Time Nick Message 00:10 kilbith sapier, tested your fixes. 1.0 scaling (still too big) : https://mediacru.sh/5d8b9692bfbb 00:11 kilbith at 0.85, the GUI scaling is nice (should be set by default) but the fonts still too skinny : https://mediacru.sh/04d769827be2 00:14 sapier don't bother to do any testing kilbith I'm already about to revert it 00:14 kilbith hmm no, i revert what i said. At 800x600 resolution and 0.85, the GUI scaling is not OK : https://mediacru.sh/GN_fmixLJCvy 00:14 sapier I'll switch android port to a new improved interpreter and you pc only guys can do what you want on it I don't care any longer 00:14 ShadowNinja sapier: GUI scaling is fine. Font scaling just has to be static. 00:15 sapier You can fix it later I'm tired about having everyone tell different things 00:15 sapier btw I already reverted this part about 6h ago it still wasn't enough 00:15 kilbith the chat bug seems to be fixed, though 00:15 sapier that's been when I decided it's not worth continueing 00:15 ShadowNinja sapier: Are fonts scaled to points now? 00:16 ShadowNinja If so, it should be fine now. 00:16 sapier read logs sfan5 still wasn't ok with it at all 00:17 ShadowNinja I'll check it myself soon. 00:17 ShadowNinja sapier: I noticed that I can't select servers in your latest android build. 00:18 ShadowNinja Quick fix or should I make an issue? 00:18 sapier don't waste your time I'm switching pc version back to old broken version, of course everyone will be free to use the fixed interpreter there too but only android will default to it 00:19 sapier I don't know I'm gonna handle it once I completed the formspec rollback 00:19 ShadowNinja Just disable it in the non-Android build for now. 00:20 sapier it's not a feature you can disable 00:20 ShadowNinja sapier: #ifdef __ANDROID__ 00:20 sapier it's a major modification to positioning and I'm not gonna mix up both stypes of positioning 00:21 sapier pc formspecs would still react to dpi, a thing they didn't on 0.4.9 00:21 sapier so the only way to get identical result is switching everything back to old code 00:24 ShadowNinja sapier: I thought you said it was needed for Android. 00:24 sapier that's why I'm gonna place the fixed interpreter in parallel 00:24 ShadowNinja sapier: With ifdefs? 00:24 sapier no 00:24 ShadowNinja sapier: How then? 00:24 sapier I'm gonna use the formspec version 00:25 sapier version 2xxx will be automatically routed to new interpreter 00:25 ShadowNinja Er, that's a server-side server-wide field. 00:25 sapier well it is now 00:25 sapier if you don't agree to this I can just add a new field formspec_type=interpreterv2 00:26 sapier or interpreter_version 00:26 ShadowNinja sapier: I'm not entirely convinced that this can't be done without breaking everything. 00:27 sapier it can be done it's less work then continuing to try to make everyone happy as I don't longer believe this task is possible at all 00:28 ShadowNinja sapier: Anyway, do you know of any other GUI description languages that we can implement? HTML would be good because it's pretty complete, but I don't know if that's even possible with Irrlicht. 00:29 sapier ShadowNinja even if I did know I'm tired about discussing this topic any serious attempt to rewrite formspec will cost about 4 weeks of fulltime develomplent and then everyone will be against it 00:31 sapier and html is still only half of it you need event processing ... at least html form handling design would match our current way of handling forms 00:32 ShadowNinja sapier: Just provide a PR / pull and wait a bit before you do anything drastic. HTML seems like a huge ammount of work, if it's even doable. 00:33 ezraanderson not sure how complicated it is, but is it possible to FOB the gui objects to a static size 1280x720 then scale it accordingly. I however think its a non-issue and scaling seems fine the way it is 00:34 sapier I'm gonna provide the pull reverting and moving androud to own interpreter ... that's gonna be my last pull for formspec (maybe except of the android part) 00:34 ShadowNinja Idea: give client-side Lua wrappers around Irrlicht's GUI functions and have it generate forms itself. 00:34 sapier I don't understand how this is supposed to help? 00:34 ShadowNinja That way you don't have to cache formspecs in node meta. 00:34 ShadowNinja sapier: No hacky GUI language. 00:34 sapier sounds like "client theme" to me 00:35 ShadowNinja It will still have scaling issues though. 00:35 sapier it's even more hacky as you'd have to keep bothe consistent theme engine as well as formspec engine 00:35 sapier well we can discuss this once I completed my current task 02:33 sapier ShadowNinja: I'm gonna have to split simple and mainmenu completely again as the formspecs for them will require different positions 02:46 sapier https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/2096 02:46 sapier back to 0.4.9 02:46 hmmmm well hey 02:46 sapier I' mgonna fix android once this is merged 02:47 hmmmm i don't see why you need to revert the entire thing to make formspec scaling work the way it used to 02:47 sapier incompatible to current formspec engine but with consistent positioning 02:47 sapier I'm not gonna add compatibility code there but just cut off all ancient things 02:48 hmmmm oh nevermind 02:48 hmmmm i thought you got rid of fontengine which i liked a lot 02:48 sapier hmmmm it's just impossible to make it scale as before but fix the issue "it's not scaling" 02:48 sapier 0.4.9 contained hardcoded offsets and position dependencys to font size 02:48 hmmmm hrmmm 02:48 sapier it's simply not possible to fix this without having to change the formspecs 02:49 hmmmm I'm personally ok with breaking compatibility here 02:49 hmmmm the next version, whatever that may be, i guess could be an era of new stuff that lacks compatibility but works properly with no hacks 02:50 sapier we could get close but obviously close will never be close enough for a couple of ppl so let them have their own broken thing and do a new correct version used on android only ... at least for the time beeing 02:50 sapier no hmmm I'm not gonna put any effort in pc formspec code 02:51 sapier I'm gonna do it right for android but I wont touch the regular mainmenu stuff 02:51 sapier if I did I was in exactly same fight I'm right now 04:49 paramat yes i really like the new fonts, i hope we keep them, nicely defined instead of fuzzy and rounded as they were before 05:36 VanessaE jesus fuck. how hard is it to just make formspecs behave like a regular GUI would? fonts specified in points, some default size that's similar to 0.4.9, fixed size across the board by default unless a mod explicitly requests a larger size, and not dependent on window size? 05:37 VanessaE G*d this is two days in a row I've missed out on this huge-ass argument 05:37 VanessaE (and both times, someone highlighted me at some point) 05:41 Zeno` You sleep too much, you miss out on the action :P 05:41 VanessaE I was watching movies. 05:56 Zeno` ShadowNinja, how is #2099 related to 2095? 05:56 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2099 -- server flag icons dont show 05:57 Zeno` Oh, you mean 2095 might fix the issue (after incorporating your comment)? 05:57 ShadowNinja Zeno`: Both involve missing minetest.formspec_escape with paths. 05:58 Zeno` yes I understand now. I thought you meant 2095 caused it. My bad 05:58 ShadowNinja The PR has to be extended to the other images too though. 05:58 Zeno` yeah 06:02 VanessaE hmmmm: we have a serious mapgen problem 06:03 VanessaE I've seen at least two reports of this: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/Screenshot%20-%2001102015%20-%2001%3a03%3a25%20AM.png 06:03 VanessaE and now it's happening on MY server also 06:03 VanessaE there is NO code in any of my mods that can possibly do this 06:04 VanessaE (except for the trees and plants on the top, those had to be added after the "corrupt" blocks were generated) 06:04 hmmmm that looks pretty interesting 06:04 hmmmm fun is the word 06:05 hmmmm i've done nothing that could result in that sort of thing. but it looks like out-of-bounds memory access at first glance 06:06 hmmmm sorry .. i have not seen anything like this 06:06 Zeno` it's... strange 06:08 VanessaE hmmmm: yeah you have, 06:08 VanessaE you showed me a screenshot the other day 06:08 hmmmm ? 06:08 VanessaE diagonal "stripes" of blocks running through the corrupt block 06:08 VanessaE s/blocks/nodes/ 06:08 hmmmm that was like a month ago 06:08 VanessaE maybe a month ago then - this isn't an up-to-date build, it's a bit old, fairly close to 0.4.11 06:09 hmmmm that wasn't an existing bug, it was a laughably failed attempt at adding write-without-read LuaVoxelManip functionality 06:09 VanessaE well this looks exactly like that screenshot you showed. 06:09 hmmmm i thought the pattern it made was neat so I pasted it. that code never made it into minetest 06:09 hmmmm so i uploaded and pasted a link to it* 06:10 VanessaE right 06:10 hmmmm s/pasted/posted/ 06:10 VanessaE I wonder if what you saw is indicative of something you *weren't* working on, but merely uncovered? 06:10 Zeno` Another screenshot of the same area but from above: http://i.imgur.com/0adAW4s.jpg 06:11 hmmmm no, it wasn't at all. that is completely unrelated to what you're seeing. 06:11 VanessaE ok 06:11 hmmmm what would be very helpful is measuring the dimensions of the messed up part, and the coordinates 06:11 VanessaE sure, one moment. 06:11 hmmmm in that second screenshot i can tell it's a mapblock wide but no clue on the rest of it 06:12 VanessaE one corner is at ~10016,78,174 06:12 VanessaE opposite to that is ~9967,63,144 06:12 VanessaE that's for the one that is on the right in my screenshot, left in zeno's 06:12 hmmmm what's the ~ for 06:13 VanessaE approximate - the corners contain a lot of air 06:13 VanessaE lemme see if I can narrow it down 06:13 hmmmm so i'll assume you actually meant 9968 06:14 hmmmm and i think you're wrong about the y dimension 06:14 VanessaE hold, I'll use worldedit to get the exact coords. 06:14 VanessaE there. 9968,64,144 to 10015,80,175 06:15 paramat weird 8) 06:15 VanessaE there's a 1-node variation at the top, might be from mudflow 06:15 hmmmm well the bottom corner is accurate at least 8) 06:15 hmmmm so that's 48x16x32 06:15 hmmmm 3x1x2 06:16 VanessaE no 06:16 hmmmm yeah, beats me.. 06:16 VanessaE at least 2 mapblocks thick 06:16 hmmmm =/ 06:16 hmmmm 80 - 64 = 16, 16 is one mapblock 06:16 hmmmm don't know how to say it any other way 06:16 hmmmm that's one mapblock 06:16 VanessaE hm, you're right, I miscounted 06:16 VanessaE so yeah 3x1x2 06:17 hmmmm those aren't the right dimensions for being a mapchunk border issue 06:17 VanessaE the other section seems to be 3x1x1 06:17 hmmmm hmm 06:18 hmmmm wonder if this is a mod issue 06:18 VanessaE I don't see how, there are no mods on this server that can create terrain like this 06:18 VanessaE (and plantlife only adds stuff on top of e.g. dirt with grass, as you saw in the screenshot) 06:19 paramat no wonder that tower block is flying with all those rotor blades 06:19 VanessaE paramat: haha 06:19 Zeno` lol 06:20 VanessaE worldedit's //inspect command can't identify the "unknown" nodes in the chunk composed thereof 06:20 VanessaE nor are they identified in the F5 display 06:20 hmmmm yes... because it's garbage data 06:21 VanessaE it's impossible for a mod to write this stuff even *with* a vmanip, isn't it? 06:21 hmmmm that's what i'm trying to figure out right now 06:21 VanessaE ok 06:21 hmmmm obviously it's not impossible because a mod can write anything they want to the vmanip 06:22 VanessaE if it matters, nodes within the mess that produce light are correctly lighted 06:22 hmmmm but it's not possible that the memory is allocated without being initialized in the vmanip 06:23 VanessaE pieces of this were copied from elsewhere on the map, I recognize part of it 06:23 hmmmm well i really can't come to any conclusions at this point. 06:24 VanessaE there are centrifuges here with teleport tubes already connected, this particular configuration is something I know cheapie built near the server's spawn 06:24 VanessaE (it's not something any mod can generate, it has to be hand-placed) 06:26 hmmmm well like i said, that's garbage data 06:26 VanessaE fair enough 06:26 hmmmm it's not unheard of that some of the garbage data it read happened to be leftover from mapblocks it previously had allocated there 06:26 hmmmm i don't think it's significant 06:27 paramat hopefully a very rare but cool occurence, adds interest to a world 06:27 VanessaE ok. safe to nuke it then? 06:27 hmmmm yeah 06:27 VanessaE all right 06:27 hmmmm the only really important details I can get from this are: 06:28 hmmmm - it's probably a voxelmanipulator related issue, not a mapgen issue 06:28 hmmmm - it's not related to map chunk borders 06:28 hmmmm - it's uninitialized data or data read out of bounds 07:05 kahrl uh, what is #2099 about 07:06 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2099 -- server flag icons dont show 07:06 kahrl image_column clearly calls formspec_escape so I don't get it 07:07 hmmmm hrmm, what is the correct way to use FontEngine::getTextWidth() on a wide string 07:08 kahrl hmmmm: what do you mean? > const std::wstring& text 07:08 hmmmm ahhh stupid IDE 07:08 hmmmm that helps 07:12 paramat please could someone review my new PR #2103 ? 07:12 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2103 -- Lua-api.txt: Document that paramtype=light is essential for a light source to spread its light by paramat 07:15 Zeno` The value stores light with and without sun in its upper and lower 4 bits *respectively*. 07:19 Zeno` looks ok to me, apart from the it's/its that kahrl mentioned, and my above comment 07:26 paramat okay will update PR soon 12:07 Zeno` will merge #2102 soon 12:07 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2102 -- Performance fixes. by onkrot 12:08 sapier veto 12:08 sapier it'S gonna collide to formspec font reversion and applying it the other way round is way less work 12:08 Zeno` oh, it conflicts? 12:09 sapier of course whole guiFormspecMenu.cpp is reverted back to 0.4.9 state 12:09 Zeno` yes, of course. ok 12:09 Zeno` but is the font reversion going ahead? 12:09 sapier I can't apply this reversion on top of your new changes but it's almost fine the other way round 12:10 Zeno` They're not my changes :) 12:10 sapier I'm quite sure because I wont continue discussing to all of you guys so live with your broken 0.4.9 way 12:10 sapier android will use the new v2 interpreter I'm preparing right now 12:11 sapier and no it's not gonna be compatible nor will I add any compatibility code there 12:11 Zeno` man, we didn't mean that it should be abandoned completely 12:13 Zeno` I've been so tired lately it's not funny, otherwise I would have been looking at the (current) font code myself to give you constructive suggestions 12:14 Zeno` I dunno. Although I am very opposed to how things currently are I am also kind of opposed to "throwing code away" 12:53 sapier it's not only you Zeno`except of celeron who does require the fixed formspecs for android too not a single one supporting the fix is there. I'm not throwing the code away I'm just moving it in parallel to get rid of this discussion. 12:56 sapier well except of zenos font scale fixes I didn't ever like that part but accepted it for compatibility reasons ... later one are gone now so no reason to keep it 12:56 sapier -zeno + zefram 13:12 Guest66066 is it okay if I ping celeron 13:51 apdap CMakeFiles\minetest.dir\objects.a(serialization.cpp.obj)serialization.cpp|| undefined reference to `deflate'| 13:51 nore sfan5, what do you think about _game #396? 13:51 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/396 -- /kill [player] command 13:51 apdap anyone? 13:51 apdap nore, i like the idea 13:52 apdap what about /kick too 13:52 sfan5 apdap: nore was talking about https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/396 13:52 apdap I see 13:53 apdap I'm having issues with zlib stuff, 'deflate' even though it's all linked correctly, can anyone send me their .cbp or whatever? 13:53 sfan5 nore: looks good; can you merge it? (BlockMen has not been there since months, I think we currently need to continue dev. w/o him) 13:53 sfan5 apdap: whats the exact problem? 13:53 apdap undefined reference to `deflate'| 13:53 apdap i had that with gettext too so I removed it 13:54 nore sfan5, btw: what about allowing another dev or two? 13:54 kilbith (yes yes yes) 13:54 sfan5 nore: i have nothing against that but the question is who? 13:54 sfan5 apdap: windows or linux? 13:54 apdap windows 13:55 sfan5 where did you acquire gettext and zlib? 13:55 nore sfan5, I'd say perhaps SN or PA for dev, paramat for mapgen-related things, and kilbith for texturing 13:55 Zeno` sfan5, I don't consider the user name "salt" heheh 13:56 sfan5 Zeno`: maybe it's pepper then ;) 13:56 Zeno` paprika maybe 13:56 apdap sfan5, i don't remember, i did it some days ago, filename "gettext-0.14.4.exe" and "gettext-0.14.4-src.zip" 13:56 apdap and zlib-1.2.5.tar.gz 13:56 apdap i think I got gettext in source forge 13:56 sfan5 apdap: can you try using the libraries the official windows builds use? 13:56 sfan5 apdap: I'll give you a link 13:57 sfan5 nore: PilzAdam for dev and paramat for mapgen things would be a good first addition 13:58 apdap paragenv7 perhaps? 13:58 apdap it's pretty cool IMO, 13:58 sfan5 nah, we won't be integrating a lua mapgen into minetest_game 13:58 nore kilbith does really good texturing too (and it looks like we almost always merged his PRs) 13:58 kilbith well, i'm not sure textures needs a submaintainer 13:59 kilbith Pilz & paramat should be sufficient enough 13:59 sfan5 apdap: 32-bit: https://sfan5.pf-control.de/zlib-1.2.8-win32.zip and https://sfan5.pf-control.de/gettext-0.14.4.zip 13:59 Zeno` there is mapgen stuff in minetest_game now? 13:59 nore about mapgen, perhaps mapgen v7/v5 could be made default for mt_game 14:00 apdap sfan5, is there any benefit in trying compiling it in 64 bits? 14:00 nore Zeno`, yep, biomes defs for v5/7, but I'm not sure snow biomes exist in v6 14:00 sfan5 apdap: 64-bit: https://sfan5.pf-control.de/zlib-1.2.8-win64.zip and https://sfan5.pf-control.de/gettext-0.18.2-win64.zip 14:00 sfan5 apdap: it could be faster with 64-bit 14:00 sfan5 nore: v7 is not stable enough 14:00 apdap okay then 14:00 nore and v5? 14:01 sfan5 dunno about v5 14:01 sfan5 it would make sense to at least have biome defs for v5 in _game 14:01 Zeno` v5 has too much floating stuff 14:01 nore I thought v7 was going to be frozen and continue to be developed as v8 14:01 apdap btw, why is the jump gravity so weird? 14:01 sfan5 in short: we support v5, but it's not default 14:01 sfan5 how about that? 14:01 sfan5 apdap: what do you mean by "so weird"? 14:02 sfan5 nore: iirc hmmmm hasn't decided on that yet 14:02 apdap the gravity seems to be weird? i don't know how to explain really 14:02 sfan5 nore: anyway, can you merge _game 396? 14:02 Zeno` apdap, there is no terminal velocity afaik 14:02 kilbith so you're agree about PA & paramat in the _game team, guys ? 14:06 apdap is there any benefit with compiling with luajit instead of lua? better speed? 14:06 apdap i'm using the normal lua lib to compile 14:06 sfan5 apdap: if you use luajit mods run faster, lua mapgens benefit from this the most 14:07 apdap ok 14:07 apdap Zeno`, should I open a feature request on that in github or is it already being worked? 14:13 nore sfan5, yep, doing it 14:14 nore sfan5, btw, what about those from #390 to #395? 14:14 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/390 -- Repeated right clicking when holding the right mouse button by Jeija 14:14 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/395 -- Config file on XDG dir on Linux 14:14 apdap i still get CMakeFiles\minetest.dir\objects.a(l_mainmenu.cpp.obj)l_mainmenu.cpp|| undefined reference to `__imp_libintl_gettext'| 14:17 apdap is it a cmake problem? 14:18 sfan5 nore: #390 yes, #391 looks not ready, #392 yes, #393 yes, #395 will need more review 14:18 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/390 -- Repeated right clicking when holding the right mouse button by Jeija 14:18 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/391 -- add lua api call to force save of settings to config file by sapier 14:18 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/392 -- Fixed two typos in commit 615fd498bc by dannydark 14:18 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/393 -- Conductive blocks/nodes 14:18 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/395 -- Config file on XDG dir on Linux 14:18 sfan5 apdap: are you linking to libintl 14:18 sfan5 ShadowBot: ಠ_ಠ14:18 apdap sfan5, http://i.imgur.com/R9spQQ5.png 14:19 nore ah, about #395, I have not checked the code yet, but from what I've seen in the comments, it is probably more efficient than #200 I created 14:19 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/395 -- Config file on XDG dir on Linux 14:19 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/200 -- clouds appear in front of water 14:20 nore ShadowNinja, could you please change ShadowBot so that it links to the moste recently updated PR between _game and mt please? 14:20 sfan5 apdap: the lua vars are only for luajit, they don't support using standard lua installations 14:21 Zeno` libintl.dll.a? 14:21 sfan5 apdap: you can also see that in the output below "LuaJIT not found, using bundled Lua." 14:21 apdap can I force them anyways? 14:21 apdap and what is the problem in cmake? i sent the screenshot 14:22 apdap no idea what might be wrong 14:22 sfan5 i don't see any problem 14:22 sfan5 it seems correct 14:22 Zeno` libintl.dll.a is correct? 14:22 apdap i downloaded it from sfan5 14:22 sfan5 apdap: yes, you can force an external lua if you edit some stuff in the cmake files 14:22 sfan5 Zeno`: yes 14:23 sfan5 apdap: there are other incorrect things 14:23 sfan5 apdap: IRRLICHT_LIBRARY needs to be the .dll.a or .a file for irrlicht 14:23 sfan5 apdap: and you can ignore IRRLICHT_SOURCE_DIR 14:25 sfan5 apdap: try looking at this page: http://dev.minetest.net/CMake_Options 14:25 apdap thx 14:26 apdap sfan5, i saw it now 14:26 apdap gettext is all correct but it doesnt work 14:26 apdap aw 14:27 sfan5 what if you build without gettext 14:27 apdap yeah 14:27 apdap but I thought gettext would be pretty usefu 14:27 apdap s/usefu/useful 14:27 sfan5 thats correct 14:28 apdap i don't have dll.a in my irrlicht folder 14:28 apdap dll.a files* 14:28 sfan5 http://sprunge.us/VOdO?diff <<< pushing this in 5 minutes 14:29 sfan5 apdap: where did you download irrlicht 14:29 apdap http://sourceforge.net/projects/irrlicht/files/Irrlicht%20SDK/1.7/1.7.3/irrlicht-1.7.3.zip/download?use_mirror=ufpr 14:29 apdap I think 14:29 sfan5 does that contain .lib files? 14:31 apdap only for win32-visualstudio 14:34 apdap i'll try to find a full release 14:35 sfan5 apdap: http://sfan5.pf-control.de/irrlicht-1.8.1-win32.zip 14:43 nore sfan5, what about the cleanup PR too (#376 IIRC) ? 14:43 nore should be merged before it gets unmergeable 14:45 kilbith game#376 14:45 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/issues/376 -- More cleanup by PilzAdam 14:45 nore oops, sorry, forgot to close the prs :( 14:45 apdap CMakeFiles\minetest.dir\objects.a(content_cao.cpp.obj)content_cao.cpp|| undefined reference to `__imp__ZN3irr5video16IdentityMaterialE'| 14:45 apdap https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=10468 14:45 apdap is this related 14:45 nore kilbith: O.O... this works? 14:46 apdap uhh I just wanted to ask if you just could zip out your jenkins auto build folder or anything that you use so it's easier, lol 14:46 kilbith yes, game#number 14:46 sfan5 nore: yep, merge that 14:47 nore btw, I wanted to add advanced versions of the grow_* functions (those used in mg, precisely for lua mapgens), thoughts on it? 14:47 Krock the old tree growing function would be nice 14:50 nore ... I was copying all the commits ids... 15:23 apdap sfan5, can you send me all of the libs and the cbp files if you use codeblock. i'm tired of trying to solve it 15:23 * VanessaE looks in 15:23 sfan5 apdap: I'm not using codeblocks 15:23 apdap all the libs is enough then :P 15:23 sfan5 sure 15:23 apdap zip them up please 15:27 sfan5 apdap: http://meow.minetest.net/mtlibs-2015_01-win32.zip 15:46 apdap LuaJIT found, checking for broken versions... then LuaJIT not found 15:46 apdap hmm 15:46 apdap should I ignore? 15:49 sfan5 apdap: what did you set LUA_LIBRARY and LUA_INCLUDE_DIR to? 15:49 apdap luajit/include 15:50 apdap libluajit.a 15:50 sfan5 can you paste the output 15:51 apdap http://pastebin.com/2bVjx6bz 15:52 sfan5 it think your luajit is broken for some reason 15:53 sfan5 did you set CODEBLOCKS_EXECUTABLE? 15:54 apdap yes 15:55 sfan5 hm 15:55 sfan5 maybe cmake does not support src code compilation the the config stage with codeblocks 15:55 sfan5 just ignore that for now 15:56 Zeno` another screenshot of cmake-gui, please? 15:57 apdap http://i.imgur.com/LgUqsiJ.png 15:57 Zeno` scroll up? 15:58 apdap http://i.imgur.com/HNINFhX.png 15:58 apdap http://i.imgur.com/1A5dUPQ.png 15:58 apdap http://i.imgur.com/Mp44G3B.png 15:59 Zeno` cmake is not using a cache is it? 16:01 apdap Zeno`, no idea. 16:02 apdap CMakeCache.txt? 16:02 Zeno` check ?/minetest/minetest and make sure there a no files there that should not be 16:02 Zeno` yeah delete that 16:03 Zeno` normally I would build binaries in a different directory to the source directory (to solve these kind of potential problems you just delete the build directory and run cmake again) 16:04 Zeno` I don't know if this is your issue though ;) 16:04 Krock I wonder why you use MinGW 16:05 Zeno` Krock, code::blocks I imagine 16:06 Zeno` apdap, after you delete those cache files run cmake again (of course) 16:06 Zeno` also delete the .cbp file (or whatever it's called) 16:07 apdap Zeno`, it regens everytime you generate a new one 16:07 Zeno` yeah, just trying to get back to a "clean" state ;) 16:08 apdap delete anything that starts with CMake or Cpack? 16:08 apdap and Makefiles? 16:08 Zeno` err not really 16:08 Zeno` anything that is not in the original repo 16:14 Zeno` and change the "where to build the binaries". It makes life much simpler 16:19 kilbith nore, this commit : https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/commit/047bfb9 is in couple with #2036 16:19 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2036 -- Builtin: Remove builtin_biome.lua if my simple biome is added to MTgame (MTG pull 392) by paramat 16:20 kilbith "paramat : If added Minetest pull 2036 should be merged to remove the builtin biome." 16:20 nore yep, I know (see paramat's comment on #2036) 16:20 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2036 -- Builtin: Remove builtin_biome.lua if my simple biome is added to MTgame (MTG pull 392) by paramat 16:20 kilbith hmmmm ^ 16:20 kilbith it's up to you 16:21 VanessaE mt_game got said biomes all right, and I brought them into dreambuilder also. 16:25 Zeno` preparing to merge #2102 16:25 ShadowBot https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/2102 -- Performance fixes. by onkrot 16:26 Zeno` speaketh now or forever be silent :) 16:29 sfan5 Zeno`: didn't sapier say that conflicts with something 16:29 sapier I did 16:29 Zeno` I want to block him merging his PR :) 16:30 sfan5 also what is "preparing to merge" 16:30 Zeno` Because I don't think reverting all you did, sapier, is necessary at all 16:30 VanessaE sapier: saying it'll block your reversion of the font stuff isn't a good enough reason to veto, imho 16:30 sapier well I'm gonna tell you once anyone of you merges something making me work additional hours to revert it I'm gonna merge the reverte immediatly once it's rebased 16:31 VanessaE sapier: don't revert, just *fix* it 16:31 Zeno` Does it really cause a conflict anyway? 16:31 VanessaE pixels = points/72*DPI ... how hard it is to set every font rendered to this? 16:31 sapier ok in this case I'm gonna merge it in a few minutes because It's plain impossible to "fix" what different guys believe has to be fixed 16:32 sapier I can't make a font smaller and bigger same time ... sorry I just can't do this 16:32 VanessaE sapier: you refuse to listen to us 16:32 Zeno` sapier, why "waste" all your good work when it can (IMO) be fixed? 16:32 VanessaE read me again: 16:32 VanessaE pixels = points/72* 16:32 VanessaE oops 16:32 VanessaE pixels = points/72*DPI 16:32 VanessaE that's IT. 16:32 VanessaE all of it. 16:32 sfan5 VanessaE: s/IT/it/ 16:33 sapier that's what already is implemented 16:33 VanessaE sfan5: emphasis. 16:33 VanessaE sapier: clearly it isn't. 16:33 sapier well it is 16:33 VanessaE sapier: if it were, fonts wouldn't change size with window size 16:33 sapier I already removed the autfontscaling for larger formspecs 16:33 sfan5 VanessaE: emphasis is _it_ or using the bold text built into irc 16:34 sapier they don't do change size any longer vanessae 16:34 Zeno` bold text is not part of the original IRC RFC 16:34 Zeno` from 1921 16:34 Zeno` so I won't use it 16:34 VanessaE sapier: let me check again. my last pull was one or two days ago and it was still broken then 16:34 VanessaE well 2 or 3 days 16:35 Zeno` hang on. If it's no longer broken why are you reverting it? 16:35 sapier the only thing changing the font size is dpi and gui_scaling factor but that's obviously not enough so I just don't se where I am supposed to change additional things 16:35 VanessaE sapier: stop. okay? just stop 16:35 sapier because sfan5 already checked the latest version and still doesn't like it at all 16:35 sfan5 Zeno`: i was talking to VanessaE 16:35 sfan5 sapier: the text is just too big 16:35 sapier it's still "broken" as of it's not identical to 0.4.9 which is plain impossible 16:35 VanessaE let me check it, because if sfan5 says it's busted, it probably is. let me see what he's seeing. 16:35 Zeno` sfan5, I was talking to sapier 16:36 Zeno` oh, you mean the bold text stuff? That was a joke :P 16:36 sfan5 k 16:36 sfan5 next time use /s 16:37 sapier no matter what I'm gonna tune it's not possible to get the new code to look exactly like old one so I'm not willing to spend any additional time for it 16:37 kilbith sapier, "I can't make a font smaller and bigger same time" wrong, we're all saying that's excessively big 16:37 Zeno` it doesn't have to look exactly the same. The font (size) just needs to be consistent 16:38 VanessaE sapier: what, in standard points is the default font size now? 16:38 VanessaE looks to be close to 13 16:38 sapier obviously if it doesn't look like 0.4.9 different ppl don't like different things and all join to fight against it ... I tried about 5 days to get this fixed it's over 16:39 sfan5 wat 16:39 sfan5 nobody complained about the main menu font (or size) in 0.4.9 16:39 VanessaE for me, fonts are now consistently sized all around, exactly like I was trying to say 16:39 sapier As I said ... pc formspecs will exactly look like 0.4.9 and for android I'm gonna do the real thing 16:39 VanessaE so if you change anything now you will break it 16:39 sfan5 VanessaE: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/M/MshHkghNi31N.png 16:39 VanessaE in other words, it's actually quite perfect. 16:40 VanessaE and to be sure, I made sure all font, scaling, and DPI settings were commented out/removed from my config. 16:40 sfan5 VanessaE: would you call how it looks in my screenshot perfect? 16:40 Krock I love the current font(sizes) 16:40 * Krock hides 16:41 sapier I'm not gonna fix anything on current code any longer the only thing I'm gonna provide is revertion to 0.4.9 then I'll never do anything on formspecs. 16:41 VanessaE sfan5: that looks a little different from my menu, probably because you have longer labels than me due to language difference 16:42 VanessaE http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/Screenshot%20-%2001102015%20-%2011%3a42%3a29%20AM.png 16:42 sfan5 VanessaE: the problem i have is that the font is too fat (e.g. the Mods text does not even fit into the tab) 16:42 VanessaE this is me, now, at git HEAD with entirely default font settings. 16:43 sfan5 VanessaE: here's what i uploaded yesterday https://cdn.mediacru.sh/e/eTMm9UxkEqTc.png 16:43 Zeno` ok, the fonts are now consistent (it seems) 16:43 sfan5 VanessaE: (ignore the left thing, it was because i was not at HEAD) 16:43 VanessaE the ESC menu is screwed up though - it's auto-scaling (the formspec, not the fonts - they're fine) with window size. 16:43 sfan5 sapier: is there a way i can make the font not look so fat 16:44 sfan5 ಠ_ಠ16:44 VanessaE sfan5: use a "condensed" font 16:44 Zeno` I like this much better than before 16:44 sfan5 the formspec looks bad at fullscreen 16:44 sapier change the font 16:44 VanessaE that's the normal name for the kind of typeface you need in your situation 16:44 sapier our font code does only know size and shadows 16:44 sapier no other parameters 16:44 VanessaE your problem isn't a function of font size 16:44 sfan5 which font did we use before? 16:44 sapier same 16:45 sfan5 then the font was made larget 16:45 Zeno` So I'm not sure you should revert anything, sapier 16:45 sfan5 larger* 16:45 VanessaE it's a function of labels being too big for their slots to begin with, the slots were probably originally sized for english text, no? 16:45 sapier just at different sizes. what you see is an effect of rounding errors 16:45 Zeno` just a few more tweaks and all is cool 16:45 sfan5 rounding errors 16:45 sfan5 yeah sure 16:45 sfan5 which font size did we have before? 16:46 sapier I'm not gonna tweak anything. I tried this for about 5 days whith lots of argueing and no noticable result 16:46 sfan5 I'm just asking a question 16:46 VanessaE sfan5: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/Screenshot_2014-05-11-17-20-50.png 16:46 VanessaE this was on an old android build, sufficient? 16:46 sapier I was answering to Zeno sfan5 16:46 sfan5 VanessaE: this is exactly the font size/family/whatever i like 16:46 VanessaE (note the date: May 11 last year) 16:47 sapier that timeout schould be an assertion 16:47 sapier once this happens you may have random memory corruption 16:47 VanessaE sapier: ignore that. 16:47 sfan5 the formspec looks bad at full screen: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/z/zWSxSSQdlrf1.png 16:47 VanessaE sapier: I was just getting a text size example 16:47 sfan5 the text is too small (or the buttons too big) 16:47 sfan5 the checkboxes are too small 16:47 VanessaE sfan5: yeah, same here. 16:48 sfan5 and the logo is not where it should be 16:48 sapier sfan5 of course do they look bad because zeno and kill... don't want fonts to scale same as formspec 16:48 VanessaE sapier: ok so it's simple: disable auto-scaling of formspecs for the ESC/Pause menu and main menu and I think you'll solve 99% of complaints 16:48 sfan5 sapier: so.. what font size did we have before? 16:48 sapier VanessaE that's not gonna work because then Zeno will complain that his fonts don't look same 16:49 VanessaE sfan5: we had what was in that android screenshot 16:49 Zeno` what? 16:49 VanessaE Zeno`: what about it? 16:49 sfan5 i mean the font size in numbers, not a visual representation 16:49 Zeno` I never said they shouldn't scale. I said the font size should be the same no matter the formspec size 16:50 sapier I'm wasting my time, everyone of you want different things 16:50 sfan5 Zeno`: but this looks bad https://cdn.mediacru.sh/z/zWSxSSQdlrf1.png 16:50 VanessaE sapier: stop! damn it man, just stop 16:50 Zeno` sfan5, was the font a different size depending on formspec before these changes? 16:50 VanessaE sapier: we all want the same damn thing 16:51 sfan5 Zeno`: i don't know, it wasn't this ugly though 16:51 sfan5 Zeno`: lemme make a screenshot 16:51 VanessaE sfan5: I think you're seeing Liberation Sans. try DejaVu instead? 16:51 sapier no we don't: some want it stay as in 0.4.9 some wanna change this some others that ... 16:51 VanessaE sapier: nononono 16:51 sfan5 VanessaE: what do i put into minetest.conf? 16:52 VanessaE sfan5: I had: font_path = /home/vanessa/.minetest/fonts/DejaVuSans.ttf 16:52 VanessaE and, mono_font_path = /home/vanessa/.minetest/fonts/DejaVuSansMono.ttf 16:52 VanessaE (both are commented out now) 16:52 VanessaE and those fonts are files I copied from my system 16:53 Calinou default font size was 12 before, I think 16:53 VanessaE sapier: people aren't demanding formspecs look identical to 0.4.9 - they're asking for something roughly equivalent. that means shit that doesn't change size with window size. That's all. 16:54 VanessaE and you already got the fonts taken care of. 16:54 VanessaE now just turn off the auto-scaling of formspecs for main menu and ESC menu 16:54 VanessaE the "skinny" font that sfan5 and kilbith are having a problem with is just the default font face, because it's no longer Dejavu Sans like it was with bitmapped fonts 16:55 sfan5 um 16:55 VanessaE when/why that changed, I don't know 16:55 sfan5 it'd the other way around 16:55 sfan5 i have a problem with the "fat" font 16:55 sfan5 i prefer the "skinny" font that was default in older versions 16:55 VanessaE sfan5: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/z/zWSxSSQdlrf1.png this is a "fat" font? 16:55 sapier I enabled autoscaling because Zeno did require formspecs to be consistent 16:55 sfan5 VanessaE: in contrast to the old font, yes 16:55 sfan5 Zeno`: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/T/TL4VSq0QBR30.png 16:56 VanessaE sfan5: do you mean the vertical strokes are thick, i.e. fat like font hinting? 16:56 Zeno` who cares about the font face? 16:56 Zeno` I don't 16:56 sfan5 i do 16:57 VanessaE Zeno`: you required formspecs to auto-scale? 16:57 Zeno` I just wanted things consistent and with VanessaE's suggestion I think they could be 16:57 Zeno` VanessaE, all I wanted was for a "12 point" font to look the same size in any formspec 16:58 VanessaE sapier: so, you misinterpreted. clearly he didn't mean autoscaling. 16:58 VanessaE he meant exactly the same thing I did 16:58 VanessaE turn off autoscaling. 16:59 kahrl one thing I noticed: the default font_size still depends on whether minetest is built with TTF support or not, even though the default font face is a bitmap font 16:59 VanessaE kahrl: indeed? 16:59 kahrl sorry if that was already discussed, honestly tl;dr 16:59 VanessaE haha 16:59 Calinou this is why IMO, bitmaps font should just go away 17:00 VanessaE well it does matter, since some people can't use freetype 17:00 sapier I can't change the fact that scaling factor does affect the layout 17:00 sapier if it doesn't scale the layout will be different 17:00 Calinou VanessaE, who can't? 17:00 VanessaE sapier: define "different". 17:00 sapier I can't tell this in detail as it's completely erratic 17:00 VanessaE Calinou: oh, I'm sure there's some weird corner-case out there where freetype doesn't work, or some people just don't liek it 17:00 VanessaE like* 17:00 VanessaE sapier: screenshots then? 17:01 VanessaE let's see the worst-case you've come across 17:01 Calinou “people just don't like it” is a bad argument, as it's a big burden on us to handle two font systems 17:01 Calinou lots of games today have TTF/OTF fonts only, people still play them 17:01 sapier what's so hard to understand about "I wont spend any more time on fixing this code" ? 17:01 VanessaE Calinou: I'm not entirely against getting rid of bitmap font support, but I'm not especially FOR it either. 17:01 VanessaE sapier: what's so hard is that you've been bitching about it for days now and not listening to people clearly enough 17:02 sapier if you believe you can tune it and make others accept it do it, I gave up yesterday 17:02 VanessaE you obviously misinterpreted zeno, and me, and others 17:02 VanessaE and now we're trying to fix that misinterpretation. 17:02 sfan5 VanessaE: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/N/NsXnj117IDOD.png here's what i mean 17:02 sapier and then next one is gonna complain 17:03 sfan5 VanessaE: additionally the 0.4.10 M fits into 12x12 px but the 0.4.11-dev needs 16x16px 17:03 sfan5 maybe it's the hinting 17:03 VanessaE sfan5: that's what I thought. you're talking about hinting, same as kilbith. that just needs a different font face is all. 17:03 VanessaE sfan5: apply the lines I gave, just point them to something you like. 17:04 Zeno` hinting is a freetype setting anyway (I dunno about Windows builds... I assume they still use freetype) 17:04 VanessaE (well mostly hinting, the overall spacing around the M is a different issue. kerning I guess) 17:04 VanessaE bbiab 17:04 * Calinou used Droid Sans at size 18 for a while, on a 1920×1080 screen 17:05 Calinou the same font I'm using on IRC right now 17:05 Zeno` sapier, do the new changes work on Android? 17:06 sapier I don't know 17:06 Zeno` because if they do, 99% of the issues people are complaining about are fixed. The other 1% should be relatively easy to fix 17:06 sapier I didn't care for android as long as it's not settled on pc 17:08 sapier no Zeno` those 1% sound like design limitations we can't fix thinks that are inherent propertys of the mechanisms we use 17:09 Zeno` such as? 17:09 sapier skinny fonts due to rounding issues 17:10 Zeno` oh, bugger that 17:10 sapier those happen at particular scaling and screen size 17:10 Zeno` that's not one of the 1% 17:10 sapier slightly different formspec layout then for 0.4.9 17:10 sapier we can't fix and stay same 17:10 Zeno` different is not bad; as long as things are consistent 17:10 sapier different non freetype font ... well the old one just didn't have different font sizes 17:11 Zeno` I don't think anyone, really, wants "exactly" the same 17:11 Zeno` they just want consistency 17:11 sapier well everything you guys tell leads to only one conclusion, to get everyone happy the only possible solution is revert ... each of you would accept different changes but wouldn't accept other changes 17:12 Zeno` I don't think that's true. I never said that at least 17:12 sapier I just don't see some subset of changes everyone would accept 17:13 sapier if you can find this subset good luck I hope you do 17:13 Zeno` I don't want to find a subset. I just want to find consistency 17:13 kahrl the subset {revert it} wouldn't be accepted by everyone either :P 17:13 Zeno` and that is so close to being there 17:14 sapier well kahrl that's not my problem 17:15 Zeno` sapier, please. Settle down? You've fixed the major complaints 17:15 Zeno` Now it's just small stuff to fix 17:15 Zeno` Reverting would, IMO, be silly 17:15 sapier exactly I fixed everything I could but it's still not enough that's the point where reverting is the only option left 17:16 Zeno` I don't understand why you're reluctant to tweak though 17:16 sapier well try to tweak it 17:16 sapier it's not gonna solve the issues of everyone 17:16 Zeno` Will VanessaE's suggestions above work (for those particular formspecs)? 17:17 sapier disabling autoscale for main menu? 17:17 sapier and paise 17:18 Zeno` well, yes, autoscale is the main problem 17:18 sapier It's gonna make mainmenu look more like old mainmenu but result in formspec beeing less consistent again 17:18 Zeno` *shrug* 17:19 sapier you'd not notice a difference on 800x600 but on any other resolution result may be good but could be bad too 17:20 Zeno` Sometimes compromises need to be made 17:21 sapier problem about compromises is everyone has to agree to them 17:21 Zeno` That will never happen 17:21 Zeno` you just need a majority 17:22 sapier right now it's always been 1: everyone else 17:22 Zeno` (well, you don't even need a majority but it helps keep the peace) 17:22 Zeno` sapier, and now it's not 1:everyone else 17:23 Zeno` because as far as I can see *most* of the major dislikes have been addressed 17:23 sfan5 VanessaE: it looks like we are using the same font, i just want the hinting configures such that it looks like in .10 17:24 sapier https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/de3888ca09a43371d3ef1fa3ff20e5501044d6ef Zeno revert changes in init.lua and game.cpp and you're gonna have the fixed size menu again, try it if you like it merge it 17:25 Zeno` sfan5, hinting is part of freetype. I'm not sure minetest even changes the hinting settings (it might, so correct me if I'm wrong) 17:25 sfan5 Zeno`: why does it look different in the new version if nothing changed? 17:25 sapier as you've been the one why I did change it most likely everyone else will be happy too 17:26 Zeno` because the font is scaled 17:26 sapier if not .. well ... you'll get used to it 17:26 Zeno` sapier, huh? 17:26 sapier I just told you where you can make those changes VanessaE suggested 17:27 sfan5 Zeno`: no, the font looks exactly the same at any resolution 17:27 Zeno` sapier, and how does it look? 17:28 sapier I already told I can't predict this in detail as there's to many dependencys 17:28 sapier try it and see yourself 17:29 sapier fonts most likely will stay same, locations of labels and buttons may vary 17:29 sfan5 hm 17:29 sfan5 this is weird 17:29 sfan5 if i change gui scale to 0.99 the font looks better 17:30 sfan5 but all the tabs still don't fit on the screen 17:31 sapier not weired rounding issue 17:32 sapier if you're at the edge for font size a small change of factor causes the font to change but the other elements may still round to oposit pixel 17:32 Zeno` patch does not apply :( 17:32 sapier come on Zeno there are 9 lines you need to change 17:33 Zeno` why do I feel you're leading me into some kind of trap? 17:33 sapier btw it ain't patch but only what you need to change 17:33 kahrl try: git revert --no-commit de3888ca0; git reset src/guiFormSpecMenu.cpp; git checkout src/guiFormSpecMenu.cpp 17:33 sapier NO 17:33 sapier he'd revert the revertion of autofontscaling too if he did this 17:34 kahrl huh? 17:34 sapier he just wants to reenable fixed formspecs 17:34 kahrl I'm just restating what you said 17:34 sapier no you miss the only init.lua and game.cpp part ;-) 17:34 kahrl um 17:34 sfan5 hm 17:34 sfan5 font_size needs to be 12 17:34 kahrl that's what the git reset and git checkout is for 17:34 sfan5 then it looks like in 0.4.10 17:35 sfan5 13 i mean 17:35 Calinou it was 12 before, I think 17:35 Calinou but feel free to make it 13 or 14 17:35 Calinou also, it should be changeable in GUI 17:35 sfan5 nope 17:36 sfan5 it was 13 before 17:36 apdap undefined reference to `__imp__ZN3irr5video16IdentityMaterialE'| 17:36 apdap help q.q 17:36 sfan5 apdap: which mingw version are you using 17:37 apdap http://i.imgur.com/gnup58s.png 17:37 apdap uhh 17:37 apdap latest mingw-w64 17:37 apdap lemme check 17:37 apdap 4.9.0 17:37 sfan5 hm 17:38 kahrl yeah, I agree with making the default font size 13 or 14 17:39 sfan5 sapier, Calinou: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/-/-KpzoDItP-qs.png 17:39 VanessaE back 17:39 sfan5 VanessaE: see the screenshot i just posted 17:39 VanessaE the one to Calinou just now? 17:40 sapier 0.4.10 is already non identical to 0.4.9 17:40 VanessaE ok I see it. 17:40 sfan5 sapier: forget the 0.4.9 thing 17:41 kahrl what is LEGACY_SCALING for, btw? (in constants.h) 17:41 sapier well try a different screen size you're gonna have different effects again, same for non freetype font 17:41 VanessaE sfan5: looks okay to me 17:41 kahrl (stuff like this should be commented :P) 17:41 sfan5 *sigh* 17:41 Zeno` seems to be ok, sapier 17:41 VanessaE certainly close enough to 0.4.10 that no one should complain imho 17:41 sapier kahrl: it's been used to make 0.4.10 similar to 0.4.9 17:41 apdap OH 17:41 apdap sfan5, I think the Irrlicht I'm using is 32 bits 17:42 apdap It's probably compiling x64 17:42 sfan5 sapier: i just want it to look like it looked in 0.4.10 with kinda-standard value of 96dpi 17:42 sfan5 apdap: that might the problem 17:42 sapier sfan5 zeno push your changes if you believe them to be ok I'll not stop you 17:42 sfan5 k 17:42 sfan5 anyone against setting default font size to 13? 17:42 apdap sfan5, is there a 64 bits irrlicht? 17:42 sfan5 apdap: yes 17:42 apdap sfan5: preview please? 17:42 sapier you should check non freetype prior merge too 17:43 sapier use_freetype=false 17:43 VanessaE sfan5: no argument from me. 17:43 sfan5 sapier: you realize that non-freetype uses a different size? 17:43 sfan5 sapier: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/src/constants.h#L102 17:43 kahrl sfan5: let me test it with a few different window sizes / dpi settings 17:43 sfan5 kahrl: sure 17:43 sapier well that's result of reverting the autofontscaling 17:44 sapier autofontscaling did adjust fonts to each other because they've been different in 0.4.9/10 too 17:44 sapier kahrl if you're on linux dpi settings will be ignored 17:44 kahrl hmm 17:45 sapier we do autodetect them from x11 17:45 Zeno` well I dunno. What would you like me to say about the patch, sapier? 17:45 sfan5 http://sprunge.us/CKEP?diff << suggested patch 17:45 sapier I don't want anyone of you to say anything about a patch I'm just telling you where you need to implement YOUR suggestions 17:46 Zeno` no, it's your patch. What do you think is wrong with it? 17:46 kahrl sapier: you mean it even ignores the dpi settings I set with xrandr? 17:46 sapier sfan5 are you sure loosing float precision is a good idea? 17:46 sfan5 kahrl: it probably won't ignore that 17:46 sapier I don't know if xrandr sets the down to x11 level 17:46 kahrl yeah those seem to be used 17:46 sfan5 sapier: if the code relies on the constant being float it is broken 17:47 sfan5 also it is set as a setting first anyway 17:47 sapier sfan5 integer division != float division 17:47 sfan5 and the code probably uses getfloat 17:47 sapier if you make it an integer you loose more information on divisions then if it's float 17:47 sfan5 it would be stupid if the code did not use floats to get the "font_size" setting 17:47 apdap Can I have a preview on the font size stuff? :) 17:47 sfan5 sapier: listen pls 17:48 sapier You did ask me I did answer if you still wanna do it the integer way do it but don't tell me later I didn't mention it 17:48 sfan5 k 17:48 sfan5 you did not read what i said 17:49 Zeno` sapier, why did you want me to make those changes? 17:49 sapier I did but I know about those large calculations within guiFormspecMenu.cpp and I don't know exactly if there ain't a location where by someone elses mistake a pure integer division occurs 17:49 sfan5 here's a tl;dr for the 4 lines i said: the font code (probably) uses getFloat() to read the font_size setting, changing the constant to an int won't have any effect 17:49 sfan5 ^ sapier 17:50 sapier but the font code is not the only one using the default font size 17:50 sfan5 if any of the font code uses that constant directly it's broken 17:50 sfan5 it should use the font_size setting 17:50 kahrl ok, font size 13 seems to be fine so far, will check a non-freetype build now 17:50 sfan5 kahrl: it will be a different size (14) w/o freetyper 17:51 sfan5 s/r$// 17:51 sapier maybe yet it wouldn't cause any harm if you did write it as float ... don't ever ask me again if you only wanna hear "it's ok" 17:51 sfan5 sapier: grep only finds something in defaultsettings.cpp and constant.h 17:51 kahrl sfan5: https://gist.github.com/kahrl/89e2e06932ece358152f 17:52 kahrl this is what I did 17:52 sfan5 i see 17:52 sfan5 i think we should do that anyway 17:52 sfan5 for consistency 17:52 sfan5 kahrl: please check that it looks (near) identicaly w/ and w/o freetype 17:53 kahrl well it uses a different font face, so probably not 17:53 sfan5 huh, what font face does it use= 17:53 sfan5 s/=/?/ 17:53 sfan5 oh 17:54 sfan5 freetype uses liberationsans, non-freetype uses lucida_sans 17:54 sapier if it was same you'd still get different results as ttf font implementation returns different font parameters 17:54 kahrl nope this is bad http://i.imgur.com/4QIAW8U.png 17:55 sfan5 is that w/o freetype? 17:55 kahrl yeah 17:56 sapier you can distinguish by font shadows, non-ft doesn't have them 17:56 kahrl font_size should be about 10 there, on my setup at least 17:57 sfan5 how does it look with font_size 10 non-freetype? 17:58 kahrl http://i.imgur.com/pGYTBz2.png 17:58 VanessaE wouldn't the correct solution for non-ttf be to re-link the fonts so that referring to 13 or 14 non-ttf gets you something that's close to 13pt ttf? 17:58 VanessaE relink, rename...whatever 17:58 sfan5 that looks ok 17:59 sapier I think the size bug is more at ttf side 17:59 * kahrl has to leave for a bit; back in a hour or so 17:59 sapier non ft-fonts use irrlicht font tool 17:59 kahrl an* 17:59 VanessaE sapier: there's an easy way to check. set a font to 72 points and display it at gui_scaling = 1.0. assuming your DPI was displayed correctly, it just has to be 25.4 mm high. 17:59 sapier while ttf fonts are autogenerated with buggy code 17:59 VanessaE if it is, freetype is fine 18:00 sfan5 http://sprunge.us/bKIZ?diff << new suggested patch 18:00 sapier do we have a size 72 non ft font? ;-) 18:00 VanessaE s/displayed/detected/. 18:00 VanessaE sapier: check it with freetype first, since you suspect the problem to be there 18:00 sapier nope 18:01 VanessaE you literally just have to set it to 72 point, display it, and stick a ruler on your screen. 18:01 VanessaE that's it 18:01 sapier I'm not working on this code any longer 18:01 Zeno` Werner Lemberg (freetype) is constantly working on freetype 18:01 Zeno` if the bug is there I'd be surprised 18:02 sapier the code translating the fonts ain't freetype 18:02 sfan5 sapier, Zeno`, kahrl: any remaining issues with the new patch? http://sprunge.us/bKIZ?diff 18:02 sapier it's some piece of rubbish someone sometimes took from somewhere in the internet 18:02 VanessaE sapier: well you're the one who said maybe freetype is wrong. 18:02 VanessaE it's on you to prove it wrong or not 18:03 VanessaE until then, the correct solution is to fix the actual non-ft fonts so that THEIR sizes are similar to freetype, not to fiddle with magic numbers 18:03 sapier well you said the non freetype fonts are wrong first so it's up to you to proove your claim 18:03 VanessaE assuming freetype is actually correct 18:03 VanessaE wat 18:03 VanessaE no, I dod not 18:03 sfan5 hm 18:03 VanessaE did not* 18:03 VanessaE learn to read 18:03 sapier you suggested renaming the non freetype fonts 18:03 VanessaE yes, I suggested it based on what someone *else* said here 18:03 sapier which is only a sane suggestion if they where wrong 18:04 Zeno` freetype is correct. If it was not someone on the mailing list would already have raised an issue 18:04 sfan5 gui_scaling=0.99 and font_size=13 makes 0.4.11-dev look pretty much exactly like 0.4.10 18:04 sapier Zeno`: it's not freetype generating the fonts 18:04 sfan5 except the text is a bit weird 18:04 Zeno` what is then? 18:04 sfan5 anyway 18:04 VanessaE sfan5: 0.99 at least confirms what sapier said about rounding errors. 18:04 sapier we use freetype to generate the fonts but we use our own code to set the parameters for freetype 18:04 VanessaE sapier: I was responding to THIS: [01-10 12:57] font_size should be about 10 there, on my setup at least 18:05 sapier and that piece of code is what I expect to be wrong 18:05 sfan5 [!!] http://sprunge.us/bKIZ?diff I'll be pushing this in 5 minutes if nobody has any problem 18:06 sapier I agree 18:06 VanessaE if kahrl believes that non-ttf fonts are displaying too big relative to ttf, and ttf is in fact displayed correctly, then the correct solution is to fix the non-ttf fonts *themselves* (either by renaming them or by re-rendering them), assuming also that kahrl's DPI size is consistent with whoever first rendered those fonts. 18:06 VanessaE sfan5: no problem from me, the above aside. 18:07 sapier meaning that irrlichts font generation tool would not generate a 10 px font if you suggest it but something different which sounds as sane as freetype itself generating wrong sized fonts 18:07 Zeno` this has to be one of the craziest conversations I've ever been involved with, lol 18:07 daswort the font is indeed a bit to big for the default window size: http://i.imgur.com/jLQEl92.png 18:09 est31 btw can I simply write i18n pull requests or is there a centralized UI for that 18:09 est31 "Texturen Pakete" is a very bad transl. 18:09 VanessaE daswort: eek. gevalt 18:10 VanessaE no antialias? eew 18:10 sfan5 est31: just make a pull; also sfan5: tell minetest devs to change "Sie sind gestorben" to "Du bist gestorben" 18:10 VanessaE ok fuck it, I give up on non-ttf arguments entirely 18:10 VanessaE do whatever you want 18:10 sapier https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/2096 is still there, no tuning required looking identical to 0.4.9 18:10 VanessaE at least ttf works 18:10 VanessaE someone close that ^^^^^ 18:10 sapier not till you guys fixed it 18:10 VanessaE do NOT revert, it's stupid to do so 18:11 Zeno` closed 18:11 sapier open 18:11 Zeno` lol sapier 18:11 Zeno` closed 18:11 daswort VanessaE, "eek. gevalt" ??? 18:11 VanessaE daswort: nevermind. 18:11 sapier I'd be carefull what you do next Zeno 18:12 Zeno` Why? You just closed it 18:12 Zeno` and opened it 18:12 Zeno` :) 18:12 sapier javascript update error 18:12 VanessaE just close the fucking thing 18:12 daswort est31, still better than "Tapete ändern" 18:13 sfan5 sapier: your pull does not help any 18:13 sfan5 the problem is solved 18:13 est31 daswort: its more about having a determinativkompositum. Its Aufzug not Auf Zug. 18:13 sfan5 nobody wanted to remove formspec scaling support 18:14 VanessaE sapier: Principle of Least Surprise 18:14 est31 (perhaps aufzug is no determinativkompositum but that doesnt change "Texturen Pakete" sounds fishy) 18:16 sapier well guys, do what you want 18:16 daswort How about "Reliefpakete" est31 *duck* 18:17 est31 daswort: why not just "Texturenpakete"? 18:17 sfan5 ^ 18:18 daswort Too reasonable. If we call it "Strukturpakete" i can write a mod called "Wirtschaftsaufschwung" for MT. est31 18:18 daswort est31, http://www.dict.cc/?s=texture 18:19 est31 daswort, https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Textur_%28Computergrafik%29 18:19 daswort Much better: http://i.imgur.com/UuR97fw.png 18:20 daswort est31, but translations can make a program more interesting and fun: http://www.pcgameshardware.de/screenshots/970x546/2009/02/weltraum1mw1.png 18:21 sfan5 VanessaE: how it looks as of HEAD: https://cdn.mediacru.sh/0/0rgc9CwnCRUW.png 18:22 est31 fun is for losers 18:22 est31 :P 18:29 VanessaE sfan5: what screen DPI? 18:30 sfan5 VanessaE: 96 18:30 VanessaE lgtm then. 18:39 kahrl back, btw has anyone noticed that the row highlight on the server list isn't clipped properly against the scrollbar 18:40 kahrl it's pretty trivial to fix actually: https://gist.github.com/kahrl/30883cd62f722f2d9344 18:40 VanessaE kahrl: see my screenshot earlier. 18:40 VanessaE I've noticed it 18:41 kahrl which one? 18:41 VanessaE this one: http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/Screenshot%20-%2001102015%20-%2011%3a42%3a29%20AM.png 18:42 kahrl ah yes 18:42 kahrl well I'll push my fix in a few minutes since it's quite trivial 18:44 VanessaE (10 minutes later) oh fuck, that commit broke X...and Y...and wow you should see Z 18:44 VanessaE ;) 18:45 kahrl are you a wizard? :D 18:45 VanessaE haha 18:45 VanessaE no but some might call me a witch ;) 18:51 ShadowNinja nore: Yes, but it would require a much more complex implementation. nore, sfan5: Try using game#num. 18:51 ShadowNinja (Or just num without the #) 18:52 nore ShadowNinja, what about just a < 500 check? 18:55 sapier Zeno` sfan5 kilbith VanessaE so what are you done fixing it now? 18:55 kilbith ? 18:56 VanessaE sapier: I have nothing further to contribute. I believe the only thing left was for someone to commit the disable-formspect-autoscaling patch you suggested or something similar. 18:56 ShadowNinja nore: Already tried that, people complained that you can't refer to old ones them. 18:57 sapier I just wanna know if it's been two numbers you guys didn't manage to tell which wasted about 12h of my time which I intended to spend for client side lua (OTTO) ... well now it's to late to start 18:57 ShadowNinja As it is <50 or so is is ignored, for gdb backtraces. 18:58 VanessaE sapier: it's never too late to start on something, but as far as font sizes are concerned, the problem is solved in HEAD now. 18:58 ShadowNinja sapier: Security is essential for that. I think it will be easier to add security before that. 18:59 sapier client side lua would be a independent engine so you don't need to add security anywhere else 18:59 sapier you can't mix it up to other lua engines as risk to get something in by accident is way to big 19:00 VanessaE sapier: I think he means in the sense of strict sandboxing and the like 19:00 sapier well VanessaE I estimated a prototype to be about 12h of development time ... I don't have this time the next weeks so it's not worth starting it 19:00 VanessaE client-side Lua sent from some server better not be able to read my Email :) 19:01 Calinou client-side Lua could be made to work like extensions 19:01 Calinou ie. server can't download it to client 19:01 Calinou client must install it itself 19:01 Calinou so we can focus on security later 19:01 VanessaE Calinou: naw, bad idea 19:01 VanessaE we'd be in MC territory then 19:01 Calinou this avoids JavaScript trap… 19:01 VanessaE broken/outdated mods all over the place 19:01 VanessaE incompatible mods from server to server 19:01 VanessaE we don't need that 19:01 sapier we already discussed this Calinou resulting in the conclusion if we provide sufficient modding capabilitys it's not gonna provide any security benefit if you have to install it manually 19:04 kilbith sapier, the right scaling fixers are called "HTML" and "CSS" ;) 19:05 sapier I'm not in mood of joking after wasting 12h of development time and beeing attacked by about all core developers just because of 2 numbers. 19:05 kilbith (sowwy) 19:07 VanessaE sapier: we tried and tried every which way to Sunday to explain what was wrong. 19:07 VanessaE it isn't our fault you elected to take the hard route :P 19:07 sapier well see logs zeno did even today claim font scaling is broken just because he didn't even bother to try the latest version. 19:08 VanessaE maybe he just didn't see that there was a new commit? 19:08 VanessaE I didn't, either (hence why I said I better re-check) 19:08 sapier great not even time enough to look at commits but accusing ... that's the the right way of course 19:09 VanessaE as it stands, if this http://irc.minetest.ru/minetest-dev/2015-01-10#i_4103710 will sort out the formspec autoscaling issue, then there's nothing left to complain about. 19:11 sapier just to mention current state ain't finished it's still not sufficient for android and maybe even not enogh for 4k screens ... and I'm out of formspec development I burnt my fingers more then once I'm not gonna touch that code anytime soon. 19:13 sfan5 sapier: we were already done when you said well guys, do what you want 19:15 sapier well guess everyone should thing about this discussion and how much went wrong there because discussions like this one is why we lost so many skilled developers in past 19:22 hmmmm ahhh stop the insanity 19:22 hmmmm i feel like i need to get involved with this the longer and longer it goes on 19:24 hmmmm in re: font sizing. i personally feel like the best way to specify font size is by points 19:24 hmmmm if font sizes get too large, then i see no reason why it shouldn't get cut off by the clipping of the control 19:24 VanessaE hmmmm: um, you're behind... 19:25 hmmmm but the control sizes should be fit to the DPI of the screen in order to make crap like android work 19:25 hmmmm all of this needs to be optional, with sane defaults 19:25 hmmmm fonts auto-scaling with the DPI makes perfect sense, just not for PC interfaces 19:26 hmmmm one size fits all is simply untrue here 19:26 hmmmm what is the current situation that i'm missing out on? 19:27 hmmmm okay so there's a "set fixed size" option for formspecs.. awesome 19:27 sapier well you're just next one requesting something different ;-P 19:27 hmmmm not requesting, just my own humble opinion on how GUIs should work 19:28 sapier that setting is there since we have formspec mainmenu 19:28 hmmmm if you have something differing from that it may or may not be just as good 19:28 VanessaE hmmmm: right now all that remains is the fixed-size option, see the log link above 19:28 hmmmm yea, I just read that commit vanessae 19:28 VanessaE everything else seems to be pretty much fixed,. 19:28 hmmmm so why is there a difference between builtin formspecs and mod-generated formspecs? 19:29 VanessaE difference in what way? 19:29 sapier because no mod does specify fixed size formspec 19:29 hmmmm from what i read there's a difference now 19:29 hmmmm no mod specifies that *yet* 19:29 hmmmm but the capability IS there, right...? 19:29 sapier for about 2 years noone (except me) did even try it 19:30 hmmmm and now how does all the recent developments affect android? 19:30 hmmmm s/developments/development/ 19:30 sapier not at all 19:30 sapier at least not direct 19:30 hmmmm so everything's fixecd 19:30 hmmmm fixed* 19:30 sapier nope 19:31 hmmmm what still needs fixing?? 19:31 sapier there's still something wrong with dpi font/formspec aspect 19:32 hmmmm btw i'm surprised irrlicht doesn't have an interface for getting the DPI of the current screen 19:32 hmmmm you only have one defined for Xorg currently.. what about Windows and the rest? do we need DPI-getting functions for the other platforms? 19:32 sapier there's some code for it in android branch but that one ain't merged yet 19:33 sapier let me check something 19:35 sapier ok so next thing left: 19:35 sapier fixed size formspecs don't work on android 19:35 hmmmm right 19:35 sapier well actually they don't work on any high dpi screen 19:35 hmmmm so I'm coding up a new static formspec 19:35 hmmmm what is the correct way to scale? 19:35 sapier non fixed size would work 19:36 sapier but there fonts are broken 19:36 hmmmm right now what I'm doing is simply g_fontengine->getTextWidth/Height(text) + some padding for selecting the element height and width 19:36 sapier because those don't scale 19:36 sapier I don't know what you wanna simplify there 19:37 sapier but do it if you believe this to be rigth way 19:37 sapier font engine never was part of the issue 19:37 hmmmm right, sure 19:37 sapier formspecs are and ppls believe how they're supposed to behave 19:38 hmmmm but I imagine there's a setting in minetest.conf now where you specify font_size = 9 or something like that and all the static formspecs (should in theory) respect this? 19:38 sapier they do 19:39 sapier still I believe the main issue beeing formspecs insane coupling of font sizes to formspec layout 19:39 sapier so unless you fix this you're always have fontsize layout dependencys 19:40 sapier if someone changes the font size the location of labels buttons .. whill change 19:41 hmmmm right now this is what I kind of have: http://fpaste.org/168173/42091886/ 19:42 hmmmm is that wrong? 19:42 VanessaE sapier: nope, you're wrong. http://digitalaudioconcepts.com/vanessa/hobbies/minetest/screenshots/Screenshot%20-%2001102015%20-%2002%3a42%3a35%20PM.png 19:42 VanessaE that's default size at upper left, "17" at upper right, and "25" at lower right 19:42 VanessaE all three formspecs are identical, to the pixel. 19:43 sapier look at SelectWorld: it's neither at same top nor bottom position. 19:43 sapier maybe it's somewhere in the middle but I'd not bet on this 19:44 VanessaE the buttons didn't move? the checkboxes seem to be in the same place? the listbox itself seems to be unmoved? the overall size of the formspec is the same? 19:44 sapier try it for a non fixed formspec where distances are bigger 19:44 VanessaE that's not a fixed-size formspec. 19:45 sapier hmmmm well it's not wrong for sure I'm just not sure if we need another class in formspec code consisting about 90% overhead code and 10% used code 19:46 sapier fixed size and 800x600 window size are same 19:46 hmmmm it's overhead that could easily get inlined... it's totally worth it to reduce the sheer amount of repetition involved with the GUIs 19:46 VanessaE ok, just checked. default, 16 (yeah, changed it. like it better), and 25. maximized. the font appears to be positioned just a few pixels up from its baseline. 19:47 sapier I wasn't talking about compiler overhead hmmmm ;-) It's just my personal opinion about readability 19:47 VanessaE the only part of the formspec that changes with font size is the widths (not the heights) of the tabs at the top of the menu 19:47 sapier for things like that I'd prefere a helper function but as I said that's a personal opinion 19:47 hmmmm having less wchar_t *text = wgettext("thing here"); core::rect(big, long, thing, here, taking, up, 3, lines); blah blah blah delete[] text; would be nice 19:48 VanessaE so font-wise, this behaves exactly as it should 19:48 hmmmm the reason why it's a helper class is because when it scopes out it automatically deletes the gettext results 19:49 hmmmm i'd make it into a macro if i could 19:50 sapier As I said It's a personal opinion influenced by the fact that I saw about 5-10 similar classes roundabout formspecs doing almost as less as this one 19:50 hmmmm should probably unify them 19:50 est31 in those .po files 19:50 est31 do the lines with #~ have a meaning 19:50 sapier I haven't tried but I guess most are used way to different 19:50 est31 or are they just comments 19:53 est31 guess first 19:55 hmmmm if somebody here knew the answer they'd tell you :) 19:56 sapier well vanessae the good thing is you're almost right about the font height dependencys 19:57 sapier the bad thing is this doesn't fix anything for about fixed formspecs don't work on high dpi screens 19:58 sapier hmmmm what issue do you intend to solve with this codeß 20:05 sapier hmmmm can you apply this? https://gist.github.com/sapier/846662f8f8aecaff166a 20:05 sapier it makes menus fixed size again 20:07 VanessaE does that also affect the pause/ESC menu? 20:07 sapier all menus 20:07 VanessaE ok 20:08 sapier unless you're on android of course there only fonts will be broken for uhd displays 20:08 VanessaE gotta go. 20:08 VanessaE bbl 20:09 sapier at least it's only gonna be the high end smartphons which might be broken *ironic* 20:15 sapier ShadowNinja: do you insist on implmeneting security (your new name for plugins) prior doing the client side lua stuff? 20:16 ShadowNinja sapier: ? What are plugins? 20:16 ShadowNinja sapier: Read my security pull. It just removes things like os.execute. 20:16 sapier those separated unloadable lua(modules)plugins you're trying to get done for about 2 years ;-) 20:17 sapier oh you've been talking about that one only? 20:17 ShadowNinja sapier: That's more related to my non-global mod namespaces. 20:18 ShadowNinja sapier: Yes, I haven't written a full-blown plugin patch yet. 20:18 sapier well I'd not have issues with this beeing merged yet as I said I'd not want to use same code as for server side modding as I'd expect this to be to risky 20:49 luizrpgluiz hi 21:51 hmmmm sapier: hah, mitigating risk by shoving the blame for it on me, huh :p 21:51 hmmmm ShadowNinja, that would break some peoples' mods 21:51 sapier nope hmmmm I've just promised I'm not gonna touch forspec code again 21:51 hmmmm they have things like map generators written in native code that they execute 21:52 hmmmm it's stupid i know 21:52 hmmmm sapier: ok 21:52 hmmmm although I think it's fine 21:52 luizrpgluiz hi 21:53 sapier well that's what they demanded I don't know why it's so complicated to do it themselfs 21:53 hmmmm luizrpgluiz, do you have anything say in regard to minetest development? 21:53 hmmmm i'm just wondering because you always come in, say hi, then leave, rince and repeat 21:53 hmmmm sapier, you shouldn't let those kind people with pitchforks bother you 21:54 sapier hmmmmm I know yet this time it's not been the usual suspects but basicall everyone ... I'm tired of fighting everyone especially if the most controversial part ain't even my work 21:55 luizrpgluiz for example, the version of minetest 0.5, will add the DirectX9 minetest in the menu? 21:55 hmmmm what? 21:55 sapier drivers are autodetected from what irrlicht tells to be available 21:56 luizrpgluiz in version 0.4.11 not have the option to play with directx 21:56 sapier well in this case irrlicht is compiled without directX support 21:58 sapier didn't buildbot script have issues with directx? 21:59 luizrpgluiz the game does not open with the directx 9 22:00 sapier luizrpgluiz: did you read what I told? 22:00 luizrpgluiz sorry sapier 22:00 sapier if irrlicht is compiled without directx(9) support you're never gonna be able to start it using directx 22:02 luizrpgluiz but because the engine no longer supports the directx? 22:02 kilbith sapier: just stop the self-inflated melodrama, we have just reported what was wrong with the scaling and attached bugs, downstream to your testing requests. not attacked you personnally. 22:03 kilbith if you call that bothering, i won't just report anything to you 22:04 sapier luizrpgluiz: what do you expect from directX9? we neither do use any of it's features nor is it faster 22:04 sapier kilbith: just stop everything is told that had to be todl 22:05 luizrpgluiz I have a friend who rode well with directx out instead of using opengl 22:06 sapier so it's not about directx9 but directx itself? 22:06 sapier that makes sense as directx drivers on windows quite often are better then opengl 22:07 sapier which build did you use luizrpgluiz? 22:09 luizrpgluiz he only changed the minetest.conf and added the line of DirectX and the game became faster 22:10 sapier ok which version? 22:11 Krock interesting. direct3d is slightly slower than opengl on my machine 22:13 sapier Krock: depends on your driver recent drivers do better opengl handling as games use it more 22:13 sapier about 5 years ago opengl was almost not relevant for games 22:14 Krock my driver is from year 2010 22:14 sapier you use drivers that old? 22:14 hmmmm iirc a lot of AAA game developers have said that opengl is technically superior to direct3d 22:14 Krock I use a graphic card which is some years older 22:15 sapier hmmmm I guess that depends on which version 22:15 hmmmm OGL 4 vs. DX11 22:15 luizrpgluiz my drivers is newer 22:16 hmmmm hmm 22:16 luizrpgluiz intel hd graphics 22:16 hmmmm I wonder what minetest does if fullscreen is enabled with a resolution not supported 22:16 luizrpgluiz intel hd graphics ironlake mobile 22:16 sapier well 2 years between directx 11 and opengl4 22:17 Krock drawtime 25 (direct3d9) vs 18 (oppengl 2.1).. seems like opengl got a much better support than direct3d :3 22:17 sapier nice 22:18 sapier still why doesn't luizrpgluiz have directx available in settings menu, the only possible reason is our build is without directx support 22:19 luizrpgluiz ok 22:19 Krock ehm. direct3d10 or 11 is not supported by irrlicht 22:19 Krock of you're talking about that 22:19 Krock *if 22:20 sapier nope 10 or 11 was only mentioned by hmmmm for comparing standards 22:20 sapier it's not relevant for us 22:20 sapier we don't even use dx9 features ;-) 22:20 Krock maybe we should use some 22:21 sapier do you know directx programming? 22:21 sapier you're welcome to help ;-) 22:21 Krock never looked at it :3 22:21 Krock well, I'll spend some time on it tomorrow. nighty'all 22:22 sapier same for me ... and I don't know anyone who does ;-) 22:32 hmmmm wooh.. surprisingly minetest works well with fullscreen 22:33 hmmmm unlike nearly everything else 22:33 hmmmm it hates my dual monitor setup with the secondary monitor on my left.. nothing works with it 22:35 sapier "well" as in uses only one monitor? 22:35 hmmmm right 22:35 hmmmm that's what I want it to do 22:35 hmmmm it's much better than other games that... 22:35 hmmmm - use the leftmost monitor 22:35 sapier well It'd be nice if it did use all monotors for me ;-) 22:35 hmmmm - reset to windowed mode and spawn itself in the center of my two monitors 22:35 hmmmm - hang 22:36 sapier well I don't have that isssue as I use xinerama 22:36 hmmmm - set the resolution to something lower than the screen size and turn panning mode on 22:36 hmmmm life as a non-windows gamer, ahh... 22:37 sapier I'd have to mess around with fov too to get a good result 22:37 hmmmm yup, you need to manually set fov or disable all monitors but the primary one in order for the aspect ratio to work correctly for far cry 2 and 3 22:38 hmmmm pretty much the standard for the "AAA" type games today 22:40 sapier guess multimonitor would be nice but I don't even wanna know how formspec will look like there