Minetest logo

IRC log for #minetest-dev, 2013-10-29

| Channels | #minetest-dev index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext

All times shown according to UTC.

Time Nick Message
00:32 Taoki joined #minetest-dev
01:14 NakedFury joined #minetest-dev
01:42 general3214 joined #minetest-dev
01:50 salamanderrake joined #minetest-dev
02:15 OWNSyouAll_DESKT joined #minetest-dev
05:26 werwerwer_ joined #minetest-dev
06:08 darkrose joined #minetest-dev
06:26 nore joined #minetest-dev
06:29 proller joined #minetest-dev
07:27 e1z0 joined #minetest-dev
07:35 Ritchie joined #minetest-dev
07:38 e1z0 joined #minetest-dev
08:53 e1z0 joined #minetest-dev
10:27 proller joined #minetest-dev
10:51 jojoa1997 joined #minetest-dev
10:53 Calinou joined #minetest-dev
11:04 iqualfragile joined #minetest-dev
11:21 proller https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/895/files - now with annoying timers reset (prevent server 100% cpu use and lag)
11:50 jojoa1997 joined #minetest-dev
12:14 nore joined #minetest-dev
12:29 hmmmm joined #minetest-dev
12:35 proller hmmmm, weather broken month ago..
12:36 ImQ009 joined #minetest-dev
12:38 djdduty joined #minetest-dev
12:51 iqualfragile_ joined #minetest-dev
13:45 NakedFury joined #minetest-dev
13:59 Ritchie_ joined #minetest-dev
14:03 proller joined #minetest-dev
14:36 ImQ009 joined #minetest-dev
14:39 zat joined #minetest-dev
14:43 rubenwardy joined #minetest-dev
15:06 werwerwer joined #minetest-dev
15:19 ImQ009 joined #minetest-dev
15:38 ImQ009_ joined #minetest-dev
15:38 ImQ009_ joined #minetest-dev
16:00 PilzAdam joined #minetest-dev
16:00 smoke_fumus|2 joined #minetest-dev
16:01 nore PilzAdam, so, what were your thoughts on #966?
16:04 rubenwardy Merge commits into one (Add callback to register on craft) commit?
16:04 e1z0_ joined #minetest-dev
16:05 nore rubenwardy, I heard that the one who commits can do that
16:05 nore but I can do it if needed too
16:05 rubenwardy ok
16:05 nore anyway, PilzAdam wanted to test it, but I don't know what was the result of his tests
16:06 nore so I'm waiting for him (and yes, that was deliberately a ping)
16:14 nore PilzAdam, ^
16:15 VanessaE what's the deal with the vector lib bug?  (shadow's fix is here:  http://ix.io/8MK )
16:15 nore waiting, as usual... ;)
16:15 ShadowNinja VanessaE: No, that doesn't fix your issue, it just catches more, unlikely, cases.
16:16 VanessaE oh.
16:16 VanessaE bummer :-/
16:27 nore why doesn't PilzAdam answer?
16:27 nore :(
16:30 proller nore, current average pull merge time = ~6 months
16:30 proller just wait 8)
16:32 nore proller, he tested my pull...
16:32 nore but no answer since then
16:33 proller okay, just 3 months if tested
16:33 nore PilzAdam, do you read that?
16:34 thexyz anyone tested that android port? is it legit?
16:36 nore thexyz, https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=116136#p116136
16:36 nore looks like it is
16:37 Calinou joined #minetest-dev
16:37 VanessaE I ain't paying three bucks to download a hacked-and-retextured copy of minecraft....
16:37 VanessaE (which is probably what that thing is)
16:39 Ritchie_ joined #minetest-dev
16:39 thexyz okay, I'll do it then
16:43 thexyz nice thread though
16:45 thexyz no one knows what license minetest is
16:46 nore it is LGPL, isn't it?
16:46 Exio4 no idea who posted the GPL there
16:46 nore so modified version has to have its source code published...
16:46 Exio4 but that part applies to MT
16:49 nore https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/966 <-- any thoughts on this?
16:50 thexyz hmmm
16:51 nore what?
16:51 rubenwardy joined #minetest-dev
16:51 VanessaE hm?
16:54 nore thexyz, what?
16:55 thexyz this is interesting
16:55 nore what is interesting?
16:59 thexyz uh so confusing
16:59 thexyz what should we do with that topic
17:00 Gethiox2 joined #minetest-dev
17:00 thexyz I guess the guy should publish modifications to minetest but he's free to not publish his own code (i.e. wrappers around it)
17:01 e1z0 joined #minetest-dev
17:01 VanessaE but is it legit?
17:02 thexyz well let's see
17:02 thexyz it appears to be
17:03 rubenwardy Does google play have content testing?
17:03 rubenwardy ie: moderators check content
17:04 thexyz okay
17:04 thexyz I got to the main menu
17:04 nore is it real minetest?
17:11 Sokomine i still have client crashes when typing longer text in the client
17:11 nore thexyz, is it minetest, or something else that looks like it
17:11 VanessaE Sokomine: ditto,.
17:12 nore Sokomine, what size?
17:12 Sokomine it's not as bad as it used to be in much older versions but it definitely became a problem again
17:12 Sokomine longer sentence. can't pinpoint it to a certain length
17:12 Sokomine rubenwardy: no, they don't test
17:13 VanessaE I wonder about the texture pack he put in there - HDX is GFDL... I personally don't care if he uses it, but is that license commercial-compatible?
17:13 Sokomine they're probably going to remove apps that they see as a too severe threat to their business modell - but all that happens afterwards. there's no prior testing
17:13 VanessaE Sokomine: then they'll probably yank this since it's programmable......
17:14 VanessaE (actually I don't know if that's true for Google, but it sure was for Apple at one time)
17:15 Sokomine no, programmable is not the problem
17:15 VanessaE ok
17:15 Sokomine guess only what goes too much against advertising/user tracking is considered a threat :-)
17:15 VanessaE oh heh
17:15 VanessaE true :P
17:16 Sokomine but there are alternative stores. you can place an app almost everywhere. and if the user trusts you, it can be installed
17:16 VanessaE which makes me wonder why he didn't just publish the apk on the forum.
17:16 Sokomine setting up an android phone is a lot of work. at least it can be done to some degree. it's amazing how much tracking is involved
17:28 thexyz meh meh
17:28 thexyz what should we do about this topic
17:29 VanessaE leave it be for now.
17:29 VanessaE let's just see where it goes
17:29 thexyz I'm not going to remove it
17:29 thexyz just some replies
17:29 VanessaE oh
17:29 thexyz like https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=116139#p116139
17:29 thexyz which is against the rules
17:29 VanessaE ehm
17:29 thexyz or maybe not against the rules, dunno, didn't read them
17:30 VanessaE well I guess toss the couple of unhelpful posts in the trash
17:30 VanessaE (afaik the rules don't specifically prohibit PilzAdam's post as such)
17:32 thexyz well that's what celeron55 wanted
17:32 thexyz iirc
17:33 thexyz when he decided to switch to lgpl
17:33 VanessaE yes
17:33 Calinou rubenwardy: I think it does but probably less strict than apple
17:33 VanessaE the question about the logo doesn't quite make sense though
17:33 VanessaE why the whole package but not it's most well-known piece of IP?
17:36 thexyz I failed to parse the last sentence, sorry
17:38 VanessaE someone complains that the minetest logo is not usable by this project, despite being the most recognizable part of the game/engine, yet the engine itself is legal for commercial use?  (source code availability aside)
17:38 VanessaE IP == Intellectual Property, marketsp33k for stuff you made. :)
17:38 rubenwardy_ joined #minetest-dev
17:39 thexyz I don't know what's the license of the logo
17:40 VanessaE https://github.com/minetest/minetest/blob/master/README.txt#L262
17:40 VanessaE if you consider it a texture then cc-by-sa 3.0, not -nc
17:41 AllegedlyDead joined #minetest-dev
17:41 VanessaE this does need to be spelled out a little more clearly in the readme though.
17:49 rubenwardy_ License for logo: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=63922#p63922
17:49 rubenwardy Creative Commons BY-SA 3.0 by Nils Dagsson Moskopp / erlehmann
17:53 thexyz that's ok then
17:53 thexyz if that erlehmann is legit, of course
17:56 celeron55 well
17:56 celeron55 that's an interesting thing to pop up
17:57 rubenwardy hmmm
17:58 celeron55 i wonder how trademark stuff goes here; minetest can very probably be expected to be a name of something approved by me or the core team or something
17:58 celeron55 i don't mind someone using the code; but someone using the name for their advantage is wrong
18:03 celeron55 also they couldn't possibly have made those UI controls with the existing LGPL code, so they must publis whatever they did to make it happen
18:03 celeron55 +h
18:06 celeron55 and google isn't helpful at all in resolving these kinds of things
18:07 celeron55 because obviously they want to make money rather than talk about issues
18:07 thexyz well the guy's from china
18:08 celeron55 google play's documents say they follow the U.S. law
18:09 Zeitgeist_ joined #minetest-dev
18:09 thexyz oh right
18:09 thexyz assuming google would care you can ask them to remove it
18:12 celeron55 dunno really; i wonder what course of action might take most sense
18:12 celeron55 make*
18:14 celeron55 maybe i should e-mail that guy and see what he's up to
18:14 celeron55 i wouldn't really expect any kind of respect towards anyone though
18:16 celeron55 it's not right to excessively hunt down ports like that; but we should define what is the minimum that they have to do in order to be acceptable
18:16 celeron55 otherwise it's all just unfair and everyone loses interest in porting
18:19 celeron55 i could send an email asking that instead of money, they should contribute back all changes they have done to LGPL code, and if they won't link to this official project nor give credits, they are not allowed to use the name
18:19 celeron55 it's fucking lame that they have simply removed the credits tab from the menu
18:19 celeron55 it's like a direct "fuck you" towards minetest
18:21 celeron55 hmm, i could ask for help from some of these past minetest contributors that have more legal interests (i.e. GPL advocates)
18:35 celeron55 thexyz: did you or someone try to buy and check it?
18:35 celeron55 i'm going to report to gnu.org, but i need some solid information for that
18:36 celeron55 https://gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html
18:38 celeron55 the LGPL does not require a distributor to give anything for free; but of course it can be assumed that the android download only contains the binaries and no extra information
18:38 thexyz celeron55: yeah, I bought it
18:39 celeron55 what came with it?
18:39 celeron55 can you make a list of files or something
18:39 VanessaE screw that, post the apk :)
18:40 thexyz celeron55: http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=MA1M0La5
18:42 thexyz it's like supertuxcart
18:42 thexyz but source seems to be modified
18:42 VanessaE HDX is slightly out-of-date in this listing but not by much.
18:44 celeron55 hmm
18:44 celeron55 what kind of a construction is this
18:44 celeron55 there's libMine.so
18:44 thexyz yeah
18:44 celeron55 and... gdbserver
18:44 thexyz well that's how it works
18:44 VanessaE gdb as in gnu debug?
18:45 celeron55 where's the actual executable in apks?
18:45 thexyz android jni and stuff
18:45 Exio4 so.. it is real? wow.
18:45 thexyz native code is compiled to a library and then it's called from java code
18:45 celeron55 okay, that makes sense
18:46 celeron55 so it's probably largely intact and they just call the equivalent of main()
18:46 VanessaE I guess it's real
18:46 thexyz it's too slow to be considered playable on my galaxy nexus though
18:46 proller joined #minetest-dev
18:47 thexyz well, local game, didn't try multiplayer
18:47 thexyz interface seems to be the only thing which is heavily modified
18:47 VanessaE thexyz: I dare you to try it on my survival server ;)
18:48 thexyz I can't enter any text so this is not happening
18:48 VanessaE your post about that on the forum is unclear
18:48 PilzAdam can you modify minetest.conf?
18:48 thexyz yes
18:54 thexyz celeron55: shouldn't you try to contact the OP before reporting it to gnu guys?
18:56 celeron55 i'm still considering what to do
18:58 VanessaE frankly I think the best thing to do is offer some kind of license agreement and request, politely, that the credits tab be reinstated.
18:58 VanessaE chinese are very hung up on "saving face"
18:58 VanessaE give him a chance to do so
18:59 VanessaE (or so I understand)
18:59 VanessaE we have a (poorly understood, barely heeded) phrase here that you'll catch more flies with honey than with vinegar :)
19:02 celeron55 i'm not planning to make any kind of public shaming out of this; but also i don't want to do any nonsense because of being inexperienced
19:03 celeron55 and also i don't want to waste much time on this
19:04 thexyz you already did
19:04 celeron55 nope
19:04 celeron55 also i wouldn't do anything useful at the moment anyway
19:05 VanessaE well seeing as how minetest is really more of a team effort now,
19:05 VanessaE (oops)
19:05 VanessaE ..why does it have to necessarily fall on you anyway?
19:07 celeron55 well i'm open to people taking this task to themselves
19:07 celeron55 but i do probably have the most knowledge about overall licenses of minetest and stuff
19:08 VanessaE true
19:09 celeron55 there's an issue with reporting this to FSF, because how they seem to generally handle these things is that if stuff is that they handle it themselves if the copyright has been given to them, and otherwise report to whoever has the copyright
19:09 celeron55 but MT's copyright is whoever's who happened to make a piece of stuff
19:09 celeron55 ...
19:10 VanessaE an open letter, drafted in a private wiki page or google docs or something similar, signed-off by several of the core devs maybe, and sent to him from some neutral party?
19:11 Miner_48er joined #minetest-dev
19:11 celeron55 i wrote complete nonsense in that previous line and can't even understand what the excess or missing part is
19:11 VanessaE no worries, what you wrote does make sense.
19:11 celeron55 8D
19:12 celeron55 send to... who? what'd that be about?
19:12 VanessaE well to who would be the guy managing the package e.g. this penguin03 fellow.
19:12 thexyz I was only able to understand it in O(N^2) complexity but that's ok
19:12 thexyz just post on forum
19:12 celeron55 that's not what i meant or what the fsf does
19:13 VanessaE as for what it would be about....erm... that's up for discussion :D
19:13 celeron55 https://gnu.org/licenses/gpl-violation.html
19:13 celeron55 "Note that the GPL, and other copyleft licenses, are copyright licenses. This means that only the copyright holders are empowered to act against violations. The FSF acts on all GPL violations reported on FSF copyrighted code, and we offer assistance to any other copyright holder who wishes to do the same"
19:13 celeron55 that's what i meant
19:13 VanessaE ah, yeah see we need to void that yet.
19:13 VanessaE it's too soon to launch a copy[right|left] tirade
19:13 VanessaE avoid*
19:14 VanessaE but maybe I'm a little biased on that
19:14 celeron55 i'm not launching anything, i'm trying to understand (and make others understand) who is the one who has the legal right to that
19:14 VanessaE copyright noise is just overwhelming in the USA :-/
19:15 VanessaE well technically, anyone whose code was used has that right, according to case law in the USA anyways.  Other countries' mileage (kilometerage?) will vary.
19:16 thexyz most (all?) code is marked as >Copyright (C) 2010-2013 celeron55
19:16 thexyz so that's you
19:16 VanessaE <offtopic>  In other news, "Tea Party Activists Praise Ted Cruz as the New Jesus Christ" </offtopic>
19:17 celeron55 thexyz: that's what the bytes in the files say, but i don't think that's legally binding at all
19:18 celeron55 because leaving those there is basically a mindless habit
19:18 thexyz now, now, gnu guys would've already told you that you shouldn't treat this as a "mindless habit" since it's that important and stuff
19:18 VanessaE celeron55: they are, depending on who makes a claim and where it is filed.
19:18 celeron55 anyway by contacting fsf, we'd be asking for assistance rather than a court case
19:23 VanessaE thing is, if you do that you have no way of knowing just how litigious they are (or would be)...  it could backfire drastically
19:23 VanessaE (s/you/someone/)
19:45 celeron55 looking more into this, we probably should include a mentiong about LGPL in the credits tab of the engine
19:45 celeron55 -g
19:45 celeron55 also we don't distribute the lgpl license terms with our binaries 8)
19:52 celeron55 there seem to be basically two issues with the android thing
19:52 celeron55 1) they don't include any license and copyright information about the engine
19:52 celeron55 2) they don't provide the source code
19:52 celeron55 (that is derived from the original LGPL source)
19:52 celeron55 any others?
19:53 celeron55 there is no legal requirement for a credits tab, but i will mention it as a separate thing
19:53 celeron55 this will be going to the android port developer
19:58 * sfan5 sees android and reads the backlog
19:59 thexyz what about the name?
20:04 jojoa1997 joined #minetest-dev
20:10 sapier joined #minetest-dev
20:13 * celeron55 came back from sauna
20:13 celeron55 thexyz: the name goes in the same "section of things" as the credits
20:13 celeron55 really, LGPL is a strict set of rules the following of which is really just a mechanical task
20:14 celeron55 but credits and other things can probably be tied to allowance of using the name "Minetest"
20:15 celeron55 that is, if you don't give credits or don't otherwise respect the community, your product can't use the name
20:15 sapier wait wasn't the difference between lgpl and gpl that lgpl doesn't require user to give his modifications back?
20:15 celeron55 sapier: lol no 8D
20:16 Exio4 no, lgpl means you can use? it with a closed program without having to opensource under GPL the first
20:16 sapier hmm ok so I should update my knowledge about lgpl :)
20:16 Exio4 i don't know how lgpl applies to programs
20:16 celeron55 it depends on how the modifications are done, and in this case they couldn't have been done in a way that does not mandate any code release
20:17 celeron55 or, well, *modifications* are exactly what needs to be released
20:17 celeron55 but if you'd modify minetest to be a library and used that from a program, you'd only need to release the... eh, modifications
20:17 celeron55 just read the license; no need to argue about it here
20:17 sapier ok I guess they didn't write their own main application calling our code so they most likely modified it
20:18 celeron55 however, do people agree about this thing i said about the "Minetest" name?
20:19 celeron55 in legal terms it's really a trademark issue rather than a copyright issue
20:19 sapier yea but I'm almost sure none of us did register minetest as trademark ... it's not cheapest thing to do
20:20 sapier still maybe it's enough to write those guys a friendly mail to gently push them into right direction ;-)
20:20 celeron55 at least in finland you don't need to register a trademark
20:21 celeron55 if you use it consistently (like Minetest is used), it's your trademark and you have the rights to it as a trademark
20:21 sapier you don't? great :-)
20:21 celeron55 you can register them if you want though
20:21 sapier I'm not sure if this is true for germany too ... and I'm almost sure it's wrong for us and brasil
20:30 kahrl afaik it's true in germany ("Gebrauchsmarke")
20:30 kahrl although i can't find anything about it atm
20:32 sapier could be but I don't think we'd have resources to fight for it if someone else would register minetest as tm
20:32 celeron55 good thing it's such a bad name nobody will
20:32 celeron55 8D
20:33 sapier yea no commercial project wants to have a "test" in it's name :)
20:33 sapier except test tools maybe
20:33 celeron55 if you have excess pocket money, you can register it for yourself in your country though :P
20:36 kahrl http://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/markeng/__4.html  2.
20:37 VanessaE in US I guess registration is not necessary but it is encouraged
20:37 sapier hmm not sure if we meet requirements for "geschäftlicher verkehr" ... but I don't want to lern legals :-)
20:37 VanessaE ( ™ vs. ® )
20:38 VanessaE but law here says you DO have to defend it.
20:38 celeron55 the US law is well known for useless lawsuits defending trademarks in weird situations 8)
20:38 sapier so if you don't blame others for abuse you don't have it any longer
20:38 VanessaE yup
20:38 VanessaE :D
20:39 celeron55 maybe we should take minecraft in court just in case
20:39 sapier if that happens we can rename to "tgfnm" ... no one ever wants to use that name
20:39 celeron55 i have $100 in donations, that should be enough
20:39 kahrl better spend it on beer
20:40 celeron55 (it's likely eventually going towards hosting costs, if somebody got concerned)
20:41 Exio4 but.. beer :(
20:42 VanessaE fuck the beer, what about the pizza? :)
20:42 Exio4 beer+pizza VanessaE
20:43 PilzAdam s/ /=/
20:43 VanessaE I hate beer :P
20:43 sapier hmm trademark registration in germany is at least 300 eur
20:44 VanessaE USD $159 here
20:44 ImQ009 joined #minetest-dev
20:45 VanessaE no, strike that.  $159 + $325
20:45 sapier wow ... if you want to keep a tm after 100 years they want 750 eur for additional 10 years
20:45 VanessaE O.o
20:46 sapier yes 300 eur is only if your tm is valid in 3 classes only but if it's automaticaly added to other classes it's additional 100 eur per class
20:46 sapier and 260 for additional 10 years per class
20:49 sapier I don't think that's a real option
20:49 celeron55 http://pastebin.com/uqiA099d
20:50 celeron55 good enough, and anything to add?
20:50 VanessaE celeron55: s/incompliances/non-compliant things/
20:52 celeron55 is that really an appropriate edit? sounds clumsy
20:52 sapier I'd not insist on the credits tab in this special form
20:52 VanessaE line 35/36 reads a bit odd in English, but no matter.  The rest is good.
20:53 VanessaE incompliance is not a word :)
20:53 celeron55 sapier: why?
20:53 VanessaE non-compliance is the usual term
20:54 sapier e.g. if credits are shown on each start that would be fine too ;-)
20:54 celeron55 ah, i thought it would be obvious that it doesn't really matter in which exact form they are
20:55 sapier maybe I understood wrong but I read that as credits have to be shown as credits tab
20:55 PilzAdam I like the idea of "PilzAdam" being shown for 30 seconds on each startup ;-)
20:55 celeron55 8D
20:56 VanessaE heh
20:56 celeron55 'In no circumstance it is acceptable to remove the "Credits" tab from the menu without replacing it with something equivalently visible'
20:56 celeron55 the beginning of that is silly
20:56 celeron55 'It is not acceptable to remove the "Credits" tab from the menu without replacing it with something equivalently visible'
20:56 celeron55 better
20:56 sapier yes
20:57 sapier wait
20:57 VanessaE you could have also written, "Under no circumstances is it ..."
20:57 sapier you could replace credits tab by "reciep for banana fish soup" still following words of that sentence
20:58 sapier as banana fish soup is "something"
20:58 VanessaE that much is true
20:58 VanessaE "something" is too vague
20:58 celeron55 lol
20:58 VanessaE remind me later to get rubenwardy to make a banana-fish soup for the food mod :D
20:59 celeron55 "replacing it with equivalently visible credits"?
20:59 sapier kik
20:59 Exio4 haha
20:59 sapier ähh lol
20:59 celeron55 but, like, is there anything to add to this?
20:59 celeron55 is this all we need?
20:59 sapier I don't think we can demand much more
21:00 VanessaE I think this is enough.  "equivalently-visible credits section or screen."
21:00 VanessaE (hyphen, and you need the extra noun)
21:00 sapier btw if they don't follow this I guess next step is to file an issue to google  is it?
21:01 celeron55 i'll contact the FSF then
21:01 sapier ok I guess they know what to do
21:01 celeron55 (google and fsf care only about part 1 though, so if they see this reasonable, it's a bonus to us)
21:02 sapier but guys we're good enough to be "stolen" now ;-)
21:02 celeron55 s/they/the android developers/
21:02 PilzAdam sapier, yay
21:02 VanessaE sapier: next thing you know there will be "cracked" copies floating around on the usual torrent sites :D
21:02 PilzAdam oh right, I should sell my cracked client for 10$
21:02 celeron55 yeah, our software is pirated and we don't have any reason to care
21:02 sapier they want money for it so I guess thats gonna happen very soon
21:03 celeron55 send the email
21:03 celeron55 sent*
21:03 sapier I wonder if cracking a non protected game is really a crime
21:03 celeron55 (i really should sleep)
21:03 * VanessaE is curious of the final copy
21:03 celeron55 (i typo everything)
21:04 celeron55 VanessaE: it's $15 DLC!
21:04 PilzAdam maybe we just get ignored
21:04 VanessaE haha
21:04 VanessaE PilzAdam: actually doesn't it go something, first they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they accept you, then they copy you, or some such?
21:05 sapier maybe we should add trademark informations to our downloads
21:05 celeron55 i changed it to asking 50% profit share and letting use the minetest name without any questions
21:05 celeron55 then i'll be rich and you cry
21:05 VanessaE heh
21:05 PilzAdam VanessaE, first they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fear you, and then you win
21:05 sapier I guess we're just fork in that case naming it minefinal
21:05 sapier :-P
21:05 VanessaE PilzAdam: right, I was close at least
21:06 VanessaE we already have the first two done and gone... :)
21:06 PilzAdam well, mojang still ignores us AFAIK
21:06 VanessaE yeah but their community sure doesn't :P
21:06 sapier does someone know without trying what installer our official win32 release uses
21:06 sapier ?
21:06 PilzAdam oh right, they laugh at us
21:07 VanessaE pfft WE laugh at us sometimes :)
21:07 sapier they won't lough at us once modstore is spread ;-P
21:07 sapier thats a usp minecraft doesn't have
21:08 celeron55 sapier: isn't it made by rubenwardy?
21:09 sapier I don't know I'll have a look maybe I'm gonna provide different versions e.g. mingw32/vs2012/(mingw64) maybe even vs2012 64bit ... last one is very very unlikely
21:11 sapier LOL http://sourceforge.net/projects/wix/ ... I guess microsoft has some sort of humor
21:11 fairiestoy joined #minetest-dev
21:13 celeron55 those sourceforge comments are absurd
21:14 sfan5 oh I get it now :P
21:14 yno joined #minetest-dev
21:15 celeron55 i wonder if i should mention that email in the forum thread
21:16 sapier I'd wait a little bit to not trigger to big waves maybe they did this by mistake
21:16 sapier yes I know that's not very likely :)
21:17 celeron55 hmm, i guess so
21:18 sapier argh that damn wix thing has win8 interface ... could someone plz tell those marketing guys lack of window borders is not necessary on screens as big as 22"
21:18 celeron55 they're probably thinking from a completely different perspective so dunno if they get the potential of working within the comunity at all
21:21 thexyz the guy is from china
21:22 sapier not very promissing
21:22 VanessaE like I said, to the Chinese, keeping up appearances and/or "saving face" are very important.
21:23 thexyz hm.. maybe, I'm not sure
21:23 thexyz I only know they don't give a shit about copyright and all that stuff
21:23 VanessaE that much is probably true
21:23 celeron55 but if they do it only for the looks, it doesn't have much long-term significance
21:24 celeron55 thexyz: but they probably give a shit about being banned from google play
21:24 celeron55 however, my previous point stays 8)
21:24 celeron55 +valid
21:25 thexyz they'll just release in chinese "google" "play"
21:25 celeron55 they could start following the rules, but if they follow them just because they have to be followed, that's not that fruitful
21:26 sapier I guess the only way to stop this would be create a own android version
21:26 thexyz in china people don't use google play
21:28 sfan5 sapier: one can build and debug minetest on android
21:29 thexyz see
21:29 thexyz we ask them for source code
21:29 thexyz then decompile their java app
21:29 thexyz misson completed
21:29 sapier I don't think we'll get that code
21:30 sfan5 if there is no classes.dex file in the .apk there is not java code from them involved
21:31 thexyz meh
21:31 thexyz there of course is classes.dex
21:31 thexyz but Minetest source modifications are of course much more important
21:31 sfan5 ^
21:31 thexyz which we're unlikely to get, as sapier says
21:32 celeron55 ...there could also be irrlicht source modifications
21:32 celeron55 which are even more important
21:32 sfan5 irrlicht works pretty well on android out of the box
21:32 thexyz yep, irrlicht's already ported for android
21:33 thexyz I see references to supertuxcart everywhere
21:33 thexyz *supertuxkart
21:33 sapier is it brave to guess that there may not be that much changes to be done to port it ?
21:33 sfan5 port irrlicht?
21:33 sapier port minetest
21:33 Exio4 the important changes are the "touch" one, for the interface and so
21:34 Exio4 if not, you will end with a quake3-like-port game that is useless without keyboard and mouse
21:34 thexyz why? I don't think it's very hard
21:34 sapier maybe those changes are already included in irrlicht port? (I'm just guessing without knowing right now)
21:34 Exio4 what other changes would you need to do to make it run?
21:35 sfan5 the minetest I compiled currently crashes and corrupts the stack after entering main()
21:35 Exio4 "big changes" i mean
21:35 sapier sfan5 compiled using what compiler?
21:35 sfan5 the changes I made to get it to compile: https://github.com/sfan5/minetest/commit/3849334f1edfd101ef643bab5e4789814be49269
21:36 Exio4 sfan5: using the sdk, i guess?
21:36 VanessaE fairly minimal changes.
21:36 sfan5 sapier: crystax NDK
21:36 sapier :-) why do you do it the hacky way and don't do it right ?
21:36 sfan5 the official one doesn't support wchar_t completly
21:36 sfan5 and something related to threads
21:36 Exio4 sapier: hmm?
21:37 sfan5 I just wanted to get it running
21:37 sfan5 I can add if(NOT Android) to the cmake files later
21:37 thexyz sapier: how do I build it?
21:37 celeron55 ^sfan5*
21:37 sapier thexyz build what?
21:38 thexyz I think it may be a good idea to start an article at dev wiki
21:38 thexyz sapier: sorry
21:38 thexyz brain doesn't work very well at 1:40 am
21:38 sapier I already added my build instructions to dev wiki ;-)
21:38 sfan5 thexyz: https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=113987#p113987 & https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?pid=115098#p115098
21:38 sapier no problem
21:38 thexyz can't english either
21:38 sapier mine are for mingw32 and vs2012 (windows)
21:39 thexyz sfan5: wiki article is not hard at all
21:39 thexyz and you won't need to link to those random posts
21:39 sfan5 ok,ok
21:39 thexyz http://dev.minetest.net/Android
21:40 thexyz is a nice place to start it, I guess
21:41 thexyz maybe a step-by-step guide would be cool too, since you say i.e. "Use this irrCompileConfig.h" but don't tell how to
21:41 sfan5 I'll do this now
21:41 thexyz so I guess I have to replace it in irrlicht source tree? or something?
21:41 thexyz okay, many thanks
21:43 sfan5 irrCompileConfig.h lies in include/
21:55 proller also my tries to compile for opengl es https://github.com/minetest/minetest/pull/526
22:06 sapier great I don't need to learn wix I just use cpack :-)
22:17 fairiestoy left #minetest-dev
22:26 sfan5 thexyz: created the page
23:51 Tesseract joined #minetest-dev

| Channels | #minetest-dev index | Today | | Google Search | Plaintext