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IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2015-04-20

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Time Nick Message
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02:06 paramat what are the correct perlinmap dimensions for 2D noise, is the 3rd dimension left out or set to 1? recently i've been setting it to 1 for compatibility with older versions of MT
02:12 hmmmm yes 1 is correct
02:12 hmmmm the others needed to be at least one or else it'd crash though
02:13 hmmmm i just fixed that
02:13 paramat okay
02:13 hmmmm ouch
02:13 hmmmm PANIC: unprotected error in call to Lua API (not enough memory)
02:14 hmmmm my actual memory usage didn't ever go above 2gb though according to htop
02:14 hmmmm i wonder wth it's talking about
02:17 hmmmm ouch.  i just calculated that each 80x80x80 noise object costs about 5mb
02:18 paramat seems excessive..
02:18 hmmmm and a 300x300x300 noise object takes up 250 mb :D
02:19 hmmmm that's the tradeoff though, higher memory usage for much faster computation
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02:33 paramat about 10 bytes per node, maybe that is reasonable
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02:37 hmmmm now here are some interesting results
02:38 hmmmm the noise APIs with lua_createtable() is much slower than lua_newtable()
02:38 hmmmm s/is/are/
02:39 hmmmm and in fact, if i use createtable(), the flat versions of the LuaPerlinMap functions get slower than the array versions
02:40 hmmmm am guessing it has to do with the cache
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04:48 Zeno` lol
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05:24 neoascetic hi all. could #2638 please be merged ASAP?
05:24 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2638 -- Fix OSX build by coercing to uint32_t by neoascetic
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06:17 Zeno` https://github.com/minetest/minetest/b​lob/master/src/touchscreengui.cpp#L533
06:17 Zeno` I sometimes wonder how minetest even works
06:18 Zeno` it's magic
06:23 Zeno` sqrt(-20) yay
06:24 Zeno` it's fractal movement detection :-o
06:27 hmmmm why -20?
06:27 Zeno` just a random negative number I chose
06:27 Zeno` I liked 20
06:27 Zeno` -25
06:27 hmmmm eh
06:27 hmmmm that code looks pretty okay to me
06:28 Zeno` so sqrt(-25) is ok?
06:28 hmmmm i wish it weren't as verbose though
06:28 hmmmm why are you saying it's passing a negative number?
06:28 Zeno` that's the original code
06:28 hmmmm yeah but what's wrong with the distance calculation
06:28 Zeno` and I'm not... the user moving their finger is making a negative number
06:28 hmmmm how so
06:29 hmmmm :| ????
06:29 hmmmm the input to that function is always non-negative
06:29 Etzos No... n*n + m*m is always going to be positive...
06:29 Zeno` well this makes no sense
06:29 hmmmm it makes sense to me
06:29 Zeno` I added an if and debug output there and it was negative... wtf
06:30 hmmmm it's calculating the length of a line from where the touch input is and the position of the pointer
06:30 hmmmm lol
06:30 hmmmm hrmmmmmm...
06:30 Zeno` I've been trying to find out the '8' too much
06:30 Zeno` something very odd is going on
06:32 hmmmm humm
06:33 hmmmm trying to decide whether I should switch from std::set to std::vector for checking to see if a decoration/node/thing can be placed in a biome
06:34 hmmmm std::set with libc++ is faster than std::vector for n > 2.  it should be clear which is the winner, but the vast majority of real decoration definitions do use about one or two biomes
06:35 neoascetic I don't know is this "refactoring" good or bad: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/386d69533095a6f36d5c3a98f2cd8de20a0132d4
06:35 hmmmm why not?
06:36 hmmmm neoascetic, you messed up RUN_IN_PLACE for OS X in one of your commits
06:36 neoascetic https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/386d69533095a6f36d5c3a98f2cd8de20a0132d4​#diff-59f99d02fe5b328bb9a57b023497b5edL359 - why do we need this check on each platform?
06:36 neoascetic with this refactoring RUN_IN_PLACE doesn't work on OSX at all
06:36 hmmmm neoascetic, how is RUN_IN_PLACE supposed to work?
06:37 hmmmm you describe to me what the expected functionality is
06:37 neoascetic First, I've asked about it on the channel and get answer: RUN_IN_PLACE mean all stuff (worlds, saves etc) should be stored in app dir and not in global-wide user dir
06:38 neoascetic the problem is: minetest doesn't work on OSX if is not a bundle (.app)
06:38 hmmmm sure.  but what is your personal definition of the "app dir", and is this how you'd like it to work?
06:38 neoascetic minetest.app
06:39 neoascetic built with make install
06:39 Zeno` I don't understand this
06:39 hmmmm and are you saying that you cannot run the minetest executable mac OS X if it is not in the applications directory?
06:39 hmmmm with mac os x*
06:39 neoascetic nope, if it is not an .app bundle
06:40 neoascetic it may be placed anywhere
06:40 neoascetic but it should be an .app bundle
06:40 hmmmm should?
06:40 neoascetic must
06:40 hmmmm it's not though
06:40 hmmmm why
06:40 neoascetic I don't know, it simply doesn't work otherwise
06:40 hmmmm this doesn't make any sense.  you're telling me that on OSX, i cannot execute a file from any location
06:41 hmmmm but that's wrong, because I actually have an OSX vm and I just tried it
06:41 neoascetic what do you run?
06:41 neoascetic minetest.app?
06:41 neoascetic minetest executable under bin/ directory?
06:42 hmmmm the expected behavior for RUN_IN_PLACE is that you can run minetest inside of the exact directory structure as what exists in the repository
06:42 hmmmm yes, the minetest executable in the bin/ directory.
06:42 neoascetic ok, I'll try this
06:42 hmmmm you should be able to have [foobar@/home/foobar/minetest] ./bin/minetest  work just fine
06:42 neoascetic previously this didn't work
06:43 neoascetic maybe this refactoring fixes the issue
06:44 hmmmm well if there's an issue you should talk about what the issue is and why it's an issue for you
06:44 hmmmm maybe you might be doing something wrong
06:44 hmmmm maybe you don't understand what the feature is supposed to do
06:44 Zeno` ugh, is there any way to filter logcat?
06:45 hmmmm RUN_IN_PLACE makes it so that minetest assumes the location of user files such as worlds and assets such as image files is relative to the currently running executable
06:45 hmmmm with the same exact directory structure that exists in the source repository
06:46 hmmmm as far as I can tell, unless I'm gravely mistaken, your modifications do not do this.
06:46 neoascetic It is with the bundle approach - but path is different (../Resources/)
06:46 hmmmm right, well the path cannot be any different at all from the source repository
06:46 neoascetic it is for MSVC build
06:46 hmmmm there's a fixup for that
06:47 neoascetic Okay, I just run "cmake RUN_IN_PLACE=1 && make"
06:47 neoascetic open ./bin/minetest
06:47 neoascetic see the main screen
06:47 hmmmm why are you using "open"
06:47 hmmmm ??
06:48 neoascetic but keyboard doesn't work - all input goes to the background terminal window
06:48 hmmmm I don't know what that does but it probably isn't the right thing
06:48 neoascetic double click on ./bin/minetest, run ./bin/minetest from terminal
06:49 neoascetic minetest doesn't get keyboard input
06:49 neoascetic this the issue I talked about and faced with when did that commit
06:49 hmmmm and you deduced that the problem must be the paths themselves?
06:49 neoascetic it is something osx-related, minetest doesn't work well if it is run not from a bundle
06:49 neoascetic yep
06:49 hmmmm it's not
06:50 hmmmm that's not possible
06:50 hmmmm there's some other issue that can be worked around
06:50 neoascetic is input work for you ?
06:50 hmmmm i am building it right now
06:50 neoascetic previously I've found that issue gone if minetest is run from withing bundle directory structure
06:50 neoascetic I agree that this is hack
06:51 hmmmm well then
06:51 hmmmm I don't agree with hacks
06:51 Zeno` V/Minetest( 8550): 2015-04-20 16:50:07: ERROR[main]: distance sq. is -821888
06:51 Zeno` E/Minetest( 8550): distance sq. is -821888
06:51 Zeno` something must be overwriting it :/
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06:54 hmmmm oh
06:54 hmmmm neoascetic, you're runing cmake wrong
06:54 hmmmm I just noticed you ran cmake RUN_IN_PLACE=1
06:54 hmmmm you need to use cmake -DRUN_IN_PLACE=1
06:57 Zeno` how am I going to debug this when it's not even possible?
06:58 Zeno` http://dpaste.com/1D4ZPMW       <--- I've reverted to master and these are now my only changes
06:59 hmmmm \(O_o)/
06:59 Zeno` oops
06:59 hmmmm is it possible that event.TouchInput.ID is changing in another thread?
06:59 Zeno` no
06:59 Zeno` it's umm
07:00 Zeno` well I don't like to say
07:00 hmmmm bahahah
07:00 hmmmm oh god dammit
07:00 hmmmm i see what the problem is now
07:00 Zeno` I *told* you I've been looking at this too long :P
07:00 Zeno` move along, nothing to see here
07:00 hmmmm you didn't notice it?
07:00 Zeno` lmao
07:01 hmmmm did you figure it out?
07:01 Zeno` yeah of course
07:01 Zeno` I'd removed the parenthesis
07:01 hmmmm starts with the letter P
07:01 Zeno` <Zeno`> well I don't like to say
07:01 Zeno` but you made me say it anyway
07:01 Zeno` grr
07:02 hmmmm i didn't realize YOU removed the parentheses there in that code sample
07:02 Zeno` dammit
07:02 Zeno` can I just go to the corner
07:02 Zeno` just forget today ever happened
07:02 Zeno` haha
07:02 hmmmm wtf
07:02 hmmmm ctrl+f doesn't find in mac
07:03 hmmmm it does on every other operating system except mac
07:03 Zeno` yeah I may have removed the ' ' from around the 'f'
07:03 hmmmm I give up
07:03 hmmmm how do I search for a word on mac os x
07:03 Zeno` //
07:03 Zeno` ?
07:04 hmmmm ahhh
07:04 Zeno` /word
07:04 hmmmm weird symbol F
07:04 Zeno` lol
07:04 hmmmm you know the loops on the four corners of a square symbol
07:04 hmmmm except i don't have one
07:05 Zeno` I think I mapped that in my VM (somehow) once
07:05 Zeno` cannot remember how thoug
07:06 Etzos hmmmm: It's the Windows/meta key I believe.
07:06 hmmmm i wonder how i managed to get this compiled the last time
07:06 hmmmm etzos:  yea, thank you that worked :)
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07:10 neoascetic hmmmm cmd key is replacement for ctrl on mac
07:10 hmmmm what on earth
07:10 Zeno` well, I'd better have my nap now that I've made a complete fool of myself
07:10 hmmmm i tried to download a file in safari and then it logged me out
07:11 hmmmm it just werks(tm) my ass
07:11 neoascetic I run -DRUN_IN_PLACE=1 too
07:11 neoascetic Do you have problem I've described?
07:11 hmmmm i'm still building it
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07:51 neoascetic hmmmm ?
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07:56 Zeno` his computer must be slow
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08:07 neoascetic hmmmm http://irrlicht.sourceforge.ne​t/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36796
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08:45 neoascetic https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/93fcab952b28f4db39d9326b83f14cbd86c0cf17​#diff-af3b638bc2a3e6c650974192a53c7291L8
08:45 neoascetic Why Uppercase?
08:46 neoascetic And then PROJECT_NAME_LOWER almost everywhere
08:49 neoascetic I guess correct project name is still "minetest" instead of "Minetest", as it named on github
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09:32 Zeno` It should be lowercase
09:33 Zeno` uppercase is just... silly :)
09:34 neoascetic Zeno would you change this?
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10:04 neoascetic tell hmmmm https://github.com/minetest/minete​st/pull/1928#issuecomment-66501792
10:05 neoascetic `tell hmmmm https://github.com/minetest/minete​st/pull/1928#issuecomment-66501792
10:05 neoascetic oh well :(
10:10 neoascetic I don't know if creation of this Contents folder by cmake if RUN_IN_PLACE=1 would be a good workaround, but it definitely the easiest
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10:29 est31 what do you think, do we need a travis for mac OS?
10:30 neoascetic I already have one: https://travis-ci.org/neoascetic/minetest
10:30 neoascetic it need to be configured in tricky way since currently travis has no support for multiple OSes
10:31 est31 ?
10:31 est31 we build for both windows and linux
10:31 neoascetic I am not sure if it possible to make a cross-compilation for osx on linux
10:32 neoascetic builds for OSX on travis are done on real macs
10:32 neoascetic (or virtual, it doesn't matter)
10:32 est31 ah
10:33 neoascetic it is possible of course to implement async way to trigger OSX build, but it is tricky anyway (altrough I would be happy to have it)
10:34 est31 http://docs.travis-ci.com/user/multi-os/
10:35 est31 "We are at capacity with Mac workers in both .org and .com environments. Consequently, we are not accepting requests for the multi-OS feature at this time."
10:35 est31 so it seems they don't want it.
10:35 neoascetic yeh, that's why workaround
10:35 est31 I guess its apple who doesn't license them
10:35 neoascetic I am building agains master only
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10:36 neoascetic It *is* possible for each PR but I guess we don't want to insult Travis
10:36 est31 yeah
10:37 neoascetic here my .travis.yml if you are interested: https://github.com/neoascetic/m​inetest/blob/builds/.travis.yml
10:37 neoascetic with cron, I simply merging master with my "builds" branch
10:39 est31 there are 20 times more linux builds for travis than mac
10:48 est31 does mac even have a sever OS?
10:48 est31 what does apple themselves do?
10:49 neoascetic Yeah, there are some server variations of OSX
10:49 est31 do they have these super designed boxes in their data centers, or some form of racks?
10:51 est31 http://www.sonnettech.com/publicfiles/mov​ies/xmacminiserverconfig4/xmacminiserverc​onfig4.hyperesources/xmacminiserver2a.png
10:51 est31 as it seems there is no other way ...
10:51 neoascetic https://www.apple.com/osx/server/
10:51 est31 http://www.sonnettech.com/publicfiles/movie​s/xmacminiserverconfig4/xmacminiserverconfi​g4.hyperesources/xmacminiserber2a-back2.png
10:52 neoascetic bullshit, as for me :)
10:52 est31 yes but that is running server services on a desktop computer, no?
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10:53 est31 I mean, if you want to run servers with mac, then you don't want those screens and so on
10:53 est31 only servers, with a network port
10:53 neoascetic I guess no, something like Windows Server
10:54 est31 neoascetic, where do you read that BSD is affected?
10:54 neoascetic GUI over network maybe
10:54 est31 windows servers can be installed on basically any "normal" rack server
10:54 neoascetic because of this switch https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/2627/​files#diff-95e351a3805a1dafa85bf20b81d086e6R262
10:54 neoascetic how does this worked before?
10:54 est31 but mac has requirements on the hardware, hasn't it?
10:54 neoascetic idk
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10:55 neoascetic it should be a mac :)
10:55 neoascetic so I guess is not possible to install it anywhere else (except hackintosh)
10:56 est31 yea
10:56 * est31 wonders if apple data centers are full of mac minis
11:00 est31 http://www.datacenterknowledge.​com/the-apple-data-center-faq/
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11:31 kilbith celeron55, is there a reason why http://www.minetest.net/download (and /mods /texturepacks, etc.) are empty ?
11:38 est31 /servers too
11:39 neoascetic I hope we will switch to github pages one day
11:39 est31 why is it currently bad?
11:40 neoascetic No control via source code
11:40 neoascetic Impossible fix something without server holder
11:40 kilbith and free i guess
11:40 est31 that is a point
11:40 est31 I guess celeron55 has to pay for the server
12:06 est31 ShadowNinja, any plans to commit https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commi​t/ac1f6d6f3b6abf0693b22376fe222a1e3c54a0b7 ?
12:06 est31 (as in push)
12:06 est31 then #1631 can be closed
12:06 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1631 -- Change mod rating field name to "value" in mmdb JSON parser by kahrl
12:06 est31 and #1629 too
12:06 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1629 -- The minetest client does not use the mmdb api correctly
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12:26 neoascetic mod STORE is a bad name for DB :)
12:28 celeron55 wut
12:28 celeron55 since when did those go empty
12:30 celeron55 this doesn't make any sense; fuck dokuwiki
12:32 celeron55 the page *is* there, for whatever reason dokuwiki has just decided not to show it, nor show any history of it to me
12:34 celeron55 okay i cleared the cache and it works
12:34 celeron55 probably has something to do with the server running out of disk space in /var........
12:34 celeron55 (i'm still setting it up)
12:35 celeron55 i mean, not setting up www.minetest.net, it's done already but setting up other things that the server runs
12:40 celeron55 github pages doesn't sound like a half bad idea but as i don't have any experience of it i don't know if it would actually work
12:40 celeron55 i'm not going to make it happen; someone else will have to
12:41 neoascetic I can do this, I just need mockups
12:41 neoascetic Github pages is simple static hosting
12:42 neoascetic Yes, it is possible to add site generation with Jekyll but this is not required (and not needed atm)
12:49 celeron55 well if there is any dynamic content, it can be hosted elsewhere and loaded to the page using client-side scripts like the server list
12:50 celeron55 i would like to see a different page layout and slightly different style; copying the current dokuwiki template isn't a good idea
12:52 neoascetic I am a bad designer. Do we have one?
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13:58 celeron55 dunno really; if i was to design it, i'd put a real minetest screenshot behind the page and have a page kind of like the current www.minetest.net on top of it, but with a wider layout (eg. possibly include the minetestcommune twitter feed in there somewhere to use the space)
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17:32 Krock ..\..\minetest\src\mg_decoration.cpp(314): error C2039: '{ctor}': Is no element of 'Decoration'
17:35 * Krock calls hmmmm
17:38 Krock Solved by copying the code from Decoration::Decoration() - better soulation is required.
17:44 hmmmm very odd
17:44 hmmmm what platform is taht?
17:48 Krock That's Win 5.1 MSVC
17:50 hmmmm what version of msvc i mean
17:52 Krock The CXX compiler identification is MSVC 16.0.30319.1
17:52 rubenwardy What do you guys think about SSH support for Minetest?
17:53 rubenwardy It could be used from PHP control panels, etc
17:54 Krock Run Build Command:"c:/WINDOWS/Microsoft.NET/​Framework/v4.0.30319/MSBuild.exe" (if required)
17:54 Krock rubenwardy, you want to control SSH or what?
17:54 rubenwardy huh?
17:55 Krock nvm
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18:30 sfan5 <rubenwardy> What do you guys think about SSH support for Minetest?
18:31 sfan5 literally no other application does that
18:31 rubenwardy What should would do instead to allow server admins to execute commands on a server? IRC is a bit overkill for that
18:31 rubenwardy s/would/we/
18:32 Calinou add a command shell.
18:32 Calinou like Minecraft had since… 2009
18:32 rubenwardy You mean actually on the terminal?
18:32 Calinou yes
18:33 Calinou so you can input commands through SSH or console
18:33 rubenwardy How would you send commands from PHP?
18:33 sfan5 popen?
18:34 rubenwardy How would that work? Using some sort of async input method?
18:34 rubenwardy for the terminal
18:34 rubenwardy std::cin blocks, afaik
18:34 sfan5 popen gives you a file you can read an write from
18:35 sfan5 (for stdin and stdout)
18:35 sfan5 also there's this thing called select()
18:36 rubenwardy Do it, then
18:37 jin_xi https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/1737 and shell on computer mod ;)
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20:54 hmmmm where did neoasethic go
20:54 hmmmm irrlicht's build on osx is failing
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22:38 est31 https://twitter.com/githubsta​tus/status/590281705967243264
22:38 est31 dammit
22:39 est31 I was writing a comment.

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