Minetest logo

IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2013-11-02

| Channels | #minetest-dev index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:17 VanessaE ShadowNinja: you never gave me your opinion on the revisions to #959 ...
00:25 proller i think.. i found...
00:25 proller IT
00:25 VanessaE IT?
00:25 proller IT!!!
00:26 proller source of server LAG
00:26 VanessaE wht what?
00:26 VanessaE spill it dammit
00:26 proller 5 min and i will push
00:28 VanessaE wait, what IS the problem?
00:28 proller server process only one packet per step
00:29 proller every client generate 10 only for move
00:31 VanessaE so 10 packets come in from a client, but only one of them gets processed?
00:31 VanessaE are you absolutely sure that you're about to change this for the better?
00:32 VanessaE I could see this causing a rise in CPU load on the server if the packet flow isn't reduced a bit to compensate.
00:34 proller usually step faster than 0.1s
00:34 VanessaE well
00:34 VanessaE 10/sec is the current default
00:34 proller but if you use lot of mods with liquid_finite - step can be longer
00:34 VanessaE riiiight
00:34 proller 10 clients generate 100 packets per second
00:35 VanessaE eek
00:35 proller if all moving
00:35 VanessaE I can see that affecting a lot more than just finite liquid servers
00:35 proller every server with lot of clients
00:55 proller runned on sky
00:55 VanessaE ?
00:57 proller https://github.com/proller/minetest/commit​/a1da6a871c35ed71be94367a8797c3faf7d60076
00:58 VanessaE so you'll process up to 100 packets per server step?
00:58 proller yes
00:59 kaeza that could be made configurable
00:59 proller but usually less
00:59 proller no need to configure it
00:59 VanessaE it might be a good idea to make it configurable, yeah
00:59 VanessaE in case someone has a high-end server that can handle say several thousand packets/step
01:00 proller who want to test - welcome to "Sky"
01:00 pitriss i second that ide a to make it configurable
01:02 proller ok
01:03 VanessaE it might be prudent to test out the 100 limit on a high-traffic server, in case that much is still too high of a default
01:03 VanessaE (slow machines, etc)
01:05 proller now i will try on my odroid
01:08 proller seems much better
01:09 VanessaE connect to it from several clients
01:09 VanessaE try to flood it with connections - simulate a very busy server
01:10 VanessaE even to the point of *almost* DOS'ing it.
01:16 proller my opengl broken
01:16 proller i use software render
01:19 proller four of me, need more
01:20 VanessaE four ain't enough :)\
01:20 VanessaE you need about 20 or 30 of you ;)
01:23 proller its problem for my notebook
01:23 VanessaE address?
01:23 VanessaE I'll flood it ;)
01:24 proller 80.240.216.69:30010
01:24 proller or "Sky" in servers
01:26 proller cooool
01:26 VanessaE there, is that enough? :D
01:27 VanessaE I have a lot of RAM to burn ;)
01:28 VanessaE <proller>  STOP!  MY MODEM IS BURNING!!!!!!!
01:28 VanessaE :D
01:28 kaeza Mine's still downloading media :<
01:29 proller 100% cpu
01:29 VanessaE all of mine are still awaiting media also
01:30 proller blocks not loading
01:30 kaeza 100% CPU is not very... informative
01:30 kaeza which CPU? OS?
01:30 VanessaE kaeza: I nailed him with 13 live minetest clients :D
01:31 kaeza O_O
01:32 proller i core of corei7 freebsd
01:32 proller problem with media
01:32 proller need to join slower
01:32 kaeza VanessaE, random_input = true?
01:32 VanessaE nope
01:32 VanessaE I didn't even think about that
01:33 proller but game playable
01:33 VanessaE shall I cancel them all out?
01:33 proller instant blocks placing
01:33 proller wait please
01:33 kaeza that setting wil come in handy here, since it simulates a real live client
01:33 VanessaE thus far none of them have completed the login process
01:33 VanessaE (one of them appears to be crashed)
01:34 proller sending files via udp is.. is....
01:34 VanessaE is...slow until kahrl finishes his http_fetch work
01:34 VanessaE which will be soon, I[m sure
01:34 proller now better
01:35 * VanessaE kills off the crashed client
01:35 proller it still playable
01:36 VanessaE shall I add a few more clients?
01:36 proller can 10 more
01:36 proller now 18
01:38 VanessaE I now have 22 clients open :)
01:38 VanessaE my CPU is screaming bloody murder at me :)
01:38 proller but there are already max_users=30 players.
01:39 proller block loading problem
01:39 proller chat instant
01:39 VanessaE shall I kill these off yet? :)
01:40 proller dig-place instant
01:40 proller packets  errs idrops      bytes    packets  errs      bytes colls
01:40 proller 677     0     0      58151        645     0     349476     0
01:40 proller 689     0     0      51810        681     0     326439     0
01:40 proller 691     0     0      48230        652     0     304881     0
01:40 VanessaE and leave-flood :D
01:40 VanessaE all but one (which seems to be the only one still alive)
01:41 VanessaE ha!
01:41 VanessaE I killed all those clients already
01:41 proller blocks loading ok
01:41 VanessaE not for me
01:41 VanessaE blocks are not reliably loading
01:42 proller need to try with http media
01:43 proller or slowly one-by-one join
01:49 kaeza oh also small typo: s/recieved/received/
01:50 proller and playable on arm!
01:50 proller kaeza, ok
01:53 proller finite liquds flow fast on cpu from galaxy s2
01:55 VanessaE proller: have you done any work with the infinite/regular liquids to make them behave better?
01:56 proller only "range" removed
01:56 proller and levels adjustable too
01:56 proller and small visual fixes
01:56 proller and its not merged
01:57 VanessaE well I meant in terms of the water flowing readily without consuming tons of CPU for things like those huge fountains pilzadam and I tested with
01:57 proller and no sense touch old liquids because they not liquid 8)
01:58 proller smaller queue and longer liquid starting flow
02:00 VanessaE note to self:  buy proller a book on learning to write complete sentences ;)
02:00 proller 8(
02:01 Miner_48er joined #minetest-dev
02:09 VanessaE aw I was only kidding :)
02:11 celeron55 joined #minetest-dev
03:50 proller VanessaE, switched to remote media 8)
03:50 VanessaE ok
03:51 proller and max 100 users
03:51 VanessaE I'll attack in a few minutes :D
04:03 proller screen minetest --address 80.240.216.69 --port 30010 --go --name t1
04:04 VanessaE is THAT how it works??
04:04 VanessaE ready? :)
04:08 VanessaE MUAHAHAHAHA!
04:09 kaeza dis gon b gud
04:10 VanessaE here come a few more
04:12 VanessaE proller: do I stop or keep going?
04:12 proller wait
04:12 * VanessaE waits.
04:13 VanessaE lemme bring up the last few that timed out.
04:13 proller they not fall
04:13 VanessaE I noticed that.
04:14 proller strange
04:14 VanessaE they're all default, plain unmodified client
04:14 VanessaE (null video, random input turned on)
04:14 proller maybe still not recieved spawn block
04:14 VanessaE maybe
04:14 VanessaE a lot of them are dieing with floating point exceptions (!)
04:14 VanessaE [66]   Floating point exception(core dumped) minetest --address 80.240.216.69 --port 30010 --go --name test-user-$i --config ~/.minetest/minetest.conf-flooding
04:15 VanessaE why is your spawn point so high up, anyway?
04:16 proller its fun
04:16 proller and anti - grief
04:16 proller cpu ~50%
04:17 proller net 100-200 pps
04:17 VanessaE looks like I can top out at 29 clients
04:17 VanessaE after that I seem to get lots of float point exceptions
04:18 proller mem 158356k
04:18 VanessaE wow
04:19 VanessaE not bad.
04:19 proller but need to optimize block-sending
04:19 proller i thing 100 players is not limit
04:19 proller think
04:20 proller after optimize
04:20 VanessaE yep, I'm maxing out at a clean 29 clients.
04:20 ShadowNinja Hmmm, better talk to someone else familiar with the net code, but that sounds great!
04:21 VanessaE oh wow, my CPU's maxed out completely.
04:21 VanessaE all 6 cores at 100%
04:22 VanessaE BAM!  leave flood ;)
04:22 proller player action instant
04:22 VanessaE here comes the next wave.
04:23 proller most lag on joins
04:23 VanessaE yeah
04:23 VanessaE and now I seem to have botched my password.  mind resetting it?
04:24 proller on my server?
04:24 VanessaE yeah
04:24 proller need to restart
04:24 VanessaE ok
04:25 proller i think enough
04:25 VanessaE ok
04:46 VanessaE 80.240.216.69:30010   1/100, 45
04:46 VanessaE haha
04:54 VanessaE I'm off to bed.  good luck, proller
05:40 celeron55 why don't you just put it on VanessaE's server
05:40 celeron55 real-life testing tends to give useful results
05:41 celeron55 and you didn't even test it without the patch
05:44 celeron55 now that i look at it, that fix does exactly nothing
05:45 celeron55 if you look at what AsyncRunStep() does, it doesn't do anything unless enough time has passed since it was last called
05:51 celeron55 the thing wouldn't work even in singleplayer if it wasn't so
05:56 ShadowNinja VanessaE: #959 looks better, although it needs some tweaks(shorter lines, foolproofing for unknown nodes, and a few others). I still would like infinitestacks to be detected in the function, but I don't know how that should be done.
05:59 ShadowNinja I notice there are three nick-quiets and a nick-ban in here, which are completely ineffective. <-- celeron55?
06:01 ShadowNinja Night for me too, bye.
07:13 nore joined #minetest-dev
07:16 darkrose joined #minetest-dev
07:16 darkrose joined #minetest-dev
07:22 nore any thoughts on #976?
07:47 EdB joined #minetest-dev
07:47 proller celeron55, my server is real and runned without patch more than half year
07:48 Ritchie joined #minetest-dev
08:04 proller and it works even in singleplayer
08:41 celeron55 obviously it works because it changes nothing
08:42 proller grep lag debug.txt | wc -l
08:42 proller 208
08:43 proller it solves problem
08:43 celeron55 no it doesn't
08:43 celeron55 look at the god damn code
08:43 celeron55 i'm not going to even argue with this
08:43 proller okay
08:44 nore celeron55, about the ABMs in Lua
08:44 nore I made speed tests
08:44 nore dirt and dirt_with_grass ABMs take each less that 0.25ms to execute for all nodes
08:45 nore and saplings take 150ms for each sapling that grows whereas it was 130ms before
08:45 celeron55 proller: it merely prioritizes incoming packets over server processing and outgoing packets resulting from the processing
08:45 celeron55 which lessens lag in certain things and increases lag in other things
08:46 proller celeron55, try to play in your game, try to join servers, not in your imaginary spacecraft simulator, in minetest
08:47 celeron55 nore: i saw that; i have no comments
08:49 celeron55 proller: make a clone of your server and run the other one without the patch and the other one with it
08:49 nore so you reckon it is fast enough?
08:50 celeron55 nore: i think there is no real alternative anyway
08:50 Calinou joined #minetest-dev
08:51 celeron55 (but it still remains a problem that there is duplicated tree-growing code)
08:52 nore about duplicated tree-growing code, trees could be changed to be made in Lua too
08:52 nore added by an on_generated on something like that
08:52 nore but I reckon it wouldn't be very efficient, though
08:52 celeron55 they should be changed to use the decoration functionality of the mapgen
08:52 celeron55 but is it ready yet?
08:52 proller celeron55, you can reproduce it in single player, liquid_finite=1 + 2 mobs mods, or just slow cpu (arm)  - fast move to new area, debug packets - and you will see server process client moves after 1-2...10 ...  seconds
08:53 nore yes, but decorations don't produce good trees
08:53 nore if changed, there should be a callback for decoration placement
08:53 celeron55 have you tried pilztest?
08:54 nore celeron55, I have, and I find the trees look all the same
08:54 nore they all have the same height, IIRC, and the same leaves pattern
08:54 celeron55 but it's not worse than the current trees
08:55 nore the current trees are all different...
08:55 proller maybe use 5-10 predefined schemes?
08:55 nore perhaps the best to do would be to wait for a mapgen gecoration placement callback, and then add the trees
08:55 celeron55 uhm... well, there definitely should be some way to make good trees with the mapgen
08:56 celeron55 without speed decrease
08:56 nore proller, yes, but that does not fix the issue of game-specific trees...
08:57 celeron55 what if some optionally enableable "tree-mangling" functionality was added to schematics placed as decorations
08:57 proller make tree api with lot of growing variants? random, scheme, ...
08:57 nore if a game wants different growing trees, how can we change the mapgen *for that game only* ?
08:57 celeron55 it would use some heuristics to make variation to the schematic
08:58 proller like minetest.define_tree({...params...})
08:58 proller register_tree
08:58 celeron55 proller: the L-system thing exists for that purpose, really
08:58 celeron55 maybe it should be just fixed
08:58 celeron55 (fixed for speed)
08:59 celeron55 there are rumours that it's slow because of how it does lighting but i haven't looked into it
09:00 nore celeron55, the mapgen would have to be able to support trees registered in Lua
09:00 nore and the tree API will never be enough to support all kind of trees
09:01 proller l-tree now place only one tree, i'm about like-ore generator, just register your trees and place conditions, and it will spawn them automaticaly
09:01 nore so a tree growing function should be called each time a tree grows...
09:02 nore does anyone know how costly is a Lua call?
09:03 nore I mean, the time to make the call
09:04 proller depend on params
09:06 nore vm data, a voxelArea, a pos, a bool, an int
09:07 nore what would that cost?
09:08 celeron55 the mapgen uses a vmanip in itself, i guess hmmmm has some optimization in there to not require copying it?
09:09 nore dunno, perhaps tree code should be made one when this is done...
09:10 proller one for tree or 100 per node?
09:17 sapier joined #minetest-dev
09:23 nore joined #minetest-dev
09:23 nore what I said while I had network problems:
09:23 nore <nore> ok, perhaps it would be better to have a function that is called for all trees at once
09:23 nore <nore> but anyway, the tree code is far too specific
09:23 nore <nore> they may only grow on grass and dirt on mapgen
09:23 nore <nore> so a game that wants to put trees in other places has to make its own tree generation
09:24 nore celeron55, ^
09:25 celeron55 the decoration placement has been made to provide that kind of placement
09:25 nore perhaps I could try to put treegen in default...
09:25 nore yes, but decorations do not provide callbacks when placing
09:25 nore so one could place saplings with that, but no trees...
09:25 celeron55 let's add a callback-type decoration? 8)
09:26 celeron55 hmmmm might hate it but if it gets stuff done, it might be good
09:26 nore I guess hmmmm should do that...
09:26 nore why should he hate it?
09:26 sapier is it only my feeling or are current discussions more suitable to a merge window then a prerelease?
09:26 celeron55 speed problems are the only probable issue i guess
09:27 nore celeron55, yes
09:27 nore the idea would be to make all callbacks at once, from Lua and not C
09:27 celeron55 sapier: that's true
09:27 nore and only one callback from C
09:27 nore but that would still be slow
09:28 celeron55 how about leaving this tree and grass stuff to after 0.4.8?
09:28 sapier while I'm absolutely positive about improving tree generation I don't think this is something to be called a blocker for 0.4.8
09:28 nore well, I would like the ABMs to be removed from core before 0.4.8, or at least be disableable...
09:28 celeron55 and focusing on just adding all necessary fixes and releasing it, and then continuing from this after it
09:29 nore but the mapgen things could wait a bit
09:29 celeron55 at least proller and sapier have patches that are necessary to make things work
09:30 nore celeron55, perhaps add a setting in minetest.conf to disable core tree growing and core dirt/dirt_with_grass conversion
09:30 nore so games could change it if they want
09:30 nore and leave the other things to after 0.4.8
09:30 celeron55 nore: if you add a comment in the duplicate tree growing code that it's duplicate and will be replaced with something in the future, i guess the patch is fine
09:30 sapier and we have multiple ways to fix the modstore stalling right now we need to discuss and decide what's best to do ... both aren't "small" fixes
09:30 nore in the core one?
09:31 celeron55 nore: i was thinking of the minetest_game one, but maybe explain it in bot
09:31 celeron55 +h
09:31 proller after my night patch speed of abm not very important
09:31 nore the one that should be removed is the core one, isn't it?
09:31 nore anyway, I will add that in both
09:31 celeron55 i don't know
09:31 celeron55 really both will be removed eventually
09:33 nore WARNING: this code is duplicate and will get removed in the future. <-- I added that
09:33 nore is it ok?
09:35 celeron55 more like "NOTE: Tree-placing code is currently duplicated in the engine and in games that have saplings; both are deprecated but not replaced yet."
09:36 nore both deprecated?
09:37 celeron55 s/Tree-placing code/This tree-placing code/g
09:37 celeron55 yes
09:37 nore how will tree be placed then?
09:38 celeron55 with schematics or the L-system or something; not with that old code
09:38 nore if it is Lua decoration callback, it will be the same code...
09:38 celeron55 what invokes the tree-placing code isn't relevant
09:41 Akien joined #minetest-dev
09:44 nore joined #minetest-dev
09:44 jin_xi joined #minetest-dev
09:46 nore joined #minetest-dev
09:47 nore joined #minetest-dev
09:49 nore joined #minetest-dev
09:53 BlockMen joined #minetest-dev
09:53 BlockMen #928 is ready to merge now
09:53 BlockMen and here the testing code: http://pastebin.com/YRGHVHk1
09:54 ImQ009 joined #minetest-dev
09:54 * BlockMen switch to hexadecimal colors and added kahrl's hexcolor-parser
09:54 nore joined #minetest-dev
09:58 nore_ joined #minetest-dev
09:59 nore celeron55, so, can it be merged?
10:06 celeron55 i think it's good now (in the context of the future plans)
10:09 sapier https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/977 ok here it is I did additional cleanup and documentation so it's ready for review
10:12 nore sapier, can it be called in_game too?
10:12 sapier not for 0.4.8
10:13 sapier it's planed to be added later but I don't want to open up a risky thing like that for upcoming release
10:13 nore ok...
10:14 sapier and of course prior adding all of those scriptapi functions need to be checked if they can be called from async ... quite some work
10:15 nore yes, but I mean can Lua-only things be called?
10:15 nore i.e., a voxelmanip data, and some parameters to do a lot of work
10:15 sapier of course those would work at once but I guess there isn't much use for it (except voxelmanip)
10:16 sapier and you should consider a async call is a costly operation so if you just switch some nodes it may be even more performant to be done synchronous
10:24 PilzAdam joined #minetest-dev
10:24 celeron55 should we add something to the topic mentioning this semi-feature-freeze until 0.4.8?
10:25 nore perhaps...
10:25 celeron55 i guess not
10:25 nore but if we do, everyone will ask when will 0.4.8 be out
10:25 celeron55 it even isn't a semi-feature-freeze because many features are really about to go in
10:25 jin_xi hey, my two cents to trees and deco discussion: i talked to hmmm about deco callbacks and he said he planned to add them. i wanted to do it myself, but idk how... anyways i think the lsystem treegen should really be done in lua for more flexibility. in my experience speed should not be an issue, as its about the same
10:26 nore jin_xi, about deco callbacks, I guess this will be done to remove that duplicated  code for default trees
10:26 celeron55 sapier: you should publicize your membership on https://github.com/minetest?tab=members
10:26 nore and you say you have coded the spawn-tree thing in Lua?
10:27 celeron55 sapier: you not being publicly in there already caused confusion 8)
10:28 jin_xi hmm, i did a turtle thing that is not tree specific but does all sort of structures, just look at my posts in the forum...
10:29 nore so perhaps the spawn-tree code should be done in Lua?
10:29 jin_xi i think 'trees' with both schematics and custom lua on deco callback should be able to do everything anybody could ever want to do
10:30 celeron55 BlockMen requested himself to be a core dev; objections?
10:31 nore I don't have any
10:33 PilzAdam celeron55, not that Im against it, but hes not very active in this channel
10:34 celeron55 he has said 906 lines here this year though
10:35 celeron55 it's about the same as ShadowNinja, and 10% of you or me
10:35 nore celeron55, how do you get the number of lines?
10:35 celeron55 i grep my logs 8)
10:35 nore so, how many lines I have written this year?
10:36 * celeron55 has always logs available for grepping facts out
10:36 celeron55 1550
10:36 PilzAdam I liked the form you had a while ago to find the first core devs
10:36 * nore likes the verb "to grep"
10:36 PilzAdam it makes sure that all core devs share the same goals
10:37 nore what was that form?
10:37 BlockMen PilzAdam, core dev can also be thrown out agan and i would like to know what you make think im having that different goals
10:37 BlockMen s/dev/devs
10:38 PilzAdam BlockMen, I dont think you have different goals, I just dont know yours
10:38 celeron55 PilzAdam: related to this, i said:
10:38 celeron55 13:00:20 < celeron55> i'm basing this addition on the hope that if people follow  what i wrote here, it's possible to avoid huge conflicts in  direction and unmergeable work: http://c55.me/blog/?p=1491
10:38 celeron55 anyone is free to disagree of course
10:40 nore celeron55, there are some suggestions of adding more "official" games...
10:40 nore should that be done?
10:41 celeron55 i left that open in that post... because i don't know
10:41 nore I reckon we need several very different games...
10:41 PilzAdam well, we obviously dont "throw out" core devs who dont agree with our goals
10:41 nore but I don't know if I am the only one to have that opinion
10:43 celeron55 my opinion is that competing with minecraft in it's own game is boring, which is why we should stretch ourselves a bit because our technology allows doing it with reasonable effort
10:45 celeron55 but there are many ways to organize that and it is the actual problem
10:45 BlockMen well, since my goals seem to be unclear: my main goal is make minetest more stable(if necessary) and allow as much individuality as possible (with focus on game modes)
10:45 BlockMen and if you say no, that does not fit, ok. but i hope its more clear now what my focus is on
10:46 celeron55 one question is, where are the people who would make content of publishable quality
10:46 celeron55 we clearly have people who can work on the engine; that's not an issue
10:47 nore celeron55, do you mean modders?
10:47 celeron55 and... with content, even quality isn't a problem; there just should be... something
10:47 celeron55 some people suggest shipping minetest with no games at all
10:47 nore we perhaps need more people to work on minetest_game...
10:47 nore and other games too...
10:47 celeron55 and make it possible to easily get a subgame in it
10:48 BlockMen a game manager would be nice
10:48 nore yes, perhaps if a game is good enough, allow to ship it with minetest could be nice
10:48 nore (and put it in default builds)
10:52 PilzAdam BlockMen, you seem to think in the same direction as I do: games are the future
10:52 PilzAdam the problem with mods is that they all depend on a single game (which is minetest_game currently), and there are obviously problems when we try to make one game for everyone
10:52 celeron55 so a thing that would work out technically just fine currently is choosing multiple games to put into minetest packages; the issue is, who chooses them and by what criteria
10:53 PilzAdam so the Minetest engine should become a generic engine, and allow multiple different games to run
10:55 celeron55 and the other issue is that there currently aren't games that are built to take advantage of this way of doing things
10:55 celeron55 eh, let's start talking about subgames
10:55 BlockMen celeron55, i would prefer a good way to offer games instead bundle them with packages. because i expect many games to come in future and that makes your question more difficult
10:55 celeron55 (this "game" term is confusing even myself)
10:56 celeron55 BlockMen: that's the future for sure; but what about the close future when we don't have the systems for that set up?
10:57 celeron55 ideally 0.4.8 would have something to show off this new way of doing things
10:57 BlockMen for the close future:packages and which could be decided on#-dev or by devs
11:02 Jordach joined #minetest-dev
11:03 celeron55 okay so anyway; BlockMen is approved
11:04 nore I reckon we need something to replace hacky_swap_node code
11:04 nore because now, each time it is done, the clients thinks meta has disappeared
11:04 nore and formspec closes, etc
11:04 BlockMen yay :)
11:05 nore and hacky_swap_node, is, as its name says, hacky
11:06 celeron55 so does someone want to make a proposal of what to put in the minetest 0.4.8 distribution, or do i make one?
11:07 BlockMen i think pilztest would be nice
11:07 celeron55 the proposal can really be left as-is from our part and we can just throw it as a recommendation at the face of packagers
11:07 celeron55 (which some of us are, but anyway)
11:07 IceCraft joined #minetest-dev
11:09 celeron55 my suggestion-suggestion is: 1) something that has a large amount of stuff to build with, 2) something that has some kind of challenging survival, 3) something that is as much different from those other two as possible
11:10 celeron55 "just fill in the names" 8D
11:12 nore 3) a space game... :)
11:12 nore 2) perhaps realtest, but it would need to be worked on a lot
11:12 nore 1) technic_game...
11:12 celeron55 this is one option for 3 https://github.com/celeron55/dungeon
11:12 BlockMen 1) technic_game + "moreblock", 2) pilztest, 3)like nore said
11:13 celeron55 but would need work
11:13 thexyz BlockMen: now please register @ freenode
11:15 thexyz if by 3) you meant something original then I think https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?id=6636 would fit
11:15 celeron55 could work
11:16 celeron55 if they are small games (like <0.5M), it's not like there couldn't be many of them
11:16 PilzAdam I still need a better name for pilztest
11:17 thexyz yeah, OCD is unfinished sadly
11:18 BlockMen thexyz, done
11:19 BlockMen PilzAdam, Voxelion?
11:20 celeron55 should this plan be published on the forum? maybe someone gets motivated to quickly finish some fun oddball project
11:20 celeron55 PilzAdam: my suggestion still stands
11:21 PilzAdam celeron55, I would prefer a "real" name
11:21 celeron55 games these days sometimes have names like that too
11:21 PilzAdam BlockMen, thats actually pretty nice
11:22 celeron55 that name is infinitely undescriptive
11:22 celeron55 the names of these subgames must make it somehow clear what kind of things they are
11:24 BlockMen we need something like "about" for games
11:24 BlockMen were are creator, version and descripts in shown
11:24 BlockMen s/were/where
11:24 celeron55 probably
11:25 celeron55 but still the name can't be that undescriptive
11:25 BlockMen but then you cut the creativity
11:26 celeron55 there shouldn't be any reference to voxels or blocks in subgame names unless they are especially focused on voxels and blocks
11:26 celeron55 minetest is about those things in any case so it's no news to anyone
11:26 celeron55 it's like calling a car "Car"
11:27 PilzAdam pilztest actually is focused on voxels
11:28 celeron55 what if a subgame comes out that's more focused on voxels than pilztest?
11:28 celeron55 then your name falls flat
11:29 sapier ahh didn't realize I have to do something to become visible as member -->doe
11:30 PilzAdam yea, the survival part needs to be clear in the name too
11:33 sapier there already is a game manager focused on modifying different games ... maybe it's not exactly what you meant with "game manager"
11:34 PilzAdam sapier, its not about modifying games, users shouldnt do that
11:34 PilzAdam its about installing games, like the modstore
11:35 sapier if users shouldn't modify games modstore is a little bit useless ;-) maybe we should decide about a consistent way of handling mods/games first (again)
11:38 celeron55 games are constant and they can be amended with mods
11:38 celeron55 it's like it's always been
11:39 sapier constant as of games you download yes but maybe a user wants to configure different "private games"
11:39 PilzAdam but do we really need a GUI for that?
11:40 BlockMen sapier, that does not need a manager, etc
11:40 sapier in best case user could do this within minetest and doesn't have to copy mods around
11:40 sapier of course it doesn't "require" those things but modstore isn't required too but yet a big benefit
11:40 PilzAdam I mean, there could be a 3rd party program for that, but it doesnt need to be in the Minetest main menu
11:41 sapier hmm maybe I should add a way to modify main menu less invasive than replace it completely e.g. add custom main menu tabs (for 0.4.9 of course)
11:41 BlockMen but with modstore you dont edit the mods, so with gamestore you dont change the game ;)
11:42 sapier there isn't a gamestore yet ... but that could be the naming gamestore for downloading and game(manager/editor) for modifying
11:42 Gethiox joined #minetest-dev
11:43 sapier and I don't think we'll get gamestore ready for 0.4.8 unless we want to wait until 2014 ;-)
11:45 celeron55 (that's why we're preselecting a couple of games for 0.4.8)
11:47 BlockMen another suggestion for 2) wasteland :P
11:51 sapier https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/968 any comment on this one?
11:54 celeron55 pilztest's name could refer also to the limited inventory
11:56 celeron55 blockbag? 8)
12:03 PilzAdam nore, your broke grass removing ABM
12:03 PilzAdam sunlight_propagate in Lua has a different meaning than in the engine
12:03 PilzAdam in the engine its sunlight_propagates || paramtype = "light"
12:03 PilzAdam currently you remove the dirt_with_grass under default:grass
12:06 sapier could some (2) coredevs plz agree to 968 ? ;-)
12:08 kahrl why do we have to define ZLIB_WINAPI at all? shouldn't this be in zlib.h depending on how it's been compiled?
12:08 kahrl or detected by the build system or something like that?
12:09 sapier yes but there's no autodetect within the headers
12:09 kahrl well that sucks a bit
12:09 sapier you have to define in your project what api to use so if you compile zlib the winapi style use that define if not the other one
12:10 kahrl is it the case that one is compiling with the stdcall version if and only if one uses msvc?
12:10 kahrl s/compiling/linking
12:10 sapier if stdcall means winapi style then yes
12:11 celeron55 nonstdcall 8)
12:11 zat joined #minetest-dev
12:11 kahrl std as in the first definition on this page? :P https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/STD
12:13 sapier yea there are a lot more ppl having sex just this moment than are programming right now so this priority may be even correct ;-P
12:14 sapier actually reading zlib.h it's exactly oposite you only use WINAPI calling convention if msvc compiler is used
12:15 sapier after my patches. current state is using winapi calling convention once built on windows
12:15 VanessaE ShadowNinja: line length is easy enough to fix (well, to a degree, too much obsession with it will make the formatting look like crap).  Checking for unknown nodes is already in there (lines 21, 22 as they now exist in the pull).  What "few others"?
12:16 kahrl I thought nothing would prevent you to use e.g. zlibwapi.dll with mingw
12:16 kahrl (which requires ZLIB_WINAPI)
12:17 sapier you can do this of course still it may result in having to add two different zlib dlls as you require to compile all libs to use winapi zlib
12:17 sapier while zlib dll is already basic component of mingw
12:17 sapier yet this one isn't built winapi style
12:19 kahrl we could use the wndproc hack :D
12:19 kahrl described here http://blogs.msdn.com/b/oldnewthi​ng/archive/2004/01/15/58973.aspx
12:19 sapier we could ... but why use a complicated solution if there's a small fix? ;-)
12:20 sapier it's not like you'd have to do anything more if you do a mingw build. you actually need to do less ... not download zlib dll separate ;-)
12:20 kahrl yeah well I guess if the fix works for everyone currently offering windows builds then commit it
12:21 sapier I tried building mingw32 and vs2012 ... I expect it to work with vs2010 too
12:23 celeron55 kahrl: i guess they need to change the dll they're using
12:23 celeron55 otherwise they get a million obscure link errors
12:23 celeron55 or something
12:24 celeron55 or maybe it looks to them link it works and the end result works only on computers without mingw installed? 8-)
12:24 celeron55 like*
12:24 sapier ppl using msvc don't get any difference
12:24 celeron55 with*
12:24 sapier ppl using mingw would have had a problem atm
12:24 kahrl unless they fixed it by downloading a separate dll... now they have to fix it again
12:25 sapier either they don't use gettext/freetype or have multiple dlls in there
12:26 sapier still it's way more consistent to use non winapi calling convention on mingw
12:28 kahrl how is this stuff done in irrlicht?
12:29 sapier good question I'll have a try with non self built irrlicht dlls
12:29 kahrl oh I think they bundle it
12:29 sapier I think so too but I'm not sure
12:30 celeron55 it's statically linked into there for sure
12:30 celeron55 like many other libs
12:30 sapier ok so  I don't need to test
12:30 kahrl so at least using a different zlib dll won't break irrlicht in some obscure manner
12:32 sapier as I said actually current way of doing it is broken if someone managed to work around this issue she/he didn't give back that fix by now
12:33 celeron55 the official build instructions put the msvc zlib dll into both builds
12:33 celeron55 so that's what most people have currently
12:33 sapier did anyone actually do this?
12:33 celeron55 probably almost everyone
12:34 celeron55 (who has built a mingw build)
12:34 sapier in forum msvc build is way more common than mingw
12:36 sapier still you can't do a clean mingw build without doing that change
12:36 celeron55 if you're prepared to help people who get problems out of it, it's ok 8)
12:36 sapier of course I always sort out issues I cause ;-)
12:37 sapier I guess I should update the "official build instructions" ... which didn't work for me either ;-P
12:38 BlockMen left #minetest-dev
12:38 kahrl for example PilzAdam's build has zlibwapi.dll and is made with mingw
12:39 sapier PilzAdam ? how did you do that? ;-)
12:39 celeron55 the mingw instructions worked as-is for me but i've never used gettext or freetype with them
12:42 sapier official build instructions don't cover freetype and curl at all
12:42 sapier maybe that's why nobody noticed by now
12:42 VanessaE can someone look at the current state of #959 and tell me perhaps what those other "things" might have been that shadow was referring to, so I can at least work on them?
12:45 nore PilzAdam, about that bug with dirt_with_grass
12:45 kahrl VanessaE: https://github.com/VanessaE/minetest/commi​t/f8bb9ccfb3c3d2a5e5d4afc0c95b4de1be63ef8c​#diff-19b5801567ac89eb6f0459c3c0cf2a47R29
12:46 kahrl I think it's possible that this indexes a nil value
12:46 VanessaE look at line 21.
12:46 VanessaE that catches the unknown node
12:46 sapier PilzAdam do you have any issues with compiling your mingw build against mingw zlib dll instead of separate dll?
12:46 VanessaE oh wait.
12:47 nore should I push the fix?
12:47 kahrl VanessaE: if the node is unknown that if is executed leading to line 29
12:47 VanessaE right, I missed that.
12:48 kahrl 34 probably to be made safer too
12:48 kahrl +has
12:48 VanessaE yah, on it.
12:48 VanessaE yeah*
12:51 VanessaE how's that look?
12:54 kahrl good
12:54 VanessaE excellent
12:55 kahrl now about the "other things" shadow mentioned... you'll have to ask :)
12:55 VanessaE heh, I just realized I call it a "library" yet it's only one function :P
12:55 kaeza one small bit: you could cache minetest.registered_nodes[name] locally for a tiny performance improvement
12:56 kaeza not sure if worth the effort though
13:02 VanessaE like that? :)
13:02 VanessaE (yes, I redefine it half-way through the call, but it's just a temp var so I didn't care :P )
13:03 VanessaE this could be written a tad better actually.
13:04 VanessaE there, that's better.
13:06 VanessaE hrm.  could line 34 possibly fail out with the right combination of nil fields?  I can never remember how that works out in practice.
13:06 proller full set of my patches https://github.com/minetes​t/minetest/pull/895/files - they do absolutely nothing and useless ;)
13:06 proller ^ about speed
13:07 nore VanessaE, 34?
13:08 nore 34 can not fail
13:08 VanessaE ok good.
13:10 nore about that space game perhaps shipped with Minetest... who would help doing it?
13:10 sapier did we discuss usage of "signef off" git feature by some time?
13:11 sapier I'll provide space mobs
13:11 celeron55 nore: it's not really possible to make a reasonable one at the moment due to a number of reasons
13:11 celeron55 or, it really depends on what can be considered reasonable...
13:11 nore yes, you may be right...
13:11 proller we have no darth vader mob 8(
13:12 sapier we don't?
13:12 VanessaE somehow I don't think LucasArts will accept tht :)
13:12 sapier we call it darktest
13:12 VanessaE (or whatever LucasFilms game division was)
13:14 sapier yet I'd like to merge the zlib mingw fix can I interpret celeron55's and kahrl's comments as agreement?
13:16 PilzAdam nore, how about posting the fix here first?
13:17 PilzAdam sapier, umm..... dunno about that
13:17 sapier PA does your build contain curl as well as freetype?
13:17 PilzAdam I just build wit buildbot.sh and copy the .dll files into the bin/ folder when it says that its missing them
13:17 PilzAdam yea, it does
13:18 sapier hmm interesting so at least building minetest without any dependencys might work the way it is ... with outdated libs of course
13:18 nore PilzAdam, too late...
13:18 sapier so at least I have to check if buildbot needs a fix too
13:18 nore I pushed it (anyway, the only change was to write nodedef.sunlight_propagetes or nodedef.paramtype == "light"
13:24 proller VanessaE, today i will make liquid porcessing limited by time, it helps to all liquids
13:24 VanessaE cool
13:29 Taoki_1 joined #minetest-dev
13:32 celeron55 i just realized the receive priorization patch probably does improve response time in cases when the server is at 100% CPU use
13:33 celeron55 and in those cases the processing would lag in any case
13:34 proller slow abm and env not big issue
13:34 sapier 100% cpu load? I'm not sure if this is a normal state of operation
13:34 proller waiting 10 seconds to open inventory - big
13:34 celeron55 sapier: it shouldn't be, but sadly it happens with crappy liquids and crappy ABMs and whatever
13:35 proller cureently all servers is laggy when 5+ players
13:35 sapier do we have any option to fix this e.g. by limiting those things to lets say 30% of cpu capacity?
13:35 proller you can wait minute+ for loading block mor move forward
13:35 sapier if there was proper map locking those things could run in their own (low prio) thread
13:35 proller not i will try liquids queue processing linited by time
13:36 proller now
13:36 proller with abm it harder
13:36 celeron55 i'd say let's put the priorization in, but it's purpose needs to be explained well in a comment; it's purpose is VERY easy to misunderstand
13:37 proller ok
13:38 celeron55 what the code does is that it prioritizes processing of received packets over timed processing when there is 100% CPU use
13:38 proller also lot of falling items can kill server (make sand fload island and touch)
13:39 VanessaE I can vouch for that one.  and it is wont to kill the client to :)
13:39 celeron55 when there is no 100% CPU use, it does nothing
13:39 VanessaE too*
13:39 proller also mapgen can eat 100% cpu
13:39 sapier sounds like a reasonable workaround until proper rework is done
13:41 Zeitgeist_ joined #minetest-dev
13:42 Gethiox joined #minetest-dev
13:55 PilzAdam we need to decide if we merge #911 or #882
13:55 PilzAdam one this needs to be merged before 0.4.8
13:56 PilzAdam #911 just fixes the current code, while #882 dumps the current code and (tries) to apply that "leveld" stuff to the normal liquids
13:57 PilzAdam while the additions of #882 to finite_liquids might be nice, it doesnt really work well with the normal liquids
13:58 sapier in current state "try to get 0.4.8 out" I'd prefere fixing instead of rewrite
13:58 sapier does 911 work reasonably well?
13:58 PilzAdam yea
13:59 proller my pull 3 months old
13:59 sapier would there be a problem if 911 is in 0.4.8 and 882 is added later?
13:59 proller maybe some compatibility glitches
13:59 PilzAdam we would need to alias "range" to "level" then, but thats not a big problem
13:59 proller maybe not
14:00 proller nobody will use range 8)
14:00 sapier was that name in 0.4.7 before?
14:00 PilzAdam range wasnt used before, no
14:01 celeron55 everything can be changed that wasn't in 0.4.7
14:01 sapier ok what about using level as name with old code if it's clear we add 882 later?
14:01 celeron55 (as long as loading worlds work)
14:01 proller making strange feature for one version is... strange
14:01 sapier -clear + sure
14:01 proller 882 extends "leveled" stuff added after 0.4.7
14:01 PilzAdam sapier, the problem with "level" is that it doesnt make sense with the normal liquids
14:02 PilzAdam from the views of modders
14:02 sapier we could explain it in docs for this version
14:02 PilzAdam also I dont like dumping range anyway
14:02 VanessaE crap, I think shadow's change to the 4k+ nodes did not work right
14:02 sapier ok if we want both there's no compatibility issue
14:03 nore VanessaE, why?
14:03 PilzAdam #882 should be rewritten to a) not dump the range feature and b) not break maps like it currently does
14:03 VanessaE nore, lemme double-check firt.
14:03 VanessaE first*
14:04 proller 882 is incompatible with range
14:04 proller it not big break
14:05 VanessaE nore: maybe it isn't that.  something is wrong.
14:05 sapier big or not big is no difference ;-) broken is broken
14:05 proller but if not move flowing flag - make more than 8 level for old liquid impossible
14:05 proller sapier, small liquid flow is not "broken"
14:06 PilzAdam also we already decided to add "range" when we merged that pull request, #911 just fixes some stuff
14:06 sapier I don't have a good fealing adding this to 0.4.8
14:06 VanessaE nore: lemme check.  helps if I actually build *and install* it...
14:06 proller PilzAdam, who "we"?
14:06 sapier it still seems to be a good improvement for 0.4.9
14:06 PilzAdam proller, the core team
14:06 proller and then for 0.5, and then....
14:07 proller PilzAdam, me - not.
14:07 sapier no proller I'd suggest merging changes stage for 0.4.9 once 0.4.8 is released to get them tested as soon as possible
14:07 celeron55 0.5 doesn't come after 0.4.9
14:07 celeron55 after 0.4.9 comes 0.4.10
14:08 VanessaE ok it wasn't shadow's change, but something is now preventing me from starting my servers -- C++ Exception
14:08 sapier we're sorting out issues with things merged months ago and haven't even fixed all of them yet
14:08 proller sapier, and test new incompatibility..
14:08 PilzAdam VanessaE, gdb
14:09 sapier yes but I'm almost sure if we add this now we're add additional delay
14:11 VanessaE http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6347162/
14:12 sapier No symbol table info available. :-(
14:12 VanessaE yeah, I stopped making debug builds, I got tired of the slowdown.
14:12 PilzAdam that looks like and assert() failed
14:12 PilzAdam anything in the normal logs?
14:13 VanessaE http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6347174/
14:13 VanessaE (and no, it isn't actually technic doing it)
14:14 PilzAdam throw technic out and try again
14:14 VanessaE no.
14:14 sapier why don't we se a debug stack?
14:15 VanessaE PilzAdam: if I remove technic, it'll just be some other mod that triggers it.  When I get "C++ Exception", it is universally a > 4096 nodes issue.
14:15 VanessaE I'm double-checking against unmodified master just to be sure.
14:17 VanessaE nope, no good even with vanilla.
14:18 PilzAdam "C++ exception" also happens alot if you deal with e.g. meta
14:18 sapier you could try a debug build and run within gdb
14:18 VanessaE that's stupid.
14:18 PilzAdam you cant say htat its because of a node limit
14:19 VanessaE I'll play with it a bit, but "C++ Exception" when it should be throwing a traceable error is just stupid.
14:19 sapier true
14:20 Ritchie joined #minetest-dev
14:21 PilzAdam sapier, so you would agree to merge #911 and deal with #882 after 0.4.8?
14:21 sapier yes that'd be my prefered way to handle it
14:21 VanessaE PilzAdam: good call on the metadata issue.  it's a technic bug all right.
14:22 sapier do we have a tag "moved to next version" or similar?
14:22 sapier wait maybe milestones are better?
14:22 PilzAdam we have a  0.48 milestone
14:22 PilzAdam +.
14:22 celeron55 VanessaE: it's better to handle exceptions like that in release builds because they're practically never run in a debugger; it at least sometimes gives some information
14:22 celeron55 a debug build will pass the exception through
14:23 celeron55 build a debug build with -O2 if you want
14:23 sapier any objections to creating 0.4.9 milestone?
14:23 VanessaE celeron55: but how is a modder supposed to trace such bugs?
14:23 PilzAdam sapier, what will go in there?
14:24 sapier pull requests we decided to merge next version
14:24 celeron55 VanessaE: such bug is not supposed to happen and if we knew what it is, we could work towards making them more understandable
14:24 nore sapier, I don't have objections for that
14:25 celeron55 hmm
14:25 PilzAdam sapier, well, we havent exactly decided to merge #882 as it is
14:25 celeron55 it seems like it's a C++ exception that has occurred when lua has called something though
14:25 VanessaE I'm checking on it, celeron55
14:26 celeron55 that's a tough path to pass any information about them i guess, lua being made in C
14:26 sapier doesn't imply they are finished yet only that their basic features are to be added
14:26 PilzAdam ok, that sounds good
14:26 sapier ok I' creating the milestone now
14:28 VanessaE celeron55: this technic commit throws the exception:  https://github.com/minetest-technic/technic/co​mmit/5ed47abee6354509ca46fefe5740872b028f083e
14:28 werwerwer_ joined #minetest-dev
14:28 PilzAdam I dont like that proller has added his pull requests to the 0.4.8 milestone
14:28 VanessaE so the craft prediction function is bugged.
14:28 PilzAdam they are marked as "low-priority-enhancement"§
14:28 celeron55 it seems like lua would handle such an exception somewhat more reasonably
14:29 celeron55 luajit catches C++ exceptions and hides their what() like that
14:29 proller PilzAdam, you set this mark?
14:29 PilzAdam no
14:29 sapier ok as 0.4.9 exists now we can flagg 882 0.4.9 agreed?
14:30 nore VanessaE, it works fine with my computer, though
14:30 PilzAdam I guess 891 goes into 0.4.9, too
14:31 sapier 891?
14:31 PilzAdam 892*
14:31 celeron55 VanessaE: can you build a non-luajit version? it seems like the only way to know what the exceptions is about
14:32 Taoki joined #minetest-dev
14:32 sapier ok I'm gonna tag 882 0.4.9 if noone complains now
14:33 hmmmm joined #minetest-dev
14:33 celeron55 it looks like we need to add exception handler blocks to all lua->c++ calls
14:34 sapier great :-/
14:34 celeron55 or deal with undecipherable errors
14:34 sapier I'm gonna file a issue
14:34 proller and dont crash server on lua error
14:36 celeron55 i'm trying now what regular lua does for C++ exceptions
14:36 sapier a lua error is a showstopper you can't tell if it's safe to continue
14:37 celeron55 i assume luajit always shows just "C++ exception" and quits
14:37 nore celeron55, no it doesn't
14:38 nore when the error is inside Lua, it shows a normal error message, with where it comes from
14:38 sapier PilzAdam 892 seems to be way to heavy for a prerelease commit too yes
14:38 celeron55 nore: that's not a C++ exception
14:38 Akien joined #minetest-dev
14:39 celeron55 i guess someone would do this test faster than my laptop compiles minetest
14:39 celeron55 building since many minutes, and building until many minutes more
14:40 celeron55 we should maybe try out precompiled headers
14:40 sapier any quick way to cause a c++ exception?
14:40 PilzAdam sapier, minetest.get_meta(something_that_is_not_a_pos) IIRC
14:40 celeron55 http://pastebin.com/gLwy51E2
14:40 celeron55 well, apparently i wouldn't have had to even rebuild this then
14:41 celeron55 i guess i'll just do that thing instead, this is still building...
14:42 sapier ok I need to rebuilt too but I guess it's faster for me
14:42 celeron55 hey what the actual fuck
14:42 celeron55 why does this rebuild like all of minetest if i just modify l_craft.cpp?
14:42 celeron55 >.cpp
14:42 celeron55 it shouldn't definitely work like that
14:43 sapier of course not that's one of the reasons why I split scriptapi.cpp
14:43 nore celeron55, a lot of files depend on it
14:43 sapier why do files depend on a cpp?
14:43 celeron55 it's a .cpp file, obviously nothing depends on it except the link stage
14:43 celeron55 but it seems like everything depends on it
14:44 sapier did you modify one of the build scripts?
14:44 celeron55 no
14:44 celeron55 this is vanilla minetest
14:44 VanessaE C++ exception cause found:  too many braces in the shapeless register craft recipe
14:44 sapier I'll ty once my build has finished
14:44 VanessaE shouldn't that have thrown a more readable error?
14:45 PilzAdam hmm.. that get_meta() thing doesnt seem to "work" anymore...
14:45 sapier so someone fixed the bug
14:45 sapier VanessaE it should
14:45 celeron55 VanessaE: give the errorneus code
14:45 sapier can you pinpoint the c++ file where the exception is thrown?
14:45 celeron55 VanessaE: we want to test it
14:46 nore minetest.register_craft({type="shapeless", recipe={{"a","b"}}}) crashes
14:46 VanessaE celeron55:  https://github.com/minetest-technic/technic/co​mmit/5ed47abee6354509ca46fefe5740872b028f083e
14:46 nore minetest.register_craft({type="shapeless", recipe={"a","b"}}) that does not
14:46 VanessaE nore, I'll push a fix to technic.
14:46 celeron55 16:46:22: ERROR[main]: ServerError: LuaError: Crafting definition (shapeless) is missing an output
14:46 nore VanessaE, already done
14:46 celeron55 non-luajit Lua gives this
14:46 n4x joined #minetest-dev
14:46 celeron55 so it's luajit's problem really
14:46 nore celeron55, forgot output
14:47 nore you should add output to that too
14:47 PilzAdam sapier, I merge #911 then, or do you have any objections?
14:47 sapier no merge it
14:47 celeron55 nore: what?
14:47 nore so it is type = "shapeless", output = "c", recipe = {{"a", "b"}} that crashed
14:47 nore I forgot output when I wrote this
14:48 sapier still this should cause a more speaking error
14:48 nore the problem is with the fact that recipe is a list inside a list, instead of a list
14:48 celeron55 anyway, it gives a reasonable error message either way
14:48 nore even with the output added?
14:48 celeron55 what do i put in output?
14:48 nore anything
14:48 nore call it "c"
14:49 sapier http://pastebin.com/BrJ66uib result without luajit
14:49 celeron55 http://pastebin.com/C2ehkh2S
14:49 sapier are you sure this is same thing causing vanesaE's error?
14:50 celeron55 with lua, with output
14:50 sapier ok celeron gets same error
14:50 nore yes, I am sure it is that
14:50 celeron55 i guess luajit guys say they can't pass a C++ exception through because it would screw up the stack
14:50 nore if you remove the additional braces, it should work
14:51 VanessaE ERROR: An unhandled exception occurred: ServerError: LuaError: error: /usr/share/minetest/builtin/vector.lua:5: Invalid vector   <--- unrelated problem, and quite frequent on my servers.  No traceback is printed.
14:52 sapier didn't I add improved traceback some time ago? are there still situations where this doesn't work?
14:52 VanessaE apparently so.
14:52 VanessaE or your code was not pushed.
14:53 sapier assert(type(v) == "table" and v.x and v.y and v.z, "Invalid vector") thanks whoever wrote that assertion
14:54 sapier if you look for that bug you could replace it by a if (assert) do backtrace assert
14:55 sapier if (assert reason) of course
14:55 VanessaE how am I supposed to find it without a valid traceback?
14:55 sapier obviously there are some situations where no traceback is created but you can create it manually
14:56 sapier it's not a solution of course only a workaround until fix is done
14:56 BlockMen joined #minetest-dev
14:57 PilzAdam nore, another thing: do you catch that minetest.get_node_light() can return nil?
14:57 BlockMen joined #minetest-dev
14:59 VanessaE sapier: right.
15:00 VanessaE sapier: but as I simply don't know how to fix this, I'm stuck.
15:00 nore PilzAdam, can it?
15:00 BlockMen can someone agree on #928?
15:00 PilzAdam nore, similiar code just crashed in pilztest for me, fix: https://github.com/PilzAdam/pilztest/commi​t/4c188a8ec36981b26f0a8c5723b6196102000a35
15:01 nore ok, I will push a fix
15:01 sapier http://pastebin.com/69wYhFtr VanessaE replace the assert in vector by this variant (I use it in mobf)
15:02 nore PilzAdam, pushed
15:03 PilzAdam nore, stop pushing things if nobody has looked at them
15:03 nore that was a 4-chars fix...
15:03 PilzAdam that line is too long now
15:03 nore ok, so I should split it?
15:03 PilzAdam yes
15:04 PilzAdam you can overwrite the history if the commit you are overwrting isnt older than 10 minutes
15:04 VanessaE sapier: done,  servers going up.
15:05 nore PilzAdam, like that?
15:06 PilzAdam no
15:06 nore why?
15:07 PilzAdam https://gist.github.com/PilzAdam/7279851
15:07 PilzAdam because of our unwritten Lua code styleguideline
15:08 nore ok
15:08 nore like now?
15:09 nore (for the second one, mainly)
15:09 PilzAdam oh god, its still wrong
15:09 nore why?
15:10 nore the second being more indented?
15:10 PilzAdam can you just stop pushing everything to upstream directly?
15:10 iqualfragile joined #minetest-dev
15:10 sapier :-) may I have a look too? I'm curious ;-)
15:10 nore yes, I should do that...
15:10 PilzAdam the 2 line in the if statement should have the same intendation
15:10 PilzAdam s/t/d/ s/d/t/
15:11 nore yes, but it is inside a parenthesis started in the previous line
15:11 PilzAdam that doesnt matter
15:12 nore ok
15:12 nore so I remove that indent, and I push?
15:12 PilzAdam yea
15:12 nore (and I am more careful next time...)
15:12 PilzAdam and fix minetest_game too
15:13 nore yes, done
15:13 PilzAdam BlockMen, havent you removed the "Leftclick: take all ..." stuff in that pull request for a while?
15:14 BlockMen yeah, but there was no agreement that it gets removed so i left it in when i rebased it
15:14 VanessaE sapier: if your code works, but is not a "proper" fix, what would be?
15:14 PilzAdam nore, what a wonderful second day as core dev: commiting something that needs 2 "fix-commits" and pushing wrong things 3 or 4 times so you need a history rewrite
15:15 thexyz what a usual day, PA being picky
15:15 PilzAdam :-p
15:15 sapier a proper fix would be find out why the traceback isn't shown on any lua error I'm not exactly sure if this really can be done as there are multiple ways a error comes to notice
15:16 thexyz I'm actually interested in what "minetest.get_node_light(above) >= 13 or 0" means
15:17 PilzAdam its (get_node_light() or 0) means "take get_node_light(), or 0 if get_node_light() is nil)
15:17 PilzAdam s/)/"
15:17 sapier so if something isn't loaded yet we asume it's light is 0?
15:17 PilzAdam the "or 0" part makes sure that you dont compare nil with 13
15:18 thexyz okay, I guess it's just in the wrong place
15:18 PilzAdam sapier, it returns nil for solid nodes
15:18 sapier doesn't it return nil for unloaded too?
15:18 PilzAdam maybe
15:19 PilzAdam nore, umm... thexyz is right, you pushed the wrong code to minetest
15:19 sapier I'm not sure but at least in mobf I assume it :-)
15:19 PilzAdam its correct in minetest_game, though
15:19 sapier come on guys don't make him even more nervous he already is ;-)
15:20 PilzAdam :-p
15:20 PilzAdam sapier, we all need to go through this
15:20 thexyz yeah
15:21 PilzAdam BlockMen, what about my suggestion to remove it, and add it to the default formspec?
15:21 sapier of course I still have to proove I can handle it better I haven't merged anything yet
15:21 PilzAdam Ill fix it minetest now (since nore disappeard)
15:21 thexyz I don't think there's much point in raging because he mistyped "or 0"
15:21 nore PilzAdam, what was the problem?
15:22 PilzAdam fixed, people can pull now
15:23 PilzAdam nore, you wrote "(minetest.get_node_light(above) >= 13 or 0)" instead of "(minetest.get_node_light(above) or 0) >= 13"
15:23 nore ah, yes, I just saw that
15:23 BlockMen PilzAdam, so adding a label to default formspec and kick it from engine, right?
15:23 nore sorry, my bad
15:23 PilzAdam BlockMen, yea
15:24 BlockMen ok, im fine with that
15:24 nore you should add "Middle click: move 10 items" too
15:24 nore since that one is the one I would never have discovered alone
15:24 nore (and for crafting too...)
15:25 PilzAdam nore, that wouldnt fit into the default sized inventory with the default window size
15:25 proller sapier, 892 fixes broken current weather
15:25 VanessaE movew/craft 10 items
15:25 VanessaE -w
15:26 nore PilzAdam, perhaps something like: Left/middle/right click: move all/10/1 items
15:26 nore that would fit
15:26 PilzAdam could work
15:26 sapier proller looks more like a rewrite than a fix ;-)
15:27 nore and perhaps even move/craft instead of move
15:27 proller its continue developing
15:27 proller weather was broken after this pull
15:27 VanessaE nore, that would be too many slashes.
15:27 VanessaE (i.e. it would seem too repetitive)
15:27 proller i cant support 90000 pulls with one thing
15:27 nore ok, write move|craft then...
15:28 VanessaE "move or craft"
15:28 Calinou joined #minetest-dev
15:28 nore ok for move or craft
15:28 sapier I'm not sure about it maybe delay decision until critical things are merged
15:28 VanessaE "Left/middle/right-click:  move or craft all/10/1 item(s)"
15:28 proller and i want to join 882 + 892 into one
15:29 sapier then it's 0.4.9
15:29 nore the only problem is that left crafts only 1...
15:29 PilzAdam VanessaE, so leftclick is "craft all items"?
15:29 VanessaE PilzAdam: ask nore :)
15:29 * BlockMen still thinks its useless at all
15:29 sapier I don't se any reason why weather and liquids need to be a single commit
15:30 VanessaE I was just tweaking his line a bit, didn't pay attention to whether it was actually correct :D
15:30 nore so perhaps move all/10/1 or craft 1/10/1 items
15:30 PilzAdam it would be ok to just leave middleclick out (as it is currently), since peopel can always find the complete set of controls in the wiki
15:31 proller sapier, because they have intersection and i cant make something new 3 months
15:31 VanessaE "Left-click:  move all/craft 1.  Middle:  move/craft 10.  Right:  Move/craft 1."
15:31 VanessaE PilzAdam: people don't read wikis
15:31 PilzAdam I did
15:31 BlockMen who came up with craft? it says move, that enough
15:31 sapier proller still having multiple things that all need discussion in a single pull will reduce it's chance to be merged drasticaly
15:31 VanessaE you're a geek.  geeks aren't people ;)
15:31 nore the middle click should definitely be there...
15:31 nore else, you don't have the idea
15:32 PilzAdam VanessaE, ok, I decide that Minetest is for geeks then
15:32 proller sapier, its not my problem, it already works on my server
15:32 VanessaE BlockMen: actually I guess that was my suggestion - a lot of people don't know that you can craft 10x with a middle-click
15:32 VanessaE PilzAdam: :P
15:33 sapier proller so you really wanna fork?
15:33 proller i make all what i can for merging, but.. nothing..
15:33 BlockMen VanessaE, you should ppl try out a bit, not write everything down ;)
15:33 sapier proller that's quite normal my security fixes have never been merged
15:33 proller just one huge pull
15:33 sapier async api is 3 version now
15:33 PilzAdam proller, the problem that I see with your features is that it doesnt really fit the goals of the other devs
15:33 sapier and entity linking I provided 2 years ago was rewritten by someone a year ago ;-)
15:34 VanessaE BlockMen: well if you think it's fine, I won't stand in your way :)
15:34 PilzAdam we mainly want to create a generic game engine, while you continue hardcoding stuff in the engine and you dont care much about the API
15:34 nore BlockMen, at least write something about middle-click
15:34 proller PilzAdam, making space shooter?
15:34 sapier and a "ALL OR NOTHING" pull request isn't very polite too
15:35 proller PilzAdam, i hardcode only slowest parts
15:35 proller and change already existed things in core
15:35 PilzAdam yea, thats not good
15:35 proller and all my things disableable
15:36 proller and disabled by default
15:36 sapier that's why we're even talking about merging it proller ;-)
15:36 PilzAdam that doesnt make them good, and as we see with finite_liquids you make it conflict with the normal liquids
15:36 proller wat?
15:36 proller conflict make you with "range"
15:37 proller other was two way compatible
15:38 sapier couldn't we fix that issue by using an alias? so this'd be a minor issue?
15:39 PilzAdam I suggested a while ago that "finite" would be a flag in nodedef
15:39 proller its one place in code
15:39 BlockMen nore, but why? there are mouses without middle button, e.g touchpads of notebooks
15:39 BlockMen so writing it always can be confusing too
15:39 proller client place, he dont know about finite or not
15:40 proller PilzAdam, no flag!
15:40 nore BlockMen, left+right click = middle click
15:40 BlockMen PilzAdam, removed from engine. fine to merge now?
15:41 nore and since almost no games use middle button, if not written, no-one thinks to it
15:41 proller flag = 2 queues and lot of shit in code, and nobody will use it
15:42 BlockMen nore, oh right
15:42 PilzAdam BlockMen, have you added it to the default formspec?
15:42 BlockMen not yet because of the discussion and because its _game, so not the same commit
15:43 PilzAdam the default formspec is in the engine
15:43 BlockMen wut? where?
15:43 PilzAdam player.cpp:67
15:44 PilzAdam in minetest_game we need to add it to creative, chest, furnace and bones
15:44 Guest48207 joined #minetest-dev
15:45 BlockMen ah, ok. would ' "LMB: Move all items, MMB: Move 10 items, RMB: Move single item" ' be fine?
15:47 PilzAdam I guess so
15:48 sapier proller how does this match to the recent abm changes?
15:48 proller neet to rewrite about dirt
15:48 proller need
15:48 proller but change small
15:49 proller and add dirt_with_snow куьщмук
15:49 proller remover
15:49 sapier what about this the weather things seem to be usefull for 0.4.8 as weather was broken after 0.4.7 but the liquid things have to wait till 0.4.9 PilzAdam what do you think about this?
15:49 VanessaE куьщмук  ?
15:49 VanessaE "English, dude.  English."
15:50 thexyz VanessaE: he've already corrected himself
15:50 thexyz "remover"
15:50 VanessaE sapier: weather depends on finite liquids wrking *just* right.
15:50 thexyz s/'ve/'s/
15:50 VanessaE thexyz: oops, yep.  ninja'd
15:50 sapier depends? why?
15:51 proller weather was added after 0.4.7
15:51 VanessaE sapier: because with weather comes the ability for it to rain, and the rain must be able to collect on the ground.  with infinite liquids, this can lead to flooding when it shouldn't.
15:51 VanessaE that's part of why proller seems so obsessed with finite liquids :)
15:51 proller VanessaE, but finite liquids now works in master
15:52 proller my pull about make them better
15:52 VanessaE proller: right.
15:52 sapier ok so actually weather fixes could be merged without causing flooding ... true?
15:53 VanessaE as long as the mod that actually makes it rain is not preloaded, probably.
15:53 proller sapier, yes
15:54 sapier is vanessae right too?
15:54 PilzAdam sapier, dunno if thats good, but we definitely need hmmmm to review proller's pull request, since he is the one who "broke" it according to proller
15:55 proller no problem with rain+current finite liquids
15:55 sapier of course that's some code to check
15:56 sapier so proller expect (minor) changes
15:56 PilzAdam it would also be possible mark weather as "indev" and recommend to no use it
15:56 sapier thats a minor change in menu
15:57 sapier first change to do proller ;-)
15:58 PilzAdam BlockMen, have you tested it well enough?
15:59 BlockMen i tested any case i could think of so i would say yes
16:02 zat joined #minetest-dev
16:02 BlockMen my suggestion for the formspec help text is too long
16:02 BlockMen it does not fit
16:04 sapier hmm that most likely means it's way to long in other translations
16:04 PilzAdam sapier, we cant translate it anymore if its done in Lua
16:05 sapier didn't we add translation support to lua?
16:05 PilzAdam for the mainmenu only
16:05 * BlockMen still want to kick at all
16:05 BlockMen *that string
16:05 sapier I assume adding it to scriptapi wouldn't be a big deal ;-)
16:06 PilzAdam sapier, the Lua code runs on the server
16:06 sapier oh ... ok so we'd have to make client tell it's localization to server ... guess thats a 0.4.9 thing
16:09 BlockMen and another problem..the label breaks the text much earlier, so even the old string does not fit anymore
16:15 BlockMen how about that: we remove the string and consider to re-add if ppl complain about?
16:16 sapier I'd be fine with it
16:16 PilzAdam how are newbies supposed to complain about it when they dont know that it existed?
16:16 nore ok with it too
16:16 sapier come one PA we don't have a hud telling punch right place left
16:17 PilzAdam sapier, we have, press Esc
16:17 ImQ009 joined #minetest-dev
16:17 sapier so what about a "?" button topright showing detailed help?
16:20 BlockMen can buttons use tooltips?
16:20 BlockMen or labels?
16:24 BlockMen and PilzAdam, i think that ppl can find out how to use inventory. or do you think they are not as skilled as mc players?
16:26 VanessaE BlockMen: buttons CAN use tooltips, yes
16:26 VanessaE Unified Inventory does this
16:28 BlockMen VanessaE, thx. just looked up, item_image_buttons can. maybe that would be an easy way to show info
16:29 VanessaE a tooltip over a "[?]" button?  sure
16:29 VanessaE I could see that.
16:29 BlockMen damn, no. it needs an registered item (image)
16:30 BlockMen that means changing button element then
16:30 BlockMen yay
16:30 VanessaE so include an image of a question mark :P
16:34 PilzAdam of course 3 core devs who want to remove the string can just overvote me
16:34 BlockMen well, i have to leave now so we talk about that next time
16:34 BlockMen bye everyone
16:35 BlockMen left #minetest-dev
16:37 thexyz celeron55: any updates from china?
16:37 celeron55 no; i would tell if there were
16:38 thexyz right; did they specify any time frame?
16:38 celeron55 no
16:54 thexyz what's the status of httpfetch?
16:54 sapier difficult as it may not be required for mainmenu if the async things are added
16:55 thexyz that's not the only thing I need it for; it's got nice media download support
16:55 sapier yes that's why I said difficult
16:56 sapier I assume it doesn't break non curl media download
16:56 thexyz https://github.com/kahrl/minetest/commit/​b7125e56b28751e30d2d2bc5fa7c6b4dc2d674a7
16:57 sapier it's a good improvement yet I'm not sure if it's tested enough for 0.4.8
16:58 thexyz oh, so we're releasing Very Soon™ now?
16:59 thexyz then it should be merged after that
16:59 VanessaE http_fetch will probably also fix a bug in the media fetching where some files are sent too late
16:59 sapier that's base for my suggestions ... we haven't released for quite a while imho it's time to do
17:00 sapier yes it may fix this bug but it may add additional concurrency bugs too
17:00 celeron55 the blocking windows localication thing was fixed (but not yet merged?) so it's okay to try to get 0.4.8 out now
17:01 celeron55 (as long as the pending problems are taken care of)
17:01 sapier no it wasn't merged by now as the fix for msvc is quite ugly ... without a clear "yes we add it" by 2 core devs I wont add things like that ;-)
17:01 celeron55 well what options do we have?
17:01 celeron55 keep stuff broken or add it? not a hard choice...
17:02 sapier If I knew a better solution I wouln't have come up wit that one ... but maybe others have better ideas
17:02 thexyz I think celeron55 suggested some improvement to your solution
17:02 sapier I don't remember any additional suggestions can you tell me where to find them?
17:04 thexyz okay, let me check logs
17:04 sapier hmm maybe you're talking about that "full localization" list?
17:06 thexyz http://irc.minetest.ru/minet​est-dev/2013-10-28#i_3398880
17:07 rubenwardy joined #minetest-dev
17:08 proller https://github.com/minetes​t/minetest/pull/895/files - now liquid is fast
17:08 Calinou joined #minetest-dev
17:09 sapier hmm the only way to use this would be creating a lookup table on startup I don't want to do api calls each time a string is translated
17:10 sapier I have to go now but I'm gonna have a try if this works later
17:10 thexyz that'd be great
17:11 sapier maybe it's as easy as doing a name lookup ... not quite sure if I understood doc right ... but could be
17:11 sapier bye
17:11 sapier left #minetest-dev
17:12 VanessaE I don't advocate 0.4.8 going out just yet.  Not 'til the http_fetch and lib_6d both go in.
17:14 proller VanessaE, all liquids fast ^^
17:14 PilzAdam VanessaE, lib_6d uses sneak for placement, that is not good since its used to place nodes at other nodes that would usually have a different effect on rightclick
17:15 VanessaE PilzAdam: well ShadowNinja advocated I do that check in the code.
17:15 VanessaE for consistency, since we have no custom modifier keys
17:15 VanessaE the original code took an 'invertall' parameter
17:16 VanessaE (which, if omitted, would be treated as false)
17:16 VanessaE er invertwall*
17:17 PilzAdam wait, so its not possible to place nodes that use minetest.rotate_and_place() when pointing at a chest?
17:17 VanessaE of course it is.
17:17 VanessaE it's just that the invert flag would be triggered, causing the node to appear in 'floor' orientation.
17:17 PilzAdam if you simply rightclick then it opens the chest instead of placing the node
17:18 VanessaE there are only three ways to do this:  either I accept an incoming flag from the calling routine, or I check for a key like sneak, or we get proper modifier keys that aren't already bound to some feature.
17:19 VanessaE the third option of course is the best, but requires more changes to the engine, and probably to the client for all I know
17:21 rubenwardy_ joined #minetest-dev
17:21 PilzAdam ah, so you dont want nodes to override on_place() with that function?
17:22 VanessaE the way the function is used now (well the version of it that is in current use), it checks explicitly for 'sneak' before calling the function, and passes that to the function.
17:22 VanessaE so basically it does the first option -
17:23 VanessaE it's normally used in an on_place callback actually.
17:23 PilzAdam what Im talking about is that you dont do the check for sneak before calling on_rightclick()
17:23 PilzAdam so if you just do on_place = minetest.rotate_and_place; then its not possible to place nodes while looking at a chest
17:24 VanessaE oh, nonono
17:24 VanessaE that's not how I normally use it
17:24 ShadowNinja VanessaE: I meant things like t["valid_lua_identifier"] instead of t.valid_lua_identifier which I intended to fix be amending if the pull was acepted.
17:24 ShadowNinja by*
17:24 PilzAdam VanessaE, thats not how _you_ use it
17:24 VanessaE ShadowNinja: ah, well that's easily fixed.
17:25 PilzAdam also, why doesnt it apply the normal facedir if you place it at the floor or ceiling?
17:25 VanessaE hadn't thought about that.
17:26 VanessaE this was designed for nodes that explicitly use 6d though.
17:26 PilzAdam this seems to be too ungeneric to be in the API
17:26 VanessaE e.g. slabs, lighting panels, etc.
17:27 PilzAdam slabs cant use this because they need the full block transformation
17:27 general3214 joined #minetest-dev
17:27 VanessaE ShadowNinja: fixed.  I guess.
17:27 VanessaE else screw it.  the code is there and I did my best on ioy.
17:27 VanessaE it*
17:28 VanessaE it works fine in moreblocks, and I use a variant of it (where I don't check for 'sneak') in homedecor's lights.
17:28 VanessaE works perfectly in both.
17:28 VanessaE or at least, it works exactly as intended.
17:28 ShadowNinja VanessaE: BTW sapier's assert_backtrace function is wrong, it should be "if not x" not "if x == false" so that nil fails properly.
17:29 VanessaE (in moreblocks, sneak is 'force wall' rather than 'invert wall')
17:29 PilzAdam see? even moreblocks cant use the function that you want to add
17:30 proller maybe old idea: little move object when punching, (for push inactive players to holes)
17:30 VanessaE proller: offtopic.
17:30 proller singletopic again?
17:31 VanessaE PilzAdam: it can, if I pass invertwall as a separate flag.
17:31 VanessaE I coded it differently in moreblocks because that's what Calinou wanted.
17:31 ShadowNinja proller: Yes, but that isn't high priority now, we have to get 0.4.8 out.
17:31 VanessaE ShadowNinja: check #959.  is that more like you were thinking?
17:32 VanessaE PilzAdam: I originally wanted the moreblocks version to do invert-wall also.  calinou didn't like that, so I didn't do it.
17:32 VanessaE so blame him :P
17:32 kahrl does anyone mind if I set #962 to milestone 0.4.8?
17:33 PilzAdam kahrl, I wouldnt mind merging if it works
17:33 proller 892 weather updated
17:33 thexyz kahrl: why can't we just throw it in
17:33 kahrl I can't test it since apparently it's a windows issue
17:34 ShadowNinja kahrl: Or just merge it. :-)
17:34 kahrl if somebody tested it it can be merged
17:34 PilzAdam I guess sapier tested it?
17:34 ShadowNinja sapier has, or at least so I assume.
17:34 kahrl I think so but I don't exactly remember
17:34 PilzAdam we wait for him then
17:34 thexyz yeah it doesn't make things worse
17:34 PilzAdam add it to the milestone if you fear that we will forget it otherwise
17:34 ShadowNinja Well he should know better than to commit un-tested code...
17:35 VanessaE PilzAdam: so what about it?  what's gonna be here?  do I check inside the routine or outside (for sneak)?  So I invert-wall, force-wall, what?
17:35 ShadowNinja How about #965? I can't test it though...
17:36 VanessaE Do*
17:36 PilzAdam VanessaE, I just wanted to point out that there are different expectations how the function should work; that means its too ungeneric to be in the API
17:36 proller 965 looks ok, i can test on freebsd
17:37 VanessaE PilzAdam: well if there are different expectations, it's because there is no consistency in these sorts of things.
17:37 ShadowNinja Ok, push it if it works.
17:37 VanessaE and it is NOT too 'ungeneric'
17:38 proller ShadowNinja, push!
17:38 nore and how about #856?
17:38 PilzAdam dunno if "ungeneric" is a good word
17:38 VanessaE you probably mean 'specialized'
17:38 ShadowNinja proller: Hmmm? Is that a confirmation that it works on FreeBSD?
17:38 VanessaE and if you want it to be consistent, then suggest a way to make it so!
17:38 VanessaE (and yes I'm getting upset)
17:39 proller ShadowNinja, to correct test opendsd needed
17:39 proller ShadowNinja, but it now only one-user-feature 8)
17:39 proller so, push!
17:40 PilzAdam VanessaE, yea, the problem is that we cant force modders to our "consistency"
17:40 proller or i can
17:41 VanessaE PilzAdam:  well all I know is this routine is needed by most any mod that places a facedir object.
17:41 VanessaE (except maybe default e.g. chests and furnces)
17:42 PilzAdam not exactly this routine, but a similiar one
17:45 VanessaE there, how about that>
17:46 VanessaE optionally pass a table as the last param, "invert_wall = true" or "force_wall = true"
17:48 nore what about merging #856?
17:48 VanessaE need to add a flag for forcing on-floor facedir to 0, versus normal facedir, maybe
17:49 nore is there anyone else agreeing with #856 (protection)?
17:50 VanessaE PilzAdam: there, how's that look?
17:51 VanessaE I suppose I need to do the same facedir thing with the ceiling mode.
17:54 nore so, about #856? any thoughts?
17:55 nore VanessaE, you need to update lua_api.txt
17:55 VanessaE oh, yeah I'll get that
17:55 VanessaE need to do something else first.
17:56 ShadowNinja I can agree with #856, but I would like more opinions.
17:56 nore I agree
17:56 nore but we need another dev probably...
17:56 celeron55 #965 seems good to me
17:57 nore and #856?
17:58 celeron55 if people really want it as-is, i guess i can't block it
17:58 nore why, what is missing?
17:59 celeron55 hmm, actually, the documentation has been changed and now it roughly is how it should be
17:59 celeron55 i'm not objecting
17:59 general3214 joined #minetest-dev
18:03 rubenwardy What do you guys think about #977?
18:03 proller celeron55, #895 - with lot useless stuff!
18:04 ShadowNinja Alright, I will push #856 then.
18:05 ShadowNinja rubenwardy: Already discussed, it will be going in after 0.4.8.
18:05 nore ShadowNinja, you need to write something about it in News... (for modders, they need to know that since there are a lot of protection mods)
18:05 ShadowNinja nore: Alright.
18:06 rubenwardy ok
18:08 VanessaE PilzAdam: ok, check the code now.  It seems to work right anyway.
18:08 ShadowNinja Hmmm, it seems that GitHub properly auto-closes and marks as merged pulls that are merged with rebase and "git merge --ff-only".
18:09 nore yep, I saw that
18:10 PilzAdam only if they are alraedy rebased, AFAIK
18:10 Evergreen joined #minetest-dev
18:10 VanessaE tested by substituting it into homedecor with some textures that clearly show the facedir
18:10 VanessaE oh I guess I better fix the docs too
18:11 PilzAdam cant you put this in misc_helpers.lua or so?
18:11 Evergreen Can someone check this pull request to see if it's good for merging?   Can a core dev approve/disapprove this pull request?    https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/197
18:11 Evergreen *whoops, accidently copied and pasted something
18:13 werwerwer joined #minetest-dev
18:14 VanessaE there, doc updated.
18:15 VanessaE PilzAdam: who, me?
18:15 PilzAdam yes
18:15 VanessaE sure if you want.
18:15 VanessaE it's a habit to keep things like this in its own file, is all
18:18 VanessaE done.
18:18 VanessaE oops
18:18 VanessaE missed a line.
18:19 VanessaE there.
18:20 PilzAdam and why have you added it in lua-api.txt in that line and somewhere else?
18:20 ShadowNinja Hows this? http://pastebin.ubuntu.com/6348417/
18:20 ShadowNinja +'
18:20 PilzAdam *not somewhere else
18:21 PilzAdam ShadowNinja, why is the . part of the link?
18:21 ShadowNinja PilzAdam: Because that was easier. ;-) fixed.
18:22 VanessaE PilzAdam: I couldn't think of a better place to put it than near the original place_node() call
18:22 VanessaE it seemed related.
18:24 ShadowNinja Anthing else PilzAdam?
18:25 ShadowNinja nore: What do you think ^.
18:25 VanessaE ShadowNinja: seems reasonable to me.
18:26 VanessaE PilzAdam: got an idea for a better location?  I put it where I did because I figured it would be easy to find.
18:27 PilzAdam I would put it near item_place_node(), but it cant be in that category since its called "Defaults for the on_* item definition functions:"
18:28 VanessaE yeah, that's not really a good place I don't thing.
18:28 VanessaE think*
18:30 PilzAdam put it in "Random:"
18:33 VanessaE done.
18:33 VanessaE (and somehow I managed to remove a couple of bogus spaces at the same time :P )
18:48 Evergreen Sorry about that previous request, accidentally copy pasted something from my clipboard.   Can Someone check to see if this pull request is clear to go?    https://github.com/minetest/minetest_game/pull/197
18:49 proller http://paste.org.ru/?0080bf WTF!
18:50 proller do not touch history!!!!
18:50 PilzAdam proller, do you read this channel?
18:51 proller sometimes
18:51 PilzAdam the history rewrite was announced and within 10 minutes after the commit that was rewritten
18:51 Akien joined #minetest-dev
18:51 proller for what?
18:54 Exio4 if you commit something, you are free to change it within a 10(~) minutes range, it is in the guidelines
18:56 proller and nobody can merge master in this 10 minutes
18:56 PilzAdam Exio4, only if you announce it here
18:56 ShadowNinja History rewrites should be avoided of course.
18:57 Exio4 PilzAdam: that is in the "common sense" part i guess?
18:58 proller 895 and 882 conflicting 8( and i cant merge them in one
18:59 thexyz ShadowNinja: shouldn't you tag your topic in the news section with [0.4.8]?
19:00 ShadowNinja thexyz: Ah, yes, done.
19:01 PilzAdam ShadowNinja, and fix everything tha rubenwardy mentioned
19:05 ShadowNinja PilzAdam: Done.
19:06 ShadowNinja All except "* [0.4.8]?" that is
19:06 ShadowNinja And for mods "C++ API" == "builtin API".
19:07 ShadowNinja And "That's not really a hack." == false.
19:10 general3214_ joined #minetest-dev
19:11 kaeza It's not a hack; it's called compatibility layer
19:11 VanessaE PilzAdam, ShadowNinja:  any other changes to #959 ?
19:47 VanessaE joined #minetest-dev
19:50 Akien joined #minetest-dev
19:55 VanessaE (oops)
20:01 ShadowNinja Perhaps the serverlist flags should be stored in a list, eg, servers.list[0].flags.creative = true, rather than mixed with the other data.
20:01 ShadowNinja I am trying to write a doT.js template for the serverlist now...
20:04 VanessaE so any further changes to #959 ?
20:06 ShadowNinja Not now.
20:06 VanessaE ok.
20:06 * VanessaE pokes PilzAdam
20:06 * general3214 punches PilzAdam
20:07 ShadowNinja Hmmm, creative is set to a empty string, rather that true or 1.
20:15 proller ShadowNinja, good idea
20:23 PilzAdam ShadowNinja, when you create minetest.<function> article in the dev wiki then create <function> that redirects to the article too
20:25 ShadowNinja PilzAdam: Perhaps there should be a auto-redirect.
20:26 ShadowNinja Untested doT.js template: https://gist.github.com/ShadowNinja/7283108
20:26 ShadowNinja It doesn't have the modlist dropdown yet (Because that should be done differently).
20:29 proller http://minetest.setun.net:8000/ - now with penis-meter
20:30 proller * pop = average number of players on server
20:30 sfan5 *cough*
20:30 VanessaE 10 users on realtest? O.o
20:31 proller and average=pi
20:31 VanessaE ha!
20:32 PilzAdam is there a limit for description?
20:32 proller no
20:39 Akien joined #minetest-dev
21:01 AllegedlyDead joined #minetest-dev
21:15 Evergreen joined #minetest-dev
21:31 ShadowNinja Here's a version of the serverlist using a doT.js template, it may or ma not work. http://ix.io/8QT
21:32 ShadowNinja (I have to load it on a HTTP server...)
21:34 VanessaE PilzAdam: so, #959 is good?
21:35 ShadowNinja \o/ It works! Although table borders are missing...
21:36 PilzAdam VanessaE, what happens if force_wall and invert_wall are both true?
21:36 VanessaE PilzAdam: force_wall overrides.
21:37 PilzAdam I wonder if it would be better if minetest.rotate_and_place(flags) would return a function that can be used in on_place in nodedef, similiar to item_eat()
21:37 Evergreen Is #197 on minetest_game good for merge?
21:37 VanessaE PilzAdam: I don't know how to do that.
21:38 VanessaE imho the pull as it stands now is good enough for general use :P
21:40 ShadowNinja http://shadowninja.minetest.net/serverlist/ <-- Serverlist w/ template. Needed: human-readable times and modlists. (+style fixes)
21:41 thexyz also needs some design
22:06 celeron55 joined #minetest-dev
22:18 Gethiox joined #minetest-dev
22:40 ShadowNinja I fixed the serverlist. To anyone that knows how: How should I implement the modlist box and similar boxes? The old way reserved a lot of extra space at the bottom of the screen.
22:42 iqualfragile @randomdevwithalotofsparetime sometimes things get out of sync between client and server
22:43 iqualfragile more precisely: entities
22:43 iqualfragile even if it is a local singleplayer server
22:43 sapier joined #minetest-dev
22:49 PilzAdam sapier, have you tested #962 ?
22:51 sapier yes on windows as well as linux .. any issues with it?
22:51 PilzAdam and it works?
22:51 sapier at least for me ;)
22:52 PilzAdam it can be merged then
22:52 sapier I only tested irrlich 1.8(windows) as well as 1.7.3(linux)
22:55 ShadowNinja https://github.com/ShadowNinja/minetest/comm​it/d3cf8a822ebd97d3ef790e210a25bde3d2c888ed
22:55 ShadowNinja proller: ^ Thoughts?
22:57 ShadowNinja Hmmm, I notice that my implementation of humanTime() works a lot better.
22:58 proller 16d 22h 25m 9s
22:58 proller its better?
22:58 proller 9s very important
22:59 proller and now  uptime, age - its 2 values
23:00 ShadowNinja proller: I can remove seconds, but it's better than "10.8h 7.6M".
23:00 proller 0.4.7, minetest, undefined
23:00 proller ShadowNinja, its not bettes
23:00 proller r
23:00 * ShadowNinja disagrees.
23:00 proller if value more than day - hours have no sense
23:00 ShadowNinja I will fix the undefined mapgen.
23:01 proller and where is xss transform?
23:02 ShadowNinja proller: Hmmm? The server is expected to send valid data.
23:02 proller no
23:03 proller for server "alert()" is valid
23:03 ShadowNinja proller: That will display as "alert()".
23:04 proller <script>alert()</script>
23:04 ShadowNinja But "<script>alert()</script>" probably won't.
23:04 proller and you lost age value
23:04 ShadowNinja There is probably some standard escapr function...
23:05 proller and why -function get(refresh) {
23:05 ShadowNinja No, age is just always undefined. (Why?)
23:05 proller its defined here http://servers.minetest.net/
23:06 ShadowNinja No need for it, it is called imediately afterward with refresh unfefined.
23:06 ShadowNinja Odd.
23:08 sapier left #minetest-dev
23:09 proller and where is more...
23:12 proller and where is disableable columns
23:12 ShadowNinja proller: Where are they in your version?
23:12 proller http://minetest.setun.net:8000/ - press clients/players
23:13 proller they can be adjusted from html
23:13 proller http://minetest.net/servers - same script
23:13 proller but without ping
23:15 ShadowNinja Hmmm, that can probably be done with doT, if you really want that. The way it works there is a little odd.
23:17 ShadowNinja Ah, I should add display.ping and the like.
23:18 proller .. and template will be not better than now
23:22 ShadowNinja Me and thexyz disagree.
23:27 ShadowNinja With IPv6 support the IP colomn has to be shortened, perhaps the first few charachters and toe rest on hover...
23:34 proller ipv6 with port must be [ip]:port
23:39 mrtux joined #minetest-dev

| Channels | #minetest-dev index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext