| Time |
Nick |
Message |
| 00:07 |
Exio4 |
#1151 |
| 00:07 |
ShadowBot |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues/1151 -- Pathfinder by Selat |
| 00:16 |
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| 17:50 |
sapier |
celeron55 https://github.com/minetest/minetest/commit/0643cef09a741d1e8a7b971f3ae70b45ac8d44bf is supposed to fix the bug introduced by the abm speedup |
| 17:51 |
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| 17:51 |
sapier |
it's a little bit hard to read there but basicaly it's meant to skip object recount as long as no object was added and perform it if there was at least one object added |
| 17:52 |
celeron55 |
oh |
| 17:52 |
celeron55 |
good |
| 17:52 |
celeron55 |
who was the guy who was having the problem |
| 17:53 |
celeron55 |
oh he's not around at the moment; well whatever, he had a build from between those so it explains |
| 17:55 |
sapier |
ok and yes you can specify a path for mods in mobf |
| 17:55 |
sapier |
mobs in mobf |
| 17:55 |
celeron55 |
oh, that issue |
| 17:55 |
sapier |
that's what you do for guards if you make them patrol |
| 17:56 |
celeron55 |
i got already bored thinking about it, but anyway, so i would like to create a mob that tries to go to a place that my custom script occasionally finds for it; otherwise it should stand still and if someone attacks it, it should attack back |
| 17:57 |
celeron55 |
if you could say where exactly to put code and what to call in mobf to make that happen, it would be very useful |
| 17:57 |
sapier |
that's basicaly a guard with path set to not loop |
| 17:57 |
sapier |
of course |
| 17:59 |
sapier |
do you want complex paths or simple ones only? |
| 18:00 |
celeron55 |
what do those mean |
| 18:01 |
sapier |
complex paths calculated by pathfinding simple ones basicaly line of sight movement |
| 18:01 |
celeron55 |
basically, i want to give a position, and it should try to go there no matter what |
| 18:01 |
celeron55 |
as intelligently as possible |
| 18:01 |
sapier |
ok so pathfinding is prefered |
| 18:01 |
celeron55 |
and the position is going to be like >50 nodes away |
| 18:02 |
sapier |
50 nodes away? are you sure that much blocks are active? |
| 18:02 |
celeron55 |
yes, i'm taking care of that |
| 18:02 |
celeron55 |
this is no ordinary usage of minetest 8) |
| 18:03 |
sapier |
ok .... well guess we're gonna find out how fast pathfinding is ... I fear it's gonna take way to much time if there ain't a way to go |
| 18:03 |
celeron55 |
well the pathfinding pull request is going to get handy |
| 18:03 |
celeron55 |
have you looked at it yet? |
| 18:04 |
sapier |
yes looks faster but I don't have any benchmark results about it ... and the one who wrote it ignores that request |
| 18:05 |
sapier |
but it's not equivalent to original one and I believe it's not complete too ... but I can't prove this assumption |
| 18:05 |
sapier |
on the other hand new code does honor heigth difference while mine didn't |
| 18:06 |
celeron55 |
your code is unable to go climb complex buildings? |
| 18:06 |
celeron55 |
well then i have to take the new code into use before even trying yours in any real situation 8) |
| 18:06 |
CiaranG |
In my experience the new one works much better. But it's not compatible. |
| 18:07 |
sapier |
no it is able to climb it just doesn't count climbing to be more expensive then walking on flat ground |
| 18:07 |
CiaranG |
I can't imagine using it over that kind of range is a good idea though. You should think about different solutions for long distance. |
| 18:07 |
celeron55 |
bah, it will work |
| 18:08 |
sapier |
for what I understand new code doesn't provide a way to get shortest path ... not sure if this is relevant |
| 18:08 |
celeron55 |
i have some experience in pathfinders in coarse 3D grids |
| 18:08 |
celeron55 |
that doesn't matter |
| 18:08 |
celeron55 |
the only thing that matters is that if there is any path, it will find it |
| 18:09 |
sapier |
50 blocks distance + 10 threshold + 20 height --> 60*20*60 nodes to check 3600 in 2d |
| 18:09 |
sapier |
assuming there are some caves in ther you're at about 5000 nodes |
| 18:10 |
celeron55 |
the first 30 nodes are likely to be flat ground, and the rest is going to be the inside of a building |
| 18:10 |
celeron55 |
so not exactly a maze |
| 18:10 |
sapier |
as I said in good case it's gonna work |
| 18:10 |
sapier |
but if there ain't a way to go there pathfinding will check all of it |
| 18:11 |
sapier |
this wouldn't be a problem if you could do pathfinding in async mode |
| 18:11 |
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| 18:15 |
sapier |
celeron55 there are multiple ways to get the mob you want in mobf, most easy way is define a state with "mgen_path" as movegen, add a custom_on_step callback and use entity.dynamic_data.current_movement_gen.set_target(entity,target) to set the target |
| 18:15 |
sapier |
this depends on mobf usage of pathfinding is enabled, this is disabled by default |
| 18:15 |
celeron55 |
sounds good |
| 18:16 |
sapier |
if you want more sophisticated design you could define different states for stand still and move too and let the target beeing calculated on state transition |
| 18:16 |
celeron55 |
have you tested mobf compatibility with selat's pathfinder? it's mentioned in there that it might not work |
| 18:18 |
sapier |
no I haven't I've been a little bit short on time to do mobf too, I've plenty of very very good fixes in current dev tree which need to be polished for release too ... hope I can do this the next week as android port seems to be almost done ... which is last part to complete the network fixes |
| 18:18 |
celeron55 |
okay; i guess i can continue with this information |
| 18:19 |
sapier |
don't bother to ask I know docs are a little bit short, I recommend looking at the existing mobs. I added a mob for each feature (almost) |
| 18:20 |
sapier |
https://github.com/sapier/animals_modpack/wiki/Developer-documentation contains some doc fragments too |
| 18:21 |
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| 18:21 |
celeron55 |
some kind of structural explanation would be much more useful than explanations of existing implementations of the pluggable parts |
| 18:22 |
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| 18:22 |
spillz |
celeron55: removing the underground check from fixes the issue with water in the stability mod |
| 18:22 |
sapier |
http://animalsmod.comuf.com/ contains doxygen doc ... could be helpfull too |
| 18:23 |
celeron55 |
i kind of can guess what "combat_melee" does, but then to figure out the actual interface between it and other parts is hard |
| 18:24 |
sapier |
http://animalsmod.comuf.com/classfighting.html |
| 18:25 |
sapier |
the doxygen doc isn't perfect lua to doxygen is a little bit tricky |
| 18:25 |
spillz |
celeron55: less issues with cave flickering too |
| 18:27 |
sapier |
hmm ok doc is way from perfect ... :-/ got a little bit messed up on last update |
| 18:30 |
sapier |
https://github.com/sapier/animals_modpack/wiki/Mob-creation-tutorial you should start with this one celeron55 |
| 18:39 |
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| 19:51 |
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| 19:52 |
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| 19:52 |
Kam_ |
hi, could someone point me in the right direction for getting started with core development? :) |
| 19:52 |
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| 19:52 |
sapier |
look at bugs try to find and fix them, improove doc ... do testing ... same as for all oss projects ;) |
| 19:53 |
Kam_ |
:) Ok thanks |
| 19:53 |
sapier |
especially testing would be helpfull |
| 19:54 |
Kam_ |
Is there a page for major bugs still untouched in the dev build? |
| 19:54 |
sapier |
github issue |
| 19:54 |
sapier |
s |
| 19:56 |
celeron55 |
it may be boring but one simple thing that is always valued is to test and report results in something where someone has mentioned "this needs testing" but nobody has yet said any results |
| 19:56 |
celeron55 |
butr what kind of things are you looking for? |
| 19:56 |
celeron55 |
-r |
| 19:57 |
celeron55 |
there doesn't really exist any kind of "do this do that" list because developers usually come in with their own list and aren't very interested in doing stuff that someone else has said they should do |
| 19:58 |
Kam_ |
Just some general experience working on OSS projects, I have decent experience with C++. I don't have any particular goals here :D |
| 19:58 |
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| 19:59 |
celeron55 |
maybe you want to choose from these and ask the person currently responsible for it: http://dev.minetest.net/Organisation#Subsystems |
| 19:59 |
sapier |
well contributing to oss projects is only about 20% of coding experience ... 50% is communication 15% is argueing and another 15% is throwing things away ;-) |
| 19:59 |
sapier |
or something similar ;-) |
| 19:59 |
celeron55 |
i bet every one of those can point you to do something |
| 20:00 |
celeron55 |
sapier: that sounds about right |
| 20:00 |
celeron55 |
that also applies to all teamwork whatsoever |
| 20:00 |
celeron55 |
if you can code, good, but that is only the 20% |
| 20:00 |
sapier |
yes oss is somehow hardcore teamwork as you don't have any authority to make someone do something :-) |
| 20:01 |
Kam_ |
Of course, I would just like to improve my experience :) |
| 20:01 |
VanessaE |
sapier: knowing THIS community, I'd say 20% code, 15% communication, 15% throwing away, and 50% arguing ;) |
| 20:01 |
Kam_ |
I have done a little bit of tinkering around with 0ad, wrote a couple patches there |
| 20:02 |
sapier |
you have a lot of different coders here with different styles ... some are better some are only different ... and most time better is just a matter of pov |
| 20:02 |
celeron55 |
Kam_: how about if you go play minetest a bit in your preferred configuration whatsoever and then see if you find something that doesn't seem good, and then try improving it |
| 20:03 |
sapier |
VanessaE you're not helpfull as of doing recruiting job ;-) |
| 20:03 |
VanessaE |
sapier: I call it as I see it ;) |
| 20:03 |
Kam_ |
hahaha |
| 20:04 |
sapier |
:-) well Kam_ VanessaE is right in some way if you wanna contribute you have to be tough and take some bad comments without beeing upset |
| 20:04 |
sapier |
most time those comments aren't meant as bad as they may have been written |
| 20:05 |
Kam_ |
lol I live in the real world just like everyone else I can handle nasty comments |
| 20:05 |
sapier |
well real world isn't even close to oss dev ;-) |
| 20:06 |
sapier |
things like suggesting some change beeing argumented to the ground just to see your suggestion is implemented silently half a year later CAN and most likely WILL happen ;-) |
| 20:07 |
sapier |
on the other hand sometimes you can't get something to be added ... e.g. once I mention the word security I can wait for at least 3 people shouting no ;-) |
| 20:08 |
celeron55 |
why did you even start talking about that stuff |
| 20:08 |
celeron55 |
how about finding stuff to do; it's not like there is lack of it |
| 20:08 |
Kam_ |
I can handle those kinds of things, no worries |
| 20:08 |
sapier |
ok :) you're welcome |
| 20:09 |
sapier |
do you have a android device? |
| 20:09 |
Kam_ |
No longer, but I could but up android on my laptop xD |
| 20:09 |
Kam_ |
boot* |
| 20:10 |
sapier |
hmm we don't have x86 android support yet ... but there are other things to check :-) |
| 20:10 |
sapier |
https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pulls gere are some things to be tested |
| 20:10 |
celeron55 |
all of our remotely easy things tend to be on the game content side, and that tends to be developed independently outside of the scope of #minetest-dev |
| 20:11 |
celeron55 |
so it's rather problematic to give things to do to random people |
| 20:12 |
Kam_ |
hahaha |
| 20:12 |
celeron55 |
basically, i suggest just taking this, choosing something that seems fixable, asking here whether it's okay to fix it in way X that you intend to do, and then doing it: https://github.com/minetest/minetest/issues?direction=desc&labels=&milestone=&page=1&sort=created&state=open |
| 20:12 |
Kam_ |
Is the codebase nicely organized? |
| 20:13 |
celeron55 |
it depends on what you are used to |
| 20:13 |
celeron55 |
it's definitely not the best, and definitely not the worst |
| 20:13 |
Kam_ |
I am best familiar with the 0ad codebase, I spent a lot of time reading and writing there |
| 20:14 |
celeron55 |
one thing is sure: if you like perfectionism, you can't find it here |
| 20:14 |
celeron55 |
well let's see... |
| 20:14 |
Kam_ |
The src directory is definitely organized differently |
| 20:15 |
sapier |
codebase is in quite messy in huge parts, we're cleaning it but nit all at once |
| 20:15 |
celeron55 |
0ad is way better organized, at least seemingly |
| 20:16 |
celeron55 |
(https://github.com/0ad/0ad) |
| 20:16 |
Kam_ |
0ad uses raw fixed pipeline OpenGL and writes their own engine and interface, minetest seems much simpler in that respect |
| 20:16 |
sapier |
we do write parts of irrlicht ourselfs too ... as irrlicht is a little bit limited |
| 20:17 |
Kam_ |
Yeah kind of, I studied it for a bit a while back |
| 20:17 |
celeron55 |
well minetest hangs onto irrlicht which basically wraps fixed pipeline opengl plus a bit more; it's all the basic OSS kind of thing; when you get deep enough, everything is half-assed and nobody has time or interest to quickly improve on anything in particular |
| 20:17 |
sapier |
but it's quite suitable for us right now ... without more experience in 3d engine development we're better of with irrlicht ... but this is my personal opinion only other developers may think different |
| 20:18 |
celeron55 |
but good enough to be useful for the community, which is who makes it and who it is for |
| 20:19 |
celeron55 |
okay, i may be a bit over-pessimistic in what i say |
| 20:19 |
sapier |
step by step celeron ;-) |
| 20:20 |
Kam_ |
0ad uses fixed pipeline because the project is reaaaaaalllllly oollldd, the idea is to slowly transition to modern GL but you know how things are lol |
| 20:21 |
celeron55 |
one thing is sure though; there is a lot of legacy randomness fixed up with perfectly designed new things and everything in between |
| 20:21 |
celeron55 |
mixed up* |
| 20:21 |
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| 20:22 |
celeron55 |
when i started this project i didn't have a global community working on it and 100klines of code in mind |
| 20:22 |
celeron55 |
as the name implies |
| 20:22 |
celeron55 |
*cough* |
| 20:23 |
Kam_ |
hahaha |
| 20:26 |
celeron55 |
browsing the code, 0ad seems to be coded to somewhat similar standards, if the way more structured source tree isn't taken into account |
| 20:27 |
celeron55 |
oh whatever; anyway, you'll probably end up being your own boss here; nobody wants to take the responsibility of managing work given to you by them |
| 20:35 |
Kam_ |
Alright :) |
| 20:39 |
Kam_ |
Is there an easy way to find the list of package names of the dependencies for Arch? |
| 20:40 |
celeron55 |
well probably by looking at the arch package |
| 20:41 |
Kam_ |
lol |
| 20:41 |
Kam_ |
I meant is there an organized list so I don't need to individually find the package name for each dependency |
| 20:43 |
celeron55 |
https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/mi/minetest-git/PKGBUILD |
| 20:43 |
celeron55 |
makedepends=('git' 'cmake') |
| 20:43 |
celeron55 |
depends=('bzip2' 'libpng' 'libjpeg' 'mesa' 'sqlite' 'openal' 'libvorbis' 'irrlicht') |
| 20:44 |
celeron55 |
i think that is fairly organized |
| 20:46 |
Kam_ |
Thank you |
| 20:53 |
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| 21:01 |
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| 21:32 |
tomasbrod |
n |
| 21:32 |
tomasbrod |
sorry :( |
| 21:32 |
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| 21:34 |
sapier |
hmmm I wonder who has been as bad to him he's got reason to run away that quick ;-) |
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| 23:45 |
Kam_ |
sapier: Who ran away D: |
| 23:45 |
Kam_ |
Aw nvm lol |
