Siva_Machina joined #minetest-dev
23:32 T4im no idea, but your issue sounds like a too low frequency too me.. imagine a wave over that world.. you cut the peaks.. you get more surface there as if you would increase frequency which "thin" peaks
23:33 T4im with*
23:35 segfault22 I basically need to be able to control the amplitude variation of the waves, relative to the threshold - so that I can make lots of smaller peaks instead of few very massive plateaus
23:36 T4im you can do that by playing with the input coordinates.. not sure if the perlin noise is "meant" to do that, but it might just do the trick
23:36 est31 joined #minetest-dev
23:36 T4im not parameters, but the coordinates
23:37 segfault22 coordinates? like the x/y/z scale?
23:37 T4im yep
23:37 segfault22 I see
23:38 est31 okay the poll phase for the website competition has ended
23:39 est31 calinou's entry won
23:39 segfault22 cool
23:40 T4im ah, "scale" actually might be exactly that parameter for perlin noise that does exactly that
23:40 est31 so, now we are at step 4 of the website contest "The core devs discuss which entry to chose, what to modify, also considering technical arguments (esp. 4. and 5.)."
23:41 est31 https://forum.minetest.net/vi​ewtopic.php?f=14&t=12843
23:41 est31 and I vouch for Calinou's entry, its technically more aligned to the github setup we want to do
23:42 segfault22 Although I am still experiencing the same problems with too massive swathes of ore, I now understand what the scale values do
23:42 est31 other opinions on this?
23:43 segfault22 The other parameters control how often the sheets occur; scale controls how far out from the center they generate
23:44 T4im well, it seems they are there to change the frequency, but in a way that allows it to be used for octaves afterwards as well, if there is lacunarity provided, too that is
23:45 est31 The only problem I see with Calinou's entry is that it is too large for slow to retrieve for metered connections
23:45 T4im which seems exists
23:47 T4im if you would just would mess with the input coordinates to change frequency, you would mix into frequency increase per octave later
23:49 T4im I wonder, weren't there plans once to add simplexnoise, est31?
23:49 T4im also, bootstrap should be able to be stripped down iirc
23:49 est31 yup
23:49 est31 (to the second msg)
23:51 segfault22 we should be able to choose which noise algorithm to use, maybe even allow custom ones
23:52 est31 well, you can do all these things already if you modify c++ code
23:53 est31 T4im, don't know whether simplex noise has been considered or not, I dont know much about mapgen
23:56 segfault22 For those of us who don't speak C++, it would be helpful to include selection of the noise algorithm in the minetest.register_ore() function
23:56 wischi2 joined #minetest-dev
23:57 segfault22 There would need to be made a standard for the files that define the algorithm, so that they can be added by mods without having to modify the C++ code
23:58 segfault22 instead of just duct-taping the algorithms to the generation code
23:58 est31 The point of c++ mapgen is speed
23:58 est31 so there is no big point in using lua noise for a c++ mapgen, if you already can use 100% pure lua mapgen
23:58 segfault22 Of course, but c++ mapgen can be augmented by being able to tell it what to do, by supplying it with a separate file for the algorithm and such
23:59 segfault22 I never suggested that we should drop C++
23:59 est31 segfault22, you can drop c++ already now
23:59 est31 there are some pure lua mapgens out there, just search for them

| Channels | #minetest-dev index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext