| Time |
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Message |
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| 04:49 |
hmmmm |
https://github.com/freeminer/freeminer/commit/2ad6e78d3be8c025722ffe0bd764860fa8c33389 |
| 04:49 |
hmmmm |
they can't do that |
| 04:50 |
hmmmm |
anyway it seems like an attempt to stop us from backporting any bugfixes that xyz makes |
| 04:54 |
darkrose |
actually they can do it, as LGPL 2.1 explicitely allows upgrading to GPL |
| 05:22 |
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| 05:22 |
Tesseract |
Minetest was switched to LGPL from GPL before... |
| 05:36 |
hmmmm |
not without the permission of all the other authors |
| 06:10 |
ShadowNinja |
Yes. |
| 06:54 |
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| 09:33 |
celeron55 |
GPL? well fuck that |
| 09:33 |
celeron55 |
at least there's a reason to use minetest now even if you hate our way of merging things |
| 09:34 |
specing |
Why did you switch to LGPL? |
| 09:35 |
specing |
Minetest is not a library |
| 09:35 |
celeron55 |
i would have switched to MIT/BSD if i could have |
| 09:35 |
celeron55 |
it's the most free that was possible with the accumulated contributors |
| 09:37 |
celeron55 |
there's no way in hell i would allow anything even a single bit more restrictive |
| 09:39 |
specing |
GPL is much better than MIT/BSD, it gives me as a user all the right I want and as much rights to the authors as possible |
| 09:40 |
specing |
BSD/MIT pretty much give the user everything |
| 09:40 |
Calinou |
supporting GPL? here we go, specing! |
| 09:40 |
specing |
YES |
| 09:40 |
Calinou |
I thought you were BSD fanatic though |
| 09:41 |
specing |
I doubt you would legally be able to do anything with those globeminner/android payed "we made it" clones if you switched to BSD/MIT |
| 09:42 |
celeron55 |
of course i couldn't |
| 09:42 |
Calinou |
they would even be legal, I think |
| 09:42 |
specing |
All you could do would be sit down and cry |
| 09:42 |
celeron55 |
i wouldn't care even now if people wouldn't have contributed that expect LGPL to be followed |
| 09:44 |
specing |
Good thing your contributors care |
| 09:45 |
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| 09:50 |
celeron55 |
it's mostly about the fact that if you make the license of a community project (where there is no central copyright authority) more restrictive, you lock down all the things you restricted your project away of for infinite time, with no way to get them back |
| 09:51 |
Calinou |
you can change license? |
| 09:51 |
specing |
what |
| 09:52 |
specing |
all the stuff made under the GPL license can be ripped out and put into a different project under the GPL license |
| 09:52 |
celeron55 |
it's only possible through the agreement of all copyright holders; there does not exist an agreement that would allow eg. me to change the licensing of minetest to whatever i want |
| 09:52 |
celeron55 |
specing: and? that didn't change the license |
| 09:52 |
celeron55 |
and you're stuck with the exact same limitations |
| 09:52 |
Calinou |
CLA/copyright assignment |
| 09:52 |
celeron55 |
with LGPL you have a bit of room to move around if you have to |
| 09:53 |
Calinou |
you moved from GPL to LGPL fine, in the past, BTW ;) |
| 09:53 |
specing |
sure, you can't take other people's work, close source it and start selling it under a different name |
| 09:53 |
celeron55 |
Calinou: with the agreement of practically every contributor up to that point of time |
| 09:53 |
celeron55 |
Calinou: it was a huge PITA and now there's like 100 times the contributors |
| 09:53 |
specing |
What are these "limitations" of GPL you speak of? |
| 09:53 |
celeron55 |
and really legally you are in a gray area even if one of them disagrees |
| 09:54 |
specing |
... because I really can't see any |
| 09:56 |
celeron55 |
also, if a GPL fork of minetest becomes succesful, it's only possible due to the fact that the original had a permissive enough license originally; it could have as well been more restrictive than GPL, making it impossible |
| 09:56 |
celeron55 |
i do not believe that GPL is some magic balance between permissiveness and nonpermissiveness |
| 09:56 |
celeron55 |
there's no reason to believe that |
| 09:59 |
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| 09:59 |
Calinou |
in practice there's almost never problems with GPL software, except obvious violations |
| 09:59 |
Calinou |
(usually done by companies) |
| 10:03 |
sapier |
gpl software especially libraries are defacto useless for any company not doing distribution work only |
| 10:03 |
sapier |
in case you sell to usa with all those patent crap it's even more critical |
| 10:04 |
sapier |
and I don't even wanna talk about gplv3 which is a nightmare because you can't even use your own "pseudopatents" to defend yourself in usa |
| 10:04 |
sapier |
well I guess if there was any doubt about freeminers intentions they're settled down now |
| 10:06 |
sapier |
at least I don't need to have a look if freeminer already fixed a problem in future :-) |
| 10:08 |
sapier |
ciaranG I'm merging your abm fixes now |
| 10:13 |
Calinou |
"defend" *cough* |
| 10:14 |
sapier |
I'm not a friend of software patents imho they should be abolished but as long as americans are as crazy about them as they are you need to play their game or vanish |
| 10:16 |
sapier |
https://github.com/Selat/minetest/commit/c92ab934ce2bd5160c0747041cff8af6f987114c does anyone have concerns about this one? |
| 10:28 |
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| 11:30 |
celeron55 |
seems fine |
| 11:32 |
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| 11:39 |
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| 12:07 |
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| 13:01 |
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| 13:01 |
xyz |
sapier: can you explain how you fixed SIGBUS issue with Android and async env? |
| 13:03 |
sapier |
I don't have curl in there by now so I guess I wouldn't have stubled into this ... btw do you intend to release your fixes in a mt compatible way? |
| 13:03 |
sapier |
+license |
| 13:03 |
xyz |
what fixes? |
| 13:04 |
sapier |
well freeminer switched to gplv3 meaning everything you push there is useless to minetest |
| 13:05 |
sapier |
as matter of fact it'd be even risky to have a look how things are done there on fixing mintest issues |
| 13:05 |
xyz |
but it seems it should call asyncOnlineFavourites regardless of whether it's built with curl or not |
| 13:05 |
xyz |
so what fixes are you talking about? |
| 13:05 |
sapier |
generaly speaking |
| 13:05 |
sapier |
most of the crashes resulted from androids broken wchar handling |
| 13:06 |
sapier |
after fixing it all those "strange crashes" where gone |
| 13:06 |
xyz |
that's only because you used official ndk, in crystax that I'm using there's nothing wrong with wchar |
| 13:06 |
sapier |
well unofficial ndks are useless |
| 13:07 |
sapier |
they stop support and what then? stay at antique version? create your own ndk ? |
| 13:08 |
xyz |
yes that sucks |
| 13:08 |
sapier |
maybe crystax isn't as clean as it seems to be about the wchar things too? |
| 13:08 |
xyz |
because it already seems to be ded |
| 13:08 |
xyz |
well, I'll try with official NDK |
| 13:09 |
sapier |
as you are there how did you manage to integrate android code to ndk? |
| 13:09 |
xyz |
btw, I don't like how you const wchar_t* wide_chars = L" !\"#$%&'()*+,-./0123456789:;<=>?@ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ[\\]^_`abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz{|}~"; |
| 13:09 |
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| 13:10 |
sapier |
I don't like that code too but I didn't find a better way by now |
| 13:10 |
xyz |
what do you mean by "android code"? |
| 13:10 |
sapier |
that progress bar on copying files is native java code isn't it? |
| 13:11 |
xyz |
check out $NDK/sources/android/support/README |
| 13:11 |
xyz |
maybe it'll solve all wchar troubles |
| 13:11 |
xyz |
ah yes it is |
| 13:11 |
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| 13:11 |
sapier |
how did you manage to show it? |
| 13:12 |
xyz |
it's set as the default activity and when it finishes it calls nativeactivity |
| 13:13 |
sapier |
sad, I was hoping for a way to show java native ui elements from c++ |
| 13:14 |
sapier |
true that library could really help avoiding that hacky conversion |
| 13:15 |
xyz |
you can do that too |
| 13:15 |
xyz |
but you really don't want to do it |
| 13:15 |
xyz |
trust me |
| 13:15 |
sapier |
why not? |
| 13:16 |
sapier |
I've seen the code to be crude but e.g. for text input I don't see a lot of different options |
| 13:17 |
xyz |
because JNI calls |
| 13:17 |
xyz |
every JNI call is like 10 lines of boilerplate and then it crashes in some random place |
| 13:18 |
xyz |
so just have a part of it written in Java, it's the best way |
| 13:18 |
sapier |
yes that's what I meant whith crude ... I already have that part, what I'm missing now is how to get that damn java code to my apk :-) |
| 13:19 |
sapier |
I thought I'd just have to extend nativeactivity and then replace it in AndroidManifest ... but for some strange reason that doesn't have any effect |
| 13:21 |
xyz |
you just put it into "src" and it just works |
| 13:22 |
sapier |
as usuall this doesn't work for me for some strange reason ;-/ |
| 13:23 |
xyz |
that's bad |
| 13:23 |
sapier |
I guess it's some silly mistake somewhere in config ... as alway |
| 13:23 |
sapier |
s |
| 13:26 |
sapier |
maybe it's related to using glue lib |
| 13:38 |
sapier |
no it isn't ... seems ant ignores new files if you don't do a clean before |
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| 21:10 |
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| 21:44 |
sapier |
argh ... I start to understand why noone writes a single application in multiple languages |
| 21:45 |
sapier |
android build now contains executable code in 3 languages ... java/c++/lua |
| 22:00 |
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| 22:03 |
sapier |
celeron55 can you try if those new android style input dialogs work for you ? http://animalsmod.comuf.com/downloads/Minetest-debug.apk |
| 22:09 |
celeron55 |
they seem to |
| 22:09 |
sapier |
the implementation is quite ugly now but I guess it's good enough to get some user feedback about this way of text input |
| 22:10 |
celeron55 |
in a kind of non-tweaked way though; i'd expect to be able to press enter to accept a single-line field but instead it starts a new line in it (i have to close the keyboard and click the dialog button) |
| 22:10 |
celeron55 |
(the button is behind the keyboard) |
| 22:11 |
sapier |
hmm let me have a look if this is just a parameter of this dialog |
| 22:11 |
celeron55 |
now i managed to do something so that the main menu is visible but takes no input whatsoever |
| 22:11 |
celeron55 |
oh, the back button fixed it |
| 22:11 |
celeron55 |
i wonder what that was |
| 22:12 |
sapier |
text input is a separate (transparent) activity ... you managed to hide the dialog without closing it |
| 22:12 |
celeron55 |
oh, apparently tapping the menu when the dialog is showing hides the dialog but the dialog still takes input |
| 22:12 |
sapier |
that shouldn't happen but obviously I missed a case |
| 22:13 |
sapier |
ok :-) sounds like the situation I missed :-) at least one of them |
| 22:13 |
celeron55 |
anyway this is infinitely better than before (because i actually can input text now) |
| 22:14 |
sapier |
good but it's a prototype only I didn't manage to call back to c++ from java by now ... no idea why but java always claims my jni function doesn't exist ... I even used javah to create the header from java code ... no success |
| 22:16 |
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| 22:19 |
sapier |
works by polling the java part for closed dialog by now ;-) |
| 22:19 |
celeron55 |
also it seems chat messages are sent twice |
| 22:20 |
kahrl |
sapier: don't you need to static { System.loadLibrary("whatever_file_the_native_part_is_in.so"); }? |
| 22:20 |
sapier |
yes I discovered this too ... wonder if that bug is in master too :) |
| 22:21 |
sapier |
kahrl I thought this is implicitly done by NativeActivity? my Java part is an extention to it |
| 22:21 |
kahrl |
what is NativeActivity? |
| 22:21 |
sapier |
sadly documentation for ndk <-> java is quite minor |
| 22:21 |
kahrl |
oh, something android specific |
| 22:21 |
kahrl |
no idea |
| 22:21 |
sapier |
a class provided by android to directly create a Activity from a native lib |
| 22:22 |
kahrl |
yeah I only used jni on windows so far |
| 22:22 |
sapier |
I guess this class has something to do with the problem |
| 22:22 |
sapier |
but I'd have to implement all the interfacing myself if I can't use it :-( |
| 22:24 |
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| 22:59 |
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| 23:03 |
sapier |
celeron55 the new version (same link) will exit input activity on clicking somewhere else as well as use "enter" to accept input |
| 23:03 |
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| 23:21 |
ShadowNinja |
~tell sapier The edit box is big and ugly. Can you use a more modern android theme and remove extra bits like the window title? |
| 23:21 |
ShadowBot |
ShadowNinja: O.K. |
| 23:54 |
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