Time Nick Message 01:04 hmmmm wow, KDE sounds like crap 01:04 hmmmm why don't you use xfce? 02:57 SitDog update: i am around & i am reading the chat logs. i don't have much to add yet, but give me a bit to continue reviewing the codebase. i did get my environment setup and running on windows. i guess the documentation could be the first update :D 07:35 celeron55 hmmmm: i use icewm 07:36 celeron55 i have not found another file browser that supports tabs, sftp, image thumbnails and removable storage 07:37 celeron55 that is the minimum i require from such software 07:39 darkrose tried pcmanfm? 07:40 celeron55 it sucks big time 07:41 darkrose eh, works for me for the few times I actually use a graphical file manager 18:45 PilzAdam Idea: Use group fuel instead of minetest.register_craft({type="fuel"...}) 18:51 celeron55 too hard to implement 18:52 celeron55 ...probably 18:52 PilzAdam get_craft_result() is in c++? 18:53 celeron55 hmm wtf 18:54 celeron55 where are the fuel recipes even used 18:54 celeron55 only in lua? 18:54 PilzAdam I guess so 18:56 celeron55 i guess it could be 18:57 celeron55 you could try doing that 18:58 celeron55 by just just... rewriting the furnace code 18:58 celeron55 -just 18:58 celeron55 or is there mods in use that want fuels from get_craft_result? 19:03 celeron55 i guess furnace replacement mods use that 19:04 celeron55 is there any plus side in using a group for that? 19:05 PilzAdam its less code; easier to understand 19:05 PilzAdam and it fits the default style 19:06 celeron55 what would the value be 19:06 celeron55 burn time in seconds? 19:07 celeron55 it would definitely work; the most work is figuring out how to implement backwards compatibility 19:08 celeron55 i guess register_craft should add the group if given a fuel, and get_craft_recipe should mimick the current behavior by inspecting if the item has the group 19:09 celeron55 so, C++ stuff 19:09 PilzAdam got it 19:09 celeron55 or alternatively a lua wrapper for the native ones that will steal the fuel behavior 19:09 PilzAdam I changed furnace to first check for group and then get_craft_result() 19:12 PilzAdam https://gist.github.com/4177830 19:14 celeron55 that can save the string "nil" to fuel_totaltime 19:14 celeron55 ...maybe 19:15 PilzAdam yea, i initialize fuel_time with 0 19:16 celeron55 because it can access an empty result from get_craft_result and put it in fuel_time 19:16 celeron55 it should probably be "if not fuel_time or fuel_time <= 0 then" 19:17 PilzAdam get_craft_result doesnt return nil 19:17 celeron55 but .time can be nil 19:17 PilzAdam https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/blob/master/doc/lua_api.txt#L896 19:17 PilzAdam no 19:17 PilzAdam only 0 19:18 celeron55 oh 19:18 celeron55 well, apparently so 19:18 PilzAdam the old code would be crashy otherwise 19:32 Taoki celeron55: Any progress with that shaders code and hardware lighting? Or any estimation when something about that will be on GIT and possible to test? 19:33 celeron55 Taoki: i won't be doing anything related to that 19:33 celeron55 and i don't know anyone who would 19:33 Taoki ahhh, ok 19:34 Taoki Not sure who will then :( 19:36 Taoki I tried looking at the lighting code, it's very large and complex. Would probably need to be someone who knows it and can understand it, as well as how shaders work, but I don't know if there's anyone else who does... 19:37 PilzAdam https://github.com/PilzAdam/minetest_game/commit/8baf0d29e73c43bd55008f5af22f616d50391ff8 19:52 celeron55 stupid adsl brokee down again -_- 19:52 celeron55 -e 19:52 celeron55 21:38:29 < celeron55> it is one thing i would be interested in doing, but it's not like i would have time for it 19:52 celeron55 21:38:45 < celeron55> there is like 10000 things i could do, and i can pick a few per week 19:52 celeron55 21:38:53 < celeron55> and less when i do other projects 19:52 celeron55 21:38:56 < celeron55> which i want to do too 19:54 Taoki Power failure. If someone posted something since my last message please re-post 19:54 Sudi hey celeron55 how do you guys handle entity creation deletion over the network? 19:54 Sudi do you send extra events when a new entity should be created/destroyed 19:55 celeron55 Taoki: that's funny; my adsl broke down at the same time 8) see the channel log (topic) for my repost of what i think this channel missed 19:55 Sudi or do you let the client figure it out from the received data? 19:55 celeron55 the server keeps track of which client knows which entity 19:55 celeron55 and sends initialization/deletion commands when it sees them getting in/out of rhange 19:55 celeron55 range* 19:56 Sudi ah ok 19:57 Taoki That log worked :) 19:57 Taoki I think this is an important one, but that's understandable. Problem is this is one of the hardest things to do, and I assume someone needs to know the code there well 19:58 celeron55 i think it is not an important one 19:58 celeron55 there is so much wrong under the hood i just can't work on it until after much other things 19:58 celeron55 and no, it is not hard at all 19:59 Taoki Well, you surely know what's wrong under the hood more than me. At this day though, there aren't quite that many things I can say are wrong with the MineTest engine. Still many things unoptimized and not done yet, but not that bad I'd say 19:59 celeron55 more like laborious and experience-requiring 19:59 celeron55 and the latter can be replaced with googling! 20:00 celeron55 also it includes planning of what to even try to do 20:04 Taoki Should try to get someone helping out on this... 20:09 celeron55 i guess the plan is to add a setting that disables the voxel lighting (as it currently is - of course it can use it in it's own way then though) and enables shaders that implement some kind of regular-ish modern lighting 20:10 celeron55 i fiddle with it at times, but i don't expect to get anything done 20:12 Taoki Yeah, that would be useful 20:12 Taoki And thanks, hope you can at least fiddle with it some and maybe you can get somewhere and post that on GIT :) 20:12 Taoki Problem is that since meshes can't be copied, the voxel lighting cause the bug where one player's brightness is copied to all 20:13 Taoki Well, one problem 20:18 celeron55 possibly a shader could be applied to only them in the non-fancy mode 20:18 celeron55 just to set the vertex color 20:19 Taoki yeah, but it would be sad to have light only for models when it would look so nicely on the whole rodls :P This is also needed for other features I had planned 20:20 Taoki One idea to give a starting point however, could be: Get the sun and all light generating entities to work without shaders, even if light shines in caves. Commit that upstream as a fully disabled, experimentan and WIP feature, which can only be enabled if someone wants to by editing the settings file. That might encourage others to work on it than the thing gettinf forgotten 20:20 Taoki **getting 20:22 Taoki I tried that, but couldn't find how to disable voxel light everywhere, then make the sun and all lights use hardware lighting. So I think I'm giving up there 20:23 Taoki But yeah, I think this would be the coolest thing that could happen right now, now that models also exist :D Among those which are possible that is 21:01 VanessaE celeron55: feature freeze for 0.4.4-release is when? 21:02 celeron55 let's say after 48 hours; but nobody should try quickly cramming anything in just because of that 21:02 VanessaE celeron55: talking to RBA, he needs more time to get the hooks for unified inventory finished. 21:03 celeron55 everything should be quite stable at 48h from now 21:03 celeron55 so that there can be a few days of testing 21:03 PilzAdam would be nice if farming would be in 21:03 PilzAdam but RBA needs to finish the textures first 21:04 celeron55 there has been so many additions after 0.4.3 already that nobody has any need to hurry in any way just to get something to 0.4.4 :P 21:05 PilzAdam but it is always a nice effect if you are a casual user and install the next version and then there are millions of new features :-) 21:05 celeron55 but if something is already good and would be just a matter of merging ready stuff in, those should be cosnidered 21:05 Taoki gah... github seems to be down for a bit 21:05 Taoki And nice, yay for 0.4.4 going out :) 21:05 PilzAdam https://status.github.com/ 21:06 PilzAdam only minetest but not minetest_game repo is down 21:06 celeron55 PilzAdam: i have experience of trying to do that; it usually leads to many days of patching a very broken game 21:07 celeron55 there are two options: don't use unstable versions and don't get surprises, or use stable versions and get large bunches of new stuff at certain times 21:07 celeron55 ehm 21:07 celeron55 s/don't/do/ 21:08 RealBadAngel hi 21:09 PilzAdam sup 21:09 RealBadAngel im polishing now the formspec additions 21:09 RealBadAngel right coords for tooltips, proper naming and API doc 21:10 RealBadAngel i shall be ready soon 21:10 sfan5 https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/pull/306 should be merged IMO 21:10 RealBadAngel with this i could release Unified Inventory today or tommorow 21:11 VanessaE sfan5: a rainbow unicorn? 21:11 VanessaE that's a strange thing to push to git master. 21:11 VanessaE :D 21:11 sfan5 :D 21:11 sfan5 you can see a short desc. at https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/pulls 21:11 RealBadAngel celeron55, are you here? 21:12 thexyz VanessaE: use f5 21:12 VanessaE sfan5: ah, the crosshairs texture idea. 21:12 VanessaE thexyz: er, I know that. Actually took three reloads to get the page up. 21:14 celeron55 i love the github artist 21:16 VanessaE heh 21:16 VanessaE celeron55: by far, my favorite "error" page was from torrentz.com or whatever it was. Depicted a playful hamster resting on its back, with a message indicating that their "hamster-powered" servers were overloaded. 21:17 PilzAdam youtube: we have currently some monkeys working on this issue 21:20 VanessaE PilzAdam: isn't that always the case with youtube? ;) 21:21 PilzAdam since its buyed by google... 21:21 VanessaE heh 21:22 celeron55 love this: http://misc.minetest.net/tscrot-2012-11-30_23-15-03.png 21:23 VanessaE yep, saw that :) 21:23 celeron55 RealBadAngel: talk in here 21:24 RealBadAngel ok, lemme prepare pastebins first 21:25 VanessaE celeron55/sfan5: regarding the crosshair, I'd have to agree with Lord89James, such a patch should allow for an Lua hook to update the texture on-demand, if possible. 21:25 VanessaE (not that it's useful to me, but from others talking about what mods they want to write, it would get used eventually) 21:27 RealBadAngel celeron55, ive made tooltips for buttons and trying to get proper rect to check later if the mouse pointer is in 21:27 RealBadAngel heres the definition of the button: http://pastebin.com/QmrYJpMy 21:28 RealBadAngel and rectangle to be passed for drawing it 21:28 RealBadAngel and it appears to not be the same for checking for mouse pointer 21:28 RealBadAngel http://pastebin.com/XYiUf9b5 21:29 celeron55 VanessaE: what kind of scaling behavior those would need to have, then? i can see people making even armor bars and stuff like that with it using texture modifiers... 21:29 RealBadAngel here is check code, same rect is passed to it 21:30 RealBadAngel tooltips are show too soon to the left and up 21:30 RealBadAngel bigger the screen size difference is greater 21:30 VanessaE celeron55: scale up relative to the window size, same way that e.g. the inventory does. 21:31 VanessaE simple Lanczos/Sinc aspect-correct scaling - nothing fancy I think. 21:31 VanessaE well come to think of it.... 21:31 VanessaE yeah, do exactly that 21:31 VanessaE then such an armor etc. interface will flow smoothly into the rest of the UI 21:32 VanessaE (in which case either keep nearest-neighbor scaling like you do now, or upgrade the whole UI to use Lanczos or some other method) 21:32 VanessaE and people could use that for other effects - I've seen demands for player visuals like "player is on fire" (bleah.) and so forth 21:33 Taoki Just grepped the code... my anaglyph stereo patch is still not in, and there's a pull request for it too 21:33 Taoki https://github.com/celeron55/minetest/pull/285 21:33 RealBadAngel hi Taoki 21:33 Taoki hi :) 21:33 VanessaE hey taoki :) 21:35 VanessaE Taoki: as long as the left/right tinting can be tuned, +1. 21:35 Taoki it can 21:36 VanessaE (didn't read the code, I just remember it from earlier) 21:43 celeron55 VanessaE: ehm, automatic scaling of the crosshair? that doesn't make any sense 21:43 celeron55 nobody wants to look at some scaled garbage 21:43 celeron55 at the middle of the screen all the time 21:44 VanessaE well the problem there is, if you don't scale it, it'll get too small on some people's screens, relative to the window and UI 21:44 celeron55 RealBadAngel: i think you can find the problem faster than i can 21:45 RealBadAngel formspec is not done by you? 21:45 celeron55 RealBadAngel: darkrose implemented stuff to the formspec the last time, you could ask her too 21:45 VanessaE celeron55: another option would be to require say two or three images for the crosshair, drawn at different sizes, and just don't scale at all, even if some are missing. 21:46 RealBadAngel celeron55, ok i will ask darkrose 21:46 VanessaE then the modder can be the one to decide if it should look different at a bigger size than at the "default" size. 21:47 celeron55 RealBadAngel: and don't ask in private; nobody likes that 21:48 RealBadAngel celeron55, strange as for me but ok 21:48 RealBadAngel darkrose, are you here? 21:48 celeron55 i guess darkrose will already answer when there's time 21:49 celeron55 VanessaE: can you suggest a practical way of making that happen from the modder's standpoint 21:49 celeron55 assuming runtime selection of it too 21:49 RealBadAngel so i will leave the question there by now and goin to find the solution meanwhile on my own 21:49 VanessaE celeron55: maybe just crosshair_images = {"crosshair_normal", "crosshair_large", "crosshair_huge.png"} 21:50 VanessaE I dunno, just a random guess 21:50 celeron55 RealBadAngel: either that, or go eat and sleep 8) 21:50 VanessaE that's the basic form I would expect without reading an API, anyway 21:50 RealBadAngel i woke up an hour ago ;) 21:50 celeron55 where would that crosshair_images go 21:50 RealBadAngel now its weekend and long coding session 21:50 VanessaE mmm..lemme think about that 21:50 PilzAdam and texturing 21:51 celeron55 it's per-player at least 21:51 VanessaE register_crosshair({ blah blah, images = {"crosshair_normal", "crosshair_large", "crosshair_huge.png"}, blah blah}) 21:51 celeron55 so i guess it's just a player:set_crosshair({"crosshair_normal", "crosshair_large", "crosshair_huge.png"}) 21:51 VanessaE oh, so close! 21:51 VanessaE set_crosshair seems better. 21:52 RealBadAngel isnt better to set default_crosshair_scale=1.0 ? 21:52 VanessaE well set_crosshair for the function name, with my format idea maybe 21:52 RealBadAngel and modify it up or down? 21:53 VanessaE no, I think c55 is right that a crosshair shouldn't scale 21:53 celeron55 player:set_crosshair({640 = "crosshair_normal", 960 = "crosshair_large", 1200 = "crosshair_huge.png"}), with the numbers being vertical resolution and the client picking the closest one 21:53 RealBadAngel imho it could be scaled for zoom feature 21:53 VanessaE celeron55: +1 21:54 VanessaE or no, that's a bit of a departure from the usual.. 21:54 RealBadAngel press and hold Z to zoom, and scale crosshair then 21:54 RealBadAngel youre talkin bout feature, im talkin bout using the feature 21:55 VanessaE how about player:set_crosshair({ {normal"crosshair_normal", size=640}, {large="crosshair_large", size=960}, {huge="crosshair_huge.png", size=1200}}) 21:55 VanessaE er, normal="..... 21:55 celeron55 it *is* a departure from the usual, but nobody wants a crosshair with smudgy boundaries or 1px horizontal lines and 2px vertical lines 21:55 VanessaE having numbers for index IDs seems a little strange 21:56 celeron55 that is horrible 21:57 VanessaE meh 21:57 RealBadAngel texture shall be one and able to set by user 21:57 celeron55 i guess the scaling behavior needs to be configurable too 21:57 VanessaE No one ever said I could design an API :) 21:57 RealBadAngel with scale 21:57 celeron55 RealBadAngel: you aren't taking into account any other uses of it than your gun-whatever-binoculars 21:57 RealBadAngel so for example some1 could make mod with night vision googles 21:57 RealBadAngel zoomin stuff for weapons 21:57 RealBadAngel etc 21:58 RealBadAngel nah, im not goin to do that 21:58 RealBadAngel but just thought it could be possible then 21:58 celeron55 do you understand the default crosshair is going to be a texture too? 21:58 celeron55 and can you imagine how it looks randomly scaled 21:58 RealBadAngel yes 21:59 RealBadAngel should be high res 21:59 RealBadAngel and scaled down 21:59 VanessaE no, I agree with c55, crosshairs should be drawn 1:1, to the pixel 22:00 celeron55 forced high resolution in minetest? no wai 22:00 RealBadAngel nope 22:00 RealBadAngel just source crosshair texture 22:00 celeron55 yes, and that is what i commented about 22:00 RealBadAngel because you wont get good result of upscaling low resolution one 22:00 celeron55 we don't do high resolution textures in here 22:01 VanessaE celeron55: regarding my set_crosshair() call, maybe it's not as good as it could be, but imo yours having numbers for key IDs looks completely wrong too. 22:01 RealBadAngel so leave it up to user 22:01 VanessaE so we need a compromise 22:01 RealBadAngel if texture!="" then 22:01 RealBadAngel all will be happy 22:02 VanessaE RealBadAngel: that's what a texture pack is for 22:02 VanessaE low rez by default, use a texture pack if you want HD or something 22:02 RealBadAngel but first of all texture shall be exposed to the outside 22:03 RealBadAngel so what if the texture for formspec inventory fields is already in the engine? 22:03 RealBadAngel if theres no way to use it? 22:04 RealBadAngel what for buttons have two possible textures one for default and second for pressed 22:04 RealBadAngel if both are set to one? 22:05 celeron55 hmm, i think minecraft's crosshair is upscaled from two to three to i guess four times and maybe more, depending on resolution 22:06 VanessaE celeron55: ew. 22:07 celeron55 it makes a consistent look with the UI and the world, as they are pixely too 22:08 celeron55 of course some people want to screw up everything with high resolution and i need to figure out a way to do it in MT 8) 22:08 celeron55 silly people 22:08 PilzAdam -1 for HD 22:08 Taoki I like HD textures. Hope MT will always work well with them 22:08 Taoki As in, 512px or higher 22:08 sfan5[iPod] it will 22:09 sfan5[iPod] unless some base engine change will get done 22:09 Taoki yeah 22:09 Taoki I don't believe MT is meant to be limited to a certain resolution like MC... as in having a purpose off that 22:10 PilzAdam someone created a 4K texture pack? 22:10 RealBadAngel its targeted to work with low res 22:10 RealBadAngel but that should mean goin with higher would be impossible 22:10 RealBadAngel not 22:12 VanessaE I use the 256px version of HDX, I get 50-60 fpx with it when I don't go insane with view distance (when I do, 40-50 fps) 22:13 VanessaE fps* 22:15 celeron55 some guy is contacting me as he wants to use minetest for some commercial project and he admits to be clueless about how to go about using minetest with propietary code and asks how to do it according to the law 22:16 celeron55 hmm, should've made that two sentences 22:16 celeron55 well whatever 22:16 celeron55 i'm not especially eager to answer anything but "go google" 22:17 celeron55 as i already explained the options briefly 22:17 Taoki GPL is a good license. It makes sure that even if you use it commercially, the MT code does stay open source :) 22:18 celeron55 if somebody is, i'll let you answer... i doubt anyone wants to explain that to some random CEO of some random startup though 22:18 Taoki Hard to imagien how MT could be used commercially at all. But it can be used for many interesting things once it gets better 22:18 Taoki "Virtual space" is one word that comes to mind... after Second Life in that sense 22:18 celeron55 the fun thing about being the lead of MT is to feel enormously superior to CEOs of startups :-------D 22:18 Taoki lol 22:19 celeron55 i've gotten many of these over times 22:19 RealBadAngel well, i think the open source community already knows the default answers to the corporation folks 22:19 celeron55 they never end up doing anything 22:19 RealBadAngel two words usally 22:19 RealBadAngel one on F, second on Y 22:19 Taoki Corporations? Well they usually do anything that yields them money. We however, do whatever is best for the project and everyone :) 22:20 Taoki RBA: Righty :D 22:21 RealBadAngel funny fact: some1 made shaders mod and huge improvements to the engine 22:21 RealBadAngel all in one 22:21 RealBadAngel mojang tried to buy the code to get it merged 22:22 Taoki RealBadAngel: Was talking with c55 earlier about using shaders to get hardware lighting. I consider that the next important feature (feature, excluding bugfixes in terms of importance). But not sure who can contribute 22:22 RealBadAngel author laughed at money they proposed and showed them a finger 22:22 celeron55 http://paste.dy.fi/Ao4 22:22 celeron55 there went the answer 22:23 Taoki sounds nice 22:23 RealBadAngel Taoki, i will help ya for sure, im getting used to the game code 22:24 RealBadAngel still, im figthin some "flowers" on my way, but still, i get some effects 22:24 Taoki Ahhh... that feeling of being open source, and grabbing evil proprietary businessmen by the back of the head. Usually it's the other way around sadly, since those with money have more power. But when someone makes something FOSS that is good and better, then they can also have more power :) 22:25 Taoki RealBadAngel: That would be nice! Would be great if you could help implement lighting with the shaders. It's a hard task though... the lighting code is big 22:26 Taoki Sadly I don't know if I can help here. Should be someone who knows the lighting code well. c55 is prolly the only dev who does but he probably can't work on this primarily 22:26 RealBadAngel Taoki ive read several Irrlicht threads. the problem is not so scary imho 22:27 Taoki RealBadAngel: Using light entities is easy. But we need shaders to mask them, so light doesn't shine in caves 22:27 Taoki I have no experience with shaders however 22:27 Taoki Also, I don't know where to replace the sun and lights everywhere in the code, and make an optional setting that disables the lightmaps 22:27 RealBadAngel me neither but its still just a piece of code 22:27 celeron55 the bigness of the lighting code is not a problem at all 22:28 Taoki Only a problem when learning it for the first time, but yeah 22:28 celeron55 the result can be just ingored 22:28 RealBadAngel i need to know just the right formulas 22:28 celeron55 i wan write a shader that ignores the result 8) 22:28 celeron55 can* 22:29 RealBadAngel all is just math 22:29 Taoki celeron55: Well, it's a feature I'd really really like, so I can't help asking you to work on it if you get the time please. But I don't wanna be one of them annoying users who beg the devs to do features for them, and it's obviously your choice. 22:29 Taoki If you can and have time to of course. Just not sure who else can 22:30 Sudi hey celeron55 how much data is minetest sending for a single player? 22:31 celeron55 dunno 22:31 celeron55 somebody else knows better than me (from experience) 22:31 celeron55 i can only say "not much" 22:32 VanessaE sudi: it varies, but anywhere from about 2kB/sec on up depending on the server and players' available bandwidth. Seems to float around 3kB/sec nominally. 22:33 RealBadAngel celeron55, one question: is virtual screen size for buttons, fields etc being fixed when passing pos and rectangles to Irrlicht? 22:34 RealBadAngel and then scaled to actual screen resolution by minetest? 22:35 * Taoki wonders if the hotbar on the HUD will become possible to texture as well, not just menus 22:35 RealBadAngel HUD display management shall be passed to LUA 22:36 RealBadAngel and defined there 22:37 Taoki agreed 22:38 Sudi VanessaE: how many updates does it send per second? 22:38 Taoki Would be nice if all hud items could be defined in lua. And if possible, even the inventory menu when you press i, so that games can customize it 22:38 Taoki Now that lua can read player keys that should be easy to do already, just needs someone to remove the c++ inventory screen afterward 22:39 VanessaE Sudi: not sure. Given a packet size of 500-odd bytes, I guess that works out to 6-8 a second or something. 22:40 celeron55 this guy sends e-mails like a machine 22:40 celeron55 two new already 22:40 RealBadAngel lol 22:40 celeron55 no doubt he's a CEO 22:40 VanessaE heh' 22:41 RealBadAngel corporation freak at his best 22:41 RealBadAngel "buy that damn c55 for me son" "i will, boss, you can count on me" 22:42 celeron55 oh, this went interesting 22:43 celeron55 not as interesting as you are thinking now though 22:43 VanessaE haha 22:43 RealBadAngel so? 22:44 celeron55 http://paste.dy.fi/A3s 22:44 celeron55 wtf does that even mean 22:45 celeron55 should i ask him to fire up an irc client and come to #minetest so he can start modding for fun? :D 22:45 celeron55 this is random 22:45 VanessaE sure, why the hell not :-) 22:46 Taoki Actually, do it! Let's see if he does ;] 22:46 VanessaE let him prove how dumb (or not) he is :D 22:46 Taoki can't call him dumb yet since i haven't seen him still 22:46 RealBadAngel tekkit is compilation of technic like mods for minecraft 22:46 VanessaE Taoki: old stereotype - CEOs tend to be dumber than you would expect for their positions. 22:47 RealBadAngel bunch of them 22:47 Taoki yeah 22:47 Taoki I'm more concerned about those who are crooked rather than dumb... 22:48 RealBadAngel dayz mod: 22:48 RealBadAngel http://www.minecraftforum.net/topic/1304383-145sspsmp-minecraft-dayz-mod-70-pre-release/ 22:50 RealBadAngel heh 22:50 RealBadAngel hes asking to do tekkit and dayz mod for minetest for free? or i do get it wrong? 22:58 celeron55 i don't even know, but here is my answer: http://paste.dy.fi/AwR 23:00 RealBadAngel good one 23:03 celeron55 by the way; the way you recognize a succesful kernel update is that it cannot find your hard disk in the next boot 23:04 celeron55 also, the usb dongle that is supposed to have an archlinux image on it will show a "debian" screen on boot 23:06 * Taoki hopes a kernel update will never break the os 23:07 celeron55 broken kernels are fun, if you're paid for fixing it or don't have anything else to do! 23:07 celeron55 this case isn't either one though 23:09 Taoki I like to know since I install all updates when they're on my repository's stable branch. I only did one kernel update so far, but it worked perfectly well 23:09 Taoki I don't have more than one distro installed however. Just Windows and openSUSE 23:09 celeron55 his answer is "Thank you." 23:10 Taoki BTW... to everyone who said openSUSE is a bad distro (RealBadAngel was on the list IIRC): You should note that MineTest is one of the default games distributed with it. Not installed by default, but it comes with its repositories. Wonder what Linux distros have it by default 23:10 celeron55 debian has had 0.3 since a long ago 23:10 Taoki I have it installed from Yast as well, though I only run the GIT one 23:10 Taoki nice 23:11 RealBadAngel me??? 23:11 Taoki RealBadAngel: Maybe I'm confusing you then, ignore that if so 23:11 RealBadAngel nope. ive never said so 23:11 Taoki Ok. There was some debate about that a few weeks ago :P 23:11 celeron55 the first package of minetest was on archlinux's AUR 23:11 RealBadAngel im debian btw 23:11 celeron55 by far 23:12 Taoki Many went like "openSUSE is so bad, why would you use a distro like that:". Though it's 2 months since I switched to it, and it works so well it's impressive 23:12 Taoki nice 23:12 RealBadAngel if i named linux distro some bad words it was ubuntu then 23:12 celeron55 (it has been there since Kray set up his server, which is since forever) 23:13 Taoki Ubuntu is bad because it uses gnome (for me at least). Kubuntu is ok. But I wouldn't use it, since there's a lot of commercial software mixed with the free one, and it's heavily corporation-dependent 23:13 celeron55 my first distro was mandrake, but since then i haven't use any red hat based distro 23:13 celeron55 (fedora, suse and the like are the red hat aka rpm genre of distros) 23:14 Taoki Well, as inflexible as that sounds, openSUSE iwas pretty much my first and currently only distro. I only try others on VirtualBox out of curiosity. The first distro I sEEN however, was Knoppix when a computer friend booted a live CD on my machine 23:14 celeron55 then there are the debian based ones, and then... some oddballs like gentoo and arch and slackware (the old one) 23:14 Taoki I think Fedora is #2 for me, from those I personally know of 23:15 Taoki I heard nice things about MINT linux too, might try that on a virtual machine as well 23:15 celeron55 mint is basically ubuntu with different default settings 23:15 celeron55 it even uses ubuntu's repos afaik 23:17 RealBadAngel i think i found the reason coords are incopatible 23:17 RealBadAngel i mean in formspec 23:19 RealBadAngel compiling now 23:28 Taoki heading off for now, later 23:33 RealBadAngel padding value seems to be not there 23:34 RealBadAngel thats why i do get proper geometry but everything seems to be moved depending on screen resolution 23:34 RealBadAngel padding.x and padding.y is just always zero valued